Chicago PlayStation Users Furious They Must Now Pay A 9% "Amusement Tax"

[Swordsmyth]

When they powered up their Playstations on Nov. 9, Gamers in the Windy City were furious to learn that they will now need to fork over a 9% levy to the city every time they pay for any of a suit of online services as Chicago steps up enforcement of its supremely unpopular Amusement Tax, which was expanded in 2015 to cover video games, streaming services and other digital-entertainment mediums. While some companies have resisted what they have decried as an overreach by city tax collectors, who are desperately trying to plug a massive budget hole while supporting some of the most under-funded public pensions in the country, Sony has become the latest video gaming company to acquiesce to the city's demands. Meanwhile, Nintendo and Microsoft (which owns Xbox) have been collecting the levies since 2015.
https://www.zerohedge.com/sites/default/files/inline-images/2018.11.15playstation.JPG
According to the Chicago Tribune, (https://www.chicagotribune.com/business/ct-biz-playstation-cloud-tax-chicago-20181113-story.html) the city’s amusement tax once only applied to concerts and sporting event tickets, but several streaming companies like Netflix and Hulu have bowed to the city's demands since the levy was first expanded. Apple, on the other hand, filed a lawsuit against the city back in August alleging that the tax on its streaming service was "illegal and discriminatory". The company isn't paying the tax while the case works its way through a Cook County court.
Previously, a group of streaming companies including Netflix, Amazon Prime, Spotify, XBox Live and Hulu sued Chicago back in 2015 alleging that the tax was in violation of federal law. However, the judge ruled in the city’s favor in May. After an appeal, the case is awaiting a ruling from an appellate court.
Bill McCaffrey, a spokesman for the city’s Law Department, told the Tribune that the city "uniformly enforces the amusement tax," and neglected to address the outcry.

"If a business is not collecting the tax where we believe it applies, the city takes the necessary steps and works with the company to ensure compliance with the law," he said.
The tax will now apply PlayStation subscription services, like PlayStation Now, PlayStation Plus, and PlayStation Music. Regular game purchases from the PlayStation store are untouched by the tax.

More at: https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-11-15/playstation-users-cash-strapped-chicago-must-now-pay-9-amusement-tax

[fedupinmo]

Chicago... so full of Win. :toady:

[oyarde]

I support a 100 percent chicago playstation tax . Nine percent is chump change . Go big or go home chicago .

[oyarde]

:star::star::star::star::star:

[TheCount]

Isn't this a defensive tariff?

[Anti Federalist]

Hah Hah.

You voted for it assenholes.

[brushfire]

fking tyrants

[Swordsmyth]

Isn't this a defensive tariff?
No.

Who is tariffing Chicago's exports?

[nobody's_hero]

Isn't this a defensive tariff?

Not sure why you're bringing that up in every thread recently. It's like you're trying to make a point but kind of failing miserably.

Circuit breaker for the fridge got tripped during the night? That's just like tariffs.

Give it a rest man.

[CaptainAmerica]

what a piece of SHI_T city...and all of them are moving to arizona. please can they stay there....and do something about their own stupid city.

[ThePaleoLibertarian]

This is bullshit, of course, but I can't help but gloat a bit. Steam, baby! PC wins again!

[TheTexan]

alleging that the tax was in violation of federal law

What federal law would that be? It certainly wouldn't be the constitution.

[TheTexan]

fking tyrants

It's only 9%. Everyone knows tyranny starts at ~62%

(for example, a 40%+ income tax is well within "reasonable" territory)

[TheCount]

No.

Who is tariffing Chicago's exports?
Chicago's tariff on imports of entertainment cancels out Georgia's subsidy on the production of entertainment.

[phill4paul]

Not sure why you're bringing that up in every thread recently. It's like you're trying to make a point but kind of failing miserably.

Circuit breaker for the fridge got tripped during the night? That's just like tariffs.

Give it a rest man.

https://connorsvinylcrate.files.wordpress.com/2014/11/warped.gif

[EBounding]

Isn't this a defensive tariff?


Not sure why you're bringing that up in every thread recently. It's like you're trying to make a point but kind of failing miserably.

Circuit breaker for the fridge got tripped during the night? That's just like tariffs.

Give it a rest man.

Yeah, stop making fun of tariffs. They're awesome.

[brushfire]

It's only 9%. Everyone knows tyranny starts at ~62%

(for example, a 40%+ income tax is well within "reasonable" territory)

You make a very good point. And after all, its for the children. I feel so ashamed.

[acptulsa]

Chicago's tariff on imports of entertainment cancels out Georgia's subsidy on the production of entertainment.

SCTV needs protection! They've got to find a way to get people out of the house and on the El!

[TheCount]

Not sure why you're bringing that up in every thread recently. It's like you're trying to make a point but kind of failing miserably.

Circuit breaker for the fridge got tripped during the night? That's just like tariffs.

Give it a rest man.


https://connorsvinylcrate.files.wordpress.com/2014/11/warped.gif

Might I suggest an alternative picture for a broken record who really just needs to give it a rest and stop talking about this same topic over and over again?

https://pbs.twimg.com/profile_images/573517737172934659/bB-v1E-8_400x400.jpeg

It's really tiring; dude has not shut up about it for years.

[phill4paul]

Might I suggest an alternative picture for a broken record who really just needs to give it a rest and stop talking about this same topic over and over again?

https://pbs.twimg.com/profile_images/573517737172934659/bB-v1E-8_400x400.jpeg

It's really tiring; dude has not shut up about it for years.

No one agrees with every politician 100%. Do you believe, like Ron Paul, that our troops should be brought home and placed along the border?

[agitator]

No.

Who is tariffing Chicago's exports?

Why do u always respond to the trolls here? It just encourages them.

[agitator]

Not sure why you're bringing that up in every thread recently. It's like you're trying to make a point but kind of failing miserably.

Circuit breaker for the fridge got tripped during the night? That's just like tariffs.

Give it a rest man.

Best to just ignore the mentally handicapped.

[acptulsa]

Why do u always respond to the trolls here? It just encourages them.

Trolls playing ping pong ties a forum right up. That's why they do it for hours on end.

[nobody's_hero]

Yeah, stop making fun of tariffs. They're awesome.

I wouldn't put it that way. But I was expecting doomsday prophecies to come true by "free market" think tanks, but what I see are businesses returning to the U.S., more job openings than unemployed people, and people getting off their asses and going to work again instead of sitting at home on food stamps. One can argue that this would have happened with or without tariffs, but that's kind of like trying to prove a negative at this point.

Thanks to China and Canada's trade war, we do have too much milk and soybeans now, which, I suppose means more flatulence. A tragedy no doubt.

Anyway there's a thread on this already that Swordsmyth updates like every 5 minutes, if you can get a word in there it might fit in more than a thread about Chicago being, well, Chicago.

[osan]

Cry me a river.

For one thing, who gives a poo about stupid ass video games? Yeah, they can be fun, but so what? There is nothing important in them. Not a whit. So either stop playing if the taxes are so offensive, or STFU and go on like the junkies most of those people are. I see little difference in principle between video addicts and the crack ho' who puts penises of questionable provenance into their mouths for token sums.

If you have no self-respect, that's fine. Just don't try to make it the John's fault. Nobody's got a gun to your head.

Humans.

[DamianTV]

Money Printing is Counterfeiting

Yes, this does relate to "Amusement Tax". First, we need to understand how our money works, as simply as it can be put:


Monetary Policy - "Print" The Money (via Loans)
Fiscal Policy - "Destroy" the Money (via Taxation)


All money printed must be destroyed. Every dollar in your pocket and bank acct represents someones debt to someone else. Welfare is no different, but instead of that Debt representing one person, it represents everyone who uses the US Dollar by using Inflation as an Invisible Tax on the Value of that dollar.

This "Amusement Tax" falls under the category of Fiscal Policy. It destroys the money, just as paying off a loan returns that money to the state it existed in initially, which was nothing. But back up two seconds, remember that Banks do NOT loan money they have, they create it out of thin air with the Magic of Fractional Reserve Lending. This is LEGAL COUNTERFEITING. What makes that Legal is the fact that the Repayment of that Loan does not allow that money to remain in existence.

There are two ways to "Destroy Money". Pay off a loan, and Taxes. Your Federal Income Tax payments made out to the IRS are used to pay the INTEREST that the US owes to the Federal Reserve Bank for use of its money. Thus, paying Taxes, indirectly, is a Loan Payment, and that money is subsequently also destroyed.

The idea of an "Amusement Tax" is made by rulers who are issuing Behavior Modification by issuance of Fines and Levies. They think that an Amusement Tax will generate revenue. They are partly right, and partly wrong. What they are really doing is merely applying the Belief, Money, Violence paradigm. If you "Believe" their words, then Amusement is a Behavioral Sin, which is sufficient grounds to punish people for partaking, thus, applying Money. Im quite sure if you avoid paying your Amusement Tax, they will apply Violence, by way of Imprisonment, thus completing the paradigm. Sadly, it falls perfectly into the Mental Trap that Taxation provides rewards of "improved" behaviors and receiving something of commensurate value in exchange. This is nothing more than an indication that the Govt spends far more than it takes in.

The Payouts can also come from Welfare. Give out too much in Welfare, and create new taxes to prevent the Money Supply from Hyperinflating.

The Life Cycle of the US Dollar as a Fiat Currency, and the World Reserve Fiat Currency is coming to an end. I would expect to see one of two things as a consequence:


Increases in both Welfare and Taxation
Introduction of New Forms of Taxation


The system is unbalanced and will remain unbalanced because those with the power to print the money have the power to print something else without consequence: Interest. Interest is inherently as dishonest as Counterfeiting because our money is Backed By Debt, so if you can "just print interest" then you can "just print debt" and "debt = money". Those with the power to Print Money, the Banks, will end up with Everything and you will end up with Nothing. The system will continue to function by bleeding out the value of the currency issued. Since you and I can not "just print money / debt", you and I are stuck holding the same quantity of money, which becomes more and more worthless. If this system could continue, in 100 years, the very idea of "Dollar Menu" or "Dollar Store" will adapt to reflect the value of the dollar, and we would end up with the "100 Dollar Store" or "100 Dollar Menu". Yes, the worst hamburgers imaginable would cost over a hundred bucks, in a hundred years, if this system did not collapse under its own weight.

Ignorance of the nature of Coin and Credit has gotten us into this mess, and expect to see more new taxes like it as an effort to keep a failed concept going, transferring everything from the people to the Money Changers. Even your elected leaders barely understand this. Perhaps it is time for New Leaders? Since we know "youre not voting hard enough" never fixes the issue, perhaps that New Leader should be YOU?

[Philhelm]

Are you not entertained?

[pcosmar]

Amused.

https://theintercept.imgix.net/wp-uploads/sites/1/2016/10/Chicago_A1.gif

https://chicagology.com/wp-content/themes/revolution-20/chicagoimages4/silentmoviecapital.jpg

[Ender]

Cry me a river.

For one thing, who gives a poo about stupid ass video games? Yeah, they can be fun, but so what? There is nothing important in them. Not a whit. So either stop playing if the taxes are so offensive, or STFU and go on like the junkies most of those people are. I see little difference in principle between video addicts and the crack ho' who puts penises of questionable provenance into their mouths for token sums.

If you have no self-respect, that's fine. Just don't try to make it the John's fault. Nobody's got a gun to your head.

Humans.

Unless you're Ender Wiggins who saved the earth with video games. ;)

These taxes are most likely unconstitutional which most taxes are- so we should all be somewhat concerned that everything is getting additional taxes upon taxes upon taxes.

[Swordsmyth]

Chicago's tariff on imports of entertainment cancels out Georgia's subsidy on the production of entertainment.
What subsidy?

Furthermore even if your characterization was correct there are two problems:

1 The Constitution prohibits the states from taxing interstate commerce and even if that weren't the case or shouldn't be the case we must abide by the rules until they can be changed. (that is why they didn't make it a tariff, game services based in the state or the city are not exempted)

2 That which is permissible isn't always advisable, Chicago and Illinois already overtax their residents and they didn't cut other taxes and shift to a tariff.

[Swordsmyth]

Why do u always respond to the trolls here? It just encourages them.
Because there are many people here who agree with them and I don't want noobs taken in by their lies.

The site staff won't ban them so somebody has to do battle with them.

[Swordsmyth]

Trolls playing ping pong ties a forum right up. That's why they do it for hours on end.
Tell it to the site staff, if the trolls aren't banned and nobody counters their lies then they win.

[Swordsmyth]

Cry me a river.

For one thing, who gives a poo about stupid ass video games? Yeah, they can be fun, but so what? There is nothing important in them. Not a whit. So either stop playing if the taxes are so offensive, or STFU and go on like the junkies most of those people are. I see little difference in principle between video addicts and the crack ho' who puts penises of questionable provenance into their mouths for token sums.

If you have no self-respect, that's fine. Just don't try to make it the John's fault. Nobody's got a gun to your head.

Humans.
If you don't like video games that is fine, this isn't about games so much as the fact that Chicago is trying to wring every loose nickle out of its residents.

[osan]

Unless you're Ender Wiggins who saved the earth with video games.

I'm so clueless on those fronts, I have no idea who that is.



These taxes are most likely unconstitutional which most taxes are- so we should all be somewhat concerned that everything is getting additional taxes upon taxes upon taxes.

All taxes are immoral.

Sadly, in this überscrewed world, it seems that at least some of them are necessary if a people is to defend itself against the predations of other populations. Then again, there's nothing to say that "government" is somehow better at managing national defense. I dunno... this crap all makes my head hurt anymore, and it's been hurting a lot lately, what with my new bad habit of elevated blood pressure. Then there's my other daughter who's decided to move to Barcelona to be near her sister and two niece/nephews.

[Anti Globalist]

Soon Xbox and Nintendo users will have to do the same thing. Unless they're already doing it.

[dude58677]

“Liberalism is a mental disorder”

[Swordsmyth]

I'm so clueless on those fronts, I have no idea who that is.
It's a reference to a character in a science fiction movie who succumbs to enemy brainwashing and becomes a traitor after winning the war for his side.

[osan]

If you don't like video games that is fine, this isn't about games so much as the fact that Chicago is trying to wring every loose nickle out of its resident.

I understand that. My point was that the players are whining about the tax on something the importance of which is just this side of zero. It appears all they can do it whine about the nasty taxes but will not suck it up like cowboys and deny that den of iniquity its revenue stream by refusing to play. They behave as despicable addicts and on that account I have no sympathy for them. Yeah, the überdouches in Chicago have no authority to do what they have done and to that point players' complaints are valid. But they can do something about it, yet apparently aren't doing it because it would seem their games are more important than the fact that they're being put over the wood. Once again, corruption of the affluent wins out over doing what is right. FAIL.

[osan]

It's a reference to a character in a science fiction movie who succumbs to enemy brainwashing and becomes a traitor after winning the war for his side.

Sounds like a Manchurian candidate.

[Ender]

It's a reference to a character in a science fiction movie who succumbs to enemy brainwashing and becomes a traitor after winning the war for his side.

NO.

It is a character in a BOOK who is a real hero & learns what the evil government he is living under is really doing to it's people as well as others.

Try reading.

[acptulsa]

NO.

It is a character in a BOOK who is a real hero & learns what the evil government he is living under is really doing to it's people as well as others.

Try reading.

Oh. Well. No wonder the shylls are spreading misinformation about him.

[DamianTV]

I'm so clueless on those fronts, I have no idea who that is.




All taxes are immoral.

Sadly, in this überscrewed world, it seems that at least some of them are necessary if a people is to defend itself against the predations of other populations. Then again, there's nothing to say that "government" is somehow better at managing national defense. I dunno... this crap all makes my head hurt anymore, and it's been hurting a lot lately, what with my new bad habit of elevated blood pressure. Then there's my other daughter who's decided to move to Barcelona to be near her sister and two niece/nephews.

Ender's Game. Movie. Basically, children are screened for military tactical geniuses, and those skills are focused on thru playing video games.

Taxation in this case is in an effort to continue Socialism, the Great Lie where everyone lives at the expense of everyone else, which is what the Taxes are used to fund. I already made my case from a Monetary perspective, but kind of doubt anyone read a word of it.

[osan]

There are a few problems here. I will address one or two.



Money Printing is Counterfeiting


First issue, and it is a big one: You employ "money" where you should be using "currency". There is literally no such a thing as printed money. Paper, most especially when it is irredeemable, cannot by definition be "money". It is only currency. The two are not the same. All money may be currency, but not all currency is money.






All money printed must be destroyed.

You've not quite explained this clearly, which is not to say I disagree, but that a more detailed and clear description of what is meant by "destroy" and why it "must" be.




The Life Cycle of the US Dollar as a Fiat Currency, and the World Reserve Fiat Currency is coming to an end.

On what do you base this assertion? Again, not saying you are wrong, but that you put it out there without 'splaining.


The system is unbalanced

Depends on how one looks at it. Thus far, I see it as being quite in balance, precarious though it may be.


Ignorance of the nature of Coin and Credit has gotten us into this mess,

THIS^^^^^.

[Ender]

Ender's Game. Movie. Basically, children are screened for military tactical geniuses, and those skills are focused on thru playing video games.

Taxation in this case is in an effort to continue Socialism, the Great Lie where everyone lives at the expense of everyone else, which is what the Taxes are used to fund. I already made my case from a Monetary perspective, but kind of doubt anyone read a word of it.

Ender's Game. BOOK- by Orson Scott Card, one of the greatest living sci-fi writers today. (The movie doesn't come close in brilliance.)

And, what you say is true about the military & video games, Still, as I said earlier, the real story is when Ender becomes a real hero as he learns what the evil government he is living under is really doing to its people as well as others.

[TheCount]

What subsidy?

http://www.georgia.org/industries/entertainment/georgia-film-tv-production/production-incentives/



1 The Constitution prohibits the states from taxing interstate commerce and even if that weren't the case or shouldn't be the case we must abide by the rules until they can be changed. (that is why they didn't make it a tariff, game services based in the state or the city are not exempted)

Given that you oppose freedom of movement among the states, I'm assuming that you also oppose free trade among the states, and are merely arguing this point because you are incapable of not posting.

Also, obviously they can simply offset that tax with a subsidy to in-state studios.



2 That which is permissible isn't always advisable, Chicago and Illinois already overtax their residents and they didn't cut other taxes and shift to a tariff.

If it's advisable to tax international trade, why would it not be advisable to tax interstate trade?

[Swordsmyth]

http://www.georgia.org/industries/entertainment/georgia-film-tv-production/production-incentives/

I see tax cuts, not subsidies.



Given that you oppose freedom of movement among the states, I'm assuming that you also oppose free trade among the states, and are merely arguing this point because you are incapable of not posting.
I'm arguing it because the rules must be observed as they are unless/until they are changed.
I believe that interstate tariffs should be allowed but they should be limited to a percentage set by the feds and only the destination state should be allowed to collect them.


Also, obviously they can simply offset that tax with a subsidy to in-state studios.
Which they haven't done because their goal is to wring money out of their citizens.
They might also be challenged for regulating interstate commerce if they tried that workaround.




If it's advisable to tax international trade, why would it not be advisable to tax interstate trade?
It might be but in this case as I said they already overtax their residents and they didn't cut other taxes and shift to a tariff.

[DamianTV]

There are a few problems here. I will address one or two.

First issue, and it is a big one: You employ "money" where you should be using "currency". There is literally no such a thing as printed money. Paper, most especially when it is irredeemable, cannot by definition be "money". It is only currency. The two are not the same. All money may be currency, but not all currency is money.


First reply is absolutely +REP worthy! You are very very correct, Money is not printed, I was just using the term rather loosely. The real definition, I should have used "currency" because currency bleeds out its value over time, money does not.

Second point, also again you are correct. Real money, when the definition is used correctly, can not be "destroyed". The "money" I meant was "Debt Based Currency" due to its nature. Its borrowed into existence, thus leaving the currency in existence as long as the debt exists. However, when the "loan is paid off", that currency is destroyed. The actual paper is redistributed, but the currency itself no longer exists on the books.

I based the "coming to and end" for the US Dollar as the worlds reserve currency on current events. Things like BRICs, and other nations seeking other ways to back their currency. It still is the Reserve Currency, but that is changing, IMHO. Other countries have seen the long term destructive nature of our Fiat Currency as their Reserve Currency and most likely want to switch away from it.

All in all, very good points!

[osan]

First reply is absolutely +REP worthy! You are very very correct, Money is not printed, I was just using the term rather loosely. The real definition, I should have used "currency" because currency bleeds out its value over time, money does not.

Second point, also again you are correct. Real money, when the definition is used correctly, can not be "destroyed". The "money" I meant was "Debt Based Currency" due to its nature. Its borrowed into existence, thus leaving the currency in existence as long as the debt exists. However, when the "loan is paid off", that currency is destroyed. The actual paper is redistributed, but the currency itself no longer exists on the books.

I based the "coming to and end" for the US Dollar as the worlds reserve currency on current events. Things like BRICs, and other nations seeking other ways to back their currency. It still is the Reserve Currency, but that is changing, IMHO. Other countries have seen the long term destructive nature of our Fiat Currency as their Reserve Currency and most likely want to switch away from it.

All in all, very good points!


If USA would give the Fed the heave-ho and execute all its officers, then return to minted gold currency, the dollar would remain supreme indefinitely.

That, of course, will not happen

[DamianTV]

If USA would give the Fed the heave-ho and execute all its officers, then return to minted gold currency, the dollar would remain supreme indefinitely.

That, of course, will not happen

Yep. Our leaders are addicted to the Debt the Federal Reserve Bank offers because otherwise, they have to raise taxes for the revenue for their War and Welfare paradigm, and raising taxes makes them quite unpopular. The important bit is they continue to maintain a dishonest currency, and with that knowledge, makes our Leaders the Dishonest ones. We are ALL victims of the schemes of Central Banking.

[osan]

Yep. Our leaders are addicted to the Debt the Federal Reserve Bank offers because otherwise, they have to raise taxes for the revenue for their War and Welfare paradigm, and raising taxes makes them quite unpopular. The important bit is they continue to maintain a dishonest currency, and with that knowledge, makes our Leaders the Dishonest ones. We are ALL victims of the schemes of Central Banking.


Are we? If so, it says nothing good about our moral fiber... being so well armed as we are and all.

It would appear convenience and the "sin" of crushing debt suits us just fine, despite our complaints.

[DamianTV]

Are we? If so, it says nothing good about our moral fiber... being so well armed as we are and all.

It would appear convenience and the "sin" of crushing debt suits us just fine, despite our complaints.

It does. Of course, alcoholics also think that "just one more drink" will at least temporarily fix their "problems". And it goes right back to Ignorance of the nature of Coin and Credit... so full circle. What gets to me is even if people hear that statement about Ignorance, they never seek to eliminate their own ignorance, and continue making the same demands that the "alcoholic" or "addict" (which includes debt) that got us in trouble in the first place.

Then an Einstein Quote comes up.


Insanity is doing the same exact thing and expecting completely different results.

[osan]

It does. Of course, alcoholics also think that "just one more drink" will at least temporarily fix their "problems". And it goes right back to Ignorance of the nature of Coin and Credit... so full circle. What gets to me is even if people hear that statement about Ignorance, they never seek to eliminate their own ignorance, and continue making the same demands that the "alcoholic" or "addict" (which includes debt) that got us in trouble in the first place.

Then an Einstein Quote comes up.


Humans.