Crazy thought: Ron Paul presidency without Vice President

[Rob]

Do we actually need a vice president?

For those history buffs, you'll remember that originally the vice president was the person who finished 2nd in the presidential race. That changed after the first few presidencies, HOWEVER, the Constitution was not amended to reflect that change. As it is I think that it may be legally possible that we have NO vice president.

Think about it, it's one less high paid government job; that's certainly Ron Paul's style isn't it?

[Grandson of Liberty]

two words why that's a bad idea. . . nancy pelosi.

[PRIEST]

Interesting. I'd like to find out the answer to this.

Maybe select "The Constitution" as the VP so if anything happens to Ron we'll maintain the rest of his presidency on principal.

[Jobarra]

VP breaks any ties in Congress. I'm thinking he'll be very useful in a Paul administration with the current Congress we have.

[NewEnd]

Isn't it supposed to be second place becomes vice president?

Wouldn't that be wierd if ron Paul made the announcement he is sticking to the constitution, and his rival would get the VP slot?

[daikonv]

that would be bad. if something were to happen to dr. paul, then the presidency would go to the third in line, which is the speaker of the house. It's best to have a VP who shares very similar ideals as Dr. Paul just in case.

[wstrucke]

i love questions like this -- i truly have no idea. anyone?

[Rob]

two words why that's a bad idea. . . nancy pelosi.

Speaker of the House, you sure she's given the VP? I don't that that's actually how it works. Does anyone have a detailed answer to this?

[aspiringconstitutionalist]

You have to have a VP at least for the sake of casting tie breaking votes in the Senate.

[wstrucke]

yeah... you have to have one, but do you have to pick one to run with you? if you didn't and won the election, who would be VP? would it then be selected by the electors? is it just a formality then that the electoral college selects your running-mate to be the VP or is there a law somewhere about that?

[RPSignbomb]

Where do some of you guys come up with this stuff? A VP serves two purposes:

1. Wins a state or a block of voters for you
2. Fills in your experince gap

Yes, of course Dr. Paul will have a VP if he wins the nomination.

[Rob]

that would be bad. if something were to happen to dr. paul, then the presidency would go to the third in line, which is the speaker of the house. It's best to have a VP who shares very similar ideals as Dr. Paul just in case.


That's a good point, one hard to overlook.

[Arek]

The 12th amendment changed the process where Electors are supposed to vote for President and Vice President separately, but we however never have candidates run for Vice President separately, so technically to Constitutionally have a VP we'd need to elect the VP separately from the president. Therefore the people have never had a chance to vote for the VP and only the electors do and of course they vote it the same way down the line as the President. We need an election for Vice President.

So technically you don't have to choose a VP, it would just return the election how it originally intended to be carried out. Not having a president and vp on a ticket but seperate tickets. Yea strange I know but thats my interpretation of the 12th amendment. So therefore we need to have a VP voted independently from the Pesident in the electoral college.

[deltabourne]

You know, I never actually gave this thought. Who would it be? I keep seeing that people's ideas of a perfect running mate would be Kucinich but obviously that won't happen.

[wstrucke]

interesting -- according to the law i can find and the Constitution, the electoral college can vote for whomever the want for VP. if they wanted Paul/Clinton, they could do that regardless of running-mates:

Twelfth Amendment

The Electors shall meet in their respective states, and vote by ballot for President and Vice-President, one of whom, at least, shall not be an inhabitant of the same state with themselves; they shall name in their ballots the person voted for as President, and in distinct ballots the person voted for as Vice-President, and they shall make distinct lists of all persons voted for as President, and of all persons voted for as Vice-President, and of the number of votes for each, which lists they shall sign and certify, and transmit sealed to the seat of the government of the United States, directed to the President of the Senate; The President of the Senate shall, in the presence of the Senate and House of Representatives, open all the certificates and the votes shall then be counted;--The person having the greatest number of votes for President, shall be the President, if such number be a majority of the whole number of Electors appointed; and if no person have such majority, then from the persons having the highest numbers not exceeding three on the list of those voted for as President, the House of Representatives shall choose immediately, by ballot, the President. But in choosing the President, the votes shall be taken by states, the representation from each state having one vote; a quorum for this purpose shall consist of a member or members from two-thirds of the states, and a majority of all the states shall be necessary to a choice.... The person having the greatest number of votes as Vice-President, shall be the Vice-President, if such number be a majority of the whole number of Electors appointed, and if no person have a majority, then from the two highest numbers on the list, the Senate shall choose the Vice-President; a quorum for the purpose shall consist of two-thirds of the whole number of Senators, and a majority of the whole number shall be necessary to a choice. But no person constitutionally ineligible to the office of President shall be eligible to that of Vice-President to the United States.

http://www.archives.gov/federal-register/electoral-college/provisions.html#12

this one is interesting too:

http://www.archives.gov/federal-register/electoral-college/provisions.html#law

the answer would then be that, no, RP would not have to select a running mate, though it should serve to significantly help his campaign if he has one.

[NewEnd]

Imagine Paul v Obama

and Paul says

Like the constitution first intended, If I become president, Obama will be the vice president, unless someone else gets more votes than Obama.


that's the way it used to be, and this strategy would once again baffle the populace, and the press, and once again, show how committed Paul is to the constitution.

[Bluedevil]

Not sure why yall are trying to find a loophole around having a VP, a vice president is a great way to attact a different demographic of voters and address and weaknesses the president might have.

[Rob]

The 12th amendment changed the process where Electors are supposed to vote for President and Vice President separately, but we however never have candidates run for Vice President separately, so technically to Constitutionally have a VP we'd need to elect the VP separately from the president. Therefore the people have never had a chance to vote for the VP and only the electors do and of course they vote it the same way down the line as the President. We need an election for Vice President.

I'd like to do that, although the resulting administration would be quite confused because we have no historical precedent as to how that would work, with a VP not necessarily supporting the president.

[ChristopherBearkat]

You NEED a VP....the REASON that they stopped doing it like that is because the President and the VP fought all the time. I'm not saying pick a yes man, but you gotta be on the same team!

[aspiringconstitutionalist]

Twelfth Amendment

. . .
the answer would then be that, no, RP would not have to select a running mate, though it should serve to significantly help his campaign if he has one.

Ditto. Constitution never says Ron Paul has to run with a running mate, but it would be better if Ron did because then he would basically guarantee that the guy best suited to the VP job would actually get to be VP in his administration. Otherwise, if Ron were to run politically commando, then the Electoral College would exercise its sole say over the choice of VP based on their own decisions about who it should be, and not based on Ron's decision.

So I'd say, yes, Ron needs a runningmate. Kucinich would be the worst possible choice, because regardless of a few areas of overlap between Dennis and Ron, they come from totally different governmental philosophies. Kucinich is a benevolent statist, and Ron Paul is a republican Constitutionalist.

I like the idea of Mark Sanford, personally.

[Bradley in DC]

sigh (http://frwebgate1.access.gpo.gov/cgi-bin/waisgate.cgi?WAISdocID=216737321101+3+0+0&WAISaction=retrieve)

[Unspun]

two words why that's a bad idea. . . nancy pelosi.

No doubt, my first thought as well.

[RPSignbomb]

Not sure why yall are trying to find a loophole around having a VP, a vice president is a great way to attact a different demographic of voters and address and weaknesses the president might have.


thank you

[aspiringconstitutionalist]

Imagine Paul v Obama

and Paul says

Like the constitution first intended, If I become president, Obama will be the vice president, unless someone else gets more votes than Obama.


that's the way it used to be, and this strategy would once again baffle the populace, and the press, and once again, show how committed Paul is to the constitution.

Paul would have to get the 12th Amdmt. repealed before he could legally do that. Of course, he could say that he would suggest to the Electoral college that Obama be his VP, but that wouldn't guarantee it. I don't see why Ron would want Obama casting tie-breaking votes in the Senate, though.

[Goldwater Conservative]

Paul's VP would exist to cast the tie-breaking vote in the Senate, be a buffer against Nancy Pelosi, and protect the space-time continuum.

[NewEnd]

I'd like to do that, although the resulting administration would be quite confused because we have no historical precedent as to how that would work, with a VP not necessarily supporting the president.

Yes you do!

The first couple of American presidential elections, the most votes got President, the second most got VP!!

Know your american history!!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_presidential_election%2C_1796

[Rob]

thank you

I agree, however, with Ron Paul it may be very difficult to find a candidate that doesn't alienate more supporters than it gains. Think about it, for the first time in God knows how long we have a very honest man running, who else is there that is at his level. Also, I believe we have very little to worry about in the Ron Paul scandal department. With a VP that may change.

[Rob]

Yes you do!

The first couple of American presidential elections, the most votes got President, the second most got VP!!

I meant with voters actually electing the VP. I guess that would be the closest thing we have though. Haha, every in Politics except for Ron Paul would be quite confused I'm sure. They may finally be forced to catch up on a little history.

[Arek]

Jefferson was a VP who did not support his President haha thats why Congress thought they needed to change the system. However by changing the system they've added a loophole where We the People can still decide the VP by refusing to vote for any Presidential/Vic e Presidential ticket. Protest that we want them on separate tickets. So we could create a precedent that would have to be followed in a future election. I mean thats my understanding of the twelfth amendment. It never states anywhere the president and vice president run on a ticket together.

[user]

Why not have a VP?

The question that keeps getting asked is, who should be the VP? I haven't read a single suggestion I was really satisfied with, to be honest. Let's face it, there is no one else like Ron Paul right now.

[Alex Libman]

Crazy indeed...

[NYgs23]

You need to have a VP who is as close as possible to being a younger clone of Paul, especially to deter would-be assassins.

[RonPaulVolunteer]

Rand Paul should be the VP.

[westmich4paul]

Rand Paul V.P. !

[Forefall]

I hope we go with Walter Williams. That will debunk some of the "racist" crap that seems to follow RP around.