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Pauls' Revere
02-23-2020, 01:44 PM
Should we form our own political party?

https://www.wikihow.com/Create-a-Political-Party

oyarde
02-23-2020, 01:46 PM
I doubt it would work .

Pauls' Revere
02-23-2020, 01:49 PM
I doubt it would work .

What if it did?

oyarde
02-23-2020, 01:52 PM
What if it did?

Then I can change from undecided /out of your mind to Yes.

nobody's_hero
02-23-2020, 02:19 PM
I think it's generally a bad strategy to further partition ourselves into smaller and smaller politically impotent factions.

I think we should hijack a party.

Voluntarist
02-23-2020, 02:29 PM
Per registered decision (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?541228-Bryan-does-this-site-reject-traditional-morality-and-Christian-teachings&p=6888638&viewfull=1#post6888638), member has been banned for violating community standards as interpreted by TheTexan (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/member.php?33245-TheTexan) (respect his authoritah (https://youtu.be/PaKjRMMU9HI)) as authorized by Brian4Liberty Ruling (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?541228-Bryan-does-this-site-reject-traditional-morality-and-Christian-teachings&p=6888539&viewfull=1#post6888539)

May God have mercy on his atheist, police-hating, non-voting, anarchist soul.

TheTexan
02-23-2020, 02:43 PM
It's a "Multiple Choice" Poll and I wanted to make TheTexan proud of me; so I voted for every choice in order that my vote would get the maximum coverage.

+rep good voting technique! it ensures that your vote wins no matter what option ends up on top :up:

JohnCifelli1
02-23-2020, 02:49 PM
Who is "we?"

Theres about 25 people posting here regularly. That includes a couple communists and a cowboy parody account.

I don't know who is in charge of the f---wad Libertarian Party, but the move was to fill those ranks 7 or 8 years ago. Too late now, until the next time we see "an idea whose time has come."

Anti Federalist
02-23-2020, 03:10 PM
Who is "we?"

Theres about 25 people posting here regularly. That includes a couple communists and a cowboy parody account.

I don't know who is in charge of the f---wad Libertarian Party, but the move was to fill those ranks 7 or 8 years ago. Too late now, until the next time we see "an idea whose time has come."

The LP party hierarchy was as opposed to Ron Paul as much as anybody else was.

enhanced_deficit
02-23-2020, 03:17 PM
I dunno, is this is the right time to disrupt bi-partisan democratic choice mirage?

Granted both coroprate fakenews media/special interest lobbies embedded major parties are linked to deep pockets funding of right/left wing globalist neocons, offering a genuine 3rd party choice not tainted by deep neocons money could undermine both major parties at critical juncture ahead of 2020. Perhaps wait till 2020 freedom choices become clear and see if deep ziocons or deep socialist wing of big gummit option takes the lead and then contemplate pro-liberty options for nonfake choices in next election.
In a recent poll, 100% of RPF folks (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?527899-Soros-vs-Adelson-whose-political-funding-is-better-for-cause-of-liberty&p=6700385&viewfull=1#post6700385) who participated expressed dissatisfaction with both current deep pockets tainted choices. It was a small sample but considering that 1000 sampled opinions often are used to quantify opinions of 300+ Million American public in national polls, maybe it's statistically accurate view.

On a related pro-choice note, alleged libertarian behind this 'march of turrany' cartoon was recently banned by MAGA White House. So well-finded GOPA wing may also oppose this.

https://grrrgraphics.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/march-of-tyranny-ben-garrison-cartoon-1.jpg

Stratovarious
02-23-2020, 03:30 PM
Yes , the Constitution Party , but we should not do it if we can't do it on a
Free Speech Platform.

I voted ''Yes'', and ''You're out of your mind'', just to be fair.... :frog:

Origanalist
02-23-2020, 03:44 PM
Poll needs more options.

Anti Globalist
02-23-2020, 06:13 PM
The idea of the creation of political parties was discouraged a long time ago. Washington said himself they shouldn't exist as they will only divide the people.

Pauls' Revere
02-23-2020, 06:15 PM
Who is "we?"

Theres about 25 people posting here regularly. That includes a couple communists and a cowboy parody account.

I don't know who is in charge of the f---wad Libertarian Party, but the move was to fill those ranks 7 or 8 years ago. Too late now, until the next time we see "an idea whose time has come."

ROFLMAO

I nominate you as our first president.

All it takes is an irate minority 25 people is pretty small.

timosman
02-23-2020, 06:19 PM
The party to hijack would be DSA. We could do to them what others did to LP. Just pretend how affected by TDS you are.

Mach
02-23-2020, 06:42 PM
It's simple........... :check: ALL OF THE ABOVE

Do every one of them at the same time, all that picking one thing at a time stuff does is constantly keep our odds on the wrong side. :)

euphemia
02-23-2020, 07:31 PM
The name should not be libertarian. It should be something that clearly says we are constitutional and all about constitutional freedoms.

TheTexan
02-23-2020, 07:35 PM
The name should not be libertarian. It should be something that clearly says we are constitutional and all about constitutional freedoms.

We could call it the Constitution Party. I'm pretty sure the name is not taken, as I've never heard of anyone in it

Swordsmyth
02-23-2020, 07:41 PM
I think it's generally a bad strategy to further partition ourselves into smaller and smaller politically impotent factions.

I think we should hijack a party.
We should emulate Ron and hijack the Republican party.

We can vote for the Constitution party when the Republican is too bad.

timosman
02-23-2020, 07:43 PM
What if Zippy decides to sign up for it? :confused:

Swordsmyth
02-23-2020, 08:05 PM
What if Zippy decides to sign up for it? :confused:
Boot him out

timosman
02-23-2020, 08:06 PM
Boot him out

Are you saying he's useless? This would be a surprise to the mods.

Swordsmyth
02-23-2020, 08:12 PM
Are you saying he's useless? This would be a surprise to the mods.
He's a negative.

Occam's Banana
02-23-2020, 08:13 PM
Poll needs more options.

Poll needs more grammar Nazis ...


Your You're out of your mind.

Poll also needs more Poles ...

https://i.imgur.com/a7XC78z.jpg

Theocrat
02-23-2020, 08:21 PM
We should emulate Ron and hijack the Republican party.

We can vote for the Constitution party when the Republican is too bad.

You're not hijacking anything. They don't want true liberty-conscious people inside their party. Just look at how they turned against Dr. Ron Paul twice when he ran, and they used the mainstream media to do it in epic proportions. Case in point:


https://youtu.be/nhUIhli71XI

Swordsmyth
02-23-2020, 08:24 PM
You're not hijacking anything. They don't want true liberty-conscious people inside their party. Just look at how they turned against Dr. Ron Paul twice when he ran, and they used the mainstream media to do it in epic proportions. Case in point:


https://youtu.be/nhUIhli71XI
If you give up because you meet resistance you will never accomplish anything.
The same is true if you give up because you don't succeed overnight.

Theocrat
02-23-2020, 08:27 PM
If you give up because you meet resistance you will never accomplish anything.
The same is true if you give up because you don't succeed overnight.

No, you migrate to places where your ideas can flourish and grow with likeminded people, such as you suggested in supporting the Constitution Party.

Swordsmyth
02-23-2020, 08:30 PM
No, you migrate to places where your ideas can flourish and grow with likeminded people, such as you suggested in supporting the Constitution Party.
They are smaller than the LP.

I'll support them and watch to see if they grow, but there are plenty of likeminded people susceptible to our message in the GOP and we can get things done together while the Constitution Party grows. (or doesn't)

Theocrat
02-23-2020, 08:39 PM
They are smaller than the LP.

I'll support them and watch to see if they grow, but there are plenty of likeminded people susceptible to our message in the GOP and we can get things done together while the Constitution Party grows. (or doesn't)

The reason why the CP is so small is because so many conservatives think that a vote for the CP is a vote for the Democrats. That mentality is the whip which the GOP uses to keep conservatives in check and loyal to their party, which does not have their principles in mind, especially as it relates to the sanctity of life.

The GOP doesn't need to change its position on anything because it understands that as long as it does "the dog & pony show" for conservatives and "whisper sweet nothings into their ears" during Presidential campaigns, they'll never leave for parties like the CP.

Like I've told you before, you're being played by the Republican Party, and you refuse to see it because you've compromised your ethics, Swordsmyth.

Swordsmyth
02-23-2020, 08:46 PM
The reason why the CP is so small is because so many conservatives think that a vote for the CP is a vote for the Democrats. That mentality is the whip which the GOP uses to keep conservatives in check and loyal to their party, which does not have their principles in mind, especially as it relates to the sanctity of life.

The GOP doesn't need to change its position on anything because it understands that as long as it does "the dog & pony show" for conservatives and "whisper sweet nothings into their ears" during Presidential campaigns, they'll never leave for parties like the CP.

Like I've told you before, you're being played by the Republican Party, and you refuse to see it because you've compromised your ethics, Swordsmyth.
LOL

I've compromised nothing.

But thanks for passing judgement on me.

I do what I can to make things better and that includes both the CP and the GOP.

I'm glad you admit you think that Ron compromised his ethics for running in the GOP, I don't.

I'll continue to work with Republicans and sinners and you can keep being a pharisee.

ATruepatriot
02-23-2020, 08:50 PM
They are smaller than the LP.

I'll support them and watch to see if they grow, but there are plenty of likeminded people susceptible to our message in the GOP and we can get things done together while the Constitution Party grows. (or doesn't)

They kind of screwed their own integrity with hypocrisy years ago. They have since changed their platform and reworded it, But when I was first looking into the "Constitution" party they absolutely believed in the first and freedom of Religion just as long as it was "a known form of CHRISTIANITY."

That hit me like a ton of bricks. What a bunch of hypocritical lairs who do not deserve to call themselves the "Constitution" party. As I dug deeper I realized they wanted to form a nation of Christian soldiers and use government to do it against the will of the people, This is the very thing the Constitution protects each and every individual from on purpose.

Something wrong with that picture and I think they should relinquish the title and label to those who truly believe in Constitutional individual and equal rights.

Swordsmyth
02-23-2020, 08:56 PM
They kind of screwed their own integrity with hypocrisy years ago. They have since changed their platform and reworded it, But when I was first looking into the "Constitution" party they absolutely believed in the first and freedom of Religion just as long as it was "a known form of CHRISTIANITY."

That hit me like a ton of bricks. What a bunch of hypocritical lairs who do not deserve to call themselves the "Constitution" party. As I dug deeper I realized they wanted to form a nation of Christian soldiers and use government to do it against the will of the people, This is the very thing the Constitution protects each and every individual from on purpose.

Something wrong with that picture and I think they should relinquish the title and label to those who truly believe in Constitutional individual and equal rights.
I understand them and you.

I hope they have [really] changed enough to be more palatable.

But there are religions that the founders never thought would be an issue and that are bad for liberty and civilization, religious liberty has always been full of exceptions, we don't and shouldn't allow things like the Thugees here.
The left wants to take religious liberty and use it to usher in anarchy followed by tyranny.

Theocrat
02-23-2020, 08:58 PM
LOL

I've compromised nothing.

But thanks for passing judgement on me.

I do what I can to make things better and that includes both the CP and the GOP.

I'm glad you admit you think that Ron compromised his ethics for running in the GOP, I don't.

I'll continue to work with Republicans and sinners and you can keep being a pharisee.

Yeah, and keep on supporting a party that hasn't worked to stop the slaughter of the unborn, hasn't brought our troops home from unconstitutional occupations, continues to devalue our currency (which is called an abomination in Scripture, by the way), increases subsidies to corporations all the while criticizing Democrats for increasing welfare spending, supports more intrusions into our privacy, has no interest in balancing our federal budget nor auditing the Federal Reserve, and has increased the size and scope of government that it's hard to tell if they're run by Democrats or not.

Your work is in vain.

timosman
02-23-2020, 08:58 PM
We need to amend the constitution to recognize the fundamental right of citizens to not give a fuck. This would prevent communism from taking toll.

Swordsmyth
02-23-2020, 09:02 PM
Yeah, and keep on supporting a party that hasn't worked to stop the slaughter of the unborn, hasn't brought our troops home from unconstitutional occupations, continues to devalue our currency (which is called an abomination in Scripture, by the way), increases subsidies to corporations all the while criticizing Democrats for increasing welfare spending, supports more intrusions into our privacy, has no interest in balancing our federal budget nor auditing the Federal Reserve, and has increased the size and scope of government that it's hard to tell if they're run by Democrats or not.

Your work is in vain.
The party is moving in our direction.
You are the one who's work is in vain because you give up if you don't get what you want immediately.

Theocrat
02-23-2020, 09:08 PM
The party is moving in our direction.
You are the one who's work is in vain because you give up if you don't get what you want immediately.

I do my work on the city and county levels because that's where true civic change starts. Our republic holds to the view that the States and the people of the States have more power than the federal government, after all.

ATruepatriot
02-23-2020, 09:09 PM
I understand them and you.

I hope they have [really] changed enough to be more palatable.

But there are religions that the founders never thought would be an issue and that are bad for liberty and civilization, religious liberty has always been full of exceptions, we don't and shouldn't allow things like the Thugees here.
The left wants to take religious liberty and use it to usher in anarchy followed by tyranny.

My concern with the concept they propose is that it opens the door for other religions to do the same when they are the majority. The Constitution is absolutely designed to protect each and every individual aside from the masses. It very well could be Sharia shoved on everyone by government because they opened a door they should not have in the first place. I actually just went and read a few days ago and the underlying sentiment of a "Christian Nation" is still there. The concept is not Constitutional and should never be because next year it could be Sharia.

Theocrat
02-23-2020, 09:20 PM
My concern with the concept they propose is that it opens the door for other religions to do the same when they are the majority. The Constitution is absolutely designed to protect each and every individual aside from the masses. It very well could be Sharia shoved on everyone by government because they opened a door they should not have in the first place. I actually just went and read a few days ago and the underlying sentiment of a "Christian Nation" is still there. The concept is not Constitutional and should never be because next year it could be Sharia.

That makes absolutely no sense. Why would a Muslim join a political party with explicit Christian beliefs in its platform? They could just form their own Sharia Party instead.

But if you change the language to just "religion," then that opens the door to all sorts of religions, besides Islam. And based on whose religious beliefs become the majority view within that party, all due to the idea that "freedom of religion" is just a blanket statement for the inclusion of all religious beliefs, then it could very well evolve into a party of Sharia law advocates.

But our founders didn't define "religion" in the general sense that we understand today. In their time, "religion" was synonymous with "denomination" or "sect," within the context of Christianity. There's simply no way our founders would have interpreted "religion" as giving way to what they would call "Mohammedans," in some general idea of "religion." That's just anachronistic.

JoshLowry
02-23-2020, 10:16 PM
That makes absolutely no sense. Why would a Muslim join a political party with explicit Christian beliefs in its platform? They could just form their own Sharia Party instead.

But if you change the language to just "religion," then that opens the door to all sorts of religions, besides Islam. And based on whose religious beliefs become the majority view within that party, all due to the idea that "freedom of religion" is just a blanket statement for the inclusion of all religious beliefs, then it could very well evolve into a party of Sharia law advocates.

But our founders didn't define "religion" in the general sense that we understand today. In their time, "religion" was synonymous with "denomination" or "sect," within the context of Christianity. There's simply no way our founders would have interpreted "religion" as giving way to what they would call "Mohammedans," in some general idea of "religion." That's just anachronistic.

Throwing my vote in for support of a party that includes religious freedoms liberties.

You are painting collectively. Not all Christians proclaim liberty throughout the land to all its inhabitants.

Good to see you back.

Pauls' Revere
02-23-2020, 10:22 PM
You're not hijacking anything. They don't want true liberty-conscious people inside their party. Just look at how they turned against Dr. Ron Paul twice when he ran, and they used the mainstream media to do it in epic proportions. Case in point:


https://youtu.be/nhUIhli71XI

+rep

:trophy:

Pauls' Revere
02-23-2020, 10:25 PM
You folks are hilarious.
6
6
6
6

:D

The sign of a new beast.

Ender
02-23-2020, 10:58 PM
Throwing my vote in for support of a party that includes religious freedoms liberties.

You are painting collectively. Not all Christians proclaim liberty throughout the land to all its inhabitants.

Good to see you back.

Exactly.

The 1st Amendment specifically states that "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof."

Origanalist
02-23-2020, 11:11 PM
That makes absolutely no sense. Why would a Muslim join a political party with explicit Christian beliefs in its platform? They could just form their own Sharia Party instead.

But if you change the language to just "religion," then that opens the door to all sorts of religions, besides Islam. And based on whose religious beliefs become the majority view within that party, all due to the idea that "freedom of religion" is just a blanket statement for the inclusion of all religious beliefs, then it could very well evolve into a party of Sharia law advocates.

But our founders didn't define "religion" in the general sense that we understand today. In their time, "religion" was synonymous with "denomination" or "sect," within the context of Christianity. There's simply no way our founders would have interpreted "religion" as giving way to what they would call "Mohammedans," in some general idea of "religion." That's just anachronistic.

I could be wrong, but I was under the impression the "founders" frowned on religions other than Christianity. They simply wanted people to be free to practice that religion in a manner they saw fit.

Am I incorrect in this?

nobody's_hero
02-24-2020, 06:33 AM
No, you migrate to places where your ideas can flourish and grow with likeminded people, such as you suggested in supporting the Constitution Party.

Okay, when do we stop retreating?

They infiltrated the GOP in the 1960s and Nolan ran off to form the LP.
They infiltrated the LP with Bob Barr in 2008 and we ran off to ???.
They infiltrated the tea party in 2010 and we shrugged our shoulders and surrendered to the 'teo-cons.'

Retreat retreat retreat retreat. They want what we create and we let them have it.

So what on God's green earth makes you think that if we just go create something new that they won't just come take it over because lo and behold we don't seem to have the fortitude to hold the line? I've not seen any evidence that just splintering off and creating something new is going to yield any tangible results.

oyarde
02-24-2020, 09:55 AM
You folks are hilarious.
6
6
6
6

:D

The sign of a new beast.
No is now in a slight lead with 9 to 7 .

kahless
02-24-2020, 02:08 PM
Okay, when do we stop retreating?

They infiltrated the GOP in the 1960s and Nolan ran off to form the LP.
They infiltrated the LP with Bob Barr in 2008 and we ran off to ???.
They infiltrated the tea party in 2010 and we shrugged our shoulders and surrendered to the 'teo-cons.'

Retreat retreat retreat retreat. They want what we create and we let them have it.

So what on God's green earth makes you think that if we just go create something new that they won't just come take it over because lo and behold we don't seem to have the fortitude to hold the line? I've not seen any evidence that just splintering off and creating something new is going to yield any tangible results.

Don't you know libertarians are doing their part holding the line by not voting, not becoming part of the process as some form of protest and writing it Ron Paul in places where these votes are not even counted. That showed them.

Seriously though I agree and was reminded when I read your post how sad it was to watch the tea party infiltration - surrender to teo-cons in recent history. Blah.

TomtheTinker
02-24-2020, 02:49 PM
Just join the LP and help the LVM Caucas take it over.

KEEF
02-24-2020, 03:30 PM
It would just end up getting highjacked similar to how the Liberty Movement of 2008 did.

Swordsmyth
02-24-2020, 05:16 PM
Okay, when do we stop retreating?

They infiltrated the GOP in the 1960s and Nolan ran off to form the LP.
They infiltrated the LP with Bob Barr in 2008 and we ran off to ???.
They infiltrated the tea party in 2010 and we shrugged our shoulders and surrendered to the 'teo-cons.'

Retreat retreat retreat retreat. They want what we create and we let them have it.

So what on God's green earth makes you think that if we just go create something new that they won't just come take it over because lo and behold we don't seem to have the fortitude to hold the line? I've not seen any evidence that just splintering off and creating something new is going to yield any tangible results.
Exactly.

Theocrat
02-24-2020, 05:36 PM
I could be wrong, but I was under the impression the "founders" frowned on religions other than Christianity. They simply wanted people to be free to practice that religion in a manner they saw fit.

Am I incorrect in this?

No. I can't find any document where any of the Founders attributed their ideas of a free, Constitutional republic to other religious worldviews such as Humanism, Islam, Buddhism, Hinduism, or any other one. They were pretty zealous that they founded the country on the principles of the Christian Faith. I think they feared more of one denomination becoming the dominant sect over the federal government than they were of another faith (like Humanism or Islam) taking over.

Theocrat
02-24-2020, 06:11 PM
Okay, when do we stop retreating?

They infiltrated the GOP in the 1960s and Nolan ran off to form the LP.
They infiltrated the LP with Bob Barr in 2008 and we ran off to ???.
They infiltrated the tea party in 2010 and we shrugged our shoulders and surrendered to the 'teo-cons.'

Retreat retreat retreat retreat. They want what we create and we let them have it.

So what on God's green earth makes you think that if we just go create something new that they won't just come take it over because lo and behold we don't seem to have the fortitude to hold the line? I've not seen any evidence that just splintering off and creating something new is going to yield any tangible results.

In a free market, you stop supporting a product/service whenever the quality or price of that product/service doesn't suit your demand. That's when you find another good product/service that's in competition and meets your demand. That's the beauty of voluntary associations.

There comes a point where an organization becomes so far removed from its core principles or promises that it no longer is worthy of patronage. It has become so corrupt that trying to clean up its corruption becomes a waste of time. The Republican Party is just at that state. You can stay and try return them to their principles, values, etc., but it will only be rape. They don't want certain views and ideas to permeate their party, and the infrastructure is such that they fend off any reformation that seeks to usurp their power. That doesn't produce any tangible results, either.

The fact that Ron Paul Forums, of all places, is infested with Trump supporters reveals whom has influenced whom in the Republican Party. It's not the neoconservatives who have compromised on their principles; it's those who claim to be Ron Paul supporters. You haven't changed a thing in the Republican Party, but the party has changed you. This isn't Ted Cruz Forums. This isn't Ben Carson Forums. This isn't Mike Huckabee Forums. This is Ron Paul Forums. I'm not going to apologize because we're in a place where there's a high standard of expectation for consistency in the principles of small government, sound money, a noninterventionist foreign policy, and most of all, the protection of human life at all stages of development. You guys have forgotten where you are.

Supporting candidates like Donald Trump is not going to change a damn thing on the federal level because people like Donald Trump don't care about libertarian principles. They say what they want to get what they want, plain and simple. Some of you are so desperate to be relevant on the federal level that you're willing to eat the crumbs on the floor of the Republican Party. And in chewing on their scraps, they ignore you to go about business as usual, waiting every 4 years to give you a plate at their table just to remind you of "what a good boy you've been."

So, like our Founding Fathers did when they dissembled themselves from England and formed their own independence, there is no retreat; there is simply the reemergence of a better order, founded on sure principles in which the last organization failed to uphold or ended up hating.

PAF
02-24-2020, 10:06 PM
Aside from perhaps local at best, voting is big business, controlled and funds/feeds the beast. Whether 2 “parties”, 3 or 7, it is still the same single government which does not and will not have your individual best interest at heart. No matter what “party” one votes for, or conjures up, until the hearts and minds of the people change, the best option is to not participate at all.

Regardless of where one resides, live as an Agorist (http://www.kopubco.com/pdf/An_Agorist_Primer_by_SEK3.pdf), educate others, and hopefully you will bring more folks in. It will not happen overnight, but perhaps over time a new dynamic will begin to take hold.

The Rebel Poet
02-25-2020, 07:16 AM
What we need to do is merge the Constitution and Libertarian parties to stop splitting our vote.

The Rebel Poet
02-25-2020, 12:25 PM
In a free market, you stop supporting a product/service whenever the quality or price of that product/service doesn't suit your demand. That's when you find another good product/service that's in competition and meets your demand. That's the beauty of voluntary associations.

There comes a point where an organization becomes so far removed from its core principles or promises that it no longer is worthy of patronage. It has become so corrupt that trying to clean up its corruption becomes a waste of time. The Republican Party is just at that state. You can stay and try return them to their principles, values, etc., but it will only be rape. They don't want certain views and ideas to permeate their party, and the infrastructure is such that they fend off any reformation that seeks to usurp their power. That doesn't produce any tangible results, either.

The fact that Ron Paul Forums, of all places, is infested with Trump supporters reveals whom has influenced whom in the Republican Party. It's not the neoconservatives who have compromised on their principles; it's those who claim to be Ron Paul supporters. You haven't changed a thing in the Republican Party, but the party has changed you. This isn't Ted Cruz Forums. This isn't Ben Carson Forums. This isn't Mike Huckabee Forums. This is Ron Paul Forums. I'm not going to apologize because we're in a place where there's a high standard of expectation for consistency in the principles of small government, sound money, a noninterventionist foreign policy, and most of all, the protection of human life at all stages of development. You guys have forgotten where you are.

Supporting candidates like Donald Trump is not going to change a damn thing on the federal level because people like Donald Trump don't care about libertarian principles. They say what they want to get what they want, plain and simple. Some of you are so desperate to be relevant on the federal level that you're willing to eat the crumbs on the floor of the Republican Party. And in chewing on their scraps, they ignore you to go about business as usual, waiting every 4 years to give you a plate at their table just to remind you of "what a good boy you've been."

So, like our Founding Fathers did when they dissembled themselves from England and formed their own independence, there is no retreat; there is simply the reemergence of a better order, founded on sure principles in which the last organization failed to uphold or ended up hating.
This.

+rep

kahless
02-25-2020, 01:35 PM
What we need to do is merge the Constitution and Libertarian parties to stop splitting our vote.

That is all we need is the Constitution Party to merge with the LP lunatic fringe to also make it look like a complete joke just like the LP. Nah.

Pauls' Revere
02-25-2020, 04:27 PM
In a free market, you stop supporting a product/service whenever the quality or price of that product/service doesn't suit your demand. That's when you find another good product/service that's in competition and meets your demand. That's the beauty of voluntary associations.

There comes a point where an organization becomes so far removed from its core principles or promises that it no longer is worthy of patronage. It has become so corrupt that trying to clean up its corruption becomes a waste of time. The Republican Party is just at that state. You can stay and try return them to their principles, values, etc., but it will only be rape. They don't want certain views and ideas to permeate their party, and the infrastructure is such that they fend off any reformation that seeks to usurp their power. That doesn't produce any tangible results, either.

The fact that Ron Paul Forums, of all places, is infested with Trump supporters reveals whom has influenced whom in the Republican Party. It's not the neoconservatives who have compromised on their principles; it's those who claim to be Ron Paul supporters. You haven't changed a thing in the Republican Party, but the party has changed you. This isn't Ted Cruz Forums. This isn't Ben Carson Forums. This isn't Mike Huckabee Forums. This is Ron Paul Forums. I'm not going to apologize because we're in a place where there's a high standard of expectation for consistency in the principles of small government, sound money, a noninterventionist foreign policy, and most of all, the protection of human life at all stages of development. You guys have forgotten where you are.

Supporting candidates like Donald Trump is not going to change a damn thing on the federal level because people like Donald Trump don't care about libertarian principles. They say what they want to get what they want, plain and simple. Some of you are so desperate to be relevant on the federal level that you're willing to eat the crumbs on the floor of the Republican Party. And in chewing on their scraps, they ignore you to go about business as usual, waiting every 4 years to give you a plate at their table just to remind you of "what a good boy you've been."

So, like our Founding Fathers did when they dissembled themselves from England and formed their own independence, there is no retreat; there is simply the reemergence of a better order, founded on sure principles in which the last organization failed to uphold or ended up hating.

Kudos!

Q: If not the GOP, DNC, LP, Constitution, Green, Socialist, Reform Party, etc... where do we go?

https://ballotpedia.org/List_of_political_parties_in_the_United_States

pcosmar
02-25-2020, 05:29 PM
We can vote for the Constitution party when the Republican is too bad.

It is.

pcosmar
02-25-2020, 05:33 PM
So who wants to kiss Satan's Dick to be the Leader?


The devil led him up to a high place and showed him in an instant all the kingdoms of the world. And he said to him, “I will give you all their authority and splendor; it has been given to me, and I can give it to anyone I want to. If you worship me, it will all be yours.

No one gets power in this world in any other way.

or why Ron Paul had no chance.

TheCount
02-25-2020, 05:38 PM
The fact that Ron Paul Forums, of all places, is infested with Trump supporters reveals whom has influenced whom in the Republican Party. It's not the neoconservatives who have compromised on their principles; it's those who claim to be Ron Paul supporters. You haven't changed a thing in the Republican Party, but the party has changed you. This isn't Ted Cruz Forums. This isn't Ben Carson Forums. This isn't Mike Huckabee Forums. This is Ron Paul Forums. I'm not going to apologize because we're in a place where there's a high standard of expectation for consistency in the principles of small government, sound money, a noninterventionist foreign policy, and most of all, the protection of human life at all stages of development. You guys have forgotten where you are.

Pretty much all of your post. However, I have a note on the specific part that I quoted:


I think that you are being far too generous in believing that people truly want liberty even as they stridently advocate for the opposite.

If someone persists, over an extended period of time, in supporting policies and candidates/politicians that are explicitly anti-liberty, then it doesn't matter if they say that they are pro-liberty or that they want liberty, because it clearly is not the case. I think that part of the reason that this forum is so infested, as you put it, is because both members and staff accept posters whose explicit intent is the erosion of liberty, so long as those posters wrap their anti-liberty screed in a a paper-thin veneer of rote pro-liberty platitudes.

The Rebel Poet
02-25-2020, 05:43 PM
That makes absolutely no sense. Why would a Muslim join a political party with explicit Christian beliefs in its platform? They could just form their own Sharia Party instead.

But if you change the language to just "religion," then that opens the door to all sorts of religions, besides Islam. And based on whose religious beliefs become the majority view within that party, all due to the idea that "freedom of religion" is just a blanket statement for the inclusion of all religious beliefs, then it could very well evolve into a party of Sharia law advocates.

But our founders didn't define "religion" in the general sense that we understand today. In their time, "religion" was synonymous with "denomination" or "sect," within the context of Christianity. There's simply no way our founders would have interpreted "religion" as giving way to what they would call "Mohammedans," in some general idea of "religion." That's just anachronistic.

Actually, that's not true.

http://webstersdictionary1828.com/Dictionary/Religion

4. Any system of faith and worship. In this sense, religion comprehends the belief and worship of pagans and Mohammedans, as well as of christians; any religion consisting in the belief of a superior power or powers governing the world, and in the worship of such power or powers. Thus we speak of the religion of the Turks, of the Hindoos, of the Indians, etc. as well as of the christian religion We speak of false religion as well as of true religion

https://johnsonsdictionaryonline.com/religion/

2. A system of divine faith and worship as opposite to others.
The image of a brute, adorn'd
With gay religions, full of pomp and gold. Milton.

The christian religion, rightly understood, is the deepest and choicest piece of philosophy that is. More.

The doctrine of the gospel proposes to men such glorious rewards and such terrible punishments as no religion ever did, and gives us far greater assurance of their reality and certainty than ever the world had. Tillotson.

Swordsmyth
02-25-2020, 06:14 PM
That is all we need is the Constitution Party to merge with the LP lunatic fringe to also make it look like a complete joke just like the LP. Nah.
You must spread some reputation around............

Swordsmyth
02-25-2020, 06:15 PM
Pretty much all of your post. However, I have a note on the specific part that I quoted:


I think that you are being far too generous in believing that people truly want liberty even as they stridently advocate for the opposite.

If someone persists, over an extended period of time, in supporting policies and candidates/politicians that are explicitly anti-liberty, then it doesn't matter if they say that they are pro-liberty or that they want liberty, because it clearly is not the case. I think that part of the reason that this forum is so infested, as you put it, is because both members and staff accept posters whose explicit intent is the erosion of liberty, so long as those posters wrap their anti-liberty screed in a a paper-thin veneer of rote pro-liberty platitudes.
You would know about that.

Swordsmyth
02-25-2020, 06:17 PM
So who wants to kiss Satan's Dick to be the Leader?



No one gets power in this world in any other way.

or why Ron Paul had no chance.
Daniel
Chapter 4

17 This matter is by the decree of the watchers, and the demand by the word of the holy ones: to the intent that the living may know that the most High ruleth in the kingdom of men, and giveth it to whomsoever he will (https://www.kingjamesbibleonline.org/Daniel-4-17/)...


The devil only has as much power as GOD allows.

mt4rp
02-25-2020, 06:44 PM
My suggestion would be to name it "The No Longer Consenting Party"

TheCount
02-25-2020, 06:46 PM
You would know about that.

Name the anti-liberty candidates and policies that I advocate, Wormtongue.



Also, report yourself.

pcosmar
02-25-2020, 07:46 PM
The devil only has as much power as GOD allows.


it has been given to me, and I can give it to anyone I want to.

The Prince of this world rules this world till Christ returns physically and removes him.

and his time is short.
Till then, every world Government is in his power. and they will be so Judged.

Swordsmyth
02-25-2020, 07:48 PM
The Prince of this world rules this world till Christ returns physically and removes him.

and his time is short.
GOD is not asleep, he limits the devil when he needs to and he chooses rulers when he needs them to make his plans work.

The devil is a liar and his words should be taken with a grain of salt.

pcosmar
02-25-2020, 07:48 PM
My suggestion would be to name it "The No Longer Consenting Party"

an idea whose time has come?

mt4rp
02-26-2020, 07:37 AM
an idea whose time has come?
It is in my mind.

nobody's_hero
02-26-2020, 08:09 AM
In a free market, you stop supporting a product/service whenever the quality or price of that product/service doesn't suit your demand. That's when you find another good product/service that's in competition and meets your demand. That's the beauty of voluntary associations.

There comes a point where an organization becomes so far removed from its core principles or promises that it no longer is worthy of patronage. It has become so corrupt that trying to clean up its corruption becomes a waste of time. The Republican Party is just at that state. You can stay and try return them to their principles, values, etc., but it will only be rape. They don't want certain views and ideas to permeate their party, and the infrastructure is such that they fend off any reformation that seeks to usurp their power. That doesn't produce any tangible results, either.

The fact that Ron Paul Forums, of all places, is infested with Trump supporters reveals whom has influenced whom in the Republican Party. It's not the neoconservatives who have compromised on their principles; it's those who claim to be Ron Paul supporters. You haven't changed a thing in the Republican Party, but the party has changed you. This isn't Ted Cruz Forums. This isn't Ben Carson Forums. This isn't Mike Huckabee Forums. This is Ron Paul Forums. I'm not going to apologize because we're in a place where there's a high standard of expectation for consistency in the principles of small government, sound money, a noninterventionist foreign policy, and most of all, the protection of human life at all stages of development. You guys have forgotten where you are.

Supporting candidates like Donald Trump is not going to change a damn thing on the federal level because people like Donald Trump don't care about libertarian principles. They say what they want to get what they want, plain and simple. Some of you are so desperate to be relevant on the federal level that you're willing to eat the crumbs on the floor of the Republican Party. And in chewing on their scraps, they ignore you to go about business as usual, waiting every 4 years to give you a plate at their table just to remind you of "what a good boy you've been."

So, like our Founding Fathers did when they dissembled themselves from England and formed their own independence, there is no retreat; there is simply the reemergence of a better order, founded on sure principles in which the last organization failed to uphold or ended up hating.

That still doesn't explain what you're going to do when someone wants to come help themselves to what you've created.

If Ron Paul was the father of the modern tea party, we are the lousy sons who sold the inherited property. We didn't fight for the tea party. It was ours. We just complained that some folks had infiltrated it and therefore it was no longer cool, so let it go. So I personally don't put one ounce of faith in new parties being the way forward. If we're just gonna give it up whenever someone comes to take it, I really don't see the point.

The TP did, however, get Rand into office, so I guess there's that.

Swordsmyth
02-26-2020, 06:45 PM
That still doesn't explain what you're going to do when someone wants to come help themselves to what you've created.

If Ron Paul was the father of the modern tea party, we are the lousy sons who sold the inherited property. We didn't fight for the tea party. It was ours. We just complained that some folks had infiltrated it and therefore it was no longer cool, so let it go. So I personally don't put one ounce of faith in new parties being the way forward. If we're just gonna give it up whenever someone comes to take it, I really don't see the point.

The TP did, however, get Rand into office, so I guess there's that.
You don't expand by running away.

Theocrat
02-26-2020, 06:55 PM
That still doesn't explain what you're going to do when someone wants to come help themselves to what you've created.

If Ron Paul was the father of the modern tea party, we are the lousy sons who sold the inherited property. We didn't fight for the tea party. It was ours. We just complained that some folks had infiltrated it and therefore it was no longer cool, so let it go. So I personally don't put one ounce of faith in new parties being the way forward. If we're just gonna give it up whenever someone comes to take it, I really don't see the point.

The TP did, however, get Rand into office, so I guess there's that.

Where did I say anything about giving up? Choosing not to be involved with the Republican Party doesn't equate to surrendering. There are other parties out there, after all, with better platforms and more principled members, looking for support. That's also not to mention that there are local, county, and state elections which are more important than just federal ones.

But you're the one out here trying to rape a political party that doesn't want your ideas inside her. What's even worse is that you're compromising little by little on your own principles, all in the name of "trying to save the party," by settling for less. You keep bringing up this defeatist notion about "someone coming in to take over what's yours," and yet, ironically, that's what you're doing from the perspectives of those in control of the Republican Party. So, by your logic, what should the neoconservatives do to keep people like you from taking over what's now theirs?

Swordsmyth
02-26-2020, 07:27 PM
Where did I say anything about giving up? Choosing not to be involved with the Republican Party doesn't equate to surrendering. There are other parties out there, after all, with better platforms and more principled members, looking for support. That's also not to mention that there are local, county, and state elections which are more important than just federal ones.

But you're the one out here trying to rape a political party that doesn't want your ideas inside her. What's even worse is that you're compromising little by little on your own principles, all in the name of "trying to save the party," by settling for less. You keep bringing up this defeatist notion about "someone coming in to take over what's yours," and yet, ironically, that's what you're doing from the perspectives of those in control of the Republican Party. So, by your logic, what should the neoconservatives do to keep people like you from taking over what's now theirs?
The two main parties have rigged the game in their favor, the odds of a 3rd party breaking through at this point are extremely low.
The Republican party tells us and its voters that it is the party of small government and that gives us every right to turn it into a party of small government.

Ron told us to take over the Republican party and that's what we should do.

Theocrat
02-26-2020, 07:33 PM
The two main parties have rigged the game in their favor, the odds of a 3rd party breaking through at this point are extremely low.
The Republican party tells us and its voters that it is the party of small government and that gives us every right to turn it into a party of small government.

Ron told us to take over the Republican party and that's what we should do.


https://youtu.be/zYALxUfEmfQ

Swordsmyth
02-26-2020, 07:35 PM
https://youtu.be/zYALxUfEmfQ
Of course he supports more choices.

But he told us to take over the GOP.
If we don't take over the GOP we won't be able to level the playing field for the other choices.

JoshLowry
02-26-2020, 08:13 PM
That still doesn't explain what you're going to do when someone wants to come help themselves to what you've created.

If Ron Paul was the father of the modern tea party, we are the lousy sons who sold the inherited property. We didn't fight for the tea party. It was ours. We just complained that some folks had infiltrated it and therefore it was no longer cool, so let it go. So I personally don't put one ounce of faith in new parties being the way forward. If we're just gonna give it up whenever someone comes to take it, I really don't see the point.

The TP did, however, get Rand into office, so I guess there's that.

Speak for your lousy self. Up against the largest media empire and internet campaigns the world has ever seen. Fought against Cheney McConnell Beck Romney Hannity Bachmann McCain etc etc.

Smeared as racist and violent by the other half of the aisle.

http://www.KentuckyFight.com

We rocked the boat and got OUR guy in office. It was a herculean fight and Senator Paul is next to the President of the US riding on Air Force One. And you characterize it as an afterthought. We didn't take over the world in less than a decade so throw in the towel!

We don't need your faith or points.

NorthCarolinaLiberty
02-27-2020, 12:35 PM
Name the anti-liberty candidates and policies that I advocate, Wormtongue.





Your reply was directed at someone else, but can you tell me why you actively campaign against Ron and Rand? You do campaign against them, right?

enhanced_deficit
03-03-2020, 05:28 PM
Let's not rush though and deliberate this for a while before any new liberty movement political action is contemplated.

I had voted 'undicded' & 'youm', on second thought should have voted 'yes'.