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View Full Version : Wesley Snipes: The Income Tax Is Illegal




spivey378
01-14-2008, 09:01 AM
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/01/14/business/14tax.html?_r=2&ref=business&oref=slogin&oref=slogin

jaumen
01-14-2008, 09:06 AM
Wow, surprising.... this is one that I'll be watching.

WilliamC
01-14-2008, 09:06 AM
Ron Paul should come out with a statement that he regards people like Wesley Snipes as Civil Rights leaders up there with Martin Luther King and Rosa Parks in that they use non-violence and peaceful means to protest opressive and unjust laws.

I think I'll drop the campaign website a suggestion to this effect :)

Falseflagop
01-14-2008, 09:11 AM
Problem with Snipes case is he filed fraud returns for a refund? He should nto have filed and his claim that the income tax is not valied is a whole lot stronger!

dshields
01-14-2008, 09:13 AM
I love this story. Finally, someone that people know and recognize taking a stand and risking his reputation.

This definitely increased my respect for the man.

Dave

kimosabi
01-14-2008, 09:13 AM
Problem with Snipes case is he filed fraud returns for a refund? He should nto have filed and his claim that the income tax is not valied is a whole lot stronger!
This is how they get you. If you sign the piece of paper, you sign your own incrimination...

Redcard
01-14-2008, 09:14 AM
Because Wesley Snipes is an expert on Contract law, IRS codes, and Constitutional process, right?

Hah.

No, he is saying it because he got caught trying to cheat the system. It's one thing to say the Income Tax is Illegal. It's another thing to file fraudulently to get more money back, thus stealing from ME AND EVERYONE WHO PAID INCOME TAXES, and then claim that it's illegal.

Wyurm
01-14-2008, 09:30 AM
Because Wesley Snipes is an expert on Contract law, IRS codes, and Constitutional process, right?

Hah.

No, he is saying it because he got caught trying to cheat the system. It's one thing to say the Income Tax is Illegal. It's another thing to file fraudulently to get more money back, thus stealing from ME AND EVERYONE WHO PAID INCOME TAXES, and then claim that it's illegal.

You still don't get it do you?
http://www.truthintaxation.us/?tax_inform=whereTaxesGo
I find that people will believe what they want to believe. Even I use the phrase "the taxpayer's money" in reference to money the government spends, but that's not the truth at all. It's the banker's money that the government spends and your tax money pays the interest. So, no, he wasn't stealing from you, me, or anyone else. Furthermore, he was only asking back what he had already paid in.

What he did was to alter the form to make it say no perjury. I'm sure he did that on purpose since this is clearly not about the money, but rather a form of civil disobedience. They won't let him win this one.

Redcard
01-14-2008, 09:35 AM
You still don't get it do you?

Yes.

I get it perfectly.

A rich man got caught gaming the system, trying to make himself richer.

Now he's trying to pretend he has some viewpoints that he didn't have BEFORE he got caught.

Trassin
01-14-2008, 09:36 AM
I wonder if Wesley Snipes became a precinct leader would more people sign up? or would we just be here talking about it?

Voters.RonPaul2008.com

hocaltar
01-14-2008, 09:40 AM
Because Wesley Snipes is an expert on Contract law, IRS codes, and Constitutional process, right?

Hah.

No, he is saying it because he got caught trying to cheat the system. It's one thing to say the Income Tax is Illegal. It's another thing to file fraudulently to get more money back, thus stealing from ME AND EVERYONE WHO PAID INCOME TAXES, and then claim that it's illegal.

Totally irrelevent. Violates the 5th ammendment, end of story.

Redcard
01-14-2008, 09:42 AM
Totally irrelevent. Violates the 5th ammendment, end of story.

If you disagree with an income tax, then don't pay it. Or pay it with your objections.

But don't try to cheat the system to get more than your money back, then suddenly act like you disagree with the income tax AFTER you get caught.

Ernest
01-14-2008, 09:43 AM
W Snipes is full of it. He was playing the race card at first. I guess he figured it wouldn't work to his advantage.

Peace&Freedom
01-14-2008, 09:56 AM
A rich man got caught gaming the system, trying to make himself richer.

Now he's trying to pretend he has some viewpoints that he didn't have BEFORE he got caught.

Actually, Snipes had the tax honesty views prior to things coming to a head with the IRS. Snipes apparently discussed the issues with them and got no answers, which should be reflected in the administrative record the IRS keeps of all submissions sent to them. He will document his prior written attempts to get the IRS to answer his questions about the applicability of tax liability in his case, along with experts and federal court decisions (like Cryer and Bannister) that agree with him.

This reliance defense may acquit him, if a jury is permitted to see the good faith evidence of his attempts to get an answer. Frequently, the judge prevents the defense from presenting any legal exhibits and instructs the jury to accept the IRS claims on face value. Then when a jury convicts the IRS does a press release asserting that the defendant's case was found to have no merit, when in fact it was blocked from being presented.

Xenophage
01-14-2008, 09:57 AM
This could be used to our advantage. A statement from Ron Paul defending Snipe's right not to pay income tax could also be used to discredit the "racist" stuff.

Truth Warrior
01-14-2008, 10:14 AM
IRS Tax courts tend to operate under their own set of rules, not particularly bound to or by the Constitution or the Bill of Rights.<IMHO> Guilty until proven innocent, required self-incrimination, etc.

american.swan
01-14-2008, 12:10 PM
i thought they changed the law where the irs does have to prove something now. before they didn't.

either way, good luck to him.

if he did game the system, then he should be charged with fraud or something and the irs needs to stay out of it mostly.

Young_Apprentice
01-14-2008, 12:24 PM
Ron Paul should come out with a statement that he regards people like Wesley Snipes as Civil Rights leaders up there with Martin Luther King and Rosa Parks in that they use non-violence and peaceful means to protest opressive and unjust laws.

I think I'll drop the campaign website a suggestion to this effect :)

Bad idea. People would misconstrue that as being disrespectful towards MLK and Rosa Parks.

Redcard
01-14-2008, 12:26 PM
Bad idea. People would misconstrue that as being disrespectful towards MLK and Rosa Parks.

No kidding.

A rich tax cheat who tried to use the race card to explain his being caught is nowhere near Rosa Parks or MLK.

Chernitsky
01-14-2008, 12:26 PM
He's right

Edu
01-14-2008, 12:57 PM
i thought they changed the law where the irs does have to prove something now. before they didn't.Yes, they need a court order and the first thing I would ask is prove jurisdiction and your status (as in owned property subject or sovereign).

Since every American thinks they are free and sovereign, if they tell you otherwise (and they do all the time, you just aren't listening) then you better figure out how to get back where you thought you were.

Here's some info on that case:
http://www.givemeliberty.org/RTPLawsuit/Update2005-07-04.htm

This should be common knowledge by now.

Wendi
01-14-2008, 01:21 PM
Civil disobedience to protest the government is one thing. Stealing money that isn't yours by submitting false information is quite another. People like this ruin the reputation of the honest tax protesters.

asgardshill
01-14-2008, 01:24 PM
From Willie Mays Hays to Inmate 8432914437. But there's still hope - Snipes can still get on with Charlie Sheen in the California Penal leagues.

amy31416
01-14-2008, 03:46 PM
Snipes is involved with and supports Nuwaubianism. And while I can respect a group that protests taxes, this is a very racist, religiously radical group that claims that white people are the result of mating with dogs and other, equally bizarre things.

He's not a stand-up guy. Forget about him.

The true peaceful tax protesters will be in worse shape thanks to him.

2young2vote
01-14-2008, 03:48 PM
HMmmmmm. I have been wondering if Ron could pardon all income tax evaders. Couldn't Ron advocate not paying the income tax just by saying "I will pardon all Income Tax evadors so do not worry if you do not pay it"? He wouldn't say that he wants them to not pay it but he could drop little hints.

hillertexas
01-14-2008, 03:51 PM
Does anyone have an IMDB Pro account so we can get Snipes' contact info...
We could use his endorsement

CountryboyRonPaul
01-14-2008, 03:56 PM
Ron Paul should come out with a statement that he regards people like Wesley Snipes as Civil Rights leaders up there with Martin Luther King and Rosa Parks in that they use non-violence and peaceful means to protest opressive and unjust laws.

I think I'll drop the campaign website a suggestion to this effect :)

I don't know if Snipes is on that same level yet, but an endorsement from Snipes would be great :D

Peace&Freedom
01-14-2008, 04:22 PM
Snipes is involved with and supports Nuwaubianism. And while I can respect a group that protests taxes, this is a very racist, religiously radical group that claims that white people are the result of mating with dogs and other, equally bizarre things.

He's not a stand-up guy. Forget about him.

The true peaceful tax protesters will be in worse shape thanks to him.

I know nothing about Nuwaubianism, but I do know Snipes has advocated for the 861 position, which puts him in the category of being in the tax HONESTY movement, not a tax PROTESTOR. Tax Protestors protest the law and defy it as an act of civil disobedience. Tax HONESTY supporters are NOT protesting the law, they are rejecting FRAUD, by objecting to the misapplication of the tax CODE (it's not positive law) against themselves and most Americans.

If you get a bill from the Moscow Tax Authority saying you are liable for Russian taxes, do you owe it? Must you pay for a tax that doesn't APPLY to you, since you don't live in Moscow or ever visited the place? If you object to paying it, it doesn't mean you are evading or defying the Russian laws, you are objecting to the wrongful assessment and enforcement of them (under color of Law) against someone who is not SUBJECT to them. Snipes is saying the code's jurisdiction is limited, regardless of how universally (and unlawfully) it is misapplied. If he is mixing the honesty argument with some racism angle, yes he is weakening his position, but it's not tax evasion to object to a tax he is not subject to.

CountryboyRonPaul
01-14-2008, 04:30 PM
Snipes is involved with and supports Nuwaubianism. And while I can respect a group that protests taxes, this is a very racist, religiously radical group that claims that white people are the result of mating with dogs and other, equally bizarre things.

He's not a stand-up guy. Forget about him.

The true peaceful tax protesters will be in worse shape thanks to him.

I researched that Nuwaubianism on Wikipedia.... Wow! those people are strange!!

But it does say....

"York has been quoted by his followers as saying that he is a Republican and so Nuwaubians are encouraged to vote Republican"


lol, so I guess that's good news for us?