PDA

View Full Version : July 4 - Not a day of National Greatness for America




woowoowoo22
07-04-2007, 10:57 AM
Like many Americans, you may fly the flag today, and celebrate the Fourth of July as a day of National Greatness. This modern idea of a celebration of American greatness, or a celebration of superpower is relatively new.

Some however, are aware of what Independence Day represents. It represents the very thing we are fighting against around the World. The Iraqis who are fighting against Americans in Iraq, are doing nothing different than what our Founding Fathers did. The American Rebels who declared Independence from the Crown of England would today be called “insurgents”.

The Boston Tea Party was a terrorist incident. The tactics and methods by which we fought the most powerful superpower of that era, are no different than the tactics and methods which are used today in Iraq. The difference is technology, yet the bloodshed remains the same. We are the Redcoats in Iraq - we are the occupying force.

We have gone away from all of the original principles which have made America great. We have gone away from the idea that we should be on peaceful terms with all other Nations, and engage in entangling alliances with none. We have gone away from idea that the Law should be equal among all people.

We have gone over to the idea of Socialism - where Government does not promote the common good, it takes from certain groups it chooses to, and gives to other groups it chooses to. If anyone else were to act likewise, we would call it theft. This has caused property rights to become meaningless. Government exists to protect your life, liberty, and property. When Government redistributes wealth, it does exactly the opposite by violating the life, liberty, and property of another.

We have become everything that every other Superpower became. The Greek, Roman, and British empires were all superpowers of their time, and ultimately they all failed. America is on course for failure as well.

The Idea of America is not Nation Greatness at all. The Idea of America is that freedom is held to the highest esteem - and that Government is held to the strictest limitations.

McDonalds cannot force you to do anything. Wal-mart cannot force you to do anything. Exxon cannot force you to do anything. Every transaction in the free market is entirely voluntary. Government is the exact opposite. With Government, there is only force. Government is what is to fear.

We might be able to bring America back to where freedom is respected and Government is truly limited. We fought off the scourage of the use of force which plaged Europe for Millenia, yet now we are no better. There is only one man who can make America great again and his name is Ron Paul.

Should Ron Paul not become elected, I am afraid we may have to take the advice of our founders:

“When in the Course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands, which have connected them with another, and to assume, among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature’s God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.”

Should peaceful Revolution not be in order - then unpeaceful Revolution may be. We hold the right to Abolish our Government if it does the opposite of what it was instituted to do:

That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it,

The Founders advised that we not change our Government for light or transient causes. This is good advice, yet the injustices of our present Government is not light nor transient. Should all else fail - We must LOCK and LOAD!

Source: http://www.freecentury.com/2007/07/04/july-4-not-a-day-of-national-greatness-for-america/

Original_Intent
07-04-2007, 11:09 AM
By and large I agree with you. There are a couple of points where i felt you crossed the line.


Case in point

"The Iraqis who are fighting against Americans in Iraq, are doing nothing different than what our Founding Fathers did."

Sorry this is demagoguery and false. Although there are some parallels saying they are doing nothing different than are Founding Fathers did is horse-hockey.

I hear what you are saying, and again, agree with you most of the way. But let's not live up to the label of America-haters please.

woowoowoo22
07-04-2007, 11:16 AM
By and large I agree with you. There are a couple of points where i felt you crossed the line.


Case in point

"The Iraqis who are fighting against Americans in Iraq, are doing nothing different than what our Founding Fathers did."

Sorry this is demagoguery and false. Although there are some parallels saying they are doing nothing different than are Founding Fathers did is horse-hockey.

I hear what you are saying, and again, agree with you most of the way. But let's not live up to the label of America-haters please.

What are they doing then? We are the occupying force.

The French did similar bombings and other insurgent activity against the Germans. They were called "freedom fighters" and the "resistance"

We had no business whatsoever in Iraq, and the truth must be told.

AgentSmith
07-04-2007, 11:26 AM
Pfffttt :p We blow things up in the sky because we are free, silly! The booms are proof!

Original_Intent
07-04-2007, 11:47 AM
I 100% agree we don't belong in Iraq. And I guess if that is the point you are trying to make, we can end the discussion right now because we 100% agree.

I still disagree with the line noted above. By and large they are not freedom fighters, as our founders were, they are only seeking to impose THEIR tyranny as opposed to ours, or one of the other factions.

The founding fathers did not suicide bomb using kids as delivery systems.

woowoowoo22
07-04-2007, 12:03 PM
The founding fathers did not suicide bomb using kids as delivery systems.

Please document 1 instance of them doing this?

That sounds like Giuliani propaganda.

Gimme Some Truth
07-04-2007, 12:40 PM
I agree with the original post in part.

I actually believe revolution, whether it be peaceful or not, against tyranny , a beautiful and just act.

As for the resistance we have faced and continue to face , in Iraq ... I see your point and agree to an extent. Is one mans terrorist another mans freedom fighter? to an extent yea maybe, tho it obviously depends on your perspective , the media you listen to and the tactics used (and herefore, again, the media you listen to.... no-one will convince me that all this "human shield" etc stuff isnt totally fabricated a large portion of the time. Emotional propaganda i call it)
There will be those that are to scared to say the above and be labeled "un-american" tho the majority of the time someone accuses another of being "un-american" what they really mean is "anti-(bush/big)government" which i see as a compliment ;)

Plus, im not american so it doesnt bother me. However how can i be anti-american when i spend alot of my time supporting Ron Paul , the most American American iv ever seen :)

johngr
07-04-2007, 02:01 PM
That whole "suicide bomb" meme is a big, fat steaming pile of bullshit. Something else is going on with that. Read this: http://www.theinsider.org/news/article.asp?id=1556

There's a whole lot going on there that we don't know about. Death squads, etc (or you think maybe the "contractors" are all about repairing the electricity and water delivery)? Suicide is almost always tactically unnecessary, against their religion and curiously, was never used against the British when they occupied Iraq.

mconder
07-04-2007, 02:05 PM
I still disagree with the line noted above. By and large they are not freedom fighters, as our founders were, they are only seeking to impose THEIR tyranny as opposed to ours, or one of the other factions.

This is closer to the truth of it. They are not "freedom" fighters.

Original_Intent
07-04-2007, 03:30 PM
Please document 1 instance of them doing this?

That sounds like Giuliani propaganda.

Umm I said they DID NOT use suicide bombers.