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DrNoZone
12-27-2007, 10:51 AM
The Ignorant David Shuster on "Morning Joe" (http://www.lewrockwell.com/blog/lewrw/archives/018037.html#more)

Posted by Thomas DiLorenzo at December 27, 2007 09:40 AM

Joe Scarborough's stand-in on the "Morning Joe" television program, David Shuster, once again has tried to smear Ron Paul, and once again reveals his ignorance in doing so. This morning Ron called in to correct the lies that various neocons like Shuster have been spreading about what he said to Tim Russert about Lincoln and his war. Shuster adamantly claimed that Ron had "embarrassed himself" by claiming that Lincoln did not invade his own country to free the slaves. But it is Shuster who is embarrassingly ignorant of his own history. In fact, it would be hard to find a single American historian with any credibility who would argue that in 1861 an invasion of the Southern states was launched to free the slaves. Shuster is not only unaware of what is written in my book, The Real Lincoln, but also of what is in almost all other books on the war.

Slave owners in the border states occupied by the U.S. Army were allowed to keep their slaves. Whenever any of Lincoln's generals, such as Gen. Fremont, took it upon themselves to emancipate some slaves early in the war he rebuffed them, reversed their decisions, and demoted them. The Emancipation Proclamation itself very specifically exempted all areas of the country that were controlled by the U.S. Army, guaranteeing that no slaves would be emancipated by the Proclamation.

In his first inaugural address Lincoln referred to the proposed "Corwin Amendment" to the Constitution that would have prohibited the federal government from ever interfering with slavery. He said that he already held the legality of slavery to be "implied constitutinal law," and "I have no objection to its being made express and irrovocable" by enshrining slavery explicitly in the Constitution.

Not only that, but it was Lincoln, working with William Seward, who orchestrated the passing of that amendment through the U.S. Senate. Even Lincoln worshipper Doris Kearns-Goodwin documents all of this in her book,Team of Rivals (p. 296). Shuster, of course, knows nothing at all about this, nor does anyone else in "the media," apparently.

In an August 22, 1862 letter to newspaper editor Horace Greeley, Lincoln explained the purpose of the war:

"My paramount objective in this struggle is to save the Union, and is not either to save or destroy slavery. If I could save the Union without freeing any slave I would do it; and if I could save it by freeing some and leaving others alone I would also do that. What I do about slavery, and the colored race, I do because I believe it helps to save the Union."

Of course, in reality he destroyed the voluntary union of the states that was established by the Founders.

The U.S. Congress concurred with Lincoln's statement. On July 22,1861, it issued a proclamation saying that the purpose of the war was not "interference with the rights or established institutions of those states" that had seceded (i.e., slavery), "but to preserve the Union with the rights of the several states [including slavery] unimpaired."

This is an ugly truth, but it is the truth. It is also something that David Shuster is totally unfamiliar with.

Ibtz
12-27-2007, 10:53 AM
Excellent!

MsDoodahs
12-27-2007, 10:56 AM
:)

LibertyEagle
12-27-2007, 10:57 AM
..

DrNoZone
12-27-2007, 11:43 AM
blimp

kushaze
12-27-2007, 11:49 AM
I just bought DiLorenzo's book The Real Lincoln. Back in high school AP US History I learned about Lincoln, and just from that text I felt Lincoln was a very overrated President and gets a lot of credit for nothing. I hope to learn some more from The Real Lincoln.

yongrel
12-27-2007, 11:50 AM
I just bought DiLorenzo's book The Real Lincoln. Back in high school AP US History I learned about Lincoln, and just from that text I felt Lincoln was a very overrated President and gets a lot of credit for nothing. I hope to learn so more from The Real Lincoln.

With that book, you certainly will.

crhoades
12-27-2007, 11:51 AM
I just bought DiLorenzo's book The Real Lincoln. Back in high school AP US History I learned about Lincoln, and just from that text I felt Lincoln was a very overrated President and gets a lot of credit for nothing. I hope to learn so more from The Real Lincoln.

Here are a ton of articles by him:
http://www.lewrockwell.com/dilorenzo/dilorenzo-arch.html

Adamsa
12-27-2007, 11:53 AM
Lincoln just wanted to keep America as one country, bear that in mind. He didn't care about slavery.

Kuldebar
12-27-2007, 11:53 AM
Look what's being taught in public schools about the current war:


Writes Ryan Hainlen:

This is directly out of my 6th grade sister's history book. (And she has a test over it tomorrow.) "At the beginning of the twenty-first century, terrorism became a major threat to world peace. In 2003, U.S. military forces invaded Iraq. They were sent to prevent Iraq from using chemical and biological weapons. ... The United States has protected innocent civilians or helped bring peace to a war-torn region."
People, Places and Change: An Introduction to World Studies
Holt, Rinehart and Winston
page 103


source (http://www.lewrockwell.com/blog/lewrw/archives/017859.html)

But, as for the "civil" war, just ask nearly anyone you meet today, you will discover that it was a war over slavery and Lincoln was a saint...

AggieforPaul
12-27-2007, 11:55 AM
Also pick up "Dishonest Abe", also by DiLorenzo.

AggieforPaul
12-27-2007, 11:56 AM
The truth is that there never reall was a civil war. "Civil war" implies two factions fighting for control of one government. In reality, the South wanted to SECEDE from the Union, not to take it over.

childofadream
12-27-2007, 12:26 PM
Ah yes he did but that is not the question Americans should be asking about “the great emancipator”. The question should be WHY was it that ole abe and his cronies were willing to wage an aggressive war (including deliberate war on civilians), destroy a third of the Country, trash the constitution, illegally jail 10,000 NORTHERN citizens (including duly elected representatives and judges) and kill 620,000 Americans in order to “keep America one country”.

The ugly truth is Lincoln believed in an etatist mercantile system (corporate welfare) and the high taxes that it took to finance that system! In order to accomplish his goals the conservative, wealthy and free trade (dare we say libertarian?) South had to be neutralized.

This is what the WBTS was all about.

It amazes me how many people (even so called supporters of Ron Paul) there are that can not seem to overcome the “education” that they received in the government schools and those bastions of cultural Marxism called “universities” and begin to understand that!

If more people don’t start to pull THAT particular 140 year old piece of fascist wool out of their eyes and see lincoln and his ilk for what they really were good luck fighting the “neo-cons” and just plain socialists and imperialists now and in the future!

For God’s sake y’all need to read “When in the Course of Human Events”, “The Real Lincoln” and “Lincoln unmasked”. If you are broke from Christmas like me and don’t have any more money to spend on books a contributor above gave the web site for LewRockwell. Go there; go to the “lincoln archives” and start reading!

Do it today!

FSP-Rebel
12-27-2007, 12:29 PM
Dr. Lorenzo is the God on the lincoln subject, he would also be great in Ron's Treasury Dept.

MsDoodahs
12-27-2007, 12:30 PM
Welcome to the boards, childofadream, and great first post!

childofadream
12-27-2007, 06:08 PM
Thanks MsDoodahs!

Have you noticed my New Zealand friend? She told me about the boards but don't have a clue what her name is here

JPFromTally
12-27-2007, 06:12 PM
Mr. Dilorenzo is a very respected author... Does this mean he endores Ron??

literatim
12-27-2007, 06:16 PM
Mr. Dilorenzo is a very respected author... Does this mean he endores Ron??

http://people.ronpaul2008.com/endorsements/2007/12/21/dr-thomas-dilorenzo/

Rex
12-27-2007, 06:29 PM
Ownt

CelestialRender
12-27-2007, 06:50 PM
I honestly can't believe we have figures in the media who don't know at least a vague outline of these things.

When did journalism die?