MS-13 gang members (illegal aliens) murder one U.S. citizen and rape another

[LibertyEagle]

Two illegal immigrant gang members from El Salvador who had a Satanic shrine in their Houston apartment are suspects in the killing of one teenager and the kidnapping of another, authorities said.

Gang leader Miguel Angel Alvarez-Flores, 22, who also goes by 'Diabolico,' and 18-year-old Diego Alexan Hernandez-Rivera appeared in Houston court Wednesday on charges of aggravated kidnapping and murder.

The MS-13 gang members laughed, smiled and waved in court.

Prosecutors said the two kidnapped a 14-year-old girl after she left school around February 2, holding her in an apartment where she was raped by a gang member.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4276336/MS-13-gang-members-accused-Satanic-rape-murder.html#ixzz4aFhicI7Z

[timosman]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AGhTr0gEe3A

[tod evans]

MS-13 gang members (illegal aliens) murder one U.S. citizen and rape another

Ok I read the whole article and didn't find mention of citizenship anywhere in it..

Were the MS-13 youngsters "citizens" too?

Or should the reader assume that because the gang started in South America they were "Illegal Immigrants"?

[timosman]

They're each being held on a $300,000 bond. http://www.khou.com/news/crime/2-alleged-members-of-ms-13-gang-charged-in-teens-murder-kidnapping/418343605

Is this a joke?

[LibertyEagle]

Look again, Tod. It's in the title in the article and in the body that I quoted.


Illegal El Salvador migrant gang members with a Satanic shrine in


Two illegal immigrant gang members from El Salvador who had a Satanic shrine in their Houston apartment are suspects in the killing of one teenager and the kidnapping of another, authorities said.

[timosman]

Ok I read the whole article and didn't find mention of citizenship anywhere in it..

Were the MS-13 youngsters "citizens" too?

Or should the reader assume that because the gang started in South America they were "Illegal Immigrants"?

There's an immigration hold on the suspects, which will keep them from getting out of jail.

[tod evans]

Okay so the "gang members" are foreigners, where does it say the girls are citizens?

Is this a case of foreigners killing each other?

[timosman]

There's an immigration hold on the suspects, which will keep them from getting out of jail.

Houston is a sanctuary city - https://theintercept.com/2016/11/29/new-sanctuary-cities-in-texas-vow-to-resist-donald-trumps-deportations/

[tod evans]

In other race/gang related newz Teh-Blacks are still killing each other in Chicago...

[presence]

Another sensationalist fake news headline by an xenophobic trumptard

I thought we had rules against this bullshit at RPF?


murder one U.S. citizen


Police released a composite sketch of the unidentified victim, asking anyone with information to call the National Center for Missing and Exploited Children at 1-800-THE-LOST (1-800-843-5678).


does not compute

[pcosmar]

More School of The Americas fallout.
LibertyEagle,, Ft Benning Ga. is the source of this. ( the source aside from satan)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_Hemisphere_Institute_for_Security_Cooperat ion

[fisharmor]

I will freely admit, based on the data you provided, that 0.00001% of illegal immigrants behave this way.

[klamath]

This is classic propaganda. Find the most horrendous cases and post them to create the illusion it applies to all immigrants. Trumps V.O.I.C.E. squad at work.

[Anti Federalist]

Honduras and El Salvador have the highest murder rates on the planet.

Mexico is failed narco-state with daily beheadings, burnings and drug cartel related murders.

Granted, much of that is/was caused by a century of American interventionism.

That said, is it truly "racist" and "xenophobic" to state that I do not want my quiet New England town turned into a crime laden, third world shithole because of thousands of migrants from these countries?

Even with an acknowledged heroin issue, I can still leave my house unlocked.

So I really want to know, is that the new definition of "racist"?

[CPUd]

we've got a lot of bad hombres

[Anti Federalist]

we've got a lot of bad hombres

That we do.

Therefore it makes little sense to import more.

[presence]

So I really want to know, is that the new definition of "racist"?

Judging people by the color of their skin, religion, or country of birth rather than the merits of their individual actions?


I do not want my quiet New England town turned into a crime laden, third world $#@!hole because of thousands of

migrants from these countries?

sounds pretty racist to me


my grandfather hated ki kes, ni ggers, and ch inks

is this much different from hating serotes and catrachos?

[TheCount]

That said, is it truly "racist" and "xenophobic" to state that I do not want my quiet New England town turned into a crime laden, third world shithole because of thousands of migrants from these countries?It would be racist if you believe that the murders in those countries are due to the genetics of the inhabitants rather than the social, economic, and political situation there.

A person who assumes that because murders happen in El Salvador, an American from El Salvador or whose family is from El Salvador who lives in the United States is more likely to be a murderer than another type of person should reflect on why they think that. It may be that they're automatically making an assumption that doesn't make sense when you actually think about it.

[CaptUSA]

That we do.

Therefore it makes little sense to import more.

Obvious red herring here. I wonder if your chances of being killed by a terrorist are better or worse than this?


I will freely admit, based on the data you provided, that 0.00001% of illegal immigrants behave this way.


This is all demagoguery to try to give some justification to how people already feel.

[jllundqu]

Judging people by the color of their skin, religion, or country of birth rather than the merits of their individual actions?



sounds pretty racist to me


my grandfather hated ki kes, ni ggers, and ch inks

is this much different from hating serotes and catrachos?

I disagree... AF said nothing of the sort. Not wanting migrants (legal or illegal) from third world shit holes where violence and murder are the order of the day is not 'racist'. That is the siren song of leftists.

[presence]

"Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!"


I don't care where they're from, what they've seen, who their parents were, what religion they practice, what vices they may have, what langauge they speak, or what color their skin may be: I stand with anyone that comes to the country by legalized or illegalized methods who seeks to earn his roof and daily bread in peace.

[phill4paul]

In other race/gang related newz Teh-Blacks are still killing each other in Chicago...

And U.S. citizen cops are raping and murdering U.S. citizens. We can't even deport them.

[dannno]

It would be racist if you believe that the murders in those countries are due to the genetics of the inhabitants rather than the social, economic, and political situation there.


Violent crime is statistically higher among people with IQ lower than 90. The IQ in these countries averages below 90.

Ashkenazi Jews were able to raise their IQ a full 20 points in 800 years. Ashkenazi Jews are not a "race" imo. I'm not sure what this subject has to do with race or racism at all.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nNnrU_fYDIA

[tod evans]

So I really want to know, is that the new definition of "racist"?

Who cares?

Certainly not I.

I gave up caring what others thought decades ago, fuck the whole lot.

[tod evans]

And U.S. citizen cops are raping and murdering U.S. citizens. We can't even deport them.

Can't declare open season either, not without worrying about 752 federal charges stemming from the incident...

Don't worry though government is going to fix all of society's ills....

[LibertyEagle]

"Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!"

Sorry, not the country's motto regarding immigration. It was written by this woman, ticked off about the plight of Jewish immigrants, to raise money for the base of the Statue of Liberty. https://www.nps.gov/stli/learn/historyculture/emma-lazarus.htm



I don't care where they're from, what they've seen, who their parents were, what religion they practice, what vices they may have, what langauge they speak, or what color their skin may be: I stand with anyone that comes to the country by legalized or illegalized methods who seeks to earn his roof and daily bread in peace.

Sure you do. But, some of us still exist who care about the existence of our nation and its sovereignty.

[CPUd]

either we have a country or we don't

[LibertyEagle]

And Presence, cheap shot on the neg rep. My thread title was not inaccurate at all. Not one bit.

[Superfluous Man]

I will freely admit, based on the data you provided, that 0.00001% of illegal immigrants behave this way.

+ rep

[Superfluous Man]

Oh no!

We're all gonna die!

Let's look to the government to save us!

[TheCount]

The IQ in these countries averages below 90.Why?

[Superfluous Man]

Ashkenazi Jews were able to raise their IQ a full 20 points in 800 years.

How do you know what their IQ was 800 years ago?

[dannno]

Oh no!

We're all gonna die!

Let's look to the government to save us!

I'd prefer they step out of the way.. But as long as that isn't happening, things need to change if we don't want to end up going in the direction of a third world socialist hellhole.

[dannno]

How do you know what their IQ was 800 years ago?

Not 800 years ago.. 1200 years ago. It was from 800 AD to 1600 AD. It is based on their historical movement and settlement into a specific region during which time their culture and wealth flourished immensely.

I suppose it would be difficult to prove whether their IQ was 100 before they moved there or 105, but to claim that it was at 120 would be a difficult impetus for you to overcome. You are welcome to do some research into the area and try to convince us.

[dannno]

Why?

That's a very complicated question, but I guess it comes down to the fact that higher IQ is not a trait that is rewarded as heavily in equatorial climates as it is in areas with harsh winter climates.

Would you like to know why that is as well?

[dannno]

What is the origin of criminal behavior? Stefan Molyneux and Brian Boutwell discuss the interplay between biology, genetics and environmental factors when it comes to accurately discussing the factors in criminal activity.

Dr. Brian Boutwell is a Biosocial Criminologist and the Associate Professor of Criminology and Criminal Justice at Saint Louis University. Dr. Boutwell is also the co-editor of the book "The Nurture Versus Biosocial Debate in Criminology: On the Origins of Criminal Behavior and Criminality" with Kevin Beaver and J. C. Barnes.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uQBKn_GNHa4

[TheCount]

That's a very complicated question, but I guess it comes down to the fact that higher IQ is not a trait that is rewarded as heavily in equatorial climates as it is in areas with harsh winter climates.

Would you like to know why that is as well?

Do you think that all of the factors involved in IQ are genetic, or do childhood environmental factors such as nutrition, disease, etc. do not play a role in determining the IQ of an adult irrespective of their genetic?

[dannno]

Do you think that all of the factors involved in IQ are genetic, or do childhood environmental factors such as nutrition, disease, etc. do not play a role in determining the IQ of an adult irrespective of their genetic?

Clearly, the answer is that both play a factor... but studies seem to indicate that environmental factors play a fairly small role compared to genetics. Putting asians on the basketball team isn't going to make them taller.

[TheCount]

Putting asians on the basketball team isn't going to make them taller.Starving the asians will make them shorter.

[dannno]

Starving the asians will make them shorter.

Ok, so there are a lot of asians here in the US who are not starving. In fact, they do comparably better than white people. But they are still shorter on average, and putting them on the basketball team is not going to make them taller.

If you listened to the videos I posted, you would hear discussion about a 90 IQ cut off. Once the average IQ in a society drops below 90, you can't have a well functioning free society. Corruption increases, everybody is on the take, and government gets bigger and more corrupt as a result. It's a sad fact, I wish it weren't true, but denying reality is not constructive.

[TheCount]

Ok, so there are a lot of asians here in the US who are not starving. In fact, they do comparably better than white people. But they are still shorter on average, and putting them on the basketball team is not going to make them taller.

I'm not asking why Asians are so tall. I'm asking why North Koreans are so short. If your answer is 'because they're Asian,' then you are ignoring the fact that there are other non-genetic factors involved in the shortness of North Koreans.

Nutrition is not going to make someone taller or smarter than they are capable of, but it can certainly impede development. Likewise affecting development are disease, stress, fatigue, and a hundred other factors related to poverty.

If "why are El Salvadorans so stupid?" is the question, you can say 'because that's the way they are" / "because they're Hispanic," or instead consider that there may other factors involved. Can you explain the variation in IQs between South American countries solely through the genetics of their inhabitants?


If you listened to the videos I posted, you would hear discussion about a 90 IQ cut off. Once the average IQ in a society drops below 90, you can't have a well functioning free society. Corruption increases, everybody is on the take, and government gets bigger and more corrupt as a result. It's a sad fact, I wish it weren't true, but denying reality is not constructive.Sure. That's why all genetically Hispanic countries have sub-90 IQ scores and the same crime rates. Right?

This also explains why high-IQ Eastern European countries and Russia are well-functioning free societies with low corruption and low crime.

What about the crime rate differences between South America and a low-IQ European country such as... say, Ireland?

Maybe there are other factors?

[Zippyjuan]

Clearly, the answer is that both play a factor... but studies seem to indicate that environmental factors play a fairly small role compared to genetics. Putting asians on the basketball team isn't going to make them taller.

You don't say.

http://cdn2.hubspot.net/hubfs/566301/yao_ming.jpg

[dannno]

You don't say.

http://cdn2.hubspot.net/hubfs/566301/yao_ming.jpg

You do realize that by posting glaring anomalies you are helping to prove my point, right?

[AuH20]

And Cuomo has the gall to outlaw semi-automatic weapons.

http://www.cnn.com/2017/03/02/us/ms-13-long-island-killings/

[dannno]

I'm not asking why Asians are so tall. I'm asking why North Koreans are so short. If your answer is 'because they're Asian,' then you are ignoring the fact that there are other non-genetic factors involved in the shortness of North Koreans.

Nutrition is not going to make someone taller or smarter than they are capable of, but it can certainly impede development. Likewise affecting development are disease, stress, fatigue, and a hundred other factors related to poverty.

If "why are El Salvadorans so stupid?" is the question, you can say 'because that's the way they are" / "because they're Hispanic," or instead consider that there may other factors involved. Can you explain the variation in IQs between South American countries solely through the genetics of their inhabitants?

Sure. That's why all genetically Hispanic countries have sub-90 IQ scores and the same crime rates. Right?

This also explains why high-IQ Eastern European countries and Russia are well-functioning free societies with low corruption and low crime.

What about the crime rate differences between South America and a low-IQ European country such as... say, Ireland?

Maybe there are other factors?

Of course there are a lot of factors for crime, but the main driver behind a lot of these factors is ultimately IQ because these other factors correlate with IQ.

It's good to see that you at least admit that different groups have varying IQs, that is a really good start.

So IQ also has to do with r vs K selection, and ultimately crime as well. r selected individuals tend to thrive in socialist environments, chaotic environments and equatorial environments where they have the ability to hunt and gather food year around. The people who breed the most and are able to protect their territory and resources physically tend to do the best in these environments over people who have high IQ.

K selected individuals on the other hand survive better in harsher climates. They have to solve problems related to creating food and shelter and they also have to defer gratification so they don't do something stupid like eat their seed stock. Breeding quickly has fewer advantages in these environments - instead it is more important to have fewer offspring and invest a lot into them so that they can learn how to deal with their specific challenges that they face in their environment. This is why K selected individuals tend to be very focused on their child's education.

Humans are a fairly unique species in that we are able to bounce back and forth between K selected and r selected tendencies, epigenetics allow our bodies to change based on the circumstances. It turns out that having a single parent household can easily turn a K selected individual into an r selected individual. r selected individuals have greater tendency to create single parent households, so this effect can spiral out of control.

So there is IQ, which helps determine r vs. K tendencies, which helps determine societal organization and functionality, and how that society reacts to their environment and to all of the ping-ponging effects of surrounding societies helps determine how well the society flourishes, criminality, etc.

There is really a lot to learn here, seriously hours and hours worth of material. I'm glad you are interested in the topic of genetics, IQ and criminality because it is one of the more important topics that needs to be addressed in modern times and it is a topic that society actively attempts to repress discussion of.

[tod evans]

How in the Sam Hell does every discussion about beaners turn into a fucking Moleneux expose?

Good grief ya'll... :mad:

[dannno]

How in the Sam Hell does every discussion about beaners turn into a fucking Moleneux expose?

Good grief ya'll... :mad:

Because he has the best explanation for the interactions between these societies and cultures. Nobody else in the mainstream really talks about it besides a few scientists and researchers.

[TheCount]

Of course there are a lot of factors for crime, but the main driver behind a lot of these factors is ultimately IQ because these other factors correlate with IQ. You didn't at all address the issue at hand. It seems that you've decided that genetics is the answer for everything, and you regurgitate the religious creed of your racial beliefs whenever the topic arises. I'm asking you to go beyond that.

[dannno]

You didn't at all address the issue at hand. It seems that you've decided that genetics is the answer for everything, and you regurgitate the religious creed of your racial beliefs whenever the topic arises. I'm asking you to go beyond that.

Huh? I didn't say genetics was the answer to everything, I said that genetics has a large effect on some of the environmental factors you described, which is absolutely true.

[Valli6]

This is classic propaganda. Find the most horrendous cases and post them to create the illusion it applies to all immigrants.
This isn't a story about immigrants. It's a story about the violent gang members Obama knowingly invited into our country and dispersed throughout it. There's nothing xenophobic about being pissed off when we see more of their handiwork. I'd guess most of their victims are other immigrants - illegal and otherwise. Doesn't make it any less heinious. MS-13 is all over the country now. We did not need this.

A dozen more of them were just charged in Long Island over seven other murders. They beat and hacked two fifteen year old girls to death with baseball bats and machetes.


Members of Notorious MS-13 Gang Indicted in Killings of Teenage Best Friends, 5 Others

...More than a dozen alleged MS-13 gang members are named in federal indictments charging them with murder and other crimes in connection with the gruesome slayings of seven people, including two teenage best friends, in the crime-plagued town of Brentwood, prosecutors announced Thursday…

...Capers said that four gang members had been looking for a rival gang member to attack or kill when they spotted the girls. They recognized Cuevas from a prior altercation with MS-13 members, called their "leader" and got approval to kill her and her friend, Capers said. The girls died by "swinging baseball bats and machetes," Capers said, adding Cuevas ran for her life.
http://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/local/Gang-Violence-MS-13-Brentwood-Suffolk-County-Long-Island-Teenagers-Dead-Missing-Police-415209143.html

[CPUd]

http://i.imgur.com/o0ZlkU0.jpg

[klamath]

This isn't a story about immigrants. It's a story about the violent gang members Obama knowingly invited into our country and dispersed throughout it. There's nothing xenophobic about being pissed off when we see more of their handiwork. I'd guess most of their victims are other immigrants - illegal and otherwise. Doesn't make it any less heinious. MS-13 is all over the country now. We did not need this.

A dozen more of them were just charged in Long Island over seven other murders. They beat and hacked two fifteen year old girls to death with baseball bats and machetes.
Sorry but there is "Illegal aliens" right in the title. Nice try. Trump himself said he is making a special commission to report of crime done specifically by illegal. Classic propaganda. Create the illusion we will all die from illegal aliens (brown) if we don't follow TRUMP NOW! Same stupid tactic used by leftists against guns and global warming. Frankly I am sick of the stupid fear tactics used by trump republicans and democrats.

[CPUd]

Sorry but there is "Illegal aliens" right in the title. Nice try. Trump himself said he is making a special commission to report of crime done specifically by illegal. Classic propaganda. Create the illusion we will all die from illegal aliens (brown) if we don't follow TRUMP NOW! Same stupid tactic used by leftists against guns and global warming. Frankly I am sick of the stupid fear tactics used by trump republicans and democrats.

Why do you hate America?

[klamath]

Why do you hate America? USA! USA! USA!

[Athan]

Another sensationalist fake news headline by an xenophobic trumptard

I thought we had rules against this bull$#@! at RPF?

does not compute

http://i.imgur.com/iaKJYmF.png

Hold up, I'm a hispanic in deep south Texas.... and holy $h!t, what the fux did I just read from you? I'm sorry, please tell me you were only pretending to be retarded and throw out ridiculous accusations like "xenophobic" and "trumptard". Or just be honest that you don't not know $h!t about MS13 and spoke before you fuxking looked into them.

Seriously.

[Anti Federalist]

It would be racist if you believe that the murders in those countries are due to the genetics of the inhabitants rather than the social, economic, and political situation there.

Right, and that's xenophobia.


A person who assumes that because murders happen in El Salvador, an American from El Salvador or whose family is from El Salvador who lives in the United States is more likely to be a murderer than another type of person should reflect on why they think that. It may be that they're automatically making an assumption that doesn't make sense when you actually think about it.

Somebody's doing the killings in El Salvador.

If not people from El Salvador, then who?

[Anti Federalist]

Who cares?

Certainly not I.

I gave up caring what others thought decades ago, fuck the whole lot.

Well, for the most part, I agree.

That said, "racism" is the modern equivalent of heresy or witchcraft.

Just the accusation alone, if it is the right flavor of racism of course, is enough to make one lose business, get fired, get harassed and threatened, and in many countries, arrested, prosecuted and thrown in prison.

So yeah, it's pretty serious.

And I just wanted the opinion of some folks around here, to see if my right to freely associate is now considered full on "racism".

[AuH20]

This isn't a story about immigrants. It's a story about the violent gang members Obama knowingly invited into our country and dispersed throughout it. There's nothing xenophobic about being pissed off when we see more of their handiwork. I'd guess most of their victims are other immigrants - illegal and otherwise. Doesn't make it any less heinious. MS-13 is all over the country now. We did not need this.

A dozen more of them were just charged in Long Island over seven other murders. They beat and hacked two fifteen year old girls to death with baseball bats and machetes.

Politically correct policies have carved out safe zones for these violent thugs. That's the moral of the story. I bet if you defended yourself against an MS-13 attack, you could be brought up for hate crimes against an oppressed minority.

[Anti Federalist]

"Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!"


I don't care where they're from, what they've seen, who their parents were, what religion they practice, what vices they may have, what langauge they speak, or what color their skin may be: I stand with anyone that comes to the country by legalized or illegalized methods who seeks to earn his roof and daily bread in peace.

Ummm, no.

We have more than enough wretched refuse to deal with already.

Especially when it is clear that the self same wretched refuse is more than willing to rob me and commit crimes and not "live in peace" as you said.

And I'm not talking about street crime.

A free man can deal with that, one on one, although it does tend to reduce "quality of life" metrics.

No, the "wretched refuse" has shown over and over, that it will rob me at the voting booth: it will use the power of "democracy" to seize my wealth, my assets, my children's inheritance and my freedom.

I have made it a point to post story after story about the evils of asset forfeiture, and how it rakes in billions, mostly stolen from poor people and immigrants and minorities.

That is nothing compared to the trillions extorted...seized from millions of people, by "legal" means in the form of massive taxation, fully supported and overwhelmingly voted for by...poor people and immigrants and minorities.

Ask these people how well letting the wretched refuse of teeming shores flood their homes worked out for them:

http://www.brushbucktours.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/02/native-americans-in-grand-teton-national-park.jpg

[Anti Federalist]

Judging people by the color of their skin, religion, or country of birth rather than the merits of their individual actions?

How long have you "known" me here?

Do you think I'm going to strike up a random conversation with a cop, or avoid him, based on the uniform he wears?


sounds pretty racist to me

my grandfather hated ki kes, ni ggers, and ch inks

is this much different from hating serotes and catrachos?

Duly noted.

[donnay]

[I]"Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!"


You quote Emma Lazarus a 19th century socialist to make your point?

[Ender]

You quote Emma Lazarus a 19th century socialist to make your point?

Do you say the Pledge of Allegiance and sing The Star Spangled Banner?

[RPtotheWH]

"Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!"


I don't care where they're from, what they've seen, who their parents were, what religion they practice, what vices they may have, what langauge they speak, or what color their skin may be: I stand with anyone that comes to the country by legalized or illegalized methods who seeks to earn his roof and daily bread in peace.

Where is that in the Constitution?

[donnay]

Do you say the Pledge of Allegiance and sing The Star Spangled Banner?

I pledge my allegiance to God and on occasion I will sing the Star Spangled Banner.

[TheCount]

Somebody's doing the killings in El Salvador.

If not people from El Salvador, then who?El Salvadorans. What I'm saying, and I know you aren't saying the opposite, is that they're not killing because they are genetically El Salvadoran. There are plenty of other reasons for the high murder rate in El Salvador.

[timosman]

El Salvadorans. What I'm saying, and I know you aren't saying the opposite, is that they're not killing because they are genetically El Salvadoran. There are plenty of other reasons for the high murder rate in El Salvador.

Like what?

[TheTexan]

Like what?

Maybe it's their diets

[Anti Federalist]

Do you say the Pledge of Allegiance and sing The Star Spangled Banner?

No, as a matter of fact, I don't.

[Anti Federalist]

El Salvadorans. What I'm saying, and I know you aren't saying the opposite, is that they're not killing because they are genetically El Salvadoran. There are plenty of other reasons for the high murder rate in El Salvador.

Exactly, so I'm not in any hurry to duplicate those reasons, or bring people who subscribe to those reasons, here.

[Anti Federalist]

Like what?

If I had to fathom a guess, it is the lack of respect and understanding of property rights, nurtured by a political tradition evident in most of Central and South America of following Marxist collectivism.

[klamath]

What a load of Crap being posted. Maybe we should look into what cultures install governments that invade and seize property from countries on the far side of the world from them? When was the last time these central American countries violently took over counties outside of their hemisphere? Ask the native Americans how much respect the new americans had for property rights?

[TheCount]

Like what?Poverty, mostly.

[AZJoe]

Poverty, mostly.

Not likely. Being poor does not make one a murderer, rapist, kidnapper, robber.
There are billions of poor people worldwide that do not become violent raping, kidnapping, murdering gang members.

[pcosmar]

How in the Sam Hell does every discussion about beaners turn into a $#@!ing Moleneux expose?

Good grief ya'll... :mad:

Skirting the real issues and attempting to place blame on easy targets.

I posted the source of this shit.
and it has nothing to do with Race or IQ levels.

It started visibly with this man,
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allen_Dulles
and those that aided and abetted.

It is currently running terrorist operations as "Western Hemisphere Institute for Security Cooperation" and was formerly known as School of The Americas..

Wikileaks published the training manual for overthrowing legitimate governments. You can read it yourself.
I did.


But go ahead and make yourself feel better thinking these are just inferior humans. or that somehow you are superior simply due to your place of birth.

[Anti Federalist]

Ask the native Americans how much respect the new americans had for property rights?

Yeah, I already asked that.

Unfettered mass migration didn't work out too well for them, did it?

[tod evans]

But go ahead and make yourself feel better thinking these are just inferior humans. or that somehow you are superior simply due to your place of birth.


What?

[pcosmar]

What?

Not directed at you,,, but at the direction of the thread drift.

This "Gang" is a CIA construct. The turmoil in these Banana republics is directly traceable to US Government actions.


Nothing to do with "race" or IQ of the victims.

[AuH20]

Not directed at you,,, but at the direction of the thread drift.

This "Gang" is a CIA construct. The turmoil in these Banana republics is directly traceable to US Government actions.


Nothing to do with "race" or IQ of the victims.

You need a particular cultural decay to create potential recruits. In this case, any method to keep this 'cultural infection' outside the border is warranted. Just because the Deep State sets something negative in motion, doesn't mean that the citizenry must let it run amok at a latter stage.

[klamath]

Yeah, I already asked that.

Unfettered mass migration didn't work out too well for them, did it? What didn't work out was a government that enslaved, double crossed and killed them. Individual settlers would have worked it out. It is when people advocate government force to settle cultural clashes that evil shit happens. Of all people I thought you would have known this.

[pcosmar]

You need particular cultural decay to create potential recruits. In this case, any method to keep this 'cultural infection' outside the border is warranted. Just because the Deep State sets something negative in motion, doesn't mean that the citizenry must let it run a muck.

Too late. The cultural infection was already here when I was born in 1957. They ran the country and killed a president,, I remember watching,, because there were no cartoons.

[AuH20]

Too late. The cultural infection was already here when I was born in 1957. They ran the country and killed a president,, I remember watching,, because there were no cartoons.

That's a different cultural infection that's well rooted and seemingly intractable. I'm referring to something that is completely controllable within the purview of the authorities.

[pcosmar]

I'm referring to something that is completely controllable within the purview of the authorities.

I'm not authoritarian.

nor do I support such.

I know of NO human worthy of such power.

What Authority do you suggest? given the current one is wholly corrupt.

[AuH20]

I'm not authoritarian.

nor do I support such.

I know of NO human worthy of such power.

What Authority do you suggest? given the current one is wholly corrupt.

Independent citizens are not allowed to enforce the law unfortunately and deport criminals. Responsibility falls upon the flawed authorities to ensure sovereignty.

[AuH20]

Imagine using letters of marque & reprisal to place 'dead or alive' orders on the heads of MS-13?

[pcosmar]

Independent citizens are not allowed to enforce the law unfortunately and deport criminals. Responsibility falls upon the flawed authorities to ensure sovereignty.

You're phucked then.

[pcosmar]

Imagine using letters of marque & reprisal to place 'dead or alive' orders on the heads of MS-13?

You might have to deal with their handlers. Could get expensive.

[CPUd]

Only President Donald can keep us safe

[Valli6]

Sorry but there is "Illegal aliens" right in the title. Nice try. Trump himself said he is making a special commission to report of crime done specifically by illegal.

That they were illegal aliens has significance here, because it proves that these particular murders could've been avoided. That can't be said about every murder, but it applies here. Acknowledging this doesn't mean one has concluded that every illegal alien is a murderer.

Here are a few more families that will never see a loved one again because their trivial lives are meaningless to the politicians shuffling pieces around a chessboard - and to the SJWs who are unable to open their minds and differentiate between concern based on factual occurrences, and plain ignorant racism.

During that increased deluge (summer of 2014?), reports were that anyone with MS-13 gang tattoos was allowed into the country if they just stated that they had quit the gang. At a minimum, such persons should've been fingerprinted* so that they might be traced if they should become involved in a serious crime later on. Instead, Obama's people accepted everyone without question, then secretively shipped them all over the country to neighborhoods where they would never be a problem for the elites.

People are rightfully pissed because they never gave a thought to the rest of us. We are sacrificial fodder for their political agenda - and we're supposed to pretend that's acceptable because some of you can't see beyond the non-whiteness that's presumed to be part of the equation?

I'll save my outrage for the victims and all the unnecessary victims yet to be.




*No, under this particular circumstance, it does not mean I support a "police state'.

[klamath]

That they were illegal aliens has significance here, because it proves that these particular murders could've been avoided. That can't be said about every murder, but it applies here. Acknowledging this doesn't mean one has concluded that every illegal alien is a murderer.

Here are a few more families that will never see a loved one again because their trivial lives are meaningless to the politicians shuffling pieces around a chessboard - and to the SJWs who are unable to open their minds and differentiate between concern based on factual occurrences, and plain ignorant racism.

During that increased deluge (summer of 2014?), reports were that anyone with MS-13 gang tattoos was allowed into the country if they just stated that they had quit the gang. At a minimum, such persons should've been fingerprinted* so that they might be traced if they should become involved in a serious crime later on. Instead, Obama's people accepted everyone without question, then secretively shipped them all over the country to neighborhoods where they would never be a problem for the elites.

People are rightfully pissed because they never gave a thought to the rest of us. We are sacrificial fodder for their political agenda - and we're supposed to pretend that's acceptable because some of you can't see beyond the non-whiteness that's presumed to be part of the equation?

I'll save my outrage for the victims and all the unnecessary victims yet to be.




*No, under this particular circumstance, it does not mean I support a "police state'.

I would say your argument dovetails nicely with ever argument made for gun control.... "This is one murder we could have stopped if only we had more extensive background checks.... trigger locks, etc etc."
Make sure to cite how heinous the crimes were... That always works nice for an agenda.

[Superfluous Man]

I would say your argument dovetails nicely with ever argument made for gun control.... "This is one murder we could have stopped if only we had more extensive background checks.... trigger locks, etc etc."
Make sure to cite how heinous the crimes were... That always works nice for an agenda.

Exactly.

And for that matter, it fits with any other kind of pre-crime enforcement.

If only we had aborted those criminals in the womb, they wouldn't have committed that crime.

If only we had deported that natural-born citizen before he committed some crime, then he wouldn't have committed it.

There's no sense to the whole argument, unless you assume from the starting point that limiting immigration is a good and just thing in the first place. But nobody can ever seem to come up with an argument for why it is.

[timosman]

Exactly.

And for that matter, it fits with any other kind of pre-crime enforcement.

If only we had aborted those criminals in the womb, they wouldn't have committed that crime.

If only we had deported that natural-born citizen before he committed some crime, then he wouldn't have committed it.

There's no sense to the whole argument, unless you assume from the starting point that limiting immigration is a good and just thing in the first place. But nobody can ever seem to come up with an argument for why it is.

Looks like you missed this thread - http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?484861-Unrestricted-Immigration

[Valli6]

I would say your argument dovetails nicely with ever argument made for gun control.... "This is one murder we could have stopped if only we had more extensive background checks.... trigger locks, etc etc."
Make sure to cite how heinous the crimes were... That always works nice for an agenda.

Except that these particular murderers had their calling cards tatooed on their bodies and faces. MS-13 has been around for a long time and law enforcement knows all about them. It didn't require any further checking to know that MS-13 are murderers and proud of it. Still, until recently, the media never mentioned them at all.

Some of you might remember hearing about several murders in Newark NJ, when (now-sen.) Cory Booker was still the mayor. The story got a lot of coverage - I think all over the country (hard to judge when it's a local story). It was a "sensational" story because the victims were teenage kids hanging out in a schoolyard and days away from starting college. Once they realized they were about to be killed, the kids were texting each other trying to figure out how to get away. But it wasn't till long after the sensation died down and the trial was over, that it came out that the killers were all illegal alien gang members. Who had the "agenda" here? I still haven't heard their motive for murdering them.

So you see, everyone heard the initial story, but almost no one heard that the killers were gang members that were in the country illegally. They had previous arrests, always promptly bailed out, never an issue obtaining bail money regardless of how high it was - and the killings were more brutal than we were told (castration and more). So, you can't claim that MS-13 is just propaganda when the media has spent years avoiding any mention of them.

I'm starting to wonder if some of you have honestly never heard of of MS-13?

[nikcers]

I'm starting to wonder if some of you have honestly never heard of of MS-13?

The radio show I was listening to on Friday asked that question and no one who called in knew who they were. I've never heard of them until I heard about it on that show. I don't consider myself uninformed , but then again I am not looking under my bed for MS-13 at night, I am looking under there and the fed is there.

[klamath]

Except that these particular murderers had their calling cards tatooed on their bodies and faces. MS-13 has been around for a long time and law enforcement knows all about them. It didn't require any further checking to know that MS-13 are murderers and proud of it. Still, until recently, the media never mentioned them at all.

Some of you might remember hearing about several murders in Newark NJ, when (now-sen.) Cory Booker was still the mayor. The story got a lot of coverage - I think all over the country (hard to judge when it's a local story). It was a "sensational" story because the victims were teenage kids hanging out in a schoolyard and days away from starting college. Once they realized they were about to be killed, the kids were texting each other trying to figure out how to get away. But it wasn't till long after the sensation died down and the trial was over, that it came out that the killers were all illegal alien gang members. Who had the "agenda" here? I still haven't heard their motive for murdering them.

So you see, everyone heard the initial story, but almost no one heard that the killers were gang members that were in the country illegally. They had previous arrests, always promptly bailed out, never an issue obtaining bail money regardless of how high it was - and the killings were more brutal than we were told (castration and more). So, you can't claim that MS-13 is just propaganda when the media has spent years avoiding any mention of them.

I'm starting to wonder if some of you have honestly never heard of of MS-13? And you miss the whole point of the thread....Paint all Hispanic immigrants as violent gangs...It really isn't about gangs and violent criminals it is about supporting Trumps agenda to hate on Mexican immigrants. I have no problems with dealing harshly with violent immigrants but I have a huge problem with broad brush painting of brown immigrants as evil and that is the motivation for these Types or posts. I see these memes on my facebook newsfeed a thousand times a day. Always a broad brush attempt to stir fear and support government taking strong action to PROTECT us. In the end you can exchange "PROTECT" to "Screw". I see the attempt to equate illegally crossing the border to the most heinous violent crime when it really on the level of driving 35 in a 25 mph zone. Running a red light is a higher crime than crossing the border. I would be more in favor of expelling anyone that ran a red light, than a person crossing a political line looking for work to feed their family.
Left or right it is always based on FEAR and what the government can do to save us! Guns, global warming, muslims, Mexicans, you name it. One thing is for sure I never expected to see Ron Paul republicans pushing this line. I could easily see the standard republicans pushing it but it just reinforces that you learn something new about peoples character every day.

[RPtotheWH]

Of course the MSM has changed the narrative to immigrants when it has been illegal imigrants all along. As a libertarian do I have the right to say who can come on my property? Or do I have no property rights?

[klamath]

Of course the MSM has changed the narrative to immigrants when it has been illegal imigrants all along. As a libertarian do I have the right to say who can come on my property? Or do I have no property rights? No. Trump changed it to ALL immigrants including legal citizens when he advocated throwing even natural born Hispanics out. Trump changed it when he advocated banning worldwide muslims coming to this country.

[CPUd]

And you miss the whole point of the thread....Paint all Hispanic immigrants as violent gangs...It really isn't about gangs and violent criminals it is about supporting Trumps agenda to hate on Mexican immigrants. I have no problems with dealing harshly with violent immigrants but I have a huge problem with broad brush painting of brown immigrants as evil and that is the motivation for these Types or posts. I see these memes on my facebook newsfeed a thousand times a day. Always a broad brush attempt to stir fear and support government taking strong action to PROTECT us. In the end you can exchange "PROTECT" to "Screw". I see the attempt to equate illegally crossing the border to the most heinous violent crime when it really on the level of driving 35 in a 25 mph zone. Running a red light is a higher crime than crossing the border. I would be more in favor of expelling anyone that ran a red light, than a person crossing a political line looking for work to feed their family.
Left or right it is always based on FEAR and what the government can do to save us! Guns, global warming, muslims, Mexicans, you name it. One thing is for sure I never expected to see Ron Paul republicans pushing this line. I could easily see the standard republicans pushing it but it just reinforces that you learn something new about peoples character every day.

If they are pushing fear and begging for government protection, they are not Ron Paul Republicans, they are authoritarians.

[AuH20]

If they are pushing fear and begging for government protection, they are not Ron Paul Republicans, they are authoritarians.

Ron Paul was another one I had to straighten out on twitter. Cut off the incentives he says. Well, that's been decided and then some.

Libertarians are fighting an old war that they are not even mentally equipped to comprehend. If it was that easy to remove the incentives no one would be talking about the wall or restating the true intent of the 14th amendment. The enemy as usual has removed any peaceful resolution to this problem.

836767199285084160

[CPUd]

Ron Paul was another one I had to straighten out on twitter. Cut off the incentives he says. Well, that's been decided and then some. Libertarians are fighting an old war that they are not even mentally equipped to comprehend.

836767199285084160

you do not believe "incentives" are affected by foreign policy?

[nikcers]

That's a very complicated question, but I guess it comes down to the fact that higher IQ is not a trait that is rewarded as heavily in equatorial climates as it is in areas with harsh winter climates.

Would you like to know why that is as well?

People in the arctic have to eat like 7000 calories a day, peoples brains use most of their energy. You do the math.

[AuH20]

you do not believe "incentives" are affected by foreign policy?

The Mexican government depends on the U.S. to buy their narcotics and at the same time provide a social welfare net for their disgruntled peoples. There is also a commensalistic relationship with Western financial institutions and the aforementioned Deep State who also profit from the illegal drug trade.

[timosman]

you do not believe "incentives" are affected by foreign policy?

CPUd coming out of the left field again. How is it you are still allowed to post? :rolleyes:

[TheCount]

Not likely. Being poor does not make one a murderer, rapist, kidnapper, robber.
There are billions of poor people worldwide that do not become violent raping, kidnapping, murdering gang members.Sure thing.

[Ender]

The Mexican government depends on the U.S. to buy their narcotics and at the same time provide a social welfare net for their disgruntled peoples. There is also a commensalistic relationship with Western financial institutions and the aforementioned Deep State who also profit from the illegal drug trade.

This is all caused by the WoD, which is an alphabet program.

[Valli6]

And you miss the whole point of the thread....Paint all Hispanic immigrants as violent gangs...It really isn't about gangs and violent criminals it is about supporting Trumps agenda to hate on Mexican immigrants. I have no problems with dealing harshly with violent immigrants but I have a huge problem with broad brush painting of brown immigrants as evil and that is the motivation for these Types or posts. I see these memes on my facebook newsfeed a thousand times a day.

See, I didn't view that as the whole point of the thread. These are out-of-the ordinary murders - of course people are going to remark on them. You expected racism, so thats what you found. I haven't seen anyone using phrases like "all illegals are dangerous" except you. Maybe you should stop eating up the steady diet of memes on your facebook newfeed. A thousand a day? What is that - some new kind of porn? On one hand, you think they're garbage, but on the other hand you're suggesting they're an indication of how racist other people are. Turn it off.

[klamath]

See, I didn't view that as the whole point of the thread. These are out-of-the ordinary murders - of course people are going to remark on them. You expected racism, so thats what you found. I haven't seen anyone using phrases like "all illegals are dangerous" except you. Maybe you should stop eating up the steady diet of memes on your facebook newfeed. A thousand a day? What is that - some new kind of porn? On one hand, you think they're garbage, but on the other hand you're suggesting they're an indication of how racist other people are. Turn it off.Certain people are racist. I know the history of the OP. She is extremely anti illegal aliens. The whole (illegal aliens) in the OP's title proves it was to show violence by illegal aliens, not to just discuss gang violence. even in this thread there are people saying people on the equator have lower IQ than northern people.

[nikcers]

Certain people are racist. I know the history of the OP. She is extremely anti illegal aliens. The whole (illegal aliens) in the OP's title proves it was to show violence by illegal aliens, not to just discuss gang violence. even in this thread there are people saying people on the equator have lower IQ than northern people.
Are you arguing that certain biological conditions can't stimulate an expression of genes? Are you Bananas?

[Anti Federalist]

What didn't work out was a government that enslaved, double crossed and killed them. Individual settlers would have worked it out. It is when people advocate government force to settle cultural clashes that evil shit happens. Of all people I thought you would have known this.

I do understand it.

That is why I am opposed to the idea of mass migration seizing control of government through the voting process.

If we did not have a massive tyrannical state over us, if it were nothing more than free peoples moving about and free people allowed to associated with whomever, then there would be no issue.

But that is not the reality.

[MallsRGood]

If it was that easy to remove the incentives no one would be talking about the wall or restating the true intent of the 14th amendment.

The anti-immigrant camp doesn't give a Salvadoran rat's ass about the welfare state or free markets or the size of government.

They're driven by racism and self-interest (protect my job from competition, protect my welfare).

Tell me about how Americans or Europeans were cutting welfare before the third world immigrants started arriving....:rolleyes:

[AZJoe]

The anti-immigrant camp doesn't give a Salvadoran rat's ass about the welfare state or free markets or the size of government.

They're driven by racism and self-interest (protect my job from competition, protect my welfare).

Tell me about how Americans or Europeans were cutting welfare before the third world immigrants started arriving....:rolleyes:

OMG. The old unthinking knee jerk shout of the statist. Want to lower taxes - you'r racist. Want to cut welfare - you're racist. Want to reduce government - you're racist. Want to end the fed - you're racist. Want to limit or vet migration - you're racist. Support nullification - you're racist. So anybody that is not Soros open borders mass migration must automatically be racist. How intellectually dishonest.

https://cairnsnews.files.wordpress.com/2016/07/shout-racist.jpg?w=300

In the US, immigration plays heavily on exploitation for political power. The Soros & Co. politicians who advocate open mass migration are the same who advocate a welfare state, taxation, government control, socialist policies. Notice how they put a cap on the H1B most highly skilled, highly talented individuals the world has to offer, yet no limits on the unskilled. They advocate mass migration because they believe they gain political advantage from it. That the immigration favors their political viewpoints and helps keep them in power; That the mass immigrants tend to favor welfare, statist politicians, statist programs, government intervention, taxation, spending. Who would not want to oppose more statists? These statist minded think they can gain political advantage for their ideology and political power from such migration. Of course as Dr.Paul has explained, the welfare magnets tend to attract people seeking welfare state benefits. Were the migrants coming here demanding to end the income tax, end the fed, support gun rights, pro second amendment, end the welfare system, end foreign intervention, end or cut licensing and regulations, limiting government, term limits on political power, the statist would see that as a threat to their power structure. Of course we all would want such immigrants, as many as we can get, no matter where they came from. Do you think Soros and company welcome a mass influx of Ron Paul and Harry Brown minded individuals? Those same statist politicians would be doing everything they can to keep a mass influx of such liberty minded individuals out of the country. Heck, they would be ardently advocating limiting immigration if they simply thought the immigrants were going to be pro Republican, let alone liberty activists.

[MallsRGood]

^^triggered?

[Feeding the Abscess]

I do understand it.

That is why I am opposed to the idea of mass migration seizing control of government through the voting process.

If we did not have a massive tyrannical state over us, if it were nothing more than free peoples moving about and free people allowed to associated with whomever, then there would be no issue.

But that is not the reality.

Reality: Schumer, McCain, etc aren't going to implement immigration restrictions in order to construct and maintain a libertarian society. The powers granted by them to various alphabet agencies in order to carry out any presumed restrictions would manifest in decidedly unlibertarian outcomes.

Stop giving them power, and stop pretending that the government will solve this problem.

[klamath]

I do understand it.

That is why I am opposed to the idea of mass migration seizing control of government through the voting process.

If we did not have a massive tyrannical state over us, if it were nothing more than free peoples moving about and free people allowed to associated with whomever, then there would be no issue.

But that is not the reality.
In reality you will never stop migration. the Indians didn't stop it, the berlin wall didn't stop it. People will die by the thousands for a chance and will go through hell in the dream to better their lives. Hiring thousands upon thousands of cops isn't going to stop it but what you will do is solidly instill in the immigrants that the people and party that claims to want individual freedom and economic freedom really doesn't. It is a solid self defeating downward spiral. I know people like to say brown people are going to bring socialism, but socialism and communism was invented and is solidly practiced in the whitest countries in the world. Socialism and tyranny were elected in this country when whites solidly controlled the electorate. FDR was elected in a day when blacks solidly voted republican.
There is a saying, "what you resist and lose to, you become." and it seems it applies well to former anti government Ron Paul forum people.

[Ender]

In reality you will never stop migration. the Indians didn't stop it, the berlin wall didn't stop it. People will die by the thousands for a chance and will go through hell in the dream to better their lives. Hiring thousands upon thousands of cops isn't going to stop it but what you will do is solidly instill in the immigrants that the people and party that claims to want individual freedom and economic freedom really doesn't. It is a solid self defeating downward spiral. I know people like to say brown people are going to bring socialism, but socialism and communism was invented and is solidly practiced in the whitest countries in the world. Socialism and tyranny were elected in this country when whites solidly controlled the electorate. FDR was elected in a day when blacks solidly voted republican.
There is a saying, "what you resist and lose to, you become." and it seems it applies well to former anti government Ron Paul forum people.

^^THIS^^

[nikcers]

Oh come on you don't think sending millions of democracy loving bilingual mexicans who love cheeseburgers and not being afraid of dying in their sleep isn't going to make Mexico great again? Maybe we won't even need a wall after we renegotiate nafta and tortilla prices go down to normal levels.