Nunes: Trump transition members were under surveillance during Obama administration

[Brian4Liberty]

Nunes: Trump transition members were under surveillance during Obama administration (https://secure.politico.com/story/2017/03/devin-nunes-donald-trump-surveillance-obama-236366)
By Austin Wright - 03/22/17


Members of the Donald Trump transition team, possibly including Trump himself, were under U.S. government surveillance following November’s presidential election, House Intelligence Chairman Devin Nunes (R-Calif.) told reporters Wednesday.

Nunes said the monitoring appeared to be done legally as a result of what's called "incidental collection," but said he was concerned because it was not related to the FBI’s investigation into Russia’s meddling in the election and was widely disseminated across the intelligence community.

“I have seen intelligence reports that clearly show that the president-elect and his team were, I guess, at least monitored,” Nunes told reporters. “It looks to me like it was all legally collected, but it was essentially a lot of information on the president-elect and his transition team and what they were doing.”
...
More: https://secure.politico.com/story/2017/03/devin-nunes-donald-trump-surveillance-obama-236366

[silverhandorder]

Oh ho ho. Life comes at you fast [Mod Edit].

[randomname]

I wonder if all Republican nominees were under such "incidental" surveillance so they could be damaged through leaks?

[CPUd]

I wonder if all Republican nominees were under such "incidental" surveillance so they could be damaged through leaks?

incidental surveillance knows no party bounds.

[Brian4Liberty]

Revealed: Intelligence Community Collected and Shared Information about Trump Transition People (http://ronpaulinstitute.org/archives/peace-and-prosperity/2017/march/22/revealed-intelligence-community-collected-and-shared-information-about-trump-transition-people/)
Written by Adam Dick - Wednesday March 22, 2017


Early information arising from a US House of Representatives Intelligence Committee investigation into possible United States government spying on Donald Trump and people associated with him appears to show that information about individuals associated with Trump and his presidential transition was collected through surveillance by, and was widely distributed in, the US intelligence community.

Rep. Devin Nunes (R-CA), chairman of the House Intelligence Committee, told reporters Wednesday that “on numerous occasions the intelligence community incidentally collected information about US citizens involved in the Trump transition” and that “details about US persons associated with the incoming administration — details with little or no apparent foreign intelligence value — were widely disseminated in intelligence community reporting.”

Nunez also stated in a press release Wednesday that he has “asked the Directors of the FBI, NSA, and CIA to expeditiously comply with my March 15 letter, and to provide a full account of” related surveillance activities.

Nunes’ discussion of the information being “incidentally collected” and then being widely distributed despite having little or no apparent foreign intelligence value highlights a reason to reject the common claim that people who have done nothing wrong have no reason to worry about mass surveillance. When you allow surveillance to run wild, then information that has nothing to do with the supposed purposes of the surveillance, such as protecting Americans from terrorist attacks, can be easily and frequently swept up and shared.

It is naïve to believe that none of the people who obtain the surveillance-derived information will then use it to their advantage, even if that results in harm to the people “incidentally” surveilled. It is also naïve to assume that surveillance efforts will not be adjusted here and there to make sure that more of the desired, but definable as “incidentally collected,” information is obtained and shared.
...
http://ronpaulinstitute.org/archives/peace-and-prosperity/2017/march/22/revealed-intelligence-community-collected-and-shared-information-about-trump-transition-people/

[otherone]

"Legally" "collected".
Nothing to see here, folks.

[CaptUSA]

Lindsey's on CNN right now saying if he was being spied on, it'd be bad.

Love it. So if they listen to us, no problem; but Lindsey??? Oh noooo!

[CaptUSA]

I wonder if all Republican nominees were under such "incidental" surveillance so they could be damaged through leaks?

Um. Everybody is under surveillance. All the time. Are we still figuring that out? All. The. Time. Everyone.

[RPtotheWH]

Its like slow motion watching people get egg on their face.

[otherone]

Lindsey's on CNN right now saying if he was being spied on, it'd be bad.



"Hello? Yes...I'd like to order one Filipino lady-boy..."


http://i.huffpost.com/gen/2726242/images/o-LINDSEY-GRAHAM-PHONE-facebook.jpg

[phill4paul]

"Hello? Yes...I'd like to order one Filipino lady-boy..."


http://i.huffpost.com/gen/2726242/images/o-LINDSEY-GRAHAM-PHONE-facebook.jpg

I regret I have no rep to give for a full throttle belly laugh.

[otherone]

I regret I have no rep to give for a full throttle belly laugh.

"Hey Lindsey. No, it's not good news. You should probably get tested, too..."
http://www.msnbc.com/sites/msnbc/files/2012/11/us_libya_attack_jpeg-0f57c_2.jpg

[TheCount]

I wonder if all Republican nominees were under such "incidental" surveillance so they could be damaged through leaks?Yes, the nefarious plan to acquire damaging information and then not use it until after the person is elected.

[PatriotOne]

Incidental collection? Widely disseminated throughout the intelligence community? Not even related to the Russian investigation? And yet this is new info after months of spreading the Russian narrative throughout the news? Wow. Mile high vat of bullshit there.

[Swordsmyth]

Yes, the nefarious plan to acquire damaging information and then not use it until after the person is elected.

Yeah, it is called blackmail, and THEY do it to all sides and eachother.

[PatriotOne]

To me, the real shocker is that after no doubt surveilling a billionaire like Trump is that couldn't even find anything worthy of embarrassing him, at the very least, with. Hell, they could have found numerous things to, at the very least, embarrass me with and I'm a 50+ yr old honest grandmother.

[Gumba of Liberty]

To me, the real shocker is that after no doubt surveilling a billionaire like Trump is that couldn't even find anything worthy of embarrassing him, at the very least, with. Hell, they could have found numerous things to, at the very least, embarrass me with and I'm a 50+ yr old honest grandmother.

+1

Seriously, I would be screwed. "Grab 'em by the pu$$y" was the best they had and, to tell you the truth, I don't think it hurt him. Some of my "urban" buddies were all about it.

[PatriotOne]

+1

Seriously, I would be screwed. "Grab 'em by the pu$$y" was the best they had and, to tell you the truth, I don't think it hurt him. Some of my "urban" buddies were all about it.


Only a female liberal and the pussified men care about locker room talk.

[CPUd]

Schiff: There is now 'more than circumstantial evidence' of Trump-Russia collusion
By MADELINE CONWAY 03/22/17 06:15 PM EDT


Rep. Adam Schiff, the top Democrat on the House Intelligence Committee, said Wednesday that there is “more than circumstantial evidence now” to suggest that President Donald Trump’s campaign may have colluded with Russia’s attempts to disrupt the election, but he would not offer details.

“I can tell you that the case is more than that,” Schiff told Chuck Todd on MSNBC. “And I can’t go into the particulars, but there is more than circumstantial evidence now.”

When Todd followed up, asking if he had “seen direct evidence of collusion,” Schiff would not say so directly, but insisted that he has seen some “evidence that is not circumstantial” and is worth investigating.

“I don’t want to go into specifics, but I will say that there is evidence that is not circumstantial and is very much worthy of investigation, so that is what we ought to do,” Schiff said.

The FBI is currently investigating any links between the Trump campaign and Russia and whether the two parties coordinated with Russia’s suspected cyberattacks on Democratic Party officials before the election.

Trump and his aides have repeatedly denied any such wrongdoing. While Democrats have been raising questions about the president’s relationship with Russia for months, no public evidence has emerged to tie him or his associates directly to the cyberattacks.

http://www.politico.com/story/2017/03/schiff-russia-trump-collusion-236386

[RPtotheWH]

http://www.politico.com/story/2017/03/schiff-russia-trump-collusion-236386

Schiff says there is evidence worthy of investigation? Another one? Also how did the Russians affect the election?

[AngryCanadian]

Meanwhile idiotic liberals on twitter are still going with the Russian Hysteria.

[AngryCanadian]

http://www.politico.com/story/2017/03/schiff-russia-trump-collusion-236386

Ah Yes Schiff that jack ass.

You should problary remove that you stand with Rand but with Schiff.

[AngryCanadian]

http://www.politico.com/story/2017/03/schiff-russia-trump-collusion-236386

This is the same Schiff jack ass whom got owned on FOX News. Maybe you should stop worshiping his behind.

[silverhandorder]

Little CPUd likes democrats.

[CPUd]

This is the same Schiff jack ass whom got owned on FOX News. Maybe you should stop worshiping his behind.

You realize they are on the same committee?

[PatriotOne]

844625269042368512

844625711323402241

844625943096442880

844631986560008193

Eamon Javers is a Washington Reporter for CNBC + wrote a book on corporate espionage. Economy, politics, spies, etc.

[CPUd]

They probably have got Manafort, too. He was in deeper than Flynn, and Manafort has already hired damage control.

[kpitcher]

I wonder if all Republican nominees were under such "incidental" surveillance so they could be damaged through leaks?

Were any other Republican nominees or their close supporters talking to the Russian Ambassador to get caught in the dragnet?

[UWDude]

Yes, the nefarious plan to acquire damaging information and then not use it until after the person is elected.

Problem was, there was no damaging information. The whole Russia thing was a ruse and misdirection.

[CPUd]

White House distances Trump from Manafort
BY JORDAN FABIAN - 03/22/17 08:47 PM EDT 91


The White House on Wednesday rushed to distance itself from President Trump’s former campaign chairman, Paul Manafort, saying Trump did not know of his secret work for a Russian oligarch.

“The president was not aware of Paul’s clients from the last decade,” White House press secretary Sean Spicer told reporters.

Spicer was responding to a bombshell Associated Press report revealing that Manafort signed a multimillion-dollar contract beginning in 2006 with Oleg Deripaska, a close associate of Vladimir Putin, to help advance the Russian leader’s interests around the world.

The story fueled the growing controversy over the Trump team’s ties to Russia, which was rekindled Monday when FBI Director James Comey publicly confirmed the bureau is investigating whether Trump associates coordinated with Moscow during the 2016 presidential election.

Trump officials initially declined to comment on the Manafort story, saying they wouldn’t speak about a non-White House employee. But facing a barrage of questions during his daily briefing, Spicer sought to minimize the nature of Manafort’s work as well as his standing in Trump’s orbit.

Spicer said the AP report did not reference any action by the president, the White House or any administration official, while adding there is no indication Manafort did “anything improper” by signing an agreement with Deripaska.

Spicer at times became flustered at the line of questioning, saying it was “insane” for Trump to be aware of Manafort’s business arrangements.

“What else don’t we know? I mean, where he went to school, what grades he got, who he played with in the sandbox?”

He also stressed that Manafort was “hired to oversee the campaign’s delegate operation” and spent “just under five months” on the Trump campaign.

But the White House’s efforts to cast Manafort as a bit player have often strained credulity.

Spicer on Monday described the former campaign chairman as someone “who played a very limited role for a very limited amount of time.” He also said Manafort was hired in June, even though he was brought on board in March.

That comment generated pushback even from allies of the president.

“I’ve know Paul a long time. I have a lot of respect for him. I worked very closely with him. I don’t think we can describe Paul’s role as limited,” financier Anthony Scaramucci, who worked on Trump’s transition team, said on CNN.

Spicer backtracked on Wednesday. “Clearly, I should have been more precise with respect to Paul’s role,” he said.

Manafort took over as de facto campaign manager after Trump fired Corey Lewandowski from the job in June. “Paul’s in charge,” Spicer, who was then communications director of the Republican National Committee, told Reuters at the time.

The longtime GOP operative was eventually dismissed from the campaign in August amid a swirling controversy around his work for a pro-Russia political party in Ukraine. Manafort is facing allegations that he was paid millions of dollars as part of the arrangement.

But even after his dismissal, Manafort was not entirely banished from Trump’s orbit.

Manafort has said privately that he still speaks to the president by phone, according to the AP. His former deputy, Rick Gates, now leads a pro-Trump outside group called America First Policies.

The new revelation about Manafort’s work for Russia has revived questions about whether Trump properly vetted individuals who worked for his campaign, transition and now his administration.

Many of those individuals have found themselves the center of the controversy over Russia.

Former national security adviser Michael Flynn resigned last month after it was revealed that he misled senior officials about his conversations with Russia’s ambassador to the U.S.

Flynn was hired for the top security job even though he informed lawyers on the Trump transition that he intended to register as a foreign agent for work he did on behalf of a businessman aligned with the Turkish government.

Asked Wednesday if he could say whether there is anyone in the White House working in the interest of a foreign government, Spicer declined to definitively rule it out.

“I can tell you that every form has been filled out,” Spicer said, referring to clearance paperwork needed for national security roles.

“To sit here and ask me whether I can vouch for, whatever it is, a few hundred people, that have filled out everything, you know, that would be ridiculous,” he said.

With headlines mounting over Trump’s links to Russia, the White House has also worked furiously to change the subject.

Spicer portrayed the Manafort story as proof of media bias, floating ties between Trump’s 2016 Democratic opponent, Hillary Clinton, and Russian interests.

He noted lobbying work done by Tony Podesta, the brother of Clinton campaign chairman John Podesta, against Russian sanctions, as well as a deal to sell American uranium deposits to a Russian company, which occurred while Clinton served as secretary of State during the Obama administration.

The spokesman also recited the new assertion from House Intelligence Committee Chairman Devin Nunes (R-Calif.) that members of Trump’s transition team had their communications inadvertently swept up in legal U.S. surveillance.

In an unusual move, Nunes rushed to the White House Wednesday afternoon to brief Trump. The president later told reporters he felt “somewhat” vindicated by Nunes’s findings, even though they did not corroborate his claim that former President Obama wiretapped Trump Tower during the campaign.

Trump did not address the Manafort story.

http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/325334-white-house-distances-trump-from-manafort

[dannno]

http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/325334-white-house-distances-trump-from-manafort


according to interviews with several people familiar with payments to Manafort and business records obtained by the AP.


So do you actually believe this bullshit or what?

[AngryCanadian]

You realize they are on the same committee?

You realize one lunatic still wont accept that Hillary lost right? or maybe u were hoping that she would win?

[AngryCanadian]

So do you actually believe this bull$#@! or what?

Sounds like the Western News Media are trying their best to bring down Trump. In any way they could possible do.

[fr33]

Can someone explain to me why Russia is the new boogeyman to people like CPUd? I don't get it at all.

[UWDude]

Can someone explain to me why Russia is the new boogeyman to people like CPUd? I don't get it at all.

That is who they are told the boogyman is. Because Russia is interfering with the grand chess game going on in Syria. And Russia is doing so because they realized in the grand chess game, they are the king. Not the most powerful, but the ultimate target and end game.

[AngryCanadian]

That is who they are told the boogyman is. Because Russia is interfering with the grand chess game going on in Syria. And Russia is doing so because they realized in the grand chess game, they are the king. Not the most powerful, but the ultimate target and end game.

My friend the US gov/deep state cant really do anything in Syria nor Ukraine its a done deal. Its game over for the elites. I hope those idiotic liberals reazlie that Russia is a nation of 8k or so WMDs enough to destroy our world.

[fr33]

That is who they are told the boogyman is. Because Russia is interfering with the grand chess game going on in Syria. And Russia is doing so because they realized in the grand chess game, they are the king. Not the most powerful, but the ultimate target and end game.

It's insane just like all of our foreign policy and media spin. We've been installing military bases and weapons within 1 gas tank's worth of driving from Russia's capital and destabilizing everything in the middle east and these fucking retards think Russia is the bad guy.... Almost every other candidate has done business with, or is doing business with, countries far worse than Russia but these fucking idiots will post "Russia" as if it should elicit some some gasping/pearl-clutching response.

[UWDude]

My friend the US gov/deep state cant really do anything in Syria nor Ukraine its a done deal. Its game over for the elites. I hope those idiotic liberals reazlie that Russia is a nation of 8k or so WMDs enough to destroy our world.

Their last hope is to cause civil war in the United States, to try and draw Russia and China in.

[CPUd]

Can someone explain to me why Russia is the new boogeyman to people like CPUd? I don't get it at all.

Where have I ever called Russia the boogeyman?

[Brian4Liberty]

Can someone explain to me why Russia is the new boogeyman to people like CPUd? I don't get it at all.

Neocons.

[CPUd]

You realize one lunatic still wont accept that Hillary lost right? or maybe u were hoping that she would win?

I was hoping for Rand to win, since Ron didn't win in 2012.

[AngryCanadian]

Their last hope is to cause civil war in the United States, to try and draw Russia and China in.

I do hope some of these democrats are exposed when some are screaming Russia and Russia that means they have something to hide, and clearer this shows a lot. According to some an Ukrainian arms dealer used held a fundraising for Adam Schiff in his town.

[CPUd]

So do you actually believe this bullshit or what?

Yeah, I'd have to agree to some extent. Manafort is dirty as fuck. It's been out in the open for years, not sure why they are just now treating it like new info.

[UWDude]

Tomorrow CPU'd and Zippy will be posting all the articles for us about Nune's "shady" Russian ties and "disconcerting" Russia connections.

[fr33]

Where have I ever called Russia the boogeyman?

It's a figure of speech. In this very thread you respond with a "Trump-Russia collusion" and about Trump's employees being "in deep" with the Russians. And it's not only this thread. You've been doing this for months. Why are you so scared of Russia?

[UWDude]

Where have I ever called Russia the boogeyman?

LoL

Trump wasn't wiretapped, (technically he wasn't) and CPUd never called Russia a boogyman (technically zhi never did).

[CPUd]

It's a figure of speech. In this very thread you respond with a "Trump-Russia collusion" and about Trump's employees being "in deep" with the Russians. And it's not only this thread. You've been doing this for months. Why are you so scared of Russia?

I'm not afraid of them. The collusion (IMO) is just some of the Trump people trying to make a few bucks, with the hopes of their newfound power getting them there a bit faster.

[UWDude]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2eqKIvrf7r4

Nunes Press conference here.
At 11:00 he is asked if the information was stored and retrieved, or collectly quickly. He says it was gathered quickly... ...meaning it was direct surveillance.


He also stresses during the press conference that all the surveillance appeared legal, but was still upsetting, and the American people would need to know about it.

In Obama's last three weeks, he gave an order that all intelligence agencies can share intelligence with each other.


https://twitter.com/Snowden/status/844611686682181632
Right or wrong, if a spy agency -- via any method -- intercepts, copies, or otherwise reviews your communications, they have spied on you.
22 Mar 2017 (https://twitter.com/Snowden/status/844611686682181632)

Snowden's Twitter

[enhanced_deficit]

http://i.magaimg.net/img/65e.jpg



Chances of Obama's birthday being made a national holiday have got slimmer now.

[CPUd]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DmD31LO5WfM

[timosman]

844638087829487616

[Mordan]

I was hoping for Rand to win, since Ron didn't win in 2012.

Appeal to emotions to bring people to your side. Paid shill. Who wastes his time replying with Wapo and CNN links on a libertarian forum? You are bought and paid for.
People should just stop answering CPU. I stopped reading his linked post. Only read his one liners for giggles.

[CPUd]

Appeal to emotions to bring people to your side. Paid shill. Who wastes his time replying with Wapo and CNN links on a libertarian forum? You are bought and paid for.
People should just stop answering CPU. I stopped reading his linked post. Only read his one liners for giggles.

You know you can't quit me,

[undergroundrr]

This site is so weird. Russia is a big, militaristic, oppressive nation-state just like the USA. Why are people here Russia fans?

Russia is a homicide machine, subject to rule by whatever nefarious regime happens to come up victorious at any given time. Congrats on Putin for hanging on for so long. He's really butch.

Russia is a massive boogeyman. So is France, Germany, USA, Saudi Arabia, Pakistan, China, Iran, Israel. They all suck and need to be dismantled just like the USA. They all spy on other people, they all spy on their own people, they all murder like psychopaths. I think Russia sucks. You're a state-licker if you don't think so.

Signed - paid shill, MSM sheeple and Hillary plant undergroundrr

[UWDude]

This site is so weird. Russia is a big, militaristic, oppressive nation-state just like the USA. Why are people here Russia fans?

Russia is a homicide machine, subject to rule by whatever nefarious regime happens to come up victorious at any given time. Congrats on Putin for hanging on for so long. He's really butch.

Russia is a massive boogeyman. So is France, Germany, USA, Saudi Arabia, Pakistan, China, Iran, Israel. They all suck and need to be dismantled just like the USA. They all spy on other people, they all spy on their own people, they all murder like psychopaths. I think Russia sucks. You're a state-licker if you don't think so.

Signed - paid shill, MSM sheeple and Hillary plant undergroundrr

Like you know anything about Russia.

[dannno]

This site is so weird. Russia is a big, militaristic, oppressive nation-state just like the USA. Why are people here Russia fans?

Russia is a homicide machine, subject to rule by whatever nefarious regime happens to come up victorious at any given time. Congrats on Putin for hanging on for so long. He's really butch.

Russia is a massive boogeyman. So is France, Germany, USA, Saudi Arabia, Pakistan, China, Iran, Israel. They all suck and need to be dismantled just like the USA. They all spy on other people, they all spy on their own people, they all murder like psychopaths. I think Russia sucks. You're a state-licker if you don't think so.

Signed - paid shill, MSM sheeple and Hillary plant undergroundrr

This post wreaks of being literally totally 100% ignorant about how the deep state operates.

[RJB]

Congrats! This demonstrates "strawmanning" much better than the example that I posted yesterday.


This site is so weird. Russia is a big, militaristic, oppressive nation-state just like the USA. Why are people here Russia fans?

Russia is a homicide machine, subject to rule by whatever nefarious regime happens to come up victorious at any given time. Congrats on Putin for hanging on for so long. He's really butch.

Russia is a massive boogeyman. So is France, Germany, USA, Saudi Arabia, Pakistan, China, Iran, Israel. They all suck and need to be dismantled just like the USA. They all spy on other people, they all spy on their own people, they all murder like psychopaths. I think Russia sucks. You're a state-licker if you don't think so.

Signed - paid shill, MSM sheeple and Hillary plant undergroundrr

[CPUd]

http://i.imgur.com/Vuuugv6.png

http://i.imgur.com/uJ7t1iQ.jpg

[TER]

This site is so weird. Russia is a big, militaristic, oppressive nation-state just like the USA. Why are people here Russia fans?

Russia is a homicide machine, subject to rule by whatever nefarious regime happens to come up victorious at any given time. Congrats on Putin for hanging on for so long. He's really butch.

Russia is a massive boogeyman. So is France, Germany, USA, Saudi Arabia, Pakistan, China, Iran, Israel. They all suck and need to be dismantled just like the USA. They all spy on other people, they all spy on their own people, they all murder like psychopaths. I think Russia sucks. You're a state-licker if you don't think so.

Signed - paid shill, MSM sheeple and Hillary plant undergroundrr

Russia is not the USSR of 50 years ago.

And America is not the USA of 50 years ago.

The biggest threat to world peace is not coming from Russia, but the USA.

As an American citizen, born and raised here, it kills me to say this, but it is what it is.

As a Christian, I will support those nations which protect Christians and the innocent and not support the ones which supply arms to create genocides of them, regardless of where I was born.

There are greater things in life than national citizenship and identity, at least for Christians.

[timosman]

Russia is not the USSR of 50 years ago.

And America is not the USA of 50 years ago.

The biggest threat to world peace is not coming from Russia, but the USA.

As an American citizen, born and raised here, it kills me to say this, but it is what it is.

Think for a second what if you happen to be on the wrong end of the worldwide outrage for not opposing the terror.
TPTB will gladly throw you under the bus just to calm things down a bit. :cool:

[TER]

Think for a second what if you happen to be on the wrong end of the worldwide outrage for not opposing the terror. :cool:

I don't understand. Can you rephrase that?

[undergroundrr]

Think for a second what if you happen to be on the wrong end of the worldwide outrage for not opposing the terror.

LOL Yeah, that's where trump is. Ending the war on terror, 50 babies at a time.

[QUOTE]Reports: US Airstrikes Killed 230 Civilians in Mosul Overnight
Over 130 Civilians Killed in Attack on a Single Building in Western Mosul
by Jason Ditz, March 23, 2017
Print This | Share This
As the US airstrikes in the Iraqi city of Mosul are increasingly concentrated around densely populated neighborhoods in the city’s west, the death toll from those airstrikes in spiraling rapidly out of control, with the most recent figures out of the area suggesting around 230 civilians were killed overnight in US and coalition strikes in just a single neighborhood.

That’s an enormous toll, of course, but is reported from several sources telling largely the same story, including that a single US airstrike against a large building full of civilians in Mosul killed over 130 people, while the other 100 or so were killed in the surrounding area.

Central Command said that they were “aware of the loss of life” and were carrying out “further investigation,” while insisting that all of their strikes against Mosul overnight “comply with the Law of Armed Conflict.” Centcom’s official report for the overnight strikes claimed they’d hit “11 fighting positions” and didn’t mention killing hundreds of civilians.

Britain’s Daily Telegraph reported that the civilian death toll was mostly women and children, saying that the bulk of the bodies were pulled from just three adjoining residences in the Jadida neighborhood. They speculated the civilians were “human shields” for ISIS snipers in the area.

That would be an awful lot of human shields, of course, and there wouldn’t be much point of stashing them inside buildings where the US forces clearly either didn’t know where they were or didn’t feel it amounted to a deterrent to bombing those buildings anyhow.

If the toll is ultimately confirmed by Centcom, which is a huge “if” given how often well documented incidents never end up on their official reports, it would roughly double the number of civilians the US has admitted to killing in Iraq and Syria over the ISIS war. NGOs have suggested the US strikes have killed well over 2,000 civilians already, and that’s not including last night’s massive toll.[QUOTE]

[Brian4Liberty]

This site is so weird. Russia is a big, militaristic, oppressive nation-state just like the USA. Why are people here Russia fans?

Being against the neoconservative, leftist and MIC war on Russia is not the same as being "Russia fans". It's a big part of what Ron Paul talks about on a daily basis, so there is nothing weird about it being on this forum.

Now it should be obvious that an outlet like RT is going to be favorable to Russia, and not so favorable to US interests that are always trying to push Russia into a corner. They have an agenda, and it is helpful to them to have Ron Paul on to give his opinions on non-aggression. It doesn't mean that Ron is a "Russia fan".


Where have I ever called Russia the boogeyman?

Can you list forum members who are pro-Russia activists, as opposed to Ron Paul style peace, prosperity and anti-aggression people?

[TheCount]

This site is so weird. Russia is a big, militaristic, oppressive nation-state just like the USA. Why are people here Russia fans?They agree with the things that Russian state media says, and as a result they consume an enormous amount of propaganda.

[Mordan]

ты ничего не знаешь

В России проблемы есть... дороги и дураки....


This site is so weird. Russia is a big, militaristic, oppressive nation-state just like the USA. Why are people here Russia fans?

Russia is a homicide machine, subject to rule by whatever nefarious regime happens to come up victorious at any given time. Congrats on Putin for hanging on for so long. He's really butch.

Russia is a massive boogeyman. So is France, Germany, USA, Saudi Arabia, Pakistan, China, Iran, Israel. They all suck and need to be dismantled just like the USA. They all spy on other people, they all spy on their own people, they all murder like psychopaths. I think Russia sucks. You're a state-licker if you don't think so.

Signed - paid shill, MSM sheeple and Hillary plant undergroundrr

[phill4paul]

ты ничего не знаешь

В России проблемы есть... дороги и дураки....

In America we speak American.

[undergroundrr]

ты ничего не знаешь

В России проблемы есть... дороги и дураки....

LOL Google translate


you know nothing

In Russia there are problems ... roads and fools ....

Muh roads!

[phill4paul]

My personal view is that everybody is under surveillance by somebody. Everybody. I happen to think every president has been taped/spied on since 1926 or so. Sure presidents were spied on before then, but I think Hoover became, well, a vacuum. Obama may have thought that it was HE that was spying on Trump, but he were being spied on to. Pointing figures at trees in the middle of an Appalacian National Park is kind of rediculous

[Marenco]

My personal view is that everybody is under surveillance by somebody. Everybody. I happen to think every president has been taped/spied on since 1926 or so. Sure presidents were spied on before then, but I think Hoover became, well, a vacuum. Obama may have thought that it was HE that was spying on Trump, but he were being spied on to. Pointing figures at trees in the middle of an Appalacian National Park is kind of rediculous

Exactly. They're doing this crap to practically all of us, which should be a huge scandal in and of itself.

[fr33]

This site is so weird. Russia is a big, militaristic, oppressive nation-state just like the USA. Why are people here Russia fans?

Russia is a homicide machine, subject to rule by whatever nefarious regime happens to come up victorious at any given time. Congrats on Putin for hanging on for so long. He's really butch.

Russia is a massive boogeyman. So is France, Germany, USA, Saudi Arabia, Pakistan, China, Iran, Israel. They all suck and need to be dismantled just like the USA. They all spy on other people, they all spy on their own people, they all murder like psychopaths. I think Russia sucks. You're a state-licker if you don't think so.

Signed - paid shill, MSM sheeple and Hillary plant undergroundrr




LOL Yeah, that's where trump is. Ending the war on terror, 50 babies at a time.


Reports: US Airstrikes Killed 230 Civilians in Mosul Overnight
Over 130 Civilians Killed in Attack on a Single Building in Western Mosul
by Jason Ditz, March 23, 2017
Print This | Share This
As the US airstrikes in the Iraqi city of Mosul are increasingly concentrated around densely populated neighborhoods in the city’s west, the death toll from those airstrikes in spiraling rapidly out of control, with the most recent figures out of the area suggesting around 230 civilians were killed overnight in US and coalition strikes in just a single neighborhood.

That’s an enormous toll, of course, but is reported from several sources telling largely the same story, including that a single US airstrike against a large building full of civilians in Mosul killed over 130 people, while the other 100 or so were killed in the surrounding area.

Central Command said that they were “aware of the loss of life” and were carrying out “further investigation,” while insisting that all of their strikes against Mosul overnight “comply with the Law of Armed Conflict.” Centcom’s official report for the overnight strikes claimed they’d hit “11 fighting positions” and didn’t mention killing hundreds of civilians.

Britain’s Daily Telegraph reported that the civilian death toll was mostly women and children, saying that the bulk of the bodies were pulled from just three adjoining residences in the Jadida neighborhood. They speculated the civilians were “human shields” for ISIS snipers in the area.

That would be an awful lot of human shields, of course, and there wouldn’t be much point of stashing them inside buildings where the US forces clearly either didn’t know where they were or didn’t feel it amounted to a deterrent to bombing those buildings anyhow.

If the toll is ultimately confirmed by Centcom, which is a huge “if” given how often well documented incidents never end up on their official reports, it would roughly double the number of civilians the US has admitted to killing in Iraq and Syria over the ISIS war. NGOs have suggested the US strikes have killed well over 2,000 civilians already, and that’s not including last night’s massive toll.

The 2nd post is a pretty good response to the 1st post. The US is Jekyll Island while Russia is Jesse James.

[TER]

They agree with the things that Russian state media says, and as a result they consume an enormous amount of propaganda.

What are those things exactly that 'they' (who I am guessing are the posters here who prefer good relations with Russia instead of bad relations) agree with in regards to what the Russian State media propaganda says? That the US government is supplying arms to terorists? That the US government is manufacturing coups, overthrowing elected leaders, and creating instability in the Middle East and elsewhere around the world?

Who is being deceived and what are the lies that 'they' have fallen for?

Please, since I imagine you think of me as being part of the they, tell me what Russian propaganda lies I have fallen for.

[r3volution 3.0]

Zero (0)

What is, the number of shits I give about pro-PATRIOT Act politician being spied on?


This site is so weird. Russia is a big, militaristic, oppressive nation-state just like the USA. Why are people here Russia fans?

The same reason that so many people became Trump fans simply because they hated Hillary, or Obama fans simply because they hated Bush, etc.

...enemy of my enemy fallacy.

[TER]

The same reason that so many people became Trump fans simply because they hated Hillary, or Obama fans simply because they hated Bush, etc.

...enemy of my enemy fallacy.

Who is it 'they' hate then, that they want the US and Russia to have good relations?

[r3volution 3.0]

Who is it 'they' hate then, that they want the US and Russia to have good relations?

It's one thing to oppose to the US' aggressive policy toward Russia (as virtually everyone at RPF has always done).

It's something else entirely to view the Russian state as some kid of champion of liberty (as some here do).

...let alone to think Trump and the Russian government are cooperating to "fight the establishment."

That is delusion.

[Jamesiv1]

It's one thing to oppose to the US' aggressive policy toward Russia (as virtually everyone at RPF has always done).

It's something else entirely to view the Russian state as some kind of champion of liberty (as some here do).

...let alone to think Trump and the Russian government are cooperating to "fight the establishment."

That is delusion.
Please give an example of a post that "views the Russian state as some kind of champion of liberty".

Please give an example of a post that even remotely suggests that "Trump and the Russian government are cooperating to 'fight the establishment.' "

[specsaregood]

It's something else entirely to view the Russian state as some kid of champion of liberty (as some here do).
...let alone to think Trump and the Russian government are cooperating to "fight the establishment."
That is delusion.

And it is something else entirely between viewing them as a champion of liberty and seeing them as allies in a fight against globalist and social agendas that some of us disagree with.

[TER]

I wonder who are the ones being indoctrinated by state propoganda...


The ones who want to see better US-Russian relations, or the ones who see Russia as the greatest threat to the world and our worst enemy.

[RPtotheWH]

[QUOTE=undergroundrr;6438994]LOL Yeah, that's where trump is. Ending the war on terror, 50 babies at a time.

[QUOTE]Reports: US Airstrikes Killed 230 Civilians in Mosul Overnight
Over 130 Civilians Killed in Attack on a Single Building in Western Mosul
by Jason Ditz, March 23, 2017
Print This | Share This
As the US airstrikes in the Iraqi city of Mosul are increasingly concentrated around densely populated neighborhoods in the city’s west, the death toll from those airstrikes in spiraling rapidly out of control, with the most recent figures out of the area suggesting around 230 civilians were killed overnight in US and coalition strikes in just a single neighborhood.

That’s an enormous toll, of course, but is reported from several sources telling largely the same story, including that a single US airstrike against a large building full of civilians in Mosul killed over 130 people, while the other 100 or so were killed in the surrounding area.

Central Command said that they were “aware of the loss of life” and were carrying out “further investigation,” while insisting that all of their strikes against Mosul overnight “comply with the Law of Armed Conflict.” Centcom’s official report for the overnight strikes claimed they’d hit “11 fighting positions” and didn’t mention killing hundreds of civilians.

Britain’s Daily Telegraph reported that the civilian death toll was mostly women and children, saying that the bulk of the bodies were pulled from just three adjoining residences in the Jadida neighborhood. They speculated the civilians were “human shields” for ISIS snipers in the area.

That would be an awful lot of human shields, of course, and there wouldn’t be much point of stashing them inside buildings where the US forces clearly either didn’t know where they were or didn’t feel it amounted to a deterrent to bombing those buildings anyhow.

If the toll is ultimately confirmed by Centcom, which is a huge “if” given how often well documented incidents never end up on their official reports, it would roughly double the number of civilians the US has admitted to killing in Iraq and Syria over the ISIS war. NGOs have suggested the US strikes have killed well over 2,000 civilians already, and that’s not including last night’s massive toll.

You missed a few important words, so I found them for you. Does any sane person think that these countries would ever admit "Yes the US bombed an ISIS stronghold and killed 50 members of ISIS."? Of course they are going to say it was women and children, just like when we talk about cutting domestic spending its always the police and firefighters that are getting cut.

[AZJoe]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hzBIngGMk8g

[timosman]

In America we speak American.

Not everybody, some people still speak English :cool:

[TheCount]

What are those things exactly that 'they' (who I am guessing are the posters here who prefer good relations with Russia instead of bad relations) agree with in regards to what the Russian State media propaganda says? Not necessarily everything, but some believe obvious propaganda such as Russian objectives in Syria or that Russian forces were not involved in combat in the Ukraine.

[TheCount]

In anticipation of a "bluh America supports terrorists in Syria" and "bluh American coup in Ukraine" response, let me pre-emptively say that there are more choices available than just wholeheartedly swallowing either one set of propaganda or the other. Many people who claim to be critical thinkers are in fact just contrarians and seek out news which opposes mainstream sources, regardless of the accuracy or bias. Contrarians don't like grey areas. They're more interested in hearing things that they agree with than being told the truth.

[phill4paul]

Not everybody, some people still speak English :cool:

Only Tories.

[AZJoe]

"Classified intelligence showing incidental collection of Trump team communications ... came from multiple sources, ...

The intelligence is said to leave no doubt the Obama administration, in its closing days, was using the cover of legitimate surveillance on foreign targets to spy on President-elect Trump, according to sources.

The key to that conclusion is the unmasking of selected U.S. persons whose names appeared in the intelligence, the sources said, adding that the paper trail leaves no other plausible purpose for the unmasking other than to damage the incoming Trump administration."
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017/03/23/potential-smoking-gun-showing-obama-administration-spied-on-trump-team-source-says.html

[TER]

Not necessarily everything, but some believe obvious propaganda such as Russian objectives in Syria or that Russian forces were not involved in combat in the Ukraine.

Who here said that Russian forces were not involved in combat in Ukraine?

What propaganda is there regarding the Russian objectives in Syria that you feel 'they' have been indoctrinated with?

[TER]

In anticipation of a "bluh America supports terrorists in Syria" and "bluh American coup in Ukraine" response, let me pre-emptively say that there are more choices available than just wholeheartedly swallowing either one set of propaganda or the other. Many people who claim to be critical thinkers are in fact just contrarians and seek out news which opposes mainstream sources, regardless of the accuracy or bias. Contrarians don't like grey areas. They're more interested in hearing things that they agree with than being told the truth.

I think your last sentence describes you exactly in this current debate.

You claim 'they' are being indoctrinated with false Russian propaganda. A friend of yours says that 'they' want better relations with Russia because they share a common enemy.

Who is the common enemy which is being referenced, and what are the propaganda lies which 'they' are being deceived in by Russian state media?

[Schifference]

I think that it is totally reasonable for a president that is campaigning for one candidate to have access and spy on the opposing candidate.

[UWDude]

Not necessarily everything, but some believe obvious propaganda such as Russian objectives in Syria or that Russian forces were not involved in combat in the Ukraine.

what is the Russian objective in Syria?


They're more interested in hearing things that they agree with than being told the truth.

Please, enlighten us with "the truth".

[CPUd]

845282931144900608
https://twitter.com/BraddJaffy/status/845282931144900608

[undergroundrr]

I think that it is totally reasonable for a president that is campaigning for one candidate to have access and spy on the opposing candidate.

I wouldn't go that far. It uses public funding, resources and force monopoly. But he's certainly welcome to hire private firms using his own money.

[r3volution 3.0]

Please give an example of a post that "views the Russian state as some kind of champion of liberty".

Please give an example of a post that even remotely suggests that "Trump and the Russian government are cooperating to 'fight the establishment.' "

I haven't kept a catalogue.

For an example of the sentiment I'm referencing, see "Russian TV/Putin Warn Globalists May Kill Trump" compliments of (dis)InfoWars.

(www).infowars.com/russia-tvputin-warn-globalists-may-kill-trump/

Similar sorts of things have been said here at RPF since the start of Trumptardation.

[enhanced_deficit]

Let's wait till investigations are completed and all the facts come out.

[TER]

I haven't kept a catalogue.

For an example of the sentiment I'm referencing, see "Russian TV/Putin Warn Globalists May Kill Trump" compliments of (dis)InfoWars.

(www).infowars.com/russia-tvputin-warn-globalists-may-kill-trump/

Similar sorts of things have been said here at RPF since the start of Trumptardation.

That is a poor answer and does not in any way justify your earlier accusations.

[Brian4Liberty]

In America we speak American.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=blKn94_rZ74

[Jamesiv1]

I haven't kept a catalogue.

For an example of the sentiment I'm referencing, see "Russian TV/Putin Warn Globalists May Kill Trump" compliments of (dis)InfoWars.

(www).infowars.com/russia-tvputin-warn-globalists-may-kill-trump/

Similar sorts of things have been said here at RPF since the start of Trumptardation.
You sir, are no lover of liberty.

[AZJoe]

Whistleblower Binney confirms NSA targeted Congress, Supreme Court, Trump. http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-03-25/theyre-praetorian-guard-whistleblower-confirms-nsa-targeted-congress-supreme-court-j

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lkChOSdOgcc

William Binney "NSA is spying on "all the members of the Supreme Court, the Joint Chiefs of Staff, Congress, both House and Senate, as well as the White House." ...

"They're taking in fundamentally the entire fiber network inside the United States and collecting all that data and storing it, in a program they call Stellar Wind," ...

"Everything we're doing, phone calls, emails and then financial transactions, credit cards, things like that, all of it."...

They are targeting and looking at all the members of the Supreme Court, the Joint Chiefs of Staff, Congress, both House and Senate, as well as the White House,"

[TER]

Whistleblower Binney confirms NSA targeted Congress, Supreme Court, Trump. http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-03-25/theyre-praetorian-guard-whistleblower-confirms-nsa-targeted-congress-supreme-court-j

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lkChOSdOgcc

William Binney "NSA is spying on "all the members of the Supreme Court, the Joint Chiefs of Staff, Congress, both House and Senate, as well as the White House." ...

"They're taking in fundamentally the entire fiber network inside the United States and collecting all that data and storing it, in a program they call Stellar Wind," ...

"Everything we're doing, phone calls, emails and then financial transactions, credit cards, things like that, all of it."...

They are targeting and looking at all the members of the Supreme Court, the Joint Chiefs of Staff, Congress, both House and Senate, as well as the White House,"

WOW

I hope our representatives are WAKING UP!

[RPtotheWH]

All the smoke alarms are going off in the building now, anyone smell anything?

http://www.freedomwatchusa.org/freedom-watch-march-21-letter-to-chairman-nunes-and-other-me

[enhanced_deficit]

Can they really do this to he first historic Prez?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kbtJ7uA8H5Y
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kbtJ7uA8H5Y

[CPUd]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RhpK_9UIjOU

[Zippyjuan]

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/devin-nunes-sally-yates-donald-trump-hearing-stop-testify-house-intelligence-committee-cia-official-a7654371.html


White House shut down Trump-Russia hearings to stop Sally Yates giving key testimony


The swirling controversy over possible links between Donald Trump’s campaign team and Russia has taken a new twist after it was claimed the White House sought to stop a former senior official from testifying before congress.

The House Intelligence Committee has cancelled all meetings scheduled for this week, where it was due to hear testimony from, among others, former acting attorney general Sally Yates.

Ms Yates was forced to step down after refusing to enact Mr Trump’s Muslim travel ban. She had earlier told the Trump campaign that security advisor Michael Flynn may have left himself vulnerable to blackmail attempts from Moscow after lying about conversations with the Russian Ambassador to Washington.



Ms Yates and other former intelligence officials had been asked to testify before the House Intelligence Committee this week, a hearing that was cancelled by the panel’s chairman, Congressman Devin Nunes.

The decision to cancel the hearing came amid criticism from Democrats after it was revealed that Mr Nunes, a Republican, travelled to the grounds of the White House to review intelligence reports and meet a secret source to bolster his claim that communications involving associates of Mr Trump were caught up in “incidental” surveillance.