First-ever private border wall built in New Mexico

[Anti Federalist]

First-ever private border wall built in New Mexico

https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2019/may/27/first-ever-private-border-wall-built-new-mexico/

Half-mile section to close 'gap' in Border Patrol's fence

By Stephen Dinan - The Washington Times - Monday, May 27, 2019

A private group announced Monday that it has constructed a half-mile wall along a section of the U.S.-Mexico border in New Mexico, in what it said was a first in the border debate.

The 18-foot steel bollard wall is similar to the designs used by the Border Patrol, sealing off a part of the border that had been a striking gap in existing fencing, according to We Build the Wall, the group behind the new section.

The section was also built faster and, organizers say, likely more cheaply than the government has been able to manage in recent years.

Kris Kobach, a former secretary of state in Kansas and an informal immigration adviser to President Trump, says the New Mexico project has the president’s blessing and says local Border Patrol agents are eager to have the assistance.

“We’re closing a gap that’s been a big headache for them,” said Mr. Kobach, who is general counsel for We Build the Wall.

The announcement comes at a critical time for the border.

Mr. Trump’s plans to build hundreds of miles of new and replacement wall took a hit late last week when a federal judge ordered a halt to part of his emergency declaration and shifting of money within the Pentagon to make up for Congress’s refusal to grant him the money he wanted.

Judge Haywood Gilliam says the president can’t spend money when Congress has debated it and refused to approve it.

Enter We Build the Wall, which says now that it’s proved it can build border wall. The group has eyes on other areas where private landowners hold border lands and want a barrier to cut down on the illegal traffic across their property.

The new wall begins at the Rio Grande and runs up to the lower elevations of Mount Cristo Rey. The wall on the Texas side ends at the river, and there used to be a gap on the New Mexico side running from the river over to Mount Cristo Rey.

Two parking lots, one on the Mexican side and one on the U.S. side, with naught but a ditch to separate them, offered a convenient staging point for would-be migrants.

Mr. Kobach says agents have told him perhaps 100 migrants a night cross — but the bigger problem is that they would cross, gaining agents’ attention, then drug smugglers would use the distraction to run drugs through elsewhere in the gap.

A typical night could exceed $100,000 worth of drugs through the gap, Mr. Kobach said.

Construction began Friday and will be completed Tuesday. Tommy Fisher’s Fisher Sand & Gravel did the construction.

Mr. Fisher has been in the news recently with Mr. Trump suggesting repeatedly and publicly that the government should consider his outfit for future border wall construction.

He was one of the contractors selected in 2017 to build wall prototypes in San Diego. None of those prototypes was deemed contract-worthy, and Congress has forbidden the Border Patrol from using any of those designs anyway.

More recently, Mr. Fisher announced he could build 234 miles of fencing at $1.4 billion — or about $6 million per mile. That’s about a quarter of the cost of Mr. Trump’s current fencing, which goes off at about $25 million per mile.

The half-mile in New Mexico cost $8 million, but Mr. Kobach said because part of it involved building on Mount Cristo Rey and involved moving a lot of dirt, that’s more expensive than most mileage would be.

A private wall has been a dream of border security enthusiasts for years.

More than a decade ago, adherents of the Minuteman movement, which sought to draw attention to the lack of border barriers in Arizona, constructed some fencing on a ranch in southeastern Arizona. The fencing was approved by local authorities as a way to corral cattle but was also seen as a way of blocking illegal migration, The Arizona Daily Star reported in 2006.

Organizers said funding didn’t materialize to finish that project.

The new wall in New Mexico is up along the border and designed just like the Border Patrol’s structures, intended to be a deterrent to illegal crossing.

[Swordsmyth]

:clap::clap::clap::clap::clap:

[Zippyjuan]

People asking what ever happened to the $ millions raised for a wall in that GoFundMe campaign.

http://nymag.com/intelligencer/2019/05/where-did-brian-kolfages-usd20-million-for-a-border-wall-go.html


Donors to Stalled Campaign That Raised $20 Million for Border Wall Want Answers


In January, in the winter of our historic government shutdown, the White House Office of Management and Budget sent a letter to Congress, claiming it would need $5.7 billion to pay for 234 miles of steel slat barriers along the border, which equates to a sound investment of $24.4 million per mile. To help get there, triple-amputee veteran Brian Kolfage founded a GoFundMe called We Build the Wall, raising $20 million to help secure the southern border — or at least four fifths of a mile of it.

But after four progressless months from We Build the Wall, Trump supporters who donated to the crowdfunding effort want to know where their money went. A woman asked on the We Build the Wall Facebook page: “I am very disappointed in you Brian Kolfage, where are the progress photographs?” “Why no updates on the status of the wall?” one user asked on Twitter. “I have a feeling this is a scam.”

Considering the online history of Brian Kolfage, the question is a valid one. As the Daily Beast reports, Kolfage “was a prolific operator of hoax pages on Facebook, and money he raised in the past to help veterans’ programs in hospitals never actually went to those hospitals.” The vet, who lost three of his limbs in a rocket attack in Iraq in 2004, founded sites including FreedomDaily, which ran headlines like “Obnoxious Black People Lose Their Minds When Victoria Secret Models Say This 1 Word On Live Video.” The site was shuttered after it was sued for misidentifying a Michigan resident as the driver of the car that killed a protestor in the Charlottesville riot.

To help promote his crowdfunded wall-building effort, Kolfage recruited Trump-world all stars like Steve Bannon; former Kansas Secretary of State Kris Kobach; pitcher and the bane of Rhode Island Curt Schilling; Blackwater founder Erik Prince; and ex-Milwaukee sheriff David Clarke to join the group’s advisory board. In January, Kobach told the New York Times that We Build the Wall would “be hopefully breaking ground within weeks.” That timeframe has been pushed back on a few occasions. In March, Kolfage said they would “start breaking ground” in April, but he also told Politico that “we should be turning dirt on this thing by May 1, June 1 at the latest.”

In addition to the timeline, other major problems remain. To avoid possible issues of sovereignty, Kolfage intends to build on private land in Arizona. In the Politico interview, he mentioned that he had eight locations lined up, but did not name them, citing “liberal groups who want to sue us and impede our progress.” But as the Phoenix New Times points out: “The vast majority of the border in Arizona exists on land owned by the federal government — land where private citizens cannot build their own walls.” Then, of course, is the inevitability of answering to donors, like the anonymous person who gave We Build the Wall $50,000 and might want an update on how their money is being allocated.


A while ago he claimed the wall was nearly finished. Now he says construction will start "soon".


"The liberal fake news thinks it’s not happening... but it’s already begun! We have given exclusive rights to our completion ceremony to a major network, only then will we release Images of our completed wall. It’s almost complete!"

https://www.vladtv.com/article/254842/veteran-accused-of-diverting-22m-border-wall-gofundme-to-lavish-life


Donors were told they would be invited to the ground breaking to start construction- nobody has heard anything.

[Schifference]

I am thinking the building department will soon issue a demand the wall be removed. Failure to do so will result in the city/county removing said wall at owners expense.

[PAF]

As long as they did not impose their wall on area private owners/businesses who do not want the wall, it is a Free Market approach that I can accept.

Good thing my offspring an I visited again earlier this year to enjoy the beautiful views. We purchased several cool souvenirs, ate really great food, etc. After the trip and much discussion, we have no desire to ever return again to look at ugly prison walls, certainly when the root cause is not being addressed by this corrupt government. As a Free Market advocate who does not believe in "too big to fail", I wonder how long before more people will choose not to go and stop supporting the local economies. I for one would NEVER vacation, buy property or a business next to a prison wall.

[Swordsmyth]

In what might be seen as a Memorial Day gift to President Trump, residents of a mountain range outside of El Paso today woke up to a new vista—a mile-long wall of metal slats constructed along the border with Mexico that just shot up over the weekend. The secret project, which started on Friday evening and was completed by Monday morning, was the work of We Build the Wall, a new group whose director is the former White House strategist Steve Bannon. The CEO is Air Force veteran Brian Kolfage, who had raised $20 million (http://nymag.com/intelligencer/2019/05/where-did-brian-kolfages-usd20-million-for-a-border-wall-go.html) to build the wall through his GoFundMe project, but it appeared to be floundering until Bannon took the helm.Bannon, who for much of the weekend was in Kazakhstan for a geopolitical seminar, says the project, overseen by construction mogul Tommy Fisher of North Dakota-based Fisher Industries, involved hundreds of workers and cost $6 million.
He says his group asked local authorities what is the most dangerous part of the border with Mexico, and they were pointed to this precarious mountain strip, “where the cartels and asylum seekers are coming in” through a gap (https://www.washingtonpost.com/immigration/he-always-brings-them-up-trump-tries-to-steer-border-wall-deal-to-north-dakota-firm/2019/05/23/92d3858c-7b30-11e9-8bb7-0fc796cf2ec0_story.html?utm_term=.3ed8bb99a40a) between two 21-mile strips of completed wall. The group hastily “purchased the rights” to the land and went at it Friday evening. “We had to catch them by surprise,” says Bannon, who predicts residents are “gonna freak out” when they see what was erected over the past two days.

More at: https://news.yahoo.com/bannon-built-the-wall-over-the-weekend-140449962.html

https://cdn2.btrstatic.com/pics/showpics/large/341227_bU7lDn12.jpg

[Anti Globalist]

How ironic is it that New Mexico was the first state to do this?

[Swordsmyth]

How ironic is it that New Mexico was the first state to do this?
Just as ironic as their governor asking for federal help now after she pulled the National Guard off the border.

[RonZeplin]

A few of us Campo Minutemen at the border, Thanksgiving 08.

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/proxy/rgqBdChbQW9rQainwQLIvtJYV7CcGCjLQ_5NZfw5PFuWe42emY RPqhfrJpH3zIP-EMXRfwT2O5dMqX9K9NzQr16uD33zOU661W7PE9mZhUpV2py4wC I4LnQ-yNdM=s0-d

JC, Max, Kingfish, Woody, Ridgerunner, Viking.

Runway mat border wall to the right.

MORE - Campo Minutemen blog (https://campominutemen.blogspot.com/2008/12/)

[Danke]

Good thing my offspring an I.. .

YOU BRED!

Holy Fuck.

[Danke]

A few of us Campo Minutemen at the border, Thanksgiving 08.

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/proxy/rgqBdChbQW9rQainwQLIvtJYV7CcGCjLQ_5NZfw5PFuWe42emY RPqhfrJpH3zIP-EMXRfwT2O5dMqX9K9NzQr16uD33zOU661W7PE9mZhUpV2py4wC I4LnQ-yNdM=s0-d

JC, Max, Kingfish, Woody, Ridgerunner, Viking.

Runway mat border wall to the right.

MORE - Campo Minutemen blog (https://campominutemen.blogspot.com/2008/12/)

hmm...

"Watch Advisor, whose group monitors the border east of Campo, reports that these job sites are good targets for material thieves. Most have been from the south side since the materials are left sometimes less than 100 feet from the border. His group chased off a group of six one night while they were on duty guarding two sites for Kiewit last month. They had climbed onto a dozer and were attempting to remove tool kits, fire extinguishers, and other items It didn't work out for them in the end."

[RonZeplin]

hmm...

"Watch Advisor, whose group monitors the border east of Campo, reports that these job sites are good targets for material thieves. Most have been from the south side since the materials are left sometimes less than 100 feet from the border. His group chased off a group of six one night while they were on duty guarding two sites for Kiewit last month. They had climbed onto a dozer and were attempting to remove tool kits, fire extinguishers, and other items It didn't work out for them in the end."

Ooops, posted link for Dec, here's the one with the pics Nov '08. https://campominutemen.blogspot.com/2008/11/

Bush may have built more wall in '08 than Trump has. Scroll down to '08 new wall pics. But only in short sections, with open border at ends as RidgeRunner (Me) Update indicates.

[enhanced_deficit]

https://cdn2.btrstatic.com/pics/showpics/large/341227_bU7lDn12.jpg

Bannon is a fighter, sometimes MAGA and Jarvanka don't appreciate him as much as they should.

https://www.economist.com/sites/default/files/images/print-edition/20170415_USD000_0.jpg
https://i2-prod.mirror.co.uk/incoming/article11806172.ece/ALTERNATES/s615b/Sky-News-presenters-crack-up-while-reading-Donald-Trumps-tweet.jpg

[asurfaholic]

As long as they did not impose their wall on area private owners/businesses who do not want the wall, it is a Free Market approach that I can accept.

Good thing my offspring an I visited again earlier this year to enjoy the beautiful views. We purchased several cool souvenirs, ate really great food, etc. After the trip and much discussion, we have no desire to ever return again to look at ugly prison walls, certainly when the root cause is not being addressed by this corrupt government. As a Free Market advocate who does not believe in "too big to fail", I wonder how long before more people will choose not to go and stop supporting the local economies. I for one would NEVER vacation, buy property or a business next to a prison wall.


I don’t care if it’s a taxpayer or privately funded wall. A wall is a wall, and I don’t believe a wall is the answer. Remove welfare and obscene drug laws and watch the problems mostly disappear.

[Superfluous Man]

As long as they did not impose their wall on area private owners/businesses who do not want the wall, it is a Free Market approach that I can accept.

Good thing my offspring an I visited again earlier this year to enjoy the beautiful views. We purchased several cool souvenirs, ate really great food, etc. After the trip and much discussion, we have no desire to ever return again to look at ugly prison walls, certainly when the root cause is not being addressed by this corrupt government. As a Free Market advocate who does not believe in "too big to fail", I wonder how long before more people will choose not to go and stop supporting the local economies. I for one would NEVER vacation, buy property or a business next to a prison wall.


I don’t care if it’s a taxpayer or privately funded wall. A wall is a wall, and I don’t believe a wall is the answer. Remove welfare and obscene drug laws and watch the problems mostly disappear.

I agree with both of these posts. The solution is for those who don't want a wall to buy property on the border and exercise their right not to build a wall there or even to buy property where there is a wall and remove it, just as some are exercising their right to build one.

Truthfully, we all know that if this private approach really were followed exclusively, there wouldn't end up being much of a wall at the border, because those who say they want it don't really want it badly enough to fund it with their own money at the level of funding that it would require. Like all statists, they only want what they're asking for when other people who don't want it are forced to cover most of the cost.

[PAF]

I don’t care if it’s a taxpayer or privately funded wall. A wall is a wall, and I don’t believe a wall is the answer. Remove welfare and obscene drug laws and watch the problems mostly disappear.




I agree with both of these posts. The solution is for those who don't want a wall to buy property on the border and exercise their right not to build a wall there or even to buy property where there is a wall and remove it, just as some are exercising their right to build one.

Truthfully, we all know that if this private approach really were followed exclusively, there wouldn't end up being much of a wall at the border, because those who say they want it don't really want it badly enough to fund it with their own money at the level of funding that it would require. Like all statists, they only want what they're asking for when other people who don't want it are forced to cover most of the cost.


Likewise I agree with both of these posts.

[angelatc]

The CEO is Air Force veteran Brian Kolfage, who had raised $20 million to build the wall through his GoFundMe project, but it appeared to be floundering until Bannon took the helm

Steve Bannon for president

[Swordsmyth]

I don’t care if it’s a taxpayer or privately funded wall. A wall is a wall, and I don’t believe a wall is the answer. Remove welfare and obscene drug laws and watch the problems mostly disappear.


I agree with both of these posts. The solution is for those who don't want a wall to buy property on the border and exercise their right not to build a wall there or even to buy property where there is a wall and remove it, just as some are exercising their right to build one.

Truthfully, we all know that if this private approach really were followed exclusively, there wouldn't end up being much of a wall at the border, because those who say they want it don't really want it badly enough to fund it with their own money at the level of funding that it would require. Like all statists, they only want what they're asking for when other people who don't want it are forced to cover most of the cost.


Likewise I agree with both of these posts.
You can't claim to believe in liberty and oppose private walls.
The biggest incentive is our economy and we will still need either increased border patrols or a wall or both even if you end the WoD and welfare.

And the one who suggested buying land just to block or remove a private wall effort and the one who agreed with him have just exposed that their goal is to give aid and comfort to the enemy and destroy America.

[Swordsmyth]

Steve Bannon for president
You could do a lot worse, I'd seriously consider him if he ran.

[PAF]

You can't claim to believe in liberty and oppose private walls.
The biggest incentive is our economy and we will still need either increased border patrols or a wall or both even if you end the WoD and welfare.

And the one who suggested buying land just to block or remove a private wall effort and the one who agreed with him have just exposed that their goal is to give aid and comfort to the enemy and destroy America.


You have a severe habit of twisting words. More and more you sound like a nazi whose end goal is that only very specific people of a specific nation should be predetermined by you to be entitled to freedom, liberty and economic prosperity.

Therefore, you have absolutely no credibility.

[Swordsmyth]

You have a severe habit of twisting words. More and more you sound like a nazi whose end goal is that only very specific people of a specific nation should be predetermined by you to be entitled to freedom, liberty and economic prosperity.

Therefore, you have absolutely no credibility.
LOL

[asurfaholic]

I believe Ron Paul didn’t stutter and say only government built walls are capable of keeping people in. A wall is a wall.

I don’t believe a wall will fix any of the issues, regardless of pays for it.

[Swordsmyth]

I believe Ron Paul didn’t stutter and say only government built walls are capable of keeping people in. A wall is a wall.

I don’t believe a wall will fix any of the issues, regardless of pays for it.

Setting aside the question of a government wall, border land owners have a right to put up walls to protect themselves, their loved ones and their property.

[angelatc]

I believe Ron Paul didn’t stutter and say only government built walls are capable of keeping people in. A wall is a wall.

I don’t believe a wall will fix any of the issues, regardless of pays for it.

Of course not. But there's no support for ending the welfare state. Trump doesn't even talk about scaling any of that back, even though this is the perfect time. And even if he did, no way could he get the House to do that.

[Swordsmyth]

Of course not. But there's no support for ending the welfare state. Trump doesn't even talk about scaling any of that back, even though this is the perfect time. And even if he did, no way could he get the House to do that.
Trump is doing what he can:

New HUD rule prevents illegals from getting public housing assistance (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?533571-New-HUD-rule-prevents-illegals-from-getting-public-housing-assistance)

Infuriating Democrats, Trump Plans To Redefine Poverty, Cutting Americans From Welfare (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?534256-Infuriating-Democrats-Trump-Plans-To-Redefine-Poverty-Cutting-Americans-From-Welfare)

[enhanced_deficit]

Steve Bannon for president

Granted he was very upset over Roy Moore's defeat caused by Jarvanka and privately probably fuming over MAGA tweets insulting him as 'sloppy Steve', at this point it seems unlikely that he would primary MAGA in 2020.
Although, anything is possible in politics. There have been rumors that Obama insults at WHCD dinner motivated Trump to run for President.

[oyarde]

How ironic is it that New Mexico was the first state to do this?

It is not new and it is not mexico . Could be a little left of mexico .

[asurfaholic]

Setting aside the question of a government wall, border land owners have a right to put up walls to protect themselves, their loved ones and their property.

That's a good point. I hate the idea of a wall, but if the actual property owners want a wall or fence, then who am I to stop them.

[TheTexan]

They're paying for the wall out of their own pockets, on private property??

They're going about this whole thing all wrong.

[Anti Federalist]

That's a good point. I hate the idea of a wall, but if the actual property owners want a wall or fence, then who am I to stop them.

Do you have a front door on your home?

[ProBlue33]

Well walls do work for those that don't haul big ladders or high end cordless grinders and recipro saws.


https://i.redd.it/3rj78yk3g1131.png


This baby would make short work of the wall, but most of these poor Mexicans can't afford it.

https://images.homedepot-static.com/productImages/752250fa-0ae7-482f-8165-3cc4f092c3e5/svn/milwaukee-impact-wrenches-2785-21hd-64_1000.jpg

[buck000]

That's a good point. I hate the idea of a wall, but if the actual property owners want a wall or fence, then who am I to stop them.

Apparently, you're not the goverment (https://www.krwg.org/post/sunland-park-issues-cease-and-desist-order-halt-border-wall-construction). :)

[asurfaholic]

Do you have a front door on your home?

Do we have a wall separating Canada from US?

Do we have a wall separating the ocean from the coasts?

Where does it stop?

Why do we need a wall? What are we trying to keep in or out?

[PAF]

Do we have a wall separating Canada from US?

Do we have a wall separating the ocean from the coasts?

Where does it stop?

Why do we need a wall? What are we trying to keep in or out?

^ I whole-heartedly agree ^

I will make the point, however, that if a wall solely exists on Private Property, funded by Private Money, government has NO business interfering with that construct.

I would opt that the Free Market dictate whether the business, tourism, real estate sales, etc. flourish or sink while staring at a prison wall.

I for one will never visit New Mexico or Texas again where portions of the wall exist. Others may choose to do so, but that is not my idea of a vacationing tourist, and I certainly would NEVER purchase property to build a home or a business.

Again, the only solution is to End Incentives that attract free-loaders into the area. If any free-loaders still roam about on public land with NO incentive to receive, who am I to stop them from traveling freely.

[Swordsmyth]

Why do we need a wall?
Because we don't put the troops on the border and throw everyone back across.



What are we trying to keep in or out?
We are trying to keep communist invaders out.

[Swordsmyth]

Again, the only solution is to End Incentives that attract free-loaders into the area. If any free-loaders still roam about on public land with NO incentive to receive, who am I to stop them from traveling freely.
Our economy is the biggest incentive and they will have an intent to use big government to take a chunk of it.

[asurfaholic]

Because we don't put the troops on the border and throw everyone back across.



We are trying to keep communist invaders out.

The “communist invaders” will come regardless of whether there is a private wall or a government wall.

You have to remove the communist policies first. Nobody is talking about the free healthcare and education and other welfare programs that do not discriminate based on immigration status.

“Build that wall... MAGA” is the stupid repeating the stupid. There is no reason to believe that a wall will stop anyone.

Don’t believe me? Look at prisons. There are walls and chain fences and barbed wires and cameras ever 12 feet. Drugs still get in, escapees get out.

To the unintelligent “do you have a front door” responding people, yes I have a front door, but if someone is going to break in, they will find a way in. It’s purpose isn’t to stop people from coming in, it just slows them down. But you better believe if someone wants in, they will find a way in.

I take offense at the notion that the wall is to prevent “communist invaders” anyways. The commies are already running the government. They are running the biggest businesses and pulling strings everywhere. They are running city councils.

Why don’t we worry about the communist US residents first? If you are worried about them why wouldn’t you start by building a wall around California to keep them all in there?

What about the socialist invaders? When are we building a wall to keep those shivering frenchy Canadians out of our country? Is it even “our” country anyways? This country historically has been a shining beacon of freedom and opportunity to the world. Why can’t we just return to being a country ruled by constitutional law and not a welfare state that drains the middle class of its wealth to grow the divide between the obscenely wealthy and the poor? With a booming economy, we should all want migrants flocking to the country to try their own hands at prosperity and freedom.

I don’t dream of a prison state. I think people are greatly confused about what a “wall” really means. There is so much more we can be focused on to fix the problems associated with people crossing the borders illegally.

Everyone seems to just want to forget logic and jump straight to some fantasyland solution. Why not use those little peckerheads and think for a freaking second. Step one: Why are they coming? Not because they want to vote for communist policies, but because we already have what they are coming for. Step 2. Quit dangling from trumps dong long enough to think for yourself about what step 3 is.

[Swordsmyth]

The “communist invaders” will come regardless of whether there is a private wall or a government wall.

You have to remove the communist policies first. Nobody is talking about the free healthcare and education and other welfare programs that do not discriminate based on immigration status.

“Build that wall... MAGA” is the stupid repeating the stupid. There is no reason to believe that a wall will stop anyone.

Don’t believe me? Look at prisons. There are walls and chain fences and barbed wires and cameras ever 12 feet. Drugs still get in, escapees get out.

To the unintelligent “do you have a front door” responding people, yes I have a front door, but if someone is going to break in, they will find a way in. It’s purpose isn’t to stop people from coming in, it just slows them down. But you better believe if someone wants in, they will find a way in.

I take offense at the notion that the wall is to prevent “communist invaders” anyways. The commies are already running the government. They are running the biggest businesses and pulling strings everywhere. They are running city councils.

Why don’t we worry about the communist US residents first? If you are worried about them why wouldn’t you start by building a wall around California to keep them all in there?

What about the socialist invaders? When are we building a wall to keep those shivering frenchy Canadians out of our country? Is it even “our” country anyways? This country historically has been a shining beacon of freedom and opportunity to the world. Why can’t we just return to being a country ruled by constitutional law and not a welfare state that drains the middle class of its wealth to grow the divide between the obscenely wealthy and the poor? With a booming economy, we should all want migrants flocking to the country to try their own hands at prosperity and freedom.

I don’t dream of a prison state. I think people are greatly confused about what a “wall” really means. There is so much more we can be focused on to fix the problems associated with people crossing the borders illegally.

Everyone seems to just want to forget logic and jump straight to some fantasyland solution. Why not use those little peckerheads and think for a freaking second. Step one: Why are they coming? Not because they want to vote for communist policies, but because we already have what they are coming for. Step 2. Quit dangling from trumps dong long enough to think for yourself about what step 3 is.
A wall or patrols will not be 100% effective, they don't have to be.

We do have too many communists here already, that is why we have to do everything we can to keep them from importing enough reinforcements to destroy any chance we have of restoring liberty.

If I could split California off from the union and keep them from coming in I would and I want troops patrolling the northern border too.

It IS OUR COUNTRY, our ancestors built it and left it to us as their gift to us and we have a responsibility to them and to our descendants to keep it from being destroyed. (particularly at the hands of foreigners)

We can't return to being a country ruled by constitutional law and not a welfare state that drains the middle class of its wealth to grow the divide between the obscenely wealthy and the poor if we allow our native communists to import unlimited reinforcements.

If we ever do restore liberty and a booming economy we can share it with some immigrants but we will have a responsibility to limit their numbers and the cultures we allow them from to preserve liberty and a booming economy.

They are coming for our economy that is much better than theirs and if we didn't have a welfare state they would vote for one, that is what previous waves of immigrants did.
And in any case they come here and vote to keep and expand the welfare state and if we allow them too we will never be able to eliminate it.

[asurfaholic]

Are you serious? You are going to blame our welfare state on people who crossed the southern border?

It was registered voting actual Americans who created this mess.

Mostly by parroting everything they heard some big fat head on the TV saying.

Like “build that wall” people are doing now. Nobody cared about a wall until trump made a spectacle of it.

[Danke]

Do we have a wall separating Canada from US?

Do we have a wall separating the ocean from the coasts?

Where does it stop?

Why do we need a wall? What are we trying to keep in or out?


We have a problem with people coming here illegally from Canada?

[Danke]

A wall or patrols will not be 100% effective, they don't have to be.

We do have too many communists here already, that is why we have to do everything we can to keep them from importing enough reinforcements to destroy any chance we have of restoring liberty.

If I could split California off from the union and keep them from coming in I would and I want troops patrolling the northern border too.

It IS OUR COUNTRY, our ancestors built it and left it to us as their gift to us and we have a responsibility to them and to our descendants to keep it from being destroyed. (particularly at the hands of foreigners)

We can't return to being a country ruled by constitutional law and not a welfare state that drains the middle class of its wealth to grow the divide between the obscenely wealthy and the poor if we allow our native communists to import unlimited reinforcements.

If we ever do restore liberty and a booming economy we can share it with some immigrants but we will have a responsibility to limit their numbers and the cultures we allow them from to preserve liberty and a booming economy.

They are coming for our economy that is much better than theirs and if we didn't have a welfare state they would vote for one, that is what previous waves of immigrants did.
And in any case they come here and vote to keep and expand the welfare state and if we allow them too we will never be able to eliminate it.

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Swordsmyth again.

[asurfaholic]

We have a problem with people coming here illegally from Canada?

Have you ever observed water flowing down a hill?

What happens when you put an obstacle at some point in that flow of water? Does all the water just flow back up the hill? Na, it goes around or eventually over the obstacle. My point isn’t that we need a northern wall, but at what point do we stop building walls?

Leave food crumbs and trash everywhere in your house, and tape off every opening you can find. You will still get roaches.

[Danke]

Have you ever observed water flowing down a hill?

What happens when you put an obstacle at some point in that flow of water? Does all the water just flow back up the hill? Na, it goes around or eventually over the obstacle. My point isn’t that we need a northern wall, but at what point do we stop building walls?

Leave food crumbs and trash everywhere in your house, and tape off every opening you can find. You will still get roaches.

Such a great analogy...

[asurfaholic]

Thanks I thought it was pretty danke myself.

[Swordsmyth]

Have you ever observed water flowing down a hill?

What happens when you put an obstacle at some point in that flow of water? Does all the water just flow back up the hill? Na, it goes around or eventually over the obstacle. My point isn’t that we need a northern wall, but at what point do we stop building walls?

Leave food crumbs and trash everywhere in your house, and tape off every opening you can find. You will still get roaches.
If you put enough levees in the path of flowing water it will find other places to flow.

We do need to clean up the food trash but we need to close the doors and windows too.

[Swordsmyth]

We have a problem with people coming here illegally from Canada?
Illegal crossings on the northern border are up 40% this year.

We need to tackle the problem from all angles but Trump can only do so much with an uncooperative Congress.

[Danke]

Illegal crossings on the northern border are up 40% this year.

We need to tackle the problem from all angles but Trump can only do so much with an uncooperative Congress.

Up 40%, what does that make it? A couple of dozen?

I use to cross the Canadian boarder in a canoe. Just need permission if I was going to stay the night.

[Swordsmyth]

Up 40%, what does that make it? A couple of dozen?
True, it is a lot harder for people to go to Canada first and then cross into America, anything that makes the invasion harder is a good thing that will reduce the numbers.
But many people are coming from over the ocean to Mexico before entering across our southern border so they might switch to Canada if we don't decrease incentives and secure the Canadian border with increased patrols.

[Swordsmyth]

New Mexico Mayor orders We Build The Wall to stop, says there are no permits and no city approval for the private wall they put up. (https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/new-mexico-mayor-orders-group-building-border-wall-to-stop-construction/ar-AAC4vkm?ocid=spartanntp) Group says all permits are in order and inspection was done. What probably happened is the landowner made it sound like a private fence, and it got approval. Now they realize it was to stop migrants, and they are up in arms.

[Zippyjuan]

Do we have a wall separating Canada from US?

Do we have a wall separating the ocean from the coasts?

Where does it stop?

Why do we need a wall? What are we trying to keep in or out?

Asia is now our biggest source of immigration. We need a Great Wall Of China (and India)!

(The asylum seekers are not sneaking across anyways- they are knocking on the door and legally asking to be let in).

[Swordsmyth]

Asia is now our biggest source of immigration. We need a Great Wall Of China (and India)!
No, we need to stop granting them visas and greencards.


(The asylum seekers are not sneaking across anyways- they are knocking on the door and legally asking to be let in).
Most are sneaking across and applying for asylum when caught but we do need to reform our ridiculously generous asylum laws, we can't afford to let every down on their luck person from the entire globe come here.

[asurfaholic]

If you put enough levees in the path of flowing water it will find other places to flow.

We do need to clean up the food trash but we need to close the doors and windows too.

If our out of control welfare state doesn’t get fixed soon, the levees will break.

Close the doors and windows, but if you leave a pot of gold visible from the street unattended, someone’s going to bust out a window or find a way in.

[brushfire]

https://www.economist.com/sites/default/files/images/print-edition/20170415_USD000_0.jpg
https://i2-prod.mirror.co.uk/incoming/article11806172.ece/ALTERNATES/s615b/Sky-News-presenters-crack-up-while-reading-Donald-Trumps-tweet.jpg


^ its no wonder why trump can only find swampers to take positions on his staff. Who the fk would want to work for that guy?

[brushfire]

Well walls do work for those that don't haul big ladders or high end cordless grinders and recipro saws.


This baby would make short work of the wall, but most of these poor Mexicans can't afford it.

https://images.homedepot-static.com/productImages/752250fa-0ae7-482f-8165-3cc4f092c3e5/svn/milwaukee-impact-wrenches-2785-21hd-64_1000.jpg


They have cordless power tools... Even the poorest are paying 'yotes thousands to guide them across the border. They have a system, and it includes the welfare they receive on the other side.

[Swordsmyth]

The man behind an online fundraising campaign to build a privately funded barrier along the U.S.-Mexico border says his group has 10 more projects in the pipeline but he declined to provide details about where the sections of wall would be located.
Veteran Brian Kolfage made the announcement during a news conference in Sunland Park, New Mexico, where We Build the Wall Inc. has been installing a concrete and metal barrier on private property.
Contractor Jimmy Fisher said Thursday the section will be just under a half-mile (less than 1 kilometer) long.
Kris Kobach, the group's legal counsel, said We Build the Wall plans to sign an easement allowing Border Patrol agents to patrol the private property without having to hand over ownership of the land to federal officials.


More at: https://news.yahoo.com/latest-group-behind-private-border-wall-more-plans-201408631.html

[specsaregood]

Leave food crumbs and trash everywhere in your house, and tape off every opening you can find. You will still get roaches.

So Mexicans are roaches? Sounds like a great slogan; "Why build a wall? La Cucaracha will get into the US anyways."

[specsaregood]

New Mexico Mayor orders We Build The Wall to stop, says there are no permits and no city approval for the private wall they put up. (https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/new-mexico-mayor-orders-group-building-border-wall-to-stop-construction/ar-AAC4vkm?ocid=spartanntp) Group says all permits are in order and inspection was done. What probably happened is the landowner made it sound like a private fence, and it got approval. Now they realize it was to stop migrants, and they are up in arms.

The city backed down. Admits that permits were issued.
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/new-mexico-town-gives-we-build-the-wall-new-permits-retracts-cease-and-desist-order


New Mexico town gives We Build The Wall new permits, retracts cease and desist order

A nonprofit group can continue building a wall on private land along the U.S.-Mexico border now that a border city rescinded a cease and desist order.
Sunland Park Mayor Javier Perea issued the cease and desist order after city officials found that We Build The Wall did not have the proper permits and had violated city ordinances. Perea announced the reversal in a press conference Thursday.
"There were two permits that were issued on behalf of the city. Those permits were issued prematurely by staff, but we are now in communication with the company and the owner of the property to ensure that if we are going to continue forward with this particular issue, that they need to come into compliance with all city ordinances and regulations, including any state requirements," Perea said.

"There are still some issues with those permits, but being that the staff did release those permits, we have reached out that we will be in communication and that they will have to be coming into compliance with all city ordinances," Perea said.

[Swordsmyth]

The city backed down. Admits that permits were issued.
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/new-mexico-town-gives-we-build-the-wall-new-permits-retracts-cease-and-desist-order

:D

[PAF]

The “communist invaders” will come regardless of whether there is a private wall or a government wall.

You have to remove the communist policies first. Nobody is talking about the free healthcare and education and other welfare programs that do not discriminate based on immigration status.

“Build that wall... MAGA” is the stupid repeating the stupid. There is no reason to believe that a wall will stop anyone.

Don’t believe me? Look at prisons. There are walls and chain fences and barbed wires and cameras ever 12 feet. Drugs still get in, escapees get out.

To the unintelligent “do you have a front door” responding people, yes I have a front door, but if someone is going to break in, they will find a way in. It’s purpose isn’t to stop people from coming in, it just slows them down. But you better believe if someone wants in, they will find a way in.

I take offense at the notion that the wall is to prevent “communist invaders” anyways. The commies are already running the government. They are running the biggest businesses and pulling strings everywhere. They are running city councils.

Why don’t we worry about the communist US residents first? If you are worried about them why wouldn’t you start by building a wall around California to keep them all in there?

What about the socialist invaders? When are we building a wall to keep those shivering frenchy Canadians out of our country? Is it even “our” country anyways? This country historically has been a shining beacon of freedom and opportunity to the world. Why can’t we just return to being a country ruled by constitutional law and not a welfare state that drains the middle class of its wealth to grow the divide between the obscenely wealthy and the poor? With a booming economy, we should all want migrants flocking to the country to try their own hands at prosperity and freedom.

I don’t dream of a prison state. I think people are greatly confused about what a “wall” really means. There is so much more we can be focused on to fix the problems associated with people crossing the borders illegally.

Everyone seems to just want to forget logic and jump straight to some fantasyland solution. Why not use those little peckerheads and think for a freaking second. Step one: Why are they coming? Not because they want to vote for communist policies, but because we already have what they are coming for. Step 2. Quit dangling from trumps dong long enough to think for yourself about what step 3 is.


+ Rep outstanding post.


The shills have no clue what the unintended consequences will be until it is too late. Or, maybe they do know, which is why they keep trying to shove statist garbage down our throats.

SwordShill, didn’t you just tell me in another thread that government will never downsize itself, but instead only grows? Haven’t you figured out yet why they want that stupid wall? Or are you going to try to brainwash me that the wall is an exception.

[Swordsmyth]

SwordShill, didn’t you just tell me in another thread that government will never downsize itself, but instead only grows? Haven’t you figured out yet why they want that stupid wall? Or are you going to try to brainwash me that the wall is an exception.
They don't want the wall or we would have it already.
And we can reduce the size of government IF we stop the importation of communists.

[PAF]

They don't want the wall or we would have it already.
And we can reduce the size of government IF we stop the importation of communists.

Nope. They will be funneled, processed, made legal, and either draw more welfare or help Fund the Fed.

Which company do you plan to report first if/when they hire a hard working illegal under the table that Section 8 folks don’t want?

[Swordsmyth]

Nope. They will be funneled, processed, made legal, and either draw more welfare or help Fund the Fed.
No, they will be stopped and those already here will be deported.

[PAF]

No, they will be stopped and those already here will be deported.

Read post 37 again. This time, engage your brain.

It is bad enough that you are an anti-liberty shill. At least move up the ranks a little to “republican” status to improve your Freedom Score to, let’s say, 25, if that’s doable?

[Swordsmyth]

Read post 37 again. This time, engage your brain.
Read post #38 again and try using your brain for the first time ever:


A wall or patrols will not be 100% effective, they don't have to be.

We do have too many communists here already, that is why we have to do everything we can to keep them from importing enough reinforcements to destroy any chance we have of restoring liberty.

If I could split California off from the union and keep them from coming in I would and I want troops patrolling the northern border too.

It IS OUR COUNTRY, our ancestors built it and left it to us as their gift to us and we have a responsibility to them and to our descendants to keep it from being destroyed. (particularly at the hands of foreigners)

We can't return to being a country ruled by constitutional law and not a welfare state that drains the middle class of its wealth to grow the divide between the obscenely wealthy and the poor if we allow our native communists to import unlimited reinforcements.

If we ever do restore liberty and a booming economy we can share it with some immigrants but we will have a responsibility to limit their numbers and the cultures we allow them from to preserve liberty and a booming economy.

They are coming for our economy that is much better than theirs and if we didn't have a welfare state they would vote for one, that is what previous waves of immigrants did.
And in any case they come here and vote to keep and expand the welfare state and if we allow them too we will never be able to eliminate it.





It is bad enough that you are an anti-liberty shill. At least move up the ranks a little to “republican” status to improve your Freedom Score to, let’s say, 25, if that’s doable?


:sleeping:

Your insults are proof that you are losing the agrument.

[PAF]

Swordsmyth

End prohibition. Check

End the War on Drugs. Working on.

End the War on Immigration. Not even mentioned.

When government gets the hell out of affairs, things run much better. Fact.

[Swordsmyth]

@Swordsmyth (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/member.php?u=65299)

End prohibition. Check

End the War on Drugs. Working on.

End the War on Immigration. Not even mentioned.

When government gets the hell out of affairs, things run much better. Fact.
The only way to keep the government out of our affairs is to keep people who want to put its nose deep in them out.

[PAF]

The only way to keep the government out of our affairs is to keep people who want to put its nose deep in them out.

Corporatists, lobbyists, mic, no-bid contracts, central banks............

The wall and increased “security” tactics are diversionary to keep your eye off the ball.

[Swordsmyth]

Corporatists, lobbyists, mic, no-bid contracts, central banks............
All of those want wide open borders to ensure they retain power.


The wall and increased “security” tactics are diversionary to keep your eye off the ball.
LOL

No, if it was we would already have a wall just like they imposed TSA on us, they desperately want to import enough communists to ensure a one party dictatorship and they are frantic that Trump is actually doing things to stop them.

[Swordsmyth]

The man behind an online fundraising campaign to build a privately funded barrier along the U.S.-Mexico border says his group has 10 more projects in the pipeline but he declined to provide details about where the sections of wall would be located.
Veteran Brian Kolfage made the announcement during a news conference in Sunland Park, New Mexico, where We Build the Wall Inc. has been installing a concrete and metal barrier on private property.
Contractor Jimmy Fisher said Thursday the section will be just under a half-mile (less than 1 kilometer) long.
Kris Kobach, the group's legal counsel, said We Build the Wall plans to sign an easement allowing Border Patrol agents to patrol the private property without having to hand over ownership of the land to federal officials.


More at: https://news.yahoo.com/latest-group-behind-private-border-wall-more-plans-201408631.html

So much for the trolls who said it was all a scam.

[asurfaholic]

So Mexicans are roaches? Sounds like a great slogan; "Why build a wall? La Cucaracha will get into the US anyways."

Ah come on. Not that I expect anyone to have any recollection of prior posts by me, but I always speak highly of Mexican people. As a whole I find them a very honorable group of people. They are usually very real; honest and authentic. They care about their families and are willing to work very hard to put food on their table. They are also generally very respectful of authority. As a matter of fact my company as of right now, my business only has Mexicans for employees. Not by some sick choice, but these are the only people willing to work hard all day long without bitching about this and that. All they want is to be treat with respect, and given plenty of hours to work. Both of which I have an abundance of.

[Superfluous Man]

No, they will be stopped and those already here will be deported.

How does one go about determining if someone already here ought to be deported?

[PAF]

How does one go about determining if someone already here ought to be deported?

I have refrained from saying this, until now, but it appears that Shill seems to be eluding to and advocates "ethnic cleansing", IMO.

[TheTexan]

How does one go about determining if someone already here ought to be deported?

Easy, just quiz them on the Constitution. If they can't explain what the 4th amendment is, then their person should be searched for evidence that they're not American.

[Superfluous Man]

Easy, just quiz them on the Constitution. If they can't explain what the 4th amendment is, then their person should be searched for evidence that they're not American.

You're making it too easy on them. The burden of proof should be on them to produce papers demonstrating they are American. Absent such proof, the presumption must be that they are not and shall be deported to...who really cares where.

[PAF]

Easy, just quiz them on the Constitution. If they can't explain what the 4th amendment is, then their person should be searched for evidence that they're not American.

Which means 98% of the U.S. citizens in America, are not Americans at all LOL

[TheTexan]

Which means 98% of the U.S. citizens in America, are not Americans at all LOL

Yes, and 98% of the people living here should be deported.

A real American can trace his family heritage back to the Mayflower.

[specsaregood]

Ah come on. Not that I expect anyone to have any recollection of prior posts by me, but I always speak highly of Mexican people. As a whole I find them a very honorable group of people. They are usually very real; honest and authentic. They care about their families and are willing to work very hard to put food on their table. They are also generally very respectful of authority. As a matter of fact my company as of right now, my business only has Mexicans for employees. Not by some sick choice, but these are the only people willing to work hard all day long without bitching about this and that. All they want is to be treat with respect, and given plenty of hours to work. Both of which I have an abundance of.

Hey, I'm not the one that compared the border and immigrants to cockroaches getting into your house. Just saying...

[PAF]

Yes, and 98% of the people living here should be deported.

A real American can trace his family heritage back to the Mayflower.

As for the native American "Indians" who can't trace their heritage back to the Mayflower... ship them to India.

[TheTexan]

As for the native American "Indians" who can't trace their heritage back to the Mayflower... ship them to India.

Deport them back to Russia where they came from

[asurfaholic]

Hey, I'm not the one that compared the border and immigrants to cockroaches getting into your house. Just saying...

That’s a fair point, I got nothing

[UWDude]

Ah come on. Not that I expect anyone to have any recollection of prior posts by me, but I always speak highly of Mexican people. As a whole I find them a very honorable group of people. They are usually very real; honest and authentic. They care about their families and are willing to work very hard to put food on their table. They are also generally very respectful of authority. As a matter of fact my company as of right now, my business only has Mexicans for employees. Not by some sick choice, but these are the only people willing to work hard all day long without bitching about this and that. All they want is to be treat with respect, and given plenty of hours to work. Both of which I have an abundance of.

mexicans make the best slaves. they dont get uppity, or demand more money for their hard work, like black people and white people. Also, comparing them to roaches was not racist... ..but seriously, blacks make the worst slaves.


Sounds like your company could use a good dose of diversity.

[Zippyjuan]

https://www.cnn.com/2019/05/31/politics/fisher-sand-and-gravel-legal-history-border-wall/index.html


Company touted by Trump to build the wall has history of fines, violations


President Donald Trump appears to have set his sights on a North Dakota construction firm with a checkered legal record to build portions of his signature border wall.

The family-owned company, Fisher Sand & Gravel, claims it can build the wall cheaper and faster than competitors. It was among a handful of construction firms chosen to build prototypes of the President's border wall in 2017 and is currently constructing portions of barrier on private land along the border in New Mexico using private donations.

It also, however, has a history of red flags including more than $1 million in fines for environmental and tax violations. A decade ago, a former co-owner of the company pleaded guilty to tax fraud, and was sentenced to prison. The company also admitted to defrauding the federal government by impeding the IRS. The former executive, who's a brother of the current company owner, is no longer associated with it.

More than two years into his presidency, Trump is still fighting to build and pay for his border wall, a key campaign issue. After failing to get his requests for wall funding passed by a Republican-held Congress during his first two years in office, Trump has met resistance this year from a Democratic-controlled House. His attempt to circumvent Congress through a national emergency declaration has been challenged in the courts.

On May 24, a federal district judge blocked the administration from using Defense Department funds to construct parts of the wall. The Trump administration has since appealed the block to the 9th US Circuit Court of Appeals and in the interim, asked the district court to allow building to continue pending appeal. The district court denied the administration's request.

Despite the uncertainty, construction firms have been competing to win multimillion-dollar contracts to build portions of wall, including Fisher Sand & Gravel.

Asked by CNN to comment on the company's history of environmental violations and legal issues, the company said in a statement: "The questions you are asking have nothing to do with the excellent product and work that Fisher is proposing with regard to protecting America's southern border. The issues and situations in your email were resolved years ago. None of those matters are outstanding today."

Catching the President's attention

The company was founded in North Dakota in 1952 and operates in several states across the US. It's enjoyed public support from North Dakota Republican Sen. Kevin Cramer, who as a congressman invited the company's CEO, Tommy Fisher, to Trump's State of the Union address in 2018. Cramer has received campaign contributions from Fisher and his wife. A photo of the event shared by Fisher in a company newsletter shows Tommy Fisher shaking Trump's hand.

The Washington Post first reported the President's interest in Fisher. According to the Post, the President has "aggressively" pushed for the Army Corps of Engineers to award a wall contract to Fisher.

The President "immediately brought up Fisher" during a May 23 meeting in the Oval Office to discuss details of the border wall with various government officials, including that he wants it to be painted black and include French-style doors, according to the Post and confirmed by CNN.

"The Army Corps of Engineers says about 450 miles of wall will be completed by the end of next year, and the only thing President Trump is pushing, is for the wall to be finished quickly so the American people have the safety and security they deserve," said Hogan Gidley, White House deputy press secretary.

A US government official familiar with the meeting tells CNN that the President has repeatedly mentioned the company in discussions he's had about the wall with the head of the Army Corps of Engineers, Lt. Gen. Todd Semonite.

Fisher has recently made efforts to raise its public profile, both by upping its lobbying efforts and through repeated appearances on conservative media by its CEO, Tommy Fisher.

In the past two years, for example, the company's congressional lobbying expenditures jumped significantly -- from $5,000 in 2017 to $75,000 in 2018, according to data compiled by the Center for Responsive Politics, a non-profit that tracks lobbying expenditures.

When asked about Fisher Sand & Gravel's lobbying, Don Larson, one of Fisher's registered lobbyists, said: "I am working to help decision makers in Washington become familiar with the company and its outstanding capabilities."


More at link.

[phill4paul]

https://www.cnn.com/2019/05/31/politics/fisher-sand-and-gravel-legal-history-border-wall/index.html



More at link.

Impeding the IRS and the EPA. That's fine in my book.

[specsaregood]

https://www.cnn.com/2019/05/31/politics/fisher-sand-and-gravel-legal-history-border-wall/index.html
More at link.

An enemy of the IRS and EPA? Sounds like my sorta people! Maybe I'll divert all my donations from politicians to this "we build the wall" group for the next cycle.

[Zippyjuan]

We should hire more companies which steal money from taxpayers. Grow that government!

[asurfaholic]

mexicans make the best slaves. they dont get uppity, or demand more money for their hard work, like black people and white people. Also, comparing them to roaches was not racist... ..but seriously, blacks make the worst slaves.


Sounds like your company could use a good dose of diversity.

Saying this as a white guy,

When I was all white employees we were bloated, over paying, under performing. I couldn’t get anyone to do the stupid stuff like wash the trucks, clean the insides of the trucks, organize scrap wire. It was like pulling teeth to get someone to crawl under a house. They all demanded raises and refused to work OT or weekends when things got super busy.

Performance was stagnant, and I was unsatisfied- I fired a lead guy and replaced him with a Mexican (legal) I trained at my previous place of employment. Things picked up pace and one helper guy left, then another I fired drugs while on the clock. Asked my guy if he knew anyone who might me interested in work. I put out some employment ads and interviewed about 15 people. The only ones who passed sniff test were the people I have working for me now and we are killing it. Company, myself and 3 others- we average $45k sales a month. Part of it is my excellent leadership :) and the other part is a group of dedicated, motivated, and highly energetic employees.

These slaves are paid very well and treated with dignity.

[Ender]

Ah come on. Not that I expect anyone to have any recollection of prior posts by me, but I always speak highly of Mexican people. As a whole I find them a very honorable group of people. They are usually very real; honest and authentic. They care about their families and are willing to work very hard to put food on their table. They are also generally very respectful of authority. As a matter of fact my company as of right now, my business only has Mexicans for employees. Not by some sick choice, but these are the only people willing to work hard all day long without bitching about this and that. All they want is to be treat with respect, and given plenty of hours to work. Both of which I have an abundance of.

Exactly my experience. I've always found Mexicans to be the hardest workers on the planet- and cool to be around.

[phill4paul]

Exactly my experience. I've always found Mexicans to be the hardest workers on the planet- and cool to be around.

And, yet, they work for less wage, bringing down the average wage for American citizen workers while receiving welfare. I've seen whole trades destroyed by illegal trespassers. Drywall is one of those. In an area I worked a first generation, DACA, took advantage of his heritage, his language skills, his welfare (free education, parents in Section 8 because they were his legal guardians, Food, etc.) and destroyed the livelihoods of 40 American workers and their families. By being able to underbid on every job by using illegal labor.

[Zippyjuan]

And, yet, they work for less wage, bringing down the average wage for American citizen workers while receiving welfare. I've seen whole trades destroyed by illegal trespassers. Drywall is one of those. In an area I worked a first generation, DACA, took advantage of his heritage, his language skills, his welfare (free education, parents in Section 8 because they were his legal guardians, Food, etc.) and destroyed the livelihoods of 40 American workers and their families. By being able to underbid on every job by using illegal labor.

One guy replaced 40 workers? Must have been amazing guy! I thought they were all lazy?


By being able to underbid on every job by using illegal labor.

Maybe the government should ban people from charging less than somebody else. Determine wages and such to protect high paying jobs instead of letting the market decide.

[phill4paul]

One guy replaced 40 workers? Must have been amazing guy! I thought they were all lazy?

You're such a dipshit. No, 40 illegals replaced 40 citizens. Under his company. This was at a resort with million, sometimes multi-million dollar homes. Local drywallers were making average about $16/hr. (late nineties). He cut that labor charge in half (if not less). Within two years his company took over 60% of business. Within 4 yrs. he was the top drywaller on the mountain. None of the workers "spoke many English." None were green card workers. And so, 40 American families found themselves out of a breadwinner. Open borders and globalism is great! Those millionaires you bitch about got out for a lot less on construction.

[Zippyjuan]

You're such a dip$#@!. No, 40 illegals replaced 40 citizens. Under his company. This was at a resort with million, sometimes multi-million dollar homes. Local drywallers were making average about $16/hr. (late nineties). He cut that labor charge in half (if not less). Within two years his company took over 60% of business. Within 4 yrs. he was the top drywaller on the mountain. None of the workers "spoke many English." None were green card workers. And so, 40 American families found themselves out of a breadwinner. Open borders and globalism is great!

So he started his own company (good for him!) and underbid the competition. Smart man!


Within two years his company took over 60% of business. Within 4 yrs. he was the top drywaller on the mountain.

Must have done a really good job. If he did a crappy one, others would not hire him.

Should you be protected from somebody trying to under-bid you? Is that a role for the government?

"Please protect me, Mr Trump! I can't compete in the world!" No wonder some people think America is weak. They fear competition. Facing competition makes you better.

[phill4paul]

So he started his own company (good for him!) and underbid the competition. Smart man!



Must have done a really good job. If he did a crappy one, others would not hire him.

Should you be protected from somebody trying to under-bid you? Is that a role for the government?

"Please protect me, Mr Trump! I can't compete in the world!" No wonder some people think America is weak. They fear competition. Facing competition makes you better.

You just don't get this. Do you?

Sure. He took advantage of the system. And also the workers. The same way you bemoan mega-corporations, but on a smaller level. He paid his workers dirt. Put them up 10, or more, people in three bedroom apartments. And deducted from their wages these costs. Sweat shop labor, Zip. I know al about it because he bragged on it after a few tequilas. Aren't you all about workers rights Zip? Or just about cheap labor for millionaires?

[Zippyjuan]

. I know al about it because he bragged on it after a few tequilas.

So you were drinking buddies? Or just making this up?

[Swordsmyth]

I have refrained from saying this, until now, but it appears that Shill seems to be eluding to and advocates "ethnic cleansing", IMO.
That is a lie, I have always made it very clear that it isn't about race/ethnicity/whatever.

[Swordsmyth]

Illegal Migrants Come Here as Ready-made Democrats — Here’s Why (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?533542-Illegal-Migrants-Come-Here-as-Ready-made-Democrats-—-Here’s-Why)

[Zippyjuan]

Illegal Migrants Come Here as Ready-made Democrats — Here’s Why (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?533542-Illegal-Migrants-Come-Here-as-Ready-made-Democrats-—-Here’s-Why)

Can't come up with anything original?

[Swordsmyth]

Can't come up with anything original?
You can't come up with an argument?

This is the #1 reason why immigration MUST be controlled so I don't need anything else.

You want to turn America into a single party communist dictatorship like Kalifornia and we are going to stop you.

[Zippyjuan]

You can't come up with an argument?

This is the #1 reason why immigration MUST be controlled so I don't need anything else.

You want to turn America into a single party communist dictatorship like Kalifornia and we are going to stop you.

Again with the guidebook cliches. You need some new material.

[Swordsmyth]

Again with the guidebook cliches. You need some new material.
That is just pathetic, you need to get new arguments from your masters.

Truth is eternal.

[nikcers]

So he started his own company (good for him!) and underbid the competition. Smart man!



Must have done a really good job. If he did a crappy one, others would not hire him.

Should you be protected from somebody trying to under-bid you? Is that a role for the government?

"Please protect me, Mr Trump! I can't compete in the world!" No wonder some people think America is weak. They fear competition. Facing competition makes you better.

Obviously in your opinion its the governments job to bring people into the country to work for less money than I will.

[Zippyjuan]

Obviously in your opinion its the governments job to bring people into the country to work for less money than I will.

Nah- the government's job is not to bring in people. The government should let people hire whomever they want to as long as the worker is willing to accept the pay -whether they are from Kansas, Canada, or India or wherever. Market should decide.

[nikcers]

Nah- the government's job is not to bring in people. The government should let people hire whomever they want to as long as the worker is willing to accept the pay -whether they are from Kansas, Canada, or India or wherever. Market should decide.

700 million people can come in and work for 50 cents an hour and thats okay with you?

[Zippyjuan]

700 million people can come in and work for 50 cents an hour and thats okay with you?

Do 700 million want to? Are there 700 million job openings for them here?

Should the government protect you? Should there be a minimum wage?

[Swordsmyth]

700 million people can come in and work for 50 cents an hour and thats okay with you?
Sure it is, his bosses will make billions and the American middle class will be averaged down to the level of poverty typical of the 3rd world.
Since money is power they will gain absolute control of the country and millions more Americans will become dependent on government for their needs, we will have a communist dictatorship almost overnight when you add all of the imported communists to the voter rolls.

[Zippyjuan]

Sure it is, his bosses will make billions and the American middle class will be averaged down to the level of poverty typical of the 3rd world.
Since money is power they will gain absolute control of the country and millions more Americans will become dependent on government for their needs, we will have a communist dictatorship almost overnight when you add all of the imported communists to the voter rolls.

More scary cliches.

[Swordsmyth]

More scary cliches.
LOL

This new tactic is Hillaryous.

[nikcers]

Do 700 million want to? Are there 700 million job openings for them here?

Should the government protect you? Should there be a minimum wage?


The survey, conducted by Gallup over 135 countries between 2007 and 2009, found that nearly 16 percent of the world’s adult population would like to move to another country permanently, if given the opportunity. Sixteen percent of the world’s adult population amounts to 700 million people

Should there be a government if they aren't going to protect me or have any borders?

[Zippyjuan]

Should there be a government if they aren't going to protect me or have any borders?

We have borders. And they are not "open". Some are trying to scare people into wanting more government control.

[Swordsmyth]

We have borders. And they are not "open".
LOL


Millions of people pouring in is not open?

It's one of the few legitimate functions of government to protect us from foreign invaders who will impose tyranny on us.

[Zippyjuan]

LOL


Millions of people pouring in is not open?

It's one of the few legitimate functions of government to protect us from foreign invaders who will impose tyranny on us.

More cliches.

[Swordsmyth]

More cliches.
LOL

I love it when you repeat that garbage, it might as well be an admission that you lost the argument.

[nikcers]

We have borders. And they are not "open". Some are trying to scare people into wanting more government control.

The government is letting anyone in though, they are keeping the border effectively open

[Zippyjuan]

The government is letting anyone in though, they are keeping the border effectively open

So Trump is failing?

https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/624/cpsprodpb/111D1/production/_107179007_monthly_border_apps640-nc.png

[nikcers]

So Trump is failing?

https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/624/cpsprodpb/111D1/production/_107179007_monthly_border_apps640-nc.png

The government is failing obviously if they have let 10s of millions in, effectively replacing the population with people who work for less money, effectively taking food out of peoples mouths

[Zippyjuan]

The government is failing obviously if they have let 10s of millions in, effectively replacing the population with people who work for less money, effectively taking food out of peoples mouths

Have you met your new replacement yet?

[Swordsmyth]

So Trump is failing?

https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/624/cpsprodpb/111D1/production/_107179007_monthly_border_apps640-nc.png
Congress and the courts are failing, that is why Trump has had to resort to emergency measures.

[Zippyjuan]

Congress and the courts are failing, that is why Trump has had to resort to emergency measures.

Which until the midterms were all run by Republicans with Trump at the top and they did nothing. Republican failure.

[Swordsmyth]

Which until the midterms were all run by Republicans with Trump at the top and they did nothing. Republican failure.
RINOs are Demoncrats in Republican clothing and they did fail their duty to the country just like ALL the Demoncrats.

And the courts have been dominated by Demoncrat extremists and they are also betraying their duty.

[asurfaholic]

Which until the midterms were all run by Republicans with Trump at the top and they did nothing. Republican failure.

I agree with this.

This is why I am shocked that there are still some here who are arguing republican vs Democrat. Left vs right.

I thought that liberty stood over all that nonsense? Why can’t we just agree that it’s not left vs right. One side isn’t ANY better than the other, because at the heart of the matter is simply a matter of IN vs OUT. The ones with the mega millions are the ones who influence every single decision. They are the reason why we can’t have nice things. When will people stop looking at trump like he is some kind of republican savior? He’s not. Never will be. You can count on all your thumbs how many true liberty advocates there are in Congress. That’s enough to make me realize that liberty is doomed. The debt is skyrocketing, as it does every single second no matter who is in charge. The wars go on, no matter who is in charge. Building a wall fixes nothing. Soon the whole country will be a social experiment gone wrong that the next 1000 years nobody will learn from because history is doomed to repeat itself over and over and over until something breaks the cycle.

What breaks the cycle? There’s a book out there that explains exactly what will happen. I believe it.

[Swordsmyth]

I agree with this.

This is why I am shocked that there are still some here who are arguing republican vs Democrat. Left vs right.

I thought that liberty stood over all that nonsense? Why can’t we just agree that it’s not left vs right. One side isn’t ANY better than the other, because at the heart of the matter is simply a matter of IN vs OUT. The ones with the mega millions are the ones who influence every single decision. They are the reason why we can’t have nice things. When will people stop looking at trump like he is some kind of republican savior? He’s not. Never will be. You can count on all your thumbs how many true liberty advocates there are in Congress. That’s enough to make me realize that liberty is doomed. The debt is skyrocketing, as it does every single second no matter who is in charge. The wars go on, no matter who is in charge. Building a wall fixes nothing. Soon the whole country will be a social experiment gone wrong that the next 1000 years nobody will learn from because history is doomed to repeat itself over and over and over until something breaks the cycle.

What breaks the cycle? There’s a book out there that explains exactly what will happen. I believe it.
The Republicans have a much better average voting record and there are ZERO good Demoncrats, you can give up or you can work with the best people you can find and try to educate them.

Allowing the invasion to continue will ensure communist rule and the total eradication of liberty for centuries.

[Zippyjuan]

The Republicans have a much better average voting record and there are ZERO good Demoncrats, you can give up or you can work with the best people you can find and try to educate them.

Allowing the invasion to continue will ensure communist rule and the total eradication of liberty for centuries.

More cliches.

[Swordsmyth]

More cliches.
Many a truth is.

[asurfaholic]

The Republicans have a much better average voting record and there are ZERO good Demoncrats, you can give up or you can work with the best people you can find and try to educate them.

Allowing the invasion to continue will ensure communist rule and the total eradication of liberty for centuries.

I’ve already said my piece on this fabricated “invasion.” The “invaders” are not going to stop coming until we fix our policy that attracts them. There’s no movement to address this.

Work with the best? Lol.

I’ll support Rand Paul and anyone who remotely resembles him. But whatever brushfires of liberty that the Ron Paul movement ignited are rapidly being drenched with that “swamp” that was supposed to be drained. Which apparently was just some cute slogan to get numb nuts to think trump was actually anti establishment. I never believed it. And I certainly don’t believe there is any sort of an “invasion” happening now that is any more significant than the last 100 years of legal and illegal immigration.

[Swordsmyth]

I’ve already said my piece on this fabricated “invasion.” The “invaders” are not going to stop coming until we fix our policy that attracts them. There’s no movement to address this.

Yes there is:



Migrants are forgoing welfare benefits out of fear of Trump’s proposed Visa rules (https://www.newsweek.com/trump-immigration-green-cards-welfare-1433132)

New HUD rule prevents illegals from getting public housing assistance (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?533571-New-HUD-rule-prevents-illegals-from-getting-public-housing-assistance)

Infuriating Democrats, Trump Plans To Redefine Poverty, Cutting Americans From Welfare (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?534256-Infuriating-Democrats-Trump-Plans-To-Redefine-Poverty-Cutting-Americans-From-Welfare)




Work with the best? Lol.

I’ll support Rand Paul and anyone who remotely resembles him. But whatever brushfires of liberty that the Ron Paul movement ignited are rapidly being drenched with that “swamp” that was supposed to be drained. Which apparently was just some cute slogan to get numb nuts to think trump was actually anti establishment. I never believed it. And I certainly don’t believe there is any sort of an “invasion” happening now that is any more significant than the last 100 years of legal and illegal immigration.
Will you work with the people Rand works with?

If you won't work with enough of the best people available to get things done you will fail.

[Swordsmyth]

Brian Kolfage, the veteran who started the viral We Build The Wall organization, revealed that cartel gunmen approached border wall construction crews brandishing rifles last night, seeking to intimidate them and prevent them from continuing the border wall construction.
Kolfage, the triple-amputee Air Force veteran and Purple Heart recipient who started the viral We Build The Wall campaign on GoFundMe, posted a tweet earlier today revealing that “15 armed cartel members with rifles dressed in camo approached our border wall last night intimidating construction crews”, and suggested his organization’s security was able to thwart the intimidation attempt.

BREAKING: 15 armed cartel members with rifles dressed in camo approached our border wall last night intimidating construction crews. @gatewaypundit (https://twitter.com/gatewaypundit?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) @OANN (https://twitter.com/OANN?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) @DonaldJTrumpJr (https://twitter.com/DonaldJTrumpJr?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) @RyanAFournier (https://twitter.com/RyanAFournier?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) @DRUDGE (https://twitter.com/DRUDGE?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) @gehrig38 (https://twitter.com/gehrig38?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) @WSJ (https://twitter.com/WSJ?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) @TrumpStudents (https://twitter.com/TrumpStudents?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) @CBSNews (https://twitter.com/CBSNews?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) @ABC (https://twitter.com/ABC?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) @LouDobbs (https://twitter.com/LouDobbs?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) @FoxNews (https://twitter.com/FoxNews?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) @realDonaldTrump (https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw)
— Brian Kolfage (@BrianKolfage) May 31, 2019 (https://twitter.com/BrianKolfage/status/1134491102529146880?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw)




More at: https://bigleaguepolitics.com/insane-cartel-gunmen-reportedly-brandish-rifles-intimidate-border-wall-construction-crew/

[tfurrh]

First-ever private border wall built in New Mexico


https://memegenerator.net/img/instances/23951116/you-didnt-build-that.jpg

[nikcers]

Have you met your new replacement yet?

Millions of homeless Americans beg for money from their replacements every single day. Its not selfish to think that Americans should have a priority over illegal immigrants.

[juleswin]

I’ve already said my piece on this fabricated “invasion.” The “invaders” are not going to stop coming until we fix our policy that attracts them. There’s no movement to address this.

Work with the best? Lol.

I’ll support Rand Paul and anyone who remotely resembles him. But whatever brushfires of liberty that the Ron Paul movement ignited are rapidly being drenched with that “swamp” that was supposed to be drained. Which apparently was just some cute slogan to get numb nuts to think trump was actually anti establishment. I never believed it. And I certainly don’t believe there is any sort of an “invasion” happening now that is any more significant than the last 100 years of legal and illegal immigration.

Remove every single welfare in this country and just as many people will still come over the border. The idea that people are coming for welfare is just wrong, the welfare is the cherry on top but people do eat ice cream all the time without cherries anywhere to be found.

I see 3 ways to reduce immigration. The bes of them is to stop destabilizing latin American countries, stop with the regime change wars, the sanctioning, the strong armining of leaders and the propping up of strong men who oppress their people. Essentially, we need to pull the CIA back from the region. More stability will mean less people trying to leave their homes. The other two options is to tank the economy so bad that immigrant see no economic benefit coming over and to build a big wall along the southern border.

[tod evans]

Remove every single welfare in this country and just as many people will still come over the border. .

Oh bullshit!

[asurfaholic]

Remove every single welfare in this country and just as many people will still come over the border. The idea that people are coming for welfare is just wrong, the welfare is the cherry on top but people do eat ice cream all the time without cherries anywhere to be found.

I see 3 ways to reduce immigration. The bes of them is to stop destabilizing latin American countries, stop with the regime change wars, the sanctioning, the strong armining of leaders and the propping up of strong men who oppress their people. Essentially, we need to pull the CIA back from the region. More stability will mean less people trying to leave their homes. The other two options is to tank the economy so bad that immigrant see no economic benefit coming over and to build a big wall along the southern border.

I agree that welfare may not be the REASON they pack their stuff and head over, but it is largely the biggest problem associated with them coming, because it is driving up the debt and creates dependency once they are here.

I’d also point out that they are probably not coming here explicitly to change the US into a communist state as some posters seem intent on.

If there is no welfare or handouts, it would be hard to compile a list of ways that their immigration actually effects your pocketbook or mine. Probably the biggest issue would be like what Phil brings up, a legitimate concern, they could be driving down labor costs in trades that previously used to provide decent wages to professionals such as himself. But at least the burden wouldn’t be resting on taxpayers to provide healthcare and education and other living benefits to these people and their families.

A couple suggestions I’d propose if anyone cared- end giving citizenship rights to people just for being born here. If both parents are not US citizens, their offspring are not either.

If we must have policies in place to not turn away people for healthcare if they cannot afford it, find a way to pass the expense of providing a poor immigrant’s healthcare bill back to the country of origin, or garnish future wages. Difficult to navigate topic here, I know. I do not support the idea that healthcare should be provided free for illegal immigrants. They came here to work, let their money pay for their costs.

I know many “illegals.” They overstay their visa, but set down roots and have a kid in school, get comfortable just working and sending money out of the country. There is no incentive to leave once their allowed term is up. The policies should prevent them from being able to set down roots as a non citizen.

Unfortunately that’s not the case.

A wall stops 0% of those problems.

[nikcers]

The biggest reason they come here is their government is more corrupt than ours is. Are you libertarians calling for regime change to solve the root of the problem? I know some Mexican immigrants that have told me that they would love regime change in Mexico.

[Danke]

Brian Kolfage, the veteran who started the viral We Build The Wall organization, revealed that cartel gunmen approached border wall construction crews brandishing rifles last night, seeking to intimidate them and prevent them from continuing the border wall construction.
Kolfage, the triple-amputee Air Force veteran and Purple Heart recipient who started the viral We Build The Wall campaign on GoFundMe, posted a tweet earlier today revealing that “15 armed cartel members with rifles dressed in camo approached our border wall last night intimidating construction crews”, and suggested his organization’s security was able to thwart the intimidation attempt.
BREAKING: 15 armed cartel members with rifles dressed in camo approached our border wall last night intimidating construction crews. @gatewaypundit (https://twitter.com/gatewaypundit?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) @OANN (https://twitter.com/OANN?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) @DonaldJTrumpJr (https://twitter.com/DonaldJTrumpJr?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) @RyanAFournier (https://twitter.com/RyanAFournier?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) @DRUDGE (https://twitter.com/DRUDGE?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) @gehrig38 (https://twitter.com/gehrig38?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) @WSJ (https://twitter.com/WSJ?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) @TrumpStudents (https://twitter.com/TrumpStudents?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) @CBSNews (https://twitter.com/CBSNews?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) @ABC (https://twitter.com/ABC?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) @LouDobbs (https://twitter.com/LouDobbs?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) @FoxNews (https://twitter.com/FoxNews?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) @realDonaldTrump (https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw)
— Brian Kolfage (@BrianKolfage) May 31, 2019 (https://twitter.com/BrianKolfage/status/1134491102529146880?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw)




More at: https://bigleaguepolitics.com/insane-cartel-gunmen-reportedly-brandish-rifles-intimidate-border-wall-construction-crew/

What are they worried about, “the wall won’t stop anyone from entering.”

[juleswin]

I agree that welfare may not be the REASON they pack their stuff and head over, but it is largely the biggest problem associated with them coming, because it is driving up the debt and creates dependency once they are here.

I’d also point out that they are probably not coming here explicitly to change the US into a communist state as some posters seem intent on.

If there is no welfare or handouts, it would be hard to compile a list of ways that their immigration actually effects your pocketbook or mine. Probably the biggest issue would be like what Phil brings up, a legitimate concern, they could be driving down labor costs in trades that previously used to provide decent wages to professionals such as himself. But at least the burden wouldn’t be resting on taxpayers to provide healthcare and education and other living benefits to these people and their families.

A couple suggestions I’d propose if anyone cared- end giving citizenship rights to people just for being born here. If both parents are not US citizens, their offspring are not either.

If we must have policies in place to not turn away people for healthcare if they cannot afford it, find a way to pass the expense of providing a poor immigrant’s healthcare bill back to the country of origin, or garnish future wages. Difficult to navigate topic here, I know. I do not support the idea that healthcare should be provided free for illegal immigrants. They came here to work, let their money pay for their costs.

I know many “illegals.” They overstay their visa, but set down roots and have a kid in school, get comfortable just working and sending money out of the country. There is no incentive to leave once their allowed term is up. The policies should prevent them from being able to set down roots as a non citizen.

Unfortunately that’s not the case.

A wall stops 0% of those problems.

I agree mostly with your post but I am going to add a few point to your well thoughtout post. I think ending welfare and birth right citizenship for immigrants(when both parents are foreigners) would do one major thing. It would cause more worker to leave their children behind. If someone realized that they had to pay the huge costs for food, schooling and healthcare to the system, they would keep their children home. But the adult workers will still be coming in the same numbers as before.

Nigerians do the same thing with Saudi Arabia where they have 0 welfare for immigrants. I am talking about 0 benefits, if you are hungry and thirsty, they will let you die of thirst and hunger, if sick and dying, they will let you die on the street. No free school for your kids etc etc but yet people are doing everything to get there. The reason why is that a labourer can make just about the same amount a GP in Nigeria could make. People will stop coming when it stops making economic sense to them. And even without benefits, it still makes sense to do menial labour in the US than Mexico.

For this and many other reasons, no Nigerian stays in Saudi after their contract is up. I am going to disagree with you on one thing and that is the idea that a wall stops nothing, a wall will deter a good many of the people trying to cross over. Mainly women and children who tend to drain from the system more than they contribute.

[juleswin]

Oh bull$#@!!

Shows what you know about the incentives to immigrants. People who live in a poor country without benefits won't be deterred from coming to a rich country just because it doesn't have benefits.

[tod evans]

Shows what you know about the incentives to immigrants. People who live in a poor country without benefits won't be deterred from coming to a rich country just because it doesn't have benefits.

Shows what you know about 'Merkins.........

Take away the freebies and the lazy cocksuckers on the tit will take the low wage jerbs the 'immigrants' come searching for...

This whole economy is one big house of cards and the migrant issue is only rocking the base it's built on harder.

[juleswin]

Shows what you know about 'Merkins.........

Take away the freebies and the lazy $#@!s on the tit will take the low wage jerbs the 'immigrants' come searching for...

This whole economy is one big house of cards and the migrant issue is only rocking the base it's built on harder.

You dont just take away welfare from Americana, riots will break out if you tried that. If that is what u are suggesting then YOU don't know Americans. The reason u don't take away the drink from an alcoholic, you don't try the same with welfare.

[tod evans]

Remove every single welfare in this country and just as many people will still come over the border.


Oh bullshit!


Shows what you know about the incentives to immigrants. People who live in a poor country without benefits won't be deterred from coming to a rich country just because it doesn't have benefits.


Shows what you know about 'Merkins.........

Take away the freebies and the lazy cocksuckers on the tit will take the low wage jerbs the 'immigrants' come searching for...

This whole economy is one big house of cards and the migrant issue is only rocking the base it's built on harder.


You dont just take away welfare from Americana, riots will break out if you tried that. If that is what u are suggesting then YOU don't know Americans. The reason u don't take away the drink from an alcoholic, you don't try the same with welfare.


Remove every single welfare in this country So you didn't actually mean what you typed?

I'm all for cutting the cord(s), all free shit...

The can can only be kicked down the road so many times before it goes in the ditch............Same analogy as a 'house of cards'....

Free shit ain't free if it's your dollars paying for it.

I say start the riots now, today! Let's get this show on the road......

[juleswin]

So you didn't actually mean what you typed?

I'm all for cutting the cord(s), all free $#@!...

The can can only be kicked down the road so many times before it goes in the ditch............Same analogy as a 'house of cards'....

Free $#@! ain't free if it's your dollars paying for it.

I say start the riots now, today! Let's get this show on the road......

I assumed everyone understood that I was talking about removing every welfare for immigrants. Personally I didn't even know anyone was suggesting removing it from citizens. From what I remember, not even Ron Paul is suggesting that.

This is something I have never even considered when discussing this topic. But still, the immigrants would be able to be more competitive than American citizens espcially if they have their family living in their home country. The immigrants will always drive the prices lower than the wage most Americans can raise a family with and for that reason, they will still come.

[UWDude]

Remove every single welfare in this country and just as many people will still come over the border. The idea that people are coming for welfare is just wrong, the welfare is the cherry on top but people do eat ice cream all the time without cherries anywhere to be found.

I see 3 ways to reduce immigration. The bes of them is to stop destabilizing latin American countries, stop with the regime change wars, the sanctioning, the strong armining of leaders and the propping up of strong men who oppress their people. Essentially, we need to pull the CIA back from the region. More stability will mean less people trying to leave their homes. The other two options is to tank the economy so bad that immigrant see no economic benefit coming over and to build a big wall along the southern border.

this is all very true, for latin american immigrants.

especially "the best of them is to stop destabilization"

However, Id guess only about a third of illegal immigrants come from latin America.

The Chinese do not come here fleeing CIA indced destabilization.

[juleswin]

this is all very true, for latin american immigrants.

especially "the best of them is to stop destabilization"

However, Id guess only about a third of illegal immigrants come from latin America.

The Chinese do not come here fleeing CIA indced destabilization.

True, stabilization will only reduced the immigration by so much. The economic benefit of working in this country will always be the biggest draw. We have people from all over coming to the US seeking fortune. The unit I work in, we have a cardiologist from England who still has all his children living in England. I am sure he didn't come here because of CIA destabilization but because he can make a lot more money in the US. Btw, he is a multi millionare which I bet would be much harder to attain as a doctor in England.

I also could have gone to the UK but I chose the US for the same reason.

[Ender]

And, yet, they work for less wage, bringing down the average wage for American citizen workers while receiving welfare. I've seen whole trades destroyed by illegal trespassers. Drywall is one of those. In an area I worked a first generation, DACA, took advantage of his heritage, his language skills, his welfare (free education, parents in Section 8 because they were his legal guardians, Food, etc.) and destroyed the livelihoods of 40 American workers and their families. By being able to underbid on every job by using illegal labor.

Get out of the fuckin' matrix, Bro.

Get rid of incentives- let people hire who they wish & pay what they wish- real capitalism, free trade- & watch everyone's lifestyle improve..

[nikcers]

Get out of the $#@!in' matrix, Bro.

Get rid of incentives- let people hire who they wish & pay what they wish- real capitalism, free trade- & watch everyone's lifestyle improve..

How does that fix their broken governmental system that gives them an incentive to come here? That's what they tell me when I talk to them, they come here because their government is corrupt. The police shot up a school down there and they covered it up.

[nikcers]

Please tell me how we can get rid of this incentive to come here in a non interventionist way?


TIXTLA, Mexico — As the bullets crackled in the air and police bundled students into the backs of police cars, Eusebio ran with all his strength.

Shots were being fired at those trying to escape, but Eusebio was afraid of being taken by the officers, who were accompanied by men in plainclothes with rifles.

“It was terrifying but I just wanted to get away. I had a bad feeling about these police,” says Eusebio, a 19-year-old student at a university for rural schoolteachers in Tixtla, in southern Guerrero state.

That feeling likely saved Eusebio’s life. On Sunday, Guerrero State Prosecutor Iñaky Blanco said alleged drug cartel assassins confessed they’d worked with police to murder detained students late last month. The suspects also led officials from the prosecutor's office to pits where 28 charred bodies were found.

Prosecutors are comparing the DNA of the victims with that of families of 43 students who went missing during the shooting on Sept. 26 in the town of Iguala.

The 19-year-old student described his fight for survival to GlobalPostduring an interview at his university. Eusebio is just a nickname. He asked that his real name not be published because he fears repercussions from what he says is a corrupt web of police and narco traffickers.

His account is supported by state officials who have arrested more than 20 police officers and alleged cartel members in connection with the shooting.

The revelations of such a terrible case of violence and corruption are a major embarrassment for President Enrique Peña Nieto, who has been trying to overhaul Mexico’s image from one of gangster bloodshed to one of reform and investment.

"None of us were armed" (https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/survivor-mexico-student-massacre-it-was-terrifying-n219911)

[enhanced_deficit]

https://www.economist.com/sites/default/files/images/print-edition/20170415_USD000_0.jpg
https://i2-prod.mirror.co.uk/incoming/article11806172.ece/ALTERNATES/s615b/Sky-News-presenters-crack-up-while-reading-Donald-Trumps-tweet.jpg


^ its no wonder why trump can only find swampers to take positions on his staff. Who the fk would want to work for that guy?


Timing probably just coincidence that news of Bannon supported Roy Moore's criticism of MAGA and Bannon's Wall success headlines are surfacing around same time.
There is no proof that Steve Bannon is trolling MAGA with this Wall project to use against him in 2020 as a 'success story' to support ultra-conservative Republicans like Roy Moore against GOP establishment but it's an interesting development.



Quote:
GOP base rockstar whose hardcore right wing influence at Brietbart may have caused some anti-MAGA headlines (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?532247-Tighter-enforcement-along-the-U-S-Mexico-border-backfired-researchers-find&p=6763552&viewfull=1#post6763552) earlier is back in news... for the cause of the Wall funding:


Steve Bannon coming to Cincinnati to rally for a wall along the Mexican border

March 7, 2019

Here's what the nation's busiest Border Patrol sector along the U.S./Mexico border looks like in Texas. Courtney M Sacco, Corpus Christi Caller-Times

Steve Bannon will travel next week to Cincinnati to rally and raise money for a wall on private land along the border with Mexico.

https://www.gannett-cdn.com/presto/2019/02/09/PPHX/d4d25bf6-37ff-4fce-93d6-8e5ad44ae15a-Bannon.jpg?width=540&height=&fit=bounds&auto=webpSteve Bannon (L), former adviser to President Trump, is joined by Brian Kolfage, founder of 'We Build The Wall,' and former Kansas Secretary of State Kris Koback, during a public discussion of border issues in Green Valley Friday night. (Photo: Alexis Egeland)

Bannon, a former chief strategist for President Donald Trump and controversial (https://www.cincinnati.com/story/news/world/2018/12/13/steve-bannon-donald-trump-europe-nationalism-populist-movement/2200098002/) editor of Breitbart.com, will join other conservative celebrities for a town hall downtown on March 12 organized by the non-profit We Build The Wall.
Also appearing at the event in the Hilton Netherland Plaza on Fifth Street will be the cowboy-hatted, pro-Trump former Milwaukee Sheriff David Clarke; former Kansas Secretary of State Kris Kobach and the founder of We Build The Wall, Air Force veteran Brian Kolfage.
We Build The Wall organizers chose Cincinnati as the second stop on the tour despite 1,400 miles separating the Mexican border and Cincinnati. The first rally was held Feb. 8 in Tucson.




Published 8 hours ago

Roy Moore says Trump 'doesn't control who votes': Alabamians are 'smarter than that'

By Sam Dorman | Fox News
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/roy-moore-trump-alabama-election

Related

https://mediadc.brightspotcdn.com/dims4/default/795286e/2147483647/strip/true/crop/2300x1323+0+0/resize/2300x1323!/quality/90/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fmediadc.brightspotcdn.com%2Fbf% 2F47%2F165edc39f8ef36977bc0f204c899%2F74f738067930 c1d2c6514fbe49dfa145.jpg


Bannon at Moore rally: 'Special place in hell for Republicans who should know better'

By Olivia Beavers - 12/11/17
Steve Bannon: "There's a special place in hell for Republicans who" don't support Roy Moore. #alsen (https://twitter.com/hashtag/alsen?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) #alpolitics (https://twitter.com/hashtag/alpolitics?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) pic.twitter.com/p2NnbGSMh5 (https://t.co/p2NnbGSMh5)
— American Bridge (@American_Bridge) December 12, 2017 (https://twitter.com/American_Bridge/status/940396851391590402?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw)

https://thehill.com/homenews/senate/364391-bannon-special-place-in-hell-for-republicans-who-dont-support-trump-moore

[Swordsmyth]

Oh bull$#@!!
Jules is absolutely right about this.

[Swordsmyth]

I agree that welfare may not be the REASON they pack their stuff and head over, but it is largely the biggest problem associated with them coming, because it is driving up the debt and creates dependency once they are here.

I’d also point out that they are probably not coming here explicitly to change the US into a communist state as some posters seem intent on.

If there is no welfare or handouts, it would be hard to compile a list of ways that their immigration actually effects your pocketbook or mine. Probably the biggest issue would be like what Phil brings up, a legitimate concern, they could be driving down labor costs in trades that previously used to provide decent wages to professionals such as himself. But at least the burden wouldn’t be resting on taxpayers to provide healthcare and education and other living benefits to these people and their families.

A couple suggestions I’d propose if anyone cared- end giving citizenship rights to people just for being born here. If both parents are not US citizens, their offspring are not either.

If we must have policies in place to not turn away people for healthcare if they cannot afford it, find a way to pass the expense of providing a poor immigrant’s healthcare bill back to the country of origin, or garnish future wages. Difficult to navigate topic here, I know. I do not support the idea that healthcare should be provided free for illegal immigrants. They came here to work, let their money pay for their costs.

I know many “illegals.” They overstay their visa, but set down roots and have a kid in school, get comfortable just working and sending money out of the country. There is no incentive to leave once their allowed term is up. The policies should prevent them from being able to set down roots as a non citizen.

Unfortunately that’s not the case.

A wall stops 0% of those problems.
They come here for the wealth and they are raised to want government to "share" it with them and they are willing to vote illegally to get it.
A wall stops many of them from coming here and voting illegally and having children who are given citizenship under current policies who grow up and vote communist.
A wall stops many of them from coming here and using our healthcare system and claiming they can't afford it.
Trump is doing what he can about welfare and Visa overstays but without Congress he is limited, he has talked about reinterpreting the law about anchor babies and I would like him to go ahead and try but we all know the courts would block him and it would end up being a coin flip when it got to SCOTUS.

A wall and/or massively increased patrols is simply the best he can do right now and it will help. (And thanks to the idiotic laws Congress won't change increased patrols will just result in catch and release but a wall will keep them from getting in at all)

[Swordsmyth]

Get out of the $#@!in' matrix, Bro.

Get rid of incentives- let people hire who they wish & pay what they wish- real capitalism, free trade- & watch everyone's lifestyle improve..
Watch them turn the US into a communist hellhole.

[asurfaholic]

They come here for the wealth and they are raised to want government to "share" it with them and they are willing to vote illegally to get it.
A wall stops many of them from coming here and voting illegally and having children who are given citizenship under current policies who grow up and vote communist.
A wall stops many of them from coming here and using our healthcare system and claiming they can't afford it.
Trump is doing what he can about welfare and Visa overstays but without Congress he is limited, he has talked about reinterpreting the law about anchor babies and I would like him to go ahead and try but we all know the courts would block him and it would end up being a coin flip when it got to SCOTUS.

A wall and/or massively increased patrols is simply the best he can do right now and it will help. (And thanks to the idiotic laws Congress won't change increased patrols will just result in catch and release but a wall will keep them from getting in at all)

You clearly have no clue what you are talking about.

They are not raised to expect the government to share wealth with them. They want to work for what they have and are frugal and rarely materialistic. Compare that to your typical American. Go walk around Walmart and tell me that Mexicans are the lazy bums. I’m beginning to realize you are actually just racist and incapable of human empathy. You aren’t against the socialist policies, you just hate the idea that a Little brown guy might get his hand in the cookie jar. Build a wall and we are still left with the same problems. I’ll bet there will be no significant reduction in the welfare drain on this country.

[Swordsmyth]

You clearly have no clue what you are talking about.

They are not raised to expect the government to share wealth with them. They want to work for what they have and are frugal and rarely materialistic. Compare that to your typical American. Go walk around Walmart and tell me that Mexicans are the lazy bums. I’m beginning to realize you are actually just racist and incapable of human empathy. You aren’t against the socialist policies, you just hate the idea that a Little brown guy might get his hand in the cookie jar. Build a wall and we are still left with the same problems. I’ll bet there will be no significant reduction in the welfare drain on this country.
I know plenty and it isn't just Mexicans, it's European socialist immigrants and communists from all over the world.

But since you want to discuss Mexicans:

Illegal Migrants Come Here as Ready-made Democrats — Here’s Why (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?533542-Illegal-Migrants-Come-Here-as-Ready-made-Democrats-—-Here’s-Why)
Every wave of immigration legal or illegal has increased the socialism/communism in this country and will continue to do so until we limit the numbers allowed to ensure that the newcomers assimilate into American liberty culture instead of assimilating Americans into their socialism/communism and it has nothing to do with race, just political culture.

[Swordsmyth]

a DHS insider exposed to us Congo migrants have made it to the USA with confirmed cases of #ebola (https://twitter.com/hashtag/ebola?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw). 3 are in custody in Laredo Tx and 6 in Laredo Mexico, and in Juarez next to our wall@WeBuildtheWall (https://twitter.com/WeBuildtheWall?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) is securing our nation! @RyanAFournier (https://twitter.com/RyanAFournier?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) @gehrig38 (https://twitter.com/gehrig38?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) @cnnbrk (https://twitter.com/cnnbrk?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) @CBSNews (https://twitter.com/CBSNews?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) @NBCNews (https://twitter.com/NBCNews?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw)
— Brian Kolfage (@BrianKolfage) May 31, 2019 (https://twitter.com/BrianKolfage/status/1134531236842606592?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw)

[tod evans]

Jules is absolutely right about this.

I don't think so, in fact I don't think that 20% would come here if this country didn't support it's non working citizens..

The "jobs" available would be no better than in their country and the 'Merkins picking crops and cleaning motels would actually want to put a roof over their head and food in their kids bellies if government didn't do it for them....


It's not free shit for foreigners that's drawing them, it's the free shit for a large portion of the citizenry...

End government handouts to every-fucking-body including Big-Lobbyists and single mothers!

[Swordsmyth]

I don't think so, in fact I don't think that 20% would come here if this country didn't support it's non working citizens..

The "jobs" available would be no better than in their country and the 'Merkins picking crops and cleaning motels would actually want to put a roof over their head and food in their kids bellies if government didn't do it for them....


It's not free $#@! for foreigners that's drawing them, it's the free $#@! for a large portion of the citizenry...

End government handouts to every-$#@!ing-body including Big-Lobbyists and single mothers!
People from all over the world came to America in droves before we had much of a welfare system, I absolutely support getting rid of welfare but the immigrants from socialist cultures with terrible economies would still come here for the economic opportunity and bring their socialist values with them, then they would vote for welfare.

We have to limit immigration and control our borders or we will end up no different than the rest of the world that is socialist/communist.

[tod evans]

People from all over the world came to America in droves before we had much of a welfare system, I absolutely support getting rid of welfare but the immigrants from socialist cultures with terrible economies would still come here for the economic opportunity and bring their socialist values with them, then they would vote for welfare.

We have to limit immigration and control our borders or we will end up no different than the rest of the world that is socialist/communist.

The draw would be substantially less as would the acceptance of the 'Merkin people without government monies..

The two go hand in hand, trying to separate them is foolish.

I don't think, even for a minute, that there would be such an influx if there wasn't such a warm welcome.

[Swordsmyth]

The draw would be substantially less as would the acceptance of the 'Merkin people without government monies..

The two go hand in hand, trying to separate them is foolish.

I don't think, even for a minute, that there would be such an influx if there wasn't such a warm welcome.
I agree, it would be foolish to assume that welfare isn't part of the draw but we need to limit immigration and secure the border in addition to eliminating welfare and especially while we try to eliminate welfare.

[specsaregood]

I don't think so, in fact I don't think that 20% would come here if this country didn't support it's non working citizens..

The "jobs" available would be no better than in their country and the 'Merkins picking crops and cleaning motels would actually want to put a roof over their head and food in their kids bellies if government didn't do it for them....


It's not free shit for foreigners that's drawing them, it's the free shit for a large portion of the citizenry...

End government handouts to every-fucking-body including Big-Lobbyists and single mothers!

Agreed, wholeheartedly.

[tod evans]

I agree, it would be foolish to assume that welfare isn't part of the draw but we need to limit immigration and secure the border in addition to eliminating welfare and especially while we try to eliminate welfare.

I would much rather see welfare ended before undertaking more debt.

[Swordsmyth]

I would much rather see welfare ended before undertaking more debt.
Every illegal that enters adds to the debt, we can't afford to not attack the problem from all angles.
The illegals will also shift our politics so that we can't end welfare if we don't stop them.


It used to be accepted that we do have a welfare state and that you can't have open borders in a welfare state, one of the reasons for that maxim was that the people who came for the welfare would ensure that you couldn't end the welfare state but now many seem to have forgotten that.

[tod evans]

Every illegal that enters adds to the debt, we can't afford to not attack the problem from all angles.
The illegals will also shift our politics so that we can't end welfare if we don't stop them.


It used to be accepted that we do have a welfare state and that you can't have open borders in a welfare state, one of the reasons for that maxim was that the people who came for the welfare would ensure that you couldn't end the welfare state but now many seem to have forgotten that.

I have NEVER accepted the welfare state, not once!

That was one of my draws to Ron Paul, ending the welfare state.

I hope I live to see the day when someone has the guts to stand at a debate podium and tell the truth; That we, as a nation, can't support all the freeloaders and if elected they'll stop payments to everyone including the war machine and single mothers, doctors, hospitals and housing........Absolutely no government monies spent on anything until there's a surplus in the vault........Especially payment to congressmen, senators and all their staff, no money spent....No pensions no nothing!

I think that would win an election, I know I'd vote for 'em....

And I think a wall is fucking ridiculous. More government spending isn't going to fix too much government spending.

[specsaregood]

And I think a wall is fucking ridiculous. More government spending isn't going to fix too much government spending.

Except this wall, which is built on private property on land donated by the owner that has suffered due to trespassers for years. Built with voluntary contributions. I like it.

You are spot on about the welfare though. If people had no choice but to work those dirty jobs they don't want to do or starve, they would do those jobs and illegals would have no jobs over here to take.

[Swordsmyth]

I have NEVER accepted the welfare state, not once!

That was one of my draws to Ron Paul, ending the welfare state.

I hope I live to see the day when someone has the guts to stand at a debate podium and tell the truth; That we, as a nation, can't support all the freeloaders and if elected they'll stop payments to everyone including the war machine and single mothers, doctors, hospitals and housing........Absolutely no government monies spent on anything until there's a surplus in the vault........Especially payment to congressmen, senators and all their staff, no money spent....No pensions no nothing!

I think that would win an election, I know I'd vote for 'em....

And I think a wall is $#@!ing ridiculous. More government spending isn't going to fix too much government spending.

I didn't say to accept the welfare state, I said that we have to accept the fact that we are stuck with one and we won't be able to get rid of it like we need to if we don't stop the invasion it attracts.

There will be much more government spending if we don't deal with the invasion than if we do.

[Ender]

You clearly have no clue what you are talking about.

They are not raised to expect the government to share wealth with them. They want to work for what they have and are frugal and rarely materialistic. Compare that to your typical American. Go walk around Walmart and tell me that Mexicans are the lazy bums. I’m beginning to realize you are actually just racist and incapable of human empathy. You aren’t against the socialist policies, you just hate the idea that a Little brown guy might get his hand in the cookie jar. Build a wall and we are still left with the same problems. I’ll bet there will be no significant reduction in the welfare drain on this country.

EXACTLY!

[tod evans]

Except this wall, which is built on private property on land donated by the owner that has suffered due to trespassers for years. Built with voluntary contributions. I like it.

You are spot on about the welfare though. If people had no choice but to work those dirty jobs they don't want to do or starve, they would do those jobs and illegals would have no jobs over here to take.

A wall like this, not the government one SS advocates is perfectly fine, hell I'd help build it...

What I don't want to do is pay bureaucrats and politicians, statisticians and union members to think about maybe building a wall on my dime....

Government can't even print money without fucking it up.........

[Ender]

How does that fix their broken governmental system that gives them an incentive to come here? That's what they tell me when I talk to them, they come here because their government is corrupt. The police shot up a school down there and they covered it up.

Like the US cops that hid when the Florida school was shot up by a "lone" shooter? Mexico's not perfect but it's not a threat to the US- more vs/vs.

[nikcers]

Like the US cops that hid when the Florida school was shot up by a "lone" shooter? Mexico's not perfect but it's not a threat to the US- more vs/vs.

There is a difference between a cop ticketing you to rob you and straight up demanding money or be arrested. The people I have talked to say they come here because their government is corrupt.

[Ender]

There is a difference between a cop ticketing you to rob you and straight up demanding money or be arrested. The people I have talked to say they come here because their government is corrupt.


San Miguel de Allende, Mexico (CNN)While politicians in Washington debate building a wall between the United States and Mexico, Americans who've moved south of the border have a different perspective on the country they've come to call home.

Walk the streets of San Miguel de Allende, a colonial town in central Mexico that's long been a mecca for American retirees, and you'll meet new arrivals who say they're grateful they've found a place to escape from mounting political tensions in the United States.

Some even have a catch phrase for the things they say brought them here. They call them "the three C's": climate, culture and cost of living.

According to the State Department, roughly 1 million US citizens live in Mexico.

More: https://www.cnn.com/2017/06/24/americas/mexico-american-expats/index.html

[nikcers]

More: https://www.cnn.com/2017/06/24/americas/mexico-american-expats/index.html

I grew up in bad neighborhoods in Nevada where all of my friends and neigbhors were Mexican immigrants, I could speak spanish pretty well before I lost touch with a friend about 10 years ago. I don't need to read any other opinions on this, I've spent thousands of hours talking to mexican immigrants.

[Ender]

I grew up in bad neighborhoods in Nevada where all of my friends and neigbhors were Mexican immigrants, I could speak spanish pretty well before I lost touch with a friend about 10 years ago. I don't need to read any other opinions on this, I've spent thousands of hours talking to mexican immigrants.

I grew up in S Cal with lottsa Mexicans & spent tons of time across the border.

[nikcers]

I grew up in S Cal with lottsa Mexicans & spent tons of time across the border.
Maybe you seen this than, I've met tons of people who are even second generation that live here who spite living here because they love their home country so much but the situation is so bad they feel they have no choice like they are in a prison they are treated like they are unwanted no matter where they go even if they go back to their own country the people treat them like they are not "one of us".

[Swordsmyth]

a DHS insider exposed to us Congo migrants have made it to the USA with confirmed cases of #ebola (https://twitter.com/hashtag/ebola?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw). 3 are in custody in Laredo Tx and 6 in Laredo Mexico, and in Juarez next to our wall@WeBuildtheWall (https://twitter.com/WeBuildtheWall?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) is securing our nation! @RyanAFournier (https://twitter.com/RyanAFournier?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) @gehrig38 (https://twitter.com/gehrig38?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) @cnnbrk (https://twitter.com/cnnbrk?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) @CBSNews (https://twitter.com/CBSNews?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) @NBCNews (https://twitter.com/NBCNews?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw)
— Brian Kolfage (@BrianKolfage) May 31, 2019 (https://twitter.com/BrianKolfage/status/1134531236842606592?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw)




Per the latest WHO weekly outbreak bulletin (https://apps.who.int/iris/bitstream/handle/10665/324950/OEW21-2026052019.pdf), the 10 month Ebola outbreak continues unabated in DRC. It's up by almost exactly 30% in the last 21 days.

The Good
They've vaccinated nearly 125K people, with an experimental vaccine that appears to confer >99% effectiveness against Ebola. (For the 1K or less people who contracted it anyways, don't worry, most of them are dead now.)

The Bad

1) Despite vaccinations, progressing at some 1000 per day, for a non-zero number of cases (currently it's something like 5% of all new cases), they have no effing clue where a given case originated, and thus no wild idea whom to vaccinate, or how to throw up a suitable containment ring around them, or how the virus got past them.

2) They are tracing contacts in 17 health zones. The problem with that is there are 22 health zones (think of counties) with active Ebola cases in the last couple of weeks. Imagine being missed by 17 out of 22 cars as you cross in a crosswalk, and you begin to appreciate why this is a problem.

In the five other zones (23%) where there is zero contact tracing, they have no idea what the disease is doing.

The Ugly

In this current outbreak, in 50% of cases, fever as a presenting sign is completely absent.
(Fever, we remind you, is how grade-school dropout customs screeners in 126 countries check people at the airports for Ebola before letting them in. Including our TSA wizards here in the U.S. It's really the only thing they can check that can be mastered by 80 IQ government employees worldwide. Sleep tight.)
Short of laboratory testing everyone (which they aren't and cannot do in nearly 1/4 of the Hot Zone in DRC), and a 40-day quarantine, cases will continue to multiply.
And they are.

Let's look at that over time, since we're at the 10-month anniversary of this outbreak today:

Index case Aug 1
2 cases Aug 1
4 Aug 1
8 Aug 1
16 Aug 1
32 Aug 3
64 Aug 3
128 Aug 31
256 Oct 15
512 Dec 3
1K Feb 24
2K May 12
4K probably about Aug 1

That would be an 11 on the 34-point Scale Of Whether It's Time To Panic, with 34 being Global Extinction Event. And headed to 12 at about 100 new cases/wk, give or take.

And we repeat, as the virus doesn't kill overnight, the correct death ratio number, we pound home, is not the WHO/Wikistupidia math-retarded posted lie of 65% of dead vs. infected, it's those dead now vs. number infected 21 days ago, which gives a consistent and far more reliable lethality percentage around 75%. Because it takes about that long to get it, and then die from it, on a rough average.

USAMRIID and CDC refer to that level of lethality as a "slate-wiper"; it erases populations.

And bear well in mind "surviving" Ebola means you now have it functionally forever, and get to suffer the sequellae of Post-Ebola virus syndrome (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Post-Ebola_virus_syndrome). {TL;DR: You're still screwed, and life, as you knew it, is over. You aren't going back to your old life ever again. Short answer: don't catch it to begin with.}

Note that by the time it was confirmed as an outbreak this time, it had already doubled 4 times, meaning it probably started two to four weeks earlier, at minimum, but no one noticed until literally 20 people dropped dead with blood shooting out of all orifices. Nominally, on Day One. Proof of this is that it doubled two more times in the next 48 hours.
Growth slowed notably, mainly because the vaccine and ring vaccination slowed the brushfire down. At first.

And then the local superstition and ignorance kicked in, they started stealing bodies from morgues, burning Ebola treatment centers, and chasing the health teams out at gunpoint, and all hell has broken loose, probably never to be contained, because we don't have the 82nd Airborne in hazmat suits available to shoot idiots at gunpoint to get this back in the bottle.

You know this because it keeps escaping to neighboring health zones and provinces, having now moved some 100 miles outward.
It has surged notably since March of this year, both in terms of numbers, and affected areas. That is an ominous sign.

Bear in mind once again that this area is
a) equatorial jungle, literally right on the Equator
b) listed in all maps relevant as "ungoverned"
c) listed in all relevant maps as "armed conflict zone"

The UN and all local organizations are doing their usual Headless Chicken, thrashing about, but to little effect, and the literature continues to try and paint a happy picture, while ill-concealing their ultimate despair that they'll get ahead of this one.

It continues to be a slow roll-out compared to 2014, but is notably picking up steam.
1000 vaccinations a day is great when you have 100 cases.
When you're working on 2200 cases and counting, and nearly 1/4 of the regions you need to be in are untouched by any effort, the horse left the barn, and you're just marking time on three sides while the whole show departs through the gaping holes in containment.

It's going to get much worse, much faster, probably in a week to a month, when cases start popping up farther afield, where there are no resources or testing, let alone contact tracing, and the percentage of cases with no clear infection chain will go from single digit percentages to mid-double digits rapidly.

And now comes unconfirmed word that we have a number of potential infected refugees in custody on the Southern border of the US. Nobody's saying they have Ebola, just getting all flustercated because they might. {Emphasis added for clarity. -A.}

My default answer is to ignore these reports until it's confirmed, because most of them are indeed false reports, so we'll wait and see how it pans out, as you all should.

But if it breaks out here, we have 11 BL-IV beds (http://raconteurreport.blogspot.com/2014/10/do-math.html), max, to adequately contain that outbreak.
For reference, Mexico has zero beds.
I repeat, Mexico has zero beds.

If it breaks out south of the border, one case becomes 100 cases in about a month, tops, (probably more like a week to ten days) and then the flood of refugees coming here becomes a tsunami (actually, we're there now completely without a pandemic to drive it faster, so picture that when it gets turned up to 11). At that point, f**k a wall. The only way you stop that flow is AC-130s doing minigun sweeps of anything moving within 1/4 mile of the international border, which is going to be hard on the millions of people who already live inside that zone on both sides of the line.

So if Mexico gets one active case, you can cancel Christmas.
America (North, and particularly Central and South) becomes Africa at that point.
Ditto if we get more than 10 cases here in the U.S.

We saw what happens when people at the local big hospital tried to be Emory or Nebraska or The Vault at USAMRIID: it fails, and you knock a 1000-bed major tertiary care facility out for months, for the whole community.
And the virus doubles, despite your best efforts.

With EVD, close isn't good enough, and only counts with horseshoes, hand grenades, and nuclear weapons.

I'm working, and have been, in level I and II trauma centers, and major high-volume ERs my entire career. More since 2014 than before, BTW.

And I'm here to tell you, by the numbers:

1) We aren't ready to deal with this, in any meaningful way, any better than in 2014
2) By "we" I mean any hospital in any city anywhere in North America, and
3) when, not if, this breaks out here, it's going to take out health care as you know it in every affected city, starting with the people who work in them, then patients and visitors. Hospitals will become abbatoirs, morgues, then ghost towns.
4) 911 responders (firefighter rigs and EMT units, and to a lesser extent, law enforcement) will become potential carriers to spread the disease back into the community.
5) anybody, anywhere, with whatever certifications, who tells you anything different is either lying out their ass at both ends, or doesn't know what they're talking about, and anything further they say can be completely discounted as utter bullsh*t from someone too stupid to live, or irredeemably evil.

Good times, huh?

That means no ER, no 9-1-1, no 50 other things people come to hospitals or call the police and fire department to handle. Trauma, heart attacks, strokes, diabetic emergencies, appendicitis, and the whole plethora of modern medicine.
Imagine the police not wanting to get within 20 feet of people on a stop or a call.
Car accidents will become morgue calls.

Because Ebola.

The Monster

The little filovirus in the masthead for these updates is magnified tens of thousand times, in pics that have been around since the mid-1970s.
A period at the end of this sentence would be a ball of virus that numbers 100,000,000 of them.
The number necessary to give you full-blown Ebola is one.

We don't know in what species Ebola resides between outbreaks. Anywhere. Ever.
We don't know how it gets transmitted from them to humans.
No idea whatsoever.

Flecks of infected blood from a human victim who has it can be coughed and sneezed 25', and may linger in the air for up to 10 minutes afterwards.
And that's only considered droplet precautions, because those particles are heavier than air, and eventually settle, unlike true airborne precautions, for something like TB, or pneumonic plague.

Your body won't care which it is if you suck in one of those droplets at the movie theater, theme park, supermarket, or mall, whenever you simply breathe it in anytime you walk within 25' of anywhere anyone has coughed in the last 10 minutes.

Have fun at WalMart, Target, the airport, a theme park, a movie multiplex, a ballpark or auditorium, and the supermarket then.

And before someone starts asking (again?!) about how to "deal" with this, by suiting up:
1) You need a 20-piece hazmat ensemble, a spotter to put it on and take it off, a metric fuckton of disinfectant and disposable items, including gloves, splash-proof goggles, gloves, suits, gloves, hoods, gloves, booties, gloves, droplet barrier masks, and gloves.
2) One break in protocol will be a terminal error.
3) And potentially expose everyone you come into contact with to the virus.
4) And require you to start all over again getting suited up for, or deconned out of, any hot zone
5) Oh, and lest we forget, it's June, and the ensemble inside is hot-as-fucking-hell, and gives the average person maybe two hours' time before they're ready to pass out from heat stroke, before we factor in dehydration, claustrophobia, and sheer panic.
6) Did we mention that hot, tired, dehydrated, exhausted, and panicky people make fucktons of sloppy mistakes?
7) Did we also mention that one mistake can get you and everyone you love or contact killed?

So yeah, fuck the idea of working in hazmat gear. Professionals hate it. With all the resources mentioned above you'll never have.
You?
You don't stand a chance.

Proper protective equipment for Ebola, we repeat and belabor, is several lengths of military-grade concertina, warning signs, a shotgun and supply of buckshot, and small breakable containers with a suitable flame accelerant, for emergency decontamination beyond the perimeter.

Chance of Ebola sneaking up your driveway and into you behind such a perimeter: 0%.

Odds of seeing this material again before the end of the year: better than even.

Happy Summer, kids!
Now do you see why I don't want to bring this up any more frequently?

UPDATE: 116 Africans, including congolese refugees, caught crossing Rio Grande (https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/local-media-release/border-patrol-agents-apprehend-large-group-del-rio)
What could possibly go wrong?

http://raconteurreport.blogspot.com/2019/06/june-ebola-update.html

[Swordsmyth]

A 7-year-old boy is being praised by many for raising $22,000 through a hot chocolate stand for the privately funded border wall, and he has set an even higher goal for his fundraising efforts.

Benton Stevens says that he will sell lemonade for the summer, and he hopes (https://thehill.com/homenews/news/446667-texas-7-year-old-has-raised-22000-for-construction-of-trumps-border-wall) to raise $50,000 for the private border wall construction.
He was in attendance at the ribbon-cutting ceremony for the first part of the private border wall.
The official Facebook site of the private border wall organizers praised (https://thehill.com/homenews/news/446667-texas-7-year-old-has-raised-22000-for-construction-of-trumps-border-wall) Stevens in a post on Friday.
"We were honored to have him at our ribbon cutting ceremony yesterday for the wall he helped pay for along with all of you who donated," the post read.
"This is only the beginning and we're excited to keep building more to protect our nation and the legal citizens who proudly call American their home!" they concluded.

More at: https://www.theblaze.com/news/7-year-old-raises-20k-for-border-wall

[Swordsmyth]

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/images/misc/quote_icon.png Originally Posted by Swordsmyth http://www.ronpaulforums.com/images/buttons/viewpost-right.png (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?p=6806330#post6806330)

a DHS insider exposed to us Congo migrants have made it to the USA with confirmed cases of #ebola (https://twitter.com/hashtag/ebola?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw). 3 are in custody in Laredo Tx and 6 in Laredo Mexico, and in Juarez next to our wall@WeBuildtheWall (https://twitter.com/WeBuildtheWall?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) is securing our nation! @RyanAFournier (https://twitter.com/RyanAFournier?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) @gehrig38 (https://twitter.com/gehrig38?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) @cnnbrk (https://twitter.com/cnnbrk?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) @CBSNews (https://twitter.com/CBSNews?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) @NBCNews (https://twitter.com/NBCNews?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw)
— Brian Kolfage (@BrianKolfage) May 31, 2019 (https://twitter.com/BrianKolfage/status/1134531236842606592?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw)


Per the latest WHO weekly outbreak bulletin (https://apps.who.int/iris/bitstream/handle/10665/324950/OEW21-2026052019.pdf), the 10 month Ebola outbreak continues unabated in DRC. It's up by almost exactly 30% in the last 21 days.

The Good
They've vaccinated nearly 125K people, with an experimental vaccine that appears to confer >99% effectiveness against Ebola. (For the 1K or less people who contracted it anyways, don't worry, most of them are dead now.)

The Bad

1) Despite vaccinations, progressing at some 1000 per day, for a non-zero number of cases (currently it's something like 5% of all new cases), they have no effing clue where a given case originated, and thus no wild idea whom to vaccinate, or how to throw up a suitable containment ring around them, or how the virus got past them.

2) They are tracing contacts in 17 health zones. The problem with that is there are 22 health zones (think of counties) with active Ebola cases in the last couple of weeks. Imagine being missed by 17 out of 22 cars as you cross in a crosswalk, and you begin to appreciate why this is a problem.

In the five other zones (23%) where there is zero contact tracing, they have no idea what the disease is doing.

The Ugly

In this current outbreak, in 50% of cases, fever as a presenting sign is completely absent.
(Fever, we remind you, is how grade-school dropout customs screeners in 126 countries check people at the airports for Ebola before letting them in. Including our TSA wizards here in the U.S. It's really the only thing they can check that can be mastered by 80 IQ government employees worldwide. Sleep tight.)
Short of laboratory testing everyone (which they aren't and cannot do in nearly 1/4 of the Hot Zone in DRC), and a 40-day quarantine, cases will continue to multiply.
And they are.

Let's look at that over time, since we're at the 10-month anniversary of this outbreak today:

Index case Aug 1
2 cases Aug 1
4 Aug 1
8 Aug 1
16 Aug 1
32 Aug 3
64 Aug 3
128 Aug 31
256 Oct 15
512 Dec 3
1K Feb 24
2K May 12
4K probably about Aug 1

That would be an 11 on the 34-point Scale Of Whether It's Time To Panic, with 34 being Global Extinction Event. And headed to 12 at about 100 new cases/wk, give or take.

And we repeat, as the virus doesn't kill overnight, the correct death ratio number, we pound home, is not the WHO/Wikistupidia math-retarded posted lie of 65% of dead vs. infected, it's those dead now vs. number infected 21 days ago, which gives a consistent and far more reliable lethality percentage around 75%. Because it takes about that long to get it, and then die from it, on a rough average.

USAMRIID and CDC refer to that level of lethality as a "slate-wiper"; it erases populations.

And bear well in mind "surviving" Ebola means you now have it functionally forever, and get to suffer the sequellae of Post-Ebola virus syndrome (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Post-Ebola_virus_syndrome). {TL;DR: You're still screwed, and life, as you knew it, is over. You aren't going back to your old life ever again. Short answer: don't catch it to begin with.}

Note that by the time it was confirmed as an outbreak this time, it had already doubled 4 times, meaning it probably started two to four weeks earlier, at minimum, but no one noticed until literally 20 people dropped dead with blood shooting out of all orifices. Nominally, on Day One. Proof of this is that it doubled two more times in the next 48 hours.
Growth slowed notably, mainly because the vaccine and ring vaccination slowed the brushfire down. At first.

And then the local superstition and ignorance kicked in, they started stealing bodies from morgues, burning Ebola treatment centers, and chasing the health teams out at gunpoint, and all hell has broken loose, probably never to be contained, because we don't have the 82nd Airborne in hazmat suits available to shoot idiots at gunpoint to get this back in the bottle.

You know this because it keeps escaping to neighboring health zones and provinces, having now moved some 100 miles outward.
It has surged notably since March of this year, both in terms of numbers, and affected areas. That is an ominous sign.

Bear in mind once again that this area is
a) equatorial jungle, literally right on the Equator
b) listed in all maps relevant as "ungoverned"
c) listed in all relevant maps as "armed conflict zone"

The UN and all local organizations are doing their usual Headless Chicken, thrashing about, but to little effect, and the literature continues to try and paint a happy picture, while ill-concealing their ultimate despair that they'll get ahead of this one.

It continues to be a slow roll-out compared to 2014, but is notably picking up steam.
1000 vaccinations a day is great when you have 100 cases.
When you're working on 2200 cases and counting, and nearly 1/4 of the regions you need to be in are untouched by any effort, the horse left the barn, and you're just marking time on three sides while the whole show departs through the gaping holes in containment.

It's going to get much worse, much faster, probably in a week to a month, when cases start popping up farther afield, where there are no resources or testing, let alone contact tracing, and the percentage of cases with no clear infection chain will go from single digit percentages to mid-double digits rapidly.

And now comes unconfirmed word that we have a number of potential infected refugees in custody on the Southern border of the US. Nobody's saying they have Ebola, just getting all flustercated because they might. {Emphasis added for clarity. -A.}

My default answer is to ignore these reports until it's confirmed, because most of them are indeed false reports, so we'll wait and see how it pans out, as you all should.

But if it breaks out here, we have 11 BL-IV beds (http://raconteurreport.blogspot.com/2014/10/do-math.html), max, to adequately contain that outbreak.
For reference, Mexico has zero beds.
I repeat, Mexico has zero beds.

If it breaks out south of the border, one case becomes 100 cases in about a month, tops, (probably more like a week to ten days) and then the flood of refugees coming here becomes a tsunami (actually, we're there now completely without a pandemic to drive it faster, so picture that when it gets turned up to 11). At that point, f**k a wall. The only way you stop that flow is AC-130s doing minigun sweeps of anything moving within 1/4 mile of the international border, which is going to be hard on the millions of people who already live inside that zone on both sides of the line.

So if Mexico gets one active case, you can cancel Christmas.
America (North, and particularly Central and South) becomes Africa at that point.
Ditto if we get more than 10 cases here in the U.S.

We saw what happens when people at the local big hospital tried to be Emory or Nebraska or The Vault at USAMRIID: it fails, and you knock a 1000-bed major tertiary care facility out for months, for the whole community.
And the virus doubles, despite your best efforts.

With EVD, close isn't good enough, and only counts with horseshoes, hand grenades, and nuclear weapons.

I'm working, and have been, in level I and II trauma centers, and major high-volume ERs my entire career. More since 2014 than before, BTW.

And I'm here to tell you, by the numbers:

1) We aren't ready to deal with this, in any meaningful way, any better than in 2014
2) By "we" I mean any hospital in any city anywhere in North America, and
3) when, not if, this breaks out here, it's going to take out health care as you know it in every affected city, starting with the people who work in them, then patients and visitors. Hospitals will become abbatoirs, morgues, then ghost towns.
4) 911 responders (firefighter rigs and EMT units, and to a lesser extent, law enforcement) will become potential carriers to spread the disease back into the community.
5) anybody, anywhere, with whatever certifications, who tells you anything different is either lying out their ass at both ends, or doesn't know what they're talking about, and anything further they say can be completely discounted as utter bullsh*t from someone too stupid to live, or irredeemably evil.

Good times, huh?

That means no ER, no 9-1-1, no 50 other things people come to hospitals or call the police and fire department to handle. Trauma, heart attacks, strokes, diabetic emergencies, appendicitis, and the whole plethora of modern medicine.
Imagine the police not wanting to get within 20 feet of people on a stop or a call.
Car accidents will become morgue calls.

Because Ebola.

The Monster

The little filovirus in the masthead for these updates is magnified tens of thousand times, in pics that have been around since the mid-1970s.
A period at the end of this sentence would be a ball of virus that numbers 100,000,000 of them.
The number necessary to give you full-blown Ebola is one.

We don't know in what species Ebola resides between outbreaks. Anywhere. Ever.
We don't know how it gets transmitted from them to humans.
No idea whatsoever.

Flecks of infected blood from a human victim who has it can be coughed and sneezed 25', and may linger in the air for up to 10 minutes afterwards.
And that's only considered droplet precautions, because those particles are heavier than air, and eventually settle, unlike true airborne precautions, for something like TB, or pneumonic plague.

Your body won't care which it is if you suck in one of those droplets at the movie theater, theme park, supermarket, or mall, whenever you simply breathe it in anytime you walk within 25' of anywhere anyone has coughed in the last 10 minutes.

Have fun at WalMart, Target, the airport, a theme park, a movie multiplex, a ballpark or auditorium, and the supermarket then.

And before someone starts asking (again?!) about how to "deal" with this, by suiting up:
1) You need a 20-piece hazmat ensemble, a spotter to put it on and take it off, a metric $#@!ton of disinfectant and disposable items, including gloves, splash-proof goggles, gloves, suits, gloves, hoods, gloves, booties, gloves, droplet barrier masks, and gloves.
2) One break in protocol will be a terminal error.
3) And potentially expose everyone you come into contact with to the virus.
4) And require you to start all over again getting suited up for, or deconned out of, any hot zone
5) Oh, and lest we forget, it's June, and the ensemble inside is hot-as-$#@!ing-hell, and gives the average person maybe two hours' time before they're ready to pass out from heat stroke, before we factor in dehydration, claustrophobia, and sheer panic.
6) Did we mention that hot, tired, dehydrated, exhausted, and panicky people make $#@!tons of sloppy mistakes?
7) Did we also mention that one mistake can get you and everyone you love or contact killed?

So yeah, $#@! the idea of working in hazmat gear. Professionals hate it. With all the resources mentioned above you'll never have.
You?
You don't stand a chance.

Proper protective equipment for Ebola, we repeat and belabor, is several lengths of military-grade concertina, warning signs, a shotgun and supply of buckshot, and small breakable containers with a suitable flame accelerant, for emergency decontamination beyond the perimeter.

Chance of Ebola sneaking up your driveway and into you behind such a perimeter: 0%.

Odds of seeing this material again before the end of the year: better than even.

Happy Summer, kids!
Now do you see why I don't want to bring this up any more frequently?

UPDATE: 116 Africans, including congolese refugees, caught crossing Rio Grande (https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/local-media-release/border-patrol-agents-apprehend-large-group-del-rio)
What could possibly go wrong?

http://raconteurreport.blogspot.com/2019/06/june-ebola-update.html

Ebola cases doubled from 1000 in March to 2000 in June (https://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/world-news/783307/ebola-congo-figures-triple-new-cases-clinics-government-who)

[Swordsmyth]

https://twitter.com/BrianKolfage/status/1138241155659788293

1138241155659788293...

[PAF]

People from all over the world came to America in droves before we had much of a welfare system, I absolutely support getting rid of welfare but the immigrants from socialist cultures with terrible economies would still come here for the economic opportunity and bring their socialist values with them, then they would vote for welfare.

We have to limit immigration and control our borders or we will end up no different than the rest of the world that is socialist/communist.

Unless you take a big giant rocket ship to another planet and find a rock to live under, people can not live in isolation. Isolation and setting bad examples only leads to more of the same. Instead of spouting off statist rhetoric, it is about time that we embrace and promote the ideas of liberty, freedom and fiscal responsibility.

Ron Paul has been speaking here in America, as well as travel to Mexico where is well received. It may take time, it may not resonate with many, but that is the only choice that we have. Otherwise, what you propose will only provide certainty for tptb.

[kahless]

IBWC locks 'We Build the Wall' gate open citing permit issue
https://www.kvia.com/news/border/ibwc-locks-we-build-the-wall-gate-open-citing-permit-issue/1085172933

"They are over stepping DHS, national security experts and undermining President Trump. As soon as they locked our gate open we noticed many other gates around El Paso just opened up!! They are planning for mass invasion."

IBWC sounds like a terrorist organization. DHS should round them up and lock them up.

[specsaregood]

IBWC locks 'We Build the Wall' gate open citing permit issue
https://www.kvia.com/news/border/ibwc-locks-we-build-the-wall-gate-open-citing-permit-issue/1085172933


IBWC sounds like a terrorist organization. DHS should round them up and lock them up.

The wiki on the IBWC for the northern border has an interesting section:


In July 2007, the Bush administration relieved U.S. Commissioner Dennis Schornack of his post in connection with a dispute between the boundary commission and the U.S. government over private construction near the border.[4] Schornack rejected the dismissal, saying that the commission is an independent, international organization outside the U.S. government's jurisdiction, and that according to the 1908 treaty that created it, a vacancy can only be created by "the death, resignation or other disability" of a commissioner.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Boundary_Commission

[Swordsmyth]

Unless you take a big giant rocket ship to another planet and find a rock to live under, people can not live in isolation. Isolation and setting bad examples only leads to more of the same. Instead of spouting off statist rhetoric, it is about time that we embrace and promote the ideas of liberty, freedom and fiscal responsibility.

Ron Paul has been speaking here in America, as well as travel to Mexico where is well received. It may take time, it may not resonate with many, but that is the only choice that we have. Otherwise, what you propose will only provide certainty for tptb.
I am not "isolationist" (why am I not surprised to see you use that old slur?), I believe in allowing foreigners to visit and even allowing some to immigrate but liberty is not the natural state of man and if you don't insulate your politics and culture you will be reduced to the lowest common denominator of tyranny.

[Swordsmyth]

IBWC locks 'We Build the Wall' gate open citing permit issue
https://www.kvia.com/news/border/ibwc-locks-we-build-the-wall-gate-open-citing-permit-issue/1085172933


IBWC sounds like a terrorist organization. DHS should round them up and lock them up.


The wiki on the IBWC for the northern border has an interesting section:


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Boundary_Commission

Treason!

[Danke]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=43&v=YPvwBjfNO7M

[Swordsmyth]

Kolfage has tweeted that the gate is now closed, and secure again.

[Swordsmyth]

Officials in Sunland Park, Arizona are threatening a landowner with arrest for failing to appear at a court hearing on a large border wall constructed on his property with the city’s approval.
Court officials told KFOX 14 (https://kfoxtv.com/news/local/owner-of-land-where-sunland-park-private-wall-is-built-failed-to-appear-for-court-hearing) that George Cudahy, owner of the American Eagle Brick Factory, faces a criminal summons after failing to show up to court on an unspecified charge Wednesday night, presumably related to the construction of a half-mile steel wall along his property bordering Mexico.

The city of sunland park New Mexico is now threatening an elderly veteran who had the wall built on his property. They can’t touch @WeBuildtheWall (https://twitter.com/WeBuildtheWall?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) and they ignore the crisis in their town. Where are their priorities? https://t.co/V9vUVERngb
— Brian Kolfage (@BrianKolfage) June 20, 2019 (https://twitter.com/BrianKolfage/status/1141691915261419521?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw)
“The court wouldn’t tell KFOX 14 the specific charge Cudahy is facing, but it comes with a $500 fine, which is the highest amount the municipal court is legally allowed to charge,” according to the news site. “The city of Sunland Park will be filing a criminal summons, meaning if Cudahy misses his next hearing, the city will arrest him.”


More at: http://www.theamericanmirror.com/nm-city-threatens-property-owner-with-arrest-over-private-border-wall/

[Swordsmyth]

Brian Kolfage’s We Build The Wall is still fundraising and it got a $458,000 donation yesterday (https://www.gofundme.com/TheTrumpWall)

[Swordsmyth]

El Cenizo council to meet with crowdfounded 'Build the Wall' group, paving way to border barrier (https://www.lmtonline.com/local/article/El-Cenizo-council-to-meet-with-crowdfounded-14350475.php)

[Swordsmyth]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pyU4ZOwtv7I

[Swordsmyth]

We Build the Wall, boasted on social media Thursday that it has begun riverfront land clearing on banks of the the Rio Grande in Mission, Texas, to build a 3.5-mile border barrier on private property. This is believed to be the first private wall construction in South Texas by this organization, which earlier this year built a section of wall near El Paso in Sunland Park, New Mexico. (https://kfoxtv.com/news/local/we-build-the-wall-telethon-goes-live-from-sunland-park-nm)
The owner of the 6,000-acre riverfront property, Lance Neuhaus, confirmed to Border Report on Thursday that he has given the tax-exempt organization We Build the Wall (https://webuildthewall.us/about-us/) permission to be on his property.

More at: https://cw39.com/2019/11/15/group-clears-private-riverfront-land-to-build-border-wall-in-south-texas/

[Swordsmyth]

Acting Homeland Security Secretary Chad Wolf made an unpublicized visit Wednesday to the site of a privately constructed border wall during his first official trip to the southern border, Yahoo News has confirmed.

The stop at the half-mile stretch of crowdfunded steel bollard fencing, was not mentioned in a media advisory sent by the DHS press office ahead of Wolf’s trip to El Paso, Texas, where he was slated to “participate in an operational tour of DHS facilities on the southwest border, meet with local DHS leadership, survey new border wall construction, and meet with state, local and community officials.”

However, a DHS spokesperson, who declined to speak on the record, confirmed to Yahoo News that Wolf did, in fact, stop by the private wall in Sunland Park, where he spoke to the owner of the property and an engineer from the construction company that built it.
“They wanted to see what we built, they wanted to inspect it,” Brian Kolfage, founder and president of We Build the Wall, the nonprofit group behind the project, told Yahoo News. “They’re interested in what we’re doing and future projects.”


“I welcome all that want to be part of the solution,” Wolf said in response to a question from reporters about We Build the Wall’s latest effort (https://www.cnn.com/2019/11/15/politics/fisher-industries-border-wall/index.html) to build a new section of border wall on private land along the Rio Grande in South Texas.
“Obviously, when you’re talking about a border wall system, you have to do that in close connection with CBP [U.S. Customs and Border Protection], the Army Corps of Engineers and the like. The requirements that they have are pretty robust. … It has to meet certain requirements,” Wolf told reporters. “So if there are going to be private entities that do that, we want to make sure that we’re talking to them, and I know the chief and others are doing that each and every day.”
At the same press conference, El Paso Border Patrol Chief Gloria Chavez praised We Build the Wall’s first completed section in Sunland Park.
“When that wall got built, everything changed for us and we were able to manage border enforcement actions there even better,” said Chavez, who accompanied Wolf to the half-mile fence, located on the southern edge of an inactive brickyard owned by an 85-year-old Air Force veteran.

More at: https://www.yahoo.com/news/acting-homeland-security-chief-chad-wolf-makes-unannounced-visit-to-privately-funded-border-wall-223803492.html

[Swordsmyth]

https://twitter.com/BrianKolfage/status/1202014269363105793

1202014269363105793

[Swordsmyth]

https://twitter.com/BrianKolfage/status/1202300057510436864

1202300057510436864

[Schifference]

https://twitter.com/BrianKolfage/status/1202014269363105793

1202014269363105793

Logically speaking that small fence did not accomplish what this guy said it did. If a person wanted to cross or smuggle across the border, that privately built wall would not have stopped them. If the new wall was impenetrable, smugglers and others would just cross someplace more conducive.

[Swordsmyth]

Logically speaking that small fence did not accomplish what this guy said it did. If a person wanted to cross or smuggle across the border, that privately built wall would not have stopped them. If the new wall was impenetrable, smugglers and others would just cross someplace more conducive.
I believe the first project filled a gap in the government fence and every little bit helps.

[Swordsmyth]

https://twitter.com/BrianKolfage/status/1205853506575486981

1205853506575486981

[Zippyjuan]

https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/salvadorhernandez/border-wall-gofundme-sunland-park-residents-migrants


But days after the half-mile private barrier was erected, groups of people continued to stream over the border and into the New Mexico city. Dozens, sometimes hundreds, of people have been apprehended within view of the newly built wall, and residents are worried the barrier has only redirected migrants to other parts of town, creating new problems and possibly making matters worse.

The only thing the new wall has done, Ontiveroz said, was toss his quiet hometown into the middle of a national political fight.

"It's a bunch of bullshit," he said.

While people continue to cross the border — some simply walking around the new wall — construction workers, news crews, and politicians who have descended upon the small desert town will soon depart, leaving residents like him to deal with the unforeseen consequences, he said.

"It is always the case, where you have outsiders coming in thinking they have a solution," Javier Perea, mayor of Sunland Park, told BuzzFeed News. "Building the wall won't change the source of the problem."


The IBWC agent said he's already seen people carving new paths around the private border wall. Some are willing to cross through the river — a potentially dangerous endeavor when waters begin to rise. Others are making the trek, with children in hand, across a higher, steeper hill nearby.

The following night, another group of 54 people were stopped at the same location, a stone's throw away from the base of the crowdfunded wall. It took nearly an hour for Border Patrol officials to arrive with enough vans to transport the group to a detention center.

A wall constructed during the Bush administration already runs along most of the border near Sunland Park, except for a stretch of tall, steep hills that jut out on the eastern part of the city. It's a mostly industrial area, where asylum-seekers have often emerged in the city in search of Border Patrol agents so they can turn themselves in.

With the private wall cutting off access to a half-mile stretch of those hills, leaving only the steeper, more treacherous part open, residents are concerned that immigrants will begin crossing in other parts of the city, toward the west and into neighborhoods.

The wall also blocked access for a dam access road. So they were ordered by a court to leave it open during the daytime.

https://time.com/5605349/gofundme-border-wall-new-mexico/


Construction of a wall on the southern border that was privately funded by a viral $23 million GoFundMe campaign hit another roadblock this week, when a U.S. agency ordered that a gate in the steel fencing be kept open during the day because it blocks access to a U.S.-owned levee road, dam and a historic monument.

The gate was built by We Build the Wall in Sunland Park, N.M., near El Paso, Texas “without authority,” the United States Section of the International Boundary and Water Commission (USIBWC) said Tuesday.

Most of the crowdfunded wall is situated on private property owned by a brick company. But when a sliding gate attached to the wall is closed, it crosses into federal land and blocks off a federally owned road, Lori Kuczmanski, a USIBWC spokesperson, tells TIME. “We have operational needs that we need to maintain, and with it being closed, and them not giving us access, we’re locked out of our own property,” Kuczmanski says. “That’s the whole situation here.”

We Build the Wall locked the private gate on June 6. After USIBWC made “repeated requests” to unlock and open the gate, law enforcement officers removed the lock and opened the gate to allow for dam maintenance. The agency is now requiring that the gate be kept open during business hours and locked at night “due to security concerns.” Meanwhile, We Build the Wall has accused the agency of “overreach.”

[Swordsmyth]

https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/salvadorhernandez/border-wall-gofundme-sunland-park-residents-migrants





The wall also blocked access for a dam access road. So they were ordered by a court to leave it open during the daytime.

https://time.com/5605349/gofundme-border-wall-new-mexico/

Old propaganda.

Every little bit helps.

[Swordsmyth]

Amid the legal hurdles leveled by IBWC and butterfly advocates, We Build The Wall received a ringing public endorsement from U.S. Customs and Border Patrol.
The influx of illegal traffic has shifted around the structure to a region where agents are equipped to respond more effectively after the nonprofit completed its first new barrier, El Paso Border Patrol sector chief Gloria Chavez told reporters (https://www.washingtonpost.com/immigration/right-wing-group-continues-to-build-private-border-wall-it-lacks-permits-but-not-official-praise/2019/11/22/b4281676-0c71-11ea-8397-a955cd542d00_story.html) in November.
“Everything changed for us, and we were able to manage the border enforcement actions there even better,” Chavez said.


With the help of the American people, We Build the Wall could construct a wall along the entire 2000-mile border, Kolfage said.
“Twenty-five million dollars won’t go that far. It’s only going to build a couple of miles. We are still raising money. We’ve just got to keep hammering at it, little chunks at a time,” he said. “If every Trump supporter donates $80, then the nonprofit could build a wall on the entire 2000-mile border. We’ve proven now that we can build wall. When we originally raised this money, it was on an idea that ‘hey we are going to go and try to build a wall.’ But now, we actually did it. DHS has endorsed us. Border Patrol has endorsed us.”

More at: https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2019/12/exclusive-we-build-the-wall-president-brian-kolfage-corrupt-international-organization-controls-southern-border-not-dhs-or-border-patrol-video/

[Swordsmyth]

Thanks to $25 million in contributions from ordinary American citizens, the non-profit organization WeBuildTheWall Inc. is in the midst of constructing a wall along the crime-ridden southern border. But the crowdfunded group is facing bureaucratic hurdles each step of the way.




Now House Republicans are intervening to get the job done.
Intent on eliminating gridlock over border wall construction, more than a dozen GOP lawmakers in Arizona introduced a legislation Thursday that would allow private organizations to build physical security barriers in the state without acquiring construction permits.
Read more (https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2020/01/breaking-us-drones-take-out-shibl-al-saydi-leader-of-iranian-backed-shiite-militia-group-north-of-baghdad-in-taji-iraq/)



The bill, HB 2084 (https://www.azleg.gov/legtext/54leg/2R/bills/HB2084P.htm), will create a “presumption of permission to build the international boundary wall on state land,” Rep. Warren Peterson (R-AZ) said (https://www.phoenixnewtimes.com/news/border-wall-arizona-immigration-republicans-bill-permits-construction-11419861) in a statement Friday.
The measure comes after a pledge the Arizona lawmaker made in June to assist WeBuildTheWall with securing the border.

I will be introducing legislation next session to make sure that @WeBuildtheWall (https://twitter.com/WeBuildtheWall?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) can erect border walls on private property in AZ without impediment from state or local government. Their organization is making a real difference with the border crisis! All with private donations! pic.twitter.com/Z1mwcum0aY (https://t.co/Z1mwcum0aY)
— Warren Petersen (@votewarren) June 3, 2019 (https://twitter.com/votewarren/status/1135527912994508800?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw)
House Republicans co-sponsoring HB2084 include Nancy Barto, Leo Biasiucci, Frank Carroll, Regina Cobb, David Cook, John Fillmore, Mark Finchem, Travis Grantham, John Kavanagh, Becky Nutt, Kevin Payne, Steve Pierce, Bret Roberts, T.J. Shope, and Jeff Weninger. Republican State Senator Rick.
Support from the GOP lawmakers is crucial to winning the war to secure the border from criminals and potential national security threats, Kolfage told the Gateway Pundit Friday.

“Now the state of Arizona as stepped up to allow us to gift this vital tool for national security to the citizens of Arizona. We are proud to be able to work with border patrol and Arizona to make this a reality. Our wall has been proven 100 percent effective,” he said.

More at: https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2020/01/arizona-republicans-introduce-bill-allowing-private-border-wall-construction/

[Swordsmyth]

McAllen, Texas — After Friday’s showdown (https://therundownnews.com/2020/01/new-judge-spots-issues-in-environmental-groups-case-against-private-border-wall/) in a Texas federal court, Fisher Industries will be able to continue some construction at its border wall site after Judge Randy Crane lifted certain stipulations of an temporary restraining order levied against the group.
Crane removed the portion of a federal government injunction (https://therundownnews.com/2020/01/exclusive-private-border-wall-contractors-optimistic-before-friday-court-showdown-with-feds/) that stopped Fisher Industries from shaving, cutting or grading the riverbank of the Rio Grande River in Mission, TX while the federal government plans its next moves.

Meanwhile, We Build The Wall (WBTW), the non-profit which raised millions in a viral crowdfunding effort and is funding the project, celebrated.
“All these silly attempts to stop us always fail. At every turn the Deep State and enviro-freaks are there trying to obstruct us, and we embarrass them legally, every single time,” WBTW founder Brian Kolfage told The Rundown News.
“Construction to grade the banks has been approved to resume after the federal government and Butterfly Center failed to prove their case as we predicted,” he continued. “Good always defeats evil and that’s exactly what you are witnessing here.”

More at: https://therundownnews.com/2020/01/private-border-wall-group-celebrates-as-judge-allows-some-construction-to-proceed/

[Swordsmyth]

https://twitter.com/BrianKolfage/status/1215364778878754817

1215364778878754817

[Swordsmyth]

https://twitter.com/BrianKolfage/status/1215400432132030464

1215400432132030464

[AngryCanadian]

https://twitter.com/BrianKolfage/status/1215364778878754817

1215364778878754817

"We Will Save Texas!"

Trump is using the middle east and Iran as a distraction to get away from the issues at home and not a good idea to do so while an election season is on.

[Swordsmyth]

Border wall construction for a privately funded barrier is underway in Mission. Ground was broken Sunday after a legal fight partially ended.

More at: https://www.krgv.com/news/work-on-privately-funded-border-wall-begins/

[tfurrh]

https://www.texastribune.org/2020/07/02/texas-border-wall-private/amp/?__twitter_impression=true


He built a privately funded border wall. It's already at risk of falling down if not fixed.

https://thumbnails.texastribune.org/QjuZt9rcgPAiXIn3R1al0j7Wero=/1200x804/smart/filters:quality(70)/https://static.texastribune.org/media/files/c0b34d3d8e88f5a11e153c2e19b597dc/Border%20Wall%20Erosion%20VGC%20TT%2025.jpg

[Swordsmyth]

https://www.texastribune.org/2020/07/02/texas-border-wall-private/amp/?__twitter_impression=true



https://thumbnails.texastribune.org/QjuZt9rcgPAiXIn3R1al0j7Wero=/1200x804/smart/filters:quality(70)/https://static.texastribune.org/media/files/c0b34d3d8e88f5a11e153c2e19b597dc/Border%20Wall%20Erosion%20VGC%20TT%2025.jpg
Fisher dismissed the concerns. A company attorney, Mark Courtois, called the erosion “a normal part of new construction projects like this and does not in any way compromise the fence or associated roadway.” The company will seek to build drainage ditches to lessen the deterioration, he added.

Fisher has said his wall — about a mile south of where the government is already building its version — will finally bring “border security to the border” through a design that erases the flooding and erosion concerns that had scuttled earlier plans and vastly speeds up construction time.
It would be the first wall system that wouldn’t cause flooding or deflect water, We Build the Wall founder Brian Kolfage claimed in a tweet. “The best engineers in the world designed this for floods, not government employees.”

Courtois, the company attorney, did not comment on the maintenance issue, but he said the fence and roadway have performed as intended and are structurally sound. He said Fisher had personally inspected the site last week and attributed the erosion to light surface sand and the parts where “vegetation has not yet fully taken hold.”

[tfurrh]

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1282276752090431490?s=19

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1282276752090431490?s=19

I disagreed with doing this very small (tiny) section of wall, in a tricky area, by a private group which raised money by ads. It was only done to make me look bad, and perhsps it now doesn’t even work. Should have been built like rest of Wall, 500 plus miles.

[Cap]

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1282276752090431490?s=19

1282276752090431490

I disagreed with doing this very small (tiny) section of wall, in a tricky area, by a private group which raised money by ads. It was only done to make me look bad, and perhsps it now doesn’t even work. Should have been built like rest of Wall, 500 plus miles.It's always about the New York lib.