Gov pours cold water on Burning Man Festival

[Pauls' Revere]

https://www.yahoo.com/gma/government-squaring-off-burning-man-organizers-over-barriers-151051608--abc-news-tech.html

The decision didn’t sit well with Burners.

"Many of the measures recommended by BLM are unreasonable, untenable, attempt to solve problems that don’t exist, and/or create new (and worse) problems," Burning Man Project wrote in a fact-checking statement.

"Altogether, these requirements would fundamentally change the operational integrity and cultural fabric of Black Rock City, and would spell the end of the event as we know it," the group added. "This is not an exaggeration."


Burners realizing what we here already know. If you don't like the problems government causes, wait until you see the solutions. Sadly, though I'm willing to bet most will still vote for bigger and more government.

[dannno]

But central to the ethos of the week is sense of self-governance, which is why the new government proposals are particularly ingratiating.


"We are our own city. We have no government, and I’m not saying it would work in everyday, but keeping the feds as far away as possible from encroaching into the event has worked OK thus far. Now, that’s not to say they aren’t present every year. But they’ve not built a f------ wall around us and it’s been just fine," Jones said.


The tension with the government has taken some longtime Burners by surprise.


"They, Burning Man Project, has worked with BLM together for so long, it’s generally been a very collaborative relationship," said Cabe Franklin, a New Yorker who has attended 14 times since 2000...

[dannno]

Time lapse of Burning Man 2013 (69,613 in attendance)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qNrEqSAviTI

[dannno]

Chicks make the best DJs


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YpF60XOmzKA

[Stratovarious]

Burners realizing what we here already know. If you don't like the problems government causes, wait until you see the solutions. Sadly, though I'm willing to bet most will still vote for bigger and more government.

H aha///////

''...and I'm here to help.'' RR

[Danke]

We should send @TheTexan (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/member.php?u=33245) there to set up a RPFs booth.

[TheTexan]

We should sent TheTexan there to set up a RPFs booth.

The more prudent option is to nuke it from orbit.

It's the only way to be sure.

[buck000]

"First the BLM came for the rancher, but I didn't care, because it didn't matter to my art party in the desert..."

[ATruepatriot]

The problem is... Just like the pipeline protests, they have absolutely no respect for the local area and communities. They come and stomp all over locals with no respect at all. They create their own problems and then blame others for it.

The LA idiots did the same thing to themselves with this event because they were trashing the locals and the Colorado River.

https://www.havasunews.com/free_access/laughlin-river-regatta-canceled/article_a6d1b29c-5c5a-11e9-aec4-8705d47e2830.html

https://lasvegassun.com/news/2016/aug/16/heaps-trash-regatta-bullhead-city-rethink-river/

https://photos.lasvegassun.com/media/img/photos/2016/08/15/20160813_bullhead_city_river_regatta_4_t653.jpg?21 4bc4f9d9bd7c08c7d0f6599bb3328710e01e7b

[acptulsa]

But central to the ethos of the week is sense of self-governance, which is why the new government proposals are particularly ingratiating.

https://i.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/facebook/000/010/692/19789999.jpg

[Danke]

The more prudent option is to nuke it from orbit.

It's the only way to be sure.

6396

[dannno]

The problem is... Just like the pipeline protests, they have absolutely no respect for the local area and communities. They come and stomp all over locals with no respect at all. They create their own problems and then blame others for it.

The LA idiots did the same thing to themselves with this event because they were trashing the locals and the Colorado River.

https://www.havasunews.com/free_access/laughlin-river-regatta-canceled/article_a6d1b29c-5c5a-11e9-aec4-8705d47e2830.html

https://lasvegassun.com/news/2016/aug/16/heaps-trash-regatta-bullhead-city-rethink-river/

https://photos.lasvegassun.com/media/img/photos/2016/08/15/20160813_bullhead_city_river_regatta_4_t653.jpg?21 4bc4f9d9bd7c08c7d0f6599bb3328710e01e7b


Uhm, that's total BS. This is not a college "spring break" type event, it's a bunch of anarchist leaning hippies. They leave no trace and clean up after themselves. There are no 'locals' in this city, they are in the middle of the desert.

[ATruepatriot]

Uhm, that's total BS. This is not a college "spring break" type event, it's a bunch of anarchist leaning hippies. They leave no trace and clean up after themselves. There are no 'locals' in this city, they are in the middle of the desert.

Maybe not right at the site, but there are always residuals and side effects from these things in the surrounding area. They are hypocrites.

http://www.sfweekly.com/news/thousands-of-abandoned-burning-man-bikes-saved-from-dump/

Pipeline Protest to "protect the environment".

https://www.opslens.com/2017/02/standing-rock-dapl-protests-garbage-abandoned/

[ATruepatriot]

Uhm, that's total BS. This is not a college "spring break" type event, it's a bunch of anarchist leaning hippies. They leave no trace and clean up after themselves. There are no 'locals' in this city, they are in the middle of the desert.

https://www.sfgate.com/travel/burningman/article/Burning-Man-garbage-reno-dumping-leave-no-trace-13186812.php

https://eplaya.burningman.org/viewtopic.php?t=32184

[dannno]

Maybe not right at the site, but there are always residuals and side effects from these things in the surrounding area. They are hypocrites.

http://www.sfweekly.com/news/thousands-of-abandoned-burning-man-bikes-saved-from-dump/

People leave bikes, the event organizers donate them to charity. Don't see the problem, or why that makes them hypocrites.




Pipeline Protest to "protect the environment".

https://www.opslens.com/2017/02/standing-rock-dapl-protests-garbage-abandoned/

I'm not defending the pipeline protesters.


https://www.sfgate.com/travel/burningman/article/Burning-Man-garbage-reno-dumping-leave-no-trace-13186812.php

Keep in mind, Reno is a 3.5 hour drive from the event.. It is the closest major city, but it has nothing to do with the event.

There are ways to resolve this problem, though, much better than what the BLM is recommending. Event organizers could purchase dumpsters in Reno or any cities that have this issue and direct the attendees to dump their trash there if they go through those towns. It's too expensive to have the dumpsters out at the playa, and you don't want people to be able to bring way more crap than they can leave with because then you just have people bringing loads of stuff there.

If they can have the participants all drive it out to a city and pay for it to be thrown away, that would be a good solution, as opposed to what the BLM is asking for which is to have trash cans at the event. Like I said, that is a bad idea and just going to create more problems because you will potentially have people bringing multiple loads of stuff in that they can't take with them, and it will create bigger waste problems.

I totally see what they are talking about, and what they mean when they say that BLM's solutions are going to create more problems than they solve.




https://eplaya.burningman.org/viewtopic.php?t=32184

If you kept reading that thread they say that the event organizers go out and clean the trash off those roads as well, so like the bikes, it's not like it just gets left there.




A side note, last year after Burning Man I was hanging out in a town that was a straight shot from Black Rock City -> Los Angeles. I saw hundreds of people traveling through coming back from Burning Man. I met a few of them at a hot springs. I did not see a single piece of trash anywhere, or illegally dumped trash or anything.

[ATruepatriot]

People leave bikes, the event organizers donate them to charity. Don't see the problem, or why that makes them hypocrites.




I'm not defending the pipeline protesters.



Keep in mind, Reno is a 3.5 hour drive from the event.. It is the closest major city, but it has nothing to do with the event.

There are ways to resolve this problem, though, much better than what the BLM is recommending. Event organizers could purchase dumpsters in Reno or any cities that have this issue and direct the attendees to dump their trash there if they go through those towns. It's too expensive to have the dumpsters out at the playa, and you don't want people to be able to bring way more crap than they can leave with because then you just have people bringing loads of stuff there.

If they can have the participants all drive it out to a city and pay for it to be thrown away, that would be a good solution, as opposed to what the BLM is asking for which is to have trash cans at the event. Like I said, that is a bad idea and just going to create more problems because you will potentially have people bringing multiple loads of stuff in that they can't take with them, and it will create bigger waste problems.

I totally see what they are talking about, and what they mean when they say that BLM's solutions are going to create more problems than they solve.




If you kept reading that thread they say that the event organizers go out and clean the trash off those roads as well, so like the bikes, it's not like it just gets left there.




A side note, last year after Burning Man I was hanging out in a town that was a straight shot from Black Rock City -> Los Angeles. I saw hundreds of people traveling through coming back from Burning Man. I met a few of them at a hot springs. I did not see a single piece of trash anywhere, or illegally dumped trash or anything.

I'll be back on this. Because I have to now go pull the quotes out of those articles I gave you proving my point because you didn't actually read them. Just so you know though, I used to work for Waste Management (garbage) and worked out of Reno and Sparks many many times and have direct inside local knowledge about this. The biggest problem is these folks filling private garbage bins and cans forcing them to pay out of their own pockets for several extra dumps so that they themselves have room for their own garbage. The idiots would fill store commercial bins and then pile another two bins full IN FRONT of the bins. How do we even get to the bin to dump it? We would have to move a mountain out of the way to even get to the bin, dump it and then refill it, idiots with no common sense at all. Our customers would have to pay for all those extra dumps out of their own pockets both private residential and commercial. So their mess just located from one place to another and created a burden on hundreds of others, most of whom never benefited from the event at all, just suffered the burden that was unduly placed on them.

There is much more to this story...

[dannno]

I'll be back on this. Because I have to now go pull the quotes out of those articles I gave you proving my point because you didn't actually read them. Just so you know though, I used to work for Waste Management (garbage) and worked out of Reno and Sparks many many times and have direct inside local knowledge about this. The biggest problem is these folks filling private garbage bins and cans forcing them to pay out of their own pockets for several extra dumps so that they themselves have room for their own garbage. The idiots would fill store commercial bins and then pile another two bins full IN FRONT of the bins. How do we even get to the bin to dump it? We would have to move a mountain out of the way to even get to the bin, dump it and then refill it, idiots with no common sense at all. Our customers would have to pay for all those extra dumps out of their own pockets both private residential and commercial. So their mess just located from one place to another and created a burden on hundreds of others, most of whom never benefited from the event at all, just suffered the burden that was unduly placed on them.

There is much more to this story...

Uh, no, you need to read MY post.

All of your links were garbage and didn't prove any of your points except that one where you said people go dump their stuff in Reno. I agreed that was a problem, even though the festival is 3.5 hours away from Reno. I told you what the solution is, and it is very simple yet you didn't bring it up. What the BLM is recommending they do will make the problem worse, overall.

[dannno]

I'm guessing ATruepatriot wants to go even further than BLM and shut down Burning Man altogether, rather than solve the problems. That's not very freedom oriented. It's not like these problems can't be easily solved. BLM is trying to solve them, but their solutions will create more problems, as I already explained.

The only problem, as far as I can tell, is people not having a place to dispose of their trash when they get back to the cities. That doesn't seem like much of a problem, in fact it is a business opportunity. One person was throwing away their garbage for $8/bag. That is waaaayyy too much, but when you have a business with high demand and low supply you get to charge a lot. That means there needs to be an increase in supply. Rent out a bunch of dumpsters, put them on an empty lot, and charge $5/car and $10/trailer/RV to get in and they can throw away as much as they want.

Make sure they break everything down, they can put construction supplies like wood and PVC in piles over thar and trash in the dumpsters.

Have Burning Man advertise the location of these places to their attendees so they know where they can go dump stuff after the week is done.

[ATruepatriot]

I'm guessing ATruepatriot wants to go even further than BLM and shut down Burning Man altogether, rather than solve the problems. That's not very freedom oriented. It's not like these problems can't be easily solved. BLM is trying to solve them, but their solutions will create more problems, as I already explained.

The only problem, as far as I can tell, is people not having a place to dispose of their trash when they get back to the cities. That doesn't seem like much of a problem, in fact it is a business opportunity. One person was throwing away their garbage for $8/bag. That is waaaayyy too much, but when you have a business with high demand and low supply you get to charge a lot. That means there needs to be an increase in supply. Rent out a bunch of dumpsters, put them on an empty lot, and charge $5/car and $10/trailer/RV to get in and they can throw away as much as they want.

Make sure they break everything down, they can put construction supplies like wood and PVC in piles over thar and trash in the dumpsters.

Have Burning Man advertise the location of these places to their attendees so they know where they can go dump stuff after the week is done.

Absolutely NOT, I hate the BLM and have been in a personal feud with them and the Sierra Club for YEARS. I absolutely support the chance to do things like this. I am just pointing out that the people who attend these things are hypocrites and are in no way personally responsible for their own actions and residuals that come from their actions. They claim to be, and they make efforts, but in the end the reality is they are still trashing the locals with an indirect cause and effect. They ruin it for themselves. While the businesses might like it, the local citizens do not.

[dannno]

Absolutely NOT, I hate the BLM and have been in a personal feud with them and the Sierra Club for YEARS. I absolutely support the chance to do things like this. I am just pointing out that the people who attend these things are hypocrites and are in no way personally responsible for their own actions and residuals that come from their actions. They claim to be, and they make efforts, but in the end the reality is they are still trashing the locals with an indirect cause and effect. They ruin it for themselves. While the businesses might like it, the local citizens do not.

The local citizens who don't like it are apparently just too stupid to open up a business and profit off of it...

Once a year you have a bunch of people coming into town in desperate need of a service, trash removal.. and the date is known way ahead of time. It's a city that can absolutely handle it, not some po-dunk place..

[Pauls' Revere]

Absolutely NOT, I hate the BLM and have been in a personal feud with them and the Sierra Club for YEARS. I absolutely support the chance to do things like this. I am just pointing out that the people who attend these things are hypocrites and are in no way personally responsible for their own actions and residuals that come from their actions. They claim to be, and they make efforts, but in the end the reality is they are still trashing the locals with an indirect cause and effect. They ruin it for themselves. While the businesses might like it, the local citizens do not.

and this is a HUGE concern with the 50th Woodstock event and a huge reason why it was cancelled. They expected like 100K people and I'm sure it would be trashed. However, a stadium can hold a lot of people and has the facilities.

[ATruepatriot]

and this is a HUGE concern with the 50th Woodstock event and a huge reason why it was cancelled. They expected like 100K people and I'm sure it would be trashed. However, a stadium can hold a lot of people and has the facilities.

But what they want is sex, drugs, and rock and roll. And all at the same time. Can't do the first two in a stadium. lol

[Pauls' Revere]

But what they want is sex, drugs, and rock and roll. And all at the same time. Can't do the first two in a stadium. lol

I use to go to "Day on the Green" back in the day in O-Town.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Day_on_the_Green

Day on the Green was a recurring concert in Oakland, California, presented by promoter Bill Graham and his company Bill Graham Presents. Held at the Oakland Coliseum, these events began in 1973 and continued into the early 1990s. The last Day on the Green overseen by Graham took place the same month as his death in a helicopter crash in 1991. There was a series of Day on the Green shows the following year in the wake of Graham's death and there were other shows in 1994-97 at the Oakland Coliseum Stadium - namely U2, Pink Floyd, and the Rolling Stones.

1982

Day On The Green #1: Journey, Santana, Toto, Gamma, The Tubes (June 26, 1982).
Day On The Green #2: Foreigner, Loverboy, Scorpions, Iron Maiden (July 18, 1982).
Day On The Green #3: The Who, The Clash, T-Bone Burnett (October 23, 1982).[2]

Good times, I actually did push ups back stage with The Clash during their Combat Rock Tour. Although that was at a much smaller venue.

[ATruepatriot]

I use to go to "Day on the Green" back in the day in O-Town.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Day_on_the_Green

Day on the Green was a recurring concert in Oakland, California, presented by promoter Bill Graham and his company Bill Graham Presents. Held at the Oakland Coliseum, these events began in 1973 and continued into the early 1990s. The last Day on the Green overseen by Graham took place the same month as his death in a helicopter crash in 1991. There was a series of Day on the Green shows the following year in the wake of Graham's death and there were other shows in 1994-97 at the Oakland Coliseum Stadium - namely U2, Pink Floyd, and the Rolling Stones.

1982

Day On The Green #1: Journey, Santana, Toto, Gamma, The Tubes (June 26, 1982).
Day On The Green #2: Foreigner, Loverboy, Scorpions, Iron Maiden (July 18, 1982).
Day On The Green #3: The Who, The Clash, T-Bone Burnett (October 23, 1982).[2]

Good times, I actually did push ups back stage with The Clash during their Combat Rock Tour. Although that was at a much smaller venue.

Been to a LOT of concerts in my life all over the country, The biggest was the US Festival in 83 at Glen Helen. :)

[Pauls' Revere]

Been to a LOT of concerts in my life all over the country, The biggest was the US Festival in 83 at Glen Helen. :)

Me to bro, Pink Floyd at RFK Stadium, Rush (Presto Tour) at Tidewater VA, B.O.C., Metallica (before they got stupid),Nine Inch Nails.

[ATruepatriot]

Me to bro, Pink Floyd at RFK Stadium, Rush (Presto Tour) at Tidewater VA, B.O.C., Metallica (before they got stupid),Nine Inch Nails.

I don't think there is anyone I haven't been to see since the mid 70's. I am a musician and lived for concerts. Traveled halfway across the states for some of them. lol

[Pauls' Revere]

The more prudent option is to nuke it from orbit.

It's the only way to be sure.

LOL The Ultimate Burning Man experience, It goes up in a mushroom cloud. [insert image]

[Pauls' Revere]

I don't think there is anyone I haven't been to see since the mid 70's. I am a musician and lived for concerts. Traveled halfway across the states for some of them. lol

Concerts are pricey these days too.

[ATruepatriot]

Concerts are pricey these days too.

Never a problem if it is a group worth seeing. I have slowed down though, all the music and groups I like are all dead or dying now. Most everything now is not worth paying the price or making the effort.