Is The President of the United States Mentally Ill?

[r3volution 3.0]

An oldie but a goodie, seeming apropos given recent events, presented without further comment:


a psychologist warned that fellow doctors have a responsibility to point out that President Donald Trump exhibits clear signs of mental illness and shouldn’t be trusted with the nuclear codes.

Speaking with host Lawrence O’Donnell, Dr. John Gartner claimed, Trump is a “paranoid, psychopathic, narcissist who is divorced from reality” who will put the nation at risk.

“If we could construct a psychiatric Frankenstein monster, we could not create a leader more dangerously mentally ill than Donald Trump,” Gartner began. “He is a paranoid, psychopathic, narcissist who is divorced from reality and lashes out impulsively at his imagined enemies. And this is someone, as you said, who is handling the nuclear codes.”

It has long been a policy within the psychiatric community to not diagnose individuals without personally interviewing them, but Gartner — who works as a therapist (http://www.johngartner.com/) in Baltimore and New York City — warned that, in the case of Trump, that should be set aside because there is ample evidence based on Trump’s public utterances.

“I would argue to my colleagues that those who don’t speak out are being unethical,” he stated. “If we have some knowledge and understanding about the unique danger that Donald Trump presents through our psychiatric training and don’t say something about it, history is not going to judge us kindly.”

Appearing with Gartner, Dr. Lance Dodes also warned against not taking a hard look at Trump’s mental state, which he believes disqualifies him from holding the highest office in the land.

“He lies because of his sociopathic tendencies that Dr. Gartner was talking about,” Dodes suggested. “He lies in the way anybody who scams people does. He’s tried to sell an idea or a product by telling you something that is untrue. There is also the kind of lie he has that in a way is more serious — that he has a loose grip on reality. We can say that because he lies about things that aren’t that important.”

http://www.rawstory.com/2017/02/psychiatrist-warns-trump-is-a-psychiatric-frankenstein-monster-who-is-at-war-with-imagined-enemies/

[Swordsmyth]

Dump has an exaggerated public persona, but that is showmanship not insanity.

[Anti Federalist]

A medical fascism coup.

I have no fucking clue if he is or is not, and neither does the TV "psychologist".

http://cdn.playbuzz.com/cdn/91b1b4bb-cc67-4375-9767-0715136edb7d/9899eded-b7e3-433b-b67a-383d7bc3042e.jpg

[r3volution 3.0]

Dump has an exaggerated public persona, but that is showmanship not insanity.

Which of the following, in your view, were showman and which were insane:

a) Jim Jones
b) Adolf Hitler
c) Huey Long
d) Charlie Manson

[Suzanimal]

I suspect most politicians are mentally unstable.

[nikcers]

I suspect most politicians are mentally unstable.

in a mad world only the mad are sane

[Swordsmyth]

Which of the following, in your view, were showman and which were insane:

a) Jim Jones
b) Adolf Hitler
c) Huey Long
d) Charlie Manson

I have had even less exposure to any of them than I have had to Dump so I couldn't say for sure, but I have seen some rather convincing conspiracy theories that would say that A, B, and D were front men for con-jobs, the same might be true of C.

[r3volution 3.0]

I have had even less exposure to any of them than I have had to Dump so I couldn't say for sure, but I have seen some rather convincing conspiracy theories that would say that A, B, and D were front men for con-jobs, the same might be true of C.

Well, my impression is that all of them, including the current leader of the "free world," were/are narcissistic sociopaths (but I suppose I repeat myself - not sure of the clinical terminology, as I'm not a psychologist). Not all politicians are this way (@Suzanimal (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/member.php?u=38380)); most just want money. The really dangerous ones aren't interested in money at all; they want applause, love applause, will do anything for applause, even kill millions of people for applause. And, no, I'm not saying Trump is going to be killing millions of people (neither did Jones or Long or Manson), only that he is not an altogether odd fit in such company, and I can rather appreciate the views of this clinician who wrote the article.

[NorthCarolinaLiberty]

LOL. The desperation of snowflakes never ends.




Don't Call Trump "Crazy": The Dangers of Pathologizing Bad Politics
Saturday, February 04, 2017 By Kelly Hayes, Truthout | Interview



The word "crazy" is deployed in many contexts in our society, often in a manner that implies abhorrent behavior must be linked to mental illness. Throughout Donald Trump's presidential campaign, and the early weeks of his presidency, it has proven nearly impossible to traverse social media -- or press coverage of the president -- without encountering language that describes Trump as "insane," a "lunatic" or clinically narcissistic. Some have even argued that it's "okay" to assess a public figure's mental health from a distance, despite longstanding psychiatric standards that prohibit such speculative diagnoses. The ethics that prohibit such diagnoses have, however, had little effect on public narratives that depict Trump as being "insane."

Comedian and daytime talk show host Joy Behar recently urged celebrity psychiatrist Dr. Phil McGraw to join that chorus by diagnosing Trump with Narcissistic Personality Disorder, during an interview on the ABC talk show "The View." McGraw declined.

Psychologist John Gartner, a part-time assistant professor of psychiatry at Johns Hopkins University Medical School, has publicly stated that Trump has "a serious mental illness that renders him psychologically incapable of competently discharging the duties of President of the United States," diagnosing him with "malignant narcissism." Gartner has gone so far as to create a petition, which encourages mental health care professionals to cosign his assessment, and demand Trump's removal on the basis of his supposed mental health problems. The petition has accrued 17,479 signatures, though it's unclear which of these individuals are mental health care professionals, since many did not fulfill Gartner's request that all signatories list their psychiatric credentials.

However, not all psychiatrists are jumping on board with the narcissism diagnosis. One such skeptic is Dr. Allen Frances, who wrote the clinical criteria for Narcissistic Personality Disorder. Frances was the chair of the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM) IV Task Force and of the department of psychiatry at Duke University School of Medicine, in Durham, North Carolina. He is currently a professor emeritus at Duke University. Frances, whose criteria for narcissism are still used today, has stated that Trump does not meet those criteria, and has been outspoken in his critiques of efforts to pathologize Trump from a distance. After firing off a series of tweets that once again stirred attention around his arguments, Frances agreed to talk with Truthout about the controversy, and why characterizing Trump as mentally ill is downright dangerous.

Your recent comments on Twitter provided a profound interruption to the "insanity" narrative that's been spun around Trump, both in the press and on social media. Can you talk a bit about your role in creating the diagnostic criteria for narcissism?

I wrote the criteria in 1978 for the DSM-III, and it's the same criteria used for the DSM-V today. I was actively involved in the creation of DSM-111 and DSM III-R. I was chair of the task force for the DSM-IV, and I have been openly critical of DSM-V.

As a writer who's been open about my own struggles with mental illness, I've always found characterizations of Trump as being "crazy" or "narcissistic" troubling. But those of us who've objected have found it nearly impossible to interrupt the "insanity" narrative. Can you talk about why you've chosen to be outspoken on the subject?

[Dr. Allen Frances]: It's an insult to people who have real mental illness to be lumped with Trump. Most people with mental illness are well-meaning, well-mannered and well-behaved. And Trump is none of these. Trump is bad, not mad. And when bad people are labelled mentally ill, it stigmatizes mental illness.

Can you explain why Trump doesn't fit the criteria for narcissism?

In order to qualify for a mental disorder you not only have to have the personality features, you also have to have clinically significant distress or impairment caused by them. Trump causes distress, but there is no evidence that he experiences it. And instead of being impaired by his narcissistic behavior, he is rewarded for it, to the extent of being elected president of the United States.

Why do you think people feel the need to pathologize Trump? Do you think it's rooted in a need to distance ourselves from his behavior?

I think people are understandably terrified by the very grave threat Trump presents to American democracy, our relation to other countries and -- scariest -- global warming. People are appalled at Trump's policies … are searching for any avenue to discredit him, but the focus of attack should be on the egregious ignorance and unfairness of the policies and on the incompetence, self-absorption and impulsiveness of the man -- not on the losing struggle to prove he has a mental illness. Psychiatric name-calling is the least effective way to win an argument.

I think that it's very important that Trump and his policies be de-legitimized. But it's unwise to do it on the basis of being mentally disordered. It's important to attack his policies in every possible way, but misdiagnosing him as mentally ill distracts from what should be a laser-like focus on how bad his actions and policies are. Trump requires a full-court political response, not a phony medicalization.

Given Trump's extreme positions -- which are already inspiring violence -- it's struck me as especially dangerous that people are labeling his behavior as being the product of mental illness. It seems like a manifestation of historical amnesia, given that entire populations have, at times, been led to commit atrocities, amid flurries of brutal politics. Do you think our refusal to recognize that shadow side of human potential could harm efforts to thwart Trump?

I see Trump as a wannabe Mussolini, but not nearly as smart and much more impulsive, and therefore more dangerous. The way out of this is not psychiatric; it's political. If there is any patriotism left in the GOP, it will stop exploiting Trump, and begin opposing the many things he is doing that are harmful to our country. Rather than psychiatric name-calling, everyone who recognizes the danger of Trump must do everything possible to reduce the political dominance of the Republican party, which is enabling his dangerous behavior. So, the focus should be on demonstrations now, and on the 2018 and 2020 elections.


http://www.truth-out.org/news/item/39356-don-t-call-trump-crazy-the-dangers-of-pathologizing-bad-politics

[NorthCarolinaLiberty]

Better put Nurse Ratched on the case. I know I could sure use some medication.


https://media.giphy.com/media/eni0ZaxsoBm6s/200.gif

[NorthCarolinaLiberty]

A medical fascism coup.




Pretty much this. People are so emotionally fragile and dependent that they are willing to trade one brand of authoritarianism for another brand of authoritarianism.

[r3volution 3.0]

LOL. The desperation of snowflakes never ends.

Am I a snowflake buttercup?

[NorthCarolinaLiberty]

Am I a snowflake buttercup?


If that's all you got to what I posted, then it sounds like it.

[nikcers]

Am I a snowflake buttercup? What kind of dining set defines you as a person?

[enhanced_deficit]

An oldie but a goodie, seeming apropos given recent events, presented without further comment:


This Q is limited to just very recent/current Prez only or recent past more violent/ISIS friendly type Prez also can be considered?




Related

Controversial Opinion: Drone Killings a Sexual Thrill for Obama (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?502216-Erection-2008-Video-Surfaces-Of-Obama-Flaunting-His-Junk-to-Reporters-on-Campaign-Plane&p=6451014&viewfull=1#post6451014)

[TheCount]

Confabulation (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confabulation)is my guess.


In psychiatry, confabulation (verb: confabulate) is a disturbance of memory, defined as the production of fabricated, distorted, or misinterpreted memories about oneself or the world, without the conscious intention to deceive. People who confabulate present incorrect memories ranging from "subtle alterations to bizarre fabrications", and are generally very confident about their recollections, despite contradictory evidence.


It could be that he doesn't even know that he's lying.

[r3volution 3.0]

What kind of dining set defines you as a person?

http://cortjezter.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/04/large.jpg

[r3volution 3.0]

This Q is limited to just very recent/current Prez only or recent past more violent/ISIS friendly type Prez also can be considered?

Related

Controversial Opinion: Drone Killings a Sexual Thrill for Obama (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?502216-Erection-2008-Video-Surfaces-Of-Obama-Flaunting-His-Junk-to-Reporters-on-Campaign-Plane&p=6451014&viewfull=1#post6451014)

Drone Strikes Up 432 Percent Donald Under Trump (https://www.thenewamerican.com/usnews/foreign-policy/item/25604-drone-strikes-up-432-percent-under-donald-trump)


If that's all you got to what I posted, then it sounds like it.

Does snowflakery consist in criticizing socialism?

[Krugminator2]

No. And I would bet a not insignificant number of very successful people have the same mental make up as Trump. I think if you looked at people from Tiger Woods, Michael Jordan, Steve Jobs, or Oprah, you would find a certain amount of self-delusion.

I'm reading The Narrow Road by Felix Dennis. I think he was a better businessman than Trump. But if he were in politics, he would definitely get called crazy.

[timosman]

I have had even less exposure to any of them than I have had to Dump so I couldn't say for sure, but I have seen some rather convincing conspiracy theories that would say that A, B, and D were front men for con-jobs, the same might be true of C.

So what's the con job going on right now?:cool:

[timosman]

Well, my impression is that all of them, including the current leader of the "free world," were/are narcissistic sociopaths (but I suppose I repeat myself - not sure of the clinical terminology, as I'm not a psychologist). Not all politicians are this way (@Suzanimal (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/member.php?u=38380)); most just want money. The really dangerous ones aren't interested in money at all; they want applause, love applause, will do anything for applause, even kill millions of people for applause. And, no, I'm not saying Trump is going to be killing millions of people (neither did Jones or Long or Manson), only that he is not an altogether odd fit in such company, and I can rather appreciate the views of this clinician who wrote the article.

That's a nice way of saying he's insane.:cool:

[oyarde]

Which of the following, in your view, were showman and which were insane:

a) Jim Jones
b) Adolf Hitler
c) Huey Long
d) Charlie Manson

You think Huey was insane ?

[r3volution 3.0]

That's a nice way of saying he's insane.:cool:

Tell me more. :cool:

[Swordsmyth]

So what's the con job going on right now?:cool:
Many different ones

[r3volution 3.0]

You think Huey was insane ?

Huey was a hillybilly conman, a sociopath who would do anything for...

https://media.giphy.com/media/c3RUgFzhcCPHq/giphy.gif

...just like Chief Orange Hair.

[UWDude]

Huey was a hillybilly conman,

Like you would have any idea about who Huey Long was. You have awfully strong opinions about things there is no way you could know anything about.

*you* are the sociopath narcissist.

Lucky for the world, all your time is wasted in front of your monitor.

[r3volution 3.0]

Like you would have any idea about who Huey Long was. You have awfully strong opinions about things there is no way you could know anything about.

*you* are the sociopath narcissist.

Lucky for the world, all your time is wasted in front of your monitor.

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/78/c2/3a/78c23aa7f3c2223a1f5fa8184862b5a9.png

[timosman]

Like you would have any idea about who Huey Long was. You have awfully strong opinions about things there is no way you could know anything about.

*you* are the sociopath narcissist.

Lucky for the world, all your time is wasted in front of your monitor.

I would like to remind you calling other people trolls is against the site policy.:cool:

[NorthCarolinaLiberty]

Does snowflakery consist in criticizing socialism?

Is changing your topic from mental health to government systems an example of bait and switch?





It could be that he doesn't even know that he's lying.


That irony is funny coming from you.

[r3volution 3.0]

Is changing your topic from mental health to government systems an example of bait and switch?

You accuse me of being a "snowflake" for calling into question's the idiot's competence.

I'm asking you why.

So, why? What does this term "snowflake" mean?

Does it mean "one who would criticize Trump (such as, for his socialism)?

If there isn't something you like about Trump (such as, his socialism), why do you defend his incompetence?

[NorthCarolinaLiberty]

You accuse me of being a "snowflake"....

"Accuse." LOL. Now it's been elevated to courtroom language.

And I actually never accused you of anything. Not only are you unable to stick with the topic of your own thread, you can't even get facts straight.

[r3volution 3.0]

You accuse me of being a "snowflake" for calling into question's the idiot's competence.

I'm asking you why.

So, why? What does this term "snowflake" mean?

Does it mean "one who would criticize Trump (such as, for his socialism)?

If there isn't something you like about Trump (such as, his socialism), why do you defend his incompetence?

"Accuse." LOL. Now it's been elevated to courtroom language.

And I actually never accused you of anything. Not only are you unable to stick with the topic of your own thread, you can't even get facts straight.

...



Am I a snowflake buttercup?If that's all you got to what I posted, then it sounds like it.

So I repeat my question:


What does this term "snowflake" mean?

Does it mean "one who would criticize Trump (such as, for his socialism)?

If there isn't something you like about Trump (such as, his socialism), why do you defend his incompetence?

[NorthCarolinaLiberty]

...



So I repeat my question:

So you continue to derail your own thread.

[r3volution 3.0]

So you continue to derail your own thread.

LOL

[NorthCarolinaLiberty]

LOL


That's all you got?


LOL

[UWDude]

I would like to remind you calling other people trolls is against the site policy.:cool:

Are you calling me a troll?

[timosman]

Confabulation (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confabulation)is my guess.




It could be that he doesn't even know that he's lying.

Are you getting paid for this extra gig - a free medical advice?

[UWDude]

You accuse me of being a "snowflake" for calling into question's the idiot's competence.

I'm asking you why.

So, why? What does this term "snowflake" mean?

Does it mean "one who would criticize Trump (such as, for his socialism)?

If there isn't something you like about Trump (such as, his socialism), why do you defend his incompetence?

Oh my god! It's genius! revolution is singlehandedly turning around the term snowflake! That boy! His IQ must be at least 100!

Those rhetorical flourishes! Those semantic rebrandings! The neverending goalpost creep! The suplex derail! Folks, we've seen some trolls, but tonight, you are in for a treat. It's not like any other night! No tonight, revolution 3.0 is back at it! I don't know about you gary, but I'm excited!

I just gotta ask, How do you find time to get away from all your groupies? Has the fame gotten to your head yet? At what point do you consider your mission as complete? What do you say to all the children who want to grow up to be just like you? Is it hard being a role model to so many aspiring trolls?

[timosman]

Are you calling me a troll?

No, but please cool down.:cool:

[UWDude]

No, but please cool down.:cool:


I dunno, pretty sure you just accused me of trolling. Now you are inferencing with the term "cool down" that I am flaming or something.

[r3volution 3.0]

Oh my god! It's genius! revolution is singlehandedly turning around the term snowflake! That boy! His IQ must be at least 100!

Those rhetorical flourishes! Those semantic rebrandings! The neverending goalpost creep! The suplex derail! Folks, we've seen some trolls, but tonight, you are in for a treat. It's not like any other night! No tonight, revolution 3.0 is back at it! I don't know about you gary, but I'm excited!

I just gotta ask, How do you find time to get away from all your groupies? Has the fame gotten to your head yet? At what point do you consider your mission as complete? What do you say to all the children who want to grow up to be just like you? Is it hard being a role model to so many aspiring trolls?

http://images.amcnetworks.com/ifc.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/03/Buckets.jpg

[Origanalist]

Are you calling me a troll?

Yes. Now run along and report me.

[NorthCarolinaLiberty]

The OP, Rev3.0, went from mental illness, to socialism, to pasting pictures.

[Origanalist]

https://replicationindex.files.wordpress.com/2017/02/train-wreck-1.jpg?w=604&h=270&crop=1

[Origanalist]

The OP, Rev3.0, went from mental illness, to socialism, to pasting pictures.

I just pasted pictures and pretty much skipped the rest of it.

[NorthCarolinaLiberty]

Are you getting paid for this extra gig - a free medical advice?


Maybe TheCount is really Jocelyn Elders.

[r3volution 3.0]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDbuhhRthqU

On another note, I'll amused to report that we're at 60/40 for the President's probable mental illness.

[timosman]

On another note, I'll amused to report that we're at 60/40 for the President's probable mental illness.

Now it is time to make a poll about your mental health.

[r3volution 3.0]

Now it is time to make a poll about your mental health.

Tell me more. :cool:

[UWDude]

changing the world, 17 votes at a time.

[UWDude]

Yes. Now run along and report me.

reporting is for stasi wannabes.

[Warrior_of_Freedom]

I'll say that Trump is not mentally sound if the rest of us can agree almost every liberal in this country is too mentally ill to cast a ballot.

[agitator]

I would like to remind you calling other people trolls is against the site policy.:cool:

Call the cops.

[Ender]

Well for the billionth time, my answer is the same as Johnny Depp's:

"He's a brat."


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T_qtANL5qAo

[UWDude]

Well for the billionth time, my answer is the same as Johnny Depp's:

"He's a brat."


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T_qtANL5qAo

Johnny Depp the wifebeater.

[Wooden Indian]

He's likely mentally and emotional ill... as are many if not most in politics and big business.

Same as the Bush and Clinton families, for example.

Singling Trump out is disingenuous, imo, and I have no love for the asshole.

[Ender]

Johnny Depp the wifebeater.

LOL

Everything's fake news unless it fits the agenda- amirite?


May 28, 2016: Depp's Daughter and Exes Come to His Defense

When some people, including a few celebrities, started to take sides through a "trial by Twitter," Depp's daughter, Lily-Rose, and two of his exes, Paradis and Lori Anne Allison, quickly came to his defense. His daughter took to Instagram to share a sweet throwback photo of the two from when she was a baby, calling her dad the "sweetest most loving person" in her caption.

Paradis reportedly wrote a letter, obtained by TMZ, in which she slammed Heard's "outrageous" allegations against Paradis' former longtime partner.

Allison, who was Depp's first wife, echoed Paradis' sentiments, telling friends that "she doesn't believe Amber Heard's claim that Johnny brutalized her multiple times during their short marriage."




August 16, 2016: Divorce Case Settled, Restraining Order Request Against Depp Withdrawn

Heard and Depp settle their divorce case with the actress also withdrawing her request for a domestic violence restraining order against Depp, ET confirmed.

"Our relationship was intensely passionate and at times volatile, but always bound by love," Heard and Depp said in a joint statement. "Neither party has made false accusations for financial gains. There was never an intent of physical or emotional harm."

"Amber wishes the best for Johnny in the future," the statement added. "Amber will be donating financial proceeds from the divorce to a charity."



http://www.etonline.com/news/189603_johnny_depp_and_amber_heard_to_divorce_a_ti meline/

[timosman]

LOL

Everything's fake news unless it fits the agenda- amirite?

So right. You are so smart.:cool:

[UWDude]

LOL

Everything's fake news unless it fits the agenda- amirite?





http://www.etonline.com/news/189603_johnny_depp_and_amber_heard_to_divorce_a_ti meline/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nhz9PCbnkkQ


Look at the brat, throw a tantrum. (have you ever in your adult life ever come close to acting like Depp?)
Depp is the Brat. Donald is the real deal.

[UWDude]

dp

[pcosmar]

I would question the sanity of anyone seeking power.

But who does decide what is a mental ill?

obviously, not enough poll options.