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Antonius Stone
12-11-2007, 03:09 PM
My roommate is a huge barack obama supporter, so I decided to go with him to a giant Obama rally in Universal City last night and what I saw there was fairly encouraging.
It seems to me, that on the surface the Obama Movement and the Ron Paul Movement are two sides of the same coin. That coin being that everywhere in this country- on the left and the right- people are sick and tired of politics as usual, manufactured candidates and corporate lobbyist money. The people on the left have moved towards Barack and the people on the right (as well as libertarians and most independents) have gone towards Ron Paul.

Now, I'll say that I like Barack. He is very charismatic, he has a common sense approach to a lot of issues and he's always been against the war. Barack seems, at least to me, to be as sincere as Ron Paul- he just isn't as old as Paul so he doesn't have as long and as distinguished a record to prove that he is sincere. But when I listen to what he's saying- he wants to build a bipartisan coalition, he wants to represent both blue and red states, he wants to compromise for the better, and he's willing to listen to other peoples solutions- I not only agree with him, but I think he really means it and because of that he has the potential to be a very good president.

Granted, i would not vote for Barack over Ron Paul because I disagree with a lot of his fiscal liberalism, but because he's so willing to work with us on the other side of the aisle I'm compelled to consider him as my second choice for POTUS, should Paul lose the Republican Nomination.

Now, if we were to go further than that, what if we were to have Paul/Obama or an Obama/Paul ticket? Given the huge movements behind the respective candidates I think that that kind of ticket would be unbeatable in the general election- matter of fact I think the general formula of (Ron Paul + Sturdy Democrat) would be unbeatable in a general election...

But I don't think it would be too difficult to build that kind of consensus because the Obama people are already on the same page as us when it comes to the War in Iraq, curbing Aggressive foreign policy, utilization of diplomacy and doing a better job of balancing the budget. We may have different solutions for healthcare, immigration and education but we also agree that the current systems in place aren't working so coming up with a solution that we all agree on can't be too difficult, can it?

What do you guys think of this?
And if there's anything bad or damning about Barack Obama, then show me, because I have yet to see it

mosquitobite
12-11-2007, 03:12 PM
I have a few concerns with naming a Democrat to the ticket.

1) someone shooting Dr Paul once they see how many vetoes he racks up
2) supreme court nominations
3) if something were to happen to Dr Paul, see #2


for Dr Paul's safety I think it's best not to split the ticket.

Pete
12-11-2007, 03:43 PM
Obama = CFR

I'm taking a break from CFR stooges.

I do like Obama as a person, but refuse to vote for any more CFR people.

partypooper
12-11-2007, 03:56 PM
honestly, obama strikes me as completely empty. i have no idea of what he stands for, specifically, except for some nice-sounding words. i don't know where is your impression of "common-sense" coming from - i never heard him say anything common-sensical, whenever i hear him he merely makes very abstract, lofty promises.

Cinci4RP
12-11-2007, 04:11 PM
Paul/Obama

I posted this the other day and was lambasted.

For many reasons.

I am really starting to believe it will be a non-issue

pdavis
12-11-2007, 04:15 PM
Obama is horrible.
He wants to mandate national service.
He will not promise to withdraw troops by 2013.
He wants universal healthcare.
An interventionist foreign policy.
He voted for the reauthorization of the US PATRIOT Act.
Voted numerous times to continue the Iraq War.
He has stated that he will not take any options off the table when dealing with Iran; not even a nuclear first strike.

Zarxrax
12-11-2007, 04:16 PM
While Obama may be a good guy, he has completely opposite views as Paul on many, or even most issues. A Paul/Obama ticket would be out of the question, because many of Paul's supporters would perhaps drop Paul if he chose someone like that as a VP. What message is it sending? To some, it might send a message that we are all Americans, we can all get along, or something like that. To many others though, it would send a message that Ron Paul supports the kind of ideas that Obama puts forth, that Paul isn't serious about the presidency, or even worse things.

Obama seems like a "good" liberal. He doesn't appear to have a lot of hidden agendas, and it would seem that he honestly believes that his policies would improve the country. I strongly disagree with his opinions though, and no matter how great a guy he might be, I don't think I could bring myself to vote for him just on that.

Goldwater Conservative
12-11-2007, 04:27 PM
I like Obama's style (optimism and civility), but not his substance. Also, I think he'd be easily manipulated in office. If he was certifiably anti-war, civil libertarian, and fiscally conservative, and I had good reason to think he would be the only one calling the shots (not special interests or the polls), I'd vote for him if Paul wasn't running.

Chernitsky
12-11-2007, 04:41 PM
C F R & too much outside influence from those in charge - they know the tide is changing and are manipulating the system in their favor, in the end it's the same old story with a new candidate...

http://smiliesftw.com/x/eek5nono.gif (http://smiliesftw.com)

Ron Paul FTW
12-11-2007, 04:45 PM
I think its clear what the CFR does, and what their goals are. Obama and I think his wife are both members, that is enough for anyone to not vote for him. Thing is, most people don't even know what the CFR is/does.

Chernitsky
12-11-2007, 04:50 PM
I think its clear what the CFR does, and what their goals are. Obama and I think his wife are both members, that is enough for anyone to not vote for him. Thing is, most people don't even know what the CFR is/does.

pretty much

FreeTraveler
12-11-2007, 05:03 PM
I seriously question whether people who support Obama really understand what Ron Paul is all about. Ron Paul is about Freedom, not more plans to redistribute our money from this group of producers to that group of non-producers.

dircha
12-11-2007, 05:37 PM
Yes, we all know Obama is a big talker.

But can you point out how, based on his policy positions, he is anything but "politics as usual"?

In what concrete way is Obama not "politics as usual"? They're the same policy positions we've heard for 30 years.

He's a good speaker, and has good speech writers, but that's it.

dircha
12-11-2007, 05:39 PM
I seriously question whether people who support Obama really understand what Ron Paul is all about. Ron Paul is about Freedom, not more plans to redistribute our money from this group of producers to that group of non-producers.

And I seriously question whether people who support Obama really understand what Obama is all about.

They certainly don't seem to. Obama is all style and no substance. He is politics as usual. It's not an accident that he spends so little time talking about what positions he actually advocates in concrete terms. It's because they're the same tired democratic liberal programs we've heard for the past 30 years.

user
12-11-2007, 05:50 PM
And if there's anything bad or damning about Barack Obama, then show me, because I have yet to see it

Supporting slavery (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=48178) qualifies.

AisA1787
12-11-2007, 06:00 PM
I'm going to put this thread out of its misery: Ron Paul wouldn't choose Obama as a running mate unless Obama fundamentally changes almost every single one of his policy positions. If you believe Obama will do that, then by all means continue the speculation.

user
12-11-2007, 06:23 PM
One of these threads pops up every now and then anyway.

SlapItHigh
12-11-2007, 06:23 PM
Now, I'll say that I like Barack. He is very charismatic, he has a common sense approach to a lot of issues and he's always been against the war.

Obama is very charismatic - you are right on that one but it pretty much ends there. He is a giant empty suit. He was the first candidate that I researched, even before Paul. Lots of double talk - especially on the war.

He has not aways been against the war. He was against the initial invasion and that is pretty much it. He admits that he did not have access to the intelligence at the time though. He has supported our troops being in Iraq to protect our strategic interests in the area. Obama voted against Kerry's bill to bring the troops home and he has continued to vote to fund the war. He is very much an interventionist which is very much the opposite of Ron Paul and this would be a major contradiction for a Paul/Obama ticket. Foreign policy is way too important.

YOu bring up a good point that Obama's age is a negative against him because he admits to being a freshman/sophmore when it comes to economics/foreign policy. But think about it....When Ron Paul was Obama's age, he was already a senior on these issues. Ron Paul just gets it and he has for a very very long time. Why hasn't Obama gotten it yet??? I don't think he ever will. He is very very uneducated on economics. I tried to research his views on inflation, the weakness of the dollar, the fed reserve, etc and I could find very very little information. How can a presidentail candidate be taken seriously in 2008 without speaking out on any of those things?? Almost all of his economic positions are about the enviornment. While that is important, there is very little we can do about the evniornment but a whole lot we can do about our current dollar situation and the growing inflation.

SlapItHigh
12-11-2007, 06:29 PM
And I seriously question whether people who support Obama really understand what Obama is all about.

Yeah this is so true. I just had an online discussion with an Obama supporter who was trying to promote him as the only choice for the dems. She actually thought that he has been "strong on bringing our troops home" and when I questioned her it was clear she did not know anything about what has been going on. She thought he was the first person to introduce a bill to bring the troops home, lol. Linked me to a article that was basically criticizing Obama for just now finally introducing that type of bill this late in the game and suggested that it was just an attempt to try to gain him some credibility on his weak foreign policy credentials. How can you not know that other bills to bring the troops home have already been proposed??

Obama is really really good at telling his audience what they want to hear. Empty change. He should definitely be some kind of salesmen or motivational speaker but a president? You've got to be kidding me. He doesn't stand for much of anything at all.

Broadlighter
12-11-2007, 06:47 PM
I've never heard Obama say anything about ending the Federal Reserve's monopoly on money and finance and eliminating the income tax. If he did, I would be all ears.

These are the two keystone issues for me. I cannot, will not support a candidate for president, congress or the senate who's not on the same page with me on those two issues.

Obama would make a nice next door neighbor, but I wouldn't dare trust him in the Whitehouse.