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View Full Version : Crops are rotting in fields as Trump's trade war bites US farmers




RonZeplin
11-22-2018, 01:35 AM
https://amp.businessinsider.com/images/5bbcc27266fb3f1dea747a6f-750-375.jpg
US farmers are struggling amid the global trade war. Here, US President Donald Trump visited Peosta, Iowa, in July. Scott Olson/Getty Images



American farmers are struggling to sell their products as tariffs introduced during the trade war between Washington and Beijing stifle demand.
In certain states, farmers are being forced into plowing their crops under — effectively burying them under soil in fields — as there is simply not enough storage room in storage facilities.
The problem is most acute for soybean farmers, as China generally buys about 60% of US soybeans but has basically stopped purchases since tariffs began.


American farmers are struggling to find storage for crops that would usually be sold overseas, with some being forced to leave produce rotting in fields as a last resort, as the trade conflict between the US and China continues.

Farmers in some US states are being forced into plowing their crops under — effectively burying them under soil in fields — as there is not enough room to store them in storage facilities, and they are unable to sell their products thanks to Chinese tariffs, Reuters reported on Wednesday (https://uk.reuters.com/article/us-usa-trade-china-grains/harvesting-in-a-trade-war-u-s-crops-rot-as-storage-costs-soar-idUKKCN1NQ0GA).

All grain depots and silos are almost full, meaning farmers have to find their own storage solutions or allow their crops to rot. Neither option is particularly palatable.
The problem is most acute for soybean farmers. China is the largest importer of soybeans in the world, but since the start of the trade war it has slapped US soybeans with a 25% tariff and turned to Brazil in an attempt to meet domestic demand (http://uk.businessinsider.com/us-farmers-take-beating-in-trade-war-with-china-2018-11).

Chinese purchases generally make up about 60% of all US soybean exports, according to the Farm Credit Administration, (https://www.fca.gov/template-fca/download/MajorUSAgriculturalExportMarkets.pdf) but those exports have practically stopped since the tariffs were introduced.

In Louisiana, as much as 15% of this year's soybean crop has been plowed under or is too damaged to sell, according to data analyzed by Louisiana State University staff and cited by Reuters.

The Trump administration has started a program of subsidies meant to lessen the impact of his trade war on US agriculture.

In August, the administration launched a $4.7 billion initial investment plan (http://uk.businessinsider.com/trump-trade-war-tariffs-usda-farmers-aid-soybeans-2018-8) aimed at helping those farming corn, cotton, dairy, hog, sorghum, soybean, and wheat.

The program could expand to as much as $12 billion. But according to Reuters, less than $900 million has been paid out so far.

https://www.businessinsider.com/us-china-trade-war-soybeans-left-rotting-thanks-to-lack-of-storage-2018-11

Swordsmyth
11-22-2018, 01:43 AM
I smell hype.

spudea
11-22-2018, 03:07 AM
I agree China should stop taxing our farmers. In the meantime, these farmers should adapt and find new buyers.

timosman
11-22-2018, 03:14 AM
I agree China should stop taxing our farmers. In the meantime, these farmers should adapt and find new buyers.

Nobody can afford the prices the Chinese were paying. :D

Jamesiv1
11-22-2018, 04:52 AM
"American Farmers" = about 4 big, international companies

that's how you know the story is fake news.

euphemia
11-22-2018, 06:27 AM
I just drove through 200 miles of farmland. I saw nothing rotting in the fields. Not in four states. Not in Tennessee, Kentucky. Illinois, or Missouri.

AZJoe
11-22-2018, 06:32 AM
The solution is simple - we just need bigger government and more government intervention. Just slap some more and bigger tariffs on food imports and force those unpatriotic Americans to buy more American produce.
Welfare, socialism, taxation AKA Tariffs. Its the solution! More government intervention and bigger government is always the solution to the failure of government intervention.

nikcers
11-22-2018, 06:34 AM
The solution is simple - we just need bigger government and more government intervention. Just slap some more and bigger tariffs on food imports and force those unpatriotic Americans to buy more American produce.
Welfare, socialism, taxation AKA Tariffs. Its the solution. More government intervention and bigger government is always the solution to the failure of government intervention.

Blue Pills all around, everyone in the matrix had a job, they were batteries for the machines.

oyarde
11-22-2018, 06:40 AM
I smell hype.

It is bs . Any crop being disced into the dirt would be because it is not good enough to sell . I sold all of my beans before 11/10 and got what I expected all yr for them . Also most people do not even have a plow anymore.In the old days even damaged crop would have been used for livestock feed , there would be zero waste . Now big farmers are often more specialized and large crop farmers have no iivestock and buy food at the grocery. My Grandfather would have thought they were dull.

AZJoe
11-22-2018, 06:41 AM
From Reuters (https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-usa-trade-china-grains/harvesting-in-a-trade-war-u-s-crops-rot-as-storage-costs-soar-idUKKCN1NQ0GR)-

U.S. farmers finishing their harvests are facing a big problem - where to put the mountain of grain they cannot sell to Chinese buyers.
For Louisiana farmer Richard Fontenot and his neighbors, the solution was a costly one: Let the crops rot. Fontenot plowed under 1,000 of his 1,700 soybean acres this fall, chopping plants into the dirt instead of harvesting more than $300,000 worth of beans. …
His beans were damaged by bad weather.. Normally, he could sell them anyway to … international grains merchants … But this year they aren’t buying as much damaged grain. … “No one wants them,” Fontenot said … “I don’t know what else to do.”

Across the United States, grain farmers are plowing under crops … according to interviews with more than two dozen farmers, academic researchers and farm lenders. …

In Louisiana, up to 15 percent of the oilseed crop is being plowed under or is too damaged to market, … Grain piles, dusted by snow, sit on the ground in North and South Dakota. And in Illinois and Indiana, some farmers are struggling to protect silo bags stuffed with crops from animals.

U.S. farmers planted 89.1 million acres of soybeans this year, the second most ever, expecting China’s rising demand … retaliation for duties imposed by Washington … effectively shut down U.S. soybean exports to China, worth around $12 billion last year. …

[Welfare to the rescue] The U.S. government rolled out an aid programme of around the same size - $12 billion … Some of that money will pass from farmers to grain merchants such as Archer Daniels Midland Co and Bunge Ltd …

Eric Honselman opens a shed which holds 75,000 bushels of corn he was forced to store after his regular bins were filled to capacity with corn and soybeans on the family farm in Casey, Illinois … Those in central Illinois could pay up to 40 percent more than in previous years to store crops over the coming weeks … The trade war has only exacerbated the strain on storage …

“I’ve never seen things this bad,” Altom said. “I know several farmers who hired lawyers, to see if they can sue over the pricing and fees issues.” …
Eric Maupin, a farmer in Newbern, Tennessee, said he was facing so-called dockage rates … more than three times as high as a year ago. … Some farmers are pulling farm equipment out of barns to make room for the overflow of grains. …

AZJoe
11-22-2018, 07:03 AM
Trade Wars
(https://www.nytimes.com/2018/11/05/business/soybeans-farmers-trade-war.html)
Farmers here in Cass County have prospered over the last two decades by growing more soybeans than any other county in the United States, and by shipping most of those beans across the Pacific Ocean to feed Chinese pigs and chickens. But this year, the Chinese have all but stopped buying. The largest market for one of America’s largest exports has shut its doors … in response to the Trump administration’s tariffs on Chinese goods.

The latest federal data, through mid-October, shows American soybean sales to China have declined by 94 percent from last year’s harvest. …

Arthur Companies … With that market now largely shut off, Mr. Karel said his firm has started to stockpile soybeans. … The hope is that prices will rise before the beans rot. “We’re sitting on the edge of our seat,” Mr. Karel said.

President Trump sees tariffs as a tool to force changes in America’s economic relationships (https://www.nytimes.com/2018/09/17/us/politics/trump-china-tariffs-trade.html?module=inline) … But that is coming at a steep cost for some industries, like farming, that have thrived … by exporting goods to foreign markets. …

China and … the European Union, have sought to maximize the political impact of their reprisals. The European Union imposed tariffs on bourbon, … and on Harley-Davidson … China's decision to impose tariffs on soybeans …

Like most successful American exports, soybeans are produced at high efficiency … using cutting-edge technologies … The United States exported $26 billion in soybeans last year …

Greg Gebeke, who farms 5,000 acres outside Arthur with two of his brothers, said he struggled to understand the administration’s goals. “I’m trying to follow and figure out who the winners are in this tariff war,” Mr. Gebeke said. “I know who one of the losers are and that’s us. And that’s painful.” …

North Dakota’s soybean industry was created by Chinese demand … China is by far the world’s largest importer of soybeans (https://www.nytimes.com/2018/07/09/business/china-trade-war-soybeans.html?module=inline). … Soybean farmers also spent millions of dollars cultivating the Chinese market. … marketing programs like trade missions to China and research intended to convince Chinese farmers that pigs raised on American soybeans grow faster and fatter. In 2015, North Dakota soybean farmers footed the bill for an event in Shanghai honoring the 10 “most loyal” buyers of American soybeans (https://ussec.org/u-s-china-soybean-industry-relations-are-further-strengthened-by-participating-in-discussions-at-major-industry-events-in-china/). The soybean industry’s sales pitch emphasized the reliability of American infrastructure and the political stability of the United States. … “I’ve been to China 25 times in the last decade talking about the dependability of U.S. soybeans,” said Kirk Leeds, the chief executive of the Iowa Soybean Association. By undermining that reputation, he said, “we have done long-term damage to the industry.” ...

But waiting carries risks. Soybeans can spoil …“Hope is unfortunately a terrible marketing plan,” …

[Welfare to the rescue] The Trump administration said in August that it would distribute $3.6 billion to soybean farmers to offset the decline in market prices. The subsidy rate of 82.5 cents per bushel … covers less than half of the losses facing North Dakota farmers at current market prices. …

Occam's Banana
11-22-2018, 07:13 AM
The last time there was a big kerfuffle involving tariffs and farmers, we ended up getting a little thing called the 16th Amendment ... (and after they went along with it, the farmers ended up getting stabbed in the back with more tariffs anyway ...)

[insert obligatory Santayana quote here]

AZJoe
11-22-2018, 07:15 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FRJVzcMPV-Q


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zFRmsUD6YQE

Ender
11-22-2018, 09:50 AM
Blue Pills all around, everyone in the matrix had a job, they were batteries for the machines.


Blue Pills all around, everyone in The Matrix has a job, they are batteries for the machines.

This is what most accept as "real".

angelatc
11-22-2018, 09:56 AM
From Reuters (https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-usa-trade-china-grains/harvesting-in-a-trade-war-u-s-crops-rot-as-storage-costs-soar-idUKKCN1NQ0GR)[- et the crops rot. Fontenot plowed under 1,000 of his 1,700 soybean acres this fall, chopping plants into the dirt instead of harvesting more than $300,000 worth of beans. …
His beans were damaged by bad weather.. …

That's what crop insurance is for. I suspect we aren't getting the whole story here

Another person who refuses to actually speak, just posts more crap.

phill4paul
11-22-2018, 10:18 AM
That's what crop insurance is for. I suspect we aren't getting the whole story here

Another person who refuses to actually speak, just posts more crap.

This. AG reports I have read lamenting that many farmers not able to get in crops due to excessive wet weather. Therefore, crops rotting in fields. Such is farming. But, find a few disgruntled farmers, throw in the M$M TDS angle, and voila! Soybean apocalypto!

euphemia
11-22-2018, 10:32 AM
Like I said Injust drove through four states. When I drove through those same states two months ago they were finishing a bountiful harvest. The fields look great and ready for winter.

RonZeplin
11-22-2018, 10:51 AM
That's what crop insurance is for. I suspect we aren't getting the whole story here

Another person who refuses to actually speak, just posts more crap.

If some farmers crops were damaged by bad weather, then the undamaged crops should be worth more, but they aren't due to big stupid gov meddling. Now you've got the whole story, enjoy the Trumpenomic MAGA wealth spread utopia. :100:

Dr.3D
11-22-2018, 11:08 AM
I live in the country and all the crops around me and in my fields have been harvested. The price of hay is higher than it was last year.

angelatc
11-22-2018, 11:11 AM
If some farmers crops were damaged by bad weather, then the undamaged crops should be worth more, but they aren't due to big stupid gov meddling. Now you've got the whole story, enjoy the Trumpenomic MAGA wealth spread utopia. :100:

Oh, look. Trump Derangement Syndrome rears up.

I think we all agree that free trade is better than managed trade, but I'm happier with Trump's attempts to fix the imbalances than the alternatives. Import tariffs have always been part of the country's economy, and I've always preferred those to subsidies and/or income taxes. Nothing to do with Trump, except he happens to be the guy who stood up to the other less successful nations who were benefitting from the trade imbalances.

kahless
11-22-2018, 11:18 AM
https://amp.businessinsider.com/images/5bbcc27266fb3f1dea747a6f-750-375.jpg
US farmers are struggling amid the global trade war. Here, US President Donald Trump visited Peosta, Iowa, in July. Scott Olson/Getty Images



American farmers are struggling to sell their products as tariffs introduced during the trade war between Washington and Beijing stifle demand.
In certain states, farmers are being forced into plowing their crops under — effectively burying them under soil in fields — as there is simply not enough storage room in storage facilities.
The problem is most acute for soybean farmers, as China generally buys about 60% of US soybeans but has basically stopped purchases since tariffs began.


American farmers are struggling to find storage for crops that would usually be sold overseas, with some being forced to leave produce rotting in fields as a last resort, as the trade conflict between the US and China continues.

Farmers in some US states are being forced into plowing their crops under — effectively burying them under soil in fields — as there is not enough room to store them in storage facilities, and they are unable to sell their products thanks to Chinese tariffs, Reuters reported on Wednesday (https://uk.reuters.com/article/us-usa-trade-china-grains/harvesting-in-a-trade-war-u-s-crops-rot-as-storage-costs-soar-idUKKCN1NQ0GA).

All grain depots and silos are almost full, meaning farmers have to find their own storage solutions or allow their crops to rot. Neither option is particularly palatable.
The problem is most acute for soybean farmers. China is the largest importer of soybeans in the world, but since the start of the trade war it has slapped US soybeans with a 25% tariff and turned to Brazil in an attempt to meet domestic demand (http://uk.businessinsider.com/us-farmers-take-beating-in-trade-war-with-china-2018-11).

Chinese purchases generally make up about 60% of all US soybean exports, according to the Farm Credit Administration, (https://www.fca.gov/template-fca/download/MajorUSAgriculturalExportMarkets.pdf) but those exports have practically stopped since the tariffs were introduced.

In Louisiana, as much as 15% of this year's soybean crop has been plowed under or is too damaged to sell, according to data analyzed by Louisiana State University staff and cited by Reuters.

The Trump administration has started a program of subsidies meant to lessen the impact of his trade war on US agriculture.

In August, the administration launched a $4.7 billion initial investment plan (http://uk.businessinsider.com/trump-trade-war-tariffs-usda-farmers-aid-soybeans-2018-8) aimed at helping those farming corn, cotton, dairy, hog, sorghum, soybean, and wheat.

The program could expand to as much as $12 billion. But according to Reuters, less than $900 million has been paid out so far.

https://www.businessinsider.com/us-china-trade-war-soybeans-left-rotting-thanks-to-lack-of-storage-2018-11

Good. It will drive the price down of Soybeans which will turn up more and more in processed foods instead of that disgusting Canola oil we import from Canada. This in turn I hope will drive the price down of processed foods. Better Soybean in your food instead of that disgusting mildly toxic Canola oil we import from Canada. Corn, Soy, Sunflower, Cottonseed is far better than that crap Canola and Palm oil imports.

angelatc
11-22-2018, 11:18 AM
Looks like soy beans are off their record highs, but better than they were. https://i.imgur.com/tfQSZVb.png

Swordsmyth
11-22-2018, 01:02 PM
Looks like soy beans are off their record highs, but better than they were. https://i.imgur.com/tfQSZVb.png

/Thread

Brian4Liberty
11-22-2018, 02:43 PM
Deja vu. We’ve had this thread about 5 times now.

So American tariffs hurt US consumers, but Chinese tariffs help Chinese consumers?

Propaganda. Big AG wants welfare.

presence
11-22-2018, 02:46 PM
Crops are rotting in fields

meh, nothing fed crop insurance can't solve

RonZeplin
11-22-2018, 03:21 PM
Truth is treason in the empire of lies. ~Some Smart Guy

nobody's_hero
11-22-2018, 04:45 PM
We have too much food.

That sucks.

I wonder how China is doing.

Danke
11-22-2018, 05:18 PM
This. AG reports I have read lamenting that many farmers not able to get in crops due to excessive wet weather. Therefore, crops rotting in fields. Such is farming. But, find a few disgruntled farmers, throw in the M$M TDS angle, and voila! Soybean apocalypto!

Global Warming caused this.

XNavyNuke
11-22-2018, 06:03 PM
Journalists are just as crappy at agriculture as they are with math and science. Please note that the super-duper Reuters journalist who quoted the farmer, Mr. Fortenot, in the original article failed to provide the background the he plowed 300 acres of beans under last year BEFORE the tariffs went into effect.

https://www.villeplattetoday.com/news/unique-trinity

Don't try and sell elevators wet beans. There is absolutely nothing unusual about beans or corn under tarps at the elevator when the yield is good and their bins are full. You see it happen every three of four years around here.

XNN

XNavyNuke
11-22-2018, 06:06 PM
My Grandfather would have thought they were dull.

Ayup.
XNN

Swordsmyth
11-22-2018, 06:07 PM
Truth is treason in the empire of lies. ~Some Smart Guy

Truth isn't found in MSM TDS articles.

RonZeplin
11-22-2018, 07:31 PM
Truth isn't found in MSM TDS articles.

Believe the lies at bushbot.com

Swordsmyth
11-22-2018, 07:33 PM
Believe the lies at bushbot.com
How about you try responding to the facts people posted in this thread that counter the MSM lies?

kpitcher
11-22-2018, 10:01 PM
I just drove through 200 miles of farmland. I saw nothing rotting in the fields. Not in four states. Not in Tennessee, Kentucky. Illinois, or Missouri.

I often see fields that aren't fully harvested although I assume the farmers expect that. Watermelon, squash, peppers, cukes, tomato will get a lot of picking done and anything not the exact size or ripeness will then be left to rot. Once the picking is done locals will call the farmer and get permission to glean. Seems like a waste of produce but must not be profitable to do a 2nd picking.

CaptUSA
11-22-2018, 10:47 PM
I agree China should stop taxing our farmers. In the meantime, these farmers should adapt and find new buyers.

Wait a minute...

I was told our country's industries couldn't adapt. That's the whole reason for the tariffs, remember?? They say you raise tariffs because if you don't the industries wouldn't be able to adapt fast enough if another country cut off their imports to us. That's whole reason they don't want other countries selling us things for cheap. Because our industries couldn't adapt. And yet, you think farmers can adapt that fast??? Farmers rely on the seasons for their things to sell. You can build a steel plant anytime.

Ender
11-22-2018, 10:55 PM
That's what crop insurance is for. I suspect we aren't getting the whole story here

Another person who refuses to actually speak, just posts more crap.

Wait- are you really insulting AZJoe? He is one of the best & most honest posters on this forum.

Swordsmyth
11-22-2018, 11:13 PM
Wait a minute...

I was told our country's industries couldn't adapt. That's the whole reason for the tariffs, remember?? They say you raise tariffs because if you don't the industries wouldn't be able to adapt fast enough if another country cut off their imports to us. That's whole reason they don't want other countries selling us things for cheap. Because our industries couldn't adapt. And yet, you think farmers can adapt that fast??? Farmers rely on the seasons for their things to sell. You can build a steel plant anytime.
Food is fungible, the price of soybeans isn't unusually low and you can't just build a steel plant any time.

devil21
11-23-2018, 12:17 AM
Who cares? Let the GMO garbage that is turning our young men into ladyboys rot in the fields. Farmers that produce that poisonous crap should go bankrupt for the damage they're causing to people to make a buck.

CaptainAmerica
11-23-2018, 12:42 AM
oh please. No one in their right mind would even TRY to compete for that job because its undercut . most of the trade skills in arizona are undercut now, if an honest worker wanted to make a living, no one will pay that person their time and value because you have half ass shit services ready to undercut them by 60 percent sometimes. Flooring for instance.........guys who do specialize should be paid 3-4 dollars per square foot, but illegal immigrants undercut at 1 dollar per square foot. how? they shack up together, thats how familys on familys they can undercut that way,and its what really goes down in the ghettos. so when farmers want to pay american workers 8 dollars an hour, they are morons.

XNavyNuke
11-23-2018, 11:35 AM
I often see fields that aren't fully harvested although I assume the farmers expect that. Watermelon, squash, peppers, cukes, tomato will get a lot of picking done and anything not the exact size or ripeness will then be left to rot. Once the picking is done locals will call the farmer and get permission to glean. Seems like a waste of produce but must not be profitable to do a 2nd picking.

Harvesting your corn late, or leaving a strip against a field line, is good for bringing in the deer. Farmers need to have some meat to go with those potatoes!

XNN

angelatc
11-23-2018, 12:08 PM
Believe the lies at bushbot.com

I hope nobody missed x-navy nuke's post which said
Please note that the super-duper Reuters journalist who quoted the farmer, Mr. Fortenot, in the original article failed to provide the background the he plowed 300 acres of beans under last year BEFORE the tariffs went into effect.

https://www.villeplattetoday.com/news/unique-trinity

I know it's hard, but just walk away.

RonZeplin
11-23-2018, 12:57 PM
I hope nobody missed x-navy nuke's post which said

I know it's hard, but just walk away.


One dumbass farmer and the US government decides that they need to pass out $5 - 12B in farm subsidies? No, it's a halfassed attempt to correct Trump's tariff screw ups by passing out money that they don't have. They'll just print some $FRN's up, and add it to the National Debt. :redflag:

angelatc
11-23-2018, 01:31 PM
One dumbass farmer and the US government decides that they need to pass out $5 - 12B in farm subsidies? No, it's a halfassed attempt to correct Trump's tariff screw ups by passing out money that they don't have. They'll just print some $FRN's up, and add it to the National Debt. :redflag:

Nobody supports subsidies, but it seems that the goalposts are moving. Are you mad about the price of soy, or are you mad about the subsidies? Because the focus of the article you posted isn't the subsidies, is it?

devil21
11-23-2018, 02:02 PM
oh please. No one in their right mind would even TRY to compete for that job because its undercut . most of the trade skills in arizona are undercut now, if an honest worker wanted to make a living, no one will pay that person their time and value because you have half ass $#@! services ready to undercut them by 60 percent sometimes. Flooring for instance.........guys who do specialize should be paid 3-4 dollars per square foot, but illegal immigrants undercut at 1 dollar per square foot. how? they shack up together, thats how familys on familys they can undercut that way,and its what really goes down in the ghettos. so when farmers want to pay american workers 8 dollars an hour, they are morons.

I'm doing a project on a new house construction. It's being built by a hispanic fella that owns a flooring business. It's probably a $1.25m place built on the profits of his fellow hispanics but he's also enlisted many of those same associates to build the entire house itself. So he's getting it built pretty close to cost on top of the money made from undercutting other businesses, however it's plainly obvious where corners are being cut and workmanship leaves something to be desired. I don't hate him for it and it's pretty damn smart business but I think demonstrates your point.

Brian4Liberty
11-23-2018, 02:43 PM
I'm doing a project on a new house construction. It's being built by a hispanic fella that owns a flooring business. It's probably a $1.25m place built on the profits of his fellow hispanics but he's also enlisted many of those same associates to build the entire house itself. So he's getting it built pretty close to cost on top of the money made from undercutting other businesses, however it's plainly obvious where corners are being cut and workmanship leaves something to be desired. I don't hate him for it and it's pretty damn smart business but I think demonstrates your point.

And most people wouldn’t know what constitutes quality until the roof falls on their heads. Sure, if it’s cosmetic and staring a person right in the face, then they might know. Applies to anything that the consumer does not understand and can not do themselves. Construction, vehicles, assorted mechanical things, computers, plumbing, electrical, etc.

Poor workmanship is the norm these days.

AZJoe
11-28-2018, 09:36 AM
That's what crop insurance is for. I suspect we aren't getting the whole story here

Another person who refuses to actually speak, just posts more crap.

This is a completely non-sensical comment by angelatc.


First, there is nothing stating the farmer did not have crop insurance.
Second, crop insurance does not haul bad crops away. The farmer would still need to do something with the crops that can’t be sold, like plow them under.
Third – crop insurance does not buy the crops, and does not replace profits. Crop insurance only covers actual expense losses. The profits are still lost even with crop insurance.
Fourth, although the crops were poor due to bad weather, the farmer stated they were still marketable as feed but for the trade war and the resultant soybean glut cause by the trade war. What would be needed here is trade-war insurance, not crop insurance for bad crops.
Fifth, with or without crop insurance does not make tariffs good. Tariffs are always a net negative on the economy imposing them.

Lastly, as to "just posting crap" - please stop doing that.

AZJoe
11-28-2018, 09:47 AM
Nobody supports subsidies, but it seems that the goalposts are moving. Are you mad about the price of soy, or are you mad about the subsidies? Because the focus of the article you posted isn't the subsidies, is it?

Actually Trump does. Trump is the one who doled out $4.7 billion and then a new $12 billion in direct farm subsidies to defray the damage caused by his other subsidies - tariffs. And the Op article did discuss those direct subsidies.

Tariffs themselves are a welfare subsidy. It is subsidizing purportedly non-competitive (although often the tariff subsidies aid very profitable business like the sugar industry) business at the expense of other businesses and consumers.

For instance the "Great" steel tariffs are a subsidy for U.S. raw material suppliers at the expense of U.S. manufacturers that use steel (Caterpillar, John Deere, Ford, GM, Construction, Boeing, etc) that now bear the higher costs and the consumers that the costs are past onto. It subsidizes base raw materials at the expense of U.S. manufacturing.

Tariffs are a welfare subsidy.

Danke
11-28-2018, 09:51 AM
This is a completely non-sensical comment by angelatc.


First, there is nothing stating the farmer did not have crop insurance.
Second, crop insurance does not haul bad crops away. The farmer would still need to do something with the crops that can’t be sold, like plow them under.
Third – crop insurance does not buy the crops, and does not replace profits. Crop insurance only covers actual expense losses. The profits are still lost even with crop insurance.
Fourth, although the crops were poor due to bad weather, the farmer stated they were still marketable as feed but for the trade war and the resultant soybean glut cause by the trade war. What would be needed here is trade-war insurance, not crop insurance for bad crops.
Fifth, with or without crop insurance does not make tariffs good. Tariffs are always a net negative on the economy imposing them.

Lastly, as to "just posting crap" - please stop doing that.

She was just trolling ya. :upsidedown:

angelatc
11-28-2018, 10:00 AM
Actually Trump does.

Tariffs are a welfare subsidy.

Obviously I meant nobody here supports subsidies. Well, Zippy does, but he's a troll.

angelatc
11-28-2018, 10:03 AM
This is a completely non-sensical comment by angelatc.


First, there is nothing stating the farmer did not have crop insurance.
Second, crop insurance does not haul bad crops away. The farmer would still need to do something with the crops that can’t be sold, like plow them under.
Third – crop insurance does not buy the crops, and does not replace profits. Crop insurance only covers actual expense losses. The profits are still lost even with crop insurance.
Fourth, although the crops were poor due to bad weather, the farmer stated they were still marketable as feed but for the trade war and the resultant soybean glut cause by the trade war. What would be needed here is trade-war insurance, not crop insurance for bad crops.
Fifth, with or without crop insurance does not make tariffs good. Tariffs are always a net negative on the economy imposing them.

Lastly, as to "just posting crap" - please stop doing that.

I posted charts showing that indicate that although the crops are off their record highs, and I also pointed out an article that another poster mentioned, in which we learned that the same farmer also had to plow his crops under the previous year before the tariffs were in effect.

Not defending tariffs, but this is just the media exploiting the leftist tendencies some of us have.

opal
11-28-2018, 01:04 PM
Who cares? Let the GMO garbage that is turning our young men into ladyboys rot in the fields. Farmers that produce that poisonous crap should go bankrupt for the damage they're causing to people to make a buck.

worth quoting cuz that's just what I was going to say.. well pretty close anyway

CaptainAmerica
12-27-2018, 02:19 AM
I'm doing a project on a new house construction. It's being built by a hispanic fella that owns a flooring business. It's probably a $1.25m place built on the profits of his fellow hispanics but he's also enlisted many of those same associates to build the entire house itself. So he's getting it built pretty close to cost on top of the money made from undercutting other businesses, however it's plainly obvious where corners are being cut and workmanship leaves something to be desired. I don't hate him for it and it's pretty damn smart business but I think demonstrates your point.

that you are a moron

devil21
12-27-2018, 03:53 AM
^^^^^^NM, posted removed, you're a thread sliding troll. No fun.

Schifference
12-27-2018, 06:05 AM
Obviously I meant nobody here supports subsidies. Well, Zippy does, but he's a troll.

There is a difference between supporting a subsidy and complying/utilizing what is available. No person would support not paying for goods but yet they support bankruptcy. Ron Paul himself would take money for his state. He would utilize deductions available when filing taxes. If the law exists use it until the law gets changed. Go shopping to the grocery. If you don't use coupon or store card you pay more for items. I don't like to use coupons or store card but use them because if I don't I pay more than I need to. If a family of 4 making $30,000 is capable of having food stamps or whatever it is called these days and heating assistance and choose not to do so they don't save any money for the government. All money gets spent.

If there are programs available for poor people and you fit the criteria why not use them until they are no longer available. If you do not utilize what is available or what you qualify for it is like not taking a deduction on your income tax that you are entitled to.

If every person utilized the programs that are available to them maybe it would go broke.

Would you use a city, state, or national park?

If a farmer/rancher has to comply with all the USDA or FDA regulations that are disadvantageous to their endeavor, why would they not utilize the part of a regulation that had advantage?

Superfluous Man
12-27-2018, 08:45 AM
All grain depots and silos are almost full, meaning farmers have to find their own storage solutions or allow their crops to rot. Neither option is particularly palatable.

Not particularly palatable to whom? I would think that to those who favor farm subsidies, such as Trump and I'm guessing many of these farmers themselves, these options are quite palatable, and preferable to a free market.

shakey1
12-27-2018, 10:57 AM
It is bs . Any crop being disced into the dirt would be because it is not good enough to sell . I sold all of my beans before 11/10 and got what I expected all yr for them . Also most people do not even have a plow anymore.In the old days even damaged crop would have been used for livestock feed , there would be zero waste . Now big farmers are often more specialized and large crop farmers have no iivestock and buy food at the grocery. My Grandfather would have thought they were dull.

yep... small family farms were diverse... grew a wide variety of crops & raised livestock... & much of the 'waste' crop was used to feed livestock... in other words, virtually no waste ... now largely taken over by factory farms that grow nothing but gmo corn, gmo soybeans & more gmo corn... no wonder they need to be subsidized.

http://static-media.fxx.com/img/FX_Networks_-_FXX/816/86/Simpsons_11_01_P4.jpg

AZJoe
12-30-2018, 10:46 AM
https://scontent-sjc3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/48370239_10155691607836493_3167725100208226304_o.j pg?_nc_cat=107&_nc_ht=scontent-sjc3-1.xx&oh=c97f376df63cd5b58130ab029499f53f&oe=5CCDD1B2

oyarde
12-30-2018, 11:44 AM
I drove three state four different times since I sold all of my beans . I saw no crops rotting in the fields . I accept no subsidies nor have I ever . I will though be OK if Danke wants to pick up my bar tab today & tomorrow .

XNavyNuke
07-06-2019, 01:15 PM
Eric Boehm pumping his soybean Armageddon over on Reason again today.

Trump's Trade War Continues To Crush Soybean Farmers
https://reason.com/2019/07/05/trumps-trade-war-continues-to-crush-soybean-farmers/

For supposedly being populated by a bunch of brilliant economic theorists, the folks over at Reason sure have a difficult time realizing that agricultural commodities are fungible. When the current Administration started pissing in China's tofu on day one, the talking heads couldn't stop pushing stories about crashing markets and farm auctions the likes of which hadn't been seen since the Great Depression. Ignore the facts and keep pumping the narrative! Reason is as bad as the rest. Instead of a crashed soybean market, last year saw record exports.

U.S. Soy Sets Export Record in Market Year
https://soygrowers.com/news-releases/u-s-soy-sets-export-record-market-year-ending-september/

According to the U.S. Census Bureau, U.S. soybean farmers exported a record-breaking 2.6 billion bushels of U.S. soy and soy products, valued at more than $28 billion last market year. The U.S. also set a new record high in combined volume of the whole soybeans, soybean meal and soybean oil exported in 2017/2018, with soybean meal exports accounting for the greatest growth.

Keep banging away on the keyboard Herr Doktor Boehm.
XNN

Swordsmyth
07-06-2019, 04:37 PM
Eric Boehm pumping his soybean Armageddon over on Reason again today.

Trump's Trade War Continues To Crush Soybean Farmers
https://reason.com/2019/07/05/trumps-trade-war-continues-to-crush-soybean-farmers/

For supposedly being populated by a bunch of brilliant economic theorists, the folks over at Reason sure have a difficult time realizing that agricultural commodities are fungible. When the current Administration started pissing in China's tofu on day one, the talking heads couldn't stop pushing stories about crashing markets and farm auctions the likes of which hadn't been seen since the Great Depression. Ignore the facts and keep pumping the narrative! Reason is as bad as the rest. Instead of a crashed soybean market, last year saw record exports.

U.S. Soy Sets Export Record in Market Year
https://soygrowers.com/news-releases/u-s-soy-sets-export-record-market-year-ending-september/


Keep banging away on the keyboard Herr Doktor Boehm.
XNN
TReason magazine.

RonZeplin
07-06-2019, 05:43 PM
Wealth Spread is alive and well under socialist Trump.

https://www.bayoubuzz.com/dir/images/trump-socialism.jpg

:info: Hillary or Bernie could have continued dubya & Obongo's policies too.

Swordsmyth
07-06-2019, 05:50 PM
Wealth Spread is alive and well under socialist Trump.

https://www.bayoubuzz.com/dir/images/trump-socialism.jpg

:info: Hillary or Bernie could have continued dubya & Obongo's policies too.

LOL

Trump is not doing anything like shrub jr. or O'Bummer, they sold out to communist china like you want us to.

XNavyNuke
07-07-2019, 06:21 AM
TReason magazine.

If there's money to be made in treason, the banksters don't dare call it treason. And if the banksters don't have a problem with it, neither will their dutiful customers.

XNN

devil21
07-07-2019, 01:44 PM
I noticed various canned vegetables at Food Lion jumped in price recently. Almost $1 for a standard sized can of store brand corn now. They were something like 69 cents a couple weeks ago.

Swordsmyth
07-07-2019, 03:02 PM
I noticed various canned vegetables at Food Lion jumped in price recently. Almost $1 for a standard sized can of store brand corn now. They were something like 69 cents a couple weeks ago.
They're just taking advantage of the media hype.

Stratovarious
07-07-2019, 04:22 PM
American rotted in the field for 8 years under 'Obummer' .

XNavyNuke
08-25-2019, 08:13 AM
Breathless reporting as, once again, journalist fail to be able to comprehend math.

China and Russia vow to ‘deepen trade in soybeans’ after tariff war kills US crop exports
https://www.scmp.com/economy/china-economy/article/3019187/china-and-russia-vow-deepen-trade-soybeans-after-tariff-war


The meeting came after President Xi Jinping and Russian counterpart Vladimir Putin agreed to increase bilateral trade from US$107 billion in 2018 to US$200 billion a year during the St Petersburg International Economic Forum in June.

At an investment forum in Moscow last year, Putin said that Russia would increase its production and export of soybeans to China in a bid to fill the gap in the market left by the US.

Russia total annual soybean production is about 4M tons. China annual import of soybeans is about 80M tons. If Putin decided to order his companies to sell every single bean to Xi, China would still be buying 95% of their beans on the world market. But hey! Orange man bad, Russia-Russia-Russia, Xi is a masterful manager of the Chinese economy and all thing international who should be emulated and worshipped.

XNN

devil21
08-25-2019, 09:54 AM
Breathless reporting as, once again, journalist fail to be able to comprehend math.

China and Russia vow to ‘deepen trade in soybeans’ after tariff war kills US crop exports
https://www.scmp.com/economy/china-economy/article/3019187/china-and-russia-vow-deepen-trade-soybeans-after-tariff-war



Russia total annual soybean production is about 4M tons. China annual import of soybeans is about 80M tons. If Putin decided to order his companies to sell every single bean to Xi, China would still be buying 95% of their beans on the world market. But hey! Orange man bad, Russia-Russia-Russia, Xi is a masterful manager of the Chinese economy and all thing international who should be emulated and worshipped.

XNN

What's the "B" in BRICS stand for? What does BRICS stand for? Then look at the "B"'s soybean production. Yes, it's dumb to think Russia can replace the US soybean figures while this all shakes out but China does have other options, of which Russia is only one.

Looking forward, after this all shakes out, I think we'll be exporting soybeans to China again but under much, much different economic framework than the current one (Chinese companies farming American land and sending crops back to China, mostly), but in the meantime there are other options.

nikcers
08-25-2019, 11:31 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9GZAe5z12MQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9GZAe5z12MQ

XNavyNuke
08-25-2019, 12:27 PM
What's the "B" in BRICS stand for? What does BRICS stand for? Then look at the "B"'s soybean production. Yes, it's dumb to think Russia can replace the US soybean figures while this all shakes out but China does have other options, of which Russia is only one.

It suxs to be a Blanquist in this global environment. The international socialist cabal really wants to see orange man fail and piss off the farmers in his political base but can't help but complaining every day this week on NPR about Brazil burning their forests.

Brazil’s Thriving Soy Industry Threatens Its Forests And Global Climate Targets
https://www.iflscience.com/environment/brazil-s-thriving-soy-industry-threatens-its-forests-and-global-climate-targets/

Quite the non-GMO, organic pickle.

XNN

Swordsmyth
08-25-2019, 08:35 PM
It suxs to be a Blanquist in this global environment. The international socialist cabal really wants to see orange man fail and piss off the farmers in his political base but can't help but complaining every day this week on NPR about Brazil burning their forests.

Brazil’s Thriving Soy Industry Threatens Its Forests And Global Climate Targets
https://www.iflscience.com/environment/brazil-s-thriving-soy-industry-threatens-its-forests-and-global-climate-targets/

Quite the non-GMO, organic pickle.

XNN
Soon China will have trouble paying for food imports from anywhere.

devil21
08-25-2019, 08:46 PM
Soon China will have trouble paying for food imports from anywhere.

Yeah I'm sure their GIANT gold and silver stores will soon be worthless and no one will accept gold and silver for food anywhere in the world. :rolleyes:

Swordsmyth
08-25-2019, 08:48 PM
Yeah I'm sure their GIANT gold and silver stores will soon be worthless and no one will accept gold and silver for food anywhere in the world. :rolleyes:
They will exhaust those delaying their doom.

devil21
08-25-2019, 08:50 PM
They will exhaust those delaying their doom.

Riiiiight. That must be it.