PDA

View Full Version : Wisconsin to give Driver's Licenses to illegals




Swordsmyth
03-04-2019, 05:04 PM
https://twitter.com/GovEvers/status/1101289976896126976

1101289976896126976



More Demoncrat votes.

Anti Federalist
03-04-2019, 05:39 PM
D/L are universally used to obtain voting access.

It's bad enough my vote must compete against freedom stealing idiot AmeriKunts.

It should never have to compete against foreign nationals, most of who are fleeing the communist/socialist shitholes they created.

Therefore this news from the newly elected Bolsheviks in WI is relevant, timely and appreciated.

oyarde
03-04-2019, 05:42 PM
Wisc will be one of the few key states up for grabs .

oyarde
03-04-2019, 05:44 PM
While bernie would easily win madison it is not likely they can win the state without a little fraud . Fraud is the only promise the dems can ever deliver on .

Swordsmyth
03-04-2019, 05:46 PM
^^^ I disagree

D/L are universally used to obtain voting access.

It's bad enough my vote must compete against freedom stealing idiot AmeriKunts.

It should never have to compete against foreign nationals, most of who are fleeing the communist/socialist $#@!holes they created.

Therefore this news from the newly elected Bolsheviks in WI is relevant, timely and appreciated.
CaptUSA has made it his personal mission in life to drive me off of this site just because he disagrees with me, we will see if the mods do anything about it or not.

Zippyjuan
03-04-2019, 05:46 PM
Immigrant licenses usually have some note on them indicating that they are not proof of citizenship and cannot be used to register to vote.

https://s3.amazonaws.com/law-media/uploads/131/52515/large/driver-s_20license.jpg?1526489405

https://www.aclunc.org/sites/default/files/styles/large/public/ab60_license.jpg?itok=i_WzZVTA


5.2. What can an AB 60 license NOT do?

An AB 60 license is not valid for official federal purposes. Therefore it does NOT:

Make the holder eligible for employment,
Allow the holder to register to vote, or
Allow the holder to obtain public benefits.34
It also does not protect against discrimination from:

Federal law enforcement agencies, or
Law enforcement from other states.

https://www.shouselaw.com/12500.html

Swordsmyth
03-04-2019, 05:51 PM
Immigrant licenses usually have some note on them indicating that they are not proof of citizenship and cannot be used to register to vote.

https://s3.amazonaws.com/law-media/uploads/131/52515/large/driver-s_20license.jpg?1526489405

https://www.aclunc.org/sites/default/files/styles/large/public/ab60_license.jpg?itok=i_WzZVTA



https://www.shouselaw.com/12500.html

That doesn't matter when leftist government workers ignore it.:seenoevil:

And not all states do that.

Zippyjuan
03-04-2019, 05:54 PM
That doesn't matter when leftist government workers ignore it.:seenoevil:

And not all states do that.

Which ones don't?

Swordsmyth
03-04-2019, 05:55 PM
Which ones don't?
You tell me:


http://www.ronpaulforums.com/images/misc/quote_icon.png Originally Posted by Zippyjuan http://www.ronpaulforums.com/images/buttons/viewpost-right.png (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?p=6761247#post6761247)

Immigrant licenses usually have some note on them indicating that they are not proof of citizenship and cannot be used to register to vote.

Stratovarious
03-04-2019, 05:59 PM
Immigrant licenses usually have some note on them indicating that they are not proof of citizenship and cannot be used to register to vote.

https://s3.amazonaws.com/law-media/uploads/131/52515/large/driver-s_20license.jpg?1526489405

https://www.aclunc.org/sites/default/files/styles/large/public/ab60_license.jpg?itok=i_WzZVTA



https://www.shouselaw.com/12500.html


The topic is not immigrants, the topic is Illegals.

Anti Federalist
03-04-2019, 06:22 PM
CaptUSA has made it his personal mission in life to drive me off of this site just because he disagrees with me, we will see if the mods do anything about it or not.

That's unfortunate.

I'm not in favor of that, any more than I am in favor of banning Zippy.

Outside of obvious spam-bots hawking dick pills or "How To Make $5000 A Week From Home", I disapprove of bans and "run-offs" and "rep-burns".

Zippyjuan
03-04-2019, 06:30 PM
You tell me:

Besides California, Colorado:

https://cbsdenver.files.wordpress.com/2014/07/drivers-license.jpg?w=1500

Connecticut:

https://assets.dmvcheatsheets.com/assets/articles/images/000/000/282/original/ct_undocumented_immigrant.jpg?1419375125

Delaware:

https://delawarestatenews.net/wp-content/uploads/2016/06/22dsn-Driving-privilege-card.jpg

Hawaii:

http://www.hawaiinewsnow.com/resizer/5PeSGQyJdxk93Jf5xwZVhQ3rZ8o=/1200x600/arc-anglerfish-arc2-prod-raycom.s3.amazonaws.com/public/4SUQYPN4YJEQFHMQXVO7BYFZQU.jpg

Illinois:

http://mediad.publicbroadcasting.net/p/wsiu/files/201301/ILTempDriversLicense.jpg

Maryland:

https://bloximages.newyork1.vip.townnews.com/fredericknewspost.com/content/tncms/assets/v3/editorial/7/d5/7d5815ec-4549-11e3-b000-001a4bcf6878/52778decf17f9.image.jpg?resize=400%2C251

New Mexico:

https://d3el53au0d7w62.cloudfront.net/wp-content/uploads/2016/11/16/a01_jd_15nov_id1.jpg

Nevada:

https://immigration.procon.org/files/1-illegal-immigration-images/dmvnv-sample-privilege-card.jpg

Utah:

https://www.ocregister.com/wp-content/uploads/migration/ntg/ntgoru-b88489144z.120150821190929000g4pbh824.10.jpg?w=620

Vermont:

http://truenorthreports.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/07/DPCCompressed.jpg

Washington is working on changing their licenses. These are all the states which currently issue driver's licenses to illegal immigrants.

Stratovarious
03-04-2019, 06:33 PM
That's unfortunate.

I'm not in favor of that, any more than I am in favor of banning Zippy.

Outside of obvious spam-bots hawking dick pills or "How To Make $5000 A Week From Home", I disapprove of bans and "run-offs" and "rep-burns".

But you're ok with censorship ?

Stratovarious
03-04-2019, 06:36 PM
While bernie would easily win madison it is not likely they can win the state without a little fraud . Fraud is the only promise the dems can ever deliver on .

''You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to oyarde again.''

Fraud, and robbery, take if from us, give it to the illegal voting base.

Swordsmyth
03-04-2019, 06:37 PM
Besides California, Colorado:

https://cbsdenver.files.wordpress.com/2014/07/drivers-license.jpg?w=1500

Connecticut:

https://assets.dmvcheatsheets.com/assets/articles/images/000/000/282/original/ct_undocumented_immigrant.jpg?1419375125

Delaware:

https://delawarestatenews.net/wp-content/uploads/2016/06/22dsn-Driving-privilege-card.jpg

Hawaii:

http://www.hawaiinewsnow.com/resizer/5PeSGQyJdxk93Jf5xwZVhQ3rZ8o=/1200x600/arc-anglerfish-arc2-prod-raycom.s3.amazonaws.com/public/4SUQYPN4YJEQFHMQXVO7BYFZQU.jpg

Illinois:

http://mediad.publicbroadcasting.net/p/wsiu/files/201301/ILTempDriversLicense.jpg

Maryland:

https://bloximages.newyork1.vip.townnews.com/fredericknewspost.com/content/tncms/assets/v3/editorial/7/d5/7d5815ec-4549-11e3-b000-001a4bcf6878/52778decf17f9.image.jpg?resize=400%2C251

New Mexico:

https://d3el53au0d7w62.cloudfront.net/wp-content/uploads/2016/11/16/a01_jd_15nov_id1.jpg

Nevada:

https://immigration.procon.org/files/1-illegal-immigration-images/dmvnv-sample-privilege-card.jpg

Utah:

https://www.ocregister.com/wp-content/uploads/migration/ntg/ntgoru-b88489144z.120150821190929000g4pbh824.10.jpg?w=620

Vermont:

http://truenorthreports.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/07/DPCCompressed.jpg

Washington is working on changing their licenses. These are all the states which currently issue driver's licenses to illegal immigrants.
And as I said, it doesn't make any difference when leftist government workers look the other way or the DMV automatically registers them to vote as has been shown to happen.

AngryCanadian
03-04-2019, 06:37 PM
How does giving undocumented people driver’s licenses and ID cards make roads and our communities safer? when their names are fake!?

Anti Globalist
03-04-2019, 06:49 PM
Wisconsins governor is a lunatic.

CaptUSA
03-04-2019, 07:44 PM
That's unfortunate.

I'm not in favor of that, any more than I am in favor of banning Zippy.

Outside of obvious spam-bots hawking dick pills or "How To Make $5000 A Week From Home", I disapprove of bans and "run-offs" and "rep-burns".

It would be unfortunate if it were true. I've never been in favor of bans. But I do have a problem when agents of governments stick their noses in to a liberty movement to stir up trouble and discord. Whether they're straight hires or freelance. When we find these people out, we should ensure that no visitor mistakes these people for "real" posters. Whether that be Zippy, SS, or any of the other half dozen or so agent provocateurs.

I think you'd understand that better than most. I never have a problem disagreeing on an issue with anyone. That makes life interesting. But this is not disagreement. This is shining the light on these interlopers that have acquired dormant accounts to sow division. Notice how they always focus on collectivism?? Notice how the accounts they take lie dormant for years before becoming prolific posters? Notice how they continually probe for new accounts to use? They used to send these infiltrators into bike gangs and civil rights organizations; now, they just use the internet.

I think it's important that we all recognize them for who they are. No need to ban them, but no need to make them comfortable, either.

Zippyjuan
03-04-2019, 07:50 PM
How does giving undocumented people driver’s licenses and ID cards make roads and our communities safer? when their names are fake!?

Having to pass the driver's tests makes certain they know the rules of the road. But even citizens can be idiot drivers. I believe they have to have insurance as well.

https://www.sacbee.com/news/politics-government/capitol-alert/article207939584.html


A study published in Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences showed hit-and-run accidents dropped in California after AB 60 went into effect, and had no discernible impact on the total number of crashes or auto-related fatalities in the state. The California Research Bureau's required January 2018 report found no AB 60 license holders had filed complaints with state agencies alleging discrimination related to their license ownership.

Swordsmyth
03-04-2019, 07:51 PM
It would be unfortunate if it were true. I've never been in favor of bans. But I do have a problem when agents of governments stick their noses in to a liberty movement to stir up trouble and discord. Whether they're straight hires or freelance. When we find these people out, we should ensure that no visitor mistakes these people for "real" posters. Whether that be Zippy, SS, or any of the other half dozen or so agent provocateurs.

I think you'd understand that better than most. I never have a problem disagreeing on an issue with anyone. That makes life interesting. But this is not disagreement. This is shining the light on these interlopers that have acquired dormant accounts to sow division. Notice how they always focus on collectivism?? Notice how the accounts they take lie dormant for years before becoming prolific posters? Notice how they continually probe for new accounts to use? They used to send these infiltrators into bike gangs and civil rights organizations; now, they just use the internet.

I think it's important that we all recognize them for who they are. No need to ban them, but no need to make them comfortable, either.
You have no proof or even any decent evidence, you targeted me because you disagree with me about positions that other members of this site also hold and now you feel free to slander me in blatant violation of site rules in spite of the fact that my positions are not contrary to the site mission.

CaptUSA
03-04-2019, 08:09 PM
Gotta love it when the agents pull out the victim card. :rolleyes:

Just wait... Jay Dobyns played the victim card too. But then his employers turned the tables on him and threw him right under that bus.

Seriously, I hope no RPFers ever get caught up in this little scheme.

acptulsa
03-04-2019, 09:12 PM
Gotta love it when the agents pull out the victim card. :rolleyes:.

When do they not play the victim card?

Oh, wait. You're right. First they inject their pet opinion in every thread, related or not to the topic, and throw sarcastic emojis around like three year old girls with glitter. Then they call everyone who disagrees traitors to the country. THEN they play the victim card.

AngryCanadian
03-04-2019, 09:41 PM
Having to pass the driver's tests makes certain they know the rules of the road. But even citizens can be idiot drivers. I believe they have to have insurance as well.

https://www.sacbee.com/news/politics-government/capitol-alert/article207939584.html

You do realize they have fake names right? majority of undocumented people always land with fake IDs and fake names.

devil21
03-04-2019, 10:03 PM
Gotta get 'em under the legal jurisdiction of the state so they can be taxed and fee'ed into poverty like every proud flag-waving American slave does. Can't have 'em claiming lack of jurisdiction (no contract agreed to) and silly stuff like that.

Swordsmyth
03-04-2019, 10:11 PM
Gotta get 'em under the legal jurisdiction of the state so they can be taxed and fee'ed into poverty like every proud flag-waving American slave does. Can't have 'em claiming lack of jurisdiction (no contract agreed to) and silly stuff like that.
LOL
As if any illegals have ever heard of those defunct portions of the UCC and the associated red herring theories.

devil21
03-04-2019, 10:18 PM
LOL
As if any illegals have ever heard of those defunct portions of the UCC and the associated red herring theories.

More ShillSmyth lies. Yawn. Seems you disappeared for a while to let the heat subside after CaptUSA kicked your ass, now you're back pushing the same old lies you were before.

Swordsmyth
03-04-2019, 10:22 PM
More ShillSmyth lies. Yawn. Seems you disappeared for a while to let the heat subside after CaptUSA kicked your ass, now you're back pushing the same old lies you were before.
LOL

Ender
03-04-2019, 10:52 PM
You have no proof or even any decent evidence, you targeted me because you disagree with me about positions that other members of this site also hold and now you feel free to slander me in blatant violation of site rules in spite of the fact that my positions are not contrary to the site mission.

Well, that's a load of BS. YOU were the one that targeted CaptUSA and brought up the boo-hoos before he was even on this thread. YOU were the one sowing hate & discontent about something that had nothing to do with the OP- and then blaming him.

Maybe it's time to GROW. UP. And grow a pair.

Swordsmyth
03-04-2019, 10:57 PM
Well, that's a load of BS. YOU were the one that targeted @CaptUSA (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/member.php?u=30558) and brought up the boo-hoos before he was even on this thread. YOU were the one sowing hate & discontent about something that had nothing to do with the OP- and then blaming him.

Maybe it's time to GROW. UP. And grow a pair.
LOL

More lies from the guy who defends every troll on the forum.

Ender
03-04-2019, 10:59 PM
LOL

More lies from the guy who defends every troll on the forum.

LOL- if that were true, I'd be defending you.

Swordsmyth
03-04-2019, 11:01 PM
LOL- if that were true, I'd be defending you.
LOL

Swordsmyth
03-04-2019, 11:04 PM
Well, that's a load of BS. YOU were the one that targeted @CaptUSA (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/member.php?u=30558) and brought up the boo-hoos before he was even on this thread. YOU were the one sowing hate & discontent about something that had nothing to do with the OP- and then blaming him.

Maybe it's time to GROW. UP. And grow a pair.
Where were your calls for civility when CaptUSA started harassing me with sexual insults? (only some of which got deleted by the mods)

r3volution 3.0
03-05-2019, 12:09 AM
Good, glad to hear it.

Only an idiot would think the state ought to have to give a person a piece of plastic in order for that person to be able to drive on the road.

Swordsmyth
03-05-2019, 12:14 AM
Good, glad to hear it.

Only an idiot would think the state ought to have to give a person a piece of plastic in order for that person to be able to drive on the road.
It is about allowing them to be registered to vote by the DMV so they can vote for the communists.

r3volution 3.0
03-05-2019, 12:14 AM
It is about allowing them to be registered to vote by the DMV so they can vote for the communists.

You and similar idiots vote for the communists every election.

In the meantime, let's let people drive.

Swordsmyth
03-05-2019, 12:21 AM
You and similar idiots vote for the communists every election.

LOL



In the meantime, let's let people drive.
Let's drive the invaders out instead, we can talk about ending DLs for everyone but that is a different question.

r3volution 3.0
03-05-2019, 12:26 AM
Let's drive the invaders out instead, we can talk about ending DLs for everyone but that is a different question.

Let's drive out all the people who vote the wrong way; o, wait, that'd be more or less the entire population.

...maybe more, less, or different voting isn't the solution?

...maybe it's monstrous to entrust the average person with this, and then have him suffer the consequences?

...maybe that's exceptionally inhumane, like releasing a house pet into the wild to fend for itself?

...maybe the "freedom" of writing some words on paper every couple years is positively destructive of liberty?

:confused:

Swordsmyth
03-05-2019, 12:33 AM
Let's drive out all the people who vote the wrong way; o, wait, that'd be more or less the entire population.

...maybe more, less, or different voting isn't the solution?

...maybe it's monstrous to entrust the average person with this, and then have him suffer the consequences?

...maybe that's exceptionally inhumane, like releasing a house pet into the wild to fend for itself?

...maybe the "freedom" of writing some words on paper every couple years is positively destructive of liberty?

:confused:
Maybe dangerous as liberty is tyranny is more dangerous, if men are only marginally capable of governing themselves how can they be capable of governing others with no checks on their power?

If those who receive government money were barred from voting we would be in a much better position to have a minimal government and keep it.

r3volution 3.0
03-05-2019, 01:48 AM
Maybe dangerous as liberty is tyranny is more dangerous

You're confused; what I was describing wasn't liberty.

People writing a name on a piece of paper every so often =/= liberty.


if men are only marginally capable of governing themselves how can they be capable of governing others with no checks on their power?

How are men capable of managing private enterprises? The profit motive (contra ideology).

The only reliable motive is self-interest.

This is why the market economy works.


If those who receive government money were barred from voting we would be in a much better position to have a minimal government and keep it.

That isn't feasible for reasons I've explained to Madison.

Those who don't presently get free stuff have incentive to vote for it going forward, among other problems.

Anti Federalist
03-05-2019, 02:01 AM
But you're ok with censorship ?

OK...fine...I'll play.

"Gee whilikers, what censorship?"

:rolleyes:

Swordsmyth
03-05-2019, 02:04 AM
You're confused; what I was describing wasn't liberty.

People writing a name on a piece of paper every so often =/= liberty.



How are men capable of managing private enterprises? The profit motive (contra ideology).

The only reliable motive is self-interest.

This is why the market economy works.
Most people do a terrible job of managing their own interests and their own interests do not always align with the rights of others, history is full of tyrants not benevolent dictators.




That isn't feasible for reasons I've explained to Madison.

Those who don't presently get free stuff have incentive to vote for it going forward, among other problems.
And they would then be removed from the voter pool, the remaining voters would then either reverse the welfare that was voted in or leave it in order to keep those voters off the rolls and create a hard limit to the amount of government intervention in the market place, either way would prevent things from getting anywhere near as bad as we are now.

r3volution 3.0
03-05-2019, 03:09 AM
Most people do a terrible job of managing their own interests and their own interests do not always align with the rights of others, history is full of tyrants not benevolent dictators.

The "invisible hand" (a perfect term) works precisely because the character of the average person leaves something to be desired.

Greed is good; it is the only thing holding civilization together.


And they would then be removed from the voter pool, the remaining voters would then either reverse the welfare that was voted in or leave it in order to keep those voters off the rolls and create a hard limit to the amount of government intervention in the market place, either way would prevent things from getting anywhere near as bad as we are now.

Good luck with that experiment.

Stratovarious
03-05-2019, 05:24 AM
That's unfortunate.

I'm not in favor of that, any more than I am in favor of banning Zippy.

...


OK...fine...I'll play.

"Gee whilikers, what censorship?"

:rolleyes:


ha ha ahaaa.

You'll play' ?

Wut Censorship?

You think this site is not Censored?

:clap: :clap: :clap:

Superfluous Man
03-05-2019, 07:44 AM
D/L are universally used to obtain voting access.

It's bad enough my vote must compete against freedom stealing idiot AmeriKunts.

It should never have to compete against foreign nationals, most of who are fleeing the communist/socialist $#@!holes they created.

Therefore this news from the newly elected Bolsheviks in WI is relevant, timely and appreciated.

They shouldn't be allowed to vote. But there's nothing at all wrong with letting them drive. Making it more difficult for them to drive is just shooting ourselves in the foot. We should take every advantage we can of what they have to offer us.

CaptUSA
03-05-2019, 09:51 AM
You have no proof or even any decent evidence, you targeted me because you disagree with me about positions that other members of this site also hold and now you feel free to slander me in blatant violation of site rules in spite of the fact that my positions are not contrary to the site mission.

Really? Accusing me of breaking the guidelines??? Because ya know...


Guidelines reminder:


Do not accuse others of violating the guidelines.



I hope I haven't hurt your wittle feewings... :cry:

Ender
03-05-2019, 12:25 PM
Where were your calls for civility when CaptUSA started harassing me with sexual insults? (only some of which got deleted by the mods)

Karma, dude- Law of the Harvest- what you sow so shall ye reap.

You've insulted more people on this forum than any other member I've ever read.

CCTelander
03-05-2019, 12:49 PM
Karma, dude- Law of the Harvest- what you sow so shall ye reap.

You've insulted more people on this forum than any other member I've ever read.


It's truly sad, but also kind of hilarious, to see a guy who for months posted 60+ posts a day the overwhelming majority of which contained some kind of barb or direct insult against other members complain about being a victim of same. Karma indeed.

Champ
03-05-2019, 12:54 PM
If people that are concerned about paid trolls, bots, purposeful divisiveness and so on, why not target all of them equally across the board. I see certain people attack board member A, but never board member B. Then others attack board member B, but not board member A. I'm seeing it happen in this very thread.

Paid trolls and bots are a real thing and to think these forums somehow escaped that would be naive when most of the interwebs are flooded with them. I'm just not seeing consistent attacks, which usually comes down to whether or not the troll/bot is saying useful things that elevate desirable arguments. There is no way I am the only person seeing this either. You can detect the patterns relatively easy and it's not just 1 group doing it.

Ender
03-05-2019, 01:07 PM
If people that are concerned about paid trolls, bots, purposeful divisiveness and so on, why not target all of them equally across the board. I see certain people attack board member A, but never board member B. Then others attack board member B, but not board member A. I'm seeing it happen in this very thread.

Paid trolls and bots are a real thing and to think these forums somehow escaped that would be naive when most of the interwebs are flooded with them. I'm just not seeing consistent attacks, which usually comes down to whether or not the troll/bot is saying useful things that elevate desirable arguments. There is no way I am the only person seeing this either. You can detect the patterns relatively easy and it's not just 1 group doing it.

A lot of people attack people they disagree with, which is not good. I have no problem with a POV I do not support, when that person & I can have a real conversation, whether we agree or not.

I DO have a problem with name-calling & insults instead of any real dialog, with someone who disagrees with a POV and is only pushing their agenda.

Champ
03-05-2019, 01:25 PM
A lot of people attack people they disagree with, which is not good. I have no problem with a POV I do not support, when that person & I can have a real conversation, whether we agree or not.

I DO have a problem with name-calling & insults instead of any real dialog, with someone who disagrees with a POV and is only pushing their agenda.

Agreed on both points. The best argument tends to be one that does not rely on personal attacks and insults.

Either way, I wasn't really referring to this in my initial post, just the hypocrisy that is going around. I see many correctly call out people for being trolls. Great. Super.

Then they let an obvious troll slip by in the very next post, because that troll happens to support their position. I'm just wondering, what was the point in the first place.

The folks that rise above this and don't get entangled in these forum battles picking and choosing which trolls are good and which are bad are some of my favorite posters to read. Sticking to liberty and relevant topics is what I'm here for. I'm glad there are many of these posters still here, because I doubt I would still come around if they weren't. But it's understood, part of the trolls duties is to make the board as unappealing as possible and/or to cause strife/divisiveness between factions that would not otherwise be fighting on trivial issues, which probably have no place on the board in the first place.

Ender
03-05-2019, 01:38 PM
Agreed on both points. The best argument tends to be one that does not rely on personal attacks and insults.

Either way, I wasn't really referring to this in my initial post, just the hypocrisy that is going around. I see many correctly call out people for being trolls. Great. Super.

Then they let an obvious troll slip by in the very next post, because that troll happens to support their position. I'm just wondering, what was the point in the first place.

The folks that rise above this and don't get entangled in these forum battles picking and choosing which trolls are good and which are bad are some of my favorite posters to read. Sticking to liberty and relevant topics is what I'm here for. I'm glad there are many of these posters still here, because I doubt I would still come around if they weren't. But it's understood, part of the trolls duties is to make the board as unappealing as possible and/or to cause strife/divisiveness between factions that would not otherwise be fighting on trivial issues, which probably have no place on the board in the first place.

ON. THE. NOSE.

And +rep

acptulsa
03-05-2019, 01:47 PM
Either way, I wasn't really referring to this in my initial post, just the hypocrisy that is going around. I see many correctly call out people for being trolls. Great. Super.

Then they let an obvious troll slip by in the very next post, because that troll happens to support their position. I'm just wondering, what was the point in the first place.

Well, that's politics, isn't it? When most people don't really get the problems we face, and only have a very tenuous grasp on how the world works, they become team players. They cease to be concerned with keeping the game fair, cheer when their team cheats, and refuse to hold their team accountable for setting the precedent when the other team then also cheats.

The science of governance then turns into a false religion where the object of reverence is the most imperfect, the most evil of men. And then we cannot learn from our mistakes because that would destroy our "faith".

What did we try, Mr. Franklin? A republic--if we can keep it.

RJB
03-05-2019, 02:11 PM
I try to avoid bad feelings towards members. If I do get irritated on one thread I try ( not always successfully) not to bring it to another thread. Sola_Fide was actually good at this at times. On a few occasions we were at each other's throats on one thread while simultaneously carrying on a cordial conversation on another.

Your fiercest enemy on one thread may be your greatest allie on another. It's funny watching two people who pretty much agree, argue simply out of spite. Troll or not, don't let an anonymous poster ruin your day.

Ender
03-05-2019, 02:27 PM
I try to avoid bad feelings towards members. If I do get irritated on one thread I try ( not always successfully) not to bring it to another thread. Sola_Fide was actually good at this at times. On a few occasions we were at each other's throats on one thread while simultaneously carrying on a cordial conversation on another.

Your fiercest enemy on one thread may be your greatest allie on another. It's funny watching two people who pretty much agree, argue simply out of spite. Troll or not, don't let an anonymous poster ruin your day.

Agree- and you put up with me awhile back when I was going through some hard times and was not too pleasant. I've always appreciated that.

And I had fun dialog with Sola_Fide, as well.

specsaregood
03-05-2019, 02:49 PM
Agree- and you put up with me awhile back when I was going through some hard times and was not too pleasant. I've always appreciated that.
And I had fun dialog with Sola-Fide, as well.

I liked aquabuddha better; but never had and real issues with Sola_fide either. He was just nicer when he was aquabuddha.

Superfluous Man
03-05-2019, 02:55 PM
The thing some people just couldn't seem to tolerate about SB/SF for some reason was him telling them they were going to hell. I don't share the sensitivity some people have about that. I just take for granted that no matter what I believe or do, there are going to be some people out there whose beliefs entail that I'm going to hell. But some people get really antsy about that. I think sometimes probably because in their own consciences they have doubts about it, and AB/SF tapped into them.

Swordsmyth
03-05-2019, 03:46 PM
They shouldn't be allowed to vote. But there's nothing at all wrong with letting them drive. Making it more difficult for them to drive is just shooting ourselves in the foot. We should take every advantage we can of what they have to offer us.
We should make everything as difficult as possible for them so that they leave.

Swordsmyth
03-05-2019, 03:48 PM
Really? Accusing me of breaking the guidelines??? Because ya know...



I hope I haven't hurt your wittle feewings... :cry:
After the way you behave I think there is a little leeway for me to point out that you are in gross violation of the rules.

Swordsmyth
03-05-2019, 03:50 PM
Karma, dude- Law of the Harvest- what you sow so shall ye reap.

You've insulted more people on this forum than any other member I've ever read.
LOL

You only punch rightward, you defend every troll on the forum and you never call any of them out for insulting others, even when Influenza hurled insults at your supposed friend AF you were completely silent, you are just Team Troll damage control.

Swordsmyth
03-05-2019, 03:51 PM
It's truly sad, but also kind of hilarious, to see a guy who for months posted 60+ posts a day the overwhelming majority of which contained some kind of barb or direct insult against other members complain about being a victim of same. Karma indeed.
More lies.

CCTelander
03-05-2019, 03:58 PM
We should make everything as difficult as possible for them so that they leave.


Then you should have no problem at all understanding the actions of some members here toward yourself, since they most decidedly do view you as an unwelcome invader.

CCTelander
03-05-2019, 04:00 PM
More lies.


Not at all. But you go on ahead and believe whatever it is you need to to get you through the night.

PAF
03-05-2019, 04:00 PM
We should make everything as difficult as possible for them so that they leave.

That blanket statement violates the NAP.

RP has stated we should reach the hearts and minds of the people, as he himself travels to Mexico to do.

I know a number of people who came here, honestly looking for a better productive life, opened businesses, and even supported RP when he ran in 2012. A few members of our liberty group came from abroad, trying to reduce taxes and reject welfare, and share stories about the country from which they came.

The answer is End Incentives, not promote being hateful and reducing freedom/liberty.

Until there is ground-swell (like there is in support of a "wall") our voices will never be heard.

Swordsmyth
03-05-2019, 04:01 PM
Then you should have no problem at all understanding the actions of some members here toward yourself, since they most decidedly do view you as an unwelcome invader.
It isn't their place to violate the rules flagrantly in order to do so, this site belongs to Bryan and is run by the mods, our country belongs to every citizen and even then we have to change the rules instead of breaking them.

But you anarchists wrap your entire philosophy around breaking rules so I am not surprised.

Swordsmyth
03-05-2019, 04:01 PM
That blanket statement violates the NAP.

RP has stated we should reach the hearts and minds of the people, as he himself travels to Mexico to do.

I know a number of people who came here, honestly looking for a better productive life, opened businesses, and even supported RP when he ran in 2012. A few members of our liberty group came from abroad, trying to reduce taxes and reject welfare, and share stories about the country from which they came.

The answer is End Incentives, not promote being hateful and reducing freedom/liberty.

Until there is ground-swell (like there is in support of a "wall") our voices will never be heard.
Their invasion violates the NAP.

PAF
03-05-2019, 04:04 PM
Their invasion violates the NAP.

Some take advantage of what this corrupt government takes from me and gives to them. You refuse to look at and address the source of the problem.

Swordsmyth
03-05-2019, 04:09 PM
Some take advantage of what this corrupt government takes from me and gives to them. You refuse to look at and address the source of the problem.
I look at and address all sources of the problem.

PAF
03-05-2019, 04:15 PM
I look at and address all sources of the problem.

From what I read, you do not.

I will go back on topic and state that I oppose DL's, registering vehicles, for personal use/travel, not only for what some term "illegals", but Americans as well. I would go so far as to say I reject DL's and registration for interstate commerce as well and that should be up to the companies to solve, but that would be for another topic/thread.

This idea of "papers please" otherwise government will prevent somebody from traveling, end up handcuffed and go to jail is getting way out of hand. First passports, which were supposed to cease after the world war, then SSN's used as ID's, then DL's, and next "biometrics".

CCTelander
03-05-2019, 04:40 PM
From what I read, you do not.

I will go back on topic and state that I oppose DL's, registering vehicles, for personal use/travel, not only for what some term "illegals", but Americans as well. I would go so far as to say I reject DL's and registration for interstate commerce as well and that should be up to the companies to solve, but that would be for another topic/thread.

This idea of "papers please" otherwise government will prevent somebody from traveling, end up handcuffed and go to jail is getting way out of hand. First passports, which were supposed to cease after the world war, then SSN's used as ID's, then DL's, and next "biometrics".


You must spread some Reputation around...

Ender
03-05-2019, 05:55 PM
LOL

You only punch rightward, you defend every troll on the forum and you never call any of them out for insulting others, even when Influenza hurled insults at your supposed friend AF you were completely silent, you are just Team Troll damage control.

There you go again- calling names and throwing insults.

Hate to tell you this but I'm not on the forum 24/7 like you are- AND Anti Federalist is one of my favorite members- we talk a lot.

I consider YOU the biggest troll on the forum.

Ender
03-05-2019, 05:57 PM
That blanket statement violates the NAP.

RP has stated we should reach the hearts and minds of the people, as he himself travels to Mexico to do.

I know a number of people who came here, honestly looking for a better productive life, opened businesses, and even supported RP when he ran in 2012. A few members of our liberty group came from abroad, trying to reduce taxes and reject welfare, and share stories about the country from which they came.

The answer is End Incentives, not promote being hateful and reducing freedom/liberty.

Until there is ground-swell (like there is in support of a "wall") our voices will never be heard.

Yep- definitely where I stand.

RJB
03-05-2019, 05:59 PM
Agree- and you put up with me awhile back when I was going through some hard times and was not too pleasant. I've always appreciated that.

And I had fun dialog with Sola-Fide, as well.
Lol. I remember you said that I received your first neg rep. That was a rough time for me two. There were two threads we went toe to toe. The second one I realized I simply misunderstood you, but that was a couple days later.

Also, I do have a sense of humor that defuses bad situations when face to face. However it doesn't carry over well on the internet. Other times I am just mean and the next day I just shake my head at myself.

Swordsmyth
03-05-2019, 05:59 PM
There you go again- calling names and throwing insults.

Hate to tell you this but I'm not on the forum 24/7 like you are- AND @Anti Federalist (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/member.php?u=3169) is one of my favorite members- we talk a lot.

I consider YOU the biggest troll on the forum.
You were on the forum when it happened, you posted about other things.
You were on the forum when the leftists hurled vicious insults at others too.
I have seen you use the "civility" angle on people to your right many times but not once on anyone to the left and you defend trolls like zippy who opposes EVERYTHING Ron stands for.

Ender
03-05-2019, 06:03 PM
Lol. I remember you said that I received your first neg rep. That was a rough time for me two. There were two threads we went toe to toe. The second one I realized I simply misunderstood you, but that was a couple days later.

Also, I do have a sense of humor that defuses bad situations when face to face. However it doesn't carry over well on the internet. Other times I am just mean and the next day I just shake my head at myself.

Agree about the humor- hard to see it in writing sometimes- that said, you are always on my cool list and we don't have to agree on every little nuance.

Ender
03-05-2019, 06:04 PM
You were on the forum when it happened, you posted about other things.
You were on the forum when the leftists hurled vicious insults at others too.
I have seen you use the "civility" angle on people to your right many times but not once on anyone to the left and you defend trolls like zippy who opposes EVERYTHING Ron stands for.

Zippy never calls names or throws hateful insults- maybe you should learn that lesson.

PAF
03-05-2019, 06:05 PM
who opposes EVERYTHING Ron stands for.

Did you ever get that chance to sit down with RP to have that little talk with him to discuss the errors of his ways?

Swordsmyth
03-05-2019, 06:08 PM
Zippy never calls names or throws hateful insults- maybe you should learn that lesson.
Maybe if you called out everyone equally and the mods enforced the guidelines equally this place wouldn't be such a jungle and we could all retract our claws.

It is nice to see your priorities though, creating a "safe space" is more important than promoting liberty.

PAF
03-05-2019, 06:17 PM
Maybe if you called out everyone equally and the mods enforced the guidelines equally this place wouldn't be such a jungle and we could all retract our claws.

It is nice to see your priorities though, creating a "safe space" is more important than promoting liberty.


Don't that beat all. Shill (and I mean that kindly), it appears from reading your posts that you yourself don't support the site mission. As for us liberty folks, you have called us leftist, anarchists, yadda yadda...

Ok, I'll admit, I do have a lot of AnCap tendencies, but you know what I mean.

Do you fully support the NAP? Unequivocally? Or do you teeter-totter on principle, like the neocons in office do?

Ender
03-05-2019, 06:24 PM
Maybe if you called out everyone equally and the mods enforced the guidelines equally this place wouldn't be such a jungle and we could all retract our claws.

It is nice to see your priorities though, creating a "safe space" is more important than promoting liberty.

WTF? Liberty? I 'm one of the biggest promoters of LIBERTY on this site. And YOU & your ilk have called me names and laden me with insults for doing so.

YOU are the one who continuously says Ron Paul is wrong.
YOU are the one who calls Judge Nap "Judge Swamp".
YOU are the one who continues on & on with the left/right paradigm to continually sow hate.
YOU are the one who calls for more ICE, more police, more military to protect your hateful POV.
YOU are the one who continuously calls names & flings insults while never actually discussing real issues.

PAF
03-05-2019, 06:29 PM
WTF? Liberty? I 'm one of the biggest promoters of LIBERTY on this site. And YOU & your ilk have called me names and laden me with insults for doing so.

YOU are the one who continuously says Ron Paul is wrong.
YOU are the one who calls Judge Nap "Judge Swamp".
YOU are the one who continues on & on with the left/right paradigm to continually sow hate.
YOU are the one who calls for more ICE, more police, more military to protect your hateful POV.
YOU are the one who continuously calls names & flings insults while never actually discussing real issues.


Wow, that's better than my post above! Well, equally as good ;-)

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Ender again.

Swordsmyth
03-05-2019, 06:30 PM
WTF? Liberty? I 'm one of the biggest promoters of LIBERTY on this site. And YOU & your ilk have called me names and laden me with insults for doing so.

YOU are the one who continuously says Ron Paul is wrong.
YOU are the one who calls Judge Nap "Judge Swamp".
YOU are the one who continues on & on with the left/right paradigm to continually sow hate.
YOU are the one who calls for more ICE, more police, more military to protect your hateful POV.
YOU are the one who continuously calls names & flings insults while never actually discussing real issues.
I do not "continuously" say Ron is wrong.
Judge Nap has gone swamp.
The left/right difference is real and growing every day and the sane members of the site recognize it and ignoring it will destroy any chance for liberty.
My POV is NOT hateful and if we don't stop the invasion we will become a communist country.
I always discuss real issues and I call names and fling insults less than many others that you ignore.

If you cared about promoting liberty you wouldn't defend zippy.

acptulsa
03-05-2019, 07:02 PM
I have seen you use the "civility" angle on people to your right many times but not once on anyone to the left...

You just accused him of being you.

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e1/Road_Sign_No_Left_Turn.jpg

Dr.3D
03-05-2019, 09:09 PM
You just accused him of being you.

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e1/Road_Sign_No_Left_Turn.jpg
Well, isn't this about the two parties?

Presently we have two parties trying to get what they want, while the other parties are just trying to get some kind of a foothold in the politics arena.

Which party most closely matches what we want to have?

Seems like the left has gone nuts, leaving us to look elsewhere.

acptulsa
03-05-2019, 09:22 PM
Seems like the left has gone nuts, leaving us to look elsewhere.

Well, the country seems to be a normal male. It has both left and right nuts. Both under a prick.

Dr.3D
03-05-2019, 09:35 PM
Well, the country seems to be a normal male. It has both left and right nuts. Both under a prick.

Yes, but I'm wondering which nut is going to do the most damage in the shortest amount of time. :)