Why Libertarians Will Change the Face of the U.S. Presidential Race

McAfee is the man to beat given the current political climate. GJ's political pragmatism just won't sell. He's had his chance. Austin Peterson has some chops but he can't deliver. He presents himself like a Marco Rubio. Just not inspiring for me. McAfee has the edge to him which is sorely needed. Of the three the only one that could compete, IMHO, is McAfee. Trump can't pull his "self-made" millionaire bull$#@!. McAfee has him on that. McAfee can argue business politics all day with him.

Originally Posted by phill4paul

McAfee is the man to beat given the current political climate. GJ's political pragmatism just won't sell. He's had his chance. Austin Peterson has some chops but he can't deliver. He presents himself like a Marco Rubio. Just not inspiring for me. McAfee has the edge to him which is sorely needed. Of the three the only one that could compete, IMHO, is McAfee. Trump can't pull his "self-made" millionaire bull$#@!. McAfee has him on that. McAfee can argue business politics all day with him.

Yeah but who is better at golf. Let's get to the important issues here.

Originally Posted by twomp

Yeah but who is better at golf. Let's get to the important issues here.

I'm sure McAfee would be the best on a golf/skeet range. Beyond that I can't say.

Petersen could win over more Republicans who are angry with Trump.

The problem with Gary Johnson is that he seems to only care about weed and gay marriage, when libertarian ism is about a whole lot more.

He is the perfect "cliche" libertarian, exactly what we don't need.

For now, McAfee is the optimal candidate to run for the LP nod, from the POV of engaging the non LP universe of voters. But Peterson is exactly the kind of libertarian who should run first as a local candidate on GOP and LP lines (since he is from MO), win office, then plan to run for President later (once more seasoned) as a kind of "favorite son" candidate in Iowa (the state next door).

Given the right preparation, he'd be perfect liberty national candidate to succeed where the Pauls couldn't, because he would be more rooted in the region where the key early state contest is to be held.

I like McAfee, he should be the nominee, but this overly optimistic view of what the LP will do in electoral politics is always a hindrance to the success of the movement. 17%? No way. Not even close. The lack of objective political analysis seems to be a constant problem for libertarians.

Originally Posted by ThePaleoLibertarian

I like McAfee, he should be the nominee, but this overly optimistic view of what the LP will do in electoral politics is always a hindrance to the success of the movement. 17%? No way. Not even close. The lack of objective political analysis seems to be a constant problem for libertarians.

Lack of exposure will never allow us to get to 17%. The only way that this could have EVER even come close to happening would have been a Ron Paul libertarian run after 2012, or less likely 2008. Even then, that would be a long shot.

5% is a more realistic goal.

The only way an LP candidate, no matter who it is, can garner enough support to make a difference is if they can make it into the debates. The debates are productions of the RNC and DNC debate commission. The only way they allow that is if their internal polling (on both sides) suggests that the LP candidate will draw more people from the opposite side of the aisle.

Think of the difficulty of that. You'd have to have the GOP internal pollsters telling them that the LP would pull from Hillary, and her pollsters telling her that the LP candidate would pull more from the GOP. AND, it would have to be outside of the margin of error. This isn't 1992 and none of the LP guys have the kind of fortune needed to address the public using paid media like Perot did.

Originally Posted by phill4paul

McAfee is the man to beat given the current political climate. GJ's political pragmatism just won't sell. He's had his chance. Austin Peterson has some chops but he can't deliver. He presents himself like a Marco Rubio. Just not inspiring for me. McAfee has the edge to him which is sorely needed. Of the three the only one that could compete, IMHO, is McAfee. Trump can't pull his "self-made" millionaire bull$#@!. McAfee has him on that. McAfee can argue business politics all day with him.

Trump would destroy McAfee in a "who can make money" debate. Now, if it was a "who can lose money" debate, McAfee would be the far-and-away victor, for he somehow managed to take his $100 million worth of assets and lose all but $4 million of it.

Originally Posted by CaptUSA

The only way an LP candidate, no matter who it is, can garner enough support to make a difference is if they can make it into the debates. The debates are productions of the RNC and DNC debate commission. The only way they allow that is if their internal polling (on both sides) suggests that the LP candidate will draw more people from the opposite side of the aisle.

Think of the difficulty of that. You'd have to have the GOP internal pollsters telling them that the LP would pull from Hillary, and her pollsters telling her that the LP candidate would pull more from the GOP. AND, it would have to be outside of the margin of error. This isn't 1992 and none of the LP guys have the kind of fortune needed to address the public using paid media like Perot did.

Very true. And the root problem is that Libertarians are not even included in MANY polls. The recent poll where Gary Johnson got 11% is the only example I can think of lately.

Into this fray will soon be thrust the nominee from the Libertarian Party. While the party has been a yawn in past years, I assure you that this year will be different. In the latest poll from undergroundpoliticalpolling.com, Libertarian candidates garnered 17 percent of votes.

Yah, right...the LP will garner the same fraction of a pecent that it always does.

The mistake is thinking that unrest and anger that is being felt out there, is Idiot AmeriKa pining for freedom and liberty.

It is not.

It is Idiot AmeriKa pining for:

A) A "strongman" who will whip things into shape and make the trains run on time.

B) A "father figure" who will hand out free $#@!.

C) Or preferably, both.

Don't forget about the "newsletter" under current in the movement, remember Rand was not good enough and to establishment, yet somehow Trump is. But god damn dude, I would love to go riding with you, do some shooting and drinking, but your a total downer sometimes. I think there is a real chance with the right candidate to pull together a coalition of voters from dissatisfied Bernie guys to Trump non believers and make a strong showing this year. 'It does not take a majority but rather an irate and tireless minority keen on setting the brush fires of freedom in the minds of men. ' or something like that plus not burning the "liberals" at the stake who dare join our coalition.

Originally Posted by afwjam

Don't forget about the "newsletter" under current in the movement, remember Rand was not good enough and to establishment, yet somehow Trump is. But god damn dude, I would love to go riding with you, do some shooting and drinking, but your a total downer sometimes. I think there is a real chance with the right candidate to pull together a coalition of voters from dissatisfied Bernie guys to Trump non believers and make a strong showing this year. 'It does not take a majority but rather an irate and tireless minority keen on setting the brush fires of freedom in the minds of men. ' or something like that plus not burning the "liberals" at the stake who dare join our coalition.

I wish I could be more optimistic about the current crisis, I really do.

Tough to do, when, for the third time in my lifetime, I am about to be put out of a job by the federal government, while my fellow citizens cheer.

I just know what the score is...

Originally Posted by afwjam

Don't forget about the "newsletter" under current in the movement, remember Rand was not good enough and to establishment, yet somehow Trump is. But god damn dude, I would love to go riding with you, do some shooting and drinking, but your a total downer sometimes. I think there is a real chance with the right candidate to pull together a coalition of voters from dissatisfied Bernie guys to Trump non believers and make a strong showing this year. 'It does not take a majority but rather an irate and tireless minority keen on setting the brush fires of freedom in the minds of men. ' or something like that plus not burning the "liberals" at the stake who dare join our coalition.

To expand a little further:

We sit around our echo chambers like this, and make reasoned, logical arguments about the state of politics, freedom and the nature of man.

And when has reason and logic done well with or convinced Idiot AmeriKa recently?

It's all just f a g talk to them.



The stark reality is that Ron Paul is wrong: freedom is NOT popular.

Originally Posted by afwjam

Don't forget about the "newsletter" under current in the movement, remember Rand was not good enough and to establishment, yet somehow Trump is. But god damn dude, I would love to go riding with you, do some shooting and drinking, but your a total downer sometimes. I think there is a real chance with the right candidate to pull together a coalition of voters from dissatisfied Bernie guys to Trump non believers and make a strong showing this year. 'It does not take a majority but rather an irate and tireless minority keen on setting the brush fires of freedom in the minds of men. ' or something like that plus not burning the "liberals" at the stake who dare join our coalition.

To expand a little further:

We sit around our echo chambers like this, and make reasoned, logical arguments about the state of politics, freedom and the nature of man.

And when has reason and logic done well with or convinced Idiot AmeriKa recently?

It's all just f a g talk to them.



The stark reality is that Ron Paul is wrong: freedom is NOT popular.

Originally Posted by afwjam

Don't forget about the "newsletter" under current in the movement, remember Rand was not good enough and to establishment, yet somehow Trump is. But god damn dude, I would love to go riding with you, do some shooting and drinking, but your a total downer sometimes. I think there is a real chance with the right candidate to pull together a coalition of voters from dissatisfied Bernie guys to Trump non believers and make a strong showing this year. 'It does not take a majority but rather an irate and tireless minority keen on setting the brush fires of freedom in the minds of men. ' or something like that plus not burning the "liberals" at the stake who dare join our coalition.

To expand a little further:

We sit around our echo chambers like this, and make reasoned, logical arguments about the state of politics, freedom and the nature of man.

And when has reason and logic done well with or convinced Idiot AmeriKa recently?

It's all just f a g talk to them.



The stark reality is that Ron Paul is wrong: freedom is NOT popular.

Freedom does not need to be popular with the masses, but rather popular with the right irate and tireless minority. I think the biggest reason freedom is not popular is do to a communications break down, this sort of thing tends to happen in popularity driven collectives. There are ways to get around these communications break downs though, because if you reason with the individual elements of such collectives you will find them a hell of a lot more reasonable then as part of the whole where the collective reasoning decreases below the abilities of one let alone the sum of the whole. I am working on some communications tools right now based on minimizing the negative aspects of humans in a collective community in hopes of achieving at least discourse rising above that of the individual maybe approaching the sum of individuals if I'm lucky and surpassing the sum of its parts if I'm blessed. Sorry the mans got you down.

Originally Posted by Tywysog Cymru

Petersen could win over more Republicans who are angry with Trump.

The ones who are angry with Trump aren't the ones who would swing Libertarian.