• Natural Citizen's Avatar
    Today, 05:28 PM
    Well, economic security and economic prosperity are two, quite different, applications. They are more than mere words. Much like Life is more than merely existing. And much like the pursuit of happiness is much more than an ideal. It's an ever-changing aspiration. It's a constantly expanding vision of self-fulfillment. That vision comes from self-realization and from self-development, morally and intellectually. And in every regard. When I say economic security, I'm talking about the fact that any society will ultimately turn into a State in some form. In any society there will be a hierarchy. This means rules. This means coercion. And this means that someone has to enforce it. Than again, what if someone cant work anymore? What if someone is disabled? Who is going to check your shipping containers from imports outside of your society? And I still never got arounf d to the free rider problem. What happens if you own the dam and some people get the overflow? Now all of a sudden he seesthat he doesn;t have to pay like the other guy. Whatt if someone consumes more than he should? What decides wht isfair and what isnt? Those are just remedial situations and one could go much deeper. I just don't really feel like it, O. I'm serious, now. I'm just really tired of this thread.
    92 replies | 1372 view(s)
  • Natural Citizen's Avatar
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  • Natural Citizen's Avatar
    92 replies | 1372 view(s)
  • Natural Citizen's Avatar
    Today, 08:16 AM
    Okay. You didn't really explain the differing modes of anarchy but I'll let you slide since it's a copypasta. Now. Add capitalism to the equation. Add economic security to the equation. Both are anti-capitalist. Yet both require economic security. Economic security demands servitude. Servitude is achieved by force of written rule or gun. It's just a given. Capitalism is organization. Anarchists (at least true to their principles anarchists) reject capitalism in whole (organization) because they recognize that some capitalist transactions are accomplished by force. To steal a quote from a good book on the topic, "It is a truism that government's power needs only to exist to be feared to be dominant, over the fear-ridden, without ever needing to be exercised aggressively."
    92 replies | 1372 view(s)
  • Natural Citizen's Avatar
    Today, 08:05 AM
    Hm. I didn't even know they transcribed Ron's videos. But I don't need to read it. Let's start with the question that was asked of Ron by the facebook subscriber in that transcript. First question on anarchy: I want to go to this email, and this is from Nathan Kelly. And he emails in to you: would you agree that the best form of government is none at all Or put another way, the only legitimate form of governance is individual governance. Ron Paul: Well, I'm glad he put the last sentence on, because you always want government.
    92 replies | 1372 view(s)
  • Natural Citizen's Avatar
    Today, 07:56 AM
    Well, I don't know what you mean by equating HB's list of works by various authors as "those days." We've always been for small, limited government as a platform. Limited for Liberty. We've not been ant-government as a platform so far as I can recall. If we have and I'm mistaken, then please tell me when that time was. That aside, let's take a look at HB's list. It contains works from a broad cast of authors. All of whom offer differing, varying, and most often contrary applications of an ideal. Now this presents a problem. I'll tell you why. It presents a problem because each and every one of those varying applications must be secured by a governmental body of some concoction which must be supported by both society as well as smart people. It's far more complex than just applying an ism to something and rolling with it. Each one of those varying applications of a single ism demand a tailored means of security. And in every case all you're doing is trading one State for another. The application of any ism (particularly with regard to securing it) is equally as important as said principles of the ism.
    92 replies | 1372 view(s)
  • Natural Citizen's Avatar
    Yesterday, 10:17 PM
    How do you get 4g on a 2g phone? If that's the case, I want to use my moto razr from back in the day instead of this smart phone.
    3 replies | 95 view(s)
  • Natural Citizen's Avatar
    Yesterday, 09:51 PM
    HA. "Natural Citizen'' is new to you. Granted, it's very easy to say that something has been 'covered' just because an opinion has been written down some place. Right? Of course it is. Here is the answer to the question. It is the only legitimate answer. And I'm sure that not one person on this board will disagree with me. Libertarianism permits for voluntary socialism so long as you're a libertarian and have renounced the use of force.
    92 replies | 1372 view(s)
  • Natural Citizen's Avatar
    Yesterday, 07:47 PM
    Ah gawsh. When the youngsters start saying youngster, it's probably time to put me out to pasture. lolol. I keep forgetting that we've watched people basically grow up under the tent for the past 30 years or so. But that's a good thing, I suppose. You guys would've had fun in the 80s when a feller had to pound pavement the old fashioned way. No Internet, no smart phones, no nothing. Instant activism was unheard of. Only radio and newspapers and if your letter got through to the editor and printed, it was a small victory. Billboards were the memes of the day. lolol.
    92 replies | 1372 view(s)
  • Natural Citizen's Avatar
    Yesterday, 07:22 PM
    This thread needs Occam's. That's what this thread needs. At least he's gosh darned realistic.
    92 replies | 1372 view(s)
  • Natural Citizen's Avatar
    Yesterday, 06:54 PM
    But there would be a State none the less. Economic security requires a coercive force. As a consequence, any system which depends upon coercive force to achieve economic security demands servitude. This is fundamental. Another thing, Pierz, respectfully speaking. This is just a little tip for functionally debating, since I've noticed that you try to do this quite a bit in order to sell your ism. And it's not just you, this happens every time we debate trustees of this particular ism. You cannot reframe the question or the terms of the whole of the debate in order to omit your ism's shortcomings. At least, not honestly. You will get busted and called out on it every single time. At least, on this forum. Every single time. Simple ignorance, of course, is an entirely different matter. We'll try to help one to understand the shortcomings of voluntary socialism if one is willing to objectively hear them so as to make an informed choice toward a functional understanding of the workings of culture, government, proper man-to-man/government-to-man relations, etc.
    92 replies | 1372 view(s)
  • Natural Citizen's Avatar
    Yesterday, 06:52 PM
    Aw, geez. Why'd you have to quote me, of all people on this thread? Hm? Why? I left the thread. Firstly, I advocate for small government. Meaning that the government has one and only one role. Which is to protect Individual Liberty. That isn't possible in what is being offered in this thread. What is being offered in this thread is the question of replacing one State with another State. And in the replacement State (A Democracy in this case), the Individual and any group of Individuals has no protection against the Majority. None. In a Democracy there is no mechanism to protect the rights of The One to the right to his rights against the unchecked power of the Majority. Secondly, I'm intellectually honest enough to know that anarchy and capitalism do not mix. They are patently contrary to one another in fundamental principle. I'm smart enough to understand that economic security is not possible without a coercive force.
    92 replies | 1372 view(s)
  • Natural Citizen's Avatar
    Yesterday, 05:08 PM
    Sigh. Youth is wasted on the young. I should make that my sig. Heh.
    30 replies | 384 view(s)
  • Natural Citizen's Avatar
    Yesterday, 04:58 PM
    Well. Collectivist mindsets do tend to view humans as members of groups rather than as individuals. I know vegans who just mind their own business and don't bother anybody.
    30 replies | 384 view(s)
  • Natural Citizen's Avatar
    Yesterday, 03:31 AM
    Whoa. I scare myself sometimes. http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?481977-Will-the-world-end-on-September-23rd&p=6527932&viewfull=1#post6527932 I should buy a lottery ticket today so the little lady can have some shoes. Everyone is accounted for today, right?
    5 replies | 89 view(s)
  • Natural Citizen's Avatar
    09-22-2017, 11:45 PM
    dannno's suave, though. In all of my years here, that dude has always talked about taking the ladies out and showing them a good time. He's probly the studliest one out of all of us. Or he's got the best herb. lol.
    16 replies | 289 view(s)
  • Natural Citizen's Avatar
    09-22-2017, 06:16 PM
    Zip, that is one creepy avy, man. You shoulda stuck with Newman from back in the day.
    81 replies | 936 view(s)
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    11 replies | 151 view(s)
  • Natural Citizen's Avatar
    09-22-2017, 04:34 PM
    Not sure Russian is a race, though. lol.
    5 replies | 111 view(s)
  • Natural Citizen's Avatar
    09-22-2017, 04:33 PM
    2) Treat others with respect. Do not suggest that other members should leave or that they otherwise don't belong here.
    5 replies | 111 view(s)
  • Natural Citizen's Avatar
    09-22-2017, 04:06 PM
    dannno, you ho. lolol.
    16 replies | 289 view(s)
  • Natural Citizen's Avatar
    09-22-2017, 03:53 PM
    It figures it'd be something like that.
    13 replies | 246 view(s)
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