PDA

View Full Version : Trump approves Iran military strike, then abruptly cancels....




phill4paul
06-21-2019, 03:32 AM
Good on him. Hope he can hold off against the neo-cons....


WASHINGTON — President Trump approved military strikes against Iran in retaliation for downing an American surveillance drone, but pulled back from launching them on Thursday night after a day of escalating tensions.

As late as 7 p.m., military and diplomatic officials were expecting a strike, after intense discussions and debate at the White House among the president’s top national security officials and congressional leaders, according to multiple senior administration officials involved in or briefed on the deliberations.

Officials said the president had initially approved attacks on a handful of Iranian targets, like radar and missile batteries.

The operation was underway in its early stages when it was called off, a senior administration official said. Planes were in the air and ships were in position, but no missiles had been fired when word came to stand down, the official said.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/trump-approves-strikes-on-iran-but-then-abruptly-pulls-back/ar-AADaA3K?li=BBnb7Kz

Intoxiklown
06-21-2019, 04:02 AM
Good on him. Hope he can hold off against the neo-cons....



https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/trump-approves-strikes-on-iran-but-then-abruptly-pulls-back/ar-AADaA3K?li=BBnb7Kz

I was just coming to post this story. Although I got a link to an Israeli new source....

https://www.timesofisrael.com/trump-said-to-okay-strikes-against-iran-then-suddenly-cancel-them/

Intoxiklown
06-21-2019, 04:03 AM
Actually....I can add this to it.

White House Adviser Bolton To Travel To Israel For Talks with Russian, Israeli Officials

https://www.rferl.org/a/white-house-adviser-bolton-to-travel-to-israel-for-talks-with-russian-israeli-officials/30011889.html

KEEF
06-21-2019, 04:49 AM
Good on him. Hope he can hold off against the neo-cons....



https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/trump-approves-strikes-on-iran-but-then-abruptly-pulls-back/ar-AADaA3K?li=BBnb7Kz
I’ll give Trump credit where credit is due, and if he can keep us out of Iran, good on him.

Warlord
06-21-2019, 05:14 AM
The neocons are running the show. Trump will yield soon.

EBounding
06-21-2019, 05:29 AM
Great move, most presidents would have gone forward with an attack. If Bolton and Pompeo resign/get fired soon, we’ll know for sure Trump is super serious about not starting a new war.

Origanalist
06-21-2019, 05:52 AM
I would have given up my next vacation to have been in the same room as John Bolton when he did this.

tfurrh
06-21-2019, 06:25 AM
The President decided to wait and ask congress..............................

PAF
06-21-2019, 07:27 AM
Americans have short memories. Introduce the thought, make it appear that care and responsibility are applied, and then move forward. Iran was/is among the last in the region and eventually must be “dealt with”. According to Fox “news”, Iran is a “rogue” nation. That in the eyes of “nationalists” is a very bad thing.

Anti Federalist
06-21-2019, 07:47 AM
Americans have short memories. Introduce the thought, make it appear that care and responsibility are applied, and then move forward. Iran was/is among the last in the region and eventually must be “dealt with”. According to Fox “news”, Iran is a “rogue” nation. That in the eyes of “nationalists” is a very bad thing.

True nationalists, like myself, could care less what Iran is up to.

It is the fuzzy headed and militant "New World Order" crowd that insist Iran must be "dealt with".

The "anti-nationalists" in other words.

I can't tell if the Drunken Monkey was pulling a bluff, confused and vacillating, or genuinely reasoned his way to the obvious conclusion that war with Iran does not serve the nation's, and it's citizens, interests, and called it off.

If it is the latter, is that not worthy of at least an "atta boy", even if thrown out there grudgingly?

Or would you prefer a land, air and sea military invasion, based on false pretenses, in the manner of W going into Iraq, with all the death and destruction that entailed?

kcchiefs6465
06-21-2019, 07:52 AM
True nationalists, like myself, could care less what Iran is up to.

It is the fuzzy headed and militant "New World Order" crowd that insist Iran must be "dealt with".

The "anti-nationalists" in other words.

I can't tell if the Drunken Monkey was pulling a bluff, confused and vacillating, or genuinely reasoned his way to the obvious conclusion that war with Iran does not serve the nation's, and it's citizens, interests, and called it off.

If it is the latter, is that not worthy of at least an "atta boy", even if thrown out there grudgingly?
Tucker Carlson must have convinced him otherwise.

As far as the attaboy... What a ****** for even considering as much.

Anti Globalist
06-21-2019, 07:56 AM
Impressive. Though I feel a war with Iran is going to happen anyway and Trump will be dragged along kicking and screaming.

EBounding
06-21-2019, 08:01 AM
I can't remember the last time a president was worried about deaths and a proportional response.

1142055392488374272

tfurrh
06-21-2019, 08:22 AM
I can't remember the last time a president was worried about deaths and a proportional response.

1142055392488374272

I appreciate this...i really do.

I will add though that Trump needs to understand he sets himself up for this crap when he chooses to appoint people like Bolton and Pompeo. He has to decide what his image will be, but the appearance of being hesitant only goes so far when you surround yourself with people who are chomping at the bit.

PAF
06-21-2019, 08:28 AM
If it is “in the news” and being discussed morning, day and night, what would anybody’s guess be, based upon repeated history.

nikcers
06-21-2019, 08:57 AM
I appreciate this...i really do.

I will add though that Trump needs to understand he sets himself up for this crap when he chooses to appoint people like Bolton and Pompeo. He has to decide what his image will be, but the appearance of being hesitant only goes so far when you surround yourself with people who are chomping at the bit.

The idea is simple, if extremely powerful people won't stop at nothing to destroy your presidency and anyone who works for you then use their power against them by putting your political enemies in your administration so they destroy your political enemies. You can also keep a closer eye on them as well, and keep them busy with fruitless tasks that hinder their ability to advance their political objectives.

sparebulb
06-21-2019, 09:15 AM
4D chess at work.

We are trading a good war now.....

for THE BEST war later.

enhanced_deficit
06-21-2019, 09:23 AM
Among pro-war circles, it is being claimed that he blinked and called things like 'all talk, no bark, 'beta male' etc but for good of country he should happily wear any labels if this allows him to avoid another war blunder. No one remembers GW Bush as an 'alpha' any more.



I can't remember the last time a president was worried about deaths and a proportional response.

1142055392488374272

Maybe deep down, he's still a democrat/liberal on some key issues (wars, big gummit debt spending, health care, DACA, LGBTQ rights etc).

https://twitter.com/IlhanMN/status/1141782845653995520


Iraq War: Biggest Blunedr in US History
Iraq War Resolution
United States House of Representatives. 215 (96.4%) of 223 Republican Representatives voted for the resolution. 82 (39.2%) of 209 Democratic Representatives voted for the resolution.

axiomata
06-21-2019, 09:36 AM
Good to know Trump won't start a war over an event with no casualties (though he was awfully closer. ) Expect the instigators to step up their game since this last one was so close.

TheTexan
06-21-2019, 10:21 AM
Great move by Trump. By appearing to de-escalate the situation, Iran will have their guard down.

And then we can come in with a sneak attack :cool:

Sammy
06-21-2019, 11:58 AM
Thanks God Trump didn't bomb Iran...We don't need a another stupid war..

Zippyjuan
06-21-2019, 12:04 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ziUZv6VOph0

James_Madison_Lives
06-21-2019, 12:19 PM
I would have given up my next vacation to have been in the same room as John Bolton when he did this.

Bolton must have been throwing things.

kahless
06-21-2019, 12:30 PM
1142071291328917504

As expected Neocons are going to Neocon. Good to see Shapiro getting lots of replies slamming him for his remarks with valid points.

1142129281289609216
1142122419957592065
1142116340104335360

Ender
06-21-2019, 01:03 PM
Daniel McAdams on this:

https://www.lewrockwell.com/lrc-blog/why-did-trump-pull-back-from-the-brink/

luctor-et-emergo
06-21-2019, 01:22 PM
OMG, I'm not here for a few weeks or so and it's almost war with Iran ? Good thing I'm back to save the planet.

RonZeplin
06-21-2019, 01:34 PM
A recycled George W Bushbot speaks....

US credibility dented in Iran standoff (https://indianpunchline.com/us-credibility-dented-in-iran-standoff/)



https://youtu.be/n7aSAutgFXI

nikcers
06-21-2019, 02:51 PM
And now some of the Democrats are pissed because they wanted Trump to start an unpopular war so they could score political points. These are some real sick people.

eleganz
06-21-2019, 02:56 PM
When you're so triggered by Trump that his actions actually make you want him to push the button so you can say "OJ man bad! I told you so!"

Some so called anti-war libertarians are truly pathetic.

Trump gave Iran an out during his press conference with Trudeau, he said maybe one of their generals made a mistake. Iran could've easily played things down and go with the narrative but they chose not to, opting to double down. China and Russia are testing and distracting Trump through Iran and Iran is happy to do it so they can receive economic support from them while sanctioned.

Don't forget, when the Syrian chemical gas attack hoax occurred shortly after Trump came into office, he responded with missile attacks on an empty building, an attempt to cool the nation down from their fury that the MSM whipped up.

eleganz
06-21-2019, 02:57 PM
And now some of the Democrats are pissed because they wanted Trump to start an unpopular war so they could score political points. These are some real sick people.

If it makes you feel better, we have some here on RPF and they aren't democrats.

eleganz
06-21-2019, 03:00 PM
Good to know Trump won't start a war over an event with no casualties (though he was awfully closer. ) Expect the instigators to step up their game since this last one was so close.

These kinds of decisions don't just become public knowledge for fun, the white house leaked it on purpose to control the narrative.

Most likely they wanted the world to know that Trump was crazy enough to pull the trigger, but calm enough to spare lives and war. They got both by doing both. Keeping his image of being a so called "mad man" but also his hesitance for war.

Origanalist
06-21-2019, 03:03 PM
When you're so triggered by Trump that his actions actually make you want him to push the button so you can say "OJ man bad! I told you so!"

Some so called anti-war libertarians are truly pathetic.

Trump gave Iran an out during his press conference with Trudeau, he said maybe one of their generals made a mistake. Iran could've easily played things down and go with the narrative but they chose not to, opting to double down. China and Russia are testing and distracting Trump through Iran and Iran is happy to do it so they can receive economic support from them while sanctioned.

Don't forget, when the Syrian chemical gas attack hoax occurred shortly after Trump came into office, he responded with missile attacks on an empty building, an attempt to cool the nation down from their fury that the MSM whipped up.





If it makes you feel better, we have some here on RPF and they aren't democrats.

Who exactly are you talking about? I keep reading this kind of stuff from people but somehow I myself never see it.

eleganz
06-21-2019, 03:07 PM
Who exactly are you talking about? I keep reading this kind of stuff from people but somehow I myself never see it.

The usuals always pop up in threads just like these, keep your eyes peeled, you realize eventually. Hint; they sound just like the liberal media anytime Trump does something decent.

Origanalist
06-21-2019, 03:12 PM
The usuals always pop up in threads just like these, keep your eyes peeled, you realize eventually. Hint; they sound just like the liberal media anytime Trump does something decent.

C'mon, you have to do better than that. You make specific allegations about forum members. You claim they're mad because Trump didn't strike Iran. I see no such posts.

So, you're either full of shit or lets see some examples.

eleganz
06-21-2019, 03:19 PM
C'mon, you have to do better than that. You make specific allegations about forum members. You claim they're mad because Trump didn't strike Iran. I see no such posts.

So, you're either full of $#@! or lets see some examples.

You want me to spend hours sifting through threads and posts finding examples that you will never be satisfied with. Think about the Cost/Benefit of my time vs. your personal idea of what constitutes sht and not sht. So what is the point here?

I told you to keep your eyes peeled and gave you a hint. Should be enough if you are sharp.

Stratovarious
06-21-2019, 03:23 PM
When you're so triggered by Trump that his actions actually make you want him to push the button so you can say "OJ man bad! I told you so!"

Some so called anti-war libertarians are truly pathetic.

Trump gave Iran an out during his press conference with Trudeau, he said maybe one of their generals made a mistake. Iran could've easily played things down and go with the narrative but they chose not to, opting to double down. China and Russia are testing and distracting Trump through Iran and Iran is happy to do it so they can receive economic support from them while sanctioned.

Don't forget, when the Syrian chemical gas attack hoax occurred shortly after Trump came into office, he responded with missile attacks on an empty building, an attempt to cool the nation down from their fury that the MSM whipped up.

What is this thing you seem to have with OJ, do you send letters too?

Stratovarious
06-21-2019, 03:26 PM
Where was the drone

Would we have shot down their drone under similar circumstances

We don't need to turn Iran into potholes for Israel.

Origanalist
06-21-2019, 03:28 PM
You want me to spend hours sifting through threads and posts finding examples that you will never be satisfied with. Think about the Cost/Benefit of my time vs. your personal idea of what constitutes sht and not sht. So what is the point here?

I told you to keep your eyes peeled and gave you a hint. Should be enough if you are sharp.

Like I said, full of shit. Talking out your ass. Nobody here is mad Trump didn't bomb Iran.

Zippyjuan
06-21-2019, 03:36 PM
Where was the drone

Would we have shot down their drone under similar circumstances

We don't need to turn Iran into potholes for Israel.


https://amp.businessinsider.com/images/5d0cc2fee3ecba20ea67a1f5-1136-568.jpg

https://www.businessinsider.com/map-iran-vs-us-airspace-argument-drone-shooting-2019-6


The Strait of Hormuz is around 50 miles wide at the point where the drone was hit. The locations are not precise enough for precise measurements, but the two locations appear to be at least 10 miles apart.

nobody's_hero
06-21-2019, 03:46 PM
True nationalists, like myself, could care less what Iran is up to.

It is the fuzzy headed and militant "New World Order" crowd that insist Iran must be "dealt with".

The "anti-nationalists" in other words.

I can't tell if the Drunken Monkey was pulling a bluff, confused and vacillating, or genuinely reasoned his way to the obvious conclusion that war with Iran does not serve the nation's, and it's citizens, interests, and called it off.

If it is the latter, is that not worthy of at least an "atta boy", even if thrown out there grudgingly?

Or would you prefer a land, air and sea military invasion, based on false pretenses, in the manner of W going into Iraq, with all the death and destruction that entailed?

+rep if I had any.

This goes back to what I was saying before, is that if Trump only ever gets negative feedback then how the hell is he supposed to know what people want? We must be the hardest people to please in the entire world, and frankly there's not a lot of political points to be gained from listening to us. We aren't exactly the kingmakers we see ourselves as in our minds.

Rand Paul isn't wasting any opportunity.

https://twitter.com/RandPaul

Libertea Party
06-21-2019, 03:50 PM
Sen Lee Backs President Trump's Iran Decision
Jun 21 2019
WASHINGTON - Sen. Mike Lee (R-UT) issued the following statement Friday after talking with President Trump about his current Iran strategy:

“After speaking with President Trump this afternoon, I am convinced he made the right call last night. It is clear the Iranian regime is a threat, and that such threats cannot be eliminated by wishful thinking like President Obama’s reckless deal with Tehran. But neither does every provocation call for a military response.”

“Economic sanctions on Iran are working. Tehran has had to cut back support for international terrorist organizations, their criminal nuclear program, and their oil exports are plummeting. The Iranian economy has been crippled, and the Iranian people know it is their own leaders’ fault.”

“Iran’s recent provocations are a transparent attempt by a desperate regime to distract the Iranian people from the true source of their hardship. They are playing a game that has served violent autocrats for decades, at the expense of America’s interests. Changing the regime’s behavior is the right goal, but it’s not at all clear air strikes will achieve it. They may unintentionally strengthen the regime by unifying the Iranian people. President Trump is finally changing the rules of the game, and is winning.”

“If and when Iran’s provocations do demand a military response, that is a constitutional decision for the American people’s representatives in Congress. For now, the president’s Iran strategy is prudent, aggressive, and effective. I fully support it, and his decision last night.”

Permalink: https://www.lee.senate.gov/public/index.cfm/2019/6/sen-lee-backs-president-trump-iran-decision

TER
06-21-2019, 03:55 PM
Me thinks the Deep State wants a war to distract from the growing domestic scandals in the Democratic Party and the FBI/DOJ. The oil tanker false flag didn’t work so they took it to the next level. Maybe that is why Pelosi and Schumer were seen celebrating after meeting with Trump in the Oval Office? He had fooled them into thinking he was going to retaliate. I doubt Trump ever had plans to retaliate. I think he was trolling the Deep State and finding leakers at the same time.

nobody's_hero
06-21-2019, 03:57 PM
Me thinks the Deep State wants a war to discract from the growing domestic scandals in the Democratic Party and the FBI/DOJ. Maybe that is why Pelosi and Schumer were seen celebrating after meeting with Trump in the Oval Office? He has fooled them into thinking he was going to retaliate. I doubt Trump ever had plans to retaliate. I think he was trolling the Deep State and finding leakers at the same time.

Well he got Conway's hubby to out himself. Maybe it worked.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/george-conway-renews-attacks-on-trump-calls-on-president-to-resign/ar-AADe1w8?ocid=spartandhp

I shudder to think what would have happened if Trump had already resigned and Pence was at the helm.

TER
06-21-2019, 04:00 PM
Well he got Conway's hubby to out himself. Maybe it worked.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/george-conway-renews-attacks-on-trump-calls-on-president-to-resign/ar-AADe1w8?ocid=spartandhp

I shudder to think what would have happened if Trump had already resigned and Pence was at the helm.

Pence was the first example by Trump of keep your friends close and your enemies closer.

Suzanimal
06-21-2019, 04:30 PM
These kinds of decisions don't just become public knowledge for fun, the white house leaked it on purpose to control the narrative.

Most likely they wanted the world to know that Trump was crazy enough to pull the trigger, but calm enough to spare lives and war. They got both by doing both. Keeping his image of being a so called "mad man" but also his hesitance for war.

Styx discussed the mad man strategy - seems to make sense.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x-hxrayECHA

Zippyjuan
06-21-2019, 04:39 PM
These kinds of decisions don't just become public knowledge for fun, the white house leaked it on purpose to control the narrative.

Most likely they wanted the world to know that Trump was crazy enough to pull the trigger, but calm enough to spare lives and war. They got both by doing both. Keeping his image of being a so called "mad man" but also his hesitance for war.

On one hand, Iran should be scared because Trump may attack them. On the other hand, he only makes threats and fails to follow though so nothing to worry about.

georgiaboy
06-21-2019, 04:57 PM
He loves this shit.

Thank you, President Trump, for projecting but not following through with bombing Iran.

No Thanks, President Trump, for projecting but not following through pulling US troops from Syria.

Ender
06-21-2019, 05:01 PM
Me thinks the Deep State wants a war to distract from the growing domestic scandals in the Democratic Party and the FBI/DOJ. The oil tanker false flag didn’t work so they took it to the next level. Maybe that is why Pelosi and Schumer were seen celebrating after meeting with Trump in the Oval Office? He had fooled them into thinking he was going to retaliate. I doubt Trump ever had plans to retaliate. I think he was trolling the Deep State and finding leakers at the same time.

So, why'd he pull out of the Iran Deal but is threatening them if they don't keep abiding?

goldenequity
06-21-2019, 05:13 PM
Sen Lee Backs President Trump's Iran Decision
Jun 21 2019
WASHINGTON - Sen. Mike Lee (R-UT) issued the following statement Friday after talking with President Trump about his current Iran strategy:

“After speaking with President Trump this afternoon, I am convinced he made the right call last night. It is clear the Iranian regime is a threat, and that such threats cannot be eliminated by wishful thinking like President Obama’s reckless deal with Tehran. But neither does every provocation call for a military response.”

“Economic sanctions on Iran are working. Tehran has had to cut back support for international terrorist organizations, their criminal nuclear program, and their oil exports are plummeting. The Iranian economy has been crippled, and the Iranian people know it is their own leaders’ fault.”

“Iran’s recent provocations are a transparent attempt by a desperate regime to distract the Iranian people from the true source of their hardship. They are playing a game that has served violent autocrats for decades, at the expense of America’s interests. Changing the regime’s behavior is the right goal, but it’s not at all clear air strikes will achieve it. They may unintentionally strengthen the regime by unifying the Iranian people. President Trump is finally changing the rules of the game, and is winning.”

“If and when Iran’s provocations do demand a military response, that is a constitutional decision for the American people’s representatives in Congress. For now, the president’s Iran strategy is prudent, aggressive, and effective. I fully support it, and his decision last night.”

Permalink: https://www.lee.senate.gov/public/index.cfm/2019/6/sen-lee-backs-president-trump-iran-decision

He's an embarrassment.

The Shameless Guide to sycophantic ass kissing (https://www.onmoneymaking.com/the-shameless-guide-to-kissing-ass-and-getting-paid.html)

goldenequity
06-21-2019, 05:24 PM
'compassion' over possible 150 dead Iranians is the biggest bullshit PR stunt I've seen in last years.
Lol, Trump starves and suffers millions of Syrians, Yemenis, Iranians or Venezuelans and, suddenly, he CARES about 150 killed Iranians?
Fuuck off and die everyone who believes in this shiit.



1142198501654351882
https://twitter.com/ArabianaINTEL/status/1142198501654351882

pcosmar
06-21-2019, 05:56 PM
'compassion' over possible 150 dead Iranians is the biggest bull$#@! PR stunt I've seen in last years.
Lol, Trump starves and suffers millions of Syrians, Yemenis, Iranians or Venezuelans and, suddenly, he CARES about 150 killed Iranians?
Fuuck off and die everyone who believes in this shiit.

I have to agree...

Someone may have warned him of the 20k to 30K dead US sailors before that level would be reached.
And two attack groups smoking or sunk.

Several High Ranking Military officers have resigned over this $hit before Trump took the chair.

It is an incredibly stupid idea that just won't go away.

eleganz
06-21-2019, 06:02 PM
Like I said, full of $#@!. Talking out your ass. Nobody here is mad Trump didn't bomb Iran.


If you can't comprehend what I said, don't btch about it.

It's like you're operating 5 steps behind here.

eleganz
06-21-2019, 06:08 PM
On one hand, Iran should be scared because Trump may attack them. On the other hand, he only makes threats and fails to follow though so nothing to worry about.

And you'd prefer a missile strike killing that 150?

Stratovarious
06-21-2019, 06:16 PM
If you can't comprehend what I said, don't btch about it.

It's like you're operating 5 steps behind here.

I like how everyone now is using my misspelling of bich idea to get the point
across , funny how we have to speak in codes to communicate, even here ,
the site that says promotes 'Freedom' lol........


So let's all stop biching ...:frog:

Stratovarious
06-21-2019, 06:17 PM
https://amp.businessinsider.com/images/5d0cc2fee3ecba20ea67a1f5-1136-568.jpg

https://www.businessinsider.com/map-iran-vs-us-airspace-argument-drone-shooting-2019-6

I know better than to take our govt's word for it. Nice map.

goldenequity
06-21-2019, 06:38 PM
amin dada
@kambrone64
Russia To Lend Iran A Hand For Exporting Oil
http://OilPrice.com https://oilprice.com/Latest-Energy-News/World-News/Russia-To-Lend-Iran-A-Hand-For-Exporting-Oil.html

https://d32r1sh890xpii.cloudfront.net/news/718x300/107f9c2e1d8de0c9a1bdb48d73e4bf99.jpg

https://7img.net/users/3715/65/05/91/smiles/1778904525.gif

Origanalist
06-21-2019, 06:39 PM
If you can't comprehend what I said, don't btch about it.

It's like you're operating 5 steps behind here.

I comprehended what you said just fine, you're just not willing to admit you were blowing smoke when it's obvious you were. Lol, 5 steps behind what? There's nothing there.

pcosmar
06-21-2019, 06:41 PM
And you'd prefer a missile strike killing that 150?

Not gonna happen.. The Missie would not reach Iran... (very real Iron Dome)

and in 15 mins all foriegn warships would be on the bottom,,or on their way.. 20k to 30k dead in minutes.

Iran already has Mass Grave-sites for the bodies. They are expecting it.

Origanalist
06-21-2019, 06:43 PM
I like how everyone now is using my misspelling of bich idea to get the point
across , funny how we have to speak in codes to communicate, even here ,
the site that says promotes 'Freedom' lol........


So let's all stop biching ...:frog:

I never used it, so I can still biatch.

goldenequity
06-21-2019, 06:44 PM
Middle East Politics
Elijah J. Magnier
Iran and Trump on the edge of the abyss
https://ejmagnier.com/2019/06/21/iran-and-trump-on-the-edge-of-the-abyss/
(highly recommended)

https://i2.wp.com/ejmagnier.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/D9iJhiuWwA0h7un.jpg?w=800&ssl=1

Stratovarious
06-21-2019, 06:48 PM
I never used it, so I can still biatch.

No need , I've got biching sewed up .

goldenequity
06-21-2019, 06:49 PM
Not gonna happen.. The Missie would not reach Iran... (very real Iron Dome)

and in 15 mins all foriegn warships would be on the bottom,,or on their way.. 20k to 30k dead in minutes.

Iran already has Mass Grave-sites for the bodies. They are expecting it.


Similary to DPRK there is no way to attack the country without thousands and thousands of US Army troops' corpses loaded on heavy airlifters in caskets...
eeyup. no FRONTAL attacks on ANY armed and capable country unless you're contemplating a thermo nuclear assault.
The cheap, superior Russian air defense systems can & will allow ANY sovereign nation to defend it's own airspace (and their neighbors)

that's why dey loves dem sum proxies bootlickers and mercs. shalom.
(except for Africa) that covert military subvert/crash/rescue 'game' is rapidly coming to a close.

pcosmar
06-21-2019, 06:51 PM
(highly recommended)



???
recommended for what.. by who,,


Iran is pushing US President Donald Trump to the edge of the abyss
IT DOES GIVE SOME INSIGHT into a perspective.. one might even say it promotes that perspective.

phill4paul
06-21-2019, 07:12 PM
Christ, at the back and forth. Lol.

Was just happy to wake up and find out we weren't in war...today.

goldenequity
06-21-2019, 07:21 PM
???
recommended for what.. by who,,
IT DOES GIVE SOME INSIGHT into a perspective.. one might even say it promotes that perspective.

Yes... for perspective. I respect Magnier's insights for years.... don't always agree but he has proven good access/insights/sources.
He doesn't always come out with what I want to hear but....
the insight regarding 'high level communications' and a 'token bombing proposal' to allow Trump to save face is WAY more believable than the 150 dead PR stunt.
If Magnier quotes an 'informed source'....
my experience with his previous works is why I offered and recommended it.
https://ejmagnier.com/2019/06/21/iran-and-trump-on-the-edge-of-the-abyss/


prolly what bothers you is the first paragraphs.
Magnier's of the opinion that Iran had a hand in the first tanker assault(s)... as a warning.
I don't agree... but hey who knows. (who could blame them for putting a little FEAR back at the aggressors.)
(MoonofAlabama actually agreed w/ him also)

further...
the premis of the piece is: 'Trump wants a (face saving) way out'. I could/can totally believe that. emphasis on 'face saving'.
(NEVER underestimate how IMPORTANT that is to the billionaire adolescent sitting in the WH.)
(aka his recent 'demands' for a nice chat... right?? he wants to be 'seen' as 'magnanimous' in granting any 'relief'. Believe it.)

he ends with this:

It is Trump’s desire to avoid war.... that makes him susceptible to Iranian pressure. Trump will be in an even more critical position domestically if Iranian missiles target Middle Eastern oil. Iran is offering only two choices to the US President: end the embargo on Iranian oil or go to war. Sources acknowledge that the future is uncertain and potentially very dangerous for the region and the global economy, since Iran will definitely not stop in its plans to halt all oil tanker navigation if its own oil cannot be exported.

Iran and the US are already at war economically. A way out of this crisis would be for Trump to close his eyes while allowing Europe to work to lift the economic pressure on Iran, without sanctioning the European companies concerned. Otherwise, there may be no escape from a regional and global catastrophe.

Well guess what...
Russia (yes THAT Russia) may have given Trump the way out (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?535893-Trump-approves-Iran-military-strike-then-abruptly-cancels&p=6816849&viewfull=1#post6816849) (not Europe... damn cowards.)
Think about it.

goldenequity
06-21-2019, 07:52 PM
NEW! IMPROVED! PR :check:


1142094741846331392
https://twitter.com/peterbakernyt/status/1142094741846331392

https://pics.me.me/stop-stop-im-gonna-pee-15882140.png

https://7img.net/users/3715/65/05/91/album/tenor_10.gif

goldenequity
06-21-2019, 08:02 PM
hat tip to Intoxiklown


Looks like the drone was, in fact, in Iranian airspace

If true, then that's pretty hard to argue. No way would the US Navy let Iran come into "international waters" right in front of their group and retrieve the wreckage of the drone.
Only way Iran could have gotten it would be if the wreckage was in their waters, and the Navy could only watch.
http://www.globaltimes.cn/content/1155132.shtml

https://7img.net/users/3715/65/05/91/smiles/1047473441.jpg

Swordsmyth
06-21-2019, 11:29 PM
This has been officially denied by both sides so it may be true:

Iranian sources told Reuters that Trump had warned Tehran via Oman that a U.S. attack was imminent, but had said he was against war and wanted talks. Washington also requested a closed-door U.N. Security Council meeting on Monday.

News of the Trump message to Iran, delivered through Oman overnight, broke shortly after the New York Times reported that Trump had called off air strikes targeting Iranian radar and missile batteries at the last minute.
“In his message, Trump said he was against any war with Iran and wanted to talk to Tehran about various issues,” one Iranian official told Reuters, speaking on condition of anonymity.
“He gave a short period of time to get our response, but Iran’s immediate response was that it is up to Supreme Leader Khamenei to decide about this issue.”
A second Iranian official said: “We made it clear that the leader is against any talks, but the message will be conveyed to him to make a decision.
“However, we told the Omani official that any attack against Iran will have regional and international consequences.”

More at: https://www.reuters.com/article/us-mideast-iran-usa/trump-warned-tehran-a-u-s-attack-was-imminent-called-for-talks-iranian-officials-idUSKCN1TL07P

Pauls' Revere
06-21-2019, 11:43 PM
realDonaldTrump If a decision to go to war with Iran happens, be the first president since WW2 to get authorization by addressing congress.

Swordsmyth
06-21-2019, 11:55 PM
Ben Shapiro is back to towing the neoconservative line on Iran.
After President Donald Trump decided to not use airstrikes against Iran, the establishment, neoconservative sphere went up in arms.
Shapiro was one of the leaders in criticizing Trump for his measured response to Iran.
The neocon commentator called (https://twitter.com/benshapiro/status/1142071291328917504) for a “disproportionate response” to Iran after it shot down a U.S. navy drone off the Persian Gulf.

More at: https://bigleaguepolitics.com/ben-shapiro-bashes-president-trump-for-his-restraint-on-iran/



Fox News Calls Trump Weak on Iran, Will Display Pro-Impeachment Ads on Their Network (https://bigleaguepolitics.com/fox-news-calls-trump-weak-on-iran-will-display-pro-impeachment-ads-on-their-network/)

They could taste it.

And Trump dashed the cup from their lips.

phill4paul
06-22-2019, 12:00 AM
Who was the last president to pull back from the brink of war?

J.F.K.?

Guess Trump is a northern Democrat.

The rat bastard!

Swordsmyth
06-22-2019, 12:33 AM
Fox News commentator Tucker Carlson reportedly played an important role in persuading President Donald Trump to call off bombing strikes on Iran in retaliation for the shooting down of an American (unmanned) drone above the Strait of Hormuz. Carlson has been advising Trump both publicly and privately against being sucked into a war with Iran, and praised Trump's restraint in his Thursday monologue.
What is clear is that Trump called off planned attacks on targets such as missile batteries and radar, despite planes already being in the air. Ships were also closing into attack, when military personnel were told that the pre-dawn attack had been nixed.
Trump tweeted an explanation early Friday, saying he had cancelled the strikes after he asked how many would die, and was told about 150 Iranians. He said that he concluded that going forward with the attack would not be “proportionate to shooting down an unmanned drone.” Trump did concede that the attack almost happened, though. “We were cocked & loaded to retaliate last night on three different sites when I asked how many will die.”
The New York Times reported, “Planes were in the air and ships were in position, but no missiles had been fired when word came to stand down.”

Earlier in the day, Trump already appeared to prefer some alternative to a military response. Trump told reporters, “I have a feeling that it was a mistake made by somebody that shouldn’t have been doing what they did,” adding, “it could have been someone loose and stupid.”
It made a “big, big difference” that the RQ-4 Global Hawk surveillance drone was unmanned, Trump told reporters.


When Trump ran for president in 2016, he and Senator Rand Paul (R-Ky.), were probably the two Republican candidates with the strongest “non-interventionist” position of all the 18 hopefuls. But as president, he was persuaded by aides to bomb Syria — twice — despite that country having never done anything to the United States. In his administration, National Security Advisor John Bolton and Secretary of State Mike Pompeo have both advocated more aggressive measures toward Iran. It is not clear who inside the Trump administration, if anyone, is urging moderation in dealings with Iran to counter war-hawks Pompeo and Bolton.
That is why it appears that the more cautionary tone of Carlson, a Fox News commentator, might have provided an alternative voice to the president. In a monologue going back to July 24, 2018, Carlson made the case against war (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s65154ZJP0c), telling his viewers that all the talk about Russia is obscuring “the real news” that the United States is “inching closer” to conflict with Iran.
“If there is one thing Washington loves more than open borders and fat lobbying contracts, it’s pointless wars half a world away,” Carlson said. “Contractors get rich. Neocon intellectuals feel powerful. Bill Kristol, Max Boot and Nancy Pelosi agree on one thing, war is good as long as the war does not help the United States.”
Inside the Trump administration, Carlson said, is Bolton, who has long called for “toppling the Iranian government again and again, though tellingly he’s never suggested what might replace the Iranian government once it’s toppled.”
We should all worry about this, Carlson continued, especially those who support Trump: “If President Trump decides to go to war with Iran, it will destroy his presidency just as the Iraq War destroyed the presidency of his Republican predecessor George W. Bush.” Carlson could have also noted that President Lyndon Johnson’s adventure in Vietnam had destructive effects on the Democratic Party, which won only one of the next six presidential elections. After World War I, Woodrow Wilson’s Democrats lost the Congress and the presidency in 1920 — by a landslide. The Korean War contributed to the loss of the White House by the Democrats in 1952.
Carlson detailed the dangers to the nation of any war with Iran: “Geographically, Iran is about four times the size of Iraq. It has three times as many people as Iraq had when we invaded. Iraq was a divided country along religious lines. Iran is not. It’s cohesive.”
Besides that, “It’s a much richer country too with a military that has spent many years preparing for a U.S. invasion. It’s a formidable force.”
Conceding that the United States could beat Iran, Carlson discussed other problems that the United States would encounter if war came. “Compared to 2003, our country is deeper in debt and far more politically divided than it’s been since the Civil War. Our military is overstretched.… Meanwhile, China is much stronger than it was 15 years ago. You can bet the Chinese military will be far more assertive than ever when we are tied down in yet another quagmire.”
Finally, Carlson concluded his monologue, “If there was a swamp in Washington, you’re looking at it, the foreign policy establishment. They are working overtime to ensnare the president in a mess in Iran. Let’s hope that he understands exactly what’s going on.”
If Carlson’s private conversations with Trump were anything like this strong monologue, perhaps he did tip the scales against a military assault upon Iran. If so, it would be ironic, because during the Bush administration, Fox News was all-in on attacking Iraq. Apparently, Carlson’s fellow Fox commentator, Sean Hannity, is still geared up for a military retaliation. Following Carlson’s Thursday night show, in which Carlson lamented the apparent “hunger for war (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=drbVn3_EAns)” that some in and out of the Trump administration have, Hannity began his program promising that Trump “will bomb the Hell out of Iran.”
Those who like Trump’s “America First” and non-interventionist stances of 2016 should hope that he watches Carlson’s show more than Hannity’s.

More at: https://www.thenewamerican.com/usnews/foreign-policy/item/32655-did-tucker-carlson-avert-war-with-iran

Swordsmyth
06-22-2019, 01:22 AM
Ben Shapiro is back to towing the neoconservative line on Iran.
After President Donald Trump decided to not use airstrikes against Iran, the establishment, neoconservative sphere went up in arms.
Shapiro was one of the leaders in criticizing Trump for his measured response to Iran.
The neocon commentator called (https://twitter.com/benshapiro/status/1142071291328917504) for a “disproportionate response” to Iran after it shot down a U.S. navy drone off the Persian Gulf.

More at: https://bigleaguepolitics.com/ben-shapiro-bashes-president-trump-for-his-restraint-on-iran/



Fox News Calls Trump Weak on Iran, Will Display Pro-Impeachment Ads on Their Network (https://bigleaguepolitics.com/fox-news-calls-trump-weak-on-iran-will-display-pro-impeachment-ads-on-their-network/)



They could taste it.

And Trump dashed the cup from their lips.

Democrats criticize Trump for showing restraint by calling off Iran strike
(https://news.yahoo.com/democrats-criticize-trump-showing-restraint-025123475.html)

unknown
06-22-2019, 02:54 AM
The neocons are running the show. Trump will yield soon.

Unfortunately, I think youre right.

Israel has been trying to get us to bomb Iran for years now.

Dont see how it can be avoided.

unknown
06-22-2019, 02:54 AM
Great move, most presidents would have gone forward with an attack. If Bolton and Pompeo resign/get fired soon, we’ll know for sure Trump is super serious about not starting a new war.

That would be great but unfortunately its never going to happen.

unknown
06-22-2019, 03:10 AM
Hey Trump, if you can change your mind on this, change your mind on bumpstocks, seriously.

Warlord
06-22-2019, 03:10 AM
God bless Tucker!

Libertea Party
06-22-2019, 04:27 AM
God bless Tucker!

For those that missed it. My favorite part (which is both antiwar, anti-statist, and incredibly insightful if a bit --ahem-- vivid):

"John Bolton is kind of bureaucratic tapeworm. Try as you might, you can’t expel him. He seems to live forever in the bowels of the federal agency reemerging to cause pain and suffering. But critically, somehow, never suffering himself"


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-c0jMsspE7Y

nikcers
06-22-2019, 04:49 AM
The ball is in Iran's court and the whole world is watching. Their talking point they have been pushing is that they don't want to come to table because the Trump administration would use any excuse to start a war with Iran and that they do think Trump doesn't want war but he doesn't control the situation and what they call the B team Bolton, bin Salman and Benjamin netanyahu have control over the situation. In reality Trump trolled the neocons by letting them taste war with Iran and then slapped the taste out of their mouths.

goldenequity
06-22-2019, 05:09 AM
Yes... for perspective. I respect Magnier's insights for years.... don't always agree but he has proven good access/insights/sources.
He doesn't always come out with what I want to hear but....
the insight regarding 'high level communications' and a 'token bombing proposal' to allow Trump to save face is WAY more believable than the 150 dead PR stunt.
If Magnier quotes an 'informed source'....
my experience with his previous works is why I offered and recommended it.
https://ejmagnier.com/2019/06/21/iran-and-trump-on-the-edge-of-the-abyss/


prolly what bothers you is the first paragraphs.
Magnier's of the opinion that Iran had a hand in the first tanker assault(s)... as a warning.
I don't agree... but hey who knows. (who could blame them for putting a little FEAR back at the aggressors.)
(MoonofAlabama actually agreed w/ him also)

further...
the premis of the piece is: 'Trump wants a (face saving) way out'. I could/can totally believe that. emphasis on 'face saving'.
(NEVER underestimate how IMPORTANT that is to the billionaire adolescent sitting in the WH.)
(aka his recent 'demands' for a nice chat... right?? he wants to be 'seen' as 'magnanimous' in granting any 'relief'. Believe it.)

he ends with this:

It is Trump’s desire to avoid war.... that makes him susceptible to Iranian pressure. Trump will be in an even more critical position domestically if Iranian missiles target Middle Eastern oil. Iran is offering only two choices to the US President: end the embargo on Iranian oil or go to war. Sources acknowledge that the future is uncertain and potentially very dangerous for the region and the global economy, since Iran will definitely not stop in its plans to halt all oil tanker navigation if its own oil cannot be exported.

Iran and the US are already at war economically. A way out of this crisis would be for Trump to close his eyes while allowing Europe to work to lift the economic pressure on Iran, without sanctioning the European companies concerned. Otherwise, there may be no escape from a regional and global catastrophe.

Well guess what...
Russia (yes THAT Russia) may have given Trump the way out (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?535893-Trump-approves-Iran-military-strike-then-abruptly-cancels&p=6816849&viewfull=1#post6816849) (not Europe... damn cowards.)
Think about it.
1142278009707270145
https://twitter.com/DanielLMcAdams/status/1142278009707270145

1142279112725340160
https://twitter.com/ejmalrai/status/1142279112725340160

goldenequity
06-22-2019, 05:41 AM
1142155987333390336
https://twitter.com/ejmalrai/status/1142155987333390336

1142276658902261760
https://twitter.com/ejmalrai/status/1142276658902261760


assorted/related...

Guy Elster guyelster
BREAKING Iran's foreign ministry spokesman says Tehran will respond firmly to any "US aggression and threat"
His comments came after Trump said to NBC that he will “obliterate” Iran in event of war, which he does not seek.
So after he called off an operation in fear of killing 150, he would annihilate a whole country?

Guy Elster
BREAKING Iran's Armed Forces spokesperson says that "any mistake by America and its regional allies, would be like firing at a powder keg that will burn America, its interests and its allies to the ground"

==============

BAIT

This is very interesting story.
As Iran informed already, downed drone was accompanied with military P-8 aircraft.
Iran restrained from shooting it down. Instead the drone was downed.
Brasco writes this:

Brasco_Aad
Cracked the code.

Iran did not fall for the false flag :check:


The P-8 was filled with dozens (Iran said 35) of military personnel according to Pentagon sources, which is highly unusual, because normal amount of crew = 9. --> 2 pilots + 7 for the mission.

Brasco_Aad
The P-8 flew along with the RQ-4A on an 'intelligence' mission.
But why also send in a P-8 when you already have the most advanced spy drone operating there?
Answer: the US WANTED Iran to shoot down the P-8, that's why they filled it to the brim with military people.

Brasco_Aad
At some point the P-8 crossed into Iran's airspace, but instead of shooting the P-8 down (what Bolton and Pompeo were hoping for)
Iran warned the P-8 to back off and they shot down the RQ-4A instead.
A very dirty plan.

But how did Iran know?

Brasco_Aad
Iran has 100s of spies operating inside UAE, Qatar, Iraq & Kuwait with access to US military facilities.
Iran also possesses advanced Thermal Imaging Radars.

This was a false flag operation designed to trigger. Iran did not bite.

=================

Ali Özkök
Looks like Iran wants to de-escalate?
Commander of the Air Force in the IRGC: "We believe that our airspace was violated by the mistake of a single American general."

(Nope. This is clear Iranian satire.)

https://7img.net/users/3715/65/05/91/smiles/1619689188.gif


=======

Fox News suggesting that Trump is lying about the pull back decision...

1142367606562705408
https://twitter.com/FluorescentGrey/status/1142367606562705408

======

Global: MilitaryInfo
FLASH: The United States has asked the United Nations Security Council to meet on Iran behind closed-doors on Monday, diplomats said - @Reuters

Reza Khaasteh
@Khaaasteh
Iran's air defense second-in-command: US drone was shot down after "numerous" warnings

Reza Khaasteh
@Khaaasteh
IRGC Aerospace Commander: The last warning was given to the US drone at 3:55, ten minutes before we shot it down.
Some parts of the drone were found in Kuhmobarak region in Iran's Hormozgan province, and some heavier debris went to deep sea.

=======

Al-Masdar News
Iran activated air defenses in Syria after learning of US attack: report
https://aml.ink/n023r

=======

1141867005835919360
https://twitter.com/MarkAmesExiled/status/1141867005835919360

=====

1142276884572581888
https://twitter.com/DanielLMcAdams/status/1142276884572581888


====

1142227971647795200
https://twitter.com/The_Cyrenian/status/1142227971647795200


====

1142282116060917760
https://twitter.com/ejmalrai/status/1142282116060917760

=======

1142281504564875265
https://twitter.com/philipgiraldi/status/1142281504564875265


========

1142123636960235528
https://twitter.com/MoonofA/status/1142123636960235528

1142112546696118274
https://twitter.com/MeetThePress/status/1142112546696118274

nobody's_hero
06-22-2019, 05:48 AM
For those that missed it. My favorite part (which is both antiwar, anti-statist, and incredibly insightful if a bit --ahem-- vivid):

"John Bolton is kind of bureaucratic tapeworm. Try as you might, you can’t expel him. He seems to live forever in the bowels of the federal agency reemerging to cause pain and suffering. But critically, somehow, never suffering himself"


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-c0jMsspE7Y

But Tucker doesn't like weed. So booooooooooo!

never mind that the video has 394,000 with 16k likes and 500 dislikes, and he's reaching an audience and changing minds in ways that we desperately need right now.

If Tucker doesn't get fired from Fox soon, it'll be a g-d damned miracle.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qco_KsG6F2Y

goldenequity
06-22-2019, 06:38 AM
BAIT continued: Did Trump KNOW of the UAE/false flag/P8 w/ 35 souls on board?


Brasco_Aad
@Brasco_Aad
"Of course Trump was in the know about this false flag, that's why his statements afterwards have been most chaotic, frequently changing his stories and comments. THIS is the MAIN reason why he did not order in an air strike. "

FREUDIAN SLIP
Remember his BS twat about "there was no man or woman in the drone"?
I think in his head was (still) the idea that the P8 was shot down (as planned).
Therefore his ridiculous reaction.

►Great point! Typical Freudian slip then...

‘We had nobody in the drone’: Trump’s explanation of UAV mechanics baffles observers
https://www.rt.com/news/462350-trump-iran-downed-drone-mistake/
“Fortunately that drone was unarmed it was… there was no man in it. It was over international waters [...], but we didn’t have a man or woman in the drone, we had nobody in the drone.”

jmdrake
06-22-2019, 08:07 AM
Good on him. Hope he can hold off against the neo-cons....



https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/trump-approves-strikes-on-iran-but-then-abruptly-pulls-back/ar-AADaA3K?li=BBnb7Kz

Good for Trump! Of course if he hadn't pulled out of the Iran nuke deal we wouldn't be at the bring of war in the first place.

juleswin
06-22-2019, 08:17 AM
Good for Trump! Of course if he hadn't pulled out of the Iran nuke deal we wouldn't be at the bring of war in the first place.

This, its not like he was cleaning up a problem created by Obama that put him in this spot. But no, everything that happened that faithful night happened because of actions and people he appointed to his admin. So good on him for getting himself out of a jam that he is solely responsible for. Next thing you know, people would start thanking him for not nuking the world seeing as he can do that now and have so far restrained himself from doing so :rolleyes:

Sorry but somehow this doesn't impress me.

nikcers
06-22-2019, 08:34 AM
This, its not like he was cleaning up a problem created by Obama that put him in this spot.

fake news

goldenequity
06-22-2019, 09:06 AM
1142432319288090624
https://twitter.com/JZarif/status/1142432319288090624/photo/1

For more visual detail on the path, location, and point of impact of the U.S. military drone Iran shot down on Thursday, and of the waters over which it was flying,
see these maps and coordinates. There can be no doubt about where the vessel was when it was brought down.
Javad Zarif FM Iran
‏Verified account

Red Line Iranian Territorial Water/Airspace

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D9q8GgpXkAE2cZi.jpg

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D9q8HvLXsAEMPtF.jpg

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D9q8IW-X4AAMP9D.jpg


=========

story regarding the P-8 aircraft. It quotes mainly Iranian sources:
https://americanmilitarynews.com/2019/06/iran-almost-shot-down-us-navy-plane-with-35-crew-as-message-to-us/

Pentagon confirmed that P-8 Poseidon really accompanied downed drone:
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/06/21/us/politics/trump-iran-attack.html

Here are mentioned warnings given to the US before the downing of the drone:
https://www.al-monitor.com/pulse/originals/2019/06/iran-tensions-us-drone-downing-gulf-trump.html

goldenequity
06-22-2019, 09:15 AM
This belongs here.:check:

Enrico Ivanov
The investigation into the crash of the #MH17 Malaysia Airlines plane in East Ukraine was always compromised, right from the start.
https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2019-06-21/mh17-report-compromised-start


It's the exact same people doing this... just the 'faces' change. MAGA.

goldenequity
06-22-2019, 09:18 AM
Guy Elster
BREAKING Iran executed a former defense contractor over spying to US: local media
(it's the benjamins baby... who can resist?)

goldenequity
06-22-2019, 09:31 AM
U.S. WANTS TO MAKE LOW-YIELD WARHEADS A MEANS OF BLACKMAILING COUNTRIES OPPOSED TO ITS DIKTAT - RUSSIAN FOREIGN MINISTRY
Interfax

tolja. :check:
When the 'moderate' proxies and 'freedom fighters' no longer work...
and the false flags and the fake news and the sanctions and the 'projected Naval 'power' no longer works...
when the 'air superiority' upon unprotected 'sovereign airspace' is now outclassed by affordable Russian air defense systems
(they've offered to sell them to the Pentagon. srsly. haha)

then THIS parasitical move against the entire unsubmissive and defiant WORLD...
is all they (Trump ESPECIALLY INCLUDED) have left.
pathetic. REALLY pathetic.

navy-vet
06-22-2019, 09:41 AM
Who was the last president to pull back from the brink of war?

J.F.K.?

Guess Trump is a northern Democrat.


The rat bastard!

Cuban Missile Crisis? No, he stood his ground and the Russians backed down. I personally knew a sailor that was there on the line that day.

UWDude
06-22-2019, 09:56 AM
Cuban Missile Crisis? No, he stood his ground and the Russians backed down. I personally knew a sailor that was there on the line that day.


That's the American narrative.

They forget to mention in schools and popular vernacular that the whole thing started with America putting Jupiter Missiles in Turkey, so the USSR responded with sending nuclear missiles to Cuba.

The Soviet missiles were not put in Cuba, and America withdrew its nuclear weapons from Turkey.

History!

Anti Federalist
06-22-2019, 10:25 AM
+rep if I had any.

This goes back to what I was saying before, is that if Trump only ever gets negative feedback then how the hell is he supposed to know what people want? We must be the hardest people to please in the entire world, and frankly there's not a lot of political points to be gained from listening to us. We aren't exactly the kingmakers we see ourselves as in our minds.

Rand Paul isn't wasting any opportunity.

https://twitter.com/RandPaul


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VplleMHgmDs

specsaregood
06-22-2019, 10:41 AM
That's the American narrative.

They forget to mention in schools and popular vernacular that the whole thing started with America putting Jupiter Missiles in Turkey, so the USSR responded with sending nuclear missiles to Cuba.

The Soviet missiles were not put in Cuba, and America withdrew its nuclear weapons from Turkey.

History!

Uhm, I learned that in my poor rural american public school.

Swordsmyth
06-22-2019, 03:14 PM
BAIT continued: Did Trump KNOW of the UAE/false flag/P8 w/ 35 souls on board?


Brasco_Aad
@Brasco_Aad
"Of course Trump was in the know about this false flag, that's why his statements afterwards have been most chaotic, frequently changing his stories and comments. THIS is the MAIN reason why he did not order in an air strike. "

FREUDIAN SLIP
Remember his BS $#@! about "there was no man or woman in the drone"?
I think in his head was (still) the idea that the P8 was shot down (as planned).
Therefore his ridiculous reaction.

►Great point! Typical Freudian slip then...

‘We had nobody in the drone’: Trump’s explanation of UAV mechanics baffles observers
https://www.rt.com/news/462350-trump-iran-downed-drone-mistake/
“Fortunately that drone was unarmed it was… there was no man in it. It was over international waters [...], but we didn’t have a man or woman in the drone, we had nobody in the drone.”

That doesn't prove he knew anything, he is emphasizing that no US military personnel were lost so that he can't be accused of failing to to protect them when he doesn't strike Iran.

Swordsmyth
06-22-2019, 03:20 PM
If Trump never even approved the strike that's even better.
If he wants to say he did and then cancelled it to look tough so the Neocons can't attack him as well that doesn't really hurt anything.

juleswin
06-22-2019, 03:23 PM
That doesn't prove he knew anything, he is emphasizing that no US military personnel were lost so that he can't be accused of failing to to protect them when he doesn't strike Iran.

Drone don't have people inside it but planes do. People are saying that the talk of people possibly being inside the drone is the Freudian slip especially if the claim of a plane flying next to the drone is true.

UWDude
06-22-2019, 03:24 PM
Uhm, I learned that in my poor rural american public school.

you are an exception to the rule, then.

popular narrative is USSR decided to tea bag the US by shoving nukes in their face in Cuba, but heroic JFK told them to stand down, and USSR shirked away, tail between their legs.

r3volution 3.0
06-22-2019, 03:25 PM
Happy ending (for now), but the weather-vane hardly inspires confidence...

If he genuinely didn't know that bombing Iran was a bad idea until the last minute, that tells you it's a matter of luck that he chose well.

...whoever he happened to talk to last, whatever tweet he happened to have read last, whether he had lunch yet, etc.

Sooner or later, if these crises keep recurring, our luck is going to run out.

Swordsmyth
06-22-2019, 03:26 PM
Drone don't have people inside it but planes do. People are saying that the talk of people possibly being inside the drone is the Freudian slip especially if the claim of a plane flying next to the drone is true.
I know that but Trump is speaking to the public and emphasizing that there is no need to avenge the loss because no personnel were lost.

He is speaking so that even the most ignorant or stupid will understand that no lives were lost and there is no excuse for killing Iranians.

Swordsmyth
06-22-2019, 03:29 PM
Happy ending (for now), but the weather-vane hardly inspires confidence...

If he genuinely didn't know that bombing Iran was a bad idea until the last minute, that tells you it's a matter of luck that he chose well.

...whoever he happened to talk to last, whatever tweet he happened to have read last, whether he had lunch yet, etc.

Sooner or later, if these crises keep recurring, our luck is going to run out.
If you assume that events played out the way you are assuming them to have played out.
Maybe Trump never intended to attack but was toying with the war mongers or maybe he never authorized the attack and then cancelled it and just said he did to sound tough for political reasons.

r3volution 3.0
06-22-2019, 03:33 PM
If you assume that events played out the way you are assuming them to have played out.
Maybe Trump never intended to attack but was toying with the war mongers or maybe he never authorized the attack and then cancelled it and just said he did to sound tough for political reasons.

Maybe there are Marines massing at undisclosed locations for Trump's final purge of the PizzaState traitors..

juleswin
06-22-2019, 03:36 PM
I know that but Trump is speaking to the public and emphasizing that there is no need to avenge the loss because no personnel were lost.

He is speaking so that even the most ignorant or stupid will understand that no lives were lost and there is no excuse for killing Iranians.

Considering that Trump has had no problem killing innocent people, he has placed increased sanctions on Iran after all of this which we know kills people, his opposition to stopping the war in Yemen is also another example that shows that he does not care about innocent lives. For this reason, I am left to believe the Freudian slip theory

Swordsmyth
06-22-2019, 03:40 PM
Considering that Trump has had no problem killing innocent people, he has placed increased sanctions on Iran after all of this which we know kills people, his opposition to stopping the war in Yemen is also another example that shows that he does not care about innocent lives. For this reason, I am left to believe the Freudian slip theory
Whether or not he cares about innocent lives doesn't matter, he doesn't want war with Iran for some reason (there are several possible reasons).
The Freudian slip theory makes no sense.

Swordsmyth
06-22-2019, 04:41 PM
According to Gen. Keane, President Trump is said to have ordered an attack on the sophisticated radar-guided surface-to-air missile launch site, in response to the unprovoked attack.
The deployment of U.S. naval and air military assets had already been set in motion when the president immediately reversed himself and ordered a stand down.

Gen. Keane said that the president reversed that decision after United States intelligence sources had come into new information that the Iranian commander who ordered the strike had acted on his own and was being disciplined for his actions.
http://patriotcrier.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/TRUMP-TWEET-IRAN-MADE-A-VERY-BIG-MISTAKE-1.png (http://patriotcrier.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/TRUMP-TWEET-IRAN-MADE-A-VERY-BIG-MISTAKE-1.png)
It is unlikely President Trump will allow himself to be rolled by a hostile foreign nation, but it is even more unlikely that he’ll add his name to the list of presidents who have allowed themselves to be drawn into unnecessary wars in the Mid-East.


http://patriotcrier.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/TRUMPT-TWEETS-IRAN.jpg (http://patriotcrier.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/TRUMPT-TWEETS-IRAN.jpg)

More at: http://thebeltwayreport.com/2019/06/breaking-trump-was-moments-away-from-wiping-iran-off-the-map-then-something-changed-he-called-it-off-heres-why/

goldenequity
06-22-2019, 05:02 PM
According to Gen. Keane, President Trump is said to have ordered an attack on the sophisticated radar-guided surface-to-air missile launch site, in response to the unprovoked attack.
The deployment of U.S. naval and air military assets had already been set in motion when the president immediately reversed himself and ordered a stand down.

Gen. Keane said that the president reversed that decision after United States intelligence sources had come into new information that the Iranian commander who ordered the strike had acted on his own and was being disciplined for his actions.
http://patriotcrier.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/TRUMP-TWEET-IRAN-MADE-A-VERY-BIG-MISTAKE-1.png (http://patriotcrier.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/TRUMP-TWEET-IRAN-MADE-A-VERY-BIG-MISTAKE-1.png)
It is unlikely President Trump will allow himself to be rolled by a hostile foreign nation, but it is even more unlikely that he’ll add his name to the list of presidents who have allowed themselves to be drawn into unnecessary wars in the Mid-East.


http://patriotcrier.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/TRUMPT-TWEETS-IRAN.jpg (http://patriotcrier.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/TRUMPT-TWEETS-IRAN.jpg)

More at: http://thebeltwayreport.com/2019/06/breaking-trump-was-moments-away-from-wiping-iran-off-the-map-then-something-changed-he-called-it-off-heres-why/

This General Keane (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?535893-Trump-approves-Iran-military-strike-then-abruptly-cancels&p=6816897&viewfull=1#post6816897)?

Swordsmyth
06-22-2019, 05:14 PM
This General Keane (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?535893-Trump-approves-Iran-military-strike-then-abruptly-cancels&p=6816897&viewfull=1#post6816897)?

LOL

I forgot you posted that.

Sorry.

goldenequity
06-22-2019, 05:28 PM
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D9sX_cNWwAAjtLu.jpg

juleswin
06-22-2019, 05:31 PM
According to Gen. Keane, President Trump is said to have ordered an attack on the sophisticated radar-guided surface-to-air missile launch site, in response to the unprovoked attack.
The deployment of U.S. naval and air military assets had already been set in motion when the president immediately reversed himself and ordered a stand down.

Gen. Keane said that the president reversed that decision after United States intelligence sources had come into new information that the Iranian commander who ordered the strike had acted on his own and was being disciplined for his actions.
http://patriotcrier.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/TRUMP-TWEET-IRAN-MADE-A-VERY-BIG-MISTAKE-1.png (http://patriotcrier.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/TRUMP-TWEET-IRAN-MADE-A-VERY-BIG-MISTAKE-1.png)
It is unlikely President Trump will allow himself to be rolled by a hostile foreign nation, but it is even more unlikely that he’ll add his name to the list of presidents who have allowed themselves to be drawn into unnecessary wars in the Mid-East.


http://patriotcrier.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/TRUMPT-TWEETS-IRAN.jpg (http://patriotcrier.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/TRUMPT-TWEETS-IRAN.jpg)

More at: http://thebeltwayreport.com/2019/06/breaking-trump-was-moments-away-from-wiping-iran-off-the-map-then-something-changed-he-called-it-off-heres-why/

Trump believes the strike was a mistake and the official that ordered the strike is being punished, so he decided to impose more economic sanctions on Iran. This makes no sense whatsoever.

Swordsmyth
06-22-2019, 05:46 PM
Trump believes the strike was a mistake and the official that ordered the strike is being punished, so he decided to impose more economic sanctions on Iran. This makes no sense whatsoever.
It does if he thinks the person being punished is a scapegoat and that the actual origin of the "mistake" was higher up the chain of command.

I don't support Trump's sanctions but more sanctions probably would have happened anyway and at least we didn't start a shooting war.

It is unclear what the details are about what happened but what we do know is that Trump didn't start a shooting war over the drone being shot down.

Ender
06-22-2019, 06:31 PM
Good for Trump! Of course if he hadn't pulled out of the Iran nuke deal we wouldn't be at the bring of war in the first place.

EXACTLY!

goldenequity
06-22-2019, 06:51 PM
1142567481124503552
https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1142567481124503552

https://media.giphy.com/media/BBkKEBJkmFbTG/giphy.gifhttp://replygif.net/i/342.gif

specsaregood
06-22-2019, 06:55 PM
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D9sX_cNWwAAjtLu.jpg

If you have the ability to hack in and disable their rocket control systems; then you just might have the ability to control them and shoot down your own spy plane. just saying...

Stratovarious
06-22-2019, 06:56 PM
I know that but Trump is speaking to the public and emphasizing that there is no need to avenge the loss because no personnel were lost.

He is speaking so that even the most ignorant or stupid will understand that no lives were lost and there is no excuse for killing Iranians.

''You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Swordsmyth again.''

Swordsmyth
06-22-2019, 07:00 PM
If you have the ability to hack in and disable their rocket control systems; then you just might have the ability to control them and shoot down your own spy plane. just saying...
If that story is true it would mean that Iran's air defenses are not as invulnerable as some claim they are.


We can't be sure of anything about this whole incident except that Trump didn't start a shooting war.

shakey1
06-22-2019, 07:32 PM
Most certainly could have turned out worse.

Libertea Party
06-22-2019, 07:39 PM
I don't have access since it's behind a paywall:

1142601210798792711


https://twitter.com/KingstonAReif/status/1142601210798792711

juleswin
06-22-2019, 07:42 PM
I don't have access since it's behind a paywall:

“These people want to push us into a war, and it’s so disgusting,” Mr. Trump told one confidante about his own inner circle of advisers. “We don’t need any more wars.”

https://t.co/9WYRlzOhyh

https://twitter.com/KingstonAReif/status/1142601210798792711

And after saying that, Mr. Trump ordered more sanctions and troops to the middle east :rolleyes:

Libertea Party
06-22-2019, 07:48 PM
And after saying that, Mr. Trump ordered more sanctions and troops to the middle east :rolleyes:

Heard about the sanctions but haven't seen anything about more troops... is there a link?

goldenequity
06-23-2019, 08:25 AM
And after saying that, Mr. Trump ordered more sanctions and troops to the middle east :rolleyes:

1142766118727237635
https://twitter.com/Russ_Warrior/status/1142766118727237635

Going where we're NOT invited:
Visualize the aggression/expansion/intervention: Red dot is the impact point of the trespassing drone against the border of Iran; and the border of the United States.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D9rALRUWwAEKxAL.jpg:small




1142757336873865216
https://twitter.com/JZarif/status/1142757336873865216

Read it again.^^^

devil21
06-23-2019, 05:34 PM
I'm glad it was walked back (assuming it was ever real in the first place) since such a strike would have effectively been the start of a big ass war. Having said that, at what point do we just assume now that Trump's various threats to do things shoudn't ever be taken seriously and everything out of the WH is complete fake news? It's been a pattern throughout his term but it's looking like SOP now.

phill4paul
06-23-2019, 05:44 PM
I'm glad it was walked back (assuming it was ever real in the first place) since such a strike would have effectively been the start of a big ass war. Having said that, at what point do we just assume now that Trump's various threats to do things shoudn't ever be taken seriously and everything out of the WH is complete fake news? It's been a pattern throughout his term but it's looking like SOP now.

That's the Trump 'rope-a-dope.' His Drunk Monkey Kung-Fu. But, if it brings other countries to the table for whatever reason instead of the status quo then I'm fine with it.

Ender
06-23-2019, 06:11 PM
That's the Trump 'rope-a-dope.' His Drunk Monkey Kung-Fu. But, if it brings other countries to the table for whatever reason instead of the status quo then I'm fine with it.

So. wanna explain why Trump pulled the US out of the Iranian Deal, of which Iran was in full compliance, piled sanctions on them for no reason, & is now threatening them if they dare leave it?

devil21
06-23-2019, 06:13 PM
That's the Trump 'rope-a-dope.' His Drunk Monkey Kung-Fu. But, if it brings other countries to the table for whatever reason instead of the status quo then I'm fine with it.

I think the only "rope-a-dope" is on the American people. John Kerry has been quietly acting as a back channel between DC and Tehran. Tweets about "massive destruction!!!11!!1!!" are for the masses, not the other countries.

Origanalist
06-23-2019, 06:14 PM
So. wanna explain why Trump pulled the US out of the Iranian Deal. of which Iran was in full compliance, piled sanctions on them for no reason, & is now threatening them if they dare leave it?

That was his crackhead monkey kung fu.

Ender
06-23-2019, 06:16 PM
That was his crackhead monkey kung fu.

LOL- shoulda known! :speaknoevil:

kcchiefs6465
06-23-2019, 06:19 PM
So. wanna explain why Trump pulled the US out of the Iranian Deal, of which Iran was in full compliance, piled sanctions on them for no reason, & is now threatening them if they dare leave it?
He avoided a war he was about to start.

He should be given a medal.

/dumbest shit ever

Origanalist
06-23-2019, 06:38 PM
So. wanna explain why Trump pulled the US out of the Iranian Deal, of which Iran was in full compliance, piled sanctions on them for no reason, & is now threatening them if they dare leave it?

Starvation Sanctions Are Worse Than Overt Warfare
https://caitlinjohnstone.com/2019/06/23/starvation-sanctions-are-worse-than-overt-warfare/

nikcers
06-23-2019, 07:18 PM
So. wanna explain why Trump pulled the US out of the Iranian Deal, of which Iran was in full compliance, piled sanctions on them for no reason, & is now threatening them if they dare leave it?

How do you know they aren't enriching it to weapons grade? Are you taking their word for it? They don't just let people walk in and check the enrichment levels there is a 24 hour waiting period. They could probably even ship the Uranium somewhere else to have it enriched to weapons grade. They could potentially sell it to a bad actor that enriches it to weapons grade and then bombs us with it they literally hate our country.

Origanalist
06-23-2019, 07:20 PM
How do you know they aren't enriching it to weapons grade? Are you taking their word for it? They don't just let people walk in and check the enrichment levels there is a 24 hour waiting period. They could probably even ship the Uranium somewhere else to have it enriched to weapons grade. They could potentially sell it to a bad actor that enriches it to weapons grade and then bombs us with it they literally hate our country.

Why do you suppose that is?

nikcers
06-23-2019, 07:23 PM
Why do you suppose that is?

Government propaghanda, they think what their government wants them to think. Iran is good at propaghanda, they even do it to us.

Origanalist
06-23-2019, 07:30 PM
Government propaghanda, they think what their government wants them to think. Iran is good at propaghanda, they even do it to us.

Glad we don't have to worry about such things here. It must really suck to be a dumb Iranian.

phill4paul
06-23-2019, 07:37 PM
So. wanna explain why Trump pulled the US out of the Iranian Deal, of which Iran was in full compliance, piled sanctions on them for no reason, & is now threatening them if they dare leave it?

So wanna explain why Iran wouldn't allow compliance inspectors at a military facility, Parchim, until after it had been bulldozed and then when allowed inspectors found traces of weapons grade uranium?

Stratovarious
06-23-2019, 07:37 PM
Nobel Peace Prize, for a hell of a lot more than the nothing Obama did,
now if we could just get Trump to stop sucking ass and shilling for Israel and their
war crimes.

Swordsmyth
06-23-2019, 07:39 PM
Nobel Peace Prize, for a hell of a lot more than the nothing Obama did,
now if we could just get Trump to stop sucking ass and shilling for Israel and their
war crimes.
Hopefully this is a start, they REALLY want us to attack Iran for them.

nikcers
06-23-2019, 07:40 PM
Glad we don't have to worry about such things here. It must really suck to be a dumb Iranian.
I would rather live here than over there.

Iran 2017/2018

The authorities heavily suppressed the rights to freedom of expression, association and peaceful assembly, as well as freedom of religion and belief, and imprisoned scores of individuals who voiced dissent. Trials were systematically unfair. Torture and other ill-treatment was widespread and committed with impunity. Floggings, amputations and other cruel punishments were carried out. The authorities endorsed pervasive discrimination and violence based on gender, political opinion, religious belief, ethnicity, disability, sexual orientation and gender identity. Hundreds of people were executed, some in public, and thousands remained on death row. They included people who were under the age of 18 at the time of the crime.
Torture and other ill-treatment

Torture and other ill-treatment remained common, especially during interrogations. Detainees held by the Ministry of Intelligence and the Revolutionary Guards were routinely subjected to prolonged solitary confinement amounting to torture.

Failure to investigate allegations of torture and exclude “confessions” obtained under torture as evidence against suspects remained systematic.

The authorities continued to deprive prisoners detained for political reasons of adequate medical care. In many cases, this was done as a deliberate punishment or to extract “confessions”, and amounted to torture.

Prisoners endured cruel and inhuman conditions of detention, including overcrowding, limited hot water, inadequate food, insufficient beds, poor ventilation and insect infestations.

More than a dozen political prisoners at Karaj’s Raja’i Shahr prison waged a prolonged hunger strike between July and September in protest at their dire detention conditions. Some faced denial of medical care, solitary confinement and fresh criminal charges in reprisal.
Cruel, inhuman or degrading punishment

Judicial authorities continued to impose and carry out, at times in public, cruel and inhuman punishments amounting to torture.

Scores of individuals, including children, faced up to 100 lashes for theft and assault as well as for acts that, under international law, must not be criminalized − including extra-marital relationships, attending mixed gender parties, eating in public during Ramadan or attending peaceful protests.

In January, journalist Hossein Movahedi was lashed 40 times in Najaf Abad, Esfahan province, after a court found him guilty of inaccurately reporting the number of motorcycles confiscated by police in the city. In August, a criminal court in Markazi province sentenced trade unionist Shapour Ehsanirad to 30 lashes and six months’ imprisonment for participating in a protest against unjust work conditions.

In February, the Supreme Court upheld a blinding sentence issued by a criminal court in Kohgiluyeh and Boyer-Ahmad province against a woman in retribution for blinding another woman.

Dozens of amputation sentences were imposed and subsequently upheld by the Supreme Court. In April, judicial authorities in Shiraz, Fars province, amputated the hand of Hamid Moinee and executed him 10 days later. He had been convicted of murder and robbery. At least four other amputation sentences were carried out for robbery.

The authorities also carried out degrading punishments. In April, three men accused of kidnapping and other crimes were paraded around Dehloran, Ilam province, with their hands tied and watering cans used for lavatory washing hung around their necks. Eight men were similarly humiliated in Pakdasht, Tehran province, in July.

In May, a woman arrested for having an intimate extramarital relationship was sentenced by a criminal court in the capital, Tehran, to two years of washing corpses and 74 lashes. The man was sentenced to 99 lashes.
Unfair trials

Trials, including those resulting in death sentences, were systematically unfair. There were no independent mechanisms for ensuring accountability within the judiciary. Serious concerns remained that judges, particularly those presiding over Revolutionary Courts, were appointed on the basis of their political opinions and affiliation with intelligence bodies, and lacked legal qualifications.

Fair trial provisions of the 2015 Code of Criminal Procedure, including those guaranteeing access to a lawyer from the time of arrest and during investigations, were routinely flouted. The authorities continued to invoke Article 48 of the Code of Criminal Procedure to prevent those detained for political reasons from accessing lawyers of their own choosing. Lawyers were told they were not on the list approved by the Head of the Judiciary, even though no official list had been made public.

Trials, particularly those before Revolutionary Courts, remained closed and extremely brief, sometimes lasting just a few minutes.

Foreign nationals and Iranians with dual nationality continued to face arbitrary arrest and detention, grossly unfair trials and lengthy imprisonment. The authorities claimed that they were countering foreign-orchestrated “infiltration projects”. In reality, such individuals were often charged with vague national security offences in connection with the peaceful exercise of their rights to freedom of expression and association.
Freedom of religion and belief

Freedom of religion and belief was systematically violated, in law and practice. The authorities continued to impose codes of public conduct rooted in a strict interpretation of Shi’a Islam on individuals of all faiths. Non-Shi’a Muslims were not allowed to stand as presidential candidates or hold key political offices.

Widespread and systematic attacks continued to be carried out against the Baha’i minority. These included arbitrary arrests, lengthy imprisonment, torture and other ill-treatment, forcible closure of Baha’i-owned businesses, confiscation of Baha’i properties, bans on employment in the public sector and denial of access to universities. The authorities regularly incited hatred and violence, vilifying Baha’is as “heretical” and “filthy”. There were renewed concerns that hate crimes could be committed with impunity after two men who had admitted to killing Farang Amiri because of his Baha’i faith were released on bail in June.

Other religious minorities not recognized under the Constitution, such as Yaresan (Ahl-e Haq), also faced systematic discrimination, including in education and employment, and were persecuted for practising their faith.

The right to change or renounce religious beliefs continued to be violated. Christian converts received harsh prison sentences, which ranged from 10 to 15 years in several cases. Raids on house churches continued.

Gonabadi dervishes faced imprisonment and attacks on their places of worship. A number were arbitrarily dismissed from employment or denied enrolment in universities.

Those who professed atheism remained at risk of arbitrary arrest and detention, torture and other ill-treatment and the death penalty for “apostasy”.

Sunni Muslims continued to report discrimination, including restrictions on holding separate prayers for Eid al-Fitr celebrations and exclusion from high-ranking positions.

In a departure from Iranian law, the Court of Administrative Justice suspended the membership of Sepanta Niknam, a Zoroastrian man, from Yazd’s City Council in October, based on an opinion from the head of Iran’s Guardian Council who said it was against Shari’a law to allow the governance of non-Muslims over Muslims.

At least two people were sentenced to death for the peaceful exercise of their rights to freedom of religion and belief (see below).
Discrimination – ethnic minorities

Ethnic minorities, including Ahwazi Arabs, Azerbaijani Turks, Baluchis, Kurds and Turkmen, remained subject to entrenched discrimination, curtailing their access to education, employment, adequate housing and political office.

Continued economic neglect of minority-populated regions further entrenched poverty and marginalization. In Sistan-Baluchistan province, residents of many villages reported a lack of access to water, electricity, schools and health facilities. The impoverished province retained high rates of illiteracy among girls and of infant mortality.

The Persian language remained the sole medium of instruction during primary and secondary education, contributing to higher drop-out rates in minority-populated areas.

There was ongoing criticism of the absence of measures ensuring minority self-government.

Members of minorities who spoke out against violations of their rights faced arbitrary arrest, torture and other ill-treatment, grossly unfair trials, imprisonment and the death penalty. Intelligence and security bodies frequently accused minority rights activists of supporting “separatist currents” threatening Iran’s territorial integrity.

Iran’s border guards continued to unlawfully shoot and kill, with full impunity, scores of unarmed Kurdish men known as Kulbars who work as cross-border porters between Iraqi and Iranian Kurdistan. In September, security forces violently suppressed protests in Baneh and Sanandaj over the fatal shootings of two Kulbars, and detained more than a dozen people.

There was a heavy police presence across Kurdistan province in September when members of Iran’s Kurdish minority held rallies in support of the independence referendum in the Kurdish region of northern Iraq. More than a dozen people were reportedly arrested.

In June, security forces were deployed in Ahvaz in advance of the Eid al-Fitr holiday to prevent gatherings planned in solidarity with families of Ahwazi Arabs imprisoned or executed for political reasons. More than a dozen people were arbitrarily detained and many more were summoned for interrogation. Ahwazi Arab human rights defender Mohammad Ali Amouri remained on death row.
Discrimination – women and girls

Women remained subject to entrenched discrimination in law and practice, including in access to divorce, employment, equal inheritance and political office, and in family and criminal law.

Acts of violence against women and girls, including domestic violence and early and forced marriage, were widespread and committed with impunity. The authorities failed to criminalize gender-based violence; a draft bill remained pending since 2012. The legal age of marriage for girls remained at 13, and fathers and grandfathers could obtain permission from courts for their daughters to be married at an even younger age.

All 137 women who registered as presidential candidates were disqualified by the Guardian Council. President Rouhani included no woman ministers in his cabinet, despite civil society demands.

Compulsory veiling (hijab) allowed police and paramilitary forces to harass and detain women for showing strands of hair under their headscarves or for wearing heavy make-up or tight clothing. State-sanctioned smear campaigns were conducted against women who campaigned against the compulsory hijab.

Iran’s Civil Code continued to deny Iranian women married to non-Iranian men the right to pass their nationality on to their children, a right enjoyed by Iranian men married to foreign spouses.

Authorities defied ongoing public pressure to open football stadiums to women spectators.

Women experienced reduced access to affordable modern contraception as the authorities failed to restore the budget for state family planning programmes cut in 2012. Parliament passed a law in October imposing severe restrictions on imparting information about contraception.

The authorities continued to monitor and restrict foreign travel of women’s rights activists. Alieh Motalebzadeh was sentenced to three years’ imprisonment in August for attending a workshop in Georgia on “Women’s empowerment and elections”.
Discrimination – persons with disabilities and people living with HIV

The UN Committee on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities reviewed Iran’s human rights record in March. The Committee condemned state discrimination and violence against people with physical and intellectual disabilities; poor implementation of accessibility standards; and denial of reasonable accommodation at the workplace. The Committee also expressed alarm at reports of forced institutionalization of people with disabilities and non-consensual medical treatments against people perceived to have a disability, including on the grounds of gender identity and sexual orientation. In December, parliament passed a proposed law on the Protection of the Rights of People with Disabilities which, if implemented fully, would enhance accessibility and access to education, housing, health care and employment.

In August the Ministry of Education adopted discriminatory criteria for disqualifying candidates for teaching positions. This included illnesses, crossed eyes, facial moles, short height and heavy weight. Following public outrage, the Ministry promised revisions but said that people living with HIV would still be barred as they lacked “moral qualifications”.
Death penalty

The authorities continued to execute hundreds of people after unfair trials. Some executions were conducted in public.

The authorities continued to describe peaceful campaigning against the death penalty as “un-Islamic”, and harassed and imprisoned anti-death penalty activists.

The majority of executions were for non-lethal drug-related offences. A new law adopted in October increased the quantities of drugs required for imposing the death penalty but retained mandatory death sentences for a wide range of drug-related offences. While the new law provided for retroactive applicability, it remained unclear how the authorities intended to implement it to commute the death sentences of those already on death row.

It was possible to confirm the execution of four individuals who were under 18 at the time of the crime and the cases of 92 other juvenile offenders who remained on death row. The real numbers were likely to be much higher. Several executions were scheduled and postponed at the last minute because of public campaigning. Retrials of juvenile offenders pursuant to Article 91 of the 2013 Islamic Penal Code continued to result in renewed death sentences following arbitrary assessments of their “maturity” at the time of the crime.

The death penalty was maintained for vaguely worded offences such as “insulting the Prophet”, “enmity against God” and “spreading corruption on earth”.

In August, spiritual teacher and prisoner of conscience Mohammad Ali Taheri was sentenced to death for the second time for “spreading corruption on earth” through establishing the spiritual group Erfan-e Halgheh; in October the Supreme Court quashed the death sentence. He remained in solitary confinement.

Prisoner of conscience Marjan Davari was sentenced to death in March for “spreading corruption on earth” in connection with her membership of the religious group Eckankar and for translating their materials. The Supreme Court subsequently quashed the death sentence and sent the case back to the Revolutionary Court in Tehran for retrial.

The Islamic Penal Code continued to provide for stoning as a method of execution.

Some consensual same-sex sexual conduct remained punishable by death.

phill4paul
06-23-2019, 07:42 PM
So wanna explain why Iran wouldn't allow compliance inspectors at a military facility, Parchim, until after it had been bulldozed and then when allowed inspectors found traces of weapons grade uranium?


Whether Trump’s move to decertify the deal will prompt Congress to pass new sanctions against Iran, or whether such a move will be enough to scrap the Obama-era deal and renegotiate something better, remains to be seen. For now, one thing is certain: the only government in the world that knows for sure whether Iran is complying with the nuclear deal is the one in Tehran.

https://thefederalist.com/2017/10/17/dont-actually-know-whether-iran-complying-nuclear-deal/

ETA: The correct link.

Ender
06-23-2019, 07:44 PM
How do you know they aren't enriching it to weapons grade? Are you taking their word for it? They don't just let people walk in and check the enrichment levels there is a 24 hour waiting period. They could probably even ship the Uranium somewhere else to have it enriched to weapons grade. They could potentially sell it to a bad actor that enriches it to weapons grade and then bombs us with it they literally hate our country.

Iran was in full compliance- Trump pulled out & is now starving them.

And why would Iran hate the US? Lessee- staging a coup to get rid of their democratically elected PM & placing our Shah puppet in charge so we can take over their country's resources. Blaming them when they took their country back; keeping them in political chains over nuclear weapons, when the were in full compliance with the Nuclear Deal- while Israel would not sign the deal & has an estimated 200-400 nuclear warheads- finally Obama did something right & put together the Iranian Deal- of which they were in full compliance- and gives them back a portion of their money that the US locked them out of. Trump gets out of the deal, sanctions them, calls them the biggest terrorists in the ME- which they are not- threatens them if they leave the deal, and has US ships & planes in their area- not to mention that Iran is completely surrounded with US bases. Just think what Uncle Sam would do if Iranian ships were in the Gulf of Mexico? But no worries- Iranians are baaaaaaad & do not want to kiss the ring of Mordor.

Stratovarious
06-23-2019, 07:45 PM
Hopefully this is a start, they REALLY want us to attack Iran for them.

Thank God, Trump avoided turning them into a huge, empty parking lot

Ender
06-23-2019, 07:48 PM
So wanna explain why Iran wouldn't allow compliance inspectors at a military facility, Parchim, until after it had been bulldozed and then when allowed inspectors found traces of weapons grade uranium?

ALL parties said that Iran was in full compliance- so who might be telling this story? Sounds like the fake chemical thing against Assad.

phill4paul
06-23-2019, 07:58 PM
ALL parties said that Iran was in full compliance- so who might be telling this story? Sounds like the fake chemical thing against Assad.

Full compliance of what was ALLOWED. Sorry, I gave the wrong link. But, I've updated it in the original post.

nikcers
06-23-2019, 07:59 PM
Iran was in full compliance- Trump pulled out & is now starving them.

And why would Iran hate the US? Lessee- staging a coup to get rid of their democratically elected PM & placing our Shah puppet in charge so we can take over their country's resources. Blaming them when they took their country back; keeping them in political chains over nuclear weapons, when the were in full compliance with the Nuclear Deal- while Israel would not sign the deal & has an estimated 200-400 nuclear warheads- finally Obama did something right & put together the Iranian Deal- of which they were in full compliance- and gives them back a portion of their money that the US locked them out of. Trump gets out of the deal, sanctions them, calls them the biggest terrorists in the ME- which they are not- threatens them if they leave the deal, and has US ships & planes in their area- not to mention that Iran is completely surrounded with US bases. Just think what Uncle Sam would do if Iranian ships were in the Gulf of Mexico? But no worries- Iranians are baaaaaaad & do not want to kiss the ring of Mordor.

That coup happened before a majority of that country was born. Plus how do you know they don't enrich the uranium into weapons grade Uranium if they can move it out somewhere else every time they want to inspect before the 24 hour waiting period? Are you really telling me that its impossible for them to take the uranium somewhere else and enrich it to weapons grade there?

Origanalist
06-23-2019, 08:04 PM
I would rather live here than over there.

Iran 2017/2018

The authorities heavily suppressed the rights to freedom of expression, association and peaceful assembly, as well as freedom of religion and belief, and imprisoned scores of individuals who voiced dissent. Trials were systematically unfair. Torture and other ill-treatment was widespread and committed with impunity. Floggings, amputations and other cruel punishments were carried out. The authorities endorsed pervasive discrimination and violence based on gender, political opinion, religious belief, ethnicity, disability, sexual orientation and gender identity. Hundreds of people were executed, some in public, and thousands remained on death row. They included people who were under the age of 18 at the time of the crime.
Torture and other ill-treatment

Torture and other ill-treatment remained common, especially during interrogations. Detainees held by the Ministry of Intelligence and the Revolutionary Guards were routinely subjected to prolonged solitary confinement amounting to torture.

Failure to investigate allegations of torture and exclude “confessions” obtained under torture as evidence against suspects remained systematic.

The authorities continued to deprive prisoners detained for political reasons of adequate medical care. In many cases, this was done as a deliberate punishment or to extract “confessions”, and amounted to torture.

Prisoners endured cruel and inhuman conditions of detention, including overcrowding, limited hot water, inadequate food, insufficient beds, poor ventilation and insect infestations.

More than a dozen political prisoners at Karaj’s Raja’i Shahr prison waged a prolonged hunger strike between July and September in protest at their dire detention conditions. Some faced denial of medical care, solitary confinement and fresh criminal charges in reprisal.
Cruel, inhuman or degrading punishment

Judicial authorities continued to impose and carry out, at times in public, cruel and inhuman punishments amounting to torture.

Scores of individuals, including children, faced up to 100 lashes for theft and assault as well as for acts that, under international law, must not be criminalized − including extra-marital relationships, attending mixed gender parties, eating in public during Ramadan or attending peaceful protests.

In January, journalist Hossein Movahedi was lashed 40 times in Najaf Abad, Esfahan province, after a court found him guilty of inaccurately reporting the number of motorcycles confiscated by police in the city. In August, a criminal court in Markazi province sentenced trade unionist Shapour Ehsanirad to 30 lashes and six months’ imprisonment for participating in a protest against unjust work conditions.

In February, the Supreme Court upheld a blinding sentence issued by a criminal court in Kohgiluyeh and Boyer-Ahmad province against a woman in retribution for blinding another woman.

Dozens of amputation sentences were imposed and subsequently upheld by the Supreme Court. In April, judicial authorities in Shiraz, Fars province, amputated the hand of Hamid Moinee and executed him 10 days later. He had been convicted of murder and robbery. At least four other amputation sentences were carried out for robbery.

The authorities also carried out degrading punishments. In April, three men accused of kidnapping and other crimes were paraded around Dehloran, Ilam province, with their hands tied and watering cans used for lavatory washing hung around their necks. Eight men were similarly humiliated in Pakdasht, Tehran province, in July.

In May, a woman arrested for having an intimate extramarital relationship was sentenced by a criminal court in the capital, Tehran, to two years of washing corpses and 74 lashes. The man was sentenced to 99 lashes.
Unfair trials

Trials, including those resulting in death sentences, were systematically unfair. There were no independent mechanisms for ensuring accountability within the judiciary. Serious concerns remained that judges, particularly those presiding over Revolutionary Courts, were appointed on the basis of their political opinions and affiliation with intelligence bodies, and lacked legal qualifications.

Fair trial provisions of the 2015 Code of Criminal Procedure, including those guaranteeing access to a lawyer from the time of arrest and during investigations, were routinely flouted. The authorities continued to invoke Article 48 of the Code of Criminal Procedure to prevent those detained for political reasons from accessing lawyers of their own choosing. Lawyers were told they were not on the list approved by the Head of the Judiciary, even though no official list had been made public.

Trials, particularly those before Revolutionary Courts, remained closed and extremely brief, sometimes lasting just a few minutes.

Foreign nationals and Iranians with dual nationality continued to face arbitrary arrest and detention, grossly unfair trials and lengthy imprisonment. The authorities claimed that they were countering foreign-orchestrated “infiltration projects”. In reality, such individuals were often charged with vague national security offences in connection with the peaceful exercise of their rights to freedom of expression and association.
Freedom of religion and belief

Freedom of religion and belief was systematically violated, in law and practice. The authorities continued to impose codes of public conduct rooted in a strict interpretation of Shi’a Islam on individuals of all faiths. Non-Shi’a Muslims were not allowed to stand as presidential candidates or hold key political offices.

Widespread and systematic attacks continued to be carried out against the Baha’i minority. These included arbitrary arrests, lengthy imprisonment, torture and other ill-treatment, forcible closure of Baha’i-owned businesses, confiscation of Baha’i properties, bans on employment in the public sector and denial of access to universities. The authorities regularly incited hatred and violence, vilifying Baha’is as “heretical” and “filthy”. There were renewed concerns that hate crimes could be committed with impunity after two men who had admitted to killing Farang Amiri because of his Baha’i faith were released on bail in June.

Other religious minorities not recognized under the Constitution, such as Yaresan (Ahl-e Haq), also faced systematic discrimination, including in education and employment, and were persecuted for practising their faith.

The right to change or renounce religious beliefs continued to be violated. Christian converts received harsh prison sentences, which ranged from 10 to 15 years in several cases. Raids on house churches continued.

Gonabadi dervishes faced imprisonment and attacks on their places of worship. A number were arbitrarily dismissed from employment or denied enrolment in universities.

Those who professed atheism remained at risk of arbitrary arrest and detention, torture and other ill-treatment and the death penalty for “apostasy”.

Sunni Muslims continued to report discrimination, including restrictions on holding separate prayers for Eid al-Fitr celebrations and exclusion from high-ranking positions.

In a departure from Iranian law, the Court of Administrative Justice suspended the membership of Sepanta Niknam, a Zoroastrian man, from Yazd’s City Council in October, based on an opinion from the head of Iran’s Guardian Council who said it was against Shari’a law to allow the governance of non-Muslims over Muslims.

At least two people were sentenced to death for the peaceful exercise of their rights to freedom of religion and belief (see below).
Discrimination – ethnic minorities

Ethnic minorities, including Ahwazi Arabs, Azerbaijani Turks, Baluchis, Kurds and Turkmen, remained subject to entrenched discrimination, curtailing their access to education, employment, adequate housing and political office.

Continued economic neglect of minority-populated regions further entrenched poverty and marginalization. In Sistan-Baluchistan province, residents of many villages reported a lack of access to water, electricity, schools and health facilities. The impoverished province retained high rates of illiteracy among girls and of infant mortality.

The Persian language remained the sole medium of instruction during primary and secondary education, contributing to higher drop-out rates in minority-populated areas.

There was ongoing criticism of the absence of measures ensuring minority self-government.

Members of minorities who spoke out against violations of their rights faced arbitrary arrest, torture and other ill-treatment, grossly unfair trials, imprisonment and the death penalty. Intelligence and security bodies frequently accused minority rights activists of supporting “separatist currents” threatening Iran’s territorial integrity.

Iran’s border guards continued to unlawfully shoot and kill, with full impunity, scores of unarmed Kurdish men known as Kulbars who work as cross-border porters between Iraqi and Iranian Kurdistan. In September, security forces violently suppressed protests in Baneh and Sanandaj over the fatal shootings of two Kulbars, and detained more than a dozen people.

There was a heavy police presence across Kurdistan province in September when members of Iran’s Kurdish minority held rallies in support of the independence referendum in the Kurdish region of northern Iraq. More than a dozen people were reportedly arrested.

In June, security forces were deployed in Ahvaz in advance of the Eid al-Fitr holiday to prevent gatherings planned in solidarity with families of Ahwazi Arabs imprisoned or executed for political reasons. More than a dozen people were arbitrarily detained and many more were summoned for interrogation. Ahwazi Arab human rights defender Mohammad Ali Amouri remained on death row.
Discrimination – women and girls

Women remained subject to entrenched discrimination in law and practice, including in access to divorce, employment, equal inheritance and political office, and in family and criminal law.

Acts of violence against women and girls, including domestic violence and early and forced marriage, were widespread and committed with impunity. The authorities failed to criminalize gender-based violence; a draft bill remained pending since 2012. The legal age of marriage for girls remained at 13, and fathers and grandfathers could obtain permission from courts for their daughters to be married at an even younger age.

All 137 women who registered as presidential candidates were disqualified by the Guardian Council. President Rouhani included no woman ministers in his cabinet, despite civil society demands.

Compulsory veiling (hijab) allowed police and paramilitary forces to harass and detain women for showing strands of hair under their headscarves or for wearing heavy make-up or tight clothing. State-sanctioned smear campaigns were conducted against women who campaigned against the compulsory hijab.

Iran’s Civil Code continued to deny Iranian women married to non-Iranian men the right to pass their nationality on to their children, a right enjoyed by Iranian men married to foreign spouses.

Authorities defied ongoing public pressure to open football stadiums to women spectators.

Women experienced reduced access to affordable modern contraception as the authorities failed to restore the budget for state family planning programmes cut in 2012. Parliament passed a law in October imposing severe restrictions on imparting information about contraception.

The authorities continued to monitor and restrict foreign travel of women’s rights activists. Alieh Motalebzadeh was sentenced to three years’ imprisonment in August for attending a workshop in Georgia on “Women’s empowerment and elections”.
Discrimination – persons with disabilities and people living with HIV

The UN Committee on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities reviewed Iran’s human rights record in March. The Committee condemned state discrimination and violence against people with physical and intellectual disabilities; poor implementation of accessibility standards; and denial of reasonable accommodation at the workplace. The Committee also expressed alarm at reports of forced institutionalization of people with disabilities and non-consensual medical treatments against people perceived to have a disability, including on the grounds of gender identity and sexual orientation. In December, parliament passed a proposed law on the Protection of the Rights of People with Disabilities which, if implemented fully, would enhance accessibility and access to education, housing, health care and employment.

In August the Ministry of Education adopted discriminatory criteria for disqualifying candidates for teaching positions. This included illnesses, crossed eyes, facial moles, short height and heavy weight. Following public outrage, the Ministry promised revisions but said that people living with HIV would still be barred as they lacked “moral qualifications”.
Death penalty

The authorities continued to execute hundreds of people after unfair trials. Some executions were conducted in public.

The authorities continued to describe peaceful campaigning against the death penalty as “un-Islamic”, and harassed and imprisoned anti-death penalty activists.

The majority of executions were for non-lethal drug-related offences. A new law adopted in October increased the quantities of drugs required for imposing the death penalty but retained mandatory death sentences for a wide range of drug-related offences. While the new law provided for retroactive applicability, it remained unclear how the authorities intended to implement it to commute the death sentences of those already on death row.

It was possible to confirm the execution of four individuals who were under 18 at the time of the crime and the cases of 92 other juvenile offenders who remained on death row. The real numbers were likely to be much higher. Several executions were scheduled and postponed at the last minute because of public campaigning. Retrials of juvenile offenders pursuant to Article 91 of the 2013 Islamic Penal Code continued to result in renewed death sentences following arbitrary assessments of their “maturity” at the time of the crime.

The death penalty was maintained for vaguely worded offences such as “insulting the Prophet”, “enmity against God” and “spreading corruption on earth”.

In August, spiritual teacher and prisoner of conscience Mohammad Ali Taheri was sentenced to death for the second time for “spreading corruption on earth” through establishing the spiritual group Erfan-e Halgheh; in October the Supreme Court quashed the death sentence. He remained in solitary confinement.

Prisoner of conscience Marjan Davari was sentenced to death in March for “spreading corruption on earth” in connection with her membership of the religious group Eckankar and for translating their materials. The Supreme Court subsequently quashed the death sentence and sent the case back to the Revolutionary Court in Tehran for retrial.

The Islamic Penal Code continued to provide for stoning as a method of execution.

Some consensual same-sex sexual conduct remained punishable by death.




From that same website...



United States of America 2017/2018

Executive orders to suspend travel to the USA from several Muslim-majority countries sparked legal challenges, which continued through the year. There were major attacks on the rights of women and girls. Eighteen detainees were transferred from the US naval base at Guantánamo Bay, Cuba; 41 detainees remained at the base and pre-trial military commission proceedings continued. Gun violence remained high. Death sentences were handed down and executions were carried out.
Background

On 20 January, Donald Trump was sworn in as President, following an election campaign in which he made comments and promised policies that were discriminatory or otherwise contradicted international human rights principles.
Refugees’ and migrants’ rights

A number of executive orders affecting migrants, asylum-seekers and refugees were signed by President Trump during the year. Two orders dated 25 January called for a wall to be built along the USA-Mexico border, allowed for refoulement (forcible return) and the increased detention of asylum-seekers and their families, increased the functions and number of immigration and customs enforcement agents, prioritized deportation of migrants, especially those suspected of crimes, and cancelled funding for “sanctuary cities” that did not co-operate with federal authorities in apprehending irregular migrants.

A third executive order signed on 27 January banned entry of foreign nationals from Iran, Iraq, Libya, Somalia, Sudan, Syria and Yemen for 90 days, suspended the US Refugee Admissions Program (USRAP) for 120 days, reduced the number of refugees eligible for entry during the 2017 fiscal year from 110,000 to 50,000, and imposed an indefinite ban on the resettlement of refugees from Syria. The order immediately led to chaos, protests and legal challenges on the basis of discrimination towards Muslims. A week later a federal judge issued a nationwide temporary injunction, which was upheld on appeal. The government issued a revised version of the order on 6 March, again suspending USRAP for 120 days, repeating the limit of 50,000 refugees, and imposing a 90-day ban on entry into the USA of nationals of six countries (the original seven minus Iraq). Federal judges in the states of Maryland and Hawaii issued nationwide injunctions temporarily blocking its implementation. On 26 June, the Supreme Court allowed a limited version of the order to take effect. The Court also ruled that the ban could be applied to refugees being supported by resettlement agencies.

A second revision of the order, signed on 24 September, indefinitely banned immigration into the USA by nationals of seven countries: Chad, Iran, Libya, North Korea, Somalia, Syria and Yemen. It also banned the issuance of certain types of non-immigrant visas to nationals of Chad, Iran, Libya, North Korea, Syria and Yemen, and specifically barred visas for Venezuelan officials from certain government agencies and their families. On 17 October, federal judges in Hawaii and Maryland again ruled against the measure, blocking the government from enforcing it on nationals from six of the countries. On 13 November, a federal appeals court panel allowed the third ban to take effect for people with no legitimate ties to the USA.

On 24 October, President Trump issued an executive order to resume USRAP “with enhanced vetting procedures”. On 4 December the Supreme Court granted the administration’s request to temporarily allow the latest so-called “Muslim ban” to take full effect as the case continued to be litigated.

On 16 August, the federal Department of Homeland Security terminated the Central American Minors programme. The programme had allowed those under 21 years of age fleeing violence in El Salvador, Guatemala and Honduras, whose parents had regular status in the USA, to apply for refugee resettlement interviews before travelling to the USA. Children from those three countries who did not qualify for refugee status and had no other means of reuniting with their parents had also been able to apply for entry under the programme.

On 5 September, the government announced that it would end the Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals (DACA) programme in six months if Congress did not find a legislative solution regarding the immigration status of those protected by the programme, placing more than 800,000 individuals at risk of deportation. DACA’s aim was to protect from deportation migrant youth who came to the USA as children and met certain eligibility criteria. Congress introduced the DREAM Act to provide DACA beneficiaries with a means to obtain regular migration status; it had not been passed into law at the end of the year.

More than 17,000 unaccompanied children and 26,000 people travelling as families were apprehended after irregularly crossing the border with Mexico between January and August. Families were detained for months, many without proper access to medical care and legal counsel, while pursuing claims to remain in the USA.
Women’s rights

Attacks on the rights of women and girls were broad and multi-faceted. President Trump’s administration overturned policies that required universities to investigate sexual violence as gender discrimination and suspended equal pay initiatives that had helped women to identify whether they were being paid less than male colleagues. Attacks on women’s reproductive health and rights were particularly virulent. There were repeated efforts by the government and Congress to withdraw funding from Planned Parenthood − a health organization providing vital reproductive and other health services, particularly to women on low incomes. The government issued rules exempting employers from providing health insurance coverage for contraception if it conflicted with their religious or moral beliefs, putting millions of women at risk of losing access to contraception. Gross inequalities remained for Indigenous women in accessing care following rape, including access to examinations, forensic evidence kits for use by medical staff, and other essential health care services. The government also introduced the so-called “global gag rule”, prohibiting any US financial assistance to any hospitals or organizations that provide information about, or access to, safe and legal abortion care.
Rights of lesbian, gay, bisexual, transgender and intersex people

Murders of LGBTI people increased during the year, against a background of continuing discrimination against LGBTI people in state and federal law. Further discriminatory measures by the government against LGBTI people increased. The USA continued to lack federal protections banning discrimination on the grounds of sexual orientation and gender identity in the workplace, housing or health care. Transgender people continued to be particularly marginalized. President Trump’s administration overturned guidelines that protected transgender students in public schools who used facilities that corresponded with their gender identity. In August, President Trump ordered a reversal in the policy announced in 2016 to allow openly transgender individuals to enlist in the military, which had been due to take effect on 1 January 2018. On 30 October, a federal judge issued a preliminary injunction blocking implementation of the directive. In December, a judge ruled that transgender people would be allowed to enlist in the military from 1 January 2018, as legal cases proceeded.
Counter-terror and security

On 28 November, a federal jury in Washington DC convicted Libyan national Ahmed Abu Khatallah on terrorism charges relating to an attack on a US diplomatic compound in Benghazi, Libya, in 2012 in which four US nationals were killed. The jury acquitted him of murder. In August, the judge had ruled that any statements made by Ahmed Abu Khatallah while held incommunicado for nearly two weeks on board a US naval vessel after being seized by US forces in Libya could be admitted as evidence. On 29 October, US forces seized another Libyan national, Mustafa al-Imam, in Libya. He was flown to the USA and appeared in federal court on 3 November after five days’ incommunicado detention. At the end of the year he was facing trial for terrorism offences in relation to the Benghazi attack.

After an attack in New York on 31 October in which eight people died and 12 were injured, Uzbek national Sayfullo Habibullaevic Saipov was charged and due to be tried in federal court, despite calls from two senior Senators for his transfer to military custody as an “enemy combatant” and comments from President Trump that he would consider sending him to Guantánamo Bay. President Trump flouted the presumption of innocence in a series of posts on Twitter in which he called for the death penalty for Sayfullo Saipov.

In January, under the administration of President Barack Obama, 18 detainees were transferred from Guantánamo Bay detention centre to Oman, Saudi Arabia and United Arab Emirates. Most of the remaining 41 Guantánamo Bay detainees were held without charge or trial. President Trump had made a pre-election pledge to keep the detention facility open and increase the numbers of detainees held there; no further detainee transfers were made into or out of Guantánamo Bay during the year.

Refusal in October by the Supreme Court to consider two jurisdictional challenges allowed military commission proceedings to continue at Guantánamo Bay, in contravention of international fair trial standards.

In October, Ahmed Mohammed Ahmed Haza al-Darbi, a Saudi Arabian national, was sentenced by military commission to 13 years’ imprisonment after pleading guilty in 2014 to conspiracy, terrorism and other offences. He had been arrested in Azerbaijan in June 2002 and handed over to US agents two months later.
Torture and other ill-treatment

In an interview on 25 January, President Trump expressed his support for torture while stating that he would “rely” upon the Secretary of Defense, the CIA Director and others in deciding whether the USA should use it. No action was taken to end impunity for the systematic human rights violations, including torture and enforced disappearance, committed in a secret detention programme operated by the CIA after the attacks on 11 September 2001.

At least three people alleged to have been involved in the secret detention programme were nominated by President Trump for senior government roles: Gina Haspel, selected in February for the role of Deputy Director of the CIA; Steven Bradbury, nominated for General Counsel at the Department of Transportation; and Steven Engel, nominated to head the Office of Legal Counsel (OLC) at the Department of Justice. Gina Haspel was believed to have been CIA Chief of Staff in Thailand in 2002 when the CIA ran a so-called “black site” in which at least two detainees were subjected to torture and enforced disappearance. She was later Chief of Staff to the Director of the Counterterrorism Center, the branch of the CIA that ran the secret detention programme. As Acting Assistant Attorney General at the OLC between 2005 and 2009, Steven Bradbury authored a number of memorandums to the CIA giving legal approval to methods of interrogation and conditions of detention that violated the international prohibition of torture and other ill-treatment. As Deputy Assistant Attorney General at the OLC in 2007, Steven Engel was also involved in the writing of one of those memorandums. On 7 November, the Senate confirmed his appointment by 51 votes to 47. On 14 November, by 50 votes to 47, the Senate confirmed the appointment of Steven Bradbury. Gina Haspel’s appointment did not require Senate confirmation.

A civil jury trial of James Mitchell and John “Bruce” Jessen, two CIA-contracted psychologists who had leading involvement in its detention programme, was due to begin on 5 September. However, in August an out-of-court settlement was reached.

On 19 June, the Supreme Court ruled in a case brought against former US officials by individuals of Arab or South Asian descent who were among the hundreds of foreign nationals taken into custody in the USA in the wake of the attacks of 11 September 2001. Following the attacks, detainees were held for months in harsh conditions and reported a range of abuses. The Supreme Court stated that if the allegations were true, then what happened to the detainees “was tragic”, and “nothing in this opinion should be read to condone the treatment to which they contend they were subjected”. However, it ruled that the case largely could not proceed, thus continuing a pattern of judicial remedies being blocked in cases involving human rights violations in the counter-terrorism context since the 2001 attacks.
Excessive use of force

The authorities continued to fail to track the exact number of people killed by law enforcement officials across the USA. Data collected by The Washington Post newspaper put the total at 987 individuals killed during the year by law enforcement agents using firearms. According to the data, African Americans – who comprised 13% of the population – represented nearly 23% of the victims in 2017. Of those killed, 24% were known to have mental health problems. A proposal by the Department of Justice to create a system to track these deaths under the Deaths in Custody Reporting Act was not compulsory for law enforcement agencies and therefore risked leading to under-reporting. No information was released on whether the reporting process had been initiated during the year.

At least 40 people across 25 states died after police used projectile electro-shock weapons on them, bringing the total number of such deaths since 2001 to at least 802. Most of the victims were not armed and did not appear to pose a threat of death or serious injury when the electro-shock weapon was deployed.

In September, the acquittal of a former police officer for shooting dead Anthony Lamar Smith in 2011 sparked weeks of protests across the city of St Louis, Missouri, and hundreds of arrests. There were allegations by local civil rights organizations that police unlawfully detained people and that their use of chemical irritants against protesters amounted to excessive use of force. St Louis police used heavy-duty riot gear and military-grade weapons and equipment to police the demonstrations. In August, President Trump annulled restrictions put in place by the previous government that limited the transfer of some military-grade equipment to law enforcement agencies.
Gun violence

In October a gunman used “bump stocks” – accessories that modify firearms to allow rapid firing similar to that of fully automatic firearms – against a crowd of concert-goers in Las Vegas, Nevada, killing 58 people. In response to the massacre, Congress considered legislation and regulations banning such devices, but the measures were not enacted. In November, Congress introduced but failed to pass a separate piece of legislation aimed at preventing gun violence.

Two pieces of federal legislation were pending at the end of the year that would make it easier for people to obtain firearm silencers and carry concealed weapons. Legislation in place since 1996 continued to deny funding to the Center for Disease Control and Prevention to conduct or sponsor research into the causes of gun violence and ways to prevent it.

President Trump’s administration considered relaxing restrictions on the export of small arms, including assault rifles and ammunition, by shifting the responsibility for processing international non-military firearms sales from the Department of State to the Department of Commerce. The move would severely weaken oversight of arms sales and risked increasing the flow of firearms to countries suffering high levels of armed violence.
Death penalty

Twenty-three men were executed in eight states, bringing to 1,465 the total number of executions since the US Supreme Court approved new capital laws in 1976. Approximately 39 new death sentences were passed. Around 2,800 people remained on death row at the end of the year.

Arkansas conducted its first executions since 2005. Ohio resumed executions after a hiatus of more than three years. Florida conducted its first executions since January 2016, when the US Supreme Court ruled its capital sentencing statute unconstitutional. The Florida Supreme Court’s decision that the ruling applied only retroactively to about half of those on death row allowed the state to begin executing those deemed not to benefit. During the year, the first death sentences were handed down under a new sentencing statute.

During the year, four inmates were exonerated of the crimes for which they were originally sentenced to death in the states of Delaware, Florida, Arkansas and Louisiana, bringing to 160 the number of such cases since 1973.
https://www.amnesty.org/en/countries/americas/united-states-of-america/report-united-states-of-america/

Ender
06-23-2019, 08:05 PM
That coup happened before a majority of that country was born. Plus how do you know they don't enrich the uranium into weapons grade Uranium if they can move it out somewhere else every time they want to inspect before the 24 hour waiting period? Are you really telling me that its impossible for them to take the uranium somewhere else and enrich it to weapons grade there?

Sounds like the Iraq WMDs carp.

And the Iranians have been under the jackboot supervision of the US for at least 70 years.

Origanalist
06-23-2019, 08:21 PM
I would rather live here than over there.

Percentage of population in prison;

US- 655 per 100,000

Iran- 284 per 100,000

Origanalist
06-23-2019, 08:22 PM
I would rather live here than over there.

When are going going to start sanctioning Saudi Arabia?

UWDude
06-23-2019, 08:39 PM
LoL TDS sufferers mad Trump didn't start war, hide it in their mealy mouthed work arounds.

Trump is the first president I ever heard mention the dead people his strikes would cause, as reason to reconsider.

Every other president talks about American lives and treasure lost, at best.

But not good enough for TDS crowd. They ignore he said Iranian lives matter, and just putz about with their confused and ass-backwards talking points.


Having said that, at what point do we just assume now that Trump's various threats to do things shoudn't ever be taken seriously and everything out of the WH is complete fake news? It's been a pattern throughout his term but it's looking like SOP now.

Lots of us who do not suffer from TDS have been assuming that for a long time. In fact, many of us have been talking about the madman theory.

It is sad, because he can only pull that rabbit from his hat so many times, before nations wise up and figure he probably will not pull the trigger... ...at least until 2020.

Zippyjuan
06-23-2019, 08:47 PM
LoL TDS sufferers mad Trump didn't start war, hide it in their mealy mouthed work arounds.

Trump is the first president I ever heard mention the dead people his strikes would cause, as reason to reconsider.

Every other president talks about American lives and treasure lost, at best.

But not good enough for TDS crowd. They ignore he said Iranian lives matter, and just putz about with their confused and ass-backwards talking points.



Lots of us who do not suffer from TDS have been assuming that for a long time. In fact, many of us have been talking about the madman theory.

It is sad, because he can only pull that rabbit from his hat so many times, before nations wise up and figure he probably will not pull the trigger... ...at least until 2020.

Why did he wait until literally the last moment to ask about that if he was really concerned about collateral damage?

He doesn't want people to know how many people his drone strikes are killing. He revoked the rule Obama put in place to release such information and turned most of the drone operations over to the CIA to maintain secrecy and greatly increased their use.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-47480207


Trump revokes Obama rule on reporting drone strike deaths

President Donald Trump has revoked a policy set by his predecessor requiring US intelligence officials to publish the number of civilians killed in drone strikes outside of war zones.

The 2016 executive order was brought in by then-President Barack Obama, who was under pressure to be more transparent.

Since the 9/11 terror attack, drone strikes have been increasingly used against terror and military targets.

The Trump administration said the rule was "superfluous" and distracting.

The order applied to the CIA, which has carried out drone strikes in countries such as Afghanistan, Pakistan, and Somalia.

"This action eliminates superfluous reporting requirements, requirements that do not improve government transparency, but rather distract our intelligence professionals from their primary mission," an official said.

What was the rule?

It required the head of the CIA to release annual summaries of US drone strikes and assess how many died as a result.

Mr Trump's executive order does not overturn reporting requirements on civilian deaths set for the military by Congress.

There have been 2,243 drone strikes in the first two years of the Trump presidency, compared with 1,878 in Mr Obama's eight years in office, according to the Bureau of Investigative Journalism, a UK-based think tank.

Human-rights activists complained about the drone programme under the Obama administration, saying the operations were overly secretive and hid the fact that civilians were sometimes killed in the strikes.

President Obama responded by saying that strikes were carried out in a precise manner - and that intelligence officials would release data on civilians who were accidentally killed in the strikes that occurred outside of war zones. President Trump has built on the existing programme and made it even more ambitious.

During Mr Obama's eight years in office, 1,878 drone strikes were carried out, according to researchers. Since Mr Trump was elected in 2016, there have been 2,243 drone strikes. The Republican president has also made some of the operations, the ones outside of war zones, more secretive. As a result, things have different today: under Mr Trump, there are more drone strikes - and less transparency.

Lawmakers and rights groups have criticised Mr Trump's decision, saying it could allow the CIA to conduct drone strikes without accountability.



More at link.

phill4paul
06-23-2019, 08:49 PM
Why did he wait until literally the last moment to ask about that if he was really concerned about collateral damage?

He doesn't want people to know how many people his drone strikes are killing. He revoked that rule and turned most of the drone operations over to the CIA to maintain secrecy.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-47480207



More at link.

WWHD?

Swordsmyth
06-23-2019, 08:50 PM
Why did he wait until literally the last moment to ask about that if he was really concerned about collateral damage?


Because he was trolling the warmongers.

He had already planned to stop it after asking.

UWDude
06-23-2019, 08:52 PM
More at link.


http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?535299-UK-Special-Election-(June-6th)&p=6817185&viewfull=1#post6817185

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?535299-UK-Special-Election-(June-6th)&p=6817575&viewfull=1#post6817575

Zippyjuan
06-23-2019, 08:52 PM
Because he was trolling the warmongers.

He had already planned to stop it after asking.

I guess that is why he has had 50% more drone attacks in just two years than Obama had in eight- to troll the warmongers.

kcchiefs6465
06-23-2019, 08:58 PM
Percentage of population in prison;

US- 655 per 100,000

Iran- 284 per 100,000
That's Iranian propaganda.

Swordsmyth
06-23-2019, 09:00 PM
I guess that is why he has had 50% more drone attacks in just two years than Obama had in eight- to troll the warmongers.
That's not what you asked about, it's separate and it's nothing like what would happen if he started a war with Iran.

Origanalist
06-23-2019, 09:08 PM
That's Iranian propaganda.

https://i.ytimg.com/vi/4jXtipMef6M/maxresdefault.jpg

specsaregood
06-23-2019, 09:32 PM
https://thefederalist.com/2017/10/17/dont-actually-know-whether-iran-complying-nuclear-deal/

ETA: The correct link.

informative link, thanks

nikcers
06-23-2019, 09:36 PM
Percentage of population in prison;

US- 655 per 100,000

Iran- 284 per 100,000

we put people in prison for our war on drugs, they stone them to death. They stone them to death for being the wrong religion. They do it in public because it makes an example out of them and makes for good propaghanda.

Origanalist
06-23-2019, 09:41 PM
we put people in prison for our war on drugs, they stone them to death. They stone them to death for being the wrong religion. They do it in public because it makes an example out of them and makes for good propaghanda.

Our buddies the Saudi's are much more civilized.

UWDude
06-23-2019, 09:48 PM
we put people in prison for our war on drugs, they stone them to death. They stone them to death for being the wrong religion. They do it in public because it makes an example out of them and makes for good propaghanda.

The freedom of people in Iran has no moral relativism to the People living in the United States.

The young people want free of Islamic Thoecratic oppression, in an age of such enlightenment.

However, America's constant threatening of them keeps the Mullahs in power, because most Iranians feel foreign policy is the most important issue. And that is because they truly are under threat from the United States.

A lot of the youth are secretly joyful about it, because they believe American interference or war will actually bring freedom, and in many ways, it would. It would also bring a ton of death, and misery, and wishing you didn't have freedom, because you literally are starving, (not starving like "OMG American children are starving!" but starving like faint in the head, belly gas bloated starving.

And once everything settled, everybody would be poor and hungry (but not starving) in Iran, their resources and wealth being funneled to America for the good of Israel and Britain and America.

Also keep in mind the horror of Iranians observing American culture. American culture is quite degenerate and ignorant. Freedom means there will be all sort of degeneracy and ignorance.

nikcers
06-23-2019, 10:15 PM
Our buddies the Saudi's are much more civilized.

WOW you moved the goalpost, first you compared Iran to America, we don't stone people to death for not following the state religion or put them in jail for 10-15 years. We don't have forced marriages for 13 year old girls and younger if they can get a court order. We don't kill people for non violent drug offenses and gay stuff.

nikcers
06-23-2019, 10:31 PM
When are going going to start sanctioning Saudi Arabia?

The idea was to stop selling them weapons which would be more effective than sanctions because they are dependent on US and British weapons and inteligence.

Origanalist
06-24-2019, 04:05 AM
WOW you moved the goalpost, first you compared Iran to America, we don't stone people to death for not following the state religion or put them in jail for 10-15 years. We don't have forced marriages for 13 year old girls and younger if they can get a court order. We don't kill people for non violent drug offenses and gay stuff.

I didn't move any goalposts. I simply put the assessment of the US up against the assessment of Iran from the same people you used in your post about Iran. None of those words are mine.

goldenequity
06-24-2019, 04:09 AM
1142757336873865216
https://twitter.com/JZarif/status/1142757336873865216

Read it again.^^^

Al-Masdar News
TheArabSource
Iran reveals another US spy drone flight: photos
https://www.almasdarnews.com/article/iran-reveals-another-us-spy-drone-flight-photos/


Guy Elster
BREAKING US cyber attacks on Iranian targets not successful, Iran minister says

Origanalist
06-24-2019, 04:34 AM
The idea was to stop selling them weapons which would be more effective than sanctions because they are dependent on US and British weapons and inteligence.

Who's idea was that?

nikcers
06-24-2019, 08:51 AM
Who's idea was that?

Rand has been one of the people pushing for it in the Senate, even Lindsey Graham voted for stopping the arms sales. This has been an ongonig effort for Rand but ever since that guy was hacked up with a bonesaw it became a lot more popular.

Swordsmyth
06-24-2019, 07:28 PM
In a stunningly frank moment during a Sunday Meet the Press interview (https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/meet-the-press/president-trump-s-full-unedited-interview-meet-press-n1020731) focused on President Trump's decision-making on Iran, especially last week's "brink of war" moment which saw Trump draw down readied military forces in what he said was a "common sense" move, the commander in chief threw his own national security advisor under the bus in spectacular fashion.

Though it's not Trump's first tongue-in-cheek denigration of Bolton's notorious hawkishness, it's certainly the most brutal and blunt take down yet, and frankly just plain enjoyable to watch. When host Chuck Todd asked the president if he was “being pushed into military action against Iran” by his advisers in what was clearly a question focused on Bolton first and foremost, Trump responded:

“John Bolton is absolutely a hawk. If it was up to him he'd take on the whole world at one time, okay?”

WATCH: President Trump tells Chuck Todd that he has doves and hawks in his cabinet. #MTP (https://twitter.com/hashtag/MTP?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) #IfItsSunday (https://twitter.com/hashtag/IfItsSunday?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw)

Trump: “I have some hawks. John Bolton is absolutely a hawk. If it was up to him he'd take on the whole world at one time.“ pic.twitter.com/JKVB2IvMVU (https://t.co/JKVB2IvMVU)
— Meet the Press (@MeetThePress) June 23, 2019 (https://twitter.com/MeetThePress/status/1142782018620678144?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw)

Trump began by explaining, “I have two groups of people. I have doves and I have hawks,” before leading into this sure to be classic line that is one for the history books:“If it was up to him he'd take on the whole world at one time, okay?”
During this section of comments focused on US policy in the Middle East, the president reiterated his preference that he hear from "both sides" on an issue, but that he was ultimately the one making the decisions.
When pressed on the dangers of having such an uber-hawk neo-conservative who remains an unapologetic cheerleader of the 2003 Iraq War, and who laid the ground work for it as a member of Bush's National Security Council, Trump followed with, “That doesn't matter because I want both sides.”

https://zh-prod-1cc738ca-7d3b-4a72-b792-20bd8d8fa069.storage.googleapis.com/s3fs-public/inline-images/bolton%20hawk.jpg

And in another clear indicator that Trump wants to stay true to his non-interventionist instincts voiced on the 2016 campaign trail, he explained to Todd that:


I was against going into Iraq... I was against going into the Middle East. Chuck we've spent 7 trillion dollars in the Middle East right now.
It was the second time this weekend that Trump was forced to defend his choice of Bolton as the nation's most influential foreign policy thinker and adviser. When peppered with questions at the White House Saturday following Thursday night's dramatic "almost war" with Iran, Trump said that he "disagrees" with Bolton "very much" but that ultimately he's "doing a very good job".

More at: https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2019-06-23/trump-unleashes-uber-hawk-bolton-he-would-take-whole-world-one-time

Swordsmyth
06-24-2019, 08:32 PM
https://assets.infowars.com/2019/06/war-avoidance12-768x629.jpg

devil21
06-24-2019, 09:57 PM
Who are these doves he speaks of, exactly? I want names. The "in his cabinet" part is not what he said.

goldenequity
06-25-2019, 08:13 AM
back to reality....

Guy Elster guyelster
BREAKING Iran says US sanctions on its Supreme Leader means permanent closure of the diplomacy path

1143455065212145664
https://twitter.com/guyelster/status/1143455065212145664
https://abs.twimg.com/emoji/v2/72x72/1f923.png



UNSC met on Iran/Gulf yesterday

https://youtu.be/t4J5Ua5tRek

only need to watch @ 2:02:30...
completely arrogant hawk spook propaganda wiz doesn't even identify himself in front of world media...
proceeds to make broad leaps between minimum evidence to accuse Iran 'because we say so' and 'we all agree it's obvious'.
GFY.

nikcers
06-25-2019, 08:21 AM
back to reality....

Guy Elster guyelster
BREAKING Iran says US sanctions on its Supreme Leader means permanent closure of the diplomacy path

1143455065212145664
https://twitter.com/guyelster/status/1143455065212145664
https://abs.twimg.com/emoji/v2/72x72/1f923.png



UNSC met on Iran/Gulf yesterday

https://youtu.be/t4J5Ua5tRek

only need to watch @ 2:02:30...
completely arrogant hawk spook propaganda wiz doesn't even identify himself in front of world media...
proceeds to make broad leaps between minimum evidence to accuse Iran 'because we say so' and 'we all agree it's obvious'.
GFY.

Yeah because the reasonable party is always the one saying that diplomacy is not an option.

goldenequity
06-25-2019, 09:29 AM
Yeah because the reasonable party is always the one saying that diplomacy is not an option.

ah... now I get it...
so the 'reasonable one' is the one who holds a gun to your head. Got it.

nikcers
06-25-2019, 09:35 AM
ah... now I get it...
so the 'reasonable one' is the one who holds a gun to your head. Got it.

Yeah because the Iran doesn't have any guns pointed at anyones heads.

Cap
06-25-2019, 09:51 AM
Yeah because the Iran doesn't have any guns pointed at anyones heads.It's hard to not respond emotionally to such an idiot as yourself.

goldenequity
06-25-2019, 09:57 AM
this was a very diplomatic event. See how happy they are?

1143476821524209665
https://twitter.com/AmbJohnBolton/status/1143476821524209665







Guy Elster‏@guyelster · 10 min.
BREAKING Trump warns Iran with obliteration if it attacks US interests.
:upsidedown:

goldenequity
06-25-2019, 10:25 AM
Unlike MH-17.... be sure: they can prove it.
(the US spook at UNSC above is trying to weasel 'where' the 'line' is drawn. Reminds me of the contortions my grand kids go through when they are caught red handed.)


1143497373718630400
https://twitter.com/ejmalrai/status/1143497373718630400

goldenequity
06-25-2019, 10:40 AM
FYI...
this shows what the spook is trying to argue.
Just LOOK at it.
How STUPID and GULLIBLE does he think we are??

http://johnhelmer.net/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/4-12.png

KEY: blue line=drone flight path; yellow line=Iranian Flight Information Region (FIR); red line=Iranian territorial waters; green line=Iranian internal waters; yellow dots=Iran radio warnings sent; red square=point of impact. Source: Iranian Foreign Minister Javad Zarif: https://twitter.com/ The US claims the point of impact was outside the red line.

Does it seem (to you) at ALL REASONABLE that Iran would walk out in front of the world and try to ARGUE they can shoot down 'anything up to the yellow line'???
Well.
Does it???
That's what he's ACCUSING!!!!

Zariff ALREADY showed the EXACT point of missile impact WELL within the RED line (territorial waters).

Fuuck that spook. spit.

goldenequity
06-25-2019, 10:56 AM
some reading 4 U


The Russian General Staff has reinforced the air defences for Russians at the Iranian nuclear reactor complex at Bushehr, on the Persian Gulf, according to sources in Moscow. At the same time, Iran has allowed filming of the movement of several of its mobile S-300 air-defence missile batteries to the south, covering the Iranian coastline of the Persian Gulf and the Gulf of Oman. More secretly, elements of Russian military intelligence, electronic warfare, and command and control advisers for Iran’s air defence systems have been mobilized to support Iran against US and allied attacks.

The range of the new surveillance extends well beyond the S-300 strike distance of 200 kilometres, and covers US drone and aircraft bases on the Arabian peninsula, as well as US warships in (and under) the Persian Gulf and off the Gulf of Oman. Early warning of US air and naval-launched attacks has now been cut below the old 4 to 6-minute Iranian threshold. Counter-firing by the Iranian armed forces has been automated from attack warning and target location.

This means that if the US is detected launching a swarm of missiles aimed at Iran’s air-defence sites, uranium mines, reactors, and military operations bunkers, Iran will launch its own swarm of missiles at the US firing platforms, as well as at Saudi and other oil production sites, refineries, and pipelines, as well tankers in ports and under way in the Gulf.

“The armed forces of Iran,” said a Russian military source requesting anonymity, “have air defence systems capable of hitting air targets at those heights at which drones of the Global Hawk series can fly; this is about 19,000 to 20,000 metres. Iran’s means of air defence are both foreign-purchased systems and systems of Iran’s own design; among them, in particular, the old Soviet system S-75 and the new Russian S-300. Recently, Iran transported some S-300’s to the south, but that happened after the drone was shot down [June 20]. Russian specialists are working at Bushehr now and this means that the S-300’s are also for protection of Bushehr.”

http://johnhelmer.net/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/2-19.png




►MORE (http://johnhelmer.net/against-the-blitz-wolf-russian-reinforcements-for-irans-defence-in-war-against-all/)

nikcers
06-25-2019, 11:01 AM
It's hard to not respond emotionally to such an idiot as yourself.

The only victim here is the people who have to pay for these wars, the military industrial complex is not limited to one country.

goldenequity
06-25-2019, 11:26 AM
some reading 4 U


The Russian General Staff has reinforced the air defences for Russians at the Iranian nuclear reactor complex at Bushehr, on the Persian Gulf, according to sources in Moscow. At the same time, Iran has allowed filming of the movement of several of its mobile S-300 air-defence missile batteries to the south, covering the Iranian coastline of the Persian Gulf and the Gulf of Oman. More secretly, elements of Russian military intelligence, electronic warfare, and command and control advisers for Iran’s air defence systems have been mobilized to support Iran against US and allied attacks.

The range of the new surveillance extends well beyond the S-300 strike distance of 200 kilometres, and covers US drone and aircraft bases on the Arabian peninsula, as well as US warships in (and under) the Persian Gulf and off the Gulf of Oman. Early warning of US air and naval-launched attacks has now been cut below the old 4 to 6-minute Iranian threshold. Counter-firing by the Iranian armed forces has been automated from attack warning and target location.

This means that if the US is detected launching a swarm of missiles aimed at Iran’s air-defence sites, uranium mines, reactors, and military operations bunkers, Iran will launch its own swarm of missiles at the US firing platforms, as well as at Saudi and other oil production sites, refineries, and pipelines, as well tankers in ports and under way in the Gulf.

“The armed forces of Iran,” said a Russian military source requesting anonymity, “have air defence systems capable of hitting air targets at those heights at which drones of the Global Hawk series can fly; this is about 19,000 to 20,000 metres. Iran’s means of air defence are both foreign-purchased systems and systems of Iran’s own design; among them, in particular, the old Soviet system S-75 and the new Russian S-300. Recently, Iran transported some S-300’s to the south, but that happened after the drone was shot down [June 20]. Russian specialists are working at Bushehr now and this means that the S-300’s are also for protection of Bushehr.”

http://johnhelmer.net/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/2-19.png




►MORE (http://johnhelmer.net/against-the-blitz-wolf-russian-reinforcements-for-irans-defence-in-war-against-all/)

While Gavrilov believes the Iranian military have already achieved high enough density of fire against incoming weapons,
he isn’t sure the range and altitude of Iranian radars will be good enough to match the attack risks.
To neutralize those, he recommends “Russian-made electronic warfare systems.
The complex of EW systems is able to significantly reduce the ability of attack aircraft to search for, detect and defeat ground targets; disrupt the onboard equipment of cruise missiles in the GPS satellite navigation system; distort the readings of radio altimeters of attack aircraft, cruise missiles and UAV’s …”

In briefings for sympathetic western reporters, [U]Iranian commanders are emphasizing the Armageddon option; that is, however weak or strong their defences may prove to be under prolonged US attack, the Iranian strategy is not to wait. Their plan, they say, is to counter-attack against Arab as well as American targets as soon as a US missile attack commences; that’s to say, at launch, not inflight nor at impact.

Ender
06-25-2019, 12:23 PM
The only victim here is the people who have to pay for these wars, the military industrial complex is not limited to one country.

GOOD GRIEF- READ A LITTLE HISTORY ON WHAT THE US HAS DONE TO IRAN!

Iran has not started a war in 100+ years but it has every right to defend itself- especially after the US has staged coups, surrounded it with bases, & has taken its resources for years- helped Saddam in his invasion, and then calls Iran the biggest terrorists in the ME, leaves the Iranian Deal, while it was completely compliant with the Nuke deal & the Iranian deal, and sanctions the Iranians because they're baaaaaad.

Swordsmyth
06-25-2019, 02:09 PM
GOOD GRIEF- READ A LITTLE HISTORY ON WHAT THE US HAS DONE TO IRAN!

Iran has not started a war in 100+ years but it has every right to defend itself- especially after the US has staged coups, surrounded it with bases, & has taken its resources for years- helped Saddam in his invasion, and then calls Iran the biggest terrorists in the ME, leaves the Iranian Deal, while it was completely compliant with the Nuke deal & the Iranian deal, and sanctions the Iranians because they're baaaaaad.
Iran is geopolitical controlled opposition, the CIA helped overthrow the Shah and install the current regime.

Swordsmyth
06-25-2019, 02:10 PM
ah... now I get it...
so the 'reasonable one' is the one who holds a gun to your head. Got it.
Maybe neither party is reasonable.

nikcers
06-25-2019, 02:18 PM
GOOD GRIEF- READ A LITTLE HISTORY ON WHAT THE US HAS DONE TO IRAN!

Iran has not started a war in 100+ years but it has every right to defend itself- especially after the US has staged coups, surrounded it with bases, & has taken its resources for years- helped Saddam in his invasion, and then calls Iran the biggest terrorists in the ME, leaves the Iranian Deal, while it was completely compliant with the Nuke deal & the Iranian deal, and sanctions the Iranians because they're baaaaaad.

So we deserve it if they attack us than? We should just let them develop nuclear weapons and arm terrorists in the middle east because America is bad? It wouldn't be a big deal if Iran armed terrorists with crude nuclear weapons because America is bad?

goldenequity
06-25-2019, 02:24 PM
GOOD GRIEF- READ A LITTLE HISTORY ON WHAT THE US HAS DONE TO IRAN!

Iran has not started a war in 100+ years but it has every right to defend itself- especially after the US has staged coups, surrounded it with bases, & has taken its resources for years- helped Saddam in his invasion, and then calls Iran the biggest terrorists in the ME, leaves the Iranian Deal, while it was completely compliant with the Nuke deal & the Iranian deal, and sanctions the Iranians because they're baaaaaad.

yer forgetting a 'special little something'....

Exclusive: CIA Files Prove America Helped Saddam as He Gassed Iran
foreignpolicy.com/2013/08/26/exclusive-cia-files-prove-america-helped-saddam-as-he-gassed-iran/] https://foreignpolicy.com/2013/08/26/exclusive-cia-files-prove-america-helped-saddam-as-he-gassed-iran/

1988: Thousands die in Halabja gas attack - BBC
[Search domain news.bbc.co.uk/onthisday/hi/dates/stories/march/16/newsid_4304000/4304853.stm] news.bbc.co.uk/onthisday/hi/dates/stories/march/16/newsid_4304000/4304853.stm
16 March. According to experts, the chemicals dropped by the planes may have included mustard gas, the nerve agents sarin, tabun and VX and possibly cyanide. The attack on Halabja, which is about 150 miles (241km) north-east of the Iraqi capital Baghdad, is the latest in the Iran-Iraq war and follows its occupation by Iranian forces.

Iran Still Haunted By Chemical Weapons Attacks | TIME.com
[Search domain world.time.com/2014/01/20/iran-still-haunted-and-influenced-by-chemical-weapons-attacks/] world.time.com/2014/01/20/iran-still-haunted-and-influenced-by-chemical-weapons-attacks/
Iranian doctors say the final toll of Iraq's chemical weapons could ultimately rival the 90,000 who died from toxic gases in World War I. In the meantime, Iran has struggled to tend to victims.




we did MORE than 'look the other way'. There's documented evidence of SUPPLY AND ENABLEMENT.
Back then we all were like.... MY Country would NEVER do such a thing, bless yer heart.
Now we know better. ha.

Deliberations by Kerry & the Obama 'billions' to Iran wasn't JUST about a 'bribe' to curtail nuclear enrichment. Nope.
It was REPARATIONS for the above. Iran demanded it.
spit.

Swordsmyth
06-25-2019, 02:28 PM
yer forgetting a 'special little something'....

Exclusive: CIA Files Prove America Helped Saddam as He Gassed Iran
foreignpolicy.com/2013/08/26/exclusive-cia-files-prove-america-helped-saddam-as-he-gassed-iran/] https://foreignpolicy.com/2013/08/26/exclusive-cia-files-prove-america-helped-saddam-as-he-gassed-iran/

1988: Thousands die in Halabja gas attack - BBC
[Search domain news.bbc.co.uk/onthisday/hi/dates/stories/march/16/newsid_4304000/4304853.stm] news.bbc.co.uk/onthisday/hi/dates/stories/march/16/newsid_4304000/4304853.stm
16 March. According to experts, the chemicals dropped by the planes may have included mustard gas, the nerve agents sarin, tabun and VX and possibly cyanide. The attack on Halabja, which is about 150 miles (241km) north-east of the Iraqi capital Baghdad, is the latest in the Iran-Iraq war and follows its occupation by Iranian forces.

Iran Still Haunted By Chemical Weapons Attacks | TIME.com
[Search domain world.time.com/2014/01/20/iran-still-haunted-and-influenced-by-chemical-weapons-attacks/] world.time.com/2014/01/20/iran-still-haunted-and-influenced-by-chemical-weapons-attacks/
Iranian doctors say the final toll of Iraq's chemical weapons could ultimately rival the 90,000 who died from toxic gases in World War I. In the meantime, Iran has struggled to tend to victims.




we did MORE than 'look the other way'. There's documented evidence of SUPPLY AND ENABLEMENT.
Back then we all were like.... MY Country would NEVER do such a thing, bless yer heart.
Now we know better. ha.

Deliberations by Kerry & the Obama 'billions' to Iran wasn't JUST about a 'bribe' to curtail nuclear enrichment. Nope.
It was REPARATIONS for the above. Iran demanded it.
spit.
And you are forgetting that the empire put the current regime in power, Iran isn't a brave rebel against the evil empire, it is an official boogeyman.

goldenequity
06-25-2019, 03:13 PM
One is an historical fact. The other is your theory.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ccenFp_3kq8

Swordsmyth
06-25-2019, 03:23 PM
One is an historical fact. The other is your theory.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ccenFp_3kq8
It's not theory any more, it's historical fact:


Ayatollah Khomeini, an Instrument of the U.S.?


According to Masud Wadan in this timely analysis of Iran’s 1979 Revolution, the US and its European allies favored the creation of an Islamic State headed by Ayatollah Khomeini, Iran’s spiritual leader, with a view to undermining Iran’s leftist-progressive revolutionary movement.
According to Wadan: “The US with the support of France, Britain and Germany struck a deal regarding Khomeini at the Guadeloupe Conference [1979]. This three-day summit agreed upon the seating of Khomeini as the leader of Iran.”
Was this a US sponsored “regime change”?
Was Washington intent upon precluding the formation of a secular democratic government in Iran?
What are the implications regarding the evolution of US-Iran relations?



Ayatollah Khomeini, the former spiritual leader of Iran who founded the Revolutionary Regime, returned to Tehran from exile in France on 1 February 1979, two weeks after the former US-backed King Mohammad Reza Shah fled the country. According to local reports, the US with the support of France, Britain and Germany struck a deal regarding Khomeini at the Guadeloupe Conference. This three-day summit agreed upon the seating of Khomeini as the leader of Iran.
BBC’s findings quoted by the Guardian (https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/jun/10/ayatollah-khomeini-jimmy-carter-administration-iran-revolution) in June 2016 suggests that Carter administration paved the way for Khomeini to return to Iran and take the power from former King Reza Shah. Two former White House advisers to Jimmy Carter (https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/jimmy-carter), speaking to the Guardian, did not question the authenticity of the documents.
https://www.globalresearch.ca/wp-content/uploads/2018/01/Screen-Shot-2018-01-10-at-12.26.55.png (https://www.globalresearch.ca/wp-content/uploads/2018/01/Screen-Shot-2018-01-10-at-12.26.55.png)

Screenshot of Guardian article (https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/jun/10/ayatollah-khomeini-jimmy-carter-administration-iran-revolution)
As reported by the BBC, Ayatollah Khomeini, in January 1979, secretly sought Carter’s assistance in overcoming opposition from Iran’s military, still loyal to the Shah. Khomeini promised that if he could return to Iran from exile in France, which the United States could facilitate, he would prevent a civil war, and his regime would not be hostile to Washington.
https://www.globalresearch.ca/wp-content/uploads/2018/01/Screen-Shot-2018-01-10-at-13.26.37.png (https://www.globalresearch.ca/wp-content/uploads/2018/01/Screen-Shot-2018-01-10-at-13.26.37.png)


Scan of BBC Report, June 3, 2016 (http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-36431160)
Even though Reza Shah remained an ally of the US, the anti-Government uprisings and social mobilizations against the Shah incited the US to push Khomeini into power. Destitution, unemployment and despotism under the Shah’s regime caused a stir across the nation which took to streets en masse, demanding regime change. The revolts spearheaded by left wing and progressive movements awakened people throughout Iran with a view to toppling the Shah’s regime.
The US and its allies perceived their interests “in great danger” with the likely ascendance of leftists to power. And there wasn’t any suitable option other than substituting the Government of Shah Reza for a fundamentalist regime headed by Khomeini. The US’s intervention in Iran’s regime change in 1979 was bolstered by some reasons including barring leftists and revolutionaries from capturing power, viability of oil export, combating Soviet advancement and avoiding fragmentation of the Iranian Army.
The shift in power occurred with the Shah being compelled to step down. The West was cognizant that Khomeini as a charismatic religious leader could exploit the feelings of its citizens and turn the public mindset away from the revolutionary process.
Even today, the UDS-NATO warmongers have employed religion as the most sustainable and dominant instrument in arresting and orienting the minds of entire nations.
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/b5/Ruhollah_Khomeini_speaking_to_his_followers_agains t_capitulation_day_1964.jpgKhomeini’s speech against the Shah in Qom, 1964 (Source: Wikimedia Commons (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ruhollah_Khomeini#/media/File:Ruhollah_Khomeini_speaking_to_his_followers_a gainst_capitulation_day_1964.jpg))

After it held power, Ayatollah Khomeini delivered anti-Western words in demagoguery speeches to his nation. He didn’t spare any ferocious punishment and shortly ordered the round-up and execution of thousands of revolutionaries and opponents. The US and Khomeini colluded over keeping their relations in dark.
The 1980 a CIA study says that
“in November 1963 Ayatollah Khomeini sent a message to the US Government through [Tehran University professor] Haj Mirza Khalil Kamarei”, in which he explained “that he was not opposed to American interests in Iran” and that “on the contrary, he thought the American presence was necessary as a counterbalance to Soviet and possibly British influence”.

But Iranian leaders have vehemently denied that Khomeini ever sent such a message.
https://www.globalresearch.ca/wp-content/uploads/2018/01/Screen-Shot-2018-01-10-at-12.33.58.png (https://www.globalresearch.ca/wp-content/uploads/2018/01/Screen-Shot-2018-01-10-at-12.33.58.png)

Screenshot of secret document, June 2016 Guardian article (https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/jun/10/ayatollah-khomeini-jimmy-carter-administration-iran-revolution)
Khomeini’s representative on secret talks with the West, Ibrahim Yazdi wrote about the shadow contacts and discussions in his memoir on the threshold of transition of power from Shah to Khomeini. He noted about his first visit with the US State Department’s representative Warne Zimmerman in January 1979.
The captivity of the Tehran-based US embassy’s staff members was a ploy for Khomeini’s Islamic regime to solidify its apparent anti-Western posture in the eyes of Iranians. But years later, the first president of Khomeini’s regime Abu Al-Hassan Bani Sadr spilled the beans and disclosed that “hostage-taking was designed in the US and implemented in Iran”.
Flash Forward to 2018: Now think twice. If Iran were really a “nemesis” (longstanding rival) of the West as heralded by the media, then how is it that Tehran’s Islamic Regime could go so far to the brink of becoming a nuclear power under the watchful eyes of the US. It would have encountered the same fire and fury as North Korea. For the US, Iran has become an easy prey to predate just like Saddam’s Iraq and Gaddafi’s Libya in early decades.
Iran benefits from a free hand in Afghanistan to capitalize on its cultural, linguistic and intelligence influence which has seen no resistance by the US forces there. Afghanistan recently inked a landmark trilateral transit deal with India and Iran in an unexpectedly brief time that was totally unimaginable without US consent. Yet, a Russian or Chinese deal of this scale and kind with Afghanistan is intolerable for the US.

More at: https://www.globalresearch.ca/history-of-us-iran-relations-regime-change-and-the-islamic-state-in-1979-ayatollah-khomeini-an-instrument-of-u-s/5625574





http://www.ronpaulforums.com/images/misc/quote_icon.png Originally Posted by Swordsmyth http://www.ronpaulforums.com/images/buttons/viewpost-right.png (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?p=6572119#post6572119)
https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-...-iran-protests (https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-01-07/who-killed-iran-protests)

And then there was Bibi Netanyahu's surprising televised address to "the Iranian people" (https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-01-01/irans-iron-fist-unleashed-revolutionary-guards-take-over-security-israel-praises) on behalf of the state of Israel, wishing them "success in their noble quest for freedom" - something which we predicted would only have an adverse effect on the demonstrators' momentum, considering that authorities in Tehran accused protest leaders of serving the interests of and being in league with foreign "enemies" like Saudi Arabia and Israel nearly from day one.
The address was surprising precisely because it was the surest way to kill the protests as quickly as possible. From the moment Netanyahu publicly declared, "When this regime [the Iranian government] finally falls, and one day it will, Iranians and Israelis will be great friends once again" - all the air was sucked out of whatever momentum the protesters had.
For many average Iranians who had not yet joined anti-government demonstrations at that point, Bibi's speech gave them every incentive to stay home. All that the regime had to say at that point was, "see, you are in league with enemies of the nation!" And that is exactly what Tehran did. It was on the very Monday of Netanyahu's speech that Iran's elite Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps (IRGC) announced (https://twitter.com/farnazfassihi/status/947914035357417472) it would be taking charge of the security situation in Tehran, though likely they were mobilized earlier.




Mahmoud Ahmadinejad revealed to have Jewish past


A photograph of the Iranian president holding up his identity card during elections in March 2008 clearly shows his family has Jewish roots.

http://i.telegraph.co.uk/multimedia/archive/01494/ahm_1494743f.jpg Ahmadinejad showing papers during election. It shows that his family's previous name was Jewish





A close-up of the document reveals he was previously known as Sabourjian – a Jewish name meaning cloth weaver.

The short note scrawled on the card suggests his family changed its name to Ahmadinejad when they converted to embrace Islam after his birth.

The Sabourjians traditionally hail from Aradan, Mr Ahmadinejad's birthplace, and the name derives from "weaver of the Sabour", the name for the Jewish Tallit shawl in Persia. The name is even on the list of reserved names for Iranian Jews compiled by Iran's Ministry of the Interior.

More at: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/middleeast/iran/6256173/Mahmoud-Ahmadinejad-revealed-to-have-Jewish-past.html


A lot of players in the alternative media believe that Iran is a legitimate enemy of the City of London Jewish Power elite. We have all seen the memes which purport that Iran is one of the only countries without a Rothschild controlled central bank. This is nonsense because the Rothschilds are all over Iran with hundreds of Rothschild-controlled Swiss banks.


They also have a hand in the enormous Middle Eastern drug trade that is being run by the Iranian Revolutionary Guard and the CIA/Mossad in Afghanistan. People don't realize that the Shah cut down on the Middle Eastern drug trade. It blossomed once the Shah was overthrown in the Iranian Revolution. The same drug trafficking, money laundering Rothschild Banking Syndicate that rules the West rules Iran.


To understand the modern day Islamic Republic of Iran, we need to go back in time. A lot has been written about the 1953 CIA Coup, Operation Ajax which overthrew Iranian Prime Minister Mossadegh after he nationalized the Iranian oil industry. But little has been mentioned about the key role of the Ayatollahs in that coup. The Ayatollahs were on the CIA and MI6 payroll, and they were the ones who recruited the street thugs from the Iranian underworld who were instrumental in creating agitation against Mossadegh.


After the coup, these Ayatollahs became best buds with the Shah. The Shah sought to gain support from the Ayatollahs in the 1950s and gave them access to government radio stations so that they could preach to the masses. However, starting in the late 1950s, the Shah used his consolidation of power after the coup to pursue nationalist policies along the likes of Mossadegh.


His first bold move was signing an oil extraction agreement with Enrico Mattei, chairman of the Italian Petroleum Agency. Mattei is famed for establishing energy independence for Italy through its own oil fields, and for trying to break the City of London Seven Sisters Oil Cartels' control of the world oil market by signing generous oil extraction deals with third world countries.


At this time, many in the Shah's inner circle started to turn against him, and a military coup was thwarted by the Shah in 1958. General Mohammad-Vali Gharani had met with American diplomats in Athens shortly before the coup. One can guess who was behind it.


The Shah further made enemies by launching major reforms he called,"the White (Bloodless) Revolution" in 1963. The reforms included land redistribution, massive infrastructure expansion and industrial projects, the right of women to vote, religious freedom, and an expansion of health care and education programs. Wikipedia explains the Shah's attitude after these reforms the best,"In the 1960s and 70s the Shah sought to develop a more independent foreign policy and established working relationships with the Soviet Union and eastern European nations."
In subsequent decades, per capita income for Iranians skyrocketed, and oil revenue fueled an enormous increase in state funding for industrial development projects."


These are things that are certainly not in the City of London's interests. The Shah's reforms faced strong opposition from the Ayatollahs, led by Ayatollah Khomeini, the future Supreme Leader of Iran. These Ayatollahs favored keeping Iran under the centuries-old backward feudal system. They were angry that they were losing influence in the public realm. In response to the reforms, Khomeini launched protests against the Shah in June of 1963. These protests were crushed after a couple of days.


It has been rumored that those protests were financed by various intelligence services, whether it was the CIA, MI6, KGB, or a combination thereof. The KGB is a suspect based on Soviet counterintelligence defector Colonel Michael Goliniewski from Poland, who revealed that Khomeini was, "one of Moscow's five sources of intelligence at the heart of the Shiite hierarchy."


Furthermore, the Shah continued to move Iran on an independent course up until his overthrow. In 1973, the Shah finally achieved Mossadegh's goal of nationalizing the Iranian Oil Industry through the 1973 Oil Sale and Purchase Agreement. He also began to move closer to the Arab countries of the Middle East.


SHAH BECOMES AN ANTISEMITE


Some very little known facts about the Shah's change in foreign policy are found in the book, "Israel and the Shah" by Devon Bowers: "After the 1967 war, Iran became deeply wary of the Jewish state as while the Shah supported a strong Israel, he did not favor an Israel that was stronger than Iran. This worry was due to the fact that the Shah believed that the '67 war had changed Israel from a defensive state to an aggressive one and thus he was concerned about possible Israeli expansion." (AKA Greater Israel).


https://www.henrymakow.com/upload_images/fd52470d-0606-4a5d-a385-0b348c5b1a27-563x720.jpegThe Shah was merely defending his homeland. The Shah was doing a plethora of things which angered the Jewish Power elite during the 70s. After the Six Day war, Iran cancelled all joint-Israeli projects, refused to allow any Israeli government officials to his 1971 2500-year Persian Empire Anniversary Celebrations, provided the Arabs with oil and logistical support during the 1973 Yom Kippur War, and even sent a plane to transport a Saudi battalion to the Golan Heights during the war.


Furthermore, the Shah signed an agreement with Saddam Hussein to end Iranian/CIA support of Kurdish rebels in Iraq, and he froze all Israeli military cooperation and business with Iran in order to pressure Israel to return all conquered Egyptian land to Egypt, which eventually came to being during the Camp David Accords in 1978 (Bowers). Sunnis and Shias were finally coming together in peace as one large Muslim block against Israel. That is something that Israel was horrified about. That is why the Greater Israel plan was created.



It was at this point that the Jewish Power Elite decided to dump the Shah. Amnesty International issued a report on Savak's torture apparatus in 1976. This was heavily played up by the Washington Post and New York Times. The CIA also released their psychological profile on the Shah to the press, which accused the Shah of being,"a megalomaniac, who would pursue his own aims, in disregard of U.S. interests." To which the Shah exclaimed,"So you would like me to be your stooge?"



Something else has been missed by the alternative media for years. I came across this quote from the Wikipedia article about the history of Jews in Iran. It states,"Even though Mohammad Reza Pahlavi was sympathetic to the jews in the beginning, he displayed antisemitic tendencies towards the end of his reign.


Yousef Cohen, the last Jewish representative of Iranian Senate describes in his memoirs that Shah became suspicious of the Jewish community in his final years because most of the international criticism about lack of freedom in Iran and military style of government came from Jewish authors. Furthermore, the writer for the influential and highly publicized book, fall of 77 (probably crash of 79 by Paul Erdman mistakenly called 77 by Cohen), which predicted the fall of Shah a few years prior to his demise was Jewish. Shah, according to Cohen, displayed a remarkable intolerance and annoyance by the Jewish community in his last annual visit in March 1978 with the community leaders. Cohen describes that the Shah believed that there is an international Jewish Conspiracy against him to end his reign as king."

https://www.henrymakow.com/2018/06/iran-does-not-oppose.html


In late 1978, leaders of the Jewish community met with Ayatollah Khomeini in Paris and declared their support for the revolution. In 1977, the City of London started economic warfare against Iran through BP. BP was buying much less oil than agreed upon through the 1973 Oil Nationalization and Purchase Agreement. Subsequently, the Iranian Jewish Community started to withdraw investments from Iran. These combined events created an influx of dissatisfied poor urban workers ripe for revolution.


https://www.henrymakow.com/upload_images/hostage.jpgAnd who funded these protests? According to the book, "Hostage to Khomeini", by Robert Dreyfuss, most of the funds were coming from City of London/Mossad affiliated banks in the U.S. and Europe. ...Once the protests started, Khomeini suddenly became the mouthpiece of the Revolution with constant coverage by the news networks, especially the Voice of America, Voice of Israel, and BBC.


Meanwhile, the Carter administration made the decision to dump the Shah, and support Ayatollah Khomeini at the Guadeloupe Conference with the U.S, U.K, France, and West Germany. The U.S. then set up a correspondence with Khomeini and ordered the Iranian army to stand down to Khomeini when he arrived in Iran. Once he arrived, Khomeini's entourage gunned down nearly all of Iran's competent military officers and servicemen, along with the lower levels of Savak. ...


At the same time, Henry Kissinger and David Rockefeller heavily lobbied the Carter administration to admit the Shah for cancer treatment, despite warnings from the State Department that this would endanger U.S. Embassy workers in Iran. Two weeks later, those warnings came true when the Hostage Crisis began. The Reagan neocons ... cut a deal with the Ayatollahs to hold the hostages until Reagan was elected, in exchange for U.S. arms during the Iran-Contra Affair.


https://www.henrymakow.com/upload_images/6565468.jpgThe U.S. began approving arms sales to Iran as early as 1981, and guess who the middleman was? Israel. Israel sold 500 million dollars worth of arms to Iran. It was paid for by Iranian oil delivered to Israel through a secret pipeline set up by Israeli financier Marc Rich. Rich started doing business with Iran just one week after the Revolution, even during the Hostage Crisis. Iran sold 40 to 75 million barrels of oil to Israel a year during the 80s.


Rich said,"They respected the contracts. We performed a service for them. We bought the oil, we handled the transport, and we sold it. They couldn't do it themselves, so we were able to do it."


Iran used the profits from this deal to buy weapons from Israel and the U.S. during the Iran-Iraq war. Other key players in this Iran-Israel relationship were Yaakov Nimrodi, a Mossad agent who helped found Savak; Manucher Ghorbanifar a double agent for Iran and Israel; Adnan Khashoggi, a Saudi Arabian billionaire with ties to Zionist financiers, and Cyrus Hashemi, an Iranian arms dealer with ties to the Mossad who was related to Rafsanjani the president of Iran during the 80s.


Hashemi was head of the First Gulf Bank and Trust Company, which transferred money to the Iranian Government in the 80s. The First Gulf Bank and Trust Company was a Federal Reserve chartered bank, which means that it was a Rothschild controlled bank. So the Rothschilds have ties to the Rafsanjani crowd of the Islamic Republic of Iran.


https://www.henrymakow.com/upload_images/Hassan_Rouhani_-_January_29%2C_2005.png[Current President] Hassan Rouhani, left, is a protege of Rafsanjani, and Rouhani is doing everything that Bibi Netanyahu wants. Iran is putting their proxy armies and IRGC troops in Syria on Israel's border, giving Netanyahu the excuse to expand to the west of the Euphrates river in pursuit of Greater Israel.


Furthermore, Iran is prolonging the Sunni-Shia conflict of the Middle East by conducting proxy wars, particularly in Yemen with the Houthis rebelling against the pro-Saudi government of Yemen. When Ahmadinejad was President, he tried to bring Sunni and Shia countries together as one block against Israel. He met with Saudi King Abdullah, and they came to the conclusion that, "the greatest danger presently threatening the Islamic nations is the attempt to fuel the fire of strife between Sunni and Shia Muslims."


That scared the hell out of Bibi. In response, the Mossad waged a covert war against Iran by killing nuclear scientists and attempting to foment a color revolution in 2009 when Ahmadinejad won reelection. In Ahmadinejad's second term, he clashed with Khamenei and the Iranian establishment. In 2010 he said, "administering the country should not be left to the [Supreme Leader], the religious scholars, and other [clerics]." He also criticized the Ayatollahs for squandering the wealth of the Iranian people. He said,"60 percent of Iran's wealth is controlled by 300 people." The Ayatollahs are billionaires. Ex-President Rafsanjani [1934-2017] had a net worth of one billion dollars.


AYATOLLAHS PLUNDER IRAN


After the revolution, the Ayatollahs nationalized most of Iranian industry, and took control of it. Rafsanjani's brother became head of Iran's largest copper mine; another became head of the country's media networks, a cousin the head of a $400 million dollar pistachio export company; a nephew and son in key positions in the Iranian oil industry, and it goes on and on. What happened to the Revolutionary ideals?


https://www.henrymakow.com/upload_images/enlogo.png(left, Illuminati -dot in circle- logo for Iranian news service)


Khomeini and the Ayatollahs promised cheap water and electricity to the Iranian poor, yet they have turned Iran into a banana republic. 60 percent of Iran's economy is centrally planned, with these Ayatollahs profiting from them like oligarchs, much like the Jewish oligarchs of the Soviet Union and modern-day Russia. The Ayatollahs slosh much of their money in Rothschild Swiss and German Banks. They also run drugs in and around the Middle East through the Iranian Revolutionary Guards. The Shah cut down on the Opium trade in Iran, but now the opium trade is booming. You can find opium in Iran by just walking down the streets.


Additionally, Iran is benefiting from the Talpiot program's technology transfer through Russia and China. Israel sells weapons and technology to China and Russia, who in turn, sell it to Iran. Israel is best buds with Russia and China. And Israel is leading the way in the One Belt One Road Initiative, looking to marry Israel's technology with China's capacity.


The One Belt One Road Initiative is being praised by most of the well-known alt-media talking heads, even though it is beyond clear that Israel is facilitating it. Through OBOR, Eurasia's infrastructure will be modernized into "smart cities", with self-driving cars, monitored traffic stops etc.


https://www.henrymakow.com/upload_images/dollar-in-flames.jpgAlongside this, the BRIC nations are challenging the U.S. dollar. This is being cheered on in the alternative media, but people do not understand the ramifications of this. The Bric nations' proposed gold standard could cause the dollar to lose its value, which will in turn, cause the western economies to crash. Once the western world goes down, the world will be ripe for the New World Order led from Jerusalem.


This is a clear example of the Hegelian Dialectic. The elites will say, "The western capitalist world has caused the western economy to collapse, we need a world currency that will benefit all nations, through a multi-polar world order."


This multi-polar world order is being cheered on by the alternative media as the solution to Zionist globalism. Yet Israel is leading the way in this multi-polar world order shift. This is the Orwellian technocratic system that we are all supposedly fighting, yet most in the alternative media are cheering this on.


Isn't that what the whole plan was always about? Gradually disintegrating the existing world order until people become demoralized and eventually accept it? That is Putin, Iran, and China's role. These countries were first demoralized through economic and social "crashes" (the looting of Russia after the fall of the USSR, Khomeini's purges and disintegration of Iran after the Revolution, and Mao Zedong's Cultural Revolution which killed millions in China).


Now, Putin, Rouhani in Iran, and XI Jinping of China were brought in to gain support from the masses as "reformers", who will facilitate Iran's development into the future, which really is the final step to Israel's end goal. It is very possible that Iran and Israel will go to war. As a result, Israel could expand to the west of the Euphrates and finalize "Greater Israel", and Iran could be pushed to the east of the Euphrates. The Rothschilds have funded both sides of wars in the past like in world wars 1 and 2.

https://www.henrymakow.com/2018/06/Iran-and-Israel-are-Secret-Allies%20.html

Iran’s Jewish Rulers (http://mileswmathis.com/iran.pdf)

Iran: Was Khomeini CIA? (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?196935-Iran-Was-Khomeini-CIA)

Ender
06-25-2019, 03:23 PM
Iran is geopolitical controlled opposition, the CIA helped overthrow the Shah and install the current regime.

The Shah was instilled by the alphabets AFTER the US/British coup of Iran's democratically elected PM.

Ender
06-25-2019, 03:26 PM
So we deserve it if they attack us than? We should just let them develop nuclear weapons and arm terrorists in the middle east because America is bad? It wouldn't be a big deal if Iran armed terrorists with crude nuclear weapons because America is bad?

Attack us..... ain't gonna happen- but Iran WILL defend it's own.

The US is the one that arms terrorists in the ME. ISIS is/was an alphabet invention- as was Al Qaeda. And what about Israel? They have 200-400 nuclear war heads- but dats cool, amirite?

Swordsmyth
06-25-2019, 03:26 PM
The Shah was instilled by the alphabets AFTER the US/British coup of Iran's democratically elected PM.
Even if Mossdegh wasn't yet another puppet who was discarded the Europeans and the CIA overthrew the Shah and installed the mullahs.

nikcers
06-25-2019, 03:30 PM
Attack us..... ain't gonna happen- but Iran WILL defend it's own.

The US is the one that arms terrorists in the ME. ISIS is/was an alphabet invention- as was Al Qaeda. And what about Israel? They have 200-400 nuclear war heads- but dats cool, amirite?

They don't chant cupcakes to America in Iran.

AZJoe
06-25-2019, 10:11 PM
Kudos to Trump for not lighting the match. Credit where due. But also blame where due.
Trump is the one that saturated the area with gasoline and then wants to take credit for not settign it ablaze.
That is like an arsonist proclaiming himself hero for putting out his own fire.

Remember Idiot Trump created this entire crises himself:

It was Idiot Trump that breached the JCPOA with 5 other nation plus the EU by unilaterally pulling out despite the US military, US CIA, US NSA, all US intelligence agencies, the UN, the IAEA, UK, France, Germany the EU, China and Russia all confirming Iran was in full compliance;
It was evil idiot Trump that initiate warfare against Iran by imposing without any basis the severest economic sanction despite the US military, US CIA, US NSA, all US intelligence agencies, the UN, the IAEA, UK, France, Germany the EU, China and Russia all confirming Iran was in full compliance;
It was evil idiot Trump that initiate warfare against Iran by imposing without any basis a total economic blockade by threatening and extorting every other signatory to the agreement as well as every other nation and business on the planet that they and their private companies would suffer the mighty wrath of the empire and seizure of assets, fines, and seizure of dollar transaction transfers thru the SWIFT system if they trade with Iran;
It is the evil Trump that ha been threatening Iran nonstop since before even taking office.
It is the evil idiot Trump that has sent a flotilla of warships and bombers and spy planes and drones off Iran's coasts and borders to harass the country;
It is the idiot Trump that launched a policy of "maximum pressure" against a nation that the US military, US CIA, US NSA, all US intelligence agencies, the UN, the IAEA, UK, France, Germany the EU, China and Russia all confirming Iran was in full compliance with the JCPOA;
It is the idiot Trump that appointed and keeps in power the maniac Bolton who has direct ties to the terrorist group MEK to be Trumps National Security Advisor ....



If Trump really wants to put out a fire, he needs to fire Bolton and Pompeo immediately.

AZJoe
06-25-2019, 10:16 PM
The Great Dr. Ron Paul weighs in - Boxed in by Neocons and the Media, Will Trump Launch Iran War? (http://www.ronpaulinstitute.org/archives/featured-articles/2019/june/24/boxed-in-by-neocons-and-the-media-will-trump-launch-iran-war/)
written by ron paul (http://www.ronpaulinstitute.org/archives/featured-articles/?author=Ron+Paul)

President Trump did the smart thing last week by calling off a US airstrike on Iran over the downing of an American spy drone …

Is Iran really the aggressive one? When you unilaterally pull out of an agreement that was reducing tensions and boosting trade; when you begin applying sanctions designed to completely destroy another country’s economy; when you position military assets right offshore of that country; when you threaten to destroy that country on a regular basis, calling it a campaign of “maximum pressure,” to me it seems a stretch to play the victim when that country retaliates by shooting a spy plane that is likely looking for the best way to attack.

Even if the US spy plane was not in Iranian airspace – but it increasingly looks like it was – it was just another part of an already-existing US war on Iran. Yes, sanctions are a form of war, not a substitute for war. …

The media are also a big part of the problem. The same media that praised Trump as “presidential” when he fired rockets into Syria on what turned out to be false claims … has been attacking Trump for not bombing Iran. …

It is hard to imagine a president having top advisors who work at cross-purposes to him, planning and plotting their wars – and maybe more – behind his back. Even Trump seems to recognize that his national security advisor is not really serving his administration well. Over the weekend he said in an interview, “John Bolton is absolutely a hawk. If it was up to him he'd take on the whole world at one time, okay?” [Comment: Yet Trump has not fired this maniac that he put into power]. …

when you have a national security advisor who wants to fight the whole world at once, you have a problem. …

President Trump is in a bind and it is of his own making. Iran has shown that it is not willing to take its marching orders from Washington, which means “maximum pressure” from the US will not work. He has two options remaining in that case: risk it all by launching a war or make a gesture toward peace. A war would ruin his presidency – and a lot more. I would urge the president to issue waivers to China, India, Turkey, and the others who wish to continue buying Iranian oil and invite the Iranian leadership to meet at a neutral location. And fire Bolton and Pompeo.

AZJoe
06-25-2019, 11:05 PM
The American Conservative: Trump Must Choose: War President or Anti-Interventionist (https://www.theamericanconservative.com/buchanan/trump-must-choose-war-president-or-anti-interventionist/)
Patrick Buchanan

Visualizing 150 Iranians dead from a missile strike that he had ordered, President Donald Trump recoiled and canceled the attack … Good for Trump.

By canceling the strike, the president also sent a message to Iran: we’re ready to negotiate. Yet given the irreconcilable character of our clashing demands, it is hard to see how the U.S. and Iran get off this road we are on, at the end of which a military collision seems almost certain.

Consider the respective demands.
Monday, the president tweeted: “The U.S. request for Iran is very simple—No Nuclear Weapons and No Further Sponsoring of Terror!”
But Iran has no nuclear weapons, has never had nuclear weapons, and has never even produced bomb-grade uranium.

According to our own intelligence agencies in 2007 and 2011, Tehran did not even have a nuclear weapons program.
Under the 2015 nuclear deal, the JCPOA, the only way Iran could have a nuclear weapons program would be in secret, outside its known nuclear facilities, all of which are under constant U.N. inspection. Where is the evidence that any such secret program exists? And if it does, why does America not tell the world where Iran’s secret nuclear facilities are located and demand immediate inspections?

“No further sponsoring of terror,” Trump says. But what does that mean? As the major Shiite power in a Middle East divided between Sunni and Shiite, Iran backs the Houthi rebels in Yemen’s civil war, Shiite Hezbollah in Lebanon, Alawite Bashar al-Assad in Syria, and the Shiite militias in Iraq that helped us stop ISIS’s drive to Baghdad. In his 12 demands, Pompeo virtually insisted that Iran abandon these allies and capitulate to their Sunni adversaries and rivals. Not going to happen.

Yet if these demands are non-negotiable, to be backed up by sanctions severe enough to choke Iran’s economy to death, we will be headed for war. …

As for the charge that Iran is “destabilizing” the Middle East, it was not Iran that invaded Afghanistan and Iraq, overthrew the Gaddafi regime in Libya, armed rebels against Assad in Syria, or aided and abetted the Saudis’ intervention in Yemen’s civil war.

Iran, pushed to the wall, its economy shrinking as inflation and unemployment rise, is approaching the limits of its tolerance. … At some point, collisions will produce casualties and we will be on the up escalator to war. Yet what vital interest of ours does Iran today threaten? …

the president himself authorized the steps that have brought us to this peril point. Trump pulled out of and trashed Obama’s nuclear deal. He imposed the sanctions that are now inflicting something close to unacceptable if not intolerable pain on Iran. He had the Islamic Revolutionary Guard declared a terrorist organization. He sent the Abraham Lincoln carrier task force and B-52s to the Gulf region. …

And who would Trump name to negotiate with Tehran for the United States?
The longer the sanctions remain in place and the deeper they bite, the greater the likelihood that Iran will respond to our economic warfare with its own asymmetric warfare. …

We appear to be at a turning point in the Trump presidency. Does he want to run in 2020 as the president who led us into war with Iran, or as the anti-interventionist who began to bring U.S. troops home? …

AZJoe
06-25-2019, 11:15 PM
Gold Goats 'n Guns (https://tomluongo.me): Iran — Message Sent, Message Delivered (https://tomluongo.me/2019/06/24/iran-message-sent-message-delivered/)

It is clear that Iran is sending the U.S. a stern message. And that message is we can hurt you asymmetrically as much as you hurt us. …

Iran’s leadership made it clear there was no mistake in their actions last week. They purposefully shot down one of our most advanced drones to send the U.S. a very clear warning. ‘Our capabilities far exceed your tolerance for withstanding them.’

The more we learn about this incident the more the initial story concocted by the U.S. looks specious. Drone in international airspace? Most likely not. …

The drone that was shot down, an RQ-4A Global Hawk, was the cream of our surveillance drones. It was flying in tandem with an anti-submarine Poseidon P-8 spy plane, which, according to Elijah Magnier was carrying far more than its normal crew of 9 (https://ejmagnier.com/2019/06/23/how-iran-decided-to-down-a-us-drone-and-narrowly-averted-war-by-sparing-another-us-plane/). Try 38. …

Iran then revealed just how loose with the truth the U.S. turned out to be and that forced a complete rethink of the situation. There was no mistake involved. No IRGC officer panicked. Iran deliberately targeted the Global Hawk after it failed to respond to hails to leave Iranian airspace and turned off its GPS, lights and digital systems. It was acting as a hostile and Iran treated it as such. After sparing the Poseidon P-8 and its crew and passengers Iran shot down the drone. …

This was a clear message that actions speak far louder than words. The Iranian leadership decided it was time to test Donald Trump’s mettle. They didn’t have to shoot down the drone. But if they didn’t it would give the U.S. carte blanche to violate Iranian airspace without fear of reprisal …

And this is where Trump’s fundamental character flaws come to the fore. He’s simply not able to see things outside of his own personal costs. A classic narcissist. And this is why he wanted desperately to bomb Iranian targets in response. Because of his fundamental flaws he had to be talked off the ledge by, reportedly, Tucker Carlson. Good on Tucker if this is even remotely true, but should it have come to this?

If this is what passes for the decision-making flowchart of the Trump administration then we should all be really worried.

In the end, this was just a drone and one that was 1) somewhere it shouldn’t have been and 2) acting in a very suspicious manner …

And given the potential costs for Iran if they were wrong, the onus of proof, in my mind, lies with the U.S., which it will not provide. That’s a clear signal that we don’t have the evidence to back up our story.

Then Trump floats this nonsense about killing 150 Iranians wouldn’t be “proportionate.” So people who starve or are denied a better life because of sanctions and threats aren’t casualties, Don’t? Only those killed by bombs? … this is the position of a sick and dangerous narcissist. … this goes for all of this country’s leaders going back decades.

Sanctions are acts of war. Embargoes are immoral. …

Trump started this fight now he doesn’t know how to get out of it. I expect Putin and Xi will sit him down at the G-20 and work through his options. These men always allow Trump to save face. Iran can’t. …

Iran isn’t interested in allowing Trump to save face here without him giving up something yuge. He started this fight and it’s up to him to put something tangible on the table. And saying, “I won’t bomb you back to the stone age over a drone” is not an olive branch.

The second thing he did today, confirming his impotence, was putting ineffectual and idiotic sanctions on Iran’s political leadership. I’m sure they are shaking in their turbins now!

The war-gaming after this incident was clear, however. Any retaliation by the U.S. would be catastrophic for the world economy. It would unleash a regional conflict on multiple fronts which would not be any kind of controlled theater. … even the biggest hawks on the Joint Chiefs of Staff would have been uncomfortable with fighting those battles. …

Iran’s message was sent and delivered. Trump found out that no amount of external direct pressure will get the Iranian government to fold. That for all the might of the U.S. military and financial empire, its weaknesses are deep enough that even a relatively weak military and economy like Iran’s can stop it all dead cold because of basic things like geography, logistics and simple human resolve.