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Thread: No (Internet Sales) Taxation without Representation!

  1. #1

    No (Internet Sales) Taxation without Representation!

    I've been watching toob vids of Ebay/Poshmark resellers and they worried this will be the end of their business. They just can't compete.




    No (Internet Sales) Taxation without Representation!

    written by ron paul

    monday june 25, 2018


    Last week the United States Supreme Court, in the case of South Dakota v. Wayfair, ruled that the Constitution’s Commerce Clause allows state governments to force out-of-state businesses to collect state sales taxes. This decision overturns the court’s precedent that a state could require only businesses with a “physical presence” in the state to comply with state tax laws.

    Unless Congress exercises its authority under the Commerce Clause to counter this decision with legislation, retailers will have to calculate sales taxes on every online purchase. An error in calculating sales taxes could cause a small retailer to undergo a costly and time-consuming audit, or even audits by multiple state governments. The compliance costs, along with the sales taxes themselves, will raise the cost of online commerce, burdening consumers and limiting the growth of internet business.

    The burdens imposed on online commerce by the court’s decision will fall particularly hard on smaller internet retailers that rely on online sales to stay open. Stifling the growth of smaller and new internet retailers may be bad for consumers, but it serves the interest of large brick-and-mortar retailers, as well as large online retailers that already have to comply with state sales taxes because they have a physical presence in most states. These large businesses support giving states new taxing powers because they wish to use government power to make sure their smaller competitors stay small.

    Allowing states to tax internet retailers with no physical presence in their states — and thus limited influence over state legislators — violates the principle of no taxation without representation. Tax- and power-hungry politicians will likely use this new power not just to increase taxes, but to impose other tax and regulatory burdens on out-of-state businesses. Having the power to tax and regulate employers and workers who cannot retaliate at the polls is a dream come true for many politicians. By making almost all online purchases subject to sales taxes, the decision will also reduce pressure on states to keep sales tax rates low.

    The Constitution’s drafters intended the Commerce Clause to create free trade among the states, not to enable states to impose taxes and regulations on out-of-state businesses. The growth of online commerce does not change the Commerce Clause’s purpose.

    Allowing state governments to force out-of-state retailers to comply with state tax laws harms small businesses, harms the growth of online commerce, and raises prices. It also benefits politicians seeking new tax revenue and helps large, politically-powerful corporations.

    Congress must protect consumers, taxpayers, and small businesses by passing legislation limiting states’ ability to extend their taxing power across their borders. This would be a rare instance of Congress using its Commerce Clause powers for the intended purpose of promoting free trade among the states, not enabling the growth of government.
    http://ronpaulinstitute.org/archives...epresentation/

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Paul View Post
    The intellectual battle for liberty can appear to be a lonely one at times. However, the numbers are not as important as the principles that we hold. Leonard Read always taught that "it's not a numbers game, but an ideological game." That's why it's important to continue to provide a principled philosophy as to what the role of government ought to be, despite the numbers that stare us in the face.
    Quote Originally Posted by Origanalist View Post
    This intellectually stimulating conversation is the reason I keep coming here.



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  3. #2
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  4. #3
    They need to get this out of the Federal courts immediately before the Feds make a big mistake (By mistake, I mean the US house of Representatives starts a universal sales tax code at the national level).

    I don't even care what decision they make, but get it back to the state level ASAP.

    and Here it comes:

    http://thehill.com/opinion/judiciary...nsure-fairness

    While states are winners for now, the Supreme Court also issued invitations for federal legislative action. Congress should act promptly to give certainty to retailers and their customers, prevent the need for further litigation, and make sure that all the states play fairly in the new legal environment.
    Last edited by nobody's_hero; 06-25-2018 at 04:08 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by timosman View Post
    This is getting silly.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    It started silly.
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  5. #4
    SCOTUS gets it all wrong yet again.

    How surprising.
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  6. #5
    As an internet retailer, I'm set against this. But this isn't quite right:
    Allowing states to tax internet retailers with no physical presence in their states — and thus limited influence over state legislators — violates the principle of no taxation without representation.
    They aren't taxing me. They're taxing their residents. They're just trying to force me to collect it.

  7. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by angelatc View Post
    As an internet retailer, I'm set against this. But this isn't quite right:

    They aren't taxing me. They're taxing their residents. They're just trying to force me to collect it.
    Exactly.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Paul View Post
    The intellectual battle for liberty can appear to be a lonely one at times. However, the numbers are not as important as the principles that we hold. Leonard Read always taught that "it's not a numbers game, but an ideological game." That's why it's important to continue to provide a principled philosophy as to what the role of government ought to be, despite the numbers that stare us in the face.
    Quote Originally Posted by Origanalist View Post
    This intellectually stimulating conversation is the reason I keep coming here.

  8. #7
    The main problem is that most people didnt even know they had to pay this sales tax, and accidentally kept some of their own money.

    Which is unacceptable
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  9. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Suzanimal View Post
    Exactly.
    Well, I'm so small that I'm not going to. Amazon, eBay, etc will all take care of that. For the stuff I sell off Facebook, Craigslist and all those places...I'm just not going to worry about it.



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