Anyone think they're setting Romney up for a fall today?

[Santana28]

I think the GOP has taken a long hard look at Mitt's fundraising and have serious doubts about him. That question at the last debate, asking him to affirm that he believed in "that book" (which was a lie when he said he did, because the Mormans have their own book)... he looked like he was going to crap his pants on stage. It was no coincidence they gave Huck (the Pastor) the opportunity to call him out on that - and Huck didn't do it. He played nice. He doesn't want to roll any heads on his way to the VP nomination. But that was clearly a warning shot in Mitt's direction.

Anyways... no one takes Fred seriously - they just want him in the race to dilute the RP vote. They know Huck is being falsely propped up and his support is not there, not to mention the many skeletons in his closet... so they dont really want him to win. Mitt seems deluded enough to think that he actually has a shot at the nomination. Huckabee is deluded enough to think that he actually has a shot at VP (hello, thats the only reason McCain is still around). Those two will fight it out for the evangelical vote, and as a distraction to take votes away from RP. And the media has been setting this one up - its going to be war between Huck and Mitt at the debate, in the same way the put Huck vs. Paul and Guiliani Vs. Paul before realizing who the stronger man was.

After the debate today, watch the media... we'll see who the anointed "conservative" vote-splitter remains... Huck, or Mitt. I think it's Mitt's turn to go down in flames tonight.

Meanwhile, i expect Ron to stay out of it all, remain courteous and respectful, and let them take care of each other themselves without firing a single shot in their direction :) And not to mention, swoop in and take all of the Iowa voters turned off by all the in-party fighting.

Just a theory....

[slantedview]

why romney? why not huck? his fundraising is even weaker.

[ComradeVlad]

i like romney so i hope not. hes my second choice after paul. anyone but jewliani.

[Fyretrohl]

question at the last debate, asking him to affirm that he believed in "that book" (which was a lie when he said he did, because the Mormans have their own book)

You lost me at this point. Please, take a page from our own Ron Paul manual. Study before you speak. As a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, aka Mormon, I can speak with intelligence and conviction when I tell you that you are mistaken. We do believe in and use the bible. And, yes, we ALSO have the Book of Mormon. The 'subtitle' for it is 'Another Testimony of Christ'. Romney had that look because he had to decide how he would word his answer. Since I am not running for office, and even if I was, I will state it directly. We believe in the bible, in as much as it is translated correctly. That would be a big thing to say on such a stage and that was likely the cause of discomfort for Mitt.

[Santana28]

because Huck has a better shot of winning Iowa than Romney does.

i dont know... it just seems like he's fallen out of favor with them ala Thompson. Huck is the one getting all the positive press lately. I could be wrong :) I probably am.

[mortepa]

I could see Alan Keyes and Huckabee ganging up on him because he is Mormon.

Then Ron steps in and shames them all for discussing their religeon, because it should not be such an issue in the debates...

That would be great! :D

[DXDoug]

Romney has no chance of winning any thing besides Utah ! and sadlly i see him losing there too lol . :D

[Santana28]

You lost me at this point. Please, take a page from our own Ron Paul manual. Study before you speak. As a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, aka Mormon, I can speak with intelligence and conviction when I tell you that you are mistaken. We do believe in and use the bible. And, yes, we ALSO have the Book of Mormon. The 'subtitle' for it is 'Another Testimony of Christ'. Romney had that look because he had to decide how he would word his answer. Since I am not running for office, and even if I was, I will state it directly. We believe in the bible, in as much as it is translated correctly. That would be a big thing to say on such a stage and that was likely the cause of discomfort for Mitt.

i think you missed my point. that kid clearly pointed to a Bible, not a Book of Mormon, and asked him specifically if he believed every word in that book exactly as it is written. Romney said yes, and the Pastor on stage didn't call him out on that at all.

i'm not mormom, but i know enough to know it is a different religion than the book that kid was holding up and that Mormons have their own book which is not the book that kid was holding. if i'm mistaken and mormons believe fully in both books, then i'm mistaken. but i think that was clearly the intended use for that question, whether you like it or not. i have nothing against mormons at all.

[Fyretrohl]

i think you missed my point. that kid clearly pointed to a Bible, not a Book of Mormon, and asked him specifically if he believed every word in that book exactly as it is written.

i'm not mormom, but i know enough to know it is a different religion than the book that kid was holding up and that Mormons have their own book which is not the book that kid was holding. if i'm mistaken and mormons believe fully in both books, then i'm mistaken. but i think that was clearly the intended use for that question, whether you like it or not. i have nothing against mormons at all.


My point is, we believe in both books. The 'fault' we would find with the Bible is that it has been translated and retranslated numerous times. Yes, I will acknowledge, if you believe in the brass plates that lead to the Book of Mormon, you could also say that the BoM was mistranslated. However, the bible is historically known to have been retranslated by Kings and other leaders to serve the needs of their nations. It is difficult to know how accurate the Bible is, in any version. Unfortunately, I do not have the access or the knowledge to read the original scrolls. :)

But, to get to the point, he does believe in the bible and the 'retranslated' scriptures are actually very few.

[rothnic]

My point is, we believe in both books. The 'fault' we would find with the Bible is that it has been translated and retranslated numerous times. Yes, I will acknowledge, if you believe in the brass plates that lead to the Book of Mormon, you could also say that the BoM was mistranslated. However, the bible is historically known to have been retranslated by Kings and other leaders to serve the needs of their nations. It is difficult to know how accurate the Bible is, in any version. Unfortunately, I do not have the access or the knowledge to read the original scrolls. :)

But, to get to the point, he does believe in the bible and the 'retranslated' scriptures are actually very few.

Not to offend you Santana, I know as a Mormon it really does get old dealing with all the misconceptions and rumors about the religion. I really wish people in the US would fully understand and learn about religions before trying to make points or argue against them basing your argument on rumors. I'm sure that Muslims feel the same way.... It sucks that Romney is so pro Church and State....I'm definitely against that.

[Santana28]

My point is, we believe in both books. The 'fault' we would find with the Bible is that it has been translated and retranslated numerous times. Yes, I will acknowledge, if you believe in the brass plates that lead to the Book of Mormon, you could also say that the BoM was mistranslated. However, the bible is historically known to have been retranslated by Kings and other leaders to serve the needs of their nations. It is difficult to know how accurate the Bible is, in any version. Unfortunately, I do not have the access or the knowledge to read the original scrolls. :)

But, to get to the point, he does believe in the bible and the 'retranslated' scriptures are actually very few.

thanks for pointing that out. but all the same - the kid asked him specifically word for word if he believed that specific translation. My evangelical pastor pulled the same trick on me at my wedding counseling session! he didnt want to know if i was a Christian - he wanted to know if i thought the very book in his hand was infallable and divine despite the translations. i told him the book was translated by man so of course there are bound to be errors, and that wasn't the answer he wanted to hear. My point is, Romney got asked the same question and instead of being honest about it, he skirted the issue and said "yes" when he technically he more than likely disagreed with that statement.

[jonahtrainer]

i think you missed my point. that kid clearly pointed to a Bible, not a Book of Mormon, and asked him specifically if he believed every word in that book exactly as it is written. Romney said yes, and the Pastor on stage didn't call him out on that at all.

i'm not mormom, but i know enough to know it is a different religion than the book that kid was holding up and that Mormons have their own book which is not the book that kid was holding. if i'm mistaken and mormons believe fully in both books, then i'm mistaken. but i think that was clearly the intended use for that question, whether you like it or not. i have nothing against mormons at all.


Romney seemed to do a fairly decent job addressing the question. As far as I understand Mormons, I did quite a bit of research in graduate school when I wrote a paper, they consider the King James Version of the Bible to be canonized scripture. One of their 'Articles of Faith' states: "We believe the Bible to be the word of God as far as it is translated correctly"

Now, as far as everyone interpreting (translating?) the Bible the same; that is the real issue which Romney addressed. It seems every Christian religion (based on my research I would include Mormons but they may have a 'different' Christ because of their different interpretation from many in the mainstream of Christianity) interpret the Bible differently. This shows no problem with the Bible but only with those interpreting it.

Now as far as addressing which interpretation is the 'correct' one ... well, that becomes a very emotionally charged answer. Of course, the Mormons think theirs is but so do most religious people with their respective beliefs.

[JaylieWoW]

You lost me at this point. Please, take a page from our own Ron Paul manual. Study before you speak. As a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, aka Mormon, I can speak with intelligence and conviction when I tell you that you are mistaken. We do believe in and use the bible. And, yes, we ALSO have the Book of Mormon. The 'subtitle' for it is 'Another Testimony of Christ'. Romney had that look because he had to decide how he would word his answer. Since I am not running for office, and even if I was, I will state it directly. We believe in the bible, in as much as it is translated correctly. That would be a big thing to say on such a stage and that was likely the cause of discomfort for Mitt.

I second that except I grew up in the Mormon Church but am no longer an active member. Further, my mother, just this morning, sent me an email that made me very happy. Before the Huckster opened his big bigot mouth, she thought he was a decent guy. Now that she knows about his anti-Mormonism stance (and can see he clearly does not believe in the vision of a country were religious freedom is important), there is absolutely NOTHING he can ever DO, INCLUDING APOLOGIZE (because she will see the lie for what it is, political pandering) to gain her trust to vote for him.

Also, don't think for one minute that just because Romney is a Mormon that all Mormons are going to flock to him like geese. My mother may or may not vote for him, but I'm still working on her!

[specialkornflake]

As a former Mormon, I'll clear this up. Mormons believe the King James Version as the word of God as well as the Book of Mormon. Mormons believe that there are parts of the Bible that have been translated incorrectly over time. Embedded in the Mormon edition of the King James Version of the Bible are footnotes that serve as corrections to the improperly translated verses. Mormons have no problem truthfully saying that the Bible is the Word of God... humans have messed it up over time.

[RevolutionSD]

i like romney so i hope not. hes my second choice after paul. anyone but jewliani.

you like romney and WHY?

[JaylieWoW]

thanks for pointing that out. but all the same - the kid asked him specifically word for word if he believed that specific translation. My evangelical pastor pulled the same trick on me at my wedding counseling session! he didnt want to know if i was a Christian - he wanted to know if i thought the very book in his hand was infallable and divine despite the translations. i told him the book was translated by man so of course there are bound to be errors, and that wasn't the answer he wanted to hear. My point is, Romney got asked the same question and instead of being honest about it, he skirted the issue and said "yes" when he technically he more than likely disagreed with that statement.

Actually the Mormons recommend the King James Version over any other version. I should know, I was a member of the Mormon church in my youth.

I never delved that deeply into the corrections Joseph Smith was asked to talk about however, so I really don't think it is something heavily concentrated on. But, that is my opinion and since I am no longer of the Mormon faith, please correct me if I am wrong.

[JMann]

thanks for pointing that out. but all the same - the kid asked him specifically word for word if he believed that specific translation. My evangelical pastor pulled the same trick on me at my wedding counseling session! he didnt want to know if i was a Christian - he wanted to know if i thought the very book in his hand was infallable and divine despite the translations. i told him the book was translated by man so of course there are bound to be errors, and that wasn't the answer he wanted to hear. My point is, Romney got asked the same question and instead of being honest about it, he skirted the issue and said "yes" when he technically he more than likely disagreed with that statement.

Your pastor sounds like an idiot.