CIA broke the law to take out its critic General Flynn

[spudea]

I hope this is OK to post here. Sorry it's not from David Brock, Nancy Pelosi, or Keith Olbermann...


Make no mistake, we have just witnessed an operation by members of the CIA to take out a high official of our own government. An agency that is widely believed to have brought down democratically elected governments overseas is now practicing the same dark arts in domestic American politics. Almost certainly, its new head Mike Pompeo was not consulted.

...

Note that the law was broken by whoever leaked the transcripts to the media. Not only is the crime underlying the "scandal" being ignored, the criminals are being hailed. On Morning Joe’s first hour today, the host, a former congressman (i.e., a lawmaker) himself, called the leakers “heroes.”

This interference in domestic politics by the CIA should be regarded as a major threat to our democracy, but of course our Trump-hating domestic media are reveling in a major point scored against the new president.

...

The Flynn Affair is a huge scandal, all right. But the media are misdirecting our attention toward the lesser dimension while they studiously ignore the real threat to our democracy.

http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2017/02/cia_broke_the_law_to_take_out_its_critic_general_f lynn.html

[robert68]

On Morning Joe’s first hour today, the host, a former congressman (i.e., a lawmaker) himself, called the leakers “heroes.”

Leaks that expose high level wrong doing are good for liberty.

[spudea]

Leaking is good for liberty.

THIS IS NOT A LEAK. THE TRANSCRIPT HAS NOT BEEN MADE PUBLIC AND DON'T EXPECT IT TO BE.

Motives matter. Tulsa Gabbard had private conversation with Bashar Assad. John McCain had private meeting with ISIS leaders in Syria, yet they were not targeted by the CIA.

Edit: sorry typing from phone. I meant to say this is not a pro liberty leak when the call recording or transcript is not made public.

[oyarde]

Abolish the CIA.

[seapilot]

Abolish the CIA.

I think we are seeing who really runs the USA foreign affairs. MSM is in collusion with them.

[oyarde]

I think we are seeing who really runs the USA foreign affairs. MSM is in collusion with them.

They would have people working in MSM.

[UWDude]

Leaking is good for liberty.

How was this leak "good for liberty"?
Anybody care to explain why what Flynn did was illegal? Why is he not allowed to talk to russia about lifting sanctions? I am truly confused.

[robert68]

How was this leak "good for liberty"?
Anybody care to explain why what Flynn did was illegal? Why is he not allowed to talk to russia about lifting sanctions? I am truly confused.

Trump wasn't President yet. He then lied to VP about it.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Logan_Act

[timosman]

How was this leak "good for liberty"?
Anybody care to explain why what Flynn did was illegal? Why is he not allowed to talk to russia about lifting sanctions? I am truly confused.

This is another example of a generic "feel good" statement which does not apply to the situation at hand at all.

[seapilot]

They would have people working in MSM.

Like the albino guy at Communist News. Reminds me of a character that was in a Bond movie.

[timosman]

Like the albino guy at Communist News. Reminds me of a character that was in a Bond movie.

Pooper?

[Brian4Liberty]

Anybody care to explain why what Flynn did was illegal? Why is he not allowed to talk to russia about lifting sanctions? I am truly confused.

The Logan Act, which has never been enforced since it was passed in 1799. Widely violated, often mentioned, but basically nothing more than a political weapon.

Logan himself was a peace activist who tried to defuse an undeclared war at sea between France and the US. Apparently it's most important use is to bludgeon those who try to avoid war.

[Origanalist]

The CIA is dirty to the core and a danger to the whole planet. Oyarde is right.

[spudea]

Trump wasn't President yet. He then lied to VP about it.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Logan_Act

You don't even know how the conversation went. A private conversation over the phone is not a formal negotiation covered by the Logan Act. Again, Tulsa Gabbard had a unplanned unauthorized private meeting with Bashar Assad. John McCain had private meetings with ISIS leaders in Syria. Those examples are much more formal and whose to say if they violated the act. Oh the CIA decides? It's a sad thing to see the CIA defended here.

[enhanced_deficit]

Not to defend the agencies here but Flynn had been pretty reckless and public in his criticism of their programs.
Even DGP didn't go as far as Flynn had gone.


16 July 2015

Retired US general: Drones cause more damage than good (http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2015/07/retired-general-drones-damage-good-150716105352708.html)

Flynn acknowledged the US invasion of Iraq helped fuel the rise of ISIL [File]
US President Barack Obama's former top military intelligence official has launched a scathing attack on the White House's counter-terrorism strategy, including the administration's handling of the ISIL threat in Iraq and Syria and the US military's drone war.

In a forthcoming interview with Al Jazeera English's Head to Head, retired US Lt. General Michael Flynn, who quit as head of the Pentagon's Defense Intelligence Agency (DIA) in August 2014, said "there should be a different approach, absolutely" on drones.
"When you drop a bomb from a drone… you are going to cause more damage than you are going to cause good," Flynn said.





https://i.ytimg.com/vi/qRnq4TEe5DU/maxresdefault.jpg

[donnay]

They would have people working in MSM.


MOCKINGBIRD: The Subversion Of The Free Press By The CIA
http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/RANCHO/POLITICS/MOCK/mockingbird.php


"You could get a journalist cheaper than a good call girl, for a couple hundred dollars a month." - CIA operative discussing with Philip Graham, editor Washington Post, on the availability and prices of journalists willing to peddle CIA propaganda and cover stories. "Katherine The Great," by Deborah Davis (New York: Sheridan Square Press, 1991)

"The Central Intelligence Agency owns everyone of any significance in the major media." -- William Colby, former CIA Director, cited by Dave Mcgowan, Derailing Democracy

"There is quite an incredible spread of relationships. You don't need to manipulate Time magazine, for example, because there are [Central Intelligence] Agency people at the management level." -- William B. Bader, former CIA intelligence officer, briefing members of the Senate Intelligence Committee, The CIA and the Media, by Carl Bernstein

"The Agency's relationship with [The New York] Times was by far its most valuable among newspapers, according to CIA officials. [It was] general Times policy ... to provide assistance to the CIA whenever possible." -- The CIA and the Media, by Carl Bernstein

"Senator William Proxmire has pegged the number of employees of the federal intelligence community at 148,000 ... though Proxmire's number is itself a conservative one. The "intelligence community" is officially defined as including only those organizations that are members of the U.S. Intelligence Board (USIB); a dozen other agencies, charged with both foreign and domestic intelligence chores, are not encompassed by the term.... The number of intelligence workers employed by the federal government is not 148,000, but some undetermined multiple of that number." -- Jim Hougan, Spooks

"For some time I have been disturbed by the way the CIA has been diverted from its original assignment. It has become an operational and at times a policy-making arm of the government.... I never had any thought that when I set up the CIA that it would be injected into peacetime cloak and dagger operations." --former President Harry Truman, 22 December 1963, one month after the JFK assassination, op-ed section of the Washington Post, early edition

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

US Govt Just Legalized Operation Mockingbird — FBI Can Now Impersonate the Media
http://www.activistpost.com/2016/09/us-govt-just-legalized-operation-mockingbird-fbi-can-now-impersonate-media.html

[CPUd]

President Donald said it himself that the press is trying to make up a war between him and the CIA, you guys are buying into the fake news.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UkKxO2WWIwE

[Brian4Liberty]

You don't even know how the conversation went. A private conversation over the phone is not a formal negotiation covered by the Logan Act. Again, Tulsa Gabbard had a unplanned unauthorized private meeting with Bashar Assad. John McCain had private meetings with ISIS leaders in Syria. Those examples are much more formal and whose to say if they violated the act. Oh the CIA decides? It's a sad thing to see the CIA defended here.

Would not be surprised in the slightest if they decided to make Gabbard the very first prosecution of the Logan Act.

McCain and Graham are doing the bidding of the MIC establishment. They are safe.

[Ender]

The CIA is dirty to the core and a danger to the whole planet. Oyarde is right.

Just ask JFK. :(

[goldenequity]

President Donald said it himself that the press is trying to make up a war between him and the CIA, you guys are buying into the fake news.


That is simply blurring a line and throwing junior out with the bath H20...
Truth is: there's White hats and Black hats throughout the agencies...
The 'War' is real inside the government but not with a 'single' agency.
No one (with a brain) is 'buying into' that broad brushstroke.
There IS a war inside the USG though.. and it is raging
as most of us knew it would.

[TheCount]

Again, Tulsa Gabbard had a unplanned unauthorized private meeting with Bashar Assad. John McCain had private meetings with ISIS leaders in Syria. Those examples are much more formal and whose to say if they violated the act. They're not private citizens. Flynn was.


The clear intent of this provision [Logan Act] is to prohibit unauthorized persons from intervening in disputes between the United States and foreign governments. Nothing in section 953 [Logan Act], however, would appear to restrict members of the Congress from engaging in discussions with foreign officials in pursuance of their legislative duties under the Constitution.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Logan_Act


Oh the CIA decides? It's a sad thing to see the CIA defended here.

What did the CIA decide? They're not involved whatsoever in determining if it's a Logan violation or not. The issue at hand for them was whether Flynn was operating with the knowledge of the President-elect and Vice President-elect. Which he apparently wasn't, and following that lied to at least the VP about it. Obviously that poses several security concerns for the CIA.

[CPUd]

831511368419389441
https://twitter.com/kylegriffin1/status/831511368419389441

[TheCount]

831511368419389441
https://twitter.com/kylegriffin1/status/831511368419389441I guess leaks are less awesome when they're making your administration look inept.

[CPUd]

831487477340831744
https://twitter.com/ggreenwald/status/831487477340831744

[Athan]

Leaking is good for liberty.

Normally yes, but this is a big win for CIA vs. JSOG. Honestly he shouldn't have resigned. The next appointment won't be as strong of a critic against the CIA abuses.

[oyarde]

President Donald said it himself that the press is trying to make up a war between him and the CIA, you guys are buying into the fake news.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UkKxO2WWIwE

I just want to be rid of them .

[Athan]

FUUUUUUUGGGG


http://ibankcoin.com/flyblog/files/2017/02/WTF.png
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/02/14/hillary-clinton-burns-michael-flynn-resignation-fake-news-tweet/
https://twitter.com/HillaryClinton/status/831377792893849600

[charrob]

I’m not convinced that this was such a “lie” that was said by Flynn, and won’t be until, and unless, the full conversation is leaked and we, the public, can read it.

The Russian ambassador almost assuredly asked Flynn about the sanctions placed upon them by Obama in the yet-to-be-proven case that the Russians hacked the Democratic elections. Flynn might have said “we’ll look into it”, or “we’ll probably be able to decrease the sanctions”, etc. He probably didn’t go into any negotiating which is why he told Pence there was really nothing discussed. A true journalist should not assume anything more until there is valid proof that it occurred.

No – the real story here is that we the public do not have the transcripts of the conversation and the media is working with (or for) the neocons that infest the CIA to create a fictionalized account that the public will never be able to verify so that they could destroy a man who refused to toe the CIA propaganda line on U.S. foreign policy.

-----------------------------

Also, isn't it the NSA that keeps and transcribes all of our telephone calls? So now the NSA is giving this information to the CIA?

-----------------------------

btw, I'm not any supporter of Michael Flynn who was a true hawk on Iran. It would be easy to jump on the 'happy' train right now and say the leaks were a wonderful thing. But that's not the point. I'm not being given enough information to even fully believe that Michael Flynn was involved in such horrible lies. This more likely seems to be a case of the deep state (who in my opinion is the true enemy) taking down someone who doesn't completely toe their line.

[AngryCanadian]

The same CIA thats behind arming Syrian Jihadists cant say i am not surprised. The CIA were for Hillary.

[CPUd]

I’m not convinced that this was such a “lie” that was said by Flynn, and won’t be until, and unless, the full conversation is leaked and we, the public, can read it.

The Russian ambassador almost assuredly asked Flynn about the sanctions placed upon them by Obama in the yet-to-be-proven case that the Russians hacked the Democratic elections. Flynn might have said “we’ll look into it”, or “we’ll probably be able to decrease the sanctions”, etc. He probably didn’t go into any negotiating which is why he told Pence there was really nothing discussed. A true journalist should not assume anything more until there is valid proof that it occurred.

No – the real story here is that we the public do not have the transcripts of the conversation and the media is working with (or for) the neocons that infest the CIA to create a fictionalized account that the public will never be able to verify so that they could destroy a man who refused to toe the CIA propaganda line on U.S. foreign policy.

-----------------------------

Also, isn't it the NSA that keeps and transcribes all of our telephone calls? So now the NSA is giving this information to the CIA?

-----------------------------

btw, I'm not any supporter of Michael Flynn who was a true hawk on Iran. It would be easy to jump on the 'happy' train right now and say the leaks were a wonderful thing. But that's not the point. I'm not being given enough information to even fully believe that Michael Flynn was involved in such horrible lies. This more likely seems to be a case of the deep state (who in my opinion is the true enemy) taking down someone who doesn't completely toe their line.

Flynn told the Russians in advance that the Obama admin was going to impose sanctions, there is a transcript/recording of this call because the FBI was monitoring the Russian ambassador and FSB was monitoring Flynn. The one who told Trump about this, and its implications, several weeks ago got fired, though for completely different reasons.

[AngryCanadian]

I just want to be rid of them .

Remember what happened to JFK when he refused obeying the CIA to do a false flag?

[AngryCanadian]

Flynn told the Russians in advance that the Obama admin was going to impose sanctions, there is a transcript/recording of this call because the FBI was monitoring the Russian ambassador and FSB was monitoring Flynn. The one who told Trump about this, and its implications, several weeks ago got fired, though for completely different reasons.

Oh i would loved it if the Russians release a lot of dirt on the Clintons and liberals.

[spudea]

They're not private citizens. Flynn was.



What did the CIA decide? They're not involved whatsoever in determining if it's a Logan violation or not. The issue at hand for them was whether Flynn was operating with the knowledge of the President-elect and Vice President-elect. Which he apparently wasn't, and following that lied to at least the VP about it. Obviously that poses several security concerns for the CIA.

Then as a private citizen, he has a right to privacy and due process. Instead the CIA feeds anonymous concerns to select ally MSM outlets in order to embarrass the current administration.

KILL THE BEAST!

[charrob]

Flynn told the Russians in advance that the Obama admin was going to impose sanctions, there is a transcript/recording of this call because the FBI was monitoring the Russian ambassador and FSB was monitoring Flynn. The one who told Trump about this, and its implications, several weeks ago got fired, though for completely different reasons.


Do you have a link for that? I read that Flynn talked to the Russian ambassador the same day, but after, Obama had already imposed the sanctions. How would Flynn have known about the sanctions before Obama imposed them?

[CPUd]

Do you have a link for that? I read that Flynn talked to the Russian ambassador the same day, but after, Obama had already imposed the sanctions. How would Flynn have known about the sanctions before Obama imposed them?

The official story from the transition team was that they didn't talk about sanctions in those calls, but they were told in private that the FBI had recorded the call and they did talk about sanctions. The Trump team thought they could keep it quiet, but it got out to the press, which is why Flynn had to resign. Otherwise those implications go up the chain, which they probably will keep pushing at now that Flynn's gone.



Intelligence analysts began to search for clues that could help explain Putin’s move. The search turned up Kislyak’s communications, which the FBI routinely monitors, and the phone call in question with Flynn, a retired Army lieutenant general with years of intelligence experience.

[The fall of Michael Flynn: A timeline]

From that call and subsequent intercepts, FBI agents wrote a secret report summarizing *Flynn’s discussions with Kislyak.

Yates, then the deputy attorney general, considered Flynn’s comments in the intercepted call to be “highly significant” and “potentially illegal,” according to an official familiar with her thinking.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/justice-department-warned-white-house-that-flynn-could-be-vulnerable-to-russian-blackmail-officials-say/2017/02/13/fc5dab88-f228-11e6-8d72-263470bf0401_story.html

[CPUd]

Also the transition team at the time was getting classified briefings, so they would have known in advance about the sanctions. Specifically, Trump and Flynn.

[robert68]

Then as a private citizen, he has a right to privacy and due process. Instead the CIA feeds anonymous concerns to select ally MSM outlets in order to embarrass the current administration.

KILL THE BEAST!

Privacy? Phone calls to Russian ambassadors are always wiretapped. He was a fool.

[charrob]

Flynn told the Russians in advance that the Obama admin was going to impose sanctions, there is a transcript/recording of this call because the FBI was monitoring the Russian ambassador and FSB was monitoring Flynn. The one who told Trump about this, and its implications, several weeks ago got fired, though for completely different reasons.

I'm still not seeing any evidence that Flynn told the Russians in advance that the Obama admin was going to impose sanctions. I've only read that Flynn spoke to the Russians after the sanctions were already in place.

[AZJoe]

Would not be surprised in the slightest if they decided to make Gabbard the very first prosecution of the Logan Act.

McCain and Graham are doing the bidding of the MIC establishment. They are safe.


McCain and Graham and Lieberman and Hillary. Campaigning with neo-Nazi groups in Ukraine, holding meetings with that government as well as the governments of Israel, Saudi Arabia, UAE, and plenty of others, not to mention accepting all the funds from foreign government into your slush fund Foundation. All those things are perfectly acceptable. You see, laws are not meant to be enforced. They are merely meant to be selectively enforced by the masters at their whim only.

[AZJoe]

"Make no mistake, we have just witnessed an operation by members of the CIA to take out a high official of our own government. An agency that is widely believed to have brought down democratically elected governments overseas is now practicing the same dark arts in domestic American politics"

Spot on!

[CPUd]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FM-snRjN-eA

[AZJoe]

On Morning Joe’s first hour today, the host, a former congressman (i.e., a lawmaker) himself, called the leakers “heroes.”

Then shouldn't they be getting the same treatment as the rest of the heroes. Shouldn't they be getting the Chelsea Manning treatment, or forced to live in the back office of some embassy for years, or forced to seek asylum from another country, or sent to prison like Kiriakou.

[PierzStyx]

I hope this is OK to post here. Sorry it's not from David Brock, Nancy Pelosi, or Keith Olbermann...



http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2017/02/cia_broke_the_law_to_take_out_its_critic_general_f lynn.html


That is alright. A neocon rag like the American "Thinker" is just as bad.

[PierzStyx]

I'm still not seeing any evidence that Flynn told the Russians in advance that the Obama admin was going to impose sanctions. I've only read that Flynn spoke to the Russians after the sanctions were already in place.

Correct. The big issue is that Flynn implied that trump would lessen or end sanctions without the proper position or authority to do so. And then he lied to everyone about it.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/feb/13/michael-flynn-resigns-quits-trump-national-security-adviser-russia

[AZJoe]

Leaking is good for liberty.

Yes, the CIA and the NSA are the advocates for transparency and full disclosure. That is why they have no secrets, and no covert operations hidden from the American people. We can certainly trust that they are giving us the truth. They have our best interests at heart. They have always been forthright with us telling us the truth about Iraq WMDs, and truth about Ukraine and Nuland and Pyatt, and the truth about Syria, and the the truth about ISIS and Al Qaeda, and torture, and renditions, and domestic spying, and everything else.

That is why the NSA and CIA have been the biggest supporters of Manning, Snowden, Assange, Kiriakou and others. Heck CIA's motto is "no secrets", and the NSA's is "always tell the truth and hide nothing". Real bastions of honesty they are.

The "leak" is not any full disclosure for the purpose of providing truth and transparency to the American people. To the contrary, it is an intentional surreptitious selective "leaked" information for the purpose of eliminating a critic, manipulating and controlling US policy, and thwart any contrary will of the American people.

While I appreciate the leak, if it is indeed true (The NYT and WaPo say the transcript can be interpreted different ways.) There is no virtue in such sinister schemes of control, manipulation and deception. The CIA and NSA are not valiant whistle-blowers. Were they, than Assange and Snowden would be doing speaking tours in the US to the cheering crowds of NSA and CIA officials.

[charrob]

Correct. The big issue is that Flynn implied that trump would lessen or end sanctions without the proper position or authority to do so. And then he lied to everyone about it.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/feb/13/michael-flynn-resigns-quits-trump-national-security-adviser-russia


I’m not convinced that this was such a “lie” that was said by Flynn, and won’t be until, and unless, the full conversation is leaked and we, the public, can read it.

The Russian ambassador almost assuredly asked Flynn about the sanctions placed upon them by Obama in the yet-to-be-proven case that the Russians hacked the Democratic elections. Flynn might have said “we’ll look into it” and nothing more. That’s the kind of thing that is so trivial in a busy day that it is almost equal to saying “no comment”. It’s highly probable that he wouldn’t have remembered saying such a trivial comment as this. But after digging deep into his memory, the next day he stated to the Wash. Post he “couldn’t be certain that the topic never came up.” imho, this is highly probable. Our brains do not register every single thing we say everyday and, in fact, we lose a lot of the trivial memories inside of a day.

imho a truth-seeking reader should not assume anything more about this conversation until we can read it. Statements by so-called "officials" don't cut it for me.

No – the real story here is that we the public do not have the transcripts of the conversation and the media is working with (or for) the neocons that infest the CIA to create a fictionalized account that the public will never be able to verify so that they could destroy a man who refused to toe the CIA propaganda line on U.S. foreign policy.

I am no supporter of Michael Flynn and completely disagree with his hawkish views on Iran. But even more than that, I absolutely abhor witch hunts on people where truth cannot be verified.

[charrob]

Yes, the CIA and the NSA are the advocates for transparency and full disclosure. That is why they have no secrets, and no covert operations hidden from the American people. We can certainly trust that they are giving us the truth. They have our best interests at heart. They have always been forthright with us telling us the truth about Iraq WMDs, and truth about Ukraine and Nuland and Pyatt, and the truth about Syria, and the the truth about ISIS and Al Qaeda, and torture, and renditions, and domestic spying, and everything else.

That is why the NSA and CIA have been the biggest supporters of Manning, Snowden, Assange, Kiriakou and others. Heck CIA's motto is "no secrets", and the NSA's is "always tell the truth and hide nothing". Real bastions of honesty they are.

The "leak" is not any full disclosure for the purpose of providing truth and transparency to the American people. To the contrary, it is an intentional surreptitious selective "leaked" information for the purpose of eliminating a critic, manipulating and controlling US policy, and thwart any contrary will of the American people.

While I appreciate the leak, if it is indeed true (The NYT and WaPo say the transcript can be interpreted different ways.) There is no virtue in such sinister schemes of control, manipulation and deception. The CIA and NSA are not valiant whistle-blowers. Were they, than Assange and Snowden would be doing speaking tours in the US to the cheering crowds of NSA and CIA officials.

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to AZJoe again. +1 rep.

[Dark_Horse_Rider]

Yes, the CIA and the NSA are the advocates for transparency and full disclosure. That is why they have no secrets, and no covert operations hidden from the American people. We can certainly trust that they are giving us the truth. They have our best interests at heart. They have always been forthright with us telling us the truth about Iraq WMDs, and truth about Ukraine and Nuland and Pyatt, and the truth about Syria, and the the truth about ISIS and Al Qaeda, and torture, and renditions, and domestic spying, and everything else.

That is why the NSA and CIA have been the biggest supporters of Manning, Snowden, Assange, Kiriakou and others. Heck CIA's motto is "no secrets", and the NSA's is "always tell the truth and hide nothing". Real bastions of honesty they are.

The "leak" is not any full disclosure for the purpose of providing truth and transparency to the American people. To the contrary, it is an intentional surreptitious selective "leaked" information for the purpose of eliminating a critic, manipulating and controlling US policy, and thwart any contrary will of the American people.

While I appreciate the leak, if it is indeed true (The NYT and WaPo say the transcript can be interpreted different ways.) There is no virtue in such sinister schemes of control, manipulation and deception. The CIA and NSA are not valiant whistle-blowers. Were they, than Assange and Snowden would be doing speaking tours in the US to the cheering crowds of NSA and CIA officials.

Nicely stated !

[unknown]

I think we are seeing who really runs the USA foreign affairs. MSM is in collusion with them.

Deep State.

[timosman]

Deep State.

Is CPUd part of this? Maybe he does not know? :confused:

[PierzStyx]

I’m not convinced that this was such a “lie” that was said by Flynn, and won’t be until, and unless, the full conversation is leaked and we, the public, can read it.

The Russian ambassador almost assuredly asked Flynn about the sanctions placed upon them by Obama in the yet-to-be-proven case that the Russians hacked the Democratic elections. Flynn might have said “we’ll look into it” and nothing more. That’s the kind of thing that is so trivial in a busy day that it is almost equal to saying “no comment”. It’s highly probable that he wouldn’t have remembered saying such a trivial comment as this. But after digging deep into his memory, the next day he stated to the Wash. Post he “couldn’t be certain that the topic never came up.” imho, this is highly probable. Our brains do not register every single thing we say everyday and, in fact, we lose a lot of the trivial memories inside of a day.

Or he could be a politician trying to cover his but. This is why people talk about "plausible deniability." Instead of going to prison to be tried for violating security laws, he merely has to step down from office.

imho a truth-seeking reader should not assume anything more about this conversation until we can read it. Statements by so-called "officials" don't cut it for me.

No – the real story here is that we the public do not have the transcripts of the conversation and the media is working with (or for) the neocons that infest the CIA to create a fictionalized account that the public will never be able to verify so that they could destroy a man who refused to toe the CIA propaganda line on U.S. foreign policy.

I am no supporter of Michael Flynn and completely disagree with his hawkish views on Iran. But even more than that, I absolutely abhor witch hunts on people where truth cannot be verified.

All of that includes a ton of supposition for someone demanding evidence of the official story.

[goldenequity]

Simple, effective, immediate relief from bs news:

WikiLeaks ‏@wikileaks Feb 14
Flynn-Kislyak intercept transcript should be released to the public
so everyone can act with complete knowledge.
Document submission: https://wikileaks.org/#submit

no bs 'redactions'... just give us the fucking transcripts and we can decide for ourselves.
Assholes treat us like children.

[nobody's_hero]

Well, Flynn's out, and I'll wager he'll be replaced by someone who is more hawkish.

Pardon me while I don't celebrate.

[goldenequity]

Well, Flynn's out, and I'll wager he'll be replaced by someone who is more hawkish.

Pardon me while I don't celebrate.

Trump Offers National Security Advisor Job To Robert Harward: Reuters
https://www.google.com/search?q=Robert+Harward&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/0/0f/Harward_2011.jpg/220px-Harward_2011.jpg

Robert S. "Bob" Harward Jr. is currently a defense contractor executive,
a retired United States Navy SEAL
and a former Deputy Commander of the United States Central Command,
under the leadership command of General James Mattis.

[charrob]

Or he could be a politician trying to cover his but. This is why people talk about "plausible deniability." Instead of going to prison to be tried for violating security laws, he merely has to step down from office.

I tend to be in the court of public opinion that i need to see proof before prosecuting another human being. So far that proof has not been given by a media that has repeatedly proven itself to be nothing more than liars and propagandists. What's going on on the MSM about Flynn right now reminds me of the Puritan witch trials.


Instead of going to prison to be tried for violating security laws, he merely has to step down from office.

What "security laws" has Flynn even violated? There's no proof he's done anything!


All of that includes a ton of supposition for someone demanding evidence of the official story.

I look at other human beings as innocent until proven guilty. Not the other way around. There's a lot of possibilities where this man could be innocent. As Glenn Greenwald stated: "Even the anonymous sources out to get Flynn said that the conversation was vague about what Flynn was really saying." The only "evidence" that will ever prove anything is if they release the transcripts of the conversation. Unless, and until, that happens I will look at Flynn as innocent of everything the completely unhinged media is in its present state of hysteria about. And so would any court of law.

[CPUd]

Trump Offers National Security Advisor Job To Robert Harward: Reuters
https://www.google.com/search?q=Robert+Harward&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/0/0f/Harward_2011.jpg/220px-Harward_2011.jpg

Robert S. "Bob" Harward Jr. is currently a defense contractor executive,
a retired United States Navy SEAL
and a former Deputy Commander of the United States Central Command,
under the leadership command of General James Mattis.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U1mlCPMYtPk

[kpitcher]

President Donald said it himself that the press is trying to make up a war between him and the CIA, you guys are buying into the fake news.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UkKxO2WWIwE

A war between them? Everyone at the CIA gave him a standing ovation! This was also the speech where God parted the rain clouds and smiled down on Trump when he was sworn in.

[angelatc]

Flynn told the Russians in advance that the Obama admin was going to impose sanctions, there is a transcript/recording of this call because the FBI was monitoring the Russian ambassador and FSB was monitoring Flynn. The one who told Trump about this, and its implications, several weeks ago got fired, though for completely different reasons.

How did Flynn know? He was long gone from the administration.

[angelatc]

Trump Offers National Security Advisor Job To Robert Harward: Reuters
https://www.google.com/search?q=Robert+Harward&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/0/0f/Harward_2011.jpg/220px-Harward_2011.jpg

Robert S. "Bob" Harward Jr. is currently a defense contractor executive,
a retired United States Navy SEAL
and a former Deputy Commander of the United States Central Command,
under the leadership command of General James Mattis.

OK, he's funny looking.

[goldenequity]

and now
for something truly different: :)




Trump does not possess the spiritual fortitude that God gave Putin.

We are in the middle of a spiritual war between Good & Evil.
And said Evil is very strong and determined.
Those behind this strife, violence, arrogance, pride, riots,
and uncontrolled lust for war with Christian Orthodox Russia
are very corrupted souls.

I have said here many a time, that this is a dark and ancient hatred.

Russia, being Orthodox Christian, is the #1 enemy of all the nations, of Satan himself.
He (Satan) has taken over the Western nations
and try as he might he is insanely furious because he cannot conquer Christian Russia.
Christian Russia will not bend her knees to him and he is beside himself in impotent rage.

It is my belief nothing can save Western nations unless they turn to God.
And this, sadly, is not probable.

Europe is atheist and Americans have all types of ” flavors” they call ‘Christianity’.

Therefore, the only thing left to us, is to pray for Russia and Putin.
Pray for them to continue being victorious in Jesus Christ the Lord.

We in the West are doomed, Russians are not.
Russia is literally the last bastion of Christianity on the planet.
They are OUR last Christian brethren on Earth.

God be with you Russia.
And pray that our end, whatever it might be, comes swiftly and not painful.




This was not what I was taught in American Sunday school.

[CPUd]

How did Flynn know? He was long gone from the administration.

Flynn was on the transition team, and one of the only ones besides Trump himself who were getting the same national security briefings as Obama admin.

[LibertyEagle]

Trump wasn't President yet. He then lied to VP about it.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Logan_Act

Actually, we don't know that he lied at all. Nor do we know that he broke any law. If and when the transcript of the call is made, we will more.

Meanwhile, how's that investigation going about Hillary selling Russia a large amount of uranium when she was Secretary of State? Not to mention all the other pay-to-play. You know, real things.

[LibertyEagle]

That is alright. A neocon rag like the American "Thinker" is just as bad.

Actually, I only see one person on their board that could be classified as a neocon. Yet, I see articles against the Federal Reserve, etc. So, unless you can back up your assertion, it's well, full of bull.

[LibertyEagle]

Correct. The big issue is that Flynn implied that trump would lessen or end sanctions without the proper position or authority to do so. And then he lied to everyone about it.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/feb/13/michael-flynn-resigns-quits-trump-national-security-adviser-russia

Have you see the transcript of the phone call? You must have, because you make proclamations of what was said with such certainty. Please post the transcript here so that we can all see it. Thanks.

What Flynn said occurred was that he said that after Trump was in office that everything would be reviewed. Not that any sanctions would be lifted.

Again, if you have proof to the contrary, post it.

[charrob]

This video "Mehdi Hasan goes Head to Head with Michael T Flynn" on AlJazeera clearly shows one solid reason why the CIA/deep state threw Flynn under the bus (Flynn acknowledges that the Obama Administration was arming al Qaeda, the Salafists, and the Muslim Brotherhood in Syria in order to overthrow Assad:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SG3j8OYKgn4&t=10m15s

Other reasons were, of course, his desire for detente with Russia and an overhaul of the "intelligence" agencies.

Shortened version of information from above video is here:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GJ9kMwWqV9k

[AZJoe]

From Liberty Blitzkrieg (https://libertyblitzkrieg.com/2017/02/15/the-public-should-demand-to-see-the-michael-flynn-transcript/):
"Somehow I doubt the Flynn leakers will find themselves in the same position as Snowden, scrambling to get to a country that will provide them safe haven from the vast, vindictive reach of the U.S. government. That’s because the leakers in this case are powerful operatives of the deep state."

[Valli6]

Lou Dobbs just interviewed William Binney (former NSA Senior Intelligence Officer and whistleblower). He said there's no question it was someone on the inside who wants to make Trump look bad.

Binney says the leak didn't necessarily come from someone in the CIA, that a few other depts also could've got it, mentioned FBI and DEA for example.

But the number of people who'd have been able to access it are few, and each of those persons will have been cleared and listed. So, he says it would only take about a day to look into the networks log inside the NSA and see who had been accessing those files - then they'd have a list of people to question/interrogate.

[AZJoe]

Lou Dobbs just interviewed William Binney (former NSA Senior Intelligence Officer and whistleblower). He said there's no question it was someone on the inside who wants to make Trump look bad. ... But the number of people who'd have been able to access it are few, and each of those persons will have been cleared and listed. So, he says it would only take about a day to look into the networks log inside the NSA and see who had been accessing those files - then they'd have a list of people to question/interrogate.

http://thefreethoughtproject.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/01/pepe-cia-thumb.jpg

[charrob]

Lou Dobbs just interviewed William Binney (former NSA Senior Intelligence Officer and whistleblower). He said there's no question it was someone on the inside who wants to make Trump look bad.

Binney says the leak didn't necessarily come from someone in the CIA, that a few other depts also could've got it, mentioned FBI and DEA for example.

But the number of people who'd have been able to access it are few, and each of those persons will have been cleared and listed. So, he says it would only take about a day to look into the networks log inside the NSA and see who had been accessing those files - then they'd have a list of people to question/interrogate.

thanks for sharing. Not sure, but this looks to be the interview:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uoou14R-ZZg

[phill4paul]

House hearings on Intelligence Agencies internal affairs....Bwahahaha.

They can't. Because they were caught.

Information has always been the best commodity.

[charrob]

There was a sea-change here at the NSA with an order that came from president Obama 17 days before he left office where he allowed the NSA who used to control the data, it now goes to 16 other agencies and that just festered this whole leaking situation, and that happened on the way out, as the president was leaving the office.

Why did the Obama administration wait until it had 17 days left in their administration to put this order in place if they thought it was so important. They had 8 years, they didn't do it, number one. Number two, it changed the exiting rule which was an executive order dating back to Ronald Reagan, that has been in place until 17 days before the Obama administration was going to end, that said the NSA gets the raw data, and they determine dissemination.

Instead, this change that the president put in place, signed off by the way by James Clapper on December 15, 2016, signed off by Loretta Lynch the Attorney General January 3, 2017, they decide that now 16 agencies can get the raw data and what that does is almost creates a shadow government. You have all these people who are not agreeing with President Trump's position, so it just festers more leaks.

If they had a justification for this, wonderful, why didn't they do it 8 years ago, 4 years ago, 3 years ago. Yet they wait until 17 days left.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-02-18/jay-sekulow-obama-should-be-held-accountable-soft-coup-attempt-against-trump




https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KLfUXH20Od8


So I guess what is confusing to me is exactly what is being said here? Do 16 other agencies mirror NSA's hard drives and now they have their own servers with that mirrored information at their agencies? Or do they simply log in to the NSA servers to access the NSA information? What exactly did this new law by Obama do?

The latter would allow what William Binney is saying... simply look into the network logs inside NSA to see who accessed those files. But if that data is mirrored/copied to servers in the 16 other agencies, then i guess to find out who accessed those files would mean having to go through the network logs on the servers at all the rest of the 16 agencies. Has anyone read anymore about this... what Obama's law actually did?