An army of illegal aliens is marching on America

[Swordsmyth]

I first became aware of this developing tale thanks to a tweet from Nicolas Medina Mora (https://twitter.com/MedinaMora/status/979729254496854016) lionizing the work of Adolfo Flores of Buzzfeed (https://twitter.com/aflores). What is Adolfo up to? Take a look.


Follow the great @aflores (https://twitter.com/aflores?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) as he accompanies a caravan of 1,200 Central American migrants as they cross Mexico all the way to the US. https://t.co/zjIrLWI2U7
— Nicolás Medina Mora (@MedinaMora) March 30, 2018 (https://twitter.com/MedinaMora/status/979729254496854016?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw)
Flores is apparently on a lengthy trek through all of Mexico with a literal army of migrants from a number of countries including Honduras. Normally one might imagine that a potential national security crisis for the United States such as this would be cause for raising the alarm. Instead, the Buzzfeed reporter is cheering them on and talking about their “struggle.”
You won’t see much in the way of coverage of this on the major networks or CNN, but Buzzfeed is covering it (https://www.buzzfeed.com/adolfoflores/a-huge-caravan-of-central-americans-is-headed-for-the-us?utm_term=.dnxnkLd1k7#.pmByj70OjE).

For five days now hundreds of Central Americans — children, women, and men, most of them from Honduras — have boldly crossed immigration checkpoints, military bases, and police in a desperate, sometimes chaotic march toward the United States. Despite their being in Mexico without authorization, no one has made any effort to stop them.
Organized by a group of volunteers called Pueblos Sin Fronteras, or People Without Borders, the caravan is intended to help migrants safely reach the United States, bypassing not only authorities who would seek to deport them, but gangs and cartels who are known to assault vulnerable migrants.
Organizers like Rodrigo Abeja hope that the sheer size of the crowd will give immigration authorities and criminals pause before trying to stop them.
“If we all protect each other we’ll get through this together,” Abeja yelled through a loudspeaker on the morning they left Tapachula, on Mexico’s border with Guatemala, for the nearly monthlong trek.
This isn’t a group of family members or some isolated, organized clan. This is an army. Flores numbers them in the hundreds but looking at the pictures coming from the “march” it clearly appears that their numbers are swelling. The real figure, as cited by Mora, is likely already more than a thousand. Their purpose? They make no bones about it when asked. They, “hope American authorities will grant them asylum or, for some, be absent when they attempt to cross the border illegally.”
Perhaps they’ve been convinced that they can simply apply for refugee status or asylum when they arrive. And they actually can apply (https://www.uscis.gov/humanitarian/refugees-asylum/refugees), but that doesn’t mean that they will be accepted on that basis. Further, Mexico bears some responsibility for helping to prevent this sort of organized invasion. Just this week our new Homeland Security Secretary met with Mexico’s Foreign Minister (https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-mexico-cooperation/mexico-u-s-sign-accords-on-customs-border-cooperation-idUSKBN1H300H) and signed agreements related to customs and border security. All of this is happening in the shadow of those NAFTA restructuring talks. It’s worth asking why, as Flores reports, nobody from Mexico is doing a thing to slow down this march. In fact, in some cases, the Buzzfeed reporter suggests that Mexican towns and cities are actually hurrying them along (https://twitter.com/aflores/status/979777465131388928).

More at: https://hotair.com/archives/2018/03/31/army-illegal-aliens-marching-america/

[Raginfridus]

No shit they're hurried north. The US made the problem, they can reap the cost.

[spudea]

this is human trafficking. If this is allowed, we don't have a country.

[Swordsmyth]

No $#@! they're hurried north. The US made the problem, they can reap the cost.

I'm getting sick of hearing the lie that all of the world's problems are America's fault, other countries have done plenty to cause their own problems.

Even if you think the empire is responsible for everything wrong in the world that doesn't mean American citizens should have to eat the consequences, those who cause the problems have harmed us enough already.

[Swordsmyth]

this is human trafficking. If this is allowed, we don't have a country.

It's not just human trafficking, it's an invasion.

A4S4: The United States shall guarantee to every State in this Union a Republican (https://usconstitution.net/glossary.html#REPUBLIC) Form of Government, and shall protect each of them against Invasion;

[timosman]

Even if you think the empire is responsible for everything wrong in the world that doesn't mean American citizens should have to eat the consequences, those who cause the problems have harmed us enough already.

One might argue our failure to put taps on an out of control empire is the reason why the chickens are coming home to roost now. :cool:

[Raginfridus]

I'm getting sick of hearing the lie that all of the world's problems are America's fault, other countries have done plenty to cause their own problems.

Even if you think the empire is responsible for everything wrong in the world that doesn't mean American citizens should have to eat the consequences, those who cause the problems have harmed us enough already.Who said all the problems? Tell me what lie I'm telling. Tell me right here, or you can tell me here:
http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?520515-How-US-Foreign-Policy-Creates-Illegal-Immigration

Or go back to last August when I strung together the consequences of our foreign policy south of the border, and all you could reply were posts like "BUNK". You want a Nation? Then reap this Nation's consequences.

[Swordsmyth]

One might argue our failure to put taps on an out of control empire is the reason why the chickens are coming home to roost now. :cool:

And what other country has done better?
We are already eating plenty of consequences here at home, we don't have to let the rest of the world tear us to pieces as some sort of perverse penance for the sins of the elite who have used us as their latest sock puppet in their long history of crimes against the whole world.

[Swordsmyth]

Who said all the problems? Tell me what lie I'm telling. Tell me right here, or you can tell me here:
http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?520515-How-US-Foreign-Policy-Creates-Illegal-Immigration

Or go back to last August when I strung together the consequences of our foreign policy south of the border, and all you could reply were posts like "BUNK". You want a Nation? Then reap this Nation's consequences.

The origin countries have done plenty to contribute to their own problems and two wrongs don't make a right.

We are already eating plenty of consequences here at home, we don't have to let the rest of the world tear us to pieces as some sort of perverse penance for the sins of the elite who have used us as their latest sock puppet in their long history of crimes against the whole world.

[spudea]

Who said all the problems? Tell me what lie I'm telling. Tell me right here, or you can tell me here:
http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?520515-How-US-Foreign-Policy-Creates-Illegal-Immigration

Or go back to last August when I strung together the consequences of our foreign policy south of the border, and all you could reply were posts like "BUNK". You want a Nation? Then reap this Nation's consequences.

One of the referenced articles in your post there blames NAFTA for harming the poor farmers in Mexico, allowing US companies and products to decimate their markets. Sounds like Mexico should have negotiated a better deal and been more protectionist! Mexico is responsible for their shit agreements and shit foreign policy as well, as well as their shit political environment of corruption and drug cartels.

Again if all the good people leave their countries, to come to the US, who is left behind to fix any problems in their home country?

[timosman]

Again if all the good people leave their countries, to come to the US, who is left behind to fix any problems in their home country?

This sounds like a valid reason for an average shitizen to be concerned. Unfortunately the timing is a bit off.:cool:

[Swordsmyth]

One of the referenced articles in your post there blames NAFTA for harming the poor farmers in Mexico, allowing US companies and products to decimate their markets. Sounds like Mexico should have negotiated a better deal and been more protectionist! Mexico is responsible for their $#@! agreements and $#@! foreign policy as well, as well as their $#@! political environment of corruption and drug cartels.

Again if all the good people leave their countries, to come to the US, who is left behind to fix any problems in their home country?

Don't let them pretend it is all of the good people coming here, at best it's a mix, in reality it is a mix weighted towards the leeches and criminals.

[Ender]

Don't let them pretend it is all of the good people coming here, at best it's a mix, in reality it is a mix weighted towards the leeches and criminals.

Where've I heard this before? Oh yeah......


The refugees seeking haven in America were poor and disease-ridden. They threatened to take jobs away from Americans and strain welfare budgets. They practiced an alien religion and pledged allegiance to a foreign leader. They were bringing with them crime. They were accused of being rapists. And, worst of all....

these undesirables were Irish.

https://www.history.com/news/when-america-despised-the-irish-the-19th-centurys-refugee-crisis

And then them ignorant coolies.


Poor and unskilled immigrants from Northern Europe and Asia poured into the United States in the mid-1800s. Most of the European immigrants were German and Irish, and under the law they were considered “free white persons” able to achieve citizenship.

Citizenship wasn’t an option for the growing numbers of Chinese and Asian immigrants settling on the West Coast. A cheap source of labor for mines, farms and railways, the Chinese were called “coolies.” The word originally meant “unskilled laborer,” but became a slur hurled at workers who labored for low wages or came to the U.S. as indentured laborers. Chinese women were largely assumed to be prostitutes.

In Los Angeles, the backlash against Asians culminated in 1871 with the Chinese Massacre. A mob of more than 500 white men killed at least 18 Chinese men and boys near downtown. No one was ever convicted of the killings.

The growing animus against Asians across the country led to discriminatory laws that would remain on the books for decades.

[Superfluous Man]

this is human trafficking. If this is allowed, we don't have a country.

So for the first century of the USA's existence, it wasn't a country?

[Swordsmyth]

Where've I heard this before? Oh yeah......



https://www.history.com/news/when-america-despised-the-irish-the-19th-centurys-refugee-crisis

And then them ignorant coolies.

Legal immigrants are a different question, those who demonstrate that they are willing to violate the law are weighted towards leeches and criminals.

[timosman]

So for the first century of the USA's existence, it wasn't a country?

Are you trying to say the immigration levels didn't change?

[Swordsmyth]

So for the first century of the USA's existence, it wasn't a country?

For the first century of our existence there wasn't an organized effort to invade us like this.

[spudea]

So for the first century of the USA's existence, it wasn't a country?

The differences are clear and in no way comparable.

[Superfluous Man]

The differences are clear and in no way comparable.

I can't tell if that's a yes or a no.

Until the advent of progressivism, nobody even dreamed that the federal government would prevent a group such as this from entering and staying in the country. There certainly didn't exist any laws authorizing the federal government to impede their crossing of the border, unless it actually regarded them as an invading army, not just figuratively but literally, which would require them to be armed.

Does that mean the USA wasn't a country?

[Superfluous Man]

For the first century of our existence there wasn't an organized effort to invade us like this.

Sure there was. In proportion to the nation's existing population, immigration was an even greater factor then than it is now.

The crucial difference, in the eyes of some, is that back then the immigrants were almost all white.

[Swordsmyth]

I can't tell if that's a yes or a no.

Until the advent of progressivism, nobody even dreamed that the federal government would prevent a group such as this from entering and staying in the country. There certainly didn't exist any laws authorizing the federal government to impede their crossing of the border, unless it actually regarded them as an invading army, not just figuratively but literally, which would require them to be armed.

Does that mean the USA wasn't a country?

Article 1

Section 9. The Migration or Importation of such Persons as any of the States now existing shall think proper to admit, shall not be prohibited by the Congress prior to the Year one thousand eight hundred and eight

It is after 1808.

"Every society has a right to fix the fundamental principles of its association, and to say to all individuals, that if they contemplate pursuits beyond the limits of these principles and involving dangers which the society chooses to avoid, they must go somewhere else for their exercise; that we want no citizens, and still less ephemeral and pseudo-citizens, on such terms. We may exclude them from our territory, as we do persons infected with disease." --Thomas Jefferson to William H. Crawford, 1816. ME 15:28

More at:
Article 1 Section 9 (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?513274-Article-1-Section-9)
We get to decide who to let in and who to keep out, just because we didn't use that power for a long time because there wasn't a comparable threat doesn't change that.



Sure there was. In proportion to the nation's existing population, immigration was an even greater factor then than it is now.

The crucial difference, in the eyes of some, is that back then the immigrants were almost all white.
Immigration back then was NOT ORGANIZED in an effort to change our culture and politics and destroy what little liberty we have.

[spudea]

IThere certainly didn't exist any laws authorizing the federal government to impede their crossing of the border, unless it actually regarded them as an invading army, not just figuratively but literally, which would require them to be armed.

What matters is the laws and conditions that exist now.

[Raginfridus]

Don't let them pretend it is all of the good people coming here, at best it's a mix, in reality it is a mix weighted towards the leeches and criminals.By no means read.

Throw money at a symptom the populists can see, with one agency, while other agencies exacerbate the original problem. The real criminals remain our government's clients, and their appetites for my money won't abate because zippyjuan was bussed back to Mexico.

[Swordsmyth]

By no means read.

Throw money at a symptom the populists can see, with one agency, while other agencies exacerbate the original problem. The real criminals remain our government's clients, and their appetites for my money won't abate because zippyjuan was bussed back to Mexico.

Just where do you get the idea I don't want to stop the other problems?
I am on record wanting to stop the drug war and all the other things the government does abroad that contribute to this and many other problems but I am not about to cheer or allow an organized invasion of our country that is designed to protect and exacerbate the system that you despise so much.

[Raginfridus]

Just where do you get the idea I don't want to stop the other problems?
I am on record wanting to stop the drug war and all the other things the government does abroad that contribute to this and many other problems but I am not about to cheer or allow an organized invasion of our country that is designed to protect and exacerbate the system that you despise so much.Your record is weaseling into Patriot stance to save yourself the trouble of moving past ambiguity.

[undergroundrr]

I hope they make it. America could use 1200 people with the courage and tenacity to make such a march. That said, by the time they get here, Nicaragua's economy might be better than ours if many more of these omnibus bills get signed.

I see the term "army" was used. What are they armed with? Satan 2's? Are they a threat to our military defenses?

Can we send 1200 beanerphobics to Central America in exchange? I'll chip in for the airlift.

[Ender]

For the first century of our existence there wasn't an organized effort to invade us like this.

Who is this "us" you speak of? In the first century of "America" the continent was invaded by those pesky white Europeans.

[Zippyjuan]

One of the referenced articles in your post there blames NAFTA for harming the poor farmers in Mexico, allowing US companies and products to decimate their markets. Sounds like Mexico should have negotiated a better deal and been more protectionist! Mexico is responsible for their $#@! agreements and $#@! foreign policy as well, as well as their $#@! political environment of corruption and drug cartels.

Again if all the good people leave their countries, to come to the US, who is left behind to fix any problems in their home country?

NAFTA is so terrible that Mexican quit coming to the US. http://www.pewhispanic.org/2015/11/19/more-mexicans-leaving-than-coming-to-the-u-s/

[Swordsmyth]

Who is this "us" you speak of? In the first century of "America" the continent was invaded by those pesky white Europeans.

"Us" refers to citizens and legal residents of the freest nation on the planet.

P.S. Maybe the Injuns should have done a better job of keeping out invaders and maybe we should learn from their failure.

[Swordsmyth]

NAFTA is so terrible that Mexican quit coming to the US. http://www.pewhispanic.org/2015/11/19/more-mexicans-leaving-than-coming-to-the-u-s/

NAFTA is bad for everyone but the oligarchs and all three countries' politicians share responsibility for it.

[Swordsmyth]

I hope they make it. America could use 1200 people with the courage and tenacity to make such a march. That said, by the time they get here, Nicaragua's economy might be better than ours if many more of these omnibus bills get signed.

I see the term "army" was used. What are they armed with? Satan 2's? Are they a threat to our military defenses?

Can we send 1200 beanerphobics to Central America in exchange? I'll chip in for the airlift.

Why don't you just advocate for making O'Bummer President for life and get it over with?

[Superfluous Man]

What matters is the laws and conditions that exist now.

Sounds like you're walking back your claim that "if this is allowed, we don't have a country."

[spudea]

I hope they make it. America could use 1200 people with the courage and tenacity to make such a march. That said, by the time they get here, Nicaragua's economy might be better than ours if many more of these omnibus bills get signed.

I see the term "army" was used. What are they armed with? Satan 2's? Are they a threat to our military defenses?

Can we send 1200 beanerphobics to Central America in exchange? I'll chip in for the airlift.

Or can they be called cowards for leaving behind their homeland to thieves and murderers seeking an easy escape and to be taken care of here? The legal immigration process takes courage, time investment, and hard work. You think these foreign nationals intend to help create a more libertarian society you hope for? Or will they be used as pawns by communists and socialists?

They have announced their intention to violate our laws and sovereignty. Maybe army is not the right term, but certainly a hostile force.

[Zippyjuan]

NAFTA is bad for everyone but the oligarchs and all three countries' politicians share responsibility for it.

https://assets.bwbx.io/images/users/iqjWHBFdfxIU/iDpyf7X2wzkM/v1/400x-1.png

[Swordsmyth]

https://assets.bwbx.io/images/users/iqjWHBFdfxIU/iDpyf7X2wzkM/v1/400x-1.png

Manipulated numbers, even if wealth grew that much (IT DIDN'T) it all went to the corrupt power brokers who created NAFTA.

[TheCount]

A field army (or numbered army or simply army) is a military formation (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_formation) in many armed forces, composed of two or more corps (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corps) and may be subordinate to an army group (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Army_group). Likewise, air armies (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_army) are equivalent formation within some air forces (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_force). A field army is composed of 100,000 to 150,000 troops.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Field_army

[RonZeplin]

Why don't you just advocate for making O'Bummer President for life and get it over with?


This groups handlers are responding to President Trump's request to congress for DACA amnesty for the illegal aliens that he's providing sanctuary to, his willingness to go way over the number of registered "Dream Students", and the fact that deportation numbers are at record lows. Their odds of not being deported and recieving amnesty are the best in a long time.

http://www.texemarrs.com/images/bush_waves_mexican_flag.gif

George W. Bush 2004 campaign, hispandering like Trump to get reelected.

[spudea]

Sounds like you're walking back your claim that "if this is allowed, we don't have a country."

You perfectly represented my point for me. The government and society envisioned by our founders no longer exists due to open borders and the influence of foreign ideologies. A Cuban refugee and Parkland High student just lead a march on DC to repeal the 2nd amendment.

[Danke]

Why doesn't Mexico welcome them with open arms instead of helping them travel to our borders?

[timosman]

You perfectly represented my point for me. The government and society envisioned by our founders no longer exists due to open borders and the influence of foreign ideologies. A Cuban refugee and Parkland High student just lead a march on DC to repeal the 2nd amendment.

You are right. There are still some who object to this but give it time and we'll be like the rest of the world. Accepting you do not know what is better for you will allow you to make this transition smoother than it would otherwise have to be. ;)

[Danke]

https://assets.bwbx.io/images/users/iqjWHBFdfxIU/iDpyf7X2wzkM/v1/400x-1.png


measured in what? FRNs? Ever heard of money printing and inflation?

[timosman]

measured in what? FRNs? Ever heard of money printing and inflation?

Dude's been on the site only for 10 years and is slowly catching on. Give it another 10 and I am sure everybody will be happy we didn't pass on this talent.

[spudea]

This groups handlers are responding to President Trump's request to congress for DACA amnesty for the illegal aliens that he's providing sanctuary to, his willingness to go way over the number of registered "Dream Students", and the fact that deportation numbers are at record lows. Their odds of not being deported and recieving amnesty are the best in a long time.

Then these people are being lied to. The Whitehouse proposal merely extended the original DACA program and requirements to all eligible persons, which was estimated to be an additional 1.3 million. One of the requirements is someone has to show that they entered the US prior to June, 2007. Deportation numbers down? ICE has stepped up raids and apprehensions nationwide. The only thing slowing deportations is the back logged immigration courts and sanctuary cities shielding violent criminals.

[aGameOfThrones]

Well, i guess.... http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/001/199/608/325.gif

[otherone]

Sure there was. In proportion to the nation's existing population, immigration was an even greater factor then than it is now.

The crucial difference, in the eyes of some, is that back then the immigrants were almost all white.

We could just declare war on Mexico again and take the rest of their land and population. Problem solved.

[Pauls' Revere]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mexican%E2%80%93American_War

U.S. forces quickly occupied the capital town of Santa Fe de Nuevo México along the upper Rio Grande and the Pacific coast territory province of Alta California (Upper California), and then invaded to the south into parts of central Mexico (modern-day northeastern Mexico and northwest Mexico); meanwhile, the Pacific Squadron of the United States Navy conducted a blockade, and took control of several garrisons on the Pacific Ocean western coast farther south in lower Baja California Territory. The U.S. Army, under the command of Major General Winfield Scott, after several fierce battles of stiff resistance from the Mexican Army outside of the capital, Mexico City, eventually captured the city, having marched west from the port of Veracruz, where the Americans staged their first amphibious landing on the Gulf of Mexico coast.

The 1848 Treaty of Guadalupe Hidalgo, forced onto the remnant Mexican government, ended the war and specified its major consequence, the Mexican Cession of the northern territories of Alta California and Santa Fe de Nuevo México to the United States. The U.S. agreed to pay $15 million compensation for the physical damage of the war. In addition, the United States assumed $3.25 million of debt already owed earlier by the Mexican government to U.S. citizens. Mexico acknowledged the loss of their province, later Republic of Texas (and now State of Texas), and thereafter cited and acknowledged the Rio Grande as its future northern national border with the United States. Mexico had lost over one-third of its original territory from its 1821 independence.

[goldenequity]

https://www.zerohedge.com/sites/default/files/styles/inline_image_desktop/public/inline-images/sub-buzz-8514-1522376172-5_0.jpg?itok=keupFwJE

https://www.zerohedge.com/sites/default/files/styles/inline_image_desktop/public/inline-images/dds_0.JPG?itok=WBUyNgwV

"Huge Caravan" Of Central American Refugees Is Headed For The U.S. Border
https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-03-31/huge-caravan-central-americans-headed-us-border-hopes-asylum

Help along the way

Despite a majority of the Hondurans being in Mexico illegally - which Mexican authorities have historically been stringent about, the caravan has not been stopped on its journey, and people from Mexican towns along the way have been helping the migrants.

The group is also planning to take "the Train of Death" in Arriaga in order to expedite the journey north, and several towns have provided buses to help the migrants along.

https://www.zerohedge.com/sites/default/files/styles/inline_image_desktop/public/inline-images/trainof.JPG?itok=y3ysXWou

“The crime rate is horrible, you can't live there,” a migrant named "Karen" told BuzzFeed News on the side of a highway near the Southern Mexico town of Huixtla. “After the president [was sworn in] it got worse. There were deaths, mobs, robbed homes, adults and kids were beaten up.”

"They want to reach the border and ask for asylum, the majority flee from gang violence, extortion and police abuses," says one of the organizers named Garibo.


https://www.zerohedge.com/sites/default/files/styles/inline_image_desktop/public/inline-images/DZTKv9cU8AAJ__s.jpg?itok=9sUazbeG

[aGameOfThrones]

http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/001/331/764/e33.png

[pao]

Why doesn't Mexico welcome them with open arms instead of helping them travel to our borders?

I'm bet Mexico would deport them all or stop them at their southern border if there was any sign that their intent was to settle in Mexico.

[Ender]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mexican%E2%80%93American_War

U.S. forces quickly occupied the capital town of Santa Fe de Nuevo México along the upper Rio Grande and the Pacific coast territory province of Alta California (Upper California), and then invaded to the south into parts of central Mexico (modern-day northeastern Mexico and northwest Mexico); meanwhile, the Pacific Squadron of the United States Navy conducted a blockade, and took control of several garrisons on the Pacific Ocean western coast farther south in lower Baja California Territory. The U.S. Army, under the command of Major General Winfield Scott, after several fierce battles of stiff resistance from the Mexican Army outside of the capital, Mexico City, eventually captured the city, having marched west from the port of Veracruz, where the Americans staged their first amphibious landing on the Gulf of Mexico coast.

The 1848 Treaty of Guadalupe Hidalgo, forced onto the remnant Mexican government, ended the war and specified its major consequence, the Mexican Cession of the northern territories of Alta California and Santa Fe de Nuevo México to the United States. The U.S. agreed to pay $15 million compensation for the physical damage of the war. In addition, the United States assumed $3.25 million of debt already owed earlier by the Mexican government to U.S. citizens. Mexico acknowledged the loss of their province, later Republic of Texas (and now State of Texas), and thereafter cited and acknowledged the Rio Grande as its future northern national border with the United States. Mexico had lost over one-third of its original territory from its 1821 independence.

The Treaty of Guadalupe Hidalgo


The Treaty of Guadalupe Hidalgo looms larger in the history of Mexico than in that of the United States. Partly because of the loss of valuable territory, the treaty ensured that Mexico would remain an underdeveloped country well into the twentieth century. Mexican historians and politicians view this treaty as a bitter lesson in U.S. aggression. As a result of the humiliation of the war and the loss of more than half of the national territory, young Mexicans embraced a reform movement, headed by Benito Juarez, governor of Oaxaca, who had opposed the treaty. In the 1850s the reformers came to power in Mexico vowing to strengthen the country's political system so that never again would they be victims of U.S. aggression. Benito Juarez's La Reforma was the start of a political and economic modernization process that continues to this day in Mexico.

The Treaty of Guadalupe Hidalgo has had implications not only for relations between the two countries but also for international law. Interpretations of the provisions of the treaty have been important in disputes over international boundaries, water and mineral rights, and the civil and property rights of the descendants of the Mexicans in the ceded territories. Since 1848 there have been hundreds of court cases citing the Treaty of Guadalupe Hidalgo as a basis for land claims, but few Mexican claimants were successful in retaining their land.

Since 1848 Native Americans and Mexican Americans have struggled to achieve political and social equality within the United States, often citing the Treaty of Guadalupe Hidalgo as a document that promised civil and property rights. Although the treaty promised U.S. citizenship to former Mexican citizens, the Native Americans in the ceded territories, who in fact were Mexican citizens, were not given full U.S. citizenship until the 1930s. Former Mexican citizens were almost universally considered foreigners by the U.S. settlers who moved into the new territories. In the first half century after ratification of the Treaty of Guadalupe Hidalgo, hundreds of state, territorial, and federal legal bodies produced a complex tapestry of conflicting opinions and decisions bearing on the meaning of the treaty. The property rights seemingly guaranteed in Articles VIII and IX of the treaty (and in the Protocol of Queretaro) were not all they seemed. In. U.S. courts, the property rights of former Mexican citizens in California, New Mexico, and Texas proved to be fragile. Within a generation the Mexican-Americans became a disenfranchised, poverty-stricken minority.



http://www.pbs.org/kera/usmexicanwar/war/wars_end_guadalupe.html

[goldenequity]

old news.
Published on Nov 25, 2013

976857811484397573

[Ender]

"Us" refers to citizens and legal residents of the freest nation on the planet.

P.S. Maybe the Injuns should have done a better job of keeping out invaders and maybe we should learn from their failure.

Sadly, the Indians were a little too trusting when the pilgrims first arrived. That said, the US is not the freest country at this moment.


Sadly, America's Not the Freest Country in the World
The U.S. used to come in second or third in rankings, but according to the latest Human Freedom Index it's at 17.
John Stossel | January 31, 2018

Is America the world's freest country? Sadly, no.

When researchers first started doing detailed international comparisons, the USA came in second or third. This year, however, we ranked 17th.

The comparison I cite is the newly released Human Freedom Index, compiled by the Fraser and Cato Institutes. They compared economic freedoms such as freedom to trade, amount of regulations and tax levels, plus personal freedoms such as women's rights and religious freedom.

Their new report concludes that the world's freest countries are now:

1. Switzerland.
2. Hong Kong.
3. New Zealand.
4. Ireland.
5. Australia.

"The United States used to have one of the freest economies in the world," Index co-author Ian Vasquez says. "It used to be a two, three or four, and then government started to grow [and] spend more."

Republicans and Democrats, under Presidents Bush and Obama, voted for increases in spending and regulation. Obama tried to make tax increases sound harmless. "Those who are more fortunate are going to have to pay a little bit more."

The result was that we fell farther from the top of the freedom ranking. Switzerland now takes first place. It has comparatively little regulation, low taxes, a free press and personal freedoms such as same-sex marriage.

A good ranking matters, not just because freedom itself is a good thing, but because economic freedom allows people to prosper.

Consider the story of Hong Kong, No. 2 on the overall freedom list (but No. 1 in economic freedom). In just 50 years, people in Hong Kong went from being among the poorest in the world to among the richest.

Prosperity happened because Hong Kong's government puts few obstacles in the way of trying new things. It took me just a few hours to get legal permission to open a business in Hong Kong. In New York, it took months. In India, I didn't even try—it would have taken years.

That's a reason India stays poor. Bureaucrats have the power to review and reject most any new idea. Fewer new ideas get tried.



https://reason.com/archives/2018/01/31/sadly-americas-not-the-freest-country-in
http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2018/01/31/john-stossel-is-america-worlds-freest-country.html

[Swordsmyth]

The Treaty of Guadalupe Hidalgo



http://www.pbs.org/kera/usmexicanwar/war/wars_end_guadalupe.html


Since 1848 Native Americans and Mexican Americans have struggled to achieve political and social equality within the United States, often citing the Treaty of Guadalupe Hidalgo as a document that promised civil and property rights. Although the treaty promised U.S. citizenship to former Mexican citizens, the Native Americans in the ceded territories, who in fact were Mexican citizens, were not given full U.S. citizenship until the 1930s. Former Mexican citizens were almost universally considered foreigners by the U.S. settlers who moved into the new territories. In the first half century after ratification of the Treaty of Guadalupe Hidalgo, hundreds of state, territorial, and federal legal bodies produced a complex tapestry of conflicting opinions and decisions bearing on the meaning of the treaty. The property rights seemingly guaranteed in Articles VIII and IX of the treaty (and in the Protocol of Queretaro) were not all they seemed. In. U.S. courts, the property rights of former Mexican citizens in California, New Mexico, and Texas proved to be fragile. Within a generation the Mexican-Americans became a disenfranchised, poverty-stricken minority.

Boo Hoo.

Mexico's record is clean?



Partly because of the loss of valuable territory, the treaty ensured that Mexico would remain an underdeveloped country well into the twentieth century.
Bunk, their underdevelopment has nothing to do with the loss of territory, they had everything they needed in their current territory.


As a result of the humiliation of the war and the loss of more than half of the national territory, young Mexicans embraced a reform movement, headed by Benito Juarez, governor of Oaxaca, who had opposed the treaty. In the 1850s the reformers came to power in Mexico vowing to strengthen the country's political system so that never again would they be victims of U.S. aggression. Benito Juarez's La Reforma was the start of a political and economic modernization process that continues to this day in Mexico.
So which is it? Did the war stunt them or launch their economic modernization process?

[Swordsmyth]

Sadly, the Indians were a little too trusting when the pilgrims first arrived.
We shouldn't emulate their error.


That said, the US is not the freest country at this moment.



https://reason.com/archives/2018/01/31/sadly-americas-not-the-freest-country-in
http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2018/01/31/john-stossel-is-america-worlds-freest-country.html

Fake news.
Even if it were true bringing in a a horde of leftist barbarians will only make things worse.

[Swordsmyth]

976857811484397573

EDIT: @goldenequity (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/member.php?u=704) this is an old story:
Published at 6:08 PM PST on Nov 25, 2013 | Updated at 11:03 AM PST on Nov 26, 2013 /EDIT


A crowd of more than 100 people pelted Border Patrol agents with rocks and bottles as they tried to cross into the U.S. illegally, according to U.S. Customs and Border Protection.
The incident happened Sunday in the Tijuana River channel, near the San Ysidro Port of Entry.
According to CBP, a Border Patrol agent ordered the Mexican nationals to stop, but they continued walking into the U.S.
Officials said the agent fired a PepperBall Launcher, but it did not deter the crowd.


“They had their phones out so this group was out to spark an incident. That's what they wanted to do, “ Border Patrol Union representative Gabriel Pacheco said.
Had cooler heads not prevailed it could have ended much worse, he said.
Even with reinforcements, agents were outnumbered, dodging threats, rocks and bottles.


More agents responded as the crowd became “unruly,” even hitting one agent in the head with a full water bottle, officials said.
According to CBP, the agents used “intermediate use-of-force” devices, and the group retreated back to the Mexican side of the border.
No one was arrested.

https://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/local/Unruly-Crowd-Attacks-Border-Patrol-Agents-233397971.html

[Ender]

Boo Hoo.

Mexico's record is clean?



Bunk, their underdevelopment has nothing to do with the loss of territory, they had everything they needed in their current territory.


So which is it? Did the war stunt them or launch their economic modernization process?


History Guy:
The U.S.-Mexican War (1846-1848)

The Mexican-American War was the first major conflict driven by the idea of "Manifest Destiny"; the belief that America had a God-given right, or destiny, to expand the country's borders from 'sea to shining sea'. This belief would eventually cause a great deal of suffering for many Mexicans, Native Americans and United States citizens. Following the earlier Texas War of Independence from Mexico, tensions between the two largest independent nations on the North American continent grew as Texas eventually became a U.S. state. Disputes over the border lines sparked military confrontation, helped by the fact that President Polk eagerly sought a war in order to seize large tracts of land from Mexico.

CAUSES OF CONFLICT:

The war between the United States and Mexico had two basic causes. First, the desire of the U.S. to expand across the North American continent to the Pacific Ocean caused conflict with all of its neighbors; from the British in Canada and Oregon to the Mexicans in the southwest and, of course, with the Native Americans. Ever since President Jefferson's acquisition of the Louisiana Territory in 1803, Americans migrated westward in ever increasing numbers, often into lands not belonging to the United States. By the time President Polk came to office in 1845, an idea called "Manifest Destiny" had taken root among the American people, and the new occupant of the White House was a firm believer in the idea of expansion. The belief that the U.S. basically had a God-given right to occupy and "civilize" the whole continent gained favor as more and more Americans settled the western lands. The fact that most of those areas already had people living upon them was usually ignored, with the attitude that democratic English-speaking America, with its high ideals and Protestant Christian ethics, would do a better job of running things than the Native Americans or Spanish-speaking Catholic Mexicans. Manifest Destiny did not necessarily call for violent expansion. In both 1835 and 1845, the United States offered to purchase California from Mexico, for $5 million and $25 million, respectively. The Mexican government refused the opportunity to sell half of its country to Mexico's most dangerous neighbor.

The second basic cause of the war was the Texas War of Independence and the subsequent annexation of that area to the United States. Not all American westward migration was unwelcome. In the 1820's and 1830's, Mexico, newly independent from Spain, needed settlers in the underpopulated northern parts of the country. An invitation was issued for people who would take an oath of allegiance to Mexico and convert to Catholicism, the state religion. Thousands of Americans took up the offer and moved, often with slaves, to the Mexican province of Texas. Soon however, many of the new "Texicans" or "Texians" were unhappy with the way the government in Mexico City tried to run the province. In 1835, Texas revolted, and after several bloody battles, the Mexican President, Santa Anna, was forced to sign the Treaty of Velasco in 1836 . This treaty gave Texas its independence, but many Mexicans refused to accept the legality of this document, as Santa Anna was a prisoner of the Texans at the time. The Republic of Texas and Mexico continued to engage in border fights and many people in the United States openly sympathized with the U.S.-born Texans in this conflict. As a result of the savage frontier fighting, the American public developed a very negative stereotype against the Mexican people and government. Partly due to the continued hostilities with Mexico, Texas decided to join with the United States, and on July 4, 1845, the annexation gained approval from the U.S. Congress.


. One interesting aspect of the war involves the fate of U.S. Army deserters of Irish origin who joined the Mexican Army as the Batallón San Patricio (Saint Patrick's Battalion). This group of Catholic Irish immigrants rebelled at the abusive treatment by Protestant, American-born officers and at the treatment of the Catholic Mexican population by the U.S. Army. At this time in American history, Catholics were an ill-treated minority, and the Irish were an unwanted ethnic group in the United States. In September, 1847, the U.S. Army hanged sixteen surviving members of the San Patricios as traitors. To this day, they are considered heroes in Mexico.

https://www.historyguy.com/Mexican-American_War.html#.WsB3vf0lFZo

[Swordsmyth]

https://www.historyguy.com/Mexican-American_War.html#.WsB3vf0lFZo

Yawn.

Not a rebuttal of my post.

Mexico wasn't an innocent victim nor is it's record clean of bloody conquest or mistreatment of the natives or it's own citizens.

In any case it is all history now.

(And I see no reason we should repeat their mistake with Texas.)

Please do keep bringing up examples of immigrants seizing territory from it's former owners.

[Raginfridus]

What is your solution Swordsmyth? Crawl out of newsbot mode w/ the ass-kisser option and form a thought.

[timosman]

What is your solution Swordsmyth? Crawl out of newsbot mode w/ the ass-kisser option and form a thought.

You could propose something on your own. :cool:

[Swordsmyth]

What is your solution @Swordsmyth (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/member.php?u=65299)? Crawl out of newsbot mode w/ the ass-kisser option and form a thought.

Yawn.

You amuse me.

[timosman]

979936301670682624

[timosman]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1f9fz47-Kps

[spudea]

https://www.historyguy.com/Mexican-American_War.html#.WsB3vf0lFZo


Mexico, newly independent from Spain, needed settlers in the underpopulated northern parts of the country. An invitation was issued for people who would take an oath of allegiance to Mexico and convert to Catholicism, the state religion. Thousands of Americans took up the offer and moved, often with slaves, to the Mexican province of Texas. Soon however, many of the new "Texicans" or "Texians" were unhappy with the way the government in Mexico City tried to run the province. In 1835, Texas revolted

Mexico tried to implement vetting but failed and migrants overthrew their government. Once again proving the exact point that we should not be so welcoming of migrants from countries drastically different than our own.

[goldenequity]

betcha didn't know:
The population of Arab descendents in Latin America dwarfs the United States.
Actually, it is home to largest Arab dispora on the planet.

Arab diaspora
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arab_diaspora
Latin America has the world's largest Arab population outside of the Arab World.
Latin America is home to anywhere from 17-25 to 30 million people of Arab descent, more than any other diaspora region in the world.
3.7 million Americans trace their roots to an Arab country.

Latin American Palestinians - Rutgers University
https://rucore.libraries.rutgers.edu/rutgers-lib/43773/
Description This study addresses the Palestinian emigration from Ottoman and British Palestine to Latin America,
with a focus on the Diaspora created in Honduras.
Through migration, diaspora and acculturation theory it analyzes the diaspora and the migration itself.

Palestinians in Latin America | Journal of Palestine Studies
http://jps.ucpress.edu/content/43/2/59
Latin America is host to an estimated half-million people of Palestinian descent, the largest such population outside the Arab world.
Migration to the region began in the late 1800s and peaked between 1900 and 1930, with surges around periods of war or economic crisis in Palestine.

Latino Palestinians
https://duckduckgo.com/?t=palemoon&q=Latino+Palestinians&ia=web

[spudea]

POTUS knows:

980443810529533952
980451155548491777

[aGameOfThrones]

Apparently they only Hate the United States when they are in the United States.

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/9c/13/69/9c136976aeff3d84320976efaca98bda.jpg

[devil21]

Shades of REX 84 exercise. Mass influx of migrants (though 1200-1500 is relatively nothing) causing a border lockdown scenario that leads to martial law and suspension of the BoR.

[Swordsmyth]

Border Patrol reaction to caravan of immigrants headed to US (https://www.yahoo.com/news/border-patrol-reaction-caravan-immigrants-132454085.html)

[spudea]

Border Patrol reaction to caravan of immigrants headed to US (https://www.yahoo.com/news/border-patrol-reaction-caravan-immigrants-132454085.html)

Ugh, you can't even call these people border patrol. They are border processors. And this guy just graciously explained exactly what is needed to do for any foreign national to stay permanently.

[TheCount]

Border Patrol reaction to caravan of immigrants headed to US (https://www.yahoo.com/news/border-patrol-reaction-caravan-immigrants-132454085.html)


That's not the border patrol, that's the president of a union of government workers.

[aGameOfThrones]

End the benies and enforce border laws or build the wall.

[spudea]

That's not the border patrol, that's the president of a union of government workers.

Brandon Judd is a border patrol agent and has been for over 18 years.

[Zippyjuan]

We need to send the US military to Mexico's southern border. Or build another wall there. And one between here and China. We don't want people walking 2000 miles in 90 degree heat.

[Swordsmyth]

We need to send the US military to Mexico's southern border. Or build another wall there. And one between here and China. We don't want people walking 2000 miles in 90 degree heat.

Our own border will do nicely.

[spudea]

We need to send the US military to Mexico's southern border. Or build another wall there. And one between here and China. We don't want people walking 2000 miles in 90 degree heat.

Good idea. We have more troops guarding borders in the eastern hemisphere than our own western hemisphere.

[seapilot]

We need to send the US military to Mexico's southern border. Or build another wall there. And one between here and China. We don't want people walking 2000 miles in 90 degree heat.

If we get them out of the hundreds of countries where they are not supposed to be, I am ok with that.

[Zippyjuan]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DZtJ51cW0AonyLg.jpg

Only if they have a time machine. To be eligible for DACA a person must:


ou may request consideration of DACA if you:

Were under the age of 31 as of June 15, 2012;

Came to the United States before reaching your 16th birthday;

Have continuously resided in the United States since June 15, 2007, up to the present time;

Were physically present in the United States on June 15, 2012, and at the time of making your request for consideration of deferred action with USCIS;

Had no lawful status on June 15, 2012, meaning that:

You never had a lawful immigration status on or before June 15, 2012, or

Any lawful immigration status or parole that you obtained prior to June 15, 2012, had expired as of June 15, 2012;

Are currently in school, have graduated or obtained a certificate of completion from high school, have obtained a General Educational Development (GED) certificate, or are an honorably discharged veteran of the Coast Guard or Armed Forces of the United States; and

Have not been convicted of a felony, a significant misdemeanor, three or more other misdemeanors, and do not otherwise pose a threat to national security or public safety.

https://www.uscis.gov/archive/frequently-asked-questions


https://static1.squarespace.com/static/55ef5a84e4b0fd8857a68f91/t/59c413f049fc2b15217b21b7/1506022385483/Donald+Trump+Twitter.png?format=1000w

[goldenequity]

U gno it wont stop :D


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JmBTBxMTEdU

[Swordsmyth]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DZtJ51cW0AonyLg.jpg

Only if they have a time machine. To be eligible for DACA a person must:



https://www.uscis.gov/archive/frequently-asked-questions

The Demoncrats want to expand it in any deal, also such details are often lost and all the foreigners hear is that we are giving away amnesty so they come to get in on it.

NO DEAL.

Keep DREAMing Juan.

[Zippyjuan]

Trump and Republicans will support and save DACA. Trump said so.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DVvcC4KX4AAzKWw.jpg

https://i2.wp.com/cdn.bipartisan-report.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/2018-03-23-08_56_06-Donald-J.-Trump-on-Twitter_-_I-am-considering-a-VETO-of-the-Omnibus-Spending-Bil.png?resize=625%2C444

[Danke]

U gno it wont stop :D


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JmBTBxMTEdU


15 + minutes of free speech haters. Lovely.

[Swordsmyth]

Trump and Republicans will support and save DACA. Trump said so.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DVvcC4KX4AAzKWw.jpg

https://i2.wp.com/cdn.bipartisan-report.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/2018-03-23-08_56_06-Donald-J.-Trump-on-Twitter_-_I-am-considering-a-VETO-of-the-Omnibus-Spending-Bil.png?resize=625%2C444

Not anymore.

[Zippyjuan]

Not anymore.

Trump never intended to. If he actually favored DACA he would never have tried ending it (still tied up in the courts).


Sending 12M illegals home won't & shouldn't happen

Even with a healthy economy and stricter border controls, the issue of what to do with twelve-million-plus illegals already here would persist. One side says use the U.S. Army, round them up, and ship them home. The other side says give them amnesty, make them full-fledged citizens, and reward the lawbreakers, thus insulting and unfairly penalizing those who have patiently waited and obeyed our immigration laws. The first choice--sending twelve to fifteen million illegals home--isn't going to happen and should not happen. Neither the determination or the ability to accomplish it exists. Besides, if each case is looked at separately, we would find ourselves splitting up families and deporting some who have lived here for decades, if not their entire life, and who never lived for any length of time in Mexico.

Source: Liberty Defined, by Rep. Ron Paul, p.153 , Apr 19, 2011


Immigrants who can't be sent back due to the magnitude of the problem should not be given citizenship--no amnesty should be granted. Maybe a "green card" with an asterisk could be issued. This in-between status, keeping illegal immigrants in limbo, will be said that it will create a class of 2nd-class citizens. Yet it could be argued that it may well allow some immigrants who come here illegally a beneficial status without automatic citizenship--a much better option than deportation.

http://www.ontheissues.org/2012/Ron_Paul_Immigration.htm

[Swordsmyth]

Trump never intended to. If he actually favored DACA he would never have tried ending it (still tied up in the courts).

He gave the Dems a chance to cut a deal, they blew it.

Ron is wrong on this, if you start deporting them the rest will leave on their own, letting them stay is rewarding lawbreakers and encourages more.

[Zippyjuan]

He gave the Dems a chance to cut a deal, they blew it.

Ron is wrong on this, if you start deporting them the rest will leave on their own, letting them stay is rewarding lawbreakers and encourages more.

Republicans control Congress- not Democrats. Trump said he would sign any deal- then reneged and said he would veto it. Congress had a bipartisan deal. https://www.nytimes.com/2018/02/14/us/politics/trump-immigration-veto-threat.html

Trump will only (reluctantly) agree if it is the only way he can get his $25 billion down payment on the wall.

[Jan2017]

I got a few hours to burn before Danke's Open Discussion space debris metorites wipe out earth evening plans . . .

According to UN Population Division statistics, Nicaraguans and Hondurans are under represented
in the diversity goals of USA immigration policy - almost pretty much walk in - with some documentation though -

2017
Nicaraguans 280,000 0.56% of migrant population in USA
Honduras 600,000 1.2%
http://www.pewglobal.org/2018/02/28/global-migrant-stocks/?country=US&date=2017

As of 2017, Mexico has 4500% more USA migrants than Nicaragua . . . , huh?

[TheCount]

Brandon Judd is a border patrol agent and has been for over 18 years.
The union boss is not an official representative of the border patrol and cannot speak for it.

[Swordsmyth]

Republicans control Congress- not Democrats. Trump said he would sign any deal- then reneged and said he would veto it. Congress had a bipartisan deal. https://www.nytimes.com/2018/02/14/us/politics/trump-immigration-veto-threat.html

Trump will only (reluctantly) agree if it is the only way he can get his $25 billion down payment on the wall.

Neither the Dems nor the RINOs were willing to make a fair deal or anything close so now there will be NO DEAL.

[Zippyjuan]

Brandon Judd is a border patrol agent and has been for over 18 years.

Apparently he doesn't always speak for what the Department of Homeland Security thinks. Article from last year.

https://www.judicialwatch.org/blog/2017/06/dhs-may-terminate-border-patrol-union-chief-reporting-corruption-blasting-open-border-policies/


DHS May Terminate Border Patrol Union Chief for Reporting Corruption, Blasting Open Border Policies

National Border Patrol Council President Brandon Judd is under investigation by the Department of Homeland Security (DHS) for reporting corruption and misconduct in agency management, including a disturbing order issued to officers directing them not to patrol a vulnerable stretch of the northern border with Canada. Judicial Watch has obtained government documents and interviewed numerous sources with direct knowledge of the situation, which appears retaliatory.




More at link.

[Danke]

The union boss is not an official representative of the border patrol and cannot speak for it.


Any Union representative probably needs to be less "politically correct" than government agents and is more honest with their answers.

[Danke]

Apparently he doesn't always speak for what the Department of Homeland Security thinks. Article from last year.

https://www.judicialwatch.org/blog/2017/06/dhs-may-terminate-border-patrol-union-chief-reporting-corruption-blasting-open-border-policies/



More at link.


Management trying to discredit/take down the Union leadership. Surprise, Surprise.

[goldenequity]

15 + minutes of free speech haters. Lovely.

C'mon Danke. You just don't appreciate diversity. You need to get out more.

980481502214488064

[RonZeplin]

Neither the Dems nor the RINOs were willing to make a fair deal or anything close so now there will be NO DEAL.

That's wonderful, no deal is necessary to deport ALL the illegal aliens including DACA's. President Trump is unwilling to deport his beloved "Dream Students" and will keep them here and provide sanctuary, until he gets congress to grant them amnesty.

A fair deal would be to enforce existing immigration law, that won't be happening under President Trump.

https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSX8tAQfWUBBiACoVCdujUhuqjQriO8Q EeUMVnyxCREBxw4tZWX

[Swordsmyth]

That's wonderful, no deal is necessary to deport ALL the illegal aliens including DACA's. President Trump is unwilling to deport his beloved "Dream Students" and will keep them here and provide sanctuary, until he gets congress to grant them amnesty.

A fair deal would be to enforce existing immigration law, that won't be happening under President Trump.

https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSX8tAQfWUBBiACoVCdujUhuqjQriO8Q EeUMVnyxCREBxw4tZWX

We shall see.

[spudea]

Congress had a bipartisan deal. https://www.nytimes.com/2018/02/14/us/politics/trump-immigration-veto-threat.html

this "deal" was put up for a vote and failed in the Senate so we don't really know what Trump would have done if it passed, per your own posts we can't trust what he says anyway. If it had passed maybe he would have signed it.

[Zippyjuan]

this "deal" was put up for a vote and failed in the Senate so we don't really know what Trump would have done if it passed, per your own posts we can't trust what he says anyway. If it had passed maybe he would have signed it.

His positions do change by the hour sometimes. No- he can't be trusted.

[spudea]

The union boss is not an official representative of the border patrol and cannot speak for it.

I dunno what your issue is, maybe with the title of the linked article? As a member of the border patrol, he was offering his reaction to the current topic, and he also represents the interests of 18,500 border agents. So cry more that its not an official POV government agency statement to inflate your post count?

[TheCount]

I dunno what your issue is, maybe with the title of the linked article? As a member of the border patrol, he was offering his reaction to the current topic, and he also represents the interests of 18,500 border agents.

Seems like you figured out my issue.

[aGameOfThrones]

15 + minutes of free speech haters. Lovely.

The parents are teaching tolerance to those kids.

[timosman]

15 + minutes of free speech haters. Lovely.

Freedom of speech? Sorry, concept unknown.:cool:

[Superfluous Man]

That's wonderful, no deal is necessary to deport ALL the illegal aliens including DACA's. President Trump is unwilling to deport his beloved "Dream Students" and will keep them here and provide sanctuary, until he gets congress to grant them amnesty.

A fair deal would be to enforce existing immigration law, that won't be happening under President Trump.

That's good.

To be fair, I don't think he campaigned on any promises to enforce existing immigration laws. He promised touchback amnesty in his campaigns. Granted, he probably did flip-flop a lot. But despite his immigration hawk rhetoric, I don't think enforcing existing immigration laws was ever something he claimed to support.

And of course, the man this website is named after has never supported doing that either.

[Swordsmyth]

Freedom? Sorry, concept unknown.:cool:

Fixed it.

[spudea]

That's good.

To be fair, I don't think he campaigned on any promises to enforce existing immigration laws. He promised touchback amnesty in his campaigns. Granted, he probably did flip-flop a lot. But despite his immigration hawk rhetoric, I don't think enforcing existing immigration laws was ever something he claimed to support.

And of course, the man this website is named after has never supported doing that either.

enforcing existing law was always part of his platform and part of many of his speeches. Here is a copy of his campaign published immigration reform platform. https://assets.donaldjtrump.com/Immigration-Reform-Trump.pdf

[Pauls' Revere]

Border Patrol reaction to caravan of immigrants headed to US (https://www.yahoo.com/news/border-patrol-reaction-caravan-immigrants-132454085.html)

Sorry, bad link.

[Swordsmyth]

Sorry, bad link.
It still works for me, here is the web address:

https://www.yahoo.com/news/border-patrol-reaction-caravan-immigrants-132454085.html

[Jan2017]

uggh . . . noisy audio

"Some seek asylum, some say they will sneak across border."
"They do not (presumably) have passports."
"Mexico state agency is assisting them." wtf ?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qVjoVx00nt8

[AuH20]

U gno it wont stop :D


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JmBTBxMTEdU

They are raising animals in the school system, just like they said. Isebyrt talked about this. No respect for themselves or private property for that matter. Beings ruled by emotion and primitive to boot. These type of people are extremely easy to control.

[RonZeplin]

uggh . . . noisy audio

"Some seek asylum, some say they will sneak across border."
"They do not (presumably) have passports."
"Mexico state agency is assisting them." wtf ?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qVjoVx00nt8

Grupos Beta, a Mexican government agency running this invasion. It's an act of war (invasion), but the D&R party pretends not to notice. President Trump will ignore his oath of office to enforce the rule of law, and obey the US Constitution just like Obama and Bush did.

http://www.asfmtech.org/20delagarza5280/files/2015/03/beta1-210xdx2.jpg

Article 4 - The States
Section 4 - Republican Government

The United States shall guarantee to every State in this Union a Republican Form of Government, and shall protect each of them against Invasion; and on Application of the Legislature, or of the Executive (when the Legislature cannot be convened) against domestic Violence.

[Jan2017]

They are raising animals in the school system, just like they said. Isebyrt talked about this. No respect for themselves or private property for that matter. Beings ruled by emotion and primitive to boot. These type of people are extremely easy to control.
Obama signs prolly weren't treated so great either,
but this is alot more persistent - Here you see kids and moms leading the charge with younger kids watching.
After 3 minutes maybe a hundred signs down ?

A couple pretty young kids return - see the camera - wave - try to put the Trump sign back up.

[AuH20]

Obama signs prolly weren't treated so great either,
but this is alot more persistent - Here you see kids and moms leading the charge with younger kids watching.
After 3 minutes maybe a hundred signs down ?

A couple pretty young kids return - see the camera - wave - try to put the trump sign back up.

The dumbed down beast mentality is arriving in the burbs as well. But the minorities have no chance. It's like getting into the batters box with two strikes.

[goldenequity]

The caravan has grown to 5000 as of last night and is growing larger every day. (surprise!!)



980762392303980544

980764358530789380

980766121983987712

980794173279342592

[Ender]

Here's what's really going on:


The ‘caravan’

Alex Mensing, one of the US collaborators who works for Pueblo Sin Fronteras, a caravan of 1,100 people, started in the city of Tapachula, which is located in the state of Chiapas, Mexico, and borders Guatemala. The caravan is currently in Oaxaca, Mexico, about 420 miles from their starting point. Mensing said the migrants would turn themselves in and request asylum.

Pueblo Sin Fronteras said they would not respond to Trump’s tweet, but stated that the refugee caravan “is a movement made of people who were forced to flee their countries of origin due to persecution and violence.”

Mensing said the caravan’s primary goal is to “flee Central America” and seek asylum either within Mexico or the United States. About four or five different immigration rights groups are working with the asylum seekers, informing and preparing them on their journey to seek refuge.

This is the fifth year the group has done the caravan.

Two caravans were mobilized in 2017 with fewer people and many of their cases have yet to be resolved. Out of the 200 people who marched with the caravan, only 3 have successfully been given asylum in the US so far.

Luis Videgaray Caso, Mexico’s secretary of foreign affairs, tweeted a response to today’s statements by President Trump.
“Every day Mexico and the US work together on migration throughout the region. Facts clearly reflect this,” he said. “An inaccurate news report should not serve to this question cooperation. Upholding human dignity and rights is not at odds with the rule of law. Happy Easter.”

http://5newsonline.com/2018/04/01/immigrant-caravan-heading-to-us-mexico-border-sparks-trumps-concern/

[dannno]

Here's what's really going on:

No, that is not what is "really going on", you should pay attention to the thread. There are more than 5,000 in the caravan now, and there were several hundred who tried to ambush the border wall in San Diego a couple weeks ago - they are waiting for the rest to arrive for another ambush.

[Ender]

No, that is not what is "really going on", you should pay attention to the thread. There are more than 5,000 in the caravan now, and there were several hundred who tried to ambush the border wall in San Diego a couple weeks ago - they are waiting for the rest to arrive for another ambush.

Ambush?

You mean this?


In a parking lot of the Our Lady of Mount Carmel Church in San Ysidro, 500 San Diegans rallied against President Trump and his wall. Trump was over at the prototypes during part of the rally.

The general theme, “Build Bridges Not Walls”, was highly visible as a variety of faith-based organizations and groups that have mobilized since Trump’s election came together to oppose his policies on the wall, immigration and other issues. Folks from Women’s March, Indivisible, ImpeachTrump mingled with immigrants’ rights groups and Democratic party activists.

https://sandiegofreepress.org/2018/03/500-rally-in-san-ysidro-against-trump-and-his-wall/

BTW, the definition of "ambush" is this:

am·bush
ˈambo͝oSH/
noun
1.
a surprise attack by people lying in wait in a concealed position.
"seven members of a patrol were killed in an ambush"
synonyms: surprise attack, trap; archaicambuscade
"the soldiers were killed in an ambush"

None of this is "concealed"- and as the article stated, this is the 5th year for the People w/o Borders group.

[dannno]

//

[goldenequity]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=faNge-o0V-k
(try to ignore that the 'chief' sounds like bill clinton.... hahaha)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fl9HMSTHeTg


The only solution is to end all migration everywhere and cut down that damn statue in New York Harbor.
It was a limited time offer.
It's over.
Everybody everywhere STAY in your own neighborhood around the planet and prosper. Good luck.
Let us know if you want to trade (fairly). So long and thanks for the fish.

[dannno]

Ambush?

You mean this?

No, it was posted earlier from a tweet that was a week and a half ago. It was an ambush at the border by a carvan in the hundreds. The story may be older than the tweet, though.

Still doesn't change that this caravan is growing larger and larger.

[timosman]

The only solution is to end all migration everywhere and cut down that damn statue in New York Harbor.
It was a limited time offer.
It's over.
Everybody everywhere STAY in your own neighborhood around the planet and prosper. Good luck.
Let us know if you want to trade (fairly). So long and thanks for the fish.

I don't think we need to be flattered anymore :cool:

https://quotefancy.com/media/wallpaper/1600x900/1332759-Jack-Paar-Quote-Immigration-is-the-sincerest-form-of-flattery.jpg

[Ender]

No, it was posted earlier from a tweet that was a week and a half ago. It was an ambush at the border by a carvan in the hundreds. The story may be older than the tweet, though.

Still doesn't change that this caravan is growing larger and larger.

Link?

[dannno]

Link?

It's from a documentary, it is a few years old so I doubt these guys will be joining up with this group, but definitely relevant.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q_WVWgNZ2ZI

[Ender]

It's from a documentary, it is a few years old so I doubt these guys will be joining up with this group, but definitely relevant.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q_WVWgNZ2ZI

You just said:


No, that is not what is "really going on", you should pay attention to the thread. There are more than 5,000 in the caravan now, and there were several hundred who tried to ambush the border wall in San Diego a couple weeks ago - they are waiting for the rest to arrive for another ambush.

And now you're saying a few years ago? :rolleyes:

[Jamesiv1]

The way to stop immigration is to make it a whole lot less rewarding to be an immigrant - especially an illegal one - starting with turning off the river of free food, shelter and medical care.

I'm thinking about denouncing my US citizenship, living in Mexico for a bit then coming back in as an immigrant if the free stuff keeps flowing. Heck, don't even have to be legal to vote. Sweet!

[Ender]

It was 2013- it was instigated and no one knows which side planned it.


Christian Ramirez of The American Friends Service Committee said the entire situation is worrisome. His group tracks border violence and Ramirez said it’s important to find out which side first instigated the violence, and how it got to that point.

This isn’t the first time border agents have been attacked, which is exactly why the Border Patrol said it takes any violence very seriously.

“This was a stupid thing to do. You’re placing the agents at risk and also those individuals you are encouraging at risk,” said Beeson.

Despite potential for a much bigger disaster, in the end, most walked away from the chaos just wiping their eyes from the pepper spray. No one was seriously injured, and no one made it past border agents.

Beeson said that if investigators do find out who distributed those fliers and organized the event, that person or persons could face criminal charges.

https://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/local/Unruly-Crowd-Attack-Organized-at-US-Mexico-Border-San-Diego-233698631.html

[TheCount]

several hundred who tried to ambush the border wall in San Diego a couple weeks ago

How does one ambush a wall? Sneak up on it while it's on its way to work?


It's from a documentary, it is a few years old so I doubt these guys will be joining up with this group, but definitely relevant. You said that they were waiting "for the rest to arrive for another ambush." It's been 5 years. Are their reinforcements still on the way?


It was 2013- it was instigated and no one knows which side planned it.
It's emotionally true that it was a couple of weeks ago and that another ambush could happen at any moment. It feels like it might be true. If you truly have #MAGA in your heart, that's more important than whether anything about it is actually true.

[dannno]

You just said:



And now you're saying a few years ago? :rolleyes:

The tweet was originally posted with the caption "Breaking News", but I noticed the tweet timestamp was a couple weeks ago. It looks like the person who posted it changed the caption to note it was a video from 2013.

There is no indication in the video that it was from 2013.

[dannno]

It was 2013- it was instigated and no one knows which side planned it.


The video may be old, but that is one of the most LOLable things I've ever heard..

[Zippyjuan]

The tweet was originally posted with the caption "Breaking News", but I noticed the tweet timestamp was a couple weeks ago. It looks like the person who posted it changed the caption to note it was a video from 2013.

There is no indication in the video that it was from 2013.

I thought you lived here. You would have heard about it on the news if it was current.

[dannno]

How does one ambush a wall? Sneak up on it while it's on its way to work?

Well I guess if you saw the video you would see that the border wall goes up to the edge of a giant river and the giant river has to be patrolled. The ambush happened on the edge of the border wall.

Trying to act "smart" doesn't really help when we have all this footage - no matter when it is from, the fact is we have thousands of people coming again who will want to do the same thing.

Trying to argue your side just makes you look even worse no matter what you do.

[nikcers]

The way to stop immigration is to make it a whole lot less rewarding to be an immigrant - especially an illegal one - starting with turning off the river of free food, shelter and medical care.

I'm thinking about denouncing my US citizenship, living in Mexico for a bit then coming back in as an immigrant if the free stuff keeps flowing. Heck, don't even have to be legal to vote. Sweet!
That's the worst part about the whole thing. The illegals keep coming here and taking all of our free lunch while real Americans go hungry. We would have free lunch for everyone if they would just stop coming here.

[dannno]

I thought you lived here.

You would have heard about it on the news if it was current.

I grew up there. Still had family there when the forum began, and my ex-gf's family lived there after that.

[TheCount]

The tweet was originally posted with the caption "Breaking News" What happened to tweets not even being words?

[Zippyjuan]

Well I guess if you saw the video you would see that the border wall goes up to the edge of a giant river and the giant river has to be patrolled. The ambush happened on the edge of the border wall.

Trying to act "smart" doesn't really help when we have all this footage - no matter when it is from, the fact is we have thousands of people coming again who will want to do the same thing.

Trying to argue your side just makes you look even worse no matter what you do.

There were two other such caravans in 2017 (a bit smaller). Are there reports of any sorts of violence related to them? http://www.kpbs.org/news/2017/may/10/asylum-seekers-caravan-held-us-san-ysidro/



The migrants, mostly Central Americans, turned themselves into U.S. Customs and Border Protection (CBP) this Sunday after the trip through Mexico with activists.

They organized the caravan in part to bring attention to the dangers migrants face in the journey through Mexico as well as challenges faced at the U.S.-Mexico border.



The agency also said it is aware of the "large group of individuals at the San Ysidro Port of Entry" that is seeking asylum and said the asylum seekers will be processed on a case-by-case basis.

U.S. immigration law dictates that people who asks a CBP officer for asylum have the right to a “credible fear” screening by U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services (USCIS). According to the USCIS website, asylum seekers get a green light in the screening if they can establish that they “have been persecuted or have a well-founded fear of persecution on account of (their) race, religion, nationality, membership in a particular social group, or political opinion” if returned to their country.

Some of the caravan’s family members are concerned about how they are are being treated in CBP custody. Los Angeles resident Dolores Ramirez traveled to the border on Tuesday to try to get information about her relatives in the caravan. She said she had received one phone call from a relative who complained of the conditions inside.

“They’re only getting 10 minutes to eat, they have no blankets, they’re sleeping on the floor in cells, they’re being yelled at,” she said. “They shouldn’t be treated like animals, they’re not animals, they didn’t cross the border illegally, they’re seeking help.”

They were trying to escape violence- not to cause it.

[Origanalist]

This thread,is highly entertaining, thank you to all the participants.

[AuH20]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b4nUkGjYBk4

[dannno]

What happened to tweets not even being words?

Well they certainly are not spoken words, which is what I was comparing them to when I made that statement and you could have easily figured out from the context if you weren't always trying to be such a smart ass.

[Zippyjuan]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QzgJIF00Xdw

[Raginfridus]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=faNge-o0V-k
(try to ignore that the 'chief' sounds like bill clinton.... hahaha)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fl9HMSTHeTgWere colonists fleeing persecution, wars, and famine? (Not the trade companies mind you, the colonists.)

I'm just asking, because that's what this alleged army claims they're leaving.

[Ender]

How does one ambush a wall? Sneak up on it while it's on its way to work?

You said that they were waiting "for the rest to arrive for another ambush." It's been 5 years. Are their reinforcements still on the way?


It's emotionally true that it was a couple of weeks ago and that another ambush could happen at any moment. It feels like it might be true. If you truly have #MAGA in your heart, that's more important than whether anything about it is actually true.

LOL!

[TheCount]

Well they certainly are not spoken words, which is what I was comparing them to when I made that statement and you could have easily figured out from the context if you weren't always trying to be such a smart ass.I'm just trying to establish what tweets are or are not. In the past, you've contended that tweets are essentially meaningless, even when using them to determine if the very person who sent the tweet actually "said" a thing or not. Now you're using tweets as evidence of whether or not an event occurred, as well as when it occurred. Is there some higher level of MAGAriffic thinking that I'm missing out on?

[dannno]

I'm just trying to establish what tweets are or are not. In the past, you've contended that tweets are essentially meaningless, even when using them to determine if the very person who sent the tweet actually "said" a thing or not. Now you're using tweets as evidence of whether or not an event occurred, as well as when it occurred. Is there some higher level of MAGAriffic thinking that I'm missing out on?

(bold) I never said they were meaningless, tweeting is typically more playful and/or trollish, which can convey much meaning in and of itself. Tweeting certainly doesn't carry the same weight as say, the President making a statement with spoken words.

Of course you knew that, but you just can't help being a smart ass.

[TheCount]

tweeting is typically more playful and/or trollish

Then why would you accept tweeted news reports as fact?

[dannno]

LOL!

Again, this isn't really doing much to help your argument. A couple weeks ago or a couple years ago, we got a caravan about 10 times bigger coming right now.

[dannno]

Then why would you accept tweeted news reports as fact?

The news report was fact, and that is the most important part. The tweet part was not fact, but it doesn't make a huge difference in the outcome, like I said in the post above this one.

[Zippyjuan]

Again, this isn't really doing much to help your argument. A couple weeks ago or a couple years ago, we got a caravan about 10 times bigger coming right now.

How much violence resulted from the other two caravans which arrived last year?

[dannno]

How much violence resulted from the other two caravans which arrived last year?

I'm guessing not much if any since the size of the caravans were much more manageable.

[Zippyjuan]

I'm guessing not much if any since the size of the caravans were much more manageable.

How much violence has happened along the route of the current caravan? (these are people fleeing violence and are travelling in large numbers to avoid facing more violence along the way).

[dannno]

How much violence has happened along the route of the current caravan?

How could anybody possibly know that information?

[Ender]

Again, this isn't really doing much to help your argument. A couple weeks ago or a couple years ago, we got a caravan about 10 times bigger coming right now.

This "Caravan" is a humanitarian action initiated by Pueblo Sin Fronteras:


Pueblo Sin Fronteras, "Caravans," & What You Should Know About The Migrants Heading To The U.S.
ByLANI SEELINGER
3 hours ago

Over Easter weekend, the president launched into yet another one of his morning tweet storms, this time attacking what he called a "caravan" of migrants soon to arrive at the U.S.' souther border. That "caravan" is actually real — but there's a lot more to know about Pueblo Sin Fronteras and the group of migrants currently making their way towards the United States. Trump's tweets make it seem like a dangerous operation — but it's actually far more of a humanitarian issue.

"Border Patrol Agents are not allowed to properly do their job at the Border because of ridiculous liberal (Democrat) laws like Catch & Release. Getting more dangerous. “Caravans” coming," Trump tweeted on Sunday. "Republicans must go to Nuclear Option to pass tough laws NOW. NO MORE DACA DEAL!"

The "caravans" he was referring to is an annual program run by an organization called Pueblo Sin Fronteras, which means "people without borders." Every year during Holy Week, the organization helps a group of Central American migrants make their journey from their homes in Central America, hoping to request (and receive) asylum in either Mexico or the U.S.

Pueblo Sin Fronteras is an immigrants rights group, and they don't rally people to make the dangerous journey north; instead, they help band people together in order to make the trip as safe as possible. By mobilizing people, the group also attempts to call for an end to gang violence in the region and to protect people from domestic violence and extortion. They build shelters along the migration routes and organize these caravans, all with the aim of protecting migrants and helping them to maintain their dignity.

The Refugee Caravan is made up of migrants who have already decided to flee their countries and who band together and organize for collective power to maintain their own safety, support... https://splinternews.com/a-refugee-caravan-is-headed-to-the-u-s-and-getting-big-1824087413 …

An estimated 1,500 migrants from Honduras, Guatemala, and El Salvador started a month-long journey on Sunday to the United States, where they intend to seek political asylum. Organizers say the...

Pueblo Sin Fronteras said that they wouldn't respond to Trump's vitriolic tweet, but they did tell CNN that the trek was "a movement made of people who were forced to flee their countries of origin due to persecution and violence."

While Trump's tweets on the subject imply — or at least allow readers to believe — that the migrants are coming from Mexico, CNN reports that they've actually only assembled in Mexico after leaving from their homes in Central America. Many of them come from Honduras, where a disputed election just sparked a wave of violent protests.

But the people aren't all Hondurans. The three countries that make up Central America's "Northern Triangle," (Honduras, El Salvador, and Guatemala), have all seen a lot of gang violence and crime over the past several years, making them some of the primary sources of immigration to the U.S., despite Trump's focus on Mexico. The people in this caravan aren't doing it for fun, according to CNN's reporting — their aim is to get away from the poverty, crime, and violence that they can't escape without leaving their home countries.

[Swordsmyth]

This "Caravan" is a humanitarian action initiated by Pueblo Sin Fronteras:

It is an invasion with a painted on smile.

[Zippyjuan]

https://www.denverpost.com/2018/04/02/donald-trump-caravan-tweets/

Fox and Friends is where Trump goes for all of his intelligence briefings.


The Fox News opinion segment was in response to a BuzzFeed report on Friday that more than a thousand Central Americans, primarily from Honduras, were winding their way up through Mexico to the U.S. border on a nearly month-long trip that began March 25. These migrants are looking to seek asylum from criminal elements back home ...

Moving in a large group is expected to blunt the efforts of criminal gangs and cartels known to isolate and later rob immigrants, many of whom bring large sums of money to make the long journey north through Mexico. The caravan organizers, Pueblos Sin Fronteras, or People without Borders, appeared to have concluded that it is safer for these people to travel together.

That trip can be deadly and is often dangerous for people finding their way along various routes that go directly north to Texas, northwestern routes that end up around Arizona or western paths along the coast that lead to California.

Just about every route is more than a thousand miles long and is canvassed by robbers and corrupt police alike shaking down Central Americans with little access to legal recourse.


Mexico is doing something – with the help of the United States. Hundreds of millions of dollars in aid flow to Mexico every year, including funds for strengthening its border with Guatemala, where migrants begin their path.

Billions in additional spending authorized by President Barack Obama in 2014 was prompted by thousands of unaccompanied minors arriving on the U.S.-Mexico border, mostly Central Americans fleeing horrific crime waves and economic crises in Honduras, El Savador and Guatemala. About 300,000 migrants were detained by Mexican authorities in the next two years.

Trump’s proposals to reduce aid to Mexico would raise the possibility that the country would be less able to stem flows of migrants and drugs coming across its border.

He has been caught in a contradiction of policy on the border before.

The budget for the U.S. Coast Guard stayed flat in 2018 despite spending increases across the Pentagon (the Coast Guard falls under the Department of Homeland Security). But the service seizes three times as much cocaine moving by sea as what U.S. agencies intercept at border checkpoints, putting a dent into Trump’s argument that a border wall would dry up hard drug supply in the United States.

[LibertyEagle]

I see the forum leftists (if not being politically-correct, I would say, Communists) are still hard at work.

[Zippyjuan]

Trump tweet: The US has no border protections. Mexico power is "absolute".


"Mexico has the absolute power not to let these large 'Caravans' of people enter their country. They must stop them at their Northern Border, which they can do because their border laws work, not allow them to pass through into our country, which has no effective border laws. Congress must immediately pass Border Legislation, use Nuclear Option if necessary, to stop the massive inflow of Drugs and People. Border Patrol Agents (and ICE) are GREAT, but the weak Dem laws don't allow them to do their job. Act now Congress, our country is being stolen!"

Of course if Trump decides to end any aid to Mexico or shut down NAFTA (which also involves Canada) Mexico could decide to let everybody freely pass through to the US.

https://www.dailydot.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/04/trump-caravan-2048x1024.jpg

[AuH20]

I see the forum leftists (if not being politically-correct, I would say, Communists) are still hard at work.

More misguided as opposed to communists. They want to make our community an even further marginalized group.

[AuH20]

I can hear the freedom from America. All that liberty and freedom is just oozing from their pores!

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-mexico-election-poll-exclusive/exclusive-mexican-leftist-has-18-point-lead-as-campaign-kicks-off-poll-idUSKCN1H90C1

[dannno]

I can hear the freedom from America. All that liberty and freedom is just oozing from their pores!

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-mexico-election-poll-exclusive/exclusive-mexican-leftist-has-18-point-lead-as-campaign-kicks-off-poll-idUSKCN1H90C1

Lol, they got four people running for Prez and no Mestizos? Is that normal?

[Swordsmyth]

I can hear the freedom from America. All that liberty and freedom is just oozing from their pores!

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-mexico-election-poll-exclusive/exclusive-mexican-leftist-has-18-point-lead-as-campaign-kicks-off-poll-idUSKCN1H90C1

BBBBBBBBut they will all vote LP if they come here.:rolleyes:

[DamianTV]

I'm getting sick of hearing the lie that all of the world's problems are America's fault, other countries have done plenty to cause their own problems.

Even if you think the empire is responsible for everything wrong in the world that doesn't mean American citizens should have to eat the consequences, those who cause the problems have harmed us enough already.

The end of the United States is planned.

The ways in which the United States is planned to end is both internal and external. The goal is to cause an emotional reaction to the US, which people do not think logically about. Once the US is gone, the Writers of History will only focus on how the US ended, and not how it started or why it started off so well. Facts will be excluded to alter the perception of future readers that the US only acquired its wealth and power by greed and covet means, and not say anything about the US being a Symbol of Freedom, where the common man had an opportunity to not only provide for themselves, but to thrive.

The US Govt is being construed as an Enemy to the people in order to incite either Civil War, or Collapse by voting in a new and more dangerous form of government that does not represent the people. We already know damn good and well the people are not represented by our government. A full scale collapse or regime change will only cement the replacement authority.

Never will the people told who the people are that truly plan and invoke the collapse of the most free nation in the world. Every good thing the US govt has ever done will be brandished as a mistake, while its actual mistakes will spotlighted for all to see how much of a failure the model of freedom is. There are many targets. Monetary takeover, which has already taken place. Physical takeover, by replacing the existing population that knows of the power of freedom with those that demand an ever increasing govt to provide for them. The destruction of the Reputation of the United States is a major tool in propaganda against freedom. The US is a Symbol that is a threat to dangerous dominant men, and their goal is not just the collapse of the US, but what the US represents. The Symbol of Freedom will be demonized until people only believe government is their only path to survival, as dismal and bleek as their futures will ever be without the Light of Liberty cast by the Symbol of Freedom and equality for all.

[Swordsmyth]

The end of the United States is planned.

The ways in which the United States is planned to end is both internal and external. The goal is to cause an emotional reaction to the US, which people do not think logically about. Once the US is gone, the Writers of History will only focus on how the US ended, and not how it started or why it started off so well. Facts will be excluded to alter the perception of future readers that the US only acquired its wealth and power by greed and covet means, and not say anything about the US being a Symbol of Freedom, where the common man had an opportunity to not only provide for themselves, but to thrive.

The US Govt is being construed as an Enemy to the people in order to incite either Civil War, or Collapse by voting in a new and more dangerous form of government that does not represent the people. We already know damn good and well the people are not represented by our government. A full scale collapse or regime change will only cement the replacement authority.

Never will the people told who the people are that truly plan and invoke the collapse of the most free nation in the world. Every good thing the US govt has ever done will be brandished as a mistake, while its actual mistakes will spotlighted for all to see how much of a failure the model of freedom is. There are many targets. Monetary takeover, which has already taken place. Physical takeover, by replacing the existing population that knows of the power of freedom with those that demand an ever increasing govt to provide for them. The destruction of the Reputation of the United States is a major tool in propaganda against freedom. The US is a Symbol that is a threat to dangerous dominant men, and their goal is not just the collapse of the US, but what the US represents. The Symbol of Freedom will be demonized until people only believe government is their only path to survival, as dismal and bleek as their futures will ever be without the Light of Liberty cast by the Symbol of Freedom and equality for all.

And many members here are wittingly or unwittingly accomplices to that plan.

[Raginfridus]

The end of the United States is planned.No, it isn't.


And many members here are wittingly or unwittingly accomplices to that plan.They must be punished.

[AuH20]

The end of the United States is planned.

The ways in which the United States is planned to end is both internal and external. The goal is to cause an emotional reaction to the US, which people do not think logically about. Once the US is gone, the Writers of History will only focus on how the US ended, and not how it started or why it started off so well. Facts will be excluded to alter the perception of future readers that the US only acquired its wealth and power by greed and covet means, and not say anything about the US being a Symbol of Freedom, where the common man had an opportunity to not only provide for themselves, but to thrive.

The US Govt is being construed as an Enemy to the people in order to incite either Civil War, or Collapse by voting in a new and more dangerous form of government that does not represent the people. We already know damn good and well the people are not represented by our government. A full scale collapse or regime change will only cement the replacement authority.

Never will the people told who the people are that truly plan and invoke the collapse of the most free nation in the world. Every good thing the US govt has ever done will be brandished as a mistake, while its actual mistakes will spotlighted for all to see how much of a failure the model of freedom is. There are many targets. Monetary takeover, which has already taken place. Physical takeover, by replacing the existing population that knows of the power of freedom with those that demand an ever increasing govt to provide for them. The destruction of the Reputation of the United States is a major tool in propaganda against freedom. The US is a Symbol that is a threat to dangerous dominant men, and their goal is not just the collapse of the US, but what the US represents. The Symbol of Freedom will be demonized until people only believe government is their only path to survival, as dismal and bleek as their futures will ever be without the Light of Liberty cast by the Symbol of Freedom and equality for all.

The US must usher in global government first, before it is finally sacrificed. You always hear the progs talking about the US leading the global order. The dismal future we're heading to must erase any residue of rugged individualism.

[Swordsmyth]

The US must usher in global government first, before it is finally sacrificed. You always hear the progs talking about the US leading the global order. The dismal future we're heading too must erase any residue of rugged individualism.

China is being considered as a replacement and the EU is auditioning for the part, fortunately neither one is up to the task, there will be more wars and schisms in the elite before we get close to world government.

[Raginfridus]

https://image.ibb.co/gtj7px/hagee1.jpg...

[pcosmar]

I see the forum leftists (if not being politically-correct, I would say, Communists) are still hard at work.

I don't see communists as a threat (if the mythical thing existed),, but there are a lot of socialists in both parties.. some use the rhetoric,, and the others change the wording. and a lot of confused fascists.

ALL of them Authoritarian. Liberty is the minority.

but if I have to choose between Commie Socialism,, or Fascist Socialism,,, well,, I'm not going to play.

I don't think it really matters in the end who is running the Police State.. I'm not going to play.nice

[goldenequity]

Trump Pushing For Nafta Deal In Next Two Weeks
https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-04-02/trump-pushing-nafta-deal-next-two-weeks

gee... why the rush? :D

[Swordsmyth]

Trump Pushing For Nafta Deal In Next Two Weeks
https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-04-02/trump-pushing-nafta-deal-next-two-weeks

gee... why the rush? :D

He also threatened to kill NAFTA if Mexico doesn't do something about border security.

I don't think a deal can be made.

[goldenequity]

He also threatened to kill NAFTA if Mexico doesn't do something about border security.

I don't think a deal can be made.

Fine. Bi-Lateral agreements only... from scratch with some tight clauses and teeth.

[Swordsmyth]

Fine. Bi-Lateral agreements only... from scratch with some tight clauses and teeth.

Yup.

[Zippyjuan]

If you keep walking away from negotiated treaties, countries will be less willing to negotiate new ones with you.

[pcosmar]

If you keep walking away from negotiated treaties, countries will be less willing to negotiate new ones with you.

That might be a good thing.

[Swordsmyth]

If you keep walking away from negotiated treaties, countries will be less willing to negotiate new ones with you.

That is a good thing right now, we need less treaties not more.

[spudea]

Big if true. Looks like Mexico may inforce their laws after all. This is from the reporter traveling with the caravan.

980973431180156929

[RonZeplin]

https://www.dailydot.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/04/trump-caravan-2048x1024.jpg

Lies, and more lies. The tweets are nonsense. President Trump has two basic powers to keep them from invading.

1) US Constitution, Article IV Section 4 -- "Protect the States against invasion". The Militia, paid (organized) or unpaid (unorganized), take your pick and obey your oath of office as Commander In Chief.

2) Immigration Law -- Illegal aliens are to be deported, do it!

Quit lying and do the job that you swore an oath to do Trump! No legislative action is required at all, just pull your head out of your ass and get to it.

[Danke]

https://youtu.be/rZwsG5tuVfU

[johnwk]

See: Annual ‘Caravan’ of Central-American Asylum Seekers – Heading to U.S.-Mexico Border – Sparks Trump’s Concern (http://ktla.com/2018/04/02/immigrant-caravan-heading-to-u-s-mexico-border-sparks-trumps-concern/)


April 2nd, 2018


”Alex Mensing, one of the US collaborators who works for Pueblo Sin Fronteras, started in the city of Tapachula, which is located in the state of Chiapas, Mexico, and borders Guatemala. The caravan of about 1,100 people is currently in Oaxaca, Mexico, about 420 miles from their starting point. Mensing said the migrants would turn themselves in and request asylum.


Pueblo Sin Fronteras said they would not respond to Trump's tweet, but stated that the refugee caravan "is a movement made of people who were forced to flee their countries of origin due to persecution and violence."


Note: that Pueblo Sin Fronteras means people without borders.


Keep in mind our Constitution is the Supreme Law of the Land. The fact is, our federal government is specifically charged with power:


”To provide for calling forth the Militia to execute the Laws of the Union, suppress Insurrections and repel Invasions” See Article 1, Section 8, Clause 15



As President, and in compliance with our federal government’s duty to protect the United States against invasions, Trump should immediately call out the National Guard, place them on the border, block these invaders, and protect the United States against this pending invasion. To not block these invaders at our border and allow them entry into the United States will, by default, entitle them to stay while a long legal process takes place which essentially allows them to stay and burden American Citizens with the costs of their economic needs: food, shelter, clothing, public schooling, medical attention, including the costs of females giving birth.


It’s time for President Trump to nip this madness in the bud, and do what is right for America’s citizens.



JWK



American citizens are sick and tired of being made into tax-slaves to finance the economic needs of millions of poverty stricken, poorly educated, low and unskilled aliens who have invaded America borders.

[johnwk]

This is a thread about the Resident's responsibility to enforce the law.



As Commander in Chief, President Trump can exercise established emergency powers over our military and order them into action if, in his judgement, the common defense and general welfare of the United States are in jeopardy. In doing so, he must inform Congress within 48 hours of taking such action, and the troops cannot be committed for more than 60 days, unless Congress approves a longer time period. The President can also exercise an additional 30 days to re-deploy the troops.

It’s time for President Trump to exercise his powers as Commander in Chief, and protect the United States and her citizens from this annual caravan invasion.

JWK


There was a time not too long ago in New York when the able-bodied were ashamed to accept home relief, a program created by Franklin D. Roosevelt in 1931 when he was Governor. Now, New York City and many other major cities are infested with countless government cheese factions from poverty stricken countries, who not only demand welfare, but use it to buy beer, wine, drugs, sex, and Lotto tickets.

[Zippyjuan]

See: Annual ‘Caravan’ of Central-American Asylum Seekers – Heading to U.S.-Mexico Border – Sparks Trump’s Concern (http://ktla.com/2018/04/02/immigrant-caravan-heading-to-u-s-mexico-border-sparks-trumps-concern/)


April 2nd, 2018


”Alex Mensing, one of the US collaborators who works for Pueblo Sin Fronteras, started in the city of Tapachula, which is located in the state of Chiapas, Mexico, and borders Guatemala. The caravan of about 1,100 people is currently in Oaxaca, Mexico, about 420 miles from their starting point. Mensing said the migrants would turn themselves in and request asylum.


Pueblo Sin Fronteras said they would not respond to Trump's tweet, but stated that the refugee caravan "is a movement made of people who were forced to flee their countries of origin due to persecution and violence."


Note: that Pueblo Sin Fronteras means people without borders.


Keep in mind our Constitution is the Supreme Law of the Land. The fact is, our federal government is specifically charged with power:


”To provide for calling forth the Militia to execute the Laws of the Union, suppress Insurrections and repel Invasions” See Article 1, Section 8, Clause 15



As President, and in compliance with our federal government’s duty to protect the United States against invasions, Trump should immediately call out the National Guard, place them on the border, block these invaders, and protect the United States against this pending invasion. To not block these invaders at our border and allow them entry into the United States will, by default, entitle them to stay while a long legal process takes place which essentially allows them to stay and burden American Citizens with the costs of their economic needs: food, shelter, clothing, public schooling, medical attention, including the costs of females giving birth.


It’s time for President Trump to nip this madness in the bud, and do what is right for America’s citizens.



JWK



American citizens are sick and tired of being made into tax-slaves to finance the economic needs of millions of poverty stricken, poorly educated, low and unskilled aliens who have invaded America borders.



So we should sent our military into Mexico. Invade yet another foreign country.

[dannno]

So we should sent our military into Mexico. Invade yet another foreign country.


Trump succeeded in using diplomacy:


Big if true. Looks like Mexico may inforce their laws after all. This is from the reporter traveling with the caravan.

980973431180156929

[Swordsmyth]

So we should sent our military into Mexico. Invade yet another foreign country.
No, we just need to patrol the border and keep them out.

[Ender]

No, we just need to patrol the border and keep them out.

Which will also lead to keeping us in.

[Swordsmyth]

Which will also lead to keeping us in.

If the troops are on the border then they can't be used to tyrannize us, a wall would allow more of them to be stationed in the rest of the country.
If you are worried about tyranny then you should want the military reduced but the remaining troops should be on the border.

[Zippyjuan]

If the troops are on the border then they can't be used to tyrannize us, a wall would allow more of them to be stationed in the rest of the country.

If you are worried about tyranny then you should want the military reduced but the remaining troops should be on the border.

Wanna bet?


If you are worried about tyranny then you should want the military reduced

Trump like military. Too much is not enough. He wants a huge parade to show it off like those other countries with dictators do.

The military can solve everything.

[Swordsmyth]

Wanna bet?
Sure.




Trump like military. Too much is not enough. He wants a huge parade to show it off like those other countries with dictators do.

The military can solve everything.

Trump is not the issue here, the military belongs on the border, it is the size of the military that is the danger.

[PierzStyx]

It's not just human trafficking, it's an invasion.

A4S4: The United States shall guarantee to every State in this Union a Republican (https://usconstitution.net/glossary.html#REPUBLIC) Form of Government, and shall protect each of them against Invasion;

Unable to lie and twist Article 1, Section 9 I see you've turned to trying to lie and twist another part of the Constitution to fit your Fascist ideals.

http://bolenreport.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/12/1984a.jpg

Maybe we should add "Immigration is Invasion" to the list. It is just pure Orwellian doublespeak, designed to obfuscate the truth, deceive the people, and justify oppression and violation of liberty.

Oh, and anyone who thinks 1,200 people constitutes "an army" is just an idiot. Modern day urban high schools have on average three times that number in students alone. You fearmongers are so pathetic.

[goldenequity]

981259962717388801


Trump gave Assange's tweet #1 spot on his twitter account

981260084360523776

[johnwk]

See: Annual ‘Caravan’ of Central-American Asylum Seekers – Heading to U.S.-Mexico Border – Sparks Trump’s Concern (http://ktla.com/2018/04/02/immigrant-caravan-heading-to-u-s-mexico-border-sparks-trumps-concern/)


April 2nd, 2018


”Alex Mensing, one of the US collaborators who works for Pueblo Sin Fronteras, started in the city of Tapachula, which is located in the state of Chiapas, Mexico, and borders Guatemala. The caravan of about 1,100 people is currently in Oaxaca, Mexico, about 420 miles from their starting point. Mensing said the migrants would turn themselves in and request asylum.


Pueblo Sin Fronteras said they would not respond to Trump's tweet, but stated that the refugee caravan "is a movement made of people who were forced to flee their countries of origin due to persecution and violence."


Note: that Pueblo Sin Fronteras means people without borders.


Keep in mind our Constitution is the Supreme Law of the Land. The fact is, our federal government is specifically charged with power:


”To provide for calling forth the Militia to execute the Laws of the Union, suppress Insurrections and repel Invasions” See Article 1, Section 8, Clause 15



As President, and in compliance with our federal government’s duty to protect the United States against invasions, Trump should immediately call out the National Guard, place them on the border, block these invaders, and protect the United States against this pending invasion. To not block these invaders at our border and allow them entry into the United States will, by default, entitle them to stay while a long legal process takes place which essentially allows them to stay and burden American Citizens with the costs of their economic needs: food, shelter, clothing, public schooling, medical attention, including the costs of females giving birth.


It’s time for President Trump to nip this madness in the bud, and do what is right for America’s citizens.



JWK



American citizens are sick and tired of being made into tax-slaves to finance the economic needs of millions of poverty stricken, poorly educated, low and unskilled aliens who have invaded America borders.






So we should sent our military into Mexico. Invade yet another foreign country.



You are the only one suggesting to send our military into Mexico.


Does it bother you that Trump may actually protect our border? If it does, GOOD!


JWK




American citizens are sick and tired of being made into tax-slaves to finance the economic needs of millions of poverty stricken, poorly educated, low and unskilled aliens who have invaded America borders.

[dannno]

So we should sent our military into Mexico. Invade yet another foreign country.

The border is in Mexico?

[aGameOfThrones]

The border is in Mexico?

https://year13.com.au/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/2dqoysk.gif

[timosman]

The border is in Mexico?

Zippy likes strawmen. ;)

[PierzStyx]

If the troops are on the border then they can't be used to tyrannize us, a wall would allow more of them to be stationed in the rest of the country.


What do you call it when you live in a place surrounded by walls with people who will shoot you for trying to pass through those walls and you have no freedom to choose who you will associate with, and everyone has to belong to one of the gangs in order to survive?

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/a/ae/Clinton_correctional_facility%2C_Dannemora%2C_NY%2 C_2007.jpg/1024px-Clinton_correctional_facility%2C_Dannemora%2C_NY%2 C_2007.jpg


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=esp-ruhkZqQ

[Swordsmyth]

A giant caravan of Central American migrants illegally crossing through Mexico, in the hopes of illegally crossing into the U.S., has ground to a halt as over a thousand migrants begin their fourth day camped out at a Mexican sports arena.

“We’re in limbo,” said one asylum seeker camped outside of the center - surrounded by garbage bags full of trash and rolled up mattresses.

Organizers admit they were taken aback by both the size of this year’s caravan—which has been a periodic ritual since 2010—and the attention it has received. They also admit their original plan of making their way to the U.S. border has likely changed. -Wall St. Journal (http://archive.is/G36x2)
“We cannot arrive to the border with 1,000 people. The group is too large, we never had seen this amount of people before,” said organizer Irineo Mujica, adding that previous caravans had about 300 people.
Meanwhile, Mexican foreign minister Luis Videgaray tweeted on Tuesday that the caravan had "disbanded," despite appearing largely intact on Wednesday - albeit not moving.

La caravana “Víacrucis del Migrante” se dispersó gradualmente por decisión de sus participantes. La política migratoria mexicana se ejerce de manera soberana y conforme a derecho, y no a partir de presiones o amenazas externas.
— Luis Videgaray Caso (@LVidegaray) April 3, 2018 (https://twitter.com/LVidegaray/status/981292845125419008?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) Mexican authorities have already deported (https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-04-04/daily-dose-irony-mexico-deports-400-caravan-marchers-entering-country-illegally) approximately 400 marchers, while the rest will be given either a 20-day transit visa through Mexico to return home, or a 30-day humanitarian visa for those who want to apply for asylum in Mexico.

Everyone else was encouraged to take a humanitarian visa in Mexico, a document allowing them to travel in Mexico for 10 to 20 days, or document giving them permission to stay in the country for 30 days to file an immigration claim. They will not go beyond Mexico City.
— Adolfo Flores (@aflores) April 3, 2018 (https://twitter.com/aflores/status/981296315907887104?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) Not so fast...
Reports are also coming in that several hundred caravan members boarded "The Beast" train in Central Mexico, while the rest of the caravan forged ahead.

A few hundred of the Hondureño migrant’s Caravan boarded “The Beast” train �� in central Mexico ����. The rest of the caravan continued on their quest to USA ���� borders by foot or other transportation methods -man in the video says! @realDonaldTrump (https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) @FoxNews (https://twitter.com/FoxNews?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) #StopTheCaravan (https://twitter.com/hashtag/StopTheCaravan?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) pic.twitter.com/gO08XTTpCv (https://t.co/gO08XTTpCv)
— Marco Gutierrez (@MarcoGutierrez) April 4, 2018 (https://twitter.com/MarcoGutierrez/status/981602667691622400?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) Some in the United States think the notion of Central American refugees seeking asylum in the United States after passing through Mexico is laughable - considering Mexico's "working" asylum system.

Mark Kirkorian, director of the Center for Immigration Studies, a Washington-based think tank that favors more immigration restrictions, said that any migrant from Honduran who tries to enter the U.S. from Mexico should forfeit their claim to be seeking asylum. -WSJ
“I’m sorry, but you are not seeking refuge from persecution if you are passing through 1,000 miles of Mexico, a country that has a working asylum system, and trying to reach the U.S.,” Mr. Kirkorian said.

More at: https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-04-04/were-limbo-migrant-caravan-stalls-out-mexico-organizers-admit-defeat

[johnwk]

What do you call it when you live in a place surrounded by walls with people who will shoot you for trying to pass through those walls and you have no freedom to choose who you will associate with, and everyone has to belong to one of the gangs in order to survive?




What do you call it when someone breaks into your home and rapes your daughter?


When you start allowing anyone to enter your home and take advantage of your accommodations, get back to us, or give it a freaken break pal.


JWK



There was a time not too long ago in New York when the able-bodied were ashamed to accept home relief, a program created by Franklin D. Roosevelt in 1931 when he was Governor. Now, New York City and many other major cities are infested with countless government cheese factions from poverty stricken countries, who not only demand welfare, but use it to buy beer, wine, drugs, sex, and Lotto tickets.

[Raginfridus]

What do you call it when someone breaks into your home and rapes your daughter?


When you start allowing anyone to enter your home and take advantage of your accommodations, get back to us, or give it a freaken break pal.


JWK



There was a time not too long ago in New York when the able-bodied were ashamed to accept home relief, a program created by Franklin D. Roosevelt in 1931 when he was Governor. Now, New York City and many other major cities are infested with countless government cheese factions from poverty stricken countries, who not only demand welfare, but use it to buy beer, wine, drugs, sex, and Lotto tickets.

If somebody broke into your house and raped your daughter, you would give the IRS your money to build a fetishistic boondoggle?

[Ender]

PierzStyx


What do you call it when you live in a place surrounded by walls with people who will shoot you for trying to pass through those walls and you have no freedom to choose who you will associate with, and everyone has to belong to one of the gangs in order to survive?

East Berlin.

[TheCount]

What do you call it when someone breaks into your home and rapes your daughter?

What do you call it when you can't tell the difference between a rapist and your daughter's boyfriend?

[Danke]

Israel built walls and they can travel freely...

[axiomata]

What do you call it when you can't tell the difference between a rapist and your daughter's boyfriend?

Homicide

[Ender]

Israel built walls and they can travel freely...

Unless they're Palestinians.

[Danke]

Unless they're Palestinians.


Correct.

[r3volution 3.0]

...a literal army of migrants

...This is an army.


...it's an invasion.

A disorderly gaggle of wanna-be tomato pickers is as much an army as the several hundred thousand Prussian fellows who entered France in 1870 were tourists, though it is understandable that the tweeters and tubers and so forth whose nationalistic doomporn you're parroting would want to thus abuse the English language for the purpose of increasing advertising revenue.


Even if it were true bringing in a a horde of leftist barbarians will only make things worse.

There is no important difference between a socialist rabble and a nationalist rabble.

They are equally ignorant and dangerous, and no sensible person ought to be be aligning himself with either.

[Origanalist]

What do you call it when someone breaks into your home and rapes your daughter?


When you start allowing anyone to enter your home and take advantage of your accommodations, get back to us, or give it a freaken break pal.


JWK



There was a time not too long ago in New York when the able-bodied were ashamed to accept home relief, a program created by Franklin D. Roosevelt in 1931 when he was Governor. Now, New York City and many other major cities are infested with countless government cheese factions from poverty stricken countries, who not only demand welfare, but use it to buy beer, wine, drugs, sex, and Lotto tickets.



Did a beaner break into your house and rape your daughter? How horrible.

[Swordsmyth]

What do you call it when you live in a place surrounded by walls with people who will shoot you for trying to pass through those walls and you have no freedom to choose who you will associate with, and everyone has to belong to one of the gangs in order to survive?

Earth.
Also the natural outcome of Anarchy.
The best you can do is claim an area, establish liberty inside it and then defend it against enemies foreign and domestic.

[Swordsmyth]

A disorderly gaggle of wanna-be tomato pickers is as much an army as the several hundred thousand Prussian fellows who entered France in 1870 were tourists, though it is understandable that the tweeters and tubers and so forth whose nationalistic doomporn you're parroting would want to thus abuse the English language for the purpose of increasing advertising revenue.



There is no important difference between a socialist rabble and a nationalist rabble.

They are equally ignorant and dangerous, and no sensible person ought to be be aligning himself with either.

Tell it to Mexico about the Texans.

[Danke]

Earth.
Also the natural outcome of Anarchy.
The best you can do is claim an area, establish liberty inside it and then defend it against enemies foreign and domestic.

if they don't invade my pocketbook, then I'll just call them visitors.

[Ender]

Tell it to Mexico about the Texans.

So, question:

Do you believe it was right for Europe to give Israel back to the Jews?

[r3volution 3.0]

Tell it to Mexico about the Texans.

You believe that this immigrant group, once settled here, would be in a position to fight and defeat the US Army and secede?

...nevermind whether they'd have any interest in doing so.

[Swordsmyth]

So, question:

Do you believe it was right for Europe to give Israel back to the Jews?

You know my position on that already.

[Danke]

So, question:

Do you believe it was right for Europe to give Israel back to the Jews?

"back"?

[Ender]

"back"?

That's the PC thinking, I believe.

[Ender]

You know my position on that already.

No, tell me.

[Swordsmyth]

You believe that this immigrant group, once settled here, would be in a position to military defeat the US Army?

If we let in anyone who wants to come in without limits it is possible, especially if/when a monetary crisis/collapse/civil war happens.

[Swordsmyth]

No, tell me.

It was none of Europe's business, they never should have occupied the area,WWI and WWII were travesties.
The situation is complex because the Arabs agreed to give the Jews a homeland in return for Jewish financing of the Arab revolt but there are no clean hands and nobody is right.

[r3volution 3.0]

If we let in anyone who wants to come in without limits it is possible, especially if/when a monetary crisis/collapse/civil war happens.

So your main concern is mestizos seceding in the event of a social collapse caused by the policies supported by native voters?

[Swordsmyth]

So you're main concern is mestizos seceding in the event of a social collapse caused by native, largely white voters?

My main concern is illegals and their anchor-babies voting Demoncrat and causing social collapse, then there is the crime they bring and the jobs they steal, THEN comes their "Reconquista".

[johnwk]

If somebody broke into your house and raped your daughter, you would give the IRS your money to build a fetishistic boondoggle?

Only a weirdo, who can think up something like that, would do what you have suggested.


JWK


.

The unavoidable truth is, our social democrat political leaders’ plan for “free” college tuition will be paid for by confiscating the paychecks of millions of college graduates who worked for and paid their own way through college and are now trying to finance their own economic needs.

[Zippyjuan]

My main concern is illegals and their anchor-babies voting Demoncrat and causing social collapse, then there is the crime they bring and the jobs they steal, THEN comes their "Reconquista".

1) illegals can't vote
2) Hispanic voter turnout is far below that of white voters.

[Swordsmyth]

1) illegals can't vote
THEY DO, I guess you think there are no school shootings because it is a "gun free zone".

2) Hispanic voter turnout is far below that of white voters.
In an already divided country it doesn't take a majority to swing an election.

[johnwk]

Did a beaner break into your house and rape your daughter? How horrible.

I'm confident that would never happen, and for several reasons, one being I have a 6" grouping at 75 feet.


JWK





Without a Fifth Column Media, Yellow Journalism, Hollywood, and a corrupted FBI, Loretta Lynch, Hillary Clinton and Barack Hussein Obama, would be making license tags in a federal penitentiary

[r3volution 3.0]

My main concern is illegals and their anchor-babies voting Demoncrat and causing social collapse

What's the budget deficit going to be this year...?

It's obvious to anyone who cares to see that a GOP controlled government is not smaller than a Democrat controlled government.

As I said, there's no important difference a socialist rabble and a nationalist rabble (and they tend to overlap anyway).


jobs they steal

Jobs are property?

...silly me, I thought they were a matter of contract.

How long shall the person who "steals" my job, who my employer prefers to employ because he is more productive, spend in prison for his crime?

*any bolshevik could (and does) speak of the same "theft" of jobs; he'd just put in class rather than racial terms (same nonsense)

[Zippyjuan]

THEY DO, I guess you think there are no school shootings because it is a "gun free zone".



You are right. There was that one person they found who did. She voted Republican in 2012. Couldn't find others though.


In an already divided country it doesn't take a majority to swing an election.

Also true. Trump didn't even win the popular vote and still got the job.

[Zippyjuan]

http://articles.latimes.com/2012/feb/01/news/la-pn-ron-paul-nevada-latino-forum-20120201

Ron Paul.


"I believe Hispanics have been used as scapegoats, to say, they're the problem instead of being a symptom maybe of a problem with the welfare state," Paul told the group. "In Nazi Germany they had to have scapegoats to blame and they turned on the Jews.


"Now there's a lot of antagonism and resentment turned just automatically on immigrants," he continued. "You say, no not immigrants, it's just illegal immigrants. I do believe in legal immigration. I want to have a provision to obey those laws. You have to understand this in the context of the economy."

Paul said he's not one of those politicians who believes that "barbed-wire fences and guns on our border will solve any of our problems." That's not, he said, the American way. And he doesn't think that a national identification card is the way to go.

What the country does need, he said, is "a much better immigration service" fed by more resources. Not that he'd "vote for extra money." But he does, he told the crowd, have a plan.

[Danke]

THEY DO, I guess you think there are no school shootings because it is a "gun free zone".

In an already divided country it doesn't take a majority to swing an election.

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Swordsmyth again.

[Swordsmyth]

What's the budget deficit going to be this year...?

It's obvious to anyone who cares to see that a GOP controlled government is not smaller than a Democrat controlled government.

As I said, there's no important difference a socialist rabble and a nationalist rabble (and they tend to overlap anyway).
RINO's are closet Demoncrats, if the Demoncrats didn't hold so many seats the RINO's wouldn't have the excuse to "compromise" and would be vulnerable to primary contests or 3rd parties.

RINOs are bad but Demoncrats in control of all three branches are much worse.




Jobs are property?

...silly me, I thought they were a matter of contract.

How long shall the person who "steals" my job, who my employer prefers to employ because he is more productive, spend in prison for his crime?

*any bolshevik could (and does) speak of the same "theft" of jobs; he'd just put in class rather than racial terms (same nonsense)
Jobs are opportunity, those opportunities are not legally theirs.

[AuH20]

http://articles.latimes.com/2012/feb/01/news/la-pn-ron-paul-nevada-latino-forum-20120201

Ron Paul.

Those 'scapegoats' will have a majority soon and their consensus will be driving us further over the cliff. Look at the elections in Central America and Mexico. Raving lunatic socialists at the top of the ticket that make America's look mild.

[Swordsmyth]

http://articles.latimes.com/2012/feb/01/news/la-pn-ron-paul-nevada-latino-forum-20120201

Ron Paul.

Well, I start off with saying that it`s a big problem. I don`t like to get involved with the Federal Government very much, (http://www.google.com/search?ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&sourceid=deskbar&q=site%3Alewrockwell.com+ron+paul+federal) but I do think it is a federal responsibility (http://www.vdare.com/archives/2007/09/06/republican-debate-giuliani-claims-his-sanctuary-policies-were-in-response-to-federal-failure/)to protect our borders....And that`s why I don`t think our border guards should be sent to Iraq, like we`ve done. I think we need more border guards. But to have the money and the personnel, we have to bring our troops home from Iraq. Ron Paul


More at: http://www.vdare.com/articles/ron-pa...al-sovereignty (http://www.vdare.com/articles/ron-paul-i-believe-in-national-sovereignty)

Totally free immigration! I`ve never taken that position...Well, you work on both. The most important is the welfare state, but you can still beef up your borders (http://www.vdare.com/articles/the-future-that-works-despite-dubya-illegal-immigration-can-be-controlled)and get rid of some incentives for illegals. (http://www.vdare.com/articles/national-data-by-edwin-s-rubenstein-307)...Ron Paul


More at: http://www.vdare.com/articles/ron-pa...al-sovereignty (http://www.vdare.com/articles/ron-paul-i-believe-in-national-sovereignty)

[Zippyjuan]

Those 'scapegoats' will have a majority soon and their consensus will be driving us further over the cliff. Look at the elections in Central America and Mexico. Raving lunatic socialists at the top of the ticket that make America's look mild.

According to projections, even by 2065 (almost 50 years from now) Whites will be twice as numerous as Hispanics. It is the Asians you need to watch out for. They are the fastest growing group these days (and top Hispanics in both legal and illegal immigration). Another thing to take into account is that the more generations immigrants are in the country, the more they become like everybody else.

http://assets.pewresearch.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/12/2015/10/FT_15.10.05_USin2065_420px.png

[Swordsmyth]

Another thing to take into account is that the more generations immigrants are in the country, the more they become like everybody else.

And the more everybody else becomes like them.

[r3volution 3.0]

RINO's are closet Demoncrats

If by "RINO's" you mean the entire Republican Party save Rand Paul and half a dozen other guys, yea.

QED (about them being the same)


if the Demoncrats didn't hold so many seats the RINO's wouldn't have the excuse to "compromise" and would be vulnerable to primary contests or 3rd parties.

The GOP promotes ever bigger government because that's what the overwhelmingly majority of the base wants.

Even if a handful of them (like former Ron Paul supporters) say they want smaller government, they're easily lured by nationalism or other distractions (culture war, ISIS!). The key thing to understand about any party, in any democracy, is that 99% of the voters have not the foggiest clue what's going on and simply react to the infantile propaganda they're fed. There is no great liberty-loving faction in America, or anywhere else, and there never was, or ever will be. A liberal politician winning is a function of his skill at manipulating essentially indifferent (if not actively illiberal) voters into voting for him through sheer force of personality (Ron), if not pure dumb luck. Whereas, socialism and nationalism, the true religions of the people, will always do well at the polls.


RINOs are bad but Demoncrats in control of all three branches are much worse.

So sayeth Mitch McConnell.


Jobs are opportunity, those opportunities are not legally theirs.

You didn't answer my question:

If my employer chooses to fire me and hire someone else, how long should my replacement spend in prison for his theft?

Or how much should he pay through a civil action?

[Superfluous Man]

And the more everybody else becomes like them.

Which is their right.

[johnwk]

SEE: Trump signs proclamation authorizing National Guard to southern border (http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/trump-signs-proclamation-ordering-national-guard-southern-border/story?id=54242454)

Apr 4, 2018, 7:33 PM ET

”Wednesday evening, a senior administration official said the president had signed a proclamation authorizing the National Guard to assist the border patrol.”

Thank you President Trump

JWK



American citizens are sick and tired of being made into tax-slaves to finance a maternity ward for the poverty stricken populations of other countries who invade America’s borders to give birth.

[AuH20]

And the more everybody else becomes like them.

I could not care less what color they are. Their culture is wholly incompatible with libertarianism or any type of conservative thought. That's what really sticks in my craw. Much of the demographic polling shows how 'progressive' Hispanics are. They are largely anti-2nd Amendment and hostile to free market principles as well as the Bill of Rights.

[Superfluous Man]

If by "RINO's" you mean the entire Republican Party save Rand Paul and half a dozen other guys, yea.


Yeah, I really don't understand the term RINO.

If RINO means Republican in name only, then the very people that label should be applied to are the ones who, like Rand Paul, put principle over party. And the establishment shills should be castigated precisely for *not* being RINOs.

[Superfluous Man]

I could care less what color they are.

Oh.

Then who was the "us" you mentioned in post 223 who will eventually no longer be in the majority? Right-handed people?

[r3volution 3.0]

Yeah, I really don't understand the term RINO.

If RINO means Republican in name only, then the very people that label should be applied to are the ones who, like Rand Paul, put principle over party. And the establishment shills should be castigated precisely for *not* being RINOs.

That very sensible analysis is at least 30 syllables too long to impact the average voter.

[AuH20]

Oh.

Then who was the "us" you mentioned in post 223 who will eventually no longer be in the majority? Right-handed people?

Americans who don't hail from the southern lands.

[Swordsmyth]

Which is their right.

But it isn't a right of the foreigners to come here and influence the natives, doubly so for illegals.
We have a right to limit foreign influence on our politics through immigration.

[r3volution 3.0]

But it isn't a right of the foreigners to come here and influence the natives, doubly so for illegals.
We have a right to limit foreign influence on our politics through immigration.

"We" have no right to participate in politics (i.e. highly organized crime) at all.

This is not a corporation; you are not a shareholder.

Voting to seize your neighbor's property or restrict his enjoyment of it (restrict his right to contract, etc) is not a right.

The only purpose of politics (which is a regrettable necessity) is to protect property rights.

Anything that better protects property rights is good; anything that impairs property rights is bad.

If you, let alone the mestizos, voting does the latter (as it invariably does), that is bad.

[Swordsmyth]

If by "RINO's" you mean the entire Republican Party save Rand Paul and half a dozen other guys, yea.

QED (about them being the same)

There are RINOs and there are less than perfect Republicans and then there are liberty candidates like Rand.




The GOP promotes ever bigger government because that's what the overwhelmingly majority of the base wants.

Even if a handful of them (like former Ron Paul supporters) say they want smaller government, they're easily lured by nationalism or other distractions (culture war, ISIS!). The key thing to understand about any party, in any democracy, is that 99% of the voters have not the foggiest clue what's going on and simply react to the infantile propaganda they're fed. There is no great liberty-loving faction in America, or anywhere else, and there never was, or ever will be. A liberal politician winning is a function of his skill at manipulating essentially indifferent (if not actively illiberal) voters into voting for him through sheer force of personality (Ron), if not pure dumb luck. Whereas, socialism and nationalism, the true religions of the people, will always do well at the polls.
The people want less government until they are lead astray, too many are easily swayed by appeals to emotion and therefore we need liberty candidates that can appeal to their emotions.

P.S. there is no liberty without enough nationalism to protect it.



So sayeth Mitch McConnell.
So sayeth the Demoncrats, they trumpet their communism these days.




You didn't answer my question:

If my employer chooses to fire me and hire someone else, how long should my replacement spend in prison for his theft?

Or how much should he pay through a civil action?

If he is here legally he didn't steal anything, all Americans and those we grant the privilege of coming here have an equal right to try for the opportunities here.

[Swordsmyth]

"We" have no right to participate in politics (i.e. highly organized crime) at all.

This is not a corporation; you are not a shareholder.

Voting to seize your neighbor's property or restrict his enjoyment of it (restrict his right to contract, etc) is not a right.

The only purpose of politics (which is a regrettable necessity) is to protect property rights.

Anything that better protects property rights is good; anything that impairs property rights is bad.

If you, let alone the mestizos, voting does the latter (as it invariably does), that is bad.

Immigration and politics are a property rights issue, we've had this conversation before so I won't go any deeper than this:
My liberty is my property and I have a right to defend it from foreigners who would come here and vote to take it away, the fact that I already have to deal with domestic enemies only makes the foreign threat worse.

[r3volution 3.0]

There are RINOs and there are less than perfect Republicans and then there are liberty candidates like Rand.

And the weighted average results in massive spending increases and no meaningful reforms of any kind.


The people want less government until they are lead astray, too many are easily swayed by appeals to emotion and therefore we need liberty candidates that can appeal to their emotions.

So you acknowledge that they are led by emotion, not reason?


P.S. there is no liberty without enough nationalism to protect it.

Liberty has been in steady decline since nationalism (and democracy and socialism, its bosom brothers) arrived in the world.

Large mobs of poorly educated people make poor decisions (shocking!).

See: the Austrian aristocrat and also Austrian-in-the-other-sense who graces my signature line.


So sayeth the Demoncrats, they trumpet their communism these days

McConnell is telling you that you need to vote GOP to make sure that...they (the GOP?) don't increase spending even more, no?


If he is here legally he didn't steal anything, all Americans and those we grant the privilege of coming here have an equal right to try for the opportunities here.

I see.

So, employers should be prohibited from employing persons they wish to employ if the majority of the community objects?

[Raginfridus]

P.S. there is no liberty without enough nationalism to protect it.Nations do not protect Liberty. You know nothing.

[r3volution 3.0]

Immigration and politics are a property rights issue, we've had this conversation before so I won't go any deeper than this:
My liberty is my property and I have a right to defend it from foreigners who would come here and vote to take it away, the fact that I already have to deal with domestic enemies only makes the foreign threat worse.

You're hanging out amongst the hangers-on of the barbarian army and don't even realize it.

You are Odoacer's shoe-shine boy.

[Swordsmyth]

And the weighted average results in massive spending increases and no meaningful reforms of any kind.
Demoncrats weight the Average worse and give the RINOs the cover they need to stay in power.




So you acknowledge that they are led by emotion, not reason?
Too many are, all of humanity trends that way. (including monarchs)




Liberty has been in steady decline since nationalism (and democracy and socialism, its bosom brothers) arrived in the world.
Nationalism is as old as the hills, the coincidence of modern nationalism and other bad trends is meaningless.


Large mobs of poorly educated people make poor decisions (shocking!).
And small numbers of unaccountable people lead them to it because it is to their advantage under any system.


See: the Austrian aristocrat and also Austrian-in-the-other-sense who graces my signature line.
Nations have cultures that vary in their devotion to and understanding of liberty, it is necessary to protect ours from those with less.




McConnell is telling you that you need to vote GOP to make sure that...they (the GOP?) don't increase spending even more, no?

When a better option is available then you shouldn't, but when there is no better option you should.
The Demoncrats give the RINOs an excuse to "compromise".



I see.

So, employers should be prohibited from employing persons they wish to employ if the majority of the community objects?
Americans have a natural right to the opportunities here, anyone else must be extended the privilege, immigration is a group question so the group gets to decide who to extend that privilege to.

[Swordsmyth]

Nations do not protect Liberty. You know nothing.

Without a nation to defend it some other nation will take it from you.

YOU know nothing.

[Danke]

Demoncrats weight the Average worse and give the RINOs the cover they need to stay in power.




Too many are, all of humanity trends that way. (including monarchs)




Nationalism is as old as the hills, the coincidence of modern nationalism and other bad trends is meaningless.


And small numbers of unaccountable people lead them to it because it is to their advantage under any system.


Nations have cultures that vary in their devotion to and understanding of liberty, it is necessary to protect ours from those with less.





When a better option is available then you shouldn't, but when there is no better option you should.
The Demoncrats give the RINOs an excuse to "compromise".



Americans have a natural right to the opportunities here, anyone else must be extended the privilege, immigration is a group question so the group gets to decide who to extend that privilege to.


You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Swordsmyth again.

[TheCount]

Without a nation to defend it some other nation will take it from you.

YOU know nothing.
How much liberty should be given up to your nation to prevent the loss of your liberty to other nations?

[Swordsmyth]

How much liberty should be given up to your nation to prevent the loss of your liberty to other nations?
As little as possible, as much as it takes.

[Origanalist]

Nations do not protect Liberty. You know nothing.

And he proudly displays it daily.

[Origanalist]

As little as possible, as much as it takes.

May your chains set lightly upon you.

[r3volution 3.0]

Nationalism is as old as the hills, the coincidence of modern nationalism and other bad trends is meaningless.

No, that's wrong.

People, for as long as the hills have stood, have been particular to their own region.

That is not the same as nationalism.

You will find nothing remotely resembling nationalist movements prior to 1789.

This is a feature of modernity, of democracy in particular.

E.G. German or Italian unification


And small numbers of unaccountable people lead them to it because it is to their advantage under any system.

Yet, somehow, the free-shit-loving mob has much more power and gets more free shit when they have the vote.

Imagine that (they did, that's why they wanted the vote in the first place).


Americans have a natural right to the opportunities here, anyone else must be extended the privilege, immigration is a group question so the group gets to decide who to extend that privilege to.

So, if the community objects to a particular employment contract, it is void. Yes?

Would you like to dedicate this statement to Herr Marx?

[Swordsmyth]

May your chains set lightly upon you.
May yours do so too.