Is Government "Good"?

[SeekLiberty]

IMO, the ONLY legitimate purpose of government is to protect our Individual Rights and our Property Rights. Having an organized, common elected group (sworn under public oath) with the mission to do this is but a necessary evil for all our protection.

Is this what we have today?

Where are we on the continuum?

Or is it in its worst state?

For me its nearly in its worst state, and is absolutely intolerable. How about you? Where are we here?

"Government, even in its best state, is but a necessary evil; in its worst state, an intolerable one." - Thomas Paine

For more about this, listen here:

http://www.americanradioshow.us/archive/20070630-1.ram

http://www.americanradioshow.us/archive/20070630-2.ram

I highly recommend this show. There's nothing else like it, believe me. Here are the topics of the current show.

Into which category would today's government fall in the eyes of Thomas Paine - "necessary evil" or "intolerable"?

New listener comments on finding American Radio.

What makes American Radio (and you) different?

Dave responds to a listener's question about what can be done to combat unconstitutional concealed carry laws.

What is a "tipping point" and what might it mean for America?

With his "Petition for Redress of Grievance" lawsuit at the U.S. First Circuit Court of Appeals, is Bob Schulz laying foundation for another 1776?

Democrats in Congress have started floating the possibility of a federal law instituting a "fairness doctrine" in talk radio. Dave tells you what's really going on.

Dave shares some listener responses to his question, "Why are so few blacks a part of the 'gun culture'?"

http://www.americanradioshow.us/archive.html

Enjoy! :)

- SL

http://www.a-human-right.com/s_irs.jpg

[foofighter20x]

LOL @ that pic!

[angrydragon]

"Government is not reason, it is not eloquence, it is force; like fire, a troublesome servant and a fearful master. Never for a moment should it be left to irresponsible action." - George Washington

[angrydragon]

http://www.theonion.com/content/files/images/Retired-General-Jump.jpg

"The Iraqi people did suffer greatly under unjust rule," Washington said. "But in truth, it is the duty of any people that wishes to be free to fight for its own independence. Had France meddled in our revolution beyond the guidance and material assistance they provided, I should think similar unrest would have darkened our nation's earliest hours."

"We're very happy that someone of General Washington's stature is speaking out," said Jon Soltz, cofounder and chairman of VoteVets.org. "He has impeccable conservative credentials, extensive foreign policy experience, is a true citizen-soldier with a proven commitment to his country, and, if that's not enough to get Bush to listen, he's the face on the dollar bill."

However, White House response to the former general's criticism was swift and sharp. Spokesman Tony Fratto dismissed Washington as "increasingly irrelevant" and "a relic" who "made some embarrassing gaffes" during his own military career, such as the Continental Army's near destruction in the Battle of Long Island in 1776.

http://www.theonion.com/content/news/retired_gen_george_washington

The Founding Fathers Meet George Bush

http://www.buzzflash.com/farrell/04/06/far04021.html

[SeekLiberty]

Oh I love all you true Patriots and lovers of Liberty! You can be my bud anytime!

- SL

[BuddyRey]

The idealist in me wants to believe that government can be good if the right people are in charge of it and the right priorities (i.e. the people rather than the corporate money or the lobbyists) are brought into focus. Then again, I know a lot of folks, especially my Libertarian friends, who want far less government than I do, and I can see where they're coming from too. It's really a tough question to answer definitively, though I tend to err on the side of having a robust government that strictly adheres to a servant role, and runs the constant risk of a non-violent revolution when policies are not in the interest of the people! Then again, in this country, where people tend to be generally complacent and don't pay much attention to politics, the aforementioned servant-government role would probably be harder to attain. After all, wasn't it Ben Franklin who said the price of liberty is eternal vigilance?

[Terribliz]

rofl that's great.

[andrewgreve]

There is no such thing as government. There are only people. If it is wrong for me to come to your house with a gun and demand that you pay me, then it is wrong for ANYONE to go to ANYONE else's house with a gun and demand that they be paid.

taxes=theft
war=murder

I'm sure you've all noticed that Paul is plugging the Austrian School of Economics an awful lot. What you might not yet be aware of is that Austrian Economics = Market Anarchy. (ie. Markets in the absence of a state--meaning all goods including protection services like police are provided by market solutions.) Head on over to the Mises Institute and get yo learnin' on: http://www.mises.org/

[SeekLiberty]

There is no such thing as government. There are only people. If it is wrong for me to come to your house with a gun and demand that you pay me, then it is wrong for ANYONE to go to ANYONE else's house with a gun and demand that they be paid.

taxes=theft
war=murder

I'm sure you've all noticed that Paul is plugging the Austrian School of Economics an awful lot. What you might not yet be aware of is that Austrian Economics = Market Anarchy. (ie. markets in the absence of a state--meaning all goods including protection services like police are provided by market solutions.) head on over to the Mises Institute and educate yourselves: http://www.mises.org/

Excellent post!

The American Republic has been a grand experiment. The idea was for We The People (THE BOSS) to hire public servants to help us protect our Individual Rights and Property Rights. It was felt this was a necessary EVIL, and that our Constitution would LIMIT their powers and keep our public servants in check.

However, instead, our public servants have become so arrogant and disrespectful of us now as to believe they RULE us, their BOSS. Now our public servants have turned into a cabal of murderers, cons, liars, and thieves! Unfortunately we've been slack for many generations with our public servants and have failed to be vigilant ... which our forefathers warned us that we HAVE to be in order to keep our Republic.

For now, we have a lot of damage to be undone. For now, the correct course is to go back to where we started ... by implementing our Constitution by FORCING our public servants to OBEY it!

For now, the only right, proper, and correct Constitutional path to make this happen is right here:

http://www.amazon.com/Constitutional-Homeland-Security-Americans-Revitalize/dp/0967175925/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/002-8267830-3940011?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1183250593&sr=8-1

This is the answer. Trust me on this. Get the book. You'll thank me for recommending it later. :)

From your picture, I see you're young. I apologize for all the previous generations for not getting this taken care of sooner. They were happily doing their own thing, prospering from the Freedom our Founding Fathers faught for while our public servants we're slowly and slyly tricking them into slavery.

But America is finally waking up to this. I'm glad to see you are. You have a exciting time (to say the least) ahead of you. It's the energetic generation now that's going to bring back Liberty to America, and hopefully by example, to the world. Once again, our great American symbol, the Statue of Liberty, will mean and represent what actually IS and not just a faint symbol of what was.

Thank you for being here. I appreciate you being an aware young man. We need your help.

- SL

PS: Once the government has been brought down to the size where our public servants FEAR their BOSS (We The People) again, then at that point, future generations can re-evalute whether government is needed at all. So far, history is proving that ALL forms of government have turned into tyranny. America was no exception. Was it a failure in defects in our Constitution? Failure in the checks and balances? That's something for the future to decide. For now, let's just try to get back to our Constitution (which everybody can agree on) and then America can go from there.

[Ponce]

"When a government is not for it's people it is then the right of the people to take over the government for the people are the government"... Ponce

AND IT SAYS SO IN THE US CONSTITUTION WHICH BUSH CALLS "NOTHING BUT A PIECE OF PAPER".

[Kuldebar]

Government is not reason, it is not eloquence, it is force; like fire, a troublesome servant and a fearful master. Never for a moment should it be left to irresponsible action.

George Washington
(attributed source: January 7, 1790 in the Boston Independent Chronicle)

The above quote pretty much sums up the attributes of Government.

[Matt Collins]

To quote columnist Charley Reese: "Government is like a retarded giant - immensely powerful but incapable of anything but the most simple of tasks".

[Spirit of '76]

The originator of this one is still in dispute, but nonetheless this tells us all we need to about government:


That government is best which governs least.

[Oddball]

Neither good nor bad.

Gubmint, like a gun, is a neutral tool.

[Kuldebar]

Neither good nor bad.

Gubmint, like a gun, is a neutral tool.

It differs from a gun though. A gun doesn't grow in size and suddenly rage out of the wielder's control.

Fire is also a "tool" one of humankind's first tools... I think government is like fire, and many of the same precautions should apply.

[Kregener]

"It's hypocritical and childish to dismiss certain founding principles simply because a convenient rationale is needed to justify interventionist policies today. The principles enshrined in the Constitution do not change." – Ron Paul

"[Courts] routinely rubber stamp egregious violations of the 1st, 4th, and 5th Amendments, and allow Congress to legislate wildly outside the bounds of its enumerated powers." – Ron Paul

"Most of our mistakes can be laid at the doorstep of our failure to follow the Constitution." – Ron Paul

"We must rethink the very role of government in our society. Anything less, any tinkering or 'reform,' won’t cut it." – Ron Paul

"We forget that those powers not explicitly granted to Congress by the Constitution are inherently denied to Congress." – Ron Paul

"…politicians are not supposed to have power over us – we're supposed to be free. We seem to have forgotten that freedom means the absence of government coercion." – Ron Paul

"Remember that one's relationship with the state is never voluntary. Every government edict, policy, regulation, court decision, and law ultimately is backed up by force…. That is why political power must be fiercely constrained by the American people." – Ron Paul

"Our constitutional system…was designed to restrain political power and place limits on the size and scope of government." – Ron Paul

"In a free society, government is restrained – and therefore political power is less important. I believe the proper role for government in America is to provide national defense, a court system for civil disputes, a criminal justice system for acts of force and fraud, and little else." – Ron Paul

"...with truly limited government, [i]t simply would not matter much who occupied various political posts, since their ability to tax, spend, and regulate would be severely curtailed. This is why champions of political power promote an activist government that involves itself in every area of our lives from cradle to grave." – Ron Paul

"Political power is inherently dangerous in a free society: it threatens the rule of law, and thus threatens our fundamental freedoms. Those who understand this should object whenever political power is glorified." – Ron Paul

"We get into trouble by not following the precepts of liberty or obeying the rule of law." – Ron Paul

"Politicians throughout history have tried to solve every problem conceivable to man, always failing to recognize that many of the problems we face result from previous so-called political solutions. Government cannot be the answer to every human ill. Continuing to view more government as the solution to problems will only make matters worse." – Ron Paul

"Money and power are important only because the government wields power not granted by the Constitution. A limited, constitutional government would not tempt special interests to buy the politicians who wield power." – Ron Paul

"The big government nanny-state…assumes people are not smart or responsible enough to take care of themselves, and thus their needs must be filled through the government’s forcible redistribution of wealth. Our system of intervention assumes that politicians and bureaucrats have superior knowledge, and are endowed with certain talents that produce efficiency. These assumptions don’t seem to hold much water…"– Ron Paul

"With no consistent moral defense of true liberty, the continued erosion of personal and property rights is inevitable. This careless disregard for liberty, our traditions, and the Constitution have brought us disaster…"– Ron Paul

"A real solution to our problems will require a better understanding of, and greater dedication to, free markets and private property rights…. Our liberties and our prosperity depend on it." – Ron Paul

"…one has to wonder how Thomas Jefferson and Benjamin Franklin would react to the current state of affairs. After all, they were outraged by mere import tariffs of a few pennies on the dollar. Today, the average American pays roughly 50 percent of their income in direct and indirect taxes." – Ron Paul

"…[many] are not bashful about using government power to do 'good'…always speaking of the noble goals while ignoring the inevitable failures and evils caused by coercion…. Once we concede government has this ‘legitimate’ function … constitutional limits on power and its mandate to protect liberty are totally forgotten." – Ron Paul

"…government action rarely solves any problem, but rather worsens existing problems or creates altogether new ones." – Ron Paul

“But a Constitution of Government once changed from Freedom, can never be restored. Liberty, once lost, is lost forever.” ~ John Adams, letter to Abigail Adams, July 17, 1775

“Guard with jealous attention the public liberty. Suspect every one who approaches that jewel. Unfortunately, nothing will preserve it but downright force. Whenever you give up that force, you are inevitably ruined.” ~ Patrick Henry, speech in the Virginia Ratifying Convention, June 5, 1778

“He has erected a multitude of New Offices, and sent hither swarms of Officers to harass our people, and eat out their substance.” ~ Declaration of Independence, July 4, 1776

“I am commonly opposed to those who modestly assume the rank of champions of liberty, and make a very patriotic noise about the people. It is the stale artifice which has duped the world a thousand times, and yet, though detected, it is still successful. I love liberty as well as anybody. I am proud of it, as the true title of our people to distinction above others; but...I would guard it by making the laws strong enough to protect it.” ~ Fisher Ames, letter to George Richard Minot, June 23, 1789

“In selecting men for office, let principle be your guide. Regard not the particular sect or denomination of the candidate — look to his character.” ~ Noah Webster, Letters to a Young Gentleman Commencing His Education, 1789

"Government is not reason, it is not eloquence; it is force! Like fire, it is a dangerous servant and a fearful master."— Attributed to George Washington

"The people never give up their liberties but under some delusion."— Edmund Burke, 1729-1797, Irish Statesman

"Rightful liberty is unobstructed action according to our will within limits drawn around us by the equal rights of others. I do not add 'within the limits of the law,' because law is often but the tyrant's will, and always so when it violates the rights of the individual." — Thomas Jefferson

[Ponce]

You guys know what "freedom" means?........ privacy.

I moved into the woods of Oregon seven years ago after living in CA. for 30 years after getting out of the Army.

Here I don't know anyone and that's the way that I want to keep it because WTSHTF anyone that comes near me I will know that they are not my friends.

WTSHTF I will have my VA Dr. and his wife who is a trauma nurse move in with me and also my attorney from CA.

In case of no food the Dr will trade his services for food.....and I told him that, all that he could say was "Very smart of you to think that way Ponce" heheheheh :D

[andrewgreve]

You guys know what "freedom" means?........ privacy.



Essentially, the idea is that we can't be truly free unless we control how much, if any, information we reveal about ourselves to the people we deal with. Having the ability to be anonymous is both securing and liberating.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crypto-anarchism

"Crypto-anarchism is a philosophy that expounds the use of strong public-key cryptography to enforce privacy and individual freedom. It is a cyberspatial realization of anarchism.[1] Crypto-anarchists aim to create cryptographic software that can be used to evade prosecution and harassment while sending and receiving information in computer networks.

With the help of the software mentioned the connection between the identity of a certain user or organisation and the pseudonym used is almost entirely unprovable unless the user reveals the connection. It is even difficult to say which country's laws will be ignored, as even the location (country) of a certain participant is unknown. In a sense, the encrypted anonymous networks (the "cipherspace") can be regarded as an independent, lawless territory. However, participants may voluntarily create new laws using smart contracts or depend on online reputation."

[SeekLiberty]

You guys know what "freedom" means?........ privacy.

I moved into the woods of Oregon seven years ago after living in CA. for 30 years after getting out of the Army.

Here I don't know anyone and that's the way that I want to keep it because WTSHTF anyone that comes near me I will know that they are not my friends.

WTSHTF I will have my VA Dr. and his wife who is a trauma nurse move in with me and also my attorney from CA.

In case of no food the Dr will trade his services for food.....and I told him that, all that he could say was "Very smart of you to think that way Ponce" heheheheh :D

Excellent! I love rugged individualism!

Personally, I'm making plans to move to Sundance, Wyoming to help in the Free State Wyoming project, which IMO is an easier state to Free. Boston T. Party is on a race to beat the Free State New Hampshire project. :D

BTW, here's the website for it ...

http://www.freestatewyoming.org/

To read a realistic scenario on how a State can become free, I highly suggest the book by Boston T. Party called "Molon Labe'."

- SL

[MsDoodahs]

There is no such thing as government. There are only people. If it is wrong for me to come to your house with a gun and demand that you pay me, then it is wrong for ANYONE to go to ANYONE else's house with a gun and demand that they be paid.

taxes=theft
war=murder

I'm sure you've all noticed that Paul is plugging the Austrian School of Economics an awful lot. What you might not yet be aware of is that Austrian Economics = Market Anarchy. (ie. Markets in the absence of a state--meaning all goods including protection services like police are provided by market solutions.) Head on over to the Mises Institute and get yo learnin' on: http://www.mises.org/


:D

[Kregener]

"Market Solutions" means gun sales too...as in...protect yourself.