Germany rejects Trump's claim it owes NATO and US 'vast sums' for defense

[Zippyjuan]

https://4.bp.blogspot.com/-tJ-ZdI5KKok/WM2UiDGAakI/AAAAAAAL89k/LQWc0HEPTzoUXdrwh-Ct664JLY6NlB3pACLcB/s1600/2.png


BERLIN, March 19 (Reuters) - German Defence Minister Ursula von der Leyen on Sunday rejected U.S. President Donald Trump's claim that Germany owes NATO and the United States "vast sums" of money for defense.

"There is no debt account at NATO," von der Leyen said in a statement, adding that it was wrong to link the alliance's target for members to spend 2 percent of their economic output on defense by 2024 solely to NATO.

"Defense spending also goes into UN peacekeeping missions, into our European missions and into our contribution to the fight against IS terrorism," von der Leyen said.

She said everyone wanted the burden to be shared fairly and for that to happen it was necessary to have a "modern security concept" that included a modern NATO but also a European defense union and investment in the United Nations.

Trump said on Twitter on Saturday - a day after meeting German Chancellor Angela Merkel in Washington - that Germany "owes vast sums of money to NATO & the United States must be paid more for the powerful, and very expensive, defense it provides to Germany!"

Trump has urged Germany and other NATO members to accelerate efforts to meet NATO's defense spending target.

German defense spending is set to rise by 1.4 billion euros to 38.5 billion euros in 2018 - a figure that is projected to represent 1.26 percent of economic output, Finance Minister Wolfgang Schaeuble has said.

In 2016, Germany's defense spending ratio stood at 1.18 percent.

During her trip to Washington, Merkel reiterated Germany's commitment to the 2 percent military spending goal.

[Zippyjuan]

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/mar/18/trump-merkel-nato-germany-owe-money-tweet


'That's not how it works': Trump's grasp of Nato questioned

President’s claim that Germany owes the US ‘vast sums of money’ shows a lack of understanding, says ex-Nato representativ

On the heels of a visibly awkward visit from the German chancellor, Angela Merkel, Donald Trump said on Saturday that Germany owed “vast sums of money” to Nato and the US, even though the alliance does not stipulate payments to America.

His remarks prompted a former US permanent representative to Nato to reply “that’s not how Nato works”, and to add that increased European spending on defense was not a “favor (or payment) to the US”.

Trump, who was at his Mar-a-Lago estate for the weekend and spending the morning at Trump International Golf Course, sent two tweets early in the day. The first denounced “the FAKE NEWS” for what he said was mistaken coverage of a “GREAT” meeting with Merkel.

Trump’s public appearances with Merkel betrayed an awkwardness between the two leaders, including during two widely remarked upon appearances in the White House. In one, the leaders failed to stage a handshake for cameras in the Oval Office, and in another Merkel looked baffled by comments made by Trump during a joint press conference. Before the visit Trump had repeatedly called Merkel’s policies “insane” and a “disaster” for Germany.

Trump’s second tweet accused Germany directly of not paying enough to the security alliance.

In a joint press conference on Friday, Trump expressed “strong support” for Nato but reiterated his belief that member nations do not contribute a “fair share”.

“Many nations owe vast sums of money from past years and it is very unfair to the United States,” he said. “These nations must pay what they owe.”

He added: “During our meeting, I thanked Chancellor Merkel for the German government’s commitment to increase defense spending and work toward contributing at least 2% of GDP.”

Trump’s tweets on Saturday suggested a misunderstanding of the way Nato is funded. According to Nato’s official guidelines, member nations are expected to spend at least 2% of their country’s gross domestic product (GDP) on defense. However, only a handful of the 28 members actually meet that target.

At a 2014 summit in Wales, members pledged to increase their military spending to 2% of GDP by 2024, a goal some have said is unachievable and unrealistic for several member states.

Ultimately, members’ contributions are based on each nation’s capability. Therefore, Nato member nations do not “owe” or have to compensate any other country.

On Saturday Ivo Daalder, who was permanent representative to Nato from 2009 to 2013, respond to Trump in a series of tweets.

“Sorry, Mr President, that’s not how Nato works,” he wrote. “The US decides for itself how much it contributes to defending Nato. This is not a financial transaction, where Nato countries pay the US to defend them. It is part of our treaty commitment.

“All Nato countries, including Germany, have committed to spend 2% of GDP on defense by 2024. So far five of 28 Nato countries do. Those who currently don’t spend 2% of their GDP on defense are now increasing their defense budgets. That’s a good thing.

[AZJoe]

Spoken like a true NATO Welfare Queen. Of course once hooked, the welfare recipient thinks it is entitled to its subsidies.

[AZJoe]

https://object.cato.org/sites/cato.org/files/wp-content/uploads/cato-tax-infographic-23-ol-2_0.jpg

[angelatc]

Spoken like a true NATO Welfare Queen. Of course once hooked, the welfare recipient thinks it is entitled to its subsidies.

"That's not how it works!" THe USA pays for it all! That's how it works!!!

[timosman]

"That's not how it works!" THe USA pays for it all! That's how it works!!!

Who controls the world currency?

[Demigod]

Trump is completely right,now I would not say that what USA provides comes free when you take into consideration that a big part of NATO are nothing more than vassal states but I think the problem comes from the fact the government and political cabals trough corruption are the ones making the money and this is the core problem of it. The average American is seeing his country provide defense and getting nothing back,the average ... is seeing American companies and "consultants" pillaging his country so both sides are angry with legitimate reasons.

And this also connects to Rands opposition for Montenegro joining NATO. The countries leadership is dragging the country into NATO for no other reason except being blackmailed ( because they are feudal criminals ) by NATO and the EU so to further isolate Russia, the average Americans will then have to pay for yet another contested area all the while the only ones profiteering will be a few well connected companies and the CIA.

Another situation is Kosovo ,where the average American pays for the bombing of Yugoslavia so that USA companies connected to the Clintons can profit and the CIA can run the drug trade for all of Europe from there. That is why neocons are always so happy for the conflicts to spread ,it is corruption/socialism/imperialism combined into a most wicked form .

[kpitcher]

The argument shouldn't be that other countries are underpaying, it should be that we'd have better things to spend 18.6% of our budget on that military - or not spend at all in the first place.

[Ender]

The argument shouldn't be that other countries are underpaying, it should be that we'd have better things to spend 18.6% of our budget on that military - or not spend at all in the first place.

Zactly.

[CPUd]

The argument shouldn't be that other countries are underpaying, it should be that we'd have better things to spend 18.6% of our budget on that military - or not spend at all in the first place.

Our military is depleted, so we are going to have a buildup of historic proportions in order to defeat ISIS and take the oil. Then we will hopefully bring our troops home.

[Zippyjuan]

Our military is depleted, so we are going to have a buildup of historic proportions in order to defeat ISIS and take the oil. Then we will hopefully bring our troops home.

Don't forget about Iran and North Korea.

[oyarde]

Those dirty germans . I knew they owed . Two percent and they have been slacking on that ? Pfft , they would never make it in the US as taxpayers .

[Jan2017]

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-trump-germany-defence-idUSKBN16Q0D8?il=0
"There is no debt account at NATO," stated their woman Defense Minister.

So msm etc. will want to pile on saying that Trump "doesn't know how NATO works."

That may be true, but perhaps in a new, better deal . . .
Germany will in fact have to foot the bill more for NATO defense on that/their continent in the future.

[klamath]

Nato hasn't defended anyone since the Warsaw pact collapsed. NATO has been funded to operate US, GB and France's interventionism. Was the US protecting Germany when NATO got into Bosnia and Kosovo? Was the US protecting Germany when the invasion of Afghanistan was launched. Was the US protecting Germany when NATO destroyed Libya?
Europe can pay more for their military if they want if the US cuts back but Germany sure as hell doesn't owe the US a damned dime for the US, English and French wars for the last 25 years. Trump can fuck himself.

[Brian4Liberty]

The solution is obvious. Reduce US spending on this to 1%, thee we will pay the least (as a percentage).

[donnay]

Who controls the world currency?

The globalists.

[inthehall]

Who controls the world currency?



ask this man.....

http://static.deathandtaxesmag.com/uploads/2017/01/mnuchin-hearing-1484852798-compressed.jpg

[donnay]

https://s17-us2.ixquick.com/cgi-bin/serveimage?url=https:%2F%2Fs-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com%2Foriginals%2F4a%2Ff7%2F82%2F4af782 df81f1d24dd6b49d5ed0d4de72.png&sp=570820a54dca574c8cb5d38013056a3d

[inthehall]

https://scontent-atl3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t31.0-8/p720x720/15844614_1125169904248566_4220123978180260049_o.jp g?oh=ff8a34798443a9086d563ec8855017b7&oe=59267784

[inthehall]

https://scontent-atl3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/15780673_1125168097582080_7551676242817690221_n.jp g?oh=67dbf56eeaf9dbff1918803b7e582dc3&oe=596E2367

[inthehall]

https://scontent-atl3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/15781368_1125168320915391_7792443932807666252_n.jp g?oh=8007b6bd21851a8f12885eda9c0956a8&oe=59683FC2

[inthehall]

https://scontent-atl3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/15823629_1125174747581415_3601979502526896197_n.jp g?oh=440ff705e255d313114460d3ac81c3d9&oe=59738659

[inthehall]

https://scontent-atl3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/15780873_1125171200915103_631533352476592884_n.jpg ?oh=3a8c31a3f48cac2a073af321746bc1b5&oe=597114AE

[inthehall]

https://scontent-atl3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/15826858_1125171044248452_7961815111697793147_n.pn g?oh=d6ee5eb2e2424111753f549e2d8e7344&oe=596D718D

[inthehall]

https://scontent-atl3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t31.0-8/15800550_1125170670915156_9080690892327925848_o.jp g?oh=33a015d3ebd13457331b2ab7f1df771b&oe=596852B0

[inthehall]

https://scontent-atl3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/15826686_1125170117581878_4299015344682022744_n.jp g?oh=63537888ce8ed7c79b41f0355de8425f&oe=595E59D2

[inthehall]

https://scontent-atl3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/15822710_1125170017581888_4777157607331146095_n.jp g?oh=86ab49081060912297b180379c9181a3&oe=5957C35A

[inthehall]

https://scontent-atl3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/15822589_1125168630915360_2138679001671108526_n.jp g?oh=da2d58434d22019a2d839581bb181bd1&oe=59640F95

[pao]

Maybe Trump can just pull the US out of Germany if he feels they don't pay enough?...Nope, too simple. Would never work. s/

[merkelstan]

Nato hasn't defended anyone since the Warsaw pact collapsed. NATO has been funded to operate US, GB and France's interventionism. Was the US protecting Germany when NATO got into Bosnia and Kosovo? Was the US protecting Germany when the invasion of Afghanistan was launched. Was the US protecting Germany when NATO destroyed Libya?
Europe can pay more for their military if they want if the US cuts back but Germany sure as hell doesn't owe the US a damned dime for the US, English and French wars for the last 25 years. Trump can $#@! himself.

Right on.

[EDIT] Though to be fair, US presence in Europe after WWII was decisive in drawing a line for the Red advance. On the other hand, the US aided Stalin. So...

[chudrockz]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=87b4a4a2wmY

[timosman]

Maybe Trump can just pull the US out of Germany if he feels they don't pay enough?...Nope, too simple. Would never work. s/

What are we still doing there? Fighting Russia?

[oyarde]

Right on.

[EDIT] Though to be fair, US presence in Europe after WWII was decisive in drawing a line for the Red advance. On the other hand, the US aided Stalin. So...

Europe will fall to the next Stalin anyway even though Europe would be hard to hold . Next time it will not be worth saving .

[Occam's Banana]

The argument shouldn't be that other countries are underpaying, it should be that we'd have better things to spend 18.6% of our budget on that military - or not spend at all in the first place.

Why do you hate Oceania?

[dean.engelhardt]

We will build a great NATO military and Germany will pay for it!

[RonPaulMall]

Nato hasn't defended anyone since the Warsaw pact collapsed. NATO has been funded to operate US, GB and France's interventionism. Was the US protecting Germany when NATO got into Bosnia and Kosovo? Was the US protecting Germany when the invasion of Afghanistan was launched. Was the US protecting Germany when NATO destroyed Libya?
Europe can pay more for their military if they want if the US cuts back but Germany sure as hell doesn't owe the US a damned dime for the US, English and French wars for the last 25 years. Trump can $#@! himself.

Trump isn't the one who gives a shit whether NATO exists or not. Forcing the Globalists in Germany to put up or shut up is a brilliant way to undermine support for NATO without giving the Globalist a valid avenue of counterattack. If Germany cuts domestic spending to appease Trump, it erodes support for NATO within Germany. If Germany refuses, it erodes support for NATO within the United States.

https://i.imgbox.com/OBc9l7ZT.jpg

[TheTexan]

Germany needs to pay for the protection were giving them.

Or something bad could happen to them.