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Anti Federalist
06-08-2018, 09:47 AM
Looking over the "celebrity suicides" since 2000, there might be something to that. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_suicides_in_the_21st_century)

I would also like to see how many were taking, or had been taking, prescription drugs that have suicidal thoughts listed as a side effect.

Brian4Liberty
06-08-2018, 10:10 AM
Looking over the "celebrity suicides" since 2000, there might be something to that. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_suicides_in_the_21st_century)

I would also like to see how many were taking, or had been taking, prescription drugs that have suicidal thoughts listed as a side effect.

Leftists tend to be emotion-driven and often irrational.

donnay
06-08-2018, 10:15 AM
Taking drugs might be the reason why they are unhinged. Up those meds and forget to take them will make they psycho. But just by virtue of taking them the side effects are clear that they have suicide thoughts.

Anti Federalist
06-08-2018, 10:17 AM
Leftists tend to be emotion-driven and often irrational.

I was prompted to consider this by the news of Anthony Bourdain's recent suicide.

Is it being emotionally overreactive?

Is it just being miserable?

I can be as miserable and curmudgeonly as the best of them, but I think the critical difference may be, my miserable outlook and misanthropy is fueled by the ongoing battle to just be left alone.

If one is a committed progressive, it must drive such people nuts that they cannot corral and boss around and make their fellow citizens comply with every edict and fatwa that progressive thought demands must be complied with in order to achieve societal Nirvana.

Swordsmyth
06-08-2018, 10:22 AM
Does leftism, progressivism, lead to suicide?


Not fast enough.

Anti Federalist
06-08-2018, 10:29 AM
Taking drugs might be the reason why they are unhinged. Up those meds and forget to take them will make they psycho. But just by virtue of taking them the side effects are clear that they have suicide thoughts.

Oh, I'm not discounting that at all.

I'm thinking the connection, the progressive line of thinking, may be this:

Look at all these people around me, running amok.

There has to be some control, and safety nets, and law and order.

Ah, progressive political thought answers these questions.

(Progressive evangelical now tries to implement these ideals and fatwas, finds resistance and failure when applied in the real world.)

Damn it, why won't these people listen to me and do what they're told???

(Frustrated and depressed, progressive evangelical turns to modern pharmacology to treat his feelings of helpless rage and depression.)

Damn it, even that does no good, now I'm suffering violent mood swings, I'm still depressed, and these damn people still won't listen to me.

(Progressive then monkeys around with drug dosing or prescription drug cocktails, nothing seems to do any good, progressive spirals down into a shit vortex of depression, hate and lethargy. Progressive then blows his brains out.)

Anti Federalist
06-08-2018, 10:30 AM
Not fast enough.

LOL - Ouch!

Brian4Liberty
06-08-2018, 10:36 AM
I was prompted to consider this by the news of Anthony Bourdain's recent suicide.

Is it being emotionally overreactive?

Is it just being miserable?

I can be as miserable and curmudgeonly as the best of them, but I think the critical difference may be, my miserable outlook and misanthropy is fueled by the ongoing battle to just be left alone.

If one is a committed progressive, it must drive such people nuts that they cannot corral and boss around and make their fellow citizens comply with every edict and fatwa that progressive thought demands must be complied with in order to achieve societal Nirvana.

Hadn't heard he died. He always struck me as a bit unhinged. TDS is real. Leftists are literally losing their minds.

The "tolerant" left are quite the opposite, and it is driving them mad. He worked at CNN, one of the centers of constant lamentations, hysteria and outrage.

Anti Federalist
06-08-2018, 10:41 AM
Hadn't heard he died. He always struck me as a bit unhinged. TDS is real. Leftists are literally losing their minds.

The "tolerant" left are quite the opposite, and it is driving them mad. He worked at CNN, one of the centers of constant lamentations, hysteria and outrage.

Exactly...that's what got me to thinking and researching...so far, what I see of "celebrity" or well known people's suicides, it seems heavily weighted toward people with leftist, progressive tendencies, when they have indicated any political leanings.

Brian4Liberty
06-08-2018, 10:59 AM
Exactly...that's what got me to thinking and researching...so far, what I see of "celebrity" or well known people's suicides, it seems heavily weighted toward people with leftist, progressive tendencies, when they have indicated any political leanings.

In fairness to leftists as a whole, Bordain was a head case his entire life, so no telling what finally pushed him over the edge.

But ask this question: If Hillary was President right now, would he have killed himself? No way to answer that, but I'd wager if there was a way to compare an alternative timeline where she had won, many lives would be much different today.

Anti Federalist
06-08-2018, 11:30 AM
So, for roughly twenty years there has been a ceaseless drumbeat from government, media, and society to "seek help" if you are feeling suicidal.

Result?

A double digit increase in suicides.


CDC: U.S. Suicide Rates Rising Dramatically

http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2018/06/07/cdc-u-s-suicide-rates-rising-dramatically/

7 Jun 2018

Suicide rates in the United States have increased by nearly 30 percent since 1999, a new report from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) states.


CDC

@CDCgov
Suicides are rising across the US. Suicide is more than a mental health condition — states and communities can adopt comprehensive strategies to prevent suicide. Read more in new #VitalSigns report: http://bit.ly/2Iim0W5
1:01 PM - Jun 7, 2018
406
638 people are talking about this
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According to a study of trends in suicide rates among individuals ten years of age and older, between 1999-2016, suicide rates rose significantly in 44 states. An increase of greater than 30 percent in suicides was observed in 25 states.

The greatest increase in suicides was seen in “middle-aged adults,” between the ages of 45 and 64.

Significant jumps in female suicides were seen in 43 states and in male suicides, in 34 states.

In 2016 alone, there were almost 45,000 deaths from suicide.

“And, unfortunately, our data show that the problem is getting worse,” Anne Schuchat, MD, principal deputy director at CDC, said at a press briefing, reports Medscape.

Among those who committed suicide and who had known mental health conditions, 67.2% had a history of treatment for mental health or substance abuse conditions, and 54 percent were in treatment at the time of their suicide.

Among those who committed suicide who did not have a known psychiatric condition, 84 percent were men and 16 percent were women. About 45 percent were dealing with relationship problems or loss, about 51 percent experienced life stressors, and about 33 percent encountered recent crises.

“I think it’s possible that we have some underrecognition of mental health conditions in our data, both because conditions haven’t been formally diagnosed and because those left behind might not have been aware of the diagnosis,” Schuchat said.

The number one means to commit suicide was found to be firearms, followed by hanging, and then poisoning, including through opioids.

“Suicide is a leading cause of death for Americans – and it’s a tragedy for families and communities across the country,” Schuchat said. “From individuals and communities to employers and healthcare professionals, everyone can play a role in efforts to help save lives and reverse this troubling rise in suicide.”

Anti Federalist
06-08-2018, 12:17 PM
Female Veterans Face Higher Risk of Suicide

https://townhall.com/tipsheet/briannaheldt/2018/06/08/female-veterans-face-higher-risk-of-suicide-n2488807

Posted: Jun 08, 2018 12:15 PM

Female Veterans Face Higher Risk of Suicide

It would appear that female veterans in America aren’t faring so well.

According to a recent NPR article, women who’ve served in combat are 250 times more likely than female civilians to commit suicide.

Male veterans, on the other hand, are only 18 times more likely to kill themselves than their male civilian counterparts.

What, exactly, is going on?

So far, it’s not exactly clear what the reason is for the disparity.

The US Department of Veterans Affairs remains a convenient and expedient scapegoat, certainly, and not entirely without good reason. Just this past May, Forbes published a piece titled 3 Ways to Fix the VA Among Ongoing Scandals. The article describes woefully inadequate facilities and cites the 2014 scandal in particular, which erupted under the Obama administration, and where government officials allegedly falsified data showing just how long desperate veterans were waiting for appointments.

But the ongoing problems and corruption in the VA can’t fully explain the problem.

Nor can the VA be wholly responsible for the suicide rate among female veterans having increased by 85%--not an insignificant number, surely--in recent years. Why are women in combat doing so much worse, comparatively, than men? And what is the reason for the sudden, sharp increase?

If nothing else, the latest polls and research seem to validate something conservatives have been saying for a long time: men and women are indeed different.

Researchers with the Service Women’s Action Network (SWAN) just released a series of mental wellness recommendations for servicewomen and female veterans. One of those recommendations is the establishment of stronger social support networks. There is concern among researchers that women who’ve served in combat zones, in contrast to men, have no real community with which to share their experiences.

But while that may be true to some degree, it doesn’t necessarily speak to why women in particular are struggling so much. Surely men, too, have a difficult time finding positive ways of processing what they’ve seen.

One wonders if this latest research will ignite the age-old debate over women serving in combat positions, in general. It’s certainly possible. As recently as 2016, PBS was reporting a Marine general’s predictions that “the Defense Department’s vows to maintain the same standards for women and men in combat jobs won’t last,” and that “the military will eventually be pressured to lower the qualifications so more women can serve in jobs like the Marine infantry.”

At the time, the Marine Corps was opposed to opening certain infantry and combat positions to women, claiming that evidence showed male-only units were more effective than combined-gender units. They also worried about the potential for sexual harassment, and for the general well-being of women serving in such positions.

Two years later, it appears that the sharp decline in women’s mental health may support the Marine Corps’ position.

It was in 2013 when then-Secretary of Defense Leon Panetta granted women the previously unavailable right to serve in combat. Three years later, and against the Marine Corps’ recommendations, all military occupational specialties (such as ground units) were made available to women.

Liberals have long insisted that true gender equality demands women be afforded access to the same opportunities as men. But what this position fails to take into account is now being borne out in the extremely troubling suicide statistics: for all the talk of equality, servicemen and servicewomen are not faring the same. Women, who now have equal access to combat positions, are suffering disproportionately. Even if they make it back to their families alive, they may still not survive.

Controversial or not, perhaps it’s time to reconsider whether serving in combat is truly what’s best for women.

AuH20
06-08-2018, 12:17 PM
Most leftists are out of tune with the natural world. They have rebelled against the restraints erected by the natural world over a millennia. Just look at their psychosis with gender identification and host of other issues? Right to healthcare? Right to housing? Hmmmph. They have been in a slow, gradual death spiral since they have been in their formative years and have spread their personal madness to the uninitiated.

Krugminator2
06-08-2018, 12:25 PM
"Why Conservatives Are Happier Than Liberals"
https://www.nytimes.com/2012/07/08/opinion/sunday/conservatives-are-happier-and-extremists-are-happiest-of-all.html


Scholars on both the left and right have studied this question extensively, and have reached a consensus that it is conservatives who possess the happiness edge. Many data sets show this. For example, the Pew Research Center in 2006 reported (http://pewresearch.org/assets/social/pdf/AreWeHappyYet.pdf) that conservative Republicans were 68 percent more likely than liberal Democrats to say they were “very happy” about their lives. This pattern has persisted for decades. The question isn’t whether this is true, but why.

My best guess is that liberals are more unhappy becomes they tend not to confront the world as it actually exists and are less likely to work within the bounds of nature and reality. Whereas conservatives probably are more accepting of the world and try to make the most of it.

timosman
06-08-2018, 12:30 PM
Progressives, the ultimate misanthropes.

AuH20
06-08-2018, 12:34 PM
Progressives, the ultimate misanthropes.

They're actually the opposite. True misanthropes would never embrace such invasive, omnipotent governments that they endorse.

Krugminator2
06-08-2018, 12:38 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9txz6_61QnI

timosman
06-08-2018, 12:43 PM
There must be an entry in the DSM (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diagnostic_and_Statistical_Manual_of_Mental_Disord ers) for this. Anybody have a link?

lilymc
06-08-2018, 01:44 PM
Maybe it has something to do with their spiritual beliefs? Leftists tend to be more secular and godless… which means no true hope, and nothing beyond this life. So maybe when they're in a deep depression, suicide seems like a good solution, at that time. When in fact, the exact opposite is true.

timosman
06-08-2018, 01:46 PM
Maybe it has something to do with their spiritual beliefs? Leftists tend to be more secular and godless… which means no true hope, and nothing beyond this life. So maybe when they're in a deep depression, suicide seems like a good solution, at that time. When in fact, the exact opposite is true.

This makes coping with the unavoidable failure in life very difficult.

Henry Rogue
06-08-2018, 01:51 PM
Looking over the "celebrity suicides" since 2000, there might be something to that. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_suicides_in_the_21st_century)

I would also like to see how many were taking, or had been taking, prescription drugs that have suicidal thoughts listed as a side effect.

Don't know, but it leads to misery for the rest of us.

Henry Rogue
06-08-2018, 01:53 PM
Maybe it has something to do with their spiritual beliefs? Leftists tend to be more secular and godless… which means no true hope, and nothing beyond this life. So maybe when they're in a deep depression, suicide seems like a good solution, at that time. When in fact, the exact opposite is true.

They have a god and religion, it is the state.

lilymc
06-08-2018, 01:57 PM
They have a god and religion, it is the state.

Yep, and how sad is that to place all one's trust in corrupt, fallible humans... instead of the true power of this world.

Henry Rogue
06-08-2018, 02:00 PM
Yep, and how sad is that to place all one's trust in corrupt, fallible humans... instead of the true power of this world.

Sad and dangerous.

timosman
06-08-2018, 02:03 PM
Yep, and how sad is that to place all one's trust in corrupt, fallible humans... instead of the true power of this world.

They refuse to believe humans are fallible.:cool:

Brian4Liberty
06-08-2018, 02:21 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9txz6_61QnI

So neoconservatives are the model "conservative"? The video plays more like a recruitment video for the neoconservative AEI.

timosman
06-08-2018, 03:06 PM
They refuse to believe humans are fallible.:cool:

Join our cult. You will be perfect. Like us. :cool:

Anti Federalist
06-08-2018, 03:38 PM
Most leftists are out of tune with the natural world. They have rebelled against the restraints erected by the natural world over a millennia. Just look at their psychosis with gender identification and host of other issues? Right to healthcare? Right to housing? Hmmmph. They have been in a slow, gradual death spiral since they have been in their formative years and have spread their personal madness to the uninitiated.


"Why Conservatives Are Happier Than Liberals"
https://www.nytimes.com/2012/07/08/opinion/sunday/conservatives-are-happier-and-extremists-are-happiest-of-all.html

My best guess is that liberals are more unhappy becomes they tend not to confront the world as it actually exists and are less likely to work within the bounds of nature and reality. Whereas conservatives probably are more accepting of the world and try to make the most of it.

Yes, I agree with both, and it gels with what I was pondering initially.

Not able to accept what cannot be changed, unable to shine on differences, the utter inability to mind their own business, and as lily noted, the rejection of anything beyond the here and now.

That is the recipe for misery, depression and ultimately suicide.

Conclusion: Leftism is a mental illness.

Anti Globalist
06-08-2018, 04:22 PM
Not fast enough.
Too soon.

Swordsmyth
06-08-2018, 04:26 PM
Too soon.

:confused:

Zippyjuan
06-08-2018, 07:56 PM
Hadn't heard he died. He always struck me as a bit unhinged. TDS is real. Leftists are literally losing their minds.

The "tolerant" left are quite the opposite, and it is driving them mad. He worked at CNN, one of the centers of constant lamentations, hysteria and outrage.

He battled demons his whole life and was a recovering addict. His CNN program was about foods from different cultures.

https://www.cnn.com/2018/06/08/us/anthony-bourdain-obit/index.html


On his award-winning series, "Parts Unknown," Bourdain brought the world home to CNN viewers. Through the simple act of sharing meals, he showcased both the extraordinary diversity of cultures and cuisines, yet how much we all have in common.


Bourdain was in France working on an upcoming episode of his award-winning CNN series, "Parts Unknown." His close friend Eric Ripert, the French chef, found Bourdain unresponsive in his hotel room Friday morning.

timosman
06-08-2018, 08:00 PM
He battled demons his whole life and was a recovering addict. His CNN program was about foods from different cultures.

https://www.cnn.com/2018/06/08/us/anthony-bourdain-obit/index.html

Thank you for solving the mystery.:cool:

Zippyjuan
06-08-2018, 08:01 PM
https://www.newscientist.com/article/dn2817-right-wing-governments-increase-suicide-rates/


Right-wing governments ‘increase suicide rates’
By Andy Coghlan

Right-wing governments may sap some people’s will to live and result in more suicides, conclude studies in Britain and Australia.

The researchers speculate that losers are more likely to kill themselves in the individualistic, “winner-takes-all” societies favoured by right wing governments, because they are left to fend for themselves. Wide disparities in wealth also sharpen any sense of hopelessness, the researchers argue.

“If you fail under that ideology, it would accentuate your feelings of failure,” says Mary Shaw, whose team at the University of Bristol analysed suicide trends in England and Wales over the past century.

Left wing governments tend to be more “inclusive” and community based, she says, decreasing the isolation felt by people down on their luck. Shaw’s team calculates that over the past century, 35,000 extra suicides occurred when the Tories were in power.

“That’s equivalent to one suicide for every day of the 20th Century, or two for every day that the Conservatives ruled,” the team write in the Journal of Epidemiology and Community Health.

Britain’s Conservative Party declined to comment on the findings.

Double trouble
Shaw and her colleagues found that on average, suicide rates were 17 per cent higher when the Conservatives were in power, compared to the annual average of 103 suicides per million population when opposition parties held office.

Richard Taylor and his team in the School of Public Health at the University of Sydney found similar trends over the past century in New South Wales. When Right-wing governments were in power, men were 17 per cent more likely and women 40 per cent more likely to commit suicide.

They report that rates were highest whenever Right wing governments held power both at federal and state levels.

Both studies reached their conclusions after taking into account other factors that affect suicide rates, such as economic slumps, wartime, and even a surge of suicides among women in the 1960s when sedatives became widely available.

“You’ve never had it so good”
But the same trend always emerged, even at times of economic boom such as the “you’ve-never-had-it-so-good” years when Harold MacMillan led the UK’s Tory government between 1957 and 1963.

During that time, annual suicides peaked at 137 per million population. Shaw points out that rates were almost as high in the 1930s (135 per million) when Labour’s Ramsay McDonald headed a coalition, but she believes the primary reason then was the century’s worst economic slump.

The lowest rate was 85 per million, during the Liberal government of David Lloyd George between 1916 and 1920. Now, under Tony Blair, it is back to the non-Conservative average of 103, down from 121 during Margaret Thatcher’s first term in the early 1980s.

Shaw admits that attempts to connect the differences to ideologies are pure speculation. “But I’d be very interested to see if suicide rates are higher wherever there’s a Right-wing government,” she says. “I’d be particularly interested to see if the relationship holds in the US.”

timosman
06-08-2018, 08:02 PM
Looks like somebody came prepared. :D

Zippyjuan
06-08-2018, 08:05 PM
That was Australia and Britain back around 2000. This looked at the US. They looked at the statewide suicide rate and tried to examine the political leanings of their residents. Correlation is not necessarily causation.

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/04/130405064029.htm


Suicide risk linked to rates of gun ownership, political conservatism

Residents of states with the highest rates of gun ownership and political conservatism are at greater risk of suicide than those in states with less gun ownership and less politically conservative leanings, according to a study by University of California, Riverside sociology professor Augustine J. Kposowa.

The study, "Association of suicide rates, gun ownership, conservatism and individual suicide risk," was published online in the journal Social Psychiatry & Psychiatric Epidemiology in February.

Suicide was the 11th leading cause of death for all ages in the United States in 2007, the most recent year for which complete mortality data was available at the time of the study. It was the seventh leading cause of death for males and the 15th leading cause of death for females. Firearms are the most commonly used method of suicide by males and poisoning the most common among females.

Kposowa, who has studied suicide and its causes for two decades, analyzed mortality data from the U.S. Multiple Cause of Death Files for 2000 through 2004 and combined individual-level data with state-level information. Firearm ownership, conservatism (measured by percentage voting for former President George W. Bush in the 2000 election), suicide rate, church adherence, and the immigration rate were measured at the state level. He analyzed data relating to 131,636 individual suicides, which were then compared to deaths from natural causes (excluding homicides and accidents).

"Many studies show that of all suicide methods, firearms have the highest case fatality, implying that an individual who selects this technique has a very low chance of survival," Kposowa said. Guns are simply the most efficient method of suicide, he added.

With few exceptions, states with the highest rates of gun ownership -- for example, Alaska, Montana, Wyoming, Idaho, Alabama, and West Virginia -- also tended to have the highest suicide rates. These states were also carried overwhelmingly by George Bush in the 2000 presidential election.

The study also found that:

The odds of committing suicide were 2.9 times higher among men than women

Non-Hispanic whites were nearly four times as likely to kill themselves as Non-Hispanic African Americans

The odds of suicide among Hispanics were 2.3 times higher than the odds among Non-Hispanic African Americans

Divorced and separated individuals were 38 percent more likely to kill themselves than those who were married

A higher percentage of church-goers at the state level reduced individual suicide risk.

"Church adherence may promote church attendance, which exposes an individual to religious beliefs, for example, about an afterlife. Suicide is proscribed in the three monotheistic religions: Judaism, Christianity and Islam," Kposowa noted in explaining the finding that church membership at the state level reduces individual risk of suicide. "In states with a higher percentage of the population that belong to a church, it is plausible that religious views and doctrine about suicide are well-known through sacred texts, theology or sermons, and adherents may be less likely to commit suicide."

Kposowa is the first to use a nationally representative sample to examine the effect of firearm availability on suicide odds. Previous studies that associated firearm availability to suicide were limited to one or two counties. His study also demonstrates that individual behavior is influenced not only by personal characteristics, but by social structural or contextual attributes. That is, what happens at the state level can influence the personal actions of those living within that state.

The sociologist said that although policies aimed at seriously regulating firearm ownership would reduce individual suicides, such policies are likely to fail not because they do not work, but because many Americans remain opposed to meaningful gun control, arguing that they have a constitutional right to bear arms.

"Even modest efforts to reform gun laws are typically met with vehement opposition. There are also millions of Americans who continue to believe that keeping a gun at home protects them against intruders, even though research shows that when a gun is used in the home, it is often against household members in the commission of homicides or suicides," Kposowa said.

"Adding to the widespread misinformation about guns is that powerful pro-gun lobby groups, especially the National Rifle Association, seem to have a stranglehold on legislators and U.S. policy, and a politician who calls for gun control may be targeted for removal from office in a future election by a gun lobby," he added.

Although total suicide rates in the U.S. are not much higher than in other Western countries, without changes in gun-ownership policies "the United States is poised to remain a very armed and potentially dangerous nation for its inhabitants for years to come."

euphemia
06-08-2018, 08:06 PM
In my opinion the entertainment industry presents a disconnect between real life and the life portrayed in TV and films. Likewise the internet also presents a disconnect between real life and the life portrayed on the web.

The conscience rebels at the duality. It is unsustainable over a lifetime. Either the real life or the fake one will win. Almost all mass-murders have/had a significant cyber footprint.

Zippyjuan
06-08-2018, 08:10 PM
https://amp.businessinsider.com/images/59fb8afb58a0c1184d8b5440-960-759.png

http://www.businessinsider.com/maps-counties-where-opioid-deaths-are-high-trump-2016-crisis-2017-10


Out of the 82 counties with exceptionally high opioid death rates, 77 voted for President Donald Trump in 2016, and most were in rural parts of the country.

Economic regression, unemployment, and the associated social decline are correlated with high rates of drug use in white counties.


Shannon Monnat, an associate professor of sociology at Syracuse University, said her findings indicate that places where rates of death due to drug addiction, alcohol abuse, and suicide are high are also places that heavily supported Trump in the election.

"I expected to see it because when you think about the underlying factors that lead to overdose or suicide, it's depression, despair, distress, and anxiety," Monnat told Business Insider.

Research Monnat did after the election suggested that counties that were largely white and had a high "economic distress index" correlated strongly with high support for Trump. The index, which Monnat has used in her research for years, combines the percentages of people who are in poverty, unemployed, disabled, in single-parent families, living on public assistance, or living without health insurance. These same places also had exceptionally high rates of drug overdoses and deaths.

Historian Kathleen Frydl's research shows an even more striking trend. She noticed that many typically Democratic counties that were particularly heavily affected by the opioid crisis went red on election night. She named this segment of the population the "oxy electorate."

https://amp.businessinsider.com/images/59fb8afb4d05ac0b3b8b5674-960-759.png

timosman
06-08-2018, 08:13 PM
Zippy is totally unaware of other members' postings as it continues its media blast.

Anti Federalist
06-08-2018, 08:16 PM
"Even modest efforts to reform gun laws are typically met with vehement opposition. There are also millions of Americans who continue to believe that keeping a gun at home protects them against intruders, even though research shows that when a gun is used in the home, it is often against household members in the commission of homicides or suicides," Kposowa said.

This is pure horseshit that has been refuted numerous times.


it is often

ETA - Oh wait, it was subtly worded in such a way that the author could deny it says what he wants it to mean.

heavenlyboy34
06-08-2018, 08:17 PM
They have a god and religion, it is the state.

That^^ This is true of the statist "Right", as well. Look how they get all offended when you don't respect their Sacred symbols and such-teh flag, teh anthem, teh troops, teh Founding Fathers, teh Constitution, etc.

Swordsmyth
06-08-2018, 08:19 PM
https://www.newscientist.com/article/dn2817-right-wing-governments-increase-suicide-rates/
Right-wing governments ‘increase suicide rates’


Translation: Liberals can't deal with reality.

oyarde
06-08-2018, 08:20 PM
Looking over the "celebrity suicides" since 2000, there might be something to that. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_suicides_in_the_21st_century)

I would also like to see how many were taking, or had been taking, prescription drugs that have suicidal thoughts listed as a side effect.

Absolute . Yes . Mentally ill kill themselves . Leftists are terminal . They spend life dreaming of stealing and killing others and spreading incurable mental disease . I am sure others also kill themselves too , those we should try and save .

Swordsmyth
06-08-2018, 08:22 PM
That^^ This is true of the statist "Right", as well. Look how they get all offended when you don't respect their Sacred symbols and such-teh flag, teh anthem, teh troops, teh Founding Fathers, teh Constitution, etc.

Many things can deserve respect without being worshiped.

Anti Federalist
06-08-2018, 08:25 PM
That was Australia and Britain back around 2000. This looked at the US. They looked at the statewide suicide rate and tried to examine the political leanings of their residents. Correlation is not necessarily causation.


Suicide was the 11th leading cause of death for all ages in the United States in 2007, the most recent year for which complete mortality data was available at the time of the study.

Kposowa, who has studied suicide and its causes for two decades, analyzed mortality data from the U.S. Multiple Cause of Death Files for 2000 through 2004 and combined individual-level data with state-level information. Firearm ownership, conservatism (measured by percentage voting for former President George W. Bush in the 2000 election), suicide rate, church adherence, and the immigration rate were measured at the state level. He analyzed data relating to 131,636 individual suicides, which were then compared to deaths from natural causes (excluding homicides and accidents).

Thanks for coming in and muddying the waters, yet again.

Your cited source only analyzed data up to 2007.

IF the question was, does the suicide rate increase or decline during a left or right government, then it seems it increases during a leftist government:

http://www.sprc.org/sites/default/files/SPRC%20Charts_03.png

But that is not what I was asking or pondering.

I was looking at the individuals that committed suicide, and how many of them, at least of those in the public eye, were, in fact, leftists of some sort or another.

And as I go through the list, I'm finding that a significant majority were.

Pauls' Revere
06-08-2018, 08:26 PM
Not fast enough.

LOL...Winner.

ThePaleoLibertarian
06-08-2018, 08:28 PM
I think it has more to do with the isolating and dysfunctional nature of modern urban cities in the West, which is where leftism thrives the most. Cities digest people. The modern Western model is highly corrosive and needs to be rethought.

timosman
06-08-2018, 08:29 PM
Somebody call 911 for Zippy. He's going to pop.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5orRsvdZeUA

Anti Federalist
06-08-2018, 08:31 PM
I think it has more to do with the isolating and dysfunctional nature of modern urban cities in the West, which is where leftism thrives the most. Cities digest people. The modern Western model is highly corrosive and needs to be rethought.

I'm sure that doesn't help matters, but the nations with the highest suicide rates are in no way "western".

http://gamapserver.who.int/mapLibrary/Files/Maps/Global_AS_suicide_rates_bothsexes_2015.png?ua=1

Zippyjuan
06-08-2018, 08:32 PM
Thanks for coming in and muddying the waters, yet again.

Your cited source only analyzed data up to 2007.

IF the question was, does the suicide rate increase or decline during a left or right government, then it seems it increases during a leftist government:
But that is not what I was asking or pondering.

I was looking at the individuals that committed suicide, and how many of them, at least of those in the public eye, were, in fact, leftists of some sort or another.

Of course you choose to check out a profession which has a strong liberal bend to it so no surprise you find liberal committing suicide by looking at a group of liberals. What about other professions?

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/these-jobs-have-the-highest-rate-of-suicide/


The CDC's occupational suicide list:

1. Farmworkers, fishermen, lumberjacks, others in forestry or agriculture (85 suicides per 100,000)

2. Carpenters, miners, electricians, construction trades (53)

3. Mechanics and those who do installation, maintenance, repair (48)

4. Factory and production workers (35)

5. Architects, engineers (32)

6. Police, firefighters, corrections workers, others in protective services (31)

7. Artists, designers, entertainers, athletes, media (24)

8. Computer programmers, mathematicians, statisticians (23)

9. Transportation workers (22)

10. Corporate executives and managers, advertising and public relations (20)

11. Lawyers and workers in legal system (19)

12. Doctors, dentists and other health care professionals (19)

13. Scientists and lab technicians (17)

14. Accountants, others in business, financial operations (16)

15. Nursing, medical assistants, health care support (15)

16. Clergy, social workers, other social service workers (14)

17. Real estate agents, telemarketers, sales (13)

18. Building and ground, cleaning, maintenance (13)

19. Cooks, food service workers (13)

20. Child care workers, barbers, animal trainers, personal care and service (8)

Swordsmyth
06-08-2018, 08:37 PM
Of course you choose to check out a profession which has a strong liberal bend to it so no surprise you find liberal committing suicide by looking at a group of liberals. What about a more conservative group- like say lawyers?



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hNW8i0bnZRU


Too bad zip, I caught it before your edit.:D

timosman
06-08-2018, 08:38 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hNW8i0bnZRU

You got him before the final edit.:cool:

ThePaleoLibertarian
06-08-2018, 08:39 PM
I'm sure that doesn't help matters, but the nations with the highest suicide rates are in no way "western".

http://gamapserver.who.int/mapLibrary/Files/Maps/Global_AS_suicide_rates_bothsexes_2015.png?ua=1
Sure, I'm not saying that's the cause of suicide worldwide. In the West, suicide is a largely urban phenomenon, though not among, say, blacks. Dysfunctional as they are, the black community is still exactly that, a community.

In the West, the edifice of the modern city is one of the causes of atomization and isolation, leading to both leftism and suicide. Other parts of the world are a different story.

Anti Federalist
06-08-2018, 08:40 PM
Of course you choose to check out a profession which has a strong liberal bend to it so no surprise you find liberal committing suicide by looking at a group of liberals. What about other professions?

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/these-jobs-have-the-highest-rate-of-suicide/

I'd love to go through that list as well, and see what comes up.

Having been a member of group 1, I can safely safe there are not many leftists in that group.

2 and 3 probably not many either.

But all the rest, there is no way to tell, could be a lot, could be a few.

heavenlyboy34
06-08-2018, 08:41 PM
Many things can deserve respect without being worshiped.

The Right's idea of "respect" is the same as worship in practice, tho. Just a semantic game they play.
i.e.
https://pics.me.me/sky-cloth-demands-worship-mehefulcoh-muh-skyclothhhh-15987663.png

Anti Federalist
06-08-2018, 08:42 PM
Too bad zip, I caught it before your edit.:D

LOL I owe you rep.

timosman
06-08-2018, 08:42 PM
The biggest source of the leftists - the government.

timosman
06-08-2018, 08:43 PM
The Right's idea of "respect" is the same as worship in practice, tho. Just a semantic game they play.

You are so smart.:cool:

Anti Federalist
06-08-2018, 08:46 PM
Sure, I'm not saying that's the cause of suicide worldwide. In the West, suicide is a largely urban phenomenon, though not among, say, blacks. Dysfunctional as they are, the black community is still exactly that, a community.

In the West, the edifice of the modern city is one of the causes of atomization and isolation, leading to both leftism and suicide. Other parts of the world are a different story.

No, in fact just the opposite seems to be the case.

I'd like to figure out why.

https://i.redd.it/swtrzog3p9zz.png

heavenlyboy34
06-08-2018, 08:47 PM
You are so smart.:cool: https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRK6S9gqu8KjDYgrBdeK-N8PC28nNL0CFG52XCAglwi5mJbHIcx

Anti Federalist
06-08-2018, 08:54 PM
Sure, I'm not saying that's the cause of suicide worldwide. In the West, suicide is a largely urban phenomenon, though not among, say, blacks. Dysfunctional as they are, the black community is still exactly that, a community.

In the West, the edifice of the modern city is one of the causes of atomization and isolation, leading to both leftism and suicide. Other parts of the world are a different story.

Let's consider this:

There is an inverse ratio of violent crime and suicide, when you compare rural and urban areas.

Clearly rural and sparsely populated areas are prone to higher suicide rates, while urban and densely populated areas are prone to higher rates of violent crime.

Leaving the ethnic angle out of it (whites mostly populate rural areas and are more prone to suicide while blacks mostly populate urban areas and are less prone to suicide), could it be that people in urban environments end up "tougher" simply due to the fact that even the most simple of daily chores are constant battle for space, time and money?

Then you'd have to question why so many countries in rural Africa have much higher suicide rates than the US.

timosman
06-08-2018, 08:56 PM
Let's consider this:

There is an inverse ratio of violent crime and suicide, when you compare rural and urban areas.

Clearly rural and sparsely populated areas are prone to higher suicide rates, while urban and densely populated areas are prone to higher rates of violent crime.

Leaving the ethnic angle out of it (whites mostly populate rural areas and are more prone to suicide while blacks mostly populate urban areas and are less prone to suicide), could it be that people in urban environments end up "tougher" simply due to the fact that even the most simple of daily chores are constant battle for space, time and money?

Then you'd have to question why so many countries in rural Africa have much higher suicide rates than the US.

Are you trying to overload Zippy?:cool:

Swordsmyth
06-08-2018, 08:57 PM
No, in fact just the opposite seems to be the case.

I'd like to figure out why.

https://i.redd.it/swtrzog3p9zz.png

The city dwellers are driving ruralites over the edge with their plundering and perversion.

Swordsmyth
06-08-2018, 08:59 PM
https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRK6S9gqu8KjDYgrBdeK-N8PC28nNL0CFG52XCAglwi5mJbHIcx

Romans 1:22 “Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,”

King James Version (KJV)

Anti Federalist
06-08-2018, 09:07 PM
https://amp.businessinsider.com/images/59fb8afb58a0c1184d8b5440-960-759.png

This is a weak argument.

Roughly 85 percent of all counties were won by Trump. (http://www.dispatch.com/content/stories/national_world/2016/12/06/1206-clinton-won-487-counties.html)

So it would stand to reason there would be significant overlap.

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/da/2016_Presidential_Election_by_County.svg/2000px-2016_Presidential_Election_by_County.svg.png

Anti Federalist
06-08-2018, 09:16 PM
Are you trying to overload Zippy?:cool:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mw3zzMWOIvk

timosman
06-08-2018, 09:21 PM
The city dwellers are driving ruralites over the edge with their plundering and perversion.

Even you know it's a stretch.:cool:

heavenlyboy34
06-08-2018, 09:52 PM
Romans 1:22

“Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,”

King James Version (KJV)

I love it when your attempts to be clever fail like this. :D (please see the context of that passage)

Swordsmyth
06-08-2018, 09:54 PM
I love it when your attempts to be clever fail like this. :D (please see the context of that passage)

It was a joke.

The context has nothing to do with respecting your flag and the country for which it stands however.

Your bald assertion that conservatives are engaged in worship is not worth debating.

Krugminator2
06-08-2018, 10:30 PM
https://www.newscientist.com/article/dn2817-right-wing-governments-increase-suicide-rates/


Here is also a fact. Every single Scandanavian country has a higher suicide rate that the United States. The suicide rates in the Scandavian countries were multiples higher than the US in the 70s when those governments were at the their most left wing.

Perhaps they aren't inclusive enough.

timosman
06-09-2018, 12:34 AM
1005196277183799296

VIDEODROME
06-09-2018, 12:54 AM
Here is also a fact. Every single Scandanavian country has a higher suicide rate that the United States. The suicide rates in the Scandavian countries were multiples higher than the US in the 70s when those governments were at the their most left wing.

Perhaps they aren't inclusive enough.

I wonder if it's the bleak climate or having less sun creating a strong Seasonal Affective Disorder.

For a while, I lived in Michigan's Upper Peninsula and was glad to get out of there. I feel like some people up there have issues mostly with alcoholism and some suicides. Their terrible job market doesn't help .

VIDEODROME
06-09-2018, 02:05 AM
Looking over the "celebrity suicides" since 2000, there might be something to that. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_suicides_in_the_21st_century)

I would also like to see how many were taking, or had been taking, prescription drugs that have suicidal thoughts listed as a side effect.

I don't think a significant number of the people in that list were necessarily active Liberal / Progressives. Many seem like people with illness like Depression, Chronic Pain, or give up in the face of Cancer.

Hunter S. Thompson sounds like he was Libertarian and just fed up with his chronic pain so he shot himself.

Tony Scott jumped from a bridge instead of waiting out a battle with Cancer.

Robin Williams had a strange neurological disorder that sounded like a combination of Depression and Pain.

Jack Wishna was just a Las Vegas entertainment business man. Maybe conservative working with the likes of Trump?

Richard "Dick" Trickle was a race car driver with chronic pain. The racing world doesn't strike me as a hub for Liberalism but I dunno. He called 911 before shooting himself.

Aaron Swartz was a computer programmer and was a Liberal activist. His suicide may have been his response to being convicted by overzealous prosecution for a 'Hacking' event at MIT.

Thomas A. Schweich was a Republican and seemed to be a victim of the GoP working against him to push him out during an election.

Michael James Marin was a millionaire businessman and Mormon who's career included work with Lehman Brothers and Merrill Lynch. Seems unlikely a Liberal. He was convicted in a bizarre arson scheme after setting his own house on fire. When he realized he was was basically being lead to prison, he gulped down a lethal dose of cyanide.

Spaulding Gray was an actor and writer(Maybe Liberal?). Depression from chronic pain and some disfigurement after a car crash.

Chris Cornell of Soundgarden was a Liberal and Obama supporter. He had issues with addiction including OxyContin. His suicide may have been related to a casual decision to take an extra Ativan and he was later found to have hung himself.

Finn Michael Westby Caspersen Sr. was an American financier and philanthropist and Republican supporter. Basically felt he was losing a battle with Kidney Cancer. Left a note stating that he "was tired, diminished and in constant pain, and that he did not want to be a burden to his loving family". It was also learned after his death he was being investigated for Tax Fraud.




These are just a few random clicks from that list. Many others are suicide terrorists or a few criminals on the verge of getting captured who killed themselves. Others were victims of past mistreatment like child abuse.

Krugminator2
06-09-2018, 06:40 AM
I wonder if it's the bleak climate or having less sun creating a strong Seasonal Affective Disorder.

For a while, I lived in Michigan's Upper Peninsula and was glad to get out of there. I feel like some people up there have issues mostly with alcoholism and some suicides. Their terrible job market doesn't help .


That's interesting. There isn't really much up there outside of the 3 or 4 cities there. I grew up and went to high school just south of the bridge.

Henry Rogue
06-09-2018, 08:19 AM
That^^ This is true of the statist "Right", as well. Look how they get all offended when you don't respect their Sacred symbols and such-teh flag, teh anthem, teh troops, teh Founding Fathers, teh Constitution, etc.

Truth. Conservative Socialist are as much Statist, as Progressive Socialist are.

Anti Federalist
06-09-2018, 09:54 AM
You won't get an argument from me on that, I'm not at all convinced that is a primary cause or tendency.



I don't think a significant number of the people in that list were necessarily active Liberal / Progressives. Many seem like people with illness like Depression, Chronic Pain, or give up in the face of Cancer.

Hunter S. Thompson sounds like he was Libertarian and just fed up with his chronic pain so he shot himself.

Tony Scott jumped from a bridge instead of waiting out a battle with Cancer.

Robin Williams had a strange neurological disorder that sounded like a combination of Depression and Pain.

Jack Wishna was just a Las Vegas entertainment business man. Maybe conservative working with the likes of Trump?

Richard "Dick" Trickle was a race car driver with chronic pain. The racing world doesn't strike me as a hub for Liberalism but I dunno. He called 911 before shooting himself.

Aaron Swartz was a computer programmer and was a Liberal activist. His suicide may have been his response to being convicted by overzealous prosecution for a 'Hacking' event at MIT.

Thomas A. Schweich was a Republican and seemed to be a victim of the GoP working against him to push him out during an election.

Michael James Marin was a millionaire businessman and Mormon who's career included work with Lehman Brothers and Merrill Lynch. Seems unlikely a Liberal. He was convicted in a bizarre arson scheme after setting his own house on fire. When he realized he was was basically being lead to prison, he gulped down a lethal dose of cyanide.

Spaulding Gray was an actor and writer(Maybe Liberal?). Depression from chronic pain and some disfigurement after a car crash.

Chris Cornell of Soundgarden was a Liberal and Obama supporter. He had issues with addiction including OxyContin. His suicide may have been related to a casual decision to take an extra Ativan and he was later found to have hung himself.

Finn Michael Westby Caspersen Sr. was an American financier and philanthropist and Republican supporter. Basically felt he was losing a battle with Kidney Cancer. Left a note stating that he "was tired, diminished and in constant pain, and that he did not want to be a burden to his loving family". It was also learned after his death he was being investigated for Tax Fraud.




These are just a few random clicks from that list. Many others are suicide terrorists or a few criminals on the verge of getting captured who killed themselves. Others were victims of past mistreatment like child abuse.

ProBlue33
06-09-2018, 10:26 AM
They have a god and religion, it is the state.

Well no wonder they are committing suicide then, they were unable to cope with losing their "precious" state from Obama/Hillary to Trump.:D

Swordsmyth
06-09-2018, 04:53 PM
I think that problem is emptiness. There is an emptiness at the core of our culture, and from this root the suicide epidemic grows. We have fled from God, from meaning, from purpose, and embraced a soft kind of nihilism; a nihilism that will not call itself nihilism. It uses other words and slogans to describe itself. "You only live once," it says. "Live your truth." People are told that there is only one life, one reality, and it has no meaning aside from what you assign to it. But what happens when you no longer see meaning? Well, our culture says, if you do not see it then it is not there.


Those who seek happiness by following the well-worn paths will inevitably fall into this pit. If you do what everyone else is doing, and live how they live, and walk in their footsteps, you will end up in the same darkness. You will begin to feel that there is no hope and no point and no real beauty or joy to be found in life. And this is the state in which so many of us are living. A great, great many people in America are wallowing in this nihilistic despair and living hollow lives devoid of substance. They struggle and flail and reach out for help, but so often the hand that grabs hold of them will only drag them deeper into the pit.



We have seen this process play out this week. It's the same thing that happens every time a famous person commits suicide. We set out immediately to almost defend the act, and to ensure that nobody says anything negative about it. We insist that suicide is nothing but the result of a "mental illness." A depressed person dies of suicide in the same way that a person may die of breast cancer. We deliver tearful, admiring eulogies to the deceased celebrity and express our hope that they have "found peace."

And what good does any of this do? How are we helping a suicidal person by explicitly suggesting that suicide is a means to peace? How are we helping him by telling him that he has no choice, that his depression may just up and kill him one day, totally against his will? What service do we provide by telling him that he has no power, no alternative, no free will? And then we are shocked when the next person does it. And the next. And the next. And each time we react the same way, saying the same things, and we think that we are helping as long as we also pass out the suicide prevention hotline.


It is good to give out the suicide prevention hotline (1-800-273-8255). It is good to encourage people to get help, talk to someone, reach out. We get that part right. But we go dangerously off course with everything else. And the crisis only worsens because we refuse to trace it all the way down to its roots. We stop at the brain, at chemical reactions and psychological disorders, but we never pause to ask why all of our brains have apparently gone haywire in modern times. If this is all just a matter of mental disorders, why in the hell are these "mental disorders" so common now?



I think it is because the disorder is not purely psychological. It goes beyond our brains and into our souls, into the emptiness. What everyone really craves deep in their bones is truth and meaning. Not meaning they arbitrarily assign, but meaning that is objective and inherent and beyond our ability to remove or change. But our culture tells us that nothing of the sort exists — there is only this physical world, and our egos, and whatever we decide to make of it all. And if we make nothing of it, and find nothing in it, then life is nothing and there is no reason to carry on living anymore.


If someone is feeling this way, yes, it is good to give them the numbers to call, and to tell them that they are not alone and people care for them, and to encourage them to talk to someone. I echo all of those exhortations. But it's not enough, in itself. People need more than that. They need more than therapy and phone numbers. They even need more than the knowledge that other people love them. They need meaning. They need hope. They need there to be a point to all of this, a reason.



Well, praise God because there is a reason, there is a point, there is a meaning. God is our foundation, our truth, our purpose, and the substance of our lives. We are not mere accidents. We are not clumps of dust that grew randomly from the Earth and somehow developed consciousness and a moral code and the capacity for love. That doesn't make sense, and we all know it doesn't make sense, and we will literally kill ourselves trying to make sense of it.


There is a transcendent, spiritual character to humanity, and we all innately recognize it. We find despair when we reject it and try to separate ourselves from it and from ourselves. Hope is found the other way, in the opposite direction. Hope is found when we embrace who we are, as children of God, and we keep our eyes and hearts focused on eternity, on home. God wants us there with Him. But not yet. There is still more to be done, more life to be lived, and we can live it in joy, knowing that there is a meaning and a point to all of this.

More at: https://www.dailywire.com/news/31625/walsh-what-really-lies-root-our-cultures-suicide-matt-walsh?utm_medium=referral&utm_source=idealmedia&utm_campaign=dailywire.com&utm_term=68731&utm_content=1

Schifference
06-09-2018, 05:02 PM
No. If it did there would be no need for this question.