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View Full Version : The damage is done, the media did its job




Ann Kobialka
01-11-2008, 04:59 AM
Everywhere right now, the tv, the papers the blogs its all Ron Paul Racist. Even if he gets an interview before the next primary its going to be "ARE you a RACIST"
I am sick at how this is playing out.

m72mc
01-11-2008, 05:05 AM
no publicity is bad publicity

at least ppl hear his name

Agent CSL
01-11-2008, 05:07 AM
People hear his name. The smart people investigate. The smart people will find out it's not true.

But.... Intelligence is something you don't find often.

Taco John
01-11-2008, 05:11 AM
It's blowing over among the supporters. It wont sink us. We know that Dr. Paul isn't racist.

Look at what happened last night. We had a Ron Paul revival here. All of a sudden, everybody is ready for another money bomb. It will blow over. They'll keep trying to bring it back, but eventually, it will backfire on them because they'll push it one to many times.

He's had to deal with this in every race he's been in... Here... Read this... Take comfort:

http://www.concordmonitor.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080105/FRONTPAGE/801050301

WilliamC
01-11-2008, 05:15 AM
Remember that this is the worst dirt they can dig up on Ron Paul and it has no basis in fact.

Think about the dirt and scandels Clinton went through before elected, and he was a two-term President.

davidhperry
01-11-2008, 05:33 AM
Everywhere right now, the tv, the papers the blogs its all Ron Paul Racist. Even if he gets an interview before the next primary its going to be "ARE you a RACIST"
I am sick at how this is playing out.

I'm frustrated as well. Remember though, the MSM and people in general have a very short attention span. The vast majority of folks out there are still not paying attention. Most people don't decide who they're voting for until a few days before the election. That's why is so important to become a precinct captain.

manny
01-11-2008, 05:34 AM
Well Ron didn't write that stuff.

John McCain definately did refer to Asians as "gooks" for years, in print and in person.

Nobody makes any fuss any more.

http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/opinion/hongop.shtml

http://www.asianweek.com/2000_02_24/feature_mccainapology.html


And this is before we get to all the arabs he would kill in the middle east, and the children of african-americans he would sacrifice to do it.

Ron Paul is the anti-racist candidate and we have to help him get the message out.

Rather than damage being done I am impressed the last couple of days how completely Ron has killed it as an issue. On CNN no less he destroyed the accusation.

the Winner is (R0N P@uL)
01-11-2008, 05:48 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EjVQ7X2l4jc

Talcott
01-11-2008, 05:48 AM
Breing the smears on it makes me fighten Mad.

Rintrah
01-11-2008, 05:57 AM
The damage has long been done. Omission has been their main weapon. I'd rather have them attacking than silence.

NJ Carlos
01-11-2008, 06:01 AM
"First they ignore you, then they ridicule you, then they fight you, then you win." -- Mahatma Gandhi

amy31416
01-11-2008, 06:19 AM
The damage has long been done. Omission has been their main weapon. I'd rather have them attacking than silence.

Same here. Ron's pissy rant to Wolf gave him an opportunity to mention a lot of his beliefs and thoughts vehemently.

I like to see that.

losinglife
01-11-2008, 06:21 AM
dont feed the trolls!

ChicagoLawyer
01-11-2008, 07:17 AM
It's blowing over among the supporters. It wont sink us. We know that Dr. Paul isn't racist.

Look at what happened last night. We had a Ron Paul revival here. All of a sudden, everybody is ready for another money bomb. It will blow over. They'll keep trying to bring it back, but eventually, it will backfire on them because they'll push it one to many times.

He's had to deal with this in every race he's been in... Here... Read this... Take comfort:

http://www.concordmonitor.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080105/FRONTPAGE/801050301

Well, it hasn't blown over for me. I am having serious reservations about campaigning for Ron Paul now. I can now longer tell people Ron Paul is an upstanding man. He is in many ways, but he's had an obvious moral failing with not policing his own newsletter for years when it put out vile commentary under his own name. I may resign from my campaign positions over this.

rodent
01-11-2008, 07:23 AM
Well, it hasn't blown over for me. I am having serious reservations about campaigning for Ron Paul now. I can now longer tell people Ron Paul is an upstanding man. He is in many ways, but he's had an obvious moral failing with not policing his own newsletter for years when it put out vile commentary under his own name. I may resign from my campaign positions over this.

Well, imagine what it was like for minorities like me when we saw that picture of RP with Don Black. Still, I don't believe he's a racist and freedom is still the best policy.

Honestly, financial collapse is more of a threat to me and my family than the KKK is. Incidentally, financial collapse is more of a threat to low income whites also. We're all in this together, and some dumb newsletter is just a distraction. Keep your eyes on freedom.

Proemio
01-11-2008, 07:26 AM
Well, it hasn't blown over for me. I am having serious reservations about campaigning for Ron Paul now. I can now longer tell people Ron Paul is an upstanding man. He is in many ways, but he's had an obvious moral failing with not policing his own newsletter for years when it put out vile commentary under his own name. I may resign from my campaign positions over this.

That's especially funny coming from a "lawyer"...

JordanL
01-11-2008, 07:31 AM
Well, it hasn't blown over for me. I am having serious reservations about campaigning for Ron Paul now. I can now longer tell people Ron Paul is an upstanding man. He is in many ways, but he's had an obvious moral failing with not policing his own newsletter for years when it put out vile commentary under his own name. I may resign from my campaign positions over this.

You've been here for a while, so I can't really say with confidence that you're simply a plant. So let me respond.

If you listen to Dr. Paul, he talks about how in a lot of ways, prior to the 90's he was fairly apolitical. When he describes the reason he ever got into Congress before, it was always because he was interested in economics.

So, keeping that in mind it doesn't surprise me at all that a newsletter published under his name while he wasnt even in Congress was not at the top of his mind. Think about it... if you were doing what you really enjoyed... helping people with their unborn child and bringing that joy into their lives... would you really be that concerned with what exactly was going into a newsletter? Especially if you didn't feel like you'd ever be involved in politics again?

If it really bothers you to the point that you no longer want to support him, I cannot imagine what supporting any of the other candidates would feel like. Dr. Paul's "fault" was that he wasn't intimitely concerned with that others were saying. If that's the biggest fault, I think we're doing pretty good, especially since it isn't somethign which he tollerates any longer.

Wyurm
01-11-2008, 07:31 AM
We have known about this stupid newsletter since I joined the grassroots back in June. It's been on his Wiki page with an explaination, in countless blogs, in message boards (suicide girls board for example) and it has been for a long time now. However, it didn't get major media attention untill just now at the beginning of the primaries. Call this what it really is: A very under-handed smear campaign. It's utter BS and we all know it.

I don't see any reason to panic over it, just stand up to it. Haven't you been called names or wrongfully accused before? Just don't let it work.

Wyurm
01-11-2008, 07:32 AM
Well, it hasn't blown over for me. I am having serious reservations about campaigning for Ron Paul now. I can now longer tell people Ron Paul is an upstanding man. He is in many ways, but he's had an obvious moral failing with not policing his own newsletter for years when it put out vile commentary under his own name. I may resign from my campaign positions over this.

You make sure to tell me when you find someone that has never made a mistake and I'll vote for them.

RPSignbomb
01-11-2008, 07:52 AM
Everywhere right now, the tv, the papers the blogs its all Ron Paul Racist. Even if he gets an interview before the next primary its going to be "ARE you a RACIST"
I am sick at how this is playing out.

With all due respect to Dr. Paul, it's his own fault. His excuses that he has no idea is terrible. Figure out who did it and pass the damn blame. As it stands now it leaves people guessing "If he does not know who wrote or took care of his newsletter how can I trust him"

I know Dr. Paul is not a racist ... but come on, this is terrible damage control.

j6p
01-11-2008, 07:55 AM
Stop Nit Picking

ceakins
01-11-2008, 07:58 AM
Well, it hasn't blown over for me. I am having serious reservations about campaigning for Ron Paul now. I can now longer tell people Ron Paul is an upstanding man. He is in many ways, but he's had an obvious moral failing with not policing his own newsletter for years when it put out vile commentary under his own name. I may resign from my campaign positions over this.

Obviously you're clueless about a doctors schedule. Those babies always come out on schedule at an appointment. I'd assume you're more educated than that, since you claim to be a lawyer.

RonPaulFTFW
01-11-2008, 08:22 AM
all we need to do is keep going.

they have no real leg to stand on here and they know it.
we just need to make some bigger news.

ChicagoLawyer
01-11-2008, 08:23 AM
The reason I am upset about this now, and was not before this week, was that before it seemed like it was in one or two newletters from 1992. I understand how a ghostwritter could put offensive remarks in one or two that Dr. Paul overlooked.

But now that TNR story is out, I know that's not what happened. These newsletters went out with this shit in them for a number of years. Would any of you allow a newsletter to go out under your own name for years and not look at them? Please. I'm sure Dr. Paul at least reviewed some of them, at least after they went out. And after he saw this vile stuff he should have fired or at least reprimanded the offender(s) (and found out who they were!) and put a stop to the practice. He didn't, or if he did it wasn't for a number of years.

I still plan on voting for Dr. Paul because he's the candidate with the closest views (by far) to mine. But I'm not sure if I can campaign for him because when you campaign for someone you tell voters "Vote for this guy because he's an upstanding man." I could say "vote for this guy because his views are great" and then when they ask me about his character say "well, he really fucked up with this newsletter he had, but he's now kind of apologized" but that won't be terribly effective, will it?

You guys may not realize it now, but this story may have rolled-back much of the good that Dr. Paul's campaign has done for the freedom movement. I've been in this movement for 15 years, and I've spend many many hours and dollars and family strain on Dr. Paul's campaign. But for the last 72 hours I've been about as low about politics as I've ever been. I'm disappointed in Ron Paul and his staff and I'm disappointed that this chance to help bring back liberty in our lifetimes has suffered a large (but not fatal, I hope) blow.

RonPaulFTFW
01-11-2008, 08:25 AM
Well, it hasn't blown over for me. I am having serious reservations about campaigning for Ron Paul now. I can now longer tell people Ron Paul is an upstanding man. He is in many ways, but he's had an obvious moral failing with not policing his own newsletter for years when it put out vile commentary under his own name. I may resign from my campaign positions over this.

It obvious you don't understand his message or the man if you're that easily swayed by his enemies.

course, I'm sure you've never been to busy to control everything in your life and you have a lot of experience running a newsletter.

If it has rolled back any good we've done it's only because people who supported him weren't real supporters anyway. in which case we haven't lost much.

I'd be ashamed to let the media control my thoughts on Dr. Paul.

me3
01-11-2008, 08:38 AM
You guys may not realize it now, but this story may have rolled-back much of the good that Dr. Paul's campaign has done for the freedom movement. I've been in this movement for 15 years, and I've spend many many hours and dollars and family strain on Dr. Paul's campaign. But for the last 72 hours I've been about as low about politics as I've ever been. I'm disappointed in Ron Paul and his staff and I'm disappointed that this chance to help bring back liberty in our lifetimes has suffered a large (but not fatal, I hope) blow.
This isn't unreasonable. I spent at least a day feeling ill and confused. It's been a tough week.

I knew about the newsletters, but not the volume of them, the length of time they ran, and some of the more personalized aspects of them.

But the question is, how do we move on? Even naming names right now, might not help. It's unfortunate, but we'll have to grin and bear it.

One thing is sure. This is a big wakeup call to anyone who is a political neophyte.

ChicagoLawyer
01-11-2008, 08:44 AM
It obvious you don't understand his message or the man if you're that easily swayed by his enemies.

course, I'm sure you've never been to busy to control everything in your life and you have a lot of experience running a newsletter.

If it has rolled back any good we've done it's only because people who supported him weren't real supporters anyway. in which case we haven't lost much.

I'd be ashamed to let the media control my thoughts on Dr. Paul.

If it came out that Dr. Paul was actually an embezzler of his patient's money would that make you rethink your support? He of course isn't an embezzler, but the point is our support for him shouldn't be blind faith, it should be based on his ideas and his character. Even with this story he still may have the strongest character of all the candidates. None of them should be exactly proud of their entire past. But because it's on the issue of race it gives me pause because what was (1) in his own newsletters (2) under his own name (3) for a number of years was antithetical to the reason I support him.

I'd be ashamed to let my own blind faith in a candidate control my thoughts about him. I wish this shit had never happened, but it did and each of us has to deal with its moral implications.

RPSignbomb
01-11-2008, 08:52 AM
It obvious you don't understand his message or the man if you're that easily swayed by his enemies.

course, I'm sure you've never been to busy to control everything in your life and you have a lot of experience running a newsletter.

If it has rolled back any good we've done it's only because people who supported him weren't real supporters anyway. in which case we haven't lost much.

I'd be ashamed to let the media control my thoughts on Dr. Paul.

lolololololol -- if a Romeny or McCain Newsletter had contained the same stuff you would be crushing them. ADMIT IT!

ThePieSwindler
01-11-2008, 08:53 AM
If it came out that Dr. Paul was actually an embezzler of his patient's money would that make you rethink your support? He of course isn't an embezzler, but the point is our support for him shouldn't be blind faith, it should be based on his ideas and his character. Even with this story he still may have the strongest character of all the candidates. None of them should be exactly proud of their entire past. But because it's on the issue of race it gives me pause because what was (1) in his own newsletters (2) under his own name (3) for a number of years was antithetical to the reason I support him.

I'd be ashamed to let my own blind faith in a candidate control my thoughts about him. I wish this shit had never happened, but it did and each of us has to deal with its moral implications.

Agreed. Although i am certainly not dropping my support of the campaign, the emotions you feel are very understandable. Ron Paul is certainly not a racist, and i trust he is a good guy, but why these were ever published bothers me. I believe him when he says he doesnt know much about it, but still something bother me. In all honesty, i dont even think thsoe pieces are as "racist" as many are making them out to be, just very un-PC, but thats no excuse for what 90% of people would see otherwise. Its a sticky situation, i think its hypocritical that the media highlights it yet lets threats to wipe a nation or a religion or a people off the face of the earth slide, but apparently black people are more in the spotlight when it comes to racism than everyone else.

This whole situation frustrates me. I still support Dr. Paul, i will still campaign for him. But this has bothered me, and i understand your emotions.

Stealth4
01-11-2008, 09:02 AM
Well, it hasn't blown over for me. I am having serious reservations about campaigning for Ron Paul now. I can now longer tell people Ron Paul is an upstanding man. He is in many ways, but he's had an obvious moral failing with not policing his own newsletter for years when it put out vile commentary under his own name. I may resign from my campaign positions over this.

I know he didnt write it, and I know he isnt a racist - an omission of oversight is OK with me once in 72 years - too bad it had to be this though.

I am just curious how he doesnt know who did write it. thats the only part thats odd to me.

I will not stop supporting Paul because of this, its not a legitimate reason not to (but in making it out to more than it is, the MSM does have a goal of hurting his support)

jaumen
01-11-2008, 09:03 AM
lolololololol -- if a Romeny or McCain Newsletter had contained the same stuff you would be crushing them. ADMIT IT!

I can't speak for him, but if I was given the exact same facts but hey applied to Romney or McCain I would not consider it a legitimate attack on them either. Ron Paul is not a racist, you know it, and I know it. He has essentially said he should have given it more oversight. He made a mistake, and he admits he made a mistake. What more can you ask for?

KewlRonduderules
01-11-2008, 09:06 AM
I think Dr. Paul said it best. If you are an owner of a company or a TV network- you simply cannot monitor everything that goes published or advertised. It is impossible. Moreover, these letters had such a low level of circulation- no wonder it took years to get back to him!!! Wasn't he a practicing MD at the time- You know this can make you very busy.

I'd encourage people to think about this critically.

He already has taken moral responsibility- 10-15 years ago for heaven's sake!!!

Don't believe the hype people.

;)

Quick
01-11-2008, 09:07 AM
Like I've been saying all week.

All of these stories will die down in the next few days or so. It just needs to make its way through the news cycle.

Look at other "scandels" that the candidates have had. Remember when information leaked about Rudy a few months ago? It was in the news for a few days, and it was gone.

Same with this. If this was a new story, then it might linger but because its been brought up numerous times in the past, those who aren't aware of it need to bring it up.

It will fade soon.

RPSignbomb
01-11-2008, 09:09 AM
I can't speak for him, but if I was given the exact same facts but hey applied to Romney or McCain I would not consider it a legitimate attack on them either. Ron Paul is not a racist, you know it, and I know it. He has essentially said he should have given it more oversight. He made a mistake, and he admits he made a mistake. What more can you ask for?

I would like Dr. Paul to expose who wrote this stuff. Not to say, "I don't know" well, they were working for you Dr. Paul.... figure it out.

We all know he did not write this stuff but a guy who is a "policy buff" not reading his own newsletter is crazy.

I did like the outrage he showed to Wolf last night - really good.

dirknb@hotmail.com
01-11-2008, 09:11 AM
At least he didn't inhale or get a blowjob from an intern.

jaumen
01-11-2008, 09:11 AM
I would like Dr. Paul to expose who wrote this stuff. Not to say, "I don't know" well, they were working for you Dr. Paul.... figure it out.

We all know he did not write this stuff but a guy who is a "policy buff" not reading his own newsletter is crazy.

I did like the outrage he showed to Wolf last night - really good.

But why does it matter who wrote it? So you can know the name of a racist? How does that matter? If we know Paul didn't write it, and he is sorry that he was negligent in monitoring the newsletter, isn't that all we need to know?

RonPaulFTFW
01-11-2008, 09:14 AM
If it came out that Dr. Paul was actually an embezzler of his patient's money would that make you rethink your support? He of course isn't an embezzler, but the point is our support for him shouldn't be blind faith, it should be based on his ideas and his character. Even with this story he still may have the strongest character of all the candidates. None of them should be exactly proud of their entire past. But because it's on the issue of race it gives me pause because what was (1) in his own newsletters (2) under his own name (3) for a number of years was antithetical to the reason I support him.

I'd be ashamed to let my own blind faith in a candidate control my thoughts about him. I wish this shit had never happened, but it did and each of us has to deal with its moral implications.

He didn't write it and I believe him.
He has no record of being racist on any level or saying anything racist.

His ideas are very anti-racist.

if you can't see that you're daft and we don't need you.

RonPaulFTFW
01-11-2008, 09:16 AM
lolololololol -- if a Romeny or McCain Newsletter had contained the same stuff you would be crushing them. ADMIT IT!

Romney and McCain are liars who don't have any decent ideas, and they actively say racist things in public debates.

Ron Paul doesn't and has great ideas that make sense.

I'm not going to change my mind because some bitter asshole decided to try to drag down Dr. Paul when he was doing well.

Deborah K
01-11-2008, 09:18 AM
Everywhere right now, the tv, the papers the blogs its all Ron Paul Racist. Even if he gets an interview before the next primary its going to be "ARE you a RACIST"
I am sick at how this is playing out.

That's why it's important for us to go to bat for him. Every time you come across these accusations, you need to address it with the venue that is putting it out there.

Get your words together and put up the best defense you can for him. He is NOT a racist. We ALL know that. NOONE can prove otherwise and those old newsletters prove nothing.

Remember, at the time they were written, Dr. Paul was practicing medicine and doing speaking engagements around the country. He rarely even read the newsletter. He was NOT in charge of the newsletter (publisher - editor) and there were many changes and transitions going on within the company that WAS in charge. His mistake was in trusting that the company would be careful about who they let write for the newsletter.

It was an honest oversight. These allegations have resurfaced time and time again over the years and are always quelled. It's all they have on him.

Madison
01-11-2008, 09:18 AM
It's blowing over among the supporters. It wont sink us. We know that Dr. Paul isn't racist.

Look at what happened last night. We had a Ron Paul revival here. All of a sudden, everybody is ready for another money bomb. It will blow over. They'll keep trying to bring it back, but eventually, it will backfire on them because they'll push it one to many times.

I think you are misunderstanding the situation. Their primary target isn't longtime Ron Paul supporters. They know we are devoted. They are targeting ALL potential voters with the smears. Underestimating them and pretending they aren't having much of an effect will only work to our detriment.

wsc321
01-11-2008, 09:19 AM
First of all, how many potential Ron Paul supporters wouldn't respond positively to the following question prior to Dr. Paul's explanation: "C'mon... you don't trust the media, do you?" IOW - aren't we already constrained to finding supporters among Americans who are either mistrusting of, or at least willing to question, the media?

So one approach would be to [1] remind a potential supporter that they cannot trust the media, then [2] simply point out that this is a decade old story about words Ron Paul himself has never written or spoken, and contradict everything he stands for. It's a simple mistake, nothing more, and the only dirt his opponents have ever been able to find on him.

Ronstock '08
01-11-2008, 09:20 AM
Everywhere right now, the tv, the papers the blogs its all Ron Paul Racist. Even if he gets an interview before the next primary its going to be "ARE you a RACIST"
I am sick at how this is playing out.


We knew this was coming. It was just a matter of when.

wsc321
01-11-2008, 09:21 AM
...His mistake was in trusting...

Great point.

Ann Kobialka
01-11-2008, 09:47 AM
First I am getting very tired of the word Troll being thrown around on almost every thread I read anymoe.
Second this child that is telling people "WE DON"T NEED YOU" grow up.
Who really cares how devoted you are to a sky high dream, and how many noodles you ate to save up $20 bucks to send into the campaign. There are some adults here strategizing, not hero worshiping. Enough of that one.
Now my original point is this is going to have a very strong impact on the next primary state. People looking now because the campaign is moving to thier state are going to see and read this. It will influence thier vote, That's why its being done and that is what sickens me.
And my last point to you younger members here, the internet is tapped out. So all this get it to the top of dig and get it u tubed is not getting votes. I know in your circles it seems like you are on the top of the world in a movement that just can't loose. But in my circles, I'm 55 and a grandmother, no one knows who Ron Paul is. That's why he comes in 5th. If they have heard about him at work, the PTA, Church, ect it's he's fringe, crazy, liberal, or not electable. All the labels the MSM have applied to him. As a grandma I probably fielded 60 calls through the holidays with family and friends all over the country and thats what I got for responses.
Want to help stop looking down your runny noses at anyone over forty and get to work talking to voters who vote and have money. And as unconventional as this is go to your local nursing home and get your self a quick 50 voters by being nice to some real old folks for a couple hours. Everyone of them look forward to voting it gets them out for the day. And they vote for who the tv tells them to. Oh that's right your guys hate OLD people. Well because the old people are voting for mccain instead of Dr. Paul he won and we got 5th.

RonPaulFTFW
01-11-2008, 09:59 AM
First I am getting very tired of the word Troll being thrown around on almost every thread I read anymoe.
Second this child that is telling people "WE DON"T NEED YOU" grow up.
Who really cares how devoted you are to a sky high dream, and how many noodles you ate to save up $20 bucks to send into the campaign. There are some adults here strategizing, not hero worshiping. Enough of that one.
Now my original point is this is going to have a very strong impact on the next primary state. People looking now because the campaign is moving to thier state are going to see and read this. It will influence thier vote, That's why its being done and that is what sickens me.
And my last point to you younger members here, the internet is tapped out. So all this get it to the top of dig and get it u tubed is not getting votes. I know in your circles it seems like you are on the top of the world in a movement that just can't loose. But in my circles, I'm 55 and a grandmother, no one knows who Ron Paul is. That's why he comes in 5th. If they have heard about him at work, the PTA, Church, ect it's he's fringe, crazy, liberal, or not electable. All the labels the MSM have applied to him. As a grandma I probably fielded 60 calls through the holidays with family and friends all over the country and thats what I got for responses.
Want to help stop looking down your runny noses at anyone over forty and get to work talking to voters who vote and have money. And as unconventional as this is go to your local nursing home and get your self a quick 50 voters by being nice to some real old folks for a couple hours. Everyone of them look forward to voting it gets them out for the day. And they vote for who the tv tells them to. Oh that's right your guys hate OLD people. Well because the old people are voting for mccain instead of Dr. Paul he won and we got 5th.

I'm almost 30 and I don't eat noodles. Thanks.
My point is that if you're letting hit pieces and smear jobs influence your weak and impressionable mind you're not going to help get the word out anyway.

So why try to beg these people to "stay with us" and "spread the word." It's obvious they are the kind of people who are easily swayed by the mainstream media and will jump on to any bandwagon that comes around. Who would support Ron Paul and understand his message and then turn their back on him when he needs them most? Right when he asked us all to stay together? A person who doesn't get it and never will, that's who.

As far As myself I'm very active in my meetup, hand out Paul DVDs and Canvass the City of Raleigh quite a bit. I'm constantly talking to real people "IRL" who need to hear Paul's message.

Your "hate old people" tirade isn't applicable and doesn't fit.

Age has nothing to do with be weak willed.

Thumper
01-11-2008, 10:02 AM
Hey, maybe with all the negative media we can get the racist sheeple vote that would normally go to Thompson, McCain or Giuliani...just a thought.



So why try to beg these people to "stay with us" and "spread the word." It's obvious they are the kind of people who are easily swayed by the mainstream media and will jump on to any bandwagon that comes around. Who would support Ron Paul and understand his message and then turn their back on him when he needs them most? Right when he asked us all to stay together? A person who doesn't get it and never will, that's who.



From a business standpoint, customer retention is cheaper than finding new customers. We don't need to be hemmoraging supporters and trying to fill the gap with new ones for a net gain of zero new supporters. Getting new people on board is important, but if they're only replacing people that we're losing it doesn't help matters much. Instead of telling people that have concerns about what is being said in the media to "Fuck Off", "Grow Up", "Leave" etc etc etc we should be trying to retain their support.

I know dealing with negativity isnt fun but if someone already want's to support RP it shouldnt be that dfficult to help them understand what is going on or at least keep them from rushing to judgement until this issue shakes out.

CountryRoads
01-11-2008, 10:03 AM
Racist is the drug war that puts hundreds of thousands of minorities in prison. Ron Paul wants to stop the drug war. Ron Paul is the anti-racist.

RonPaulFTFW
01-11-2008, 10:07 AM
Racist is the drug war that puts hundreds of thousands of minorities in prison. Ron Paul wants to stop the drug war. Ron Paul is the anti-racist.

Yeah... why talk about the real issue of what's racist when you can bitch and complain about a ghost written smear job.

WeWillWin08
01-11-2008, 10:08 AM
I strongly suggest that everyone please read this thread "Paulites, We are WINNING (Paulites, We are WINNING!)!"

I think tihs puts forth some very good arguements about what is going on.

Guymontag
01-11-2008, 10:27 AM
"I dont want to trade with them, they only want to trade Burkas"

"We will send them to meet those virgins they always talk about"

Those two comments are just as racist as what what said in the newsletter but because it refers to an American enemy its okay, just like McCain saying "Gooks". I couldnt imagine being a muslim in this country and having to deal with that kind of hate. The media singling out some old news letters when the realm racism is happening on the Fox News debate stage shows that our society accepts racism with open arms as long as its not blacks, gays, jews or mexicans. "Rag heads" and "Gooks" are fair game.

evadmurd
01-11-2008, 10:28 AM
People hear his name. The smart people investigate. The smart people will find out it's not true.

It's unfortunate that most voters are not smart people. baaaaaa.

robatsu
01-11-2008, 10:56 AM
This scandal has two components. The first is "are you a racist'? The second is, how could this have happened on your watch.

In the cnn interview and other damage control, RP very effectively addresses the first issue, whether he is a racist or not. Most reasonable people are willing to grant that he is not.

But the second issue, of how something like this could have gone on, even intermittently, for a couple of years, has not been addressed. The previous story, a rogue writer dismissed after one or two troublesome passages was fully believable. The current story, a newsletter with your name on it containing occasionally scurrilous material - how many of us would not know about something like that going out for several years under our names. His explanation just isn't believable, which actually is good, because if it was believable, it would mean Ron Paul is a complete idiot. But we know he is not, so noone reasonable can reallly believe the story.

Anyhow, as much as I love Ron Paul, check my post history, I'm far from a troll, I don't see recovery in a meaningful way from this crisis until he can address, "ok, we know you're not a racist, but how did this happen" and the answer is more than a mysterious one-armed man. Even for those of us who don't care, this isn't a moral issue, but a necessary piece of a campaign going forward - believe me, you need a pretty darn good explanation about how a racist newsletter was published in your name to remain viable for President of the U.S. in 2008

Anyone who thinks they are picking on RP is kidding themselves. This would be made hay of on any candidate - look at what happened to Trent Lott, for instance.

So while like most people on this board, I was heartened by Ron on CNN, the damage control is only partially complete. Just as I was hoping that HQ would do something instead of their initial lame-o response, they did. I'm also hoping that they are keeping on top of this, realizing that they need to more fully address the second element of the story.

Just my opinion.

mconder
01-11-2008, 10:57 AM
People hear his name. The smart people investigate. The smart people will find out it's not true.

But.... Intelligence is something you don't find often.

All two of them.

Andrew-Austin
01-11-2008, 11:01 AM
no publicity is bad publicity

at least ppl hear his name

Sheeple associate the word "racist" with his name, not exactly a good thing.

Iwantchange
01-11-2008, 11:05 AM
Look if we act like a "moth to a flame" then it's going to get the attention we don't want. In about a week most Americans will forget that it even happen. I think Ron Paul has done an excellent job of adressing it, and we should follow in his foot steps. Don't bring it up unless it's brought up, and if it is adress it the same way Ron Paul did.

BLS
01-11-2008, 11:06 AM
The reason I am upset about this now, and was not before this week, was that before it seemed like it was in one or two newletters from 1992. I understand how a ghostwritter could put offensive remarks in one or two that Dr. Paul overlooked.

But now that TNR story is out, I know that's not what happened. These newsletters went out with this shit in them for a number of years. Would any of you allow a newsletter to go out under your own name for years and not look at them? Please. I'm sure Dr. Paul at least reviewed some of them, at least after they went out. And after he saw this vile stuff he should have fired or at least reprimanded the offender(s) (and found out who they were!) and put a stop to the practice. He didn't, or if he did it wasn't for a number of years.

I still plan on voting for Dr. Paul because he's the candidate with the closest views (by far) to mine. But I'm not sure if I can campaign for him because when you campaign for someone you tell voters "Vote for this guy because he's an upstanding man." I could say "vote for this guy because his views are great" and then when they ask me about his character say "well, he really fucked up with this newsletter he had, but he's now kind of apologized" but that won't be terribly effective, will it?

You guys may not realize it now, but this story may have rolled-back much of the good that Dr. Paul's campaign has done for the freedom movement. I've been in this movement for 15 years, and I've spend many many hours and dollars and family strain on Dr. Paul's campaign. But for the last 72 hours I've been about as low about politics as I've ever been. I'm disappointed in Ron Paul and his staff and I'm disappointed that this chance to help bring back liberty in our lifetimes has suffered a large (but not fatal, I hope) blow.


Brother...you and I have been around here a long time.

You are allowing yourself to fall into the trap the media wants you to fall into.
This is their one and only 'ace up their sleeve', and it doesn't have real teeth.

If you allow them to manipulate you into getting down on this, and withdrawing from the campaign, they win. And that's exactly what they are trying to do.

You know it. I know it. Everyone knows it.

Don't let your emotions get in the way of your judgement.
(ha ha...I should talk....but you know what i"m saying)

NOBODY.....anywhere, ever, can come forward and say they have heard Ron say anything like this.

So regardless of whether he knew or not, he does NOT share that belief.
Did he screw up? Yup. Somewhere, somethings not right.

Who's he covering for? I don't know. Maybe he really didn't know.
It's just quite possible that our good Dr was blind to the whole thing.

RevolutionSD
01-11-2008, 11:18 AM
We're in the attack stage folks.
None of us should be surprised.
I called this several weeks ago when the first tiny little attacks were coming out. I said it would get a LOT worse. It always does.

First they ignore you
Then they make fun of you
Then they attack you
Then you WIN

This is NOT the time to give up because of a baseless attack. It was expected. Let's counter it wherever possible and move on...we've got some winning to do!

RonPaulFTFW
01-11-2008, 11:24 AM
I think a lot of you are forgetting that Ron Paul stands for Liberty. The real meaning.

That means that if racists, nazi's, black panthers, truthers, anarchist, commies, whatever... if they want to say things they have that right to say it, as long as they aren't violent or threaten the rights of others.

They have the right to believe what they want to believe, vote, give money, write papers... they are Americans. Ron Paul believes in the true concept of liberty that all people have the right to think whatever they want, even if it's disgusting and vile. I support that too.

Ron Paul is a christian and is anti-abortion. I'm very very against both of those ideals but I still love the man.

Why are you letting the MSM push you out of this?

Please grow some stones and stand up for something instead of worrying about being PC.

Joe3113
01-11-2008, 11:27 AM
We're in the attack stage folks.
None of us should be surprised.
I called this several weeks ago when the first tiny little attacks were coming out. I said it would get a LOT worse. It always does.

First they ignore you
Then they make fun of you
Then they attack you
Then you WIN

This is NOT the time to give up because of a baseless attack. It was expected. Let's counter it wherever possible and move on...we've got some winning to do!

+1

I'm actually liking all the attention :D

I'm assuming there are still a lot of closet racists in the south right?

korch
01-11-2008, 11:28 AM
I see two streams of thought in this argument:

1) He's at worst a closet racist, at best delinquent in management by allowing these articles to be published.

2) He doesn't know who wrote them, and he didn't write them--so who cares?


I'd like to offer a third, that, to me, appears to be completely absent in all discussion.

The articles themselves, while distasteful, are neither racist, homophobic, or anti-semitic.

The articles on the LA riots aren't racist. They're harsh, but neither racist or false. If people can't deal with it, it's not Ron's place to apologize for hurting their feelings--regardless of who wrote it.

The David Duke article does not praise David Duke. It argues that Duke was able to garner 9% of the black vote running on the platform of individual liberty despite his background, and questions what it was that allowed an admitted KKK member to get that many votes from black voters--concluding that the liberty message is powerful enough to overcome even Duke's serious issues to get a reasonable amount of minority vote. It is not a praise of Duke--it is a praise of the liberty message using Duke to make the point as to how powerful it is.

The MLK articles (not in Ron's writing style from what I've seen of it) is very harsh, but apparently true as well. The data offered appears to be pointing to another author's work (that author being a black man who outs this info.) The article is also an argument of voting against a federal holiday for King--which, FWIW, is no longer celebrated at the corporation I work for since being purchased by the Brits. (I guess you don't have to worry about not honoring King's holiday if you aren't a US company as it can't be used in the squealing points.)

The articles on staying in the closet just appear to be ranting decrying the need for homosexuals to proudly proclaim their orientation to all. Where I live, there is a fairly large football homecoming parade yearly that always has a gay pride float where the participants are often clad in leather chest straps and chaps, dirty dancing and making out with their partners for shock value. Simultaneously, the streets are usually lined with parents with small children. (Adults don't watch parades by and large.) Now, I don't give a sh!t who you sleep with, love, or want to marry (hell marriage is financial trap in the modern era anyway, and if gays get state-backed marriage, they may come to regret it)--but no parent should have to answer a lot of questions from a 5-6 year old after seeing a float like this when no other float's parade participants feel the need to act this way in what is designed as a family atmosphere.

As to the anti-semitism, being against the Israel lobby in Washington is in no way anti-semitic period.

I guess my point is this:

We are buying into a two-pronged smokescreen whereby we are now correctly defending Paul against the attacks, but missing the point that the attacks have been framed to generate dissent due to matters of taste--not factual -isms.

Top that off with the blatancy of some posters who are here to stir the sh!t in a "sympathetic" manner, and you have what I am now witnessing.

It's a facade! The whole argument!

Hell, if I knew the authors, I wouldn't out them either in the face of a bullsh!t scandal.

I'm done now.

Joe3113
01-11-2008, 11:28 AM
I think a lot of you are forgetting that Ron Paul stands for Liberty. The real meaning.

That means that if racists, nazi's, black panthers, truthers, anarchist, commies, whatever... if they want to say things they have that right to say it, as long as they aren't violent or threaten the rights of others.

They have the right to believe what they want to believe, vote, give money, write papers... they are Americans. Ron Paul believes in the true concept of liberty that all people have the right to think whatever they want, even if it's disgusting and vile. I support that too.

Ron Paul is a christian and is anti-abortion. I'm very very against both of those ideals but I still love the man.

Why are you letting the MSM push you out of this?

Please grow some stones and stand up for something instead of worrying about being PC.

Hell Yeah!!!!!!

integrity
01-11-2008, 11:38 AM
I see two streams of thought in this argument:

1) He's at worst a closet racist, at best delinquent in management by allowing these articles to be published.

2) He doesn't know who wrote them, and he didn't write them--so who cares?


I'd like to offer a third, that, to me, appears to be completely absent in all discussion.

The articles themselves, while distasteful, are neither racist, homophobic, or anti-semitic.

The articles on the LA riots aren't racist. They're harsh, but neither racist or false. If people can't deal with it, it's not Ron's place to apologize for hurting their feelings--regardless of who wrote it.

The David Duke article does not praise David Duke. It argues that Duke was able to garner 9% of the black vote running on the platform of individual liberty despite his background, and questions what it was that allowed an admitted KKK member to get that many votes from black voters--concluding that the liberty message is powerful enough to overcome even Duke's serious issues to get a reasonable amount of minority vote. It is not a praise of Duke--it is a praise of the liberty message using Duke to make the point as to how powerful it is.

The MLK articles (not in Ron's writing style from what I've seen of it) is very harsh, but apparently true as well. The data offered appears to be pointing to another author's work (that author being a black man who outs this info.) The article is also an argument of voting against a federal holiday for King--which, FWIW, is no longer celebrated at the corporation I work for since being purchased by the Brits. (I guess you don't have to worry about not honoring King's holiday if you aren't a US company as it can't be used in the squealing points.)

The articles on staying in the closet just appear to be ranting decrying the need for homosexuals to proudly proclaim their orientation to all. Where I live, there is a fairly large football homecoming parade yearly that always has a gay pride float where the participants are often clad in leather chest straps and chaps, dirty dancing and making out with their partners for shock value. Simultaneously, the streets are usually lined with parents with small children. (Adults don't watch parades by and large.) Now, I don't give a sh!t who you sleep with, love, or want to marry (hell marriage is financial trap in the modern era anyway, and if gays get state-backed marriage, they may come to regret it)--but no parent should have to answer a lot of questions from a 5-6 year old after seeing a float like this when no other float's parade participants feel the need to act this way in what is designed as a family atmosphere.

As to the anti-semitism, being against the Israel lobby in Washington is in no way anti-semitic period.

I guess my point is this:

We are buying into a two-pronged smokescreen whereby we are now correctly defending Paul against the attacks, but missing the point that the attacks have been framed to generate dissent due to matters of taste--not factual -isms.

Top that off with the blatancy of some posters who are here to stir the sh!t in a "sympathetic" manner, and you have what I am now witnessing.

It's a facade! The whole argument!

Hell, if I knew the authors, I wouldn't out them either in the face of a bullsh!t scandal.

I'm done now.


great post. And I personally feel blacks are fleet footed. thats why they do well in sports.

RickyJ
01-11-2008, 11:48 AM
Well, it hasn't blown over for me. I am having serious reservations about campaigning for Ron Paul now. I can now longer tell people Ron Paul is an upstanding man. He is in many ways, but he's had an obvious moral failing with not policing his own newsletter for years when it put out vile commentary under his own name. I may resign from my campaign positions over this.

Adios false freedom fighter!

Ron Paul has never ever uttered racist words in his life. If he had then you better believe it would be broadcast non-stop. Obviously a infiltrator wrote this trying to take Ron Paul down. He is not exactly liked by the establishment you know.

ChooseLiberty
01-11-2008, 11:53 AM
Correct. Some of them were reactions to the LA riots. The LA riots were crazy. Remember the black men that drug a random white truck driver out of his truck cab and almost beat him to death?

I'm sure leaving the articles in the newsletter had something to do with FREE SPEECH. They were the opinions of the writer and even if RP read them he probably didn't feel the need to act as the "thought police".




The articles themselves, while distasteful, are neither racist, homophobic, or anti-semitic.

mosquitobite
01-11-2008, 11:55 AM
I see two streams of thought in this argument:

1) He's at worst a closet racist, at best delinquent in management by allowing these articles to be published.

2) He doesn't know who wrote them, and he didn't write them--so who cares?


I'd like to offer a third, that, to me, appears to be completely absent in all discussion.

The articles themselves, while distasteful, are neither racist, homophobic, or anti-semitic.

The articles on the LA riots aren't racist. They're harsh, but neither racist or false. If people can't deal with it, it's not Ron's place to apologize for hurting their feelings--regardless of who wrote it.

The David Duke article does not praise David Duke. It argues that Duke was able to garner 9% of the black vote running on the platform of individual liberty despite his background, and questions what it was that allowed an admitted KKK member to get that many votes from black voters--concluding that the liberty message is powerful enough to overcome even Duke's serious issues to get a reasonable amount of minority vote. It is not a praise of Duke--it is a praise of the liberty message using Duke to make the point as to how powerful it is.

The MLK articles (not in Ron's writing style from what I've seen of it) is very harsh, but apparently true as well. The data offered appears to be pointing to another author's work (that author being a black man who outs this info.) The article is also an argument of voting against a federal holiday for King--which, FWIW, is no longer celebrated at the corporation I work for since being purchased by the Brits. (I guess you don't have to worry about not honoring King's holiday if you aren't a US company as it can't be used in the squealing points.)

The articles on staying in the closet just appear to be ranting decrying the need for homosexuals to proudly proclaim their orientation to all. Where I live, there is a fairly large football homecoming parade yearly that always has a gay pride float where the participants are often clad in leather chest straps and chaps, dirty dancing and making out with their partners for shock value. Simultaneously, the streets are usually lined with parents with small children. (Adults don't watch parades by and large.) Now, I don't give a sh!t who you sleep with, love, or want to marry (hell marriage is financial trap in the modern era anyway, and if gays get state-backed marriage, they may come to regret it)--but no parent should have to answer a lot of questions from a 5-6 year old after seeing a float like this when no other float's parade participants feel the need to act this way in what is designed as a family atmosphere.

As to the anti-semitism, being against the Israel lobby in Washington is in no way anti-semitic period.

I guess my point is this:

We are buying into a two-pronged smokescreen whereby we are now correctly defending Paul against the attacks, but missing the point that the attacks have been framed to generate dissent due to matters of taste--not factual -isms.

Top that off with the blatancy of some posters who are here to stir the sh!t in a "sympathetic" manner, and you have what I am now witnessing.

It's a facade! The whole argument!

Hell, if I knew the authors, I wouldn't out them either in the face of a bullsh!t scandal.

I'm done now.

Great post Korch!

RickyJ
01-11-2008, 11:56 AM
But because it's on the issue of race it gives me pause because what was (1) in his own newsletters (2) under his own name (3) for a number of years was antithetical to the reason I support him.

OK, what exactly in his newsletters is giving you a problem? The fact that carjackers were called animals? Or the fact that David Duke was actually praised for his anti big government platform?

texasbelle
01-11-2008, 12:08 PM
My 2 cents... If Ron Paul exposed who wrote these racist remarks then that would be a form of pandering to the media, IMO. To pander to the media is not presidential. I think it is much better to state that he is not racist, has never been heard uttering a racist remark, and define how he is the anti-racist. He apologized for not monitoring the newsletter. If this is the worst the media thinks they have on Ron Paul then we are fine.

ecliptic
01-11-2008, 12:09 PM
WILL YOU FALL ON A SWORD OF YOUR OWN MAKING? (http://www.wendymcelroy.com/news.php?extend.1297)

The identity of the author of the 'objectionable' material from past issues of Ron Paul's Newsletter -- material that is currently being used by major media to skewer Paul [see blog post below] -- is an open secret within the circles in which I run. The news accounts refer to him merely as an "aide." We call him by his first name.

I am addressing an appeal to this man. Damage is being done to the libertarian movement (see Radley Balko's analysis) and to Ron Paul. Frankly, I don't give a flying fuck about the latter...but I know you do. Will you now do the decent thing for libertarianism and come forward to acknowledge responsibility for the material being used against your mentor?

A reader of this blog comments, People are calling for Paul to name the author but the problem is that the name most mentioned over the years as the ghost-writer for those horrid newsletters is equally as prominent to Paul and remains a close confidant of the Paul campaign. He [Paul] can blame a former aide if he wishes, and he does, but if the former aide is a good friend and top advisor today then his severing himself from the writer doesn't work. He can't talk about it being a former aide if, in essence, the author is now a top adviser to Paul and good chum.

I disagree on one point. The author can talk about it. He should talk about it. I will not 'out' the person in question on this blog although people are urging me to do so. One of them writes, After the way he's treated the rest of us [ex-friends who criticize Paul], it might be worth taking him down a peg or two. I won't...but neither will I pretend that I do not know the background of the matter. I appeal to the author to do the decent thing. Don't let Ron Paul take the fall for your words and actions. Don't further sully the libertarian movement by your silence. I know that -- in writing this -- I am severing all connection between us in the future and, frankly, I am sorry to do so. Nevertheless...so be it. Through our years of association, one thing I have never considered you to be is a coward.Please prove my assessment correct; please take responsibility.
Wendy McElroy - Tuesday 08 January 2008 - 22:01:55

Young_Apprentice
01-11-2008, 12:16 PM
This can only lead to more interviews; more interviews in which RP performs like he did on Wolf yesterday can only be a good thing.

RonPaulFTFW
01-11-2008, 12:23 PM
This can only lead to more interviews; more interviews in which RP performs like he did on Wolf yesterday can only be a good thing.

Exactly!!!

Quitters please go help McCain.

Peppy690
01-11-2008, 12:38 PM
I'm glad cnn is still reporting the story. They just teased it.."If you are a ron paul supporter, did you know...."

ecliptic
01-11-2008, 12:38 PM
http://img233.imageshack.us/img233/2156/picture69ep2.png (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qEdcvUek6-s)

( click image for 0:31 YouTube video )

Paulbot_9876
01-11-2008, 12:42 PM
they are trying to get rp to drop out.....it is not going to happen....he is in it for the long run....
the media needs to know their bs is not going to work.....rp is in it till the end.....they know he will take votes from the other candidates....best we can do to counter the media is keep rp in the race and his money rolling in......

apropos
01-11-2008, 01:17 PM
Arguments that depend on proving you "aren't" something can never truly be won. That is why they are so effective.

The only way that this attack can be effectively handled is by observing that the accusation of racist is too easily applied to people in an argument. Most Americans would agree with that, especially after seeing a year of the Duke Lacrosse case. Whether Paul is a racist or not has nothing to do with his economic policies, foreign policies, etc.

Any of the views expressed in the newsletters are matters of taste, emotion, PC indoctrination, and etiquette - and ultimately they do not matter to the ideas of the platform. The Fed needs to be removed and the hundreds of US bases worldwide need to be brought home regardless of what someone thinks about blacks, whites, or Asians.

Do mere words matter more than proposing real solutions this nation's problems? And words that are judged by the fickle god of political correctness, no less? Considering that PC is communist propaganda writ small, I think not. It's merely meant to humiliate one into silence.

constituent
01-11-2008, 01:19 PM
Do mere words matter more than proposing real solutions this nation's problems? And words that are judged by the fickle god of political correctness, no less?

unfortunately, yes.

from a song:

language is the liquid that we're all dissolved in, great for solving problems after
it creates a problem.

gb13
01-11-2008, 01:21 PM
I'm a bit worried though. Everywhere I look, I see a story about it. CNN is playing it like twice an hour, and it's always heavily spun. They don't even show the full clip of him defending himself to Wolf Blitzer.

rockandrollsouls
01-11-2008, 01:28 PM
Ron Paul supporters are here through and through. Unlike other candidates, we cannot be swayed so easily. We are a different breed. When others are giving up, we will be gaining momentum. Don't worry so much; this is far from over.

WeWillWin08
01-11-2008, 01:31 PM
I'm a bit worried though. Everywhere I look, I see a story about it. CNN is playing it like twice an hour, and it's always heavily spun. They don't even show the full clip of him defending himself to Wolf Blitzer.
Do you honestly expect anything different from the MSM?

gb13
01-11-2008, 01:34 PM
Ron Paul supporters are here through and through. Unlike other candidates, we cannot be swayed so easily. We are a different breed. When others are giving up, we will be gaining momentum. Don't worry so much; this is far from over.

There is no doubt about that. We are truly a different breed. What I'm worried about is that we need more new supporters - and fast. If the first thing people are hearing about RP is this bogus racist charge, it may affect their judgment if they don't research to find the truth. And the trouble is, that so many Americans consider watching CNN and FAUX as doing their research.

We need to combat this.

clintontj72
01-11-2008, 01:38 PM
Well Ron didn't write that stuff.

John McCain definately did refer to Asians as "gooks" for years, in print and in person.

Nobody makes any fuss any more.

http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/opinion/hongop.shtml

http://www.asianweek.com/2000_02_24/feature_mccainapology.html


And this is before we get to all the arabs he would kill in the middle east, and the children of african-americans he would sacrifice to do it.

Ron Paul is the anti-racist candidate and we have to help him get the message out.

Rather than damage being done I am impressed the last couple of days how completely Ron has killed it as an issue. On CNN no less he destroyed the accusation.

Ron Paul needs to deflect this on to the real racist McCain! Let's make this happen!

Todd
01-11-2008, 01:41 PM
No it's not...It's baseless.

No video evidence. It's 20 years old and it's free media.

MsDoodahs
01-11-2008, 01:47 PM
I've been in this movement for 15 years, and I've spend many many hours and dollars and family strain on Dr. Paul's campaign. But for the last 72 hours I've been about as low about politics as I've ever been. I'm disappointed in Ron Paul and his staff and I'm disappointed that this chance to help bring back liberty in our lifetimes has suffered a large (but not fatal, I hope) blow.

I've been in this movement for around 6 or 7 years myself.

I've dropped many hours and many dollars on the campaign.

This is the FIGHT phase.

To get to the WIN phase, we must GO THROUGH this phase.

Some won't have the stomach/spine for getting through it.

I do. :)

tom4ronpaul08
01-11-2008, 01:48 PM
hey maybe this is the secret strategy... because i am hearing his name every 15 min now on cnn... ?
the way i look at it nothing in those letters is that bad ... mostly the hard truth and is that now what DR Paul is all about .....
get his name out there and then us grass rooters can explain the truth about the matter that ron is not a raciest ... but will defend someones right to liberty and freedom and free thought

ClockwiseSpark
01-11-2008, 02:00 PM
To the MSM:

http://wardsmythe.com/in_ur_shadows.gif

manny
01-11-2008, 02:20 PM
Hi ChicagoLawyer, I know you've been a forum member a long time - I used to lurk on these boards when there weren't many people here and I remember you being on very early.

So I'm very worried that such strong supporters as you feel so upset over the issue. I too would be upset if I thought there was any weight to the accusations but I don't. I wish to point out a few things:

Ron didn't write those articles; nobody - even Fox! - is claiming he did.

Check out ronpaullibrary, the dozen books he has published, articles written, two presedential campaings, tv debates, interviews, speeches in Congress ... and you'll no doubt be reminded that he has not once said anything of this nature. In fact he has gone out of his way to repudiate racism, and criticise viewing people in groups.

His views on capital punishment have changed (rare he changes ;)) precisely because he has seen it misused against black americans.

He has spent 30yrs telling the truth, however much pressure is put upon him to do otherwise. Think through how frustrating it must be for him - a decent man, veteran, doctor, congressman who actually cares about his country and the consitution to be labelled everywhere as a terrorist sympathiser because he wouldn't support the idiotic war in Iraq. Did he crumble? Change his tune? Pander? Nope - he tells it straight always. So when he says he didn't write the articles I believe him.

Some have mentioned that there seems uncertainty about how many articles/ the time span of them etc. Well if one looks at the offensive articles there is quite a variety - some of which alone wouldn't be very noteworthy. He should have kept a closer eye on any publication who he lent his name to but he was a doctor at the time and we all know he would have been giving his patients 100% of the attention. If tomorrow Lew Rockwell goes crazy and starts writing offensive articles would that make Ron guilty of that?

As regards racist charges in general the man takes his political inspiration from Mises, Hayek and Rothbard (all Jewish, and the latter a friend) and has listed at various times his heroes as being Martin Luther King (black), Rosa Parks (black) and Gandhi (Asian Indian).

To broaden it out Obama's Church has all kinds of very reactionary ideals. Rudy's (can't rememebr exactly who it is) campaign manager or some other aide talks of driving muslims "back to the caves". McCain calls Asians "gooks". And that's before we start on with what supporters of Hillary have done/said.

What does this have to do with RP? Well it ought to remind us very clearly that every presedential candidate will have people in some way associated with them who they do not control/agree with. I wish the world was perfect and everybody open-minded but it isn't. And clearly whoever wrote those articles isn't. Ron however I think is a very open-minded person, a gentleman and our best hope for a color-blind society. You can feel confident in supporting him and encouraging others to do so - Ron has devoted his entire life to defending the liberty of all people, of every race and color and his record is proof of it. As he himself said he's the anti-racist candidate. I hope you'll continue to support him and contribute on this forum.

Charles Wilson
01-11-2008, 02:23 PM
All this crapo about racism is a diversion by the MSM to try and direct the conversation away from Ron Paul's message. Ignore it, Ron Paul answered the charge and that should be the end of it. If anything, turn it around on them. Awhile back Tim Russert steped on his own d--- when he asked Ron about Lincoln and slavery. Ron's answer was brillient when he said there was a better solution to ending slavery. Lincoln suspended habias corpus and 600,000 Americans died needlessly. The slaves could have been purchased by the government and set free without bloodshed.

If anyone is a racist it is the neocons and the MSM attack dogs. During the war the south was looted of anything of value and most everything else was destroyed. The Federal government left the southerners and the newly freed slaves with virtually nothing of value. The people survived only because they shared what they had left with each other. That is not racism folks, that is brotherly love. The neocons will never understand that. BTW: Know what we are dealing with, neocon is just another name for fascist. The MSM propagandists would make Joseph Goebbels proud http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goebbels.

Dave Wood
01-11-2008, 02:27 PM
Folks, COME ON!

If Mccain can somehow come back from trying to stab the entire republican base in the back with his amnesty bull***......This thing with RP will turn out to be a positive.

Americans have very short memories unless it is something that hurts them economically.

Mccains gaffe was economic and he still is in this. There is no such thing as bad publicity.

MayTheRonBeWithYou
01-11-2008, 02:42 PM
Don't worry. Ron has already these questions. They will play out soon enough.