My brother says "this is where I disagree with RP"

[Jeremy]

He thinks getting rid of the IRS is unrealistic. I said we'd have the same income we had 10 years ago (did I quote that right?) And he's like "it's just impossible, it's too hard to do".

(He will be voting for RP, but he's not as much as a fan like you and me)

[RonPaulFTFW]

Paul says that if we cut spending to levels of the year 2000 we wouldn't need the income tax.

and he's 100 percent right.

And we could easily do that by shutting down all our military bases.

Paul talks about using tarrifs and other state taxes to fund the government.

[steph3n]

Paul says that if we cut spending to levels of the year 2000 we wouldn't need the income tax.

and he's 100 percent right.

And we could easily do that by shutting down all our military bases.

no military alone wont do that, sorry.
It takes over cuts in government waste as well.

[zackmario]

RP has said that getting rid of federal income tax is something he would like to do, but it will be a gradual move in that direction, with support from the congress. Its not like he is going to get into office and send them a pink slip the next day.

[drulay]

He thinks getting rid of the IRS is unrealistic. I said we'd have the same income we had 10 years ago (did I quote that right?) And he's like "it's just impossible, it's too hard to do".

(He will be voting for RP, but he's not a fan like you and me)

Well, it is unrealistic for a president to do. We would need cross-aisle support in both houses and huge support from the American people. Support means "I am for downsizing government and reducing our costs dramatically" not just "yea I don't like the income tax"

This is one of the side agendas that would be nice, but realistically speaking - probably won't happen even if we get our man in the white house.

[Psych0t]

For all Americans, the IRS has become a part of life, therefor they do not reject it because they think the government has to get money somehow.

[Give me liberty]

Paul says that if we cut spending to levels of the year 2000 we wouldn't need the income tax.

and he's 100 percent right.

And we could easily do that by shutting down all our military bases.

Paul talks about using tarrifs and other state taxes to fund the government.

Shutting down them? where in the us? or in Eu

If its in Eu, fine by me.

[Ethek]

He disagreess with the IRS. Thats cool RP thinks it wont happen overnight. HE doesnt have the authority strait up anyhow. Just emphasize that its power that has been stripped away from the people. Politicians use it so they can pander promises for votes. Most of what they promise is unconstitutional and so is the income tax.

[Arklatex]

Tell him that he's right, Ron Paul is a philosophical jerk in the right direction for a change.

[Basilieus]

Tell your friend he's an idiot because hes basing his assumptions on something he has no clue about.

I had this same scenario with 4 co-workers at the same time, they are all above 30 and I am 23. They said, "if we got rid of the income tax we couldn't fund our government and all the services."

I said...

1) The income tax is used to pay for the interest on the money the federal reserve prints.
2) The federal reserve isn't government, it's a private centralized bank.
3) We don't want government like it is today.
4) If we cut spending to that of 8 years ago, we can easily get rid of the income tax.

No one said anything, because they have no idea what they are talking about.

[Xonox]

RP admits it's impossible to just drop the IRS all at once... he'd start phasing them out on day one though.

[slantedview]

He thinks getting rid of the IRS is unrealistic. I said we'd have the same income we had 10 years ago (did I quote that right?) And he's like "it's just impossible, it's too hard to do".

(He will be voting for RP, but he's not as much as a fan like you and me)
two points.

first point - was it unrealistic before we had an IRS? it's not this magical entity that has always existed. we've only had it since 1913, and it doesn't even constitute the majority of federal income. we can do without it. anyways "hard to do" is just a fucking lame ass excuse.

second point - ron is not the only one that wants to get rid of it. huck as well.

[ronpaulyourmom]

Look it aint gonna happen overnight.

First you'll have to end the war, bring the troops home, and save 400 billion a year.

Then you'll have to stop wasteful government programs and trim others, save another 300 billion.

Then you're gonna wanna cut taxes a bit and use whatever is left to start paying down the debt.


After a year or two of that is when the real action will start, revamping social security and healthcare, having some bigger tax cuts. You probably can't eliminate the Income Tax until a 2nd term, unless we had some really amazing economic growth.

[me3]

Tell your friend he's an idiot because hes basing his assumptions on something he has no clue about.
It's his brother, so you might want to tone down the language. If you are this big of a jerk in real life, I doubt you have attracted many people to Ron Paul.

[AceNZ]

Just because something is hard to do doesn't mean that it's not a worthwhile goal.

[TTB]

Of the 2.4 trillion dollars the Feds confiscated in 2006, 1.0 Trillion came from Individual Income Taxes. "Defense" spending was 520 Billion, and International (assume this is Foreign Aid) was 30 Billion. So eliminatng Foreign Aid and scaling back "Defense" by 70-80%, would save 446 Billion per year. This leaves about 554 Billion to cut in other areas.

Some facts on the Federal Budget (well, government 'facts' anyway :D)

http://www.cbo.gov/budget/data/historical.pdf

or

http://www.cbo.gov/budget/data/historical.xls

[zadrock]

I hate this crap. Does anyone ever look at the platforms of other candidates and point out how unrealistic their ideas are? Yes, getting rid of the IRS is unrealistic. But Paul would move us in the right direction (lower taxes, less wasteful spending). Is it so wrong to have a long-term goal?

Let's look at some of the other options:
Obama - universal health care - are you kidding me? Impossible, unrealistic
McCain - 100 years in Iraq - completely infeasible
Romney - $20 billion to auto industry - what a crock! Wait... This one could probably happen, sadly... :(

Z

[fuzzybekool]

Ron Paul can not get rid of the IRS without Congress. The 16th Amendment is unconstitutional and ideally, Ron Paul would love to get rid of it.

The biggest point Ron Paul is making is we need to cut Federal Spending by drastically reducing our Empire around the world.

[Psych0t]

two points.

first point - was it unrealistic before we had an IRS? it's not this magical entity that has always existed. we've only had it since 1913, and it doesn't even constitute the majority of federal income. we can do without it. anyways "hard to do" is just a fucking lame ass excuse.

second point - ron is not the only one that wants to get rid of it. huck as well.

Actually, federal taxes were first introduced in the 1880s, rejected, then finally accepted in 1913. No one paid taxes even then, it wasn't until WW2 when people started making a lot of money when the government finally established the IRS, so people started paying

[Shink]

Would you take issue if Ron uncostitutionally shut down the unconstitutional IRS by use of signing statements, etc.? An interesting thought...

[quantized]

From what i understand, Ron Paul is also fully aware of the challenges involves in getting rid of the IRS. He said multiple times that whether this can be done depends on what Americans view on the government role is. He will not get rid of the IRS just like that. He will instead do it progressively, educate the people, and provide a transition plan for this to happen. But bottom line, it comes to Americans to decide if they want a governemnt to take care of them from cradle to grave or personal responsibility.

[Psych0t]

Would you take issue if Ron uncostitutionally shut down the unconstitutional IRS by use of signing statements, etc.? An interesting thought...

two negatives make a positive in this case, imo.

[Shink]

Would you take issue if Ron uncostitutionally shut down the unconstitutional IRS by use of signing statements, etc.? An interesting thought...

BUMP

[Ogren]

Polifact.com did a study to verify what ron said about the income tax, they found that our current revenue is 1.37 trillion, in 1995 our revenue was around 1.12 trillion, so thats about a 200 billion dollar difference, but when factor in that we will be eliminating other departments including the irs and cutting foriegn aid and overseas spending we will be left with hundreds of billions in surplus, which can be given back to the people.

[RoamZero]

Ron Paul would probably start by scaling back spending and using the income tax to pay off our debts. In the interim if he got really lucky he might get a flat tax through. After that, if he is really really lucky, after some years with a flat tax it will be diminished into nothing when his VP is president ;).

[HenryKnoxFineBooks]

Couple of points to stress:

1. The income tax represents 33% of the Federal Govt.'s revenue. (approx. 900 billion)

2. Removing this would give us a federal revenue equal to the year 2000 ( its approx. 66% of the present day revenue).


Also, the Income tax was introduced and sold to the American people as a tax on the rich only...of course then they changed it :

In 1913 the tax rate was 1% on taxable net income above $3,000 ($4,000 for married couples), less deductions and exemptions. It rose to a rate of 7% on incomes above $500,000.
During World War I the top rate rose to 77%; after the war, the top rate was scaled down to a low of 25%

[Basilieus]

It's his brother, so you might want to tone down the language. If you are this big of a jerk in real life, I doubt you have attracted many people to Ron Paul.

What did I say?... I was being sarcastic.

My god I hope your not that big of an idiot in real life.

Edit: Oh shit I forgot /sarcasm

ps. /sarcasm

[BLuegreengrey]

People are conditioned, but what was once unbelieveable is plausable.

[scandinaviany3]

He thinks getting rid of the IRS is unrealistic. I said we'd have the same income we had 10 years ago (did I quote that right?) And he's like "it's just impossible, it's too hard to do".

(He will be voting for RP, but he's not as much as a fan like you and me)

Paul has said cant do immediately...

But at end of 2nd term would be able to

[TTB]

Ron Paul can not get rid of the IRS without Congress. The 16th Amendment is unconstitutional and ideally, Ron Paul would love to get rid of it.

The biggest point Ron Paul is making is we need to cut Federal Spending by drastically reducing our Empire around the world.

Although completely against the spirit of the constitution, the 16th amendment, by definition, is constitutional. It was ratified by the necessary margin (yes, I know there are arguments out there that it was not ratified successfully).

Now, having the power to do something (e.g. tax incomes) doesn't mean that Congress should use it. Therefore, repealing the 16th is not necessary to eliminate income taxes. A simple act of Congress could do the trick. Of course, the safest course of action for future generations would be to work to repeal it. I'm just saying that it's not necessary.

[Goldwater Conservative]

He'd put an end to the strong-arm (that's putting it mildly...) tactics of the IRS, but would otherwise have to work with Congress to cut spending enough to also eliminate the income tax. If nothing else, he could freeze spending by vetoing everything that makes it to his desk (which is effectively a cut, given inflation). Very much possible if the people elect a president like Paul and the Republicans start acting like conservatives again, which they probably would being the opportunists politicians are.

[TonySutton]

First look at the Emergency Spending that is off the books. Get rid of all that stuff. I think 2006 had a ton. Check the Glenn Beck interview with David Walker Jan 08. He talks about it. Its on youtube.

[ronpaul.in]

we collect 900billion a year in income tax, we spend more than that on the war in iraq and lets not forget the 200billion we spend a year on the war on drugs, CUT SPENDING, then cut IRS

[Caravello]

It won't be hard to do if the country enters into some type of financial crisis. Then you start with a clean slate and you build on that.

But even short of that, we can't afford our entitlements, so something will have to be done in the next 10 years. It can't be avoided.

[Akus]

He thinks getting rid of the IRS is unrealistic. I said we'd have the same income we had 10 years ago (did I quote that right?) And he's like "it's just impossible, it's too hard to do".

(He will be voting for RP, but he's not as much as a fan like you and me)

did you get him to read www.ronpaullibrary.com?

[niall]

I never thought I'd see people fighting to keep the IRS...

[asheville4paul]

Ron Paul needs to write a step by step plan that can show that this can be done. His campaign needs to come up with some tangible plans that we the grassroots can present to the uninformed masses. His ideas seem radical to many people but I believe all of these questions could be answered in a well written outline (At least for domestic issues) .

[cantnvrcould]

visit www.freedomtofascism.com - order this dvd - show it to everyone - you will be quite surprised -
TE

[JS4Pat]

He thinks getting rid of the IRS is unrealistic. I said we'd have the same income we had 10 years ago (did I quote that right?) And he's like "it's just impossible, it's too hard to do".

(He will be voting for RP, but he's not as much as a fan like you and me)

From Today's Florida Times Union...



As president, I would help make that dream a reality by working to abolish the Internal Revenue Service and repeal the 16th Amendment that created the federal income tax.

Some doubt whether this can be done. "Can we really abolish the IRS and get rid of the income tax?" they ask. "How would we pay to run the government?"

Few Americans realize that personal income tax dollars represent less than half of federal receipts.

The federal government also receives funding from sources such as tariffs, excise taxes, usage taxes and highway fees. In fact, you could remove the entire personal income tax-funded portion of the budget and the federal government would still receive roughly the same income that it did during the Clinton years. All we would need to do to make this possible would be to cut spending back to 1990s levels, and this is certainly possible, without even touching Social Security and Medicare.

For example, we could easily and quickly save hundreds of billions of dollars by:

- Changing our foreign policy. The United States has more than half a million troops deployed around the world. We should bring them home and pursue a noninterventionist foreign policy, meaning that we should talk and trade with other nations but not engage in the nation-building and undeclared wars that have cost us so much since World War II.

- Abolishing unconstitutional and invasive federal bureaucracies such as the Department of Education. Abolishing the Education Department would benefit us not only by returning our tax dollars, but also by giving control over schools back to local school boards and parents, thereby greatly improving our children's education.

- Stopping foreign aid. Government-to-government foreign aid dollars seldom reach those they are intended to help, due to political wrangling and middlemen looking to make a quick profit.

Additionally, some of those we help with government funds eventually turn on us, just as Osama bin Laden did. Private charities are much more effective at helping the truly needy, and Americans give generously to such causes.

In 1900, "Tax Freedom Day," the day when the average American finishes working to pay for government, was Jan. 22.

In 2007, it fell on April 30. We now work nearly half of the year to satisfy government's appetite, and in return we get skyrocketing debt, onerous regulation and endless global scheming. This is a travesty.

It's time we return to constitutional, fiscally prudent government, before Washington's financial Hindenburg crashes and burns, incinerating our liberties and prosperity.

Together, we can abolish the IRS, repeal the income tax, and cut spending both safely and immediately.

We can reclaim full title to the fruits of our labors, and in so doing enjoy prosperity to a degree that Americans haven't experienced in decades, free from the slavery of mounting debt.

We can make every day "Tax Freedom Day."

http://www.jacksonville.com/tu-online/stories/012208/opl_238666799.shtml