Charlotte Police Shooting and Aftermath

[Brian4Liberty]

What We Know About the Charlotte Shooting


At a news conference this morning, Charlotte Mayor Jennifer Roberts called Tuesday's shooting a "tragedy."

Here is how police say the shooting unfolded.

Shortly before 4 p.m. Tuesday, officers with the Charlotte-Mecklenburg Police's Metro Division Crime Reduction Unit were searching an apartment complex for a suspect with an outstanding warrant.

"Officers observed a subject inside a vehicle in the apartment complex" and "the subject exited the vehicle armed with a firearm," the police said.

"Officers observed the subject get back into the vehicle at which time they began to approach the subject," the police said.

The shooting

Officers gave loud verbal commands telling him to get out, police said this morning. That's when Scott got out of the car with a handgun, police said.

Police said the man "posed an imminent deadly threat to the officers who subsequently fired their weapon striking the subject."

He was taken to a hospital where he was declared dead, police said.

Officers recovered a handgun "in close proximity" to Scott's body, police said.

Keith Scott, the victim

The victim was identified as 43-year-old Keith Lamont Scott.

Scott's family said he wasn't armed, ABC affiliate WSOC reported. The family said Scott had a book in his hand and was waiting for his son to be dropped off from school, WSOC said.

Police say a weapon was seized from the scene but no book was found.

The officer

The officer involved in the shooting was Brentley Vinson, who has worked for the Charlotte-Mecklenburg Police Department for two years, the department said.

"As is standard procedure with any officer involved shooting, Officer Vinson has been placed on paid administrative leave," the department said.

The investigation

This morning, Charlotte-Mecklenburg Police Chief Kerr Putney said there is a lot of video from the scene, including body cameras from the officers who responded. Vinson was not wearing a body camera, he said.

Police said detectives were reviewing videos and interviewing witnesses as part of the investigation.

Putney said he has not seen all of the video at this point, but later added, "I don't know that [Scott] definitively pointed the weapon specifically towards an officer."

Putney said overnight that the outstanding warrants that prompted the officers' arrival were not specific to Scott, adding, "We don’t know if there is a connection of the deceased with the suspect we were looking for."

"At this point, all we know is there, in the apartment complex parking lot, this subject gets out with a weapon, they engage him and one of the officers felt a lethal threat and fired his weapon because of it," Putney said overnight.

The Internal Affairs Bureau is conducting "a separate but parallel investigation to determine whether CMPD policies and procedures were adhered to," the police said.

The riots

After Scott was shot, protesters took to the Charlotte streets overnight, shutting down Interstate 85. They opened up 18-wheelers, emptying the contents onto the highway and setting boxes on fire.

The police chief said this morning that officers heroically responded to the scene to help. Sixteen officers were injured and multiple vehicles were damaged, the police said. One person was arrested.
...
http://abcnews.go.com/US/deadly-charlotte-officer-involved-shooting/story?id=42245158

[puppetmaster]

Heard the officer was black? If true, several articles in have read have conveniently omitted this fact while stating the race of the deceased multiple times.

[Brian4Liberty]

Heard the officer was black? If true, several articles in have read have conveniently omitted this fact while stating the race of the deceased multiple times.

Of course. Have to make it a racial issue. Some articles do mention it in passing...


Police In North Carolina Fatally Shoot Black Man, Sparking Protests
Protests erupted after the sixth killing of a civilian by Charlotte-Mecklenburg police in the past year.

Police in Charlotte, North Carolina, on Tuesday fatally shot a black man they said was armed as they searched for someone else, sparking violent protests that injured more than 12 officers. Witnesses said the man who was killed, Keith Lamont Scott, was unarmed.

“He exited the vehicle armed with a handgun,” Charlotte Police Chief Kerr Putney said in a news conference Tuesday. “The officers gave loud, clear verbal commands which were also heard by many of the witnesses.”

Police instructed Scott to drop the weapon, he said, but he re-entered his vehicle and exited again still holding the gun.

“He stepped out, posing a threat to the officers,” so one officer shot at him, Putney said. The officers immediately requested medical help, which performed CPR on the scene. Scott, 43, later succumbed to his injuries while in medical care.

Police identified the shooter as Officer Brentley Vinson, who has worked for the department since July 2014. Vinson is black.
...
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/charlotte-police-shooting_us_57e1c953e4b0e80b1b9efd69

[puppetmaster]

They mention the deceased was blake twice in the opening and probably in title and squeeze in the officers race at the end when many have stopped reading.

[phill4paul]

The officer wore blue. That's all that really matters.

[fisharmor]

Guys, if they didn't make it a racial issue, it wouldn't have made the news at all.

[CaptUSA]

Guys, if they didn't make it a racial issue, it wouldn't have made the news at all.

Good point. Do we really think we'd see athletes sitting during the pledge if it wasn't a racial thing? Hell no.

It's hard to bear, but perhaps the right things happen for the wrong reasons. People are protesting the police actions - would this happen if the stories were just about the color blue?

[Brian4Liberty]

Good point. Do we really think we'd see athletes sitting during the pledge if it wasn't a racial thing? Hell no.

It's hard to bear, but perhaps the right things happen for the wrong reasons. People are protesting the police actions - would this happen if the stories were just about the color blue?

Many of them are protesting "racists", not cops. I've talked to people like that in person. They fully support aggressive police action and tactics. It's just "the racists" they want punished.

What will be the result of these "protests" as in Charlotte (often better described as looting and destruction)? More spending, more government, more money for Police departments and probably a big grant to the SPLC to identify and list "the racists" that need to be punished.

[Ender]

So, the whole point of a guy being shot by police for exiting his car with a book in his hand, isn't important- only that the press is telling us he was black.

Go figure.

[Brian4Liberty]

So, the whole point of a guy being shot by police for exiting his car with a book in his hand, isn't important- only that the press is telling us he was black.

Go figure.

Well, we don't know all the details in this case yet, and probably never will, but obviously Police tactics and itchy trigger fingers should be the main issue.

The people on TV don't share that opinion. They are going on and on about racism today, even when the officer in this case was black.

So yes, that is another topic worthy of discussion in addition to Police misconduct.

[euphemia]

I agree with you on this one, Ender. I think making it a racial issue marginalizes the very people that need support. Somehow we have lost the ability to talk to each other. I don't like it that police are shooting first and asking questions later. That's just wrong. As law and order as I am, I would rather let a guilty person go free than to have one innocent person die. In this case, the police had a warrant for something else, and if they didn't execute the warrant, but executed this man, then shame on them.

[puppetmaster]

So, the whole point of a guy being shot by police for exiting his car with a book in his hand, isn't important- only that the press is telling us he was black.

Go figure. gun not book, you are mistaken. But you may beleive what the MSM tells you if you choose

[puppetmaster]

I agree with you on this one, Ender. I think making it a racial issue marginalizes the very people that need support. Somehow we have lost the ability to talk to each other. I don't like it that police are shooting first and asking questions later. That's just wrong. As law and order as I am, I would rather let a guilty person go free than to have one innocent person die. In this case, the police had a warrant for something else, and if they didn't execute the warrant, but executed this man, then shame on them. i guarantee you if I make a stop and the driver gets out with a gun he will be shot and it will be fatal . I will not let him point his gun at me first.

[phill4paul]

i guarantee you if I make a stop and the driver gets out with a gun he will be shot and it will be fatal . I will not let him point his gun at me first.

And a prosecutor will decide if you need to be prosecuted. There will be only your word vs. that of witnesses. And your word won't stand as solid as that of a police officer vs. <anyone else>. You are not on Theyre team. Good luck.
Was it a gun or a book? Who knows? If there is video then it needs to be released, immediately. It wouldn't be the first time a weapon or other evidence was planted to exonerate a boy in blue.

[Ender]

gun not book, you are mistaken. But you may beleive what the MSM tells you if you choose

You're quoting the MSM too, buddy.


Officers recovered a handgun "in close proximity" to Scott's body, police said.

How many times has a handgun "in close proximity" been planted by police?


Scott's family said he wasn't armed, ABC affiliate WSOC reported. The family said Scott had a book in his hand and was waiting for his son to be dropped off from school, WSOC said.

Maybe it was a gun but from most of the police shootings in recent history, I'm betting he didn't.

[puppetmaster]

You're quoting the MSM too, buddy.



How many times has a handgun "in close proximity" been planted by police?



Maybe it was a gun but from most of the police shootings in recent history, I'm betting he didn't. yes I am. Quoting them as liars and spin artists. You quote them like the gospel. Next thing it will be a bible he was holding right next to the "drop gun"

[fisharmor]

And a prosecutor will decide if you need to be prosecuted. There will be only your word vs. that of witnesses. And your word won't stand as solid as that of a police officer vs. <anyone else>. You are not on Theyre team. Good luck.
Correction... generally the prosecutor will not decide if you need to be prosecuted.
If you shoot someone, you can bet the whole farm that you're getting prosecuted.
I wouldn't, though, because you're going to need to sell the farm to afford the legal fees to stay out of prison.

There are two official reactions. Wearing a blue uniform means the reaction is to pretend like nothing happened, unless people with torches and pitchforks show up outside the precinct, at which point a grand jury will be convened and instructed not to bring charges.

Not wearing a uniform means your life as you knew it is over, your savings are gone, you'll be taking charity from friends and family to feed your kids, and the only hope you have left is keeping your sphincter its current size.

[Brian4Liberty]

The presence of a gun in and of itself is no justification for the Police to shoot someone. There is a Second Amendment, and every citizen has the right to bear arms. Now there are certainly other factors that might make shooting at a suspect acceptable and mandatory.

The NY/NJ bomber, Ahmad Rahami, is a prime example. A suspected killer, who pulled out a gun and started firing. No doubts there whatsoever.

On the other hand, when several officers shout contradictory commands and shoot a person all in a matter of 5 seconds, that is a major problem, even if that person is wearing a side arm or even holding it in their hand when the Police come upon them. Tamir Rice, Andy Lopez and Erik Scott (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?259956-Updates-on-Costco-Police-Shooting-in-Nevada) are examples of unjustified killings.

Now what will the media focus on? The rights of citizens to bear arms? No (unless they want to push the gun-banning agenda). The use of military tactics and training for street cops? No. Patrolling America as if it's Kabul or Baghdad? No.

But they will focus on racism, because it fits their Alinsky agitprop agenda, even if it's a white cop shooting a white person, a black cop shooting a black person, or a Hispanic cop shooting an Asian.

[phill4paul]

Correction... generally the prosecutor will not decide if you need to be prosecuted.
If you shoot someone, you can bet the whole farm that you're getting prosecuted.
I wouldn't, though, because you're going to need to sell the farm to afford the legal fees to stay out of prison.

There are two official reactions. Wearing a blue uniform means the reaction is to pretend like nothing happened, unless people with torches and pitchforks show up outside the precinct, at which point a grand jury will be convened and instructed not to bring charges.

Not wearing a uniform means your life as you knew it is over, your savings are gone, you'll be taking charity from friends and family to feed your kids, and the only hope you have left is keeping your sphincter its current size.

Depends, I have known some that were not prosecuted. But, I understand your sentiment, and for the most part you are correct. You had better have all your ducks in a row from the get go. Civilian R.O.E. are much more limiting than a simple "feared for life" hero-in-blue defense.

[Brian4Liberty]

Erik Scott? Keith Scott? Hmmm.

Edit: And Walter Scott...

[euphemia]

Making it about race won't solve the problem. Making it about the police and bad judgement, will.

[puppetmaster]

And a prosecutor will decide if you need to be prosecuted. There will be only your word vs. that of witnesses. And your word won't stand as solid as that of a police officer vs. <anyone else>. You are not on Theyre team. Good luck.
Was it a gun or a book? Who knows? If there is video then it needs to be released, immediately. It wouldn't be the first time a weapon or other evidence was planted to exonerate a boy in blue. i was putting myself in the position of law enforcement in this scenario. I understand officers words usually carry more weight in court. Also won't be the first time "witnesses" lie or have recollections that are untrue.

[Ender]

yes I am. Quoting them as liars and spin artists. You quote them like the gospel. Next thing it will be a bible he was holding right next to the "drop gun"

I rarely quote the MSM as believable.

YOU believe their spin on him having a gun- I am suspicious.

[puppetmaster]

I rarely quote the MSM as believable.

YOU believe their spin on him having a gun- I am suspicious.

"Their spin" as in the officers account?...yeah I beleive him until proof otherwise. Suspicious of me or the officer?

[Brian4Liberty]

Erik Scott? Keith Scott? Hmmm.

Edit: And Walter Scott...

#ScottLivesMatter

[Ender]

"Their spin" as in the officers account?...yeah I beleive him until proof otherwise. Suspicious of me or the officer?

Not you- we don't always agree but you're cool.

The po-pos are suspicious IMHPOV.

[CaptUSA]

i guarantee you if I make a stop and the driver gets out with a gun he will be shot and it will be fatal . I will not let him point his gun at me first.

Well, then, you would be a murderer plain and simple. If someone holding a gun, and not aiming it at anyone, is worthy of summary judgment and execution, then I guess 3/4 of the people in here are just awaiting their death sentence.

[morfeeis]

The officer wore blue. That's all that really matters.

I so wish people would stop focusing on white/black, it's as it always has been about the have vs the have nots...

[Brian4Liberty]

#ScottLivesMatter

Yet another Scott killed by Police. Antronie Scott. (http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/local/crime/article/SAPD-suspends-officer-who-shot-killed-unarmed-6864080.php)

Hmmm... It's a war on the Scotts. #ErikScott #WalterScott #AntronieScott #KeithScott #DevinScott #JoshuaScott #ScottLivesMatter

[Ender]

Yet another Scott killed by Police. Antronie Scott. (http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/local/crime/article/SAPD-suspends-officer-who-shot-killed-unarmed-6864080.php)

All for the lovely WoD. :rolleyes:

[phill4paul]

i was putting myself in the position of law enforcement in this scenario. I understand officers words usually carry more weight in court. Also won't be the first time "witnesses" lie or have recollections that are untrue.

Of course. What better position to be in?

[sdsubball23]

So do you guys agree with Black Lives Matter on the matter of police shootings of black people?

[phill4paul]

So do you guys agree with Black Lives Matter on the matter of police shootings of black people?

For myself, yes. But, just because I believe in that does not mean I believe in the Us (black) vs. Blue (white controlled) agenda pushed by the organization. Law enforcement in this country is out of wack and headed towards the <insert Godwin's Law discriptor.> Death by cop is color blind.

[spudea]

http://images.memes.com/meme/414503

[phill4paul]

OMG! Local news keeps interrupting "Survivor!" WTF have we become as a nation when this is possible?

[Origanalist]

So do you guys agree with Black Lives Matter on the matter of police shootings of black people?

I do not. In my opinion they make a big mistake by compartmentalizing the problem into race. Truthfully I think the majority of them would be ok if cops stopped shooting blacks and just shot white people. Which makes them no better than the bootlickers on the other side that automatically assume if a cop shoots a black person they must have been a thug.

[Ender]

For myself, yes. But, just because I believe in that does not mean I believe in the Us (black) vs. Blue (white controlled) agenda pushed by the organization. Law enforcement in this country is out of wack and headed towards the <insert Godwin's Law discriptor.> Death by cop is color blind.

That's my position, as well.

[presence]

Downtown Charlotte is in total riot mode; tear gas and rubber bullets meyhem.




Man shot during Charlotte demonstration against fatal police shooting (https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2016/09/21/protests-break-out-in-charlotte-after-police-fatally-shoot-man-they-say-wielded-firearm/) Washington Post - ‎6 hours ago‎
News reports and posts on social media later showed police in riot gear firing tear gas and rubber bullets at the protesters and some people smashing out the windows of police cars. Activists said the violent overnight demonstrations stemmed from ...





Man fatally shot during Charlotte protest against police shooting, city says (https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/2016/09/21/cba5221c-800b-11e6-8d0c-fb6c00c90481_story.html) Washington Post - ‎1 hour ago‎
As the protest grew in size and anger, police appeared in riot gear and fired tear gas and rubber bullets. Some protesters began smashing the windows of police cars. By early Wednesday, demonstrators had shut down traffic on Interstate 85. Some opened ...





Second night of unrest in Charlotte, North Carolina, turns deadly (https://www.yahoo.com/news/charlotte-braces-more-unrest-police-shooting-004226506.html) Yahoo News - ‎23 minutes ago‎
CHARLOTTE, N.C. (Reuters) - One person was shot dead on Wednesday in a second night of unrest in Charlotte, North Carolina, officials said, as riot police fired tear gas and rubber bullets to disperse unruly protesters after the fatal police shooting ...





One person killed during protest of Charlotte police shooting (http://www.foxnews.com/us/2016/09/21/one-person-killed-during-protest-charlotte-police-shooting.html) Fox News - ‎49 minutes ago‎
City of Charlotte (@CLTgov) September 22, 2016. What started as a prayer vigil over the Tuesday shooting of 43-year-old Keith Lamont Scott turned into a night of looting and arson, as police officers used tear gas and rubber bullets to disperse violent ...





Charlotte riot: Protester killed as clashes erupt for second night in North Carolina over police shooting (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/09/22/protester-killed-as-clashes-erupt-for-second-night-in-charlotte/) Telegraph.co.uk - ‎1 hour ago‎
The demonstrators rushed police in riot gear at a downtown Charlotte hotel and officers responded by firing rubber bullets and tear gas to disperse the crowd. The slain protester was shot by a civilian, not police, officials said. "It was confirmed not ...



1 fatally shot during uptown protests over officer-involved shooting (http://www.charlotteobserver.com/news/local/article103311102.html) Charlotte Observer - ‎56 minutes ago‎
At 9:45 p.m., police fired rubber bullets at the crowd. Protests had remained peaceful in uptown on Wednesday, after the fatal police shooting of Keith Lamont Scott. But the scene turned chaotic after 8:30 p.m., when protesters went from Marshall Park ...



1 Dead in Renewed Charlotte Violence Following Police Shooting of Black Man (http://www.voanews.com/a/police-shootings-sparks-protest-in-charlotte/3518072.html) Voice of America - ‎21 minutes ago‎
Violence erupted for a second straight night in Charlotte, North Carolina, where marchers filled the streets to protest another fatal police shooting of an African-American man. City officials said one person was shot dead during the protests, but that ...





Person killed in Charlotte protests (http://www.upi.com/Top_News/US/2016/09/21/Person-killed-in-Charlotte-protests/3331474509487/) UPI.com - ‎28 minutes ago‎
CHARLOTTE, N.C., Sept. 21 (UPI) -- A person has been shot and killed by a civilian during a second violent night of protests in Charlotte following the police shooting of a man on Tuesday, officials said. Charlotte police in riot gear have used tear ...



12 officers injured as protests break out in Charlotte after police fatally shoot man (http://www.commercejournal.com/cnhi_network/officers-injured-as-protests-break-out-in-charlotte-after-police/article_fa11399f-c7fd-5e9e-ab07-60d6095f06d7.html) Commerce Journal - ‎1 hour ago‎
The demonstrations began peacefully, but news reports and posts on social media later showed police in riot gear firing tear gas and rubber bullets at the demonstrators and some people smashing out the windows of police cars. After midnight, protesters ...





Striking images from the violent protests in Charlotte after fatal police shooting (http://www.aol.com/article/news/2016/09/21/striking-images-from-the-violent-protests-in-charlotte-after-fat/21476717/) AOL News - ‎6 hours ago‎
Police fired tear gas and rubber bullets at residents, while protesters smashed the windows of police vehicles and news trucks. Police said 16 officers were injured during the night, though they didn't provide information on how many demonstrators had ...



1 shot dead, 2 hospitalized during 2nd night of Charlotte riots (http://www.wnd.com/2016/09/riots-in-charlotte-after-fatal-police-shooting/) WND.com - ‎42 minutes ago‎
“Moments earlier, police fired tear gas at protesters at the entrance to the Omni Hotel in uptown Charlotte. Loud booms sounded, and police said explosives had been used,” the newspaper reported. “Your life is in danger, you need to move!” shouted ...



Protesters clash with police in Charlotte, North Carolina, over fatal shooting of black man Keith Lamont Scott, who ... (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/09/21/protesters-clash-with-police-in-charlotte-north-carolina-over-fa/) Telegraph.co.uk - ‎17 hours ago‎
protestors blocked roads, setting fire to goods stolen from the backs of trucks, and flung rocks and bottles at police, who responded with volleys of teargas and rubber bullets. Police had been trying to serve an arrest warrant for different individual ...





At Least One Person Has Been Shot And Killed During The Second Night Of Charlotte Protests (http://uproxx.com/news/charlotte-protests-death-second-night/) UPROXX - ‎1 hour ago‎
Police have been firing rubber bullets and launching tear gas clouds in an effort to disperse the crowd. The shooting reportedly took place outside the Omni hotel, which has locked its doors. Currently, a line of police in riot gear is not directly ...



One shot dead as hundreds protest for second night in Charlotte (http://www.itv.com/news/2016-09-22/charlotte-demonstration-second-night/) ITV News - ‎54 minutes ago‎
Charlotte Police Chief Kerr Putney described the protest as "very aggressive". Police in the city have fired rubber bullets and tear gas on protesters in a bid to break up the demonstration. Protesters first took to the North Carolina city's streets on ...





Person Killed as Police Clash with Protesters in North Carolina (http://www.telesurtv.net/english/news/Person-Killed-as-Police-Clash-with-Protesters-in-North-Carolina-20160921-0028.html) teleSUR English - ‎57 minutes ago‎
However, later on reports and social media posts showed police in riot gear firing tear gas and rubber bullets at the protesters and some people smashing the windows of police cars. The protests in Charlotte unfolded as demonstrators in Tulsa, Oklahoma ...





One dead during protests against US police shooting (http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2016/09/protest-police-shooting-160922014515930.html) Aljazeera.com - ‎45 minutes ago‎
Charlotte Police Chief Kerr Putney did not identify the person who died or say whether the individual was taking part in the second night of protests in the city on Wednesday. Police in riot gear fired tear gas and rubber bullets to disperse ...



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The officers responded by firing rubber bullets and tear gas into the crowd. The running battle continued into the early morning hours, with protestors briefing shutting down a portion of Interstate-85. Police reportedly used flash grenades to break up ...



One dead in unrest over fatal police shooting (http://news.sky.com/story/protester-dies-after-being-shot-in-north-carolina-10587946) Sky News - ‎50 minutes ago‎
Police then unleashed a volley of rubber bullets, tear gas and flash-bang grenades to disperse the demonstrators, who began throwing fireworks and debris at officers outside a hotel. People were also seen looting a convenience store after smashing its ...





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CHARLOTTE — The morning after violent protests erupted over the fatal police shooting of a black man, officials here called for peace while stressing that the man was armed and posing an “imminent deadly threat” when officers shot and killed him ...





Riots in Charlotte Following Police Shooting of Keith Lamont Scott (https://reason.com/blog/2016/09/21/charlotte-shooting-riots-keith-scott) Reason (blog) - ‎12 hours ago‎
From there, some demonstrators began vandalizing a police vehicle, and police shot rubber bullets and tear gas at demonstators, some of whom responded by throwing rocks and other objects at officers. Later in the evening, protesters shut down ...





Protester shot dead in Charlotte demo, police deny involvement (http://www.presstv.ir/Detail/2016/09/22/485799/US-police-shoots-protester-dead-in-NC) Press TV - ‎32 minutes ago‎
A protester shot at a demonstration against US police brutality on African Americans has succumbed to his wounds in the state of North Carolina, the Charlotte police chief says. The protesters were marching Wednesday to denounce the police shooting of ...





Protesters, Officers Clash in the Aftermath of Keith Lamont Scott Shooting Death (http://www.theroot.com/articles/news/2016/09/protestors-officers-clash-in-the-aftermath-of-keith-lamont-scott-shooting-death/) The Root - ‎12 hours ago‎
Scene from protests in Charlotte, N.C., Sept. 20, 2016, over the ... However, it was not too long before news reports and social media posts began showing police in riot gear deploying tear gas at protesters and firing rubber bullets. Some civilians ...



1 dead in protest over killing in US city (http://www.9news.com.au/world/2016/09/22/11/48/1-killed-during-black-protest-in-us-city) 9news.com.au - ‎1 hour ago‎
One person has been shot dead in a second night of unrest in Charlotte, North Carolina, officials said. The shooting occurred as police in riot gear fired tear gas and rubber bullets to disperse a demonstration against the fatal police shooting of a ...





Media successfully spark more riots, even though no one is sure what really happened in Charlotte (http://canadafreepress.com/article/media-successfully-spark-more-riots-even-though-no-one-is-sure-what-really) Canada Free Press - ‎11 hours ago‎
News reports and posts on social media later showed police in riot gear firing tear gas and rubber bullets at the demonstrators and some people smashing out the windows of police cars. Early Wednesday morning, protesters shut down traffic on Interstate 85.





Police Kill Black Man In North Carolina, Clash With Protesters (http://www.telesurtv.net/english/news/Police-Kill-Black-Man-In-North-Carolina-Clash-With-Protesters-20160920-0032.html) teleSUR English - ‎12 hours ago‎
News reports and posts on social media later showed police in riot gear firing tear gas and rubber bullets at the demonstrators and some people smashing out the windows of police cars. Along a stretch of I-85, protesters opened up the backs of tractor ...





Protests, injuries follow North Carolina police shooting of disabled Black man (http://www.dailykos.com/story/2016/9/21/1572545/-Protests-injuries-follow-North-Carolina-police-shooting-of-disabled-Black-man) Daily Kos - ‎18 hours ago‎
Charlotte-Mecklenburg police were at The Village at College Downs apartment complex to deliver an outstanding warrant, they said, when they saw Scott exit a vehicle with a weapon, they say, and then get back in the vehicle. As the officers approached ...





Police Chief on Man Killed by Charlotte Cops: 'We Did Find a Weapon' (http://www.newsmax.com/Newsfront/police-shooting-charlotte/2016/09/20/id/749287/) Newsmax - ‎11 hours ago‎
Mayor Jennifer Roberts, meanwhile, called for calm after protesters blocked a highway and clashed with police in Charlotte, North Carolina, early on Wednesday morning after officers fatally shot a black man they said had a gun when they approached him

[fisharmor]

The po-pos are suspicious IMHPOV.

If a policeman said "good morning" to me I'd be looking for a window to see if the sun was even out.

[fisharmor]

So do you guys agree with Black Lives Matter on the matter of police shootings of black people?

I can only assume that it would be OK with BLM if they stuck to beating them to death like Kelly Thomas, or tying them to chairs and pepper spraying them to death like Nick Christie, or melting their faces off with flashbang grenades like Baby Bou Bou.
Or any of the other stuff that they do to non-blacks.

[fisharmor]

Where does BLM stand on Louima Abner? I mean he just had a broken mop shoved up his anus by a cop. He was black, but it wasn't a shooting, and he survived, so it's OK, right?

[Brian4Liberty]

Downtown Charlotte is in total riot mode; tear gas and rubber bullets meyhem.

Are they looting big rigs, or is tonight more of a brick and mortar shopping spree?

[puppetmaster]

Not you- we don't always agree but you're cool.

The po-pos are suspicious IMHPOV. cool.....me? Lol. Thanks

[fedupinmo]

Downtown Charlotte is in total riot mode; tear gas and rubber bullets meyhem.
Are they sure this time?

https://8.smash.com/u/2014/08/ryan_rubber_bullets.jpg

[Danke]

Are they sure this time?

https://8.smash.com/u/2014/08/ryan_rubber_bullets.jpg

Earplug.

[fedupinmo]

Earplug.
You must not be a reporter...

[AngryCanadian]

Rubber bullets yup. Earplug? lolol

[Danke]

Rubber bullets yup. Earplug? lolol

That is not a rubber bullet.

This is a rubber bullet:

http://blog.themancompany.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/02/tampon.jpg

It even has a fuse.

They are using explosive rubber bullets on the protesters.

[puppetmaster]

That is not a rubber bullet.

This is a rubber bullet:

http://blog.themancompany.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/02/tampon.jpg

It even has a fuse.

They are using explosive rubber bullets on the protesters. looks like it is a ballistic tip...can you confirm?

[Danke]

looks like it is a ballistic tip...can you confirm?

I think Suzanimal can explain its application and how it works.

[puppetmaster]

I think Suzanimal can explain its application and how it works.

She is our ballistics specialist

[AngryCanadian]

That is not a rubber bullet.

This is a rubber bullet:

http://blog.themancompany.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/02/tampon.jpg

It even has a fuse.

They are using explosive rubber bullets on the protesters.


Some rubber bullets dont have that at the end of the bullet very few do.

[Natural Citizen]

That is not a rubber bullet.

This is a rubber bullet:

http://blog.themancompany.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/02/tampon.jpg

It even has a fuse.

They are using explosive rubber bullets on the protesters.

Some rubber bullets dont have that at the end of the bullet very few do.

Oh gosh. Whatsamatterwit you, AngryCanadian. Heh.

[puppetmaster]

So do you guys agree with Black Lives Matter on the matter of police shootings of black people? no I do not

[John F Kennedy III]

So do you guys agree with Black Lives Matter on the matter of police shootings of black people?

Hands up don't shoot being a complete lie is just one of the many many cases where they have lied about shootings involving black people. BLM can fuck off.

[devil21]

A big to-do by the media about mostly nothing. A few broken windows uptown and a looted basketball merchandise store attached to the Hornets arena. Charlotte isn't really the kind of city where people go batshit and start burning things down.

[PierzStyx]

gun not book, you are mistaken. But you may beleive what the MSM tells you if you choose

Really it is entirely irrelevant. I have as much a right to carry around a book as I do a gun. To shoot me because I am holding either is tyrannical and evil. It is murder.

[PierzStyx]

i guarantee you if I make a stop and the driver gets out with a gun he will be shot and it will be fatal . I will not let him point his gun at me first.

Because you are sick and what is wrong with the system. Unrestrained violence put into the hands of arrogant thugs will always result in oppression and bloodshed.

Still it si good to know you have no problem with being a murderer. Lets me know I don't have to worry about respecting you.

[JK/SEA]

So do you guys agree with Black Lives Matter on the matter of police shootings of black people?


i can see their concern....

[puppetmaster]

Really it is entirely irrelevant. I have as much a right to carry around a book as I do a gun. To shoot me because I am holding either is tyrannical and evil. It is murder. the shooter also has a right to shoot if he or she feels threatened right? Facts are, to get out of a car with a gun while ANY other person(s) are pointing a gun at you is dangerous and easily could be viewed as threatening. If it went down like it sounds, then I feel the officer could be justified. Who knows he could have been pointing his gun or attempting to? We may never know.

[puppetmaster]

Because you are sick and what is wrong with the system. Unrestrained violence put into the hands of arrogant thugs will always result in oppression and bloodshed.

Still it si good to know you have no problem with being a murderer. Lets me know I don't have to worry about respecting you. i live in reality...you should try it, but it may be scary. Until you have been there, you are clueless but I understand your thought process.

[pcosmar]

the shooter also has a right to shoot if he or she feels threatened right? .

Wrong.
You have a right to self defense. This does not apply to paranoid delusions.

[Brian4Liberty]

This tidbit doesn't make much news. So apparently the officer was in plain clothes, and no doubt was in an unmarked car. Guess people just need to comply with orders from anyone.


Officers repeatedly told Scott to drop his handgun, the chief said, but he didn't. Officer Brentley Vinson, who is black, then shot him.

The chief said he was not certain whether Scott pointed his gun at officers. Vinson, who was in plain clothes

[Brian4Liberty]

Apparently this is the brother of Keith Scott. He talks about the officer jumping out with plain clothes, so his brother would not know it was a cop. His further commentary would indicate that he was not an actual witness though, as he appears to be unaware that the cop was black.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sGhcG_01sjw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sGhcG_01sjw

[puppetmaster]

Wrong.
You have a right to self defense. This does not apply to paranoid delusions. and you know this officer was delusional? You know this officer was not threatened and acted in self defense? No you don't and I don't know either, so at this point speculation is just that. I am 100% for self defense and never said otherwise.

[puppetmaster]

Apparently this is the brother of Keith Scott. He talks about the officer jumping out with plain clothes, so his brother would not know it was a cop. His further commentary would indicate that he was not an actual witness though, as he appears to be unaware that the cop was black.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sGhcG_01sjw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sGhcG_01sjw Maybe the sirens and flashing lights did not give him a clue? The officer had a police vest on that said police but he probably could not see due to the spot and headlights.

[DaninPA]

I think that at some point, someone is going to decide that any interaction with a cop is a threat to their life, and act accordingly. Actually I'm surprised it hasn't happened already.

[Danke]

I think that at some point, someone is going to decide that any interaction with a cop is a threat to their life, and act accordingly. Actually I'm surprised it hasn't happened already.



Mom calls the cops on 3-year-old daughter over seat


SCOTTSDALE, Ariz. (CNN) – An Arizona mom went to the extremes to teach her 3-year-old the importance of seat belt safety.

Michelle Fortin’s daughter unbuckled her seat belt during a ride home, so her mom called the police.

Scottsdale Police officers took the opportunity to back up the mom’s message, driving home the importance of seat belts.

“I guess it was an extreme choice on my part to call the police, but I knew she was gonna remember it.”

Apparently, the plan worked, the little girl has promised it won’t happen again.

https://mgtvwten.files.wordpress.com/2016/09/momcallscopsondaughter.png?w=1138

http://news10.com/2016/09/22/mom-calls-the-cops-on-3-year-old-daughter-over-seat-belt/

[devil21]

This tidbit doesn't make much news. So apparently the officer was in plain clothes, and no doubt was in an unmarked car. Guess people just need to comply with orders from anyone.

Not sure how a plain clothes cop has body cam video...

[puppetmaster]

Not sure how a plain clothes cop has body cam video...
Think there were multiple units present

[Brian4Liberty]

Think there were multiple units present

But it's entirely possible that the undercover was the first there.

[Schifference]

Mom calls the cops on 3-year-old daughter over seat


SCOTTSDALE, Ariz. (CNN) – An Arizona mom went to the extremes to teach her 3-year-old the importance of seat belt safety.

Michelle Fortin’s daughter unbuckled her seat belt during a ride home, so her mom called the police.

Scottsdale Police officers took the opportunity to back up the mom’s message, driving home the importance of seat belts.

“I guess it was an extreme choice on my part to call the police, but I knew she was gonna remember it.”

Apparently, the plan worked, the little girl has promised it won’t happen again.

https://mgtvwten.files.wordpress.com/2016/09/momcallscopsondaughter.png?w=1138

http://news10.com/2016/09/22/mom-calls-the-cops-on-3-year-old-daughter-over-seat-belt/

What a nice officer. He probably didn't even ticket the mother. I hope he doesn't get in trouble for that.

[Brian4Liberty]

Mom calls the cops on 3-year-old daughter over seat


SCOTTSDALE, Ariz. (CNN) – An Arizona mom went to the extremes to teach her 3-year-old the importance of seat belt safety.

Michelle Fortin’s daughter unbuckled her seat belt during a ride home, so her mom called the police.

Scottsdale Police officers took the opportunity to back up the mom’s message, driving home the importance of seat belts.

“I guess it was an extreme choice on my part to call the police, but I knew she was gonna remember it.”

Apparently, the plan worked, the little girl has promised it won’t happen again.

https://mgtvwten.files.wordpress.com/2016/09/momcallscopsondaughter.png?w=1138

http://news10.com/2016/09/22/mom-calls-the-cops-on-3-year-old-daughter-over-seat-belt/

The woman was on TV. Actually, she called the Police business number and scheduled a visit with the Officer that does school presentations.

[Suzanimal]

I think Suzanimal can explain its application and how it works.

It's been modified to to create a bloody entry.


She is our ballistics specialist

:cool::)

[puppetmaster]

It's been modified to to create a bloody entry.



:cool::)

Looks effective

[devil21]

Martial law in effect in the corporate City of Charlotte. Curfew, military and state of emergency in effect. A very polite, civilized southern brand of martial law however ;)

[Anti Federalist]

I think that at some point, someone is going to decide that any interaction with a cop is a threat to their life, and act accordingly. Actually I'm surprised it hasn't happened already.

Of course it is.

Any contact with a cop is a life or death situation, to be taken very seriously.

[Anti Federalist]

For myself, yes. But, just because I believe in that does not mean I believe in the Us (black) vs. Blue (white controlled) agenda pushed by the organization. Law enforcement in this country is out of wack and headed towards the <insert Godwin's Law discriptor.> Death by cop is color blind.

This.


I do not. In my opinion they make a big mistake by compartmentalizing the problem into race. Truthfully I think the majority of them would be ok if cops stopped shooting blacks and just shot white people. Which makes them no better than the bootlickers on the other side that automatically assume if a cop shoots a black person they must have been a thug.

And this.

We already know that's the case: cops shoot more white people than black people.

And this shit is only going to increase it even more.

The cops will take, or already have taken, an attitude of "fuck those ni ggers, let them burn their shit down."

And they will then double down on the killing and beating and shakedowns of the stupid, weak, white folks in AmeriKa who go on licking the cop's assholes while standing at attention and singing about the "land of the free" in an open air prison.

[Madison320]

Here's an interesting conspiracy theory. Could the Charlotte riots be manufactured by democrats to help Hillary?

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-09-22/who-behind-riots-charlotte-police-says-70-arrested-protesters-had-out-state-ids

[devil21]

Here's an interesting conspiracy theory. Could the Charlotte riots be manufactured by democrats to help Hillary?

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-09-22/who-behind-riots-charlotte-police-says-70-arrested-protesters-had-out-state-ids

I've been watching the arrests.org mugshot site for Mecklenburg County and so far that 70% figure for protest related arrests doesn't stand up. They haven't posted the arrests from last night yet though, just the previous two nights. Some are not from Charlotte but most are local. The majority of non-local arrests are from neighboring areas of NC and SC with only a few from other states. Pretty much everyone arrested is from areas within a couple hour drive.

[Madison320]

I've been watching the arrests.org mugshot site for Mecklenburg County and so far that 70% figure for protest related arrests doesn't stand up. They haven't posted the arrests from last night yet though, just the previous two nights. Some are not from Charlotte but most are local. The majority of non-local arrests are from neighboring areas of NC and SC with only a few from other states. Pretty much everyone arrested is from areas within a couple hour drive.

Yeah, I'm not much on conspiracies. I'm not sure the riots help Hillary anyway now that I think about it. White cops shooting blacks will probably help Hillary, but not the actual riots themselves. Just like terrorist attacks will help Trump. I think he got a big boost from those bombs last week. Especially after the democrats and the media tried to cover it up or at least downplay it.

[Danke]

Wife's video:

http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/charlotte-shooting-video-footage-shows-fatal-encounter-between-police-keith-n653426

[navy-vet]

All of this reminds me of an old song I liked as a kid:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OyYMXjmzjwQ

[Brian4Liberty]

Wife's video:

http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/charlotte-shooting-video-footage-shows-fatal-encounter-between-police-keith-n653426


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=893129Dp8hQ

At the start of the video, which is not the start of the confrontation, we see that it is only unmarked vehicles and plain clothes cops. A marked vehicle with uniformed officers does show up, pretty much right before the shooting. Hard to say what the mental state of the victim was. Wife says TBI, and he just took his meds. Suicide by cop?

[phill4paul]

Suicide by cop?

Last I checked, assisted suicide is against the law.

[Danke]

Last I checked, assisted suicide is against the law.

You make it sound like you check often.

[phill4paul]

You make it sound like you check often.

Didn't mean to. <shrug>

[Brian4Liberty]

Last I checked, assisted suicide is against the law.

In bizarro world, some assisted suicides are more equal than others.

Suicide: if you need assistance, it's probably not your thing.

On a serious note, there are all kinds of stats about how many people are killed by cops. When you start looking at them individually, it seems that a lot of them are suicide by cop.

[phill4paul]

In bizarro world, some assisted suicides are more equal than others.

Suicide: if you need assistance, it's probably not your thing.

On a serious note, there are all kinds of stats about how many people are killed by cops. When you start looking at them individually, it seems that a lot of them are suicide by cop.

"Suicide by cop" is a meme that I have seen more often recently. It's used to discount facts. It drives a narrative. "Suicide by cop" coupled with "Cop feared for their life" equals justusfide. I'm not saying that it can't happen. That it doesn't happen. But just because someone might be having an interaction with meds doesn't mean they want to be "suicided."

[devil21]

Yeah, I'm not much on conspiracies. I'm not sure the riots help Hillary anyway now that I think about it. White cops shooting blacks will probably help Hillary, but not the actual riots themselves. Just like terrorist attacks will help Trump. I think he got a big boost from those bombs last week. Especially after the democrats and the media tried to cover it up or at least downplay it.

I'm very much on conspiracies but that 70% interview and follow-up articles reek of trying to keep people from joining the protests under concern of "being associated with out-of-state criminals" and "Soros". I'm going to the protests today, mostly in observer mode. Seems like not much can get Americans off their asses to march for much of anything so may as well take in the experience while it's there. On RPF, we've been talking about cops blasting people for YEARS so at least people are marching for something that we've been talking about! Can't get anyone to protest the Fed or never-ending wars or taxes out the wazoo...

[devil21]

If anyone cares, I have a few thoughts after participating in today's march through uptown Charlotte. It was great to see people exercising 1st Amendment actions. The crowd was very diverse and the media doesn't seem interested in showing that angle. The cameras were there for the very beginning of the march and the very end. The media opted-out of the rest of it.

The cognitive dissonance on display made my head feel like exploding, however. For example, electoral politics was inserted some. Like signs saying to oust Republican Gov. McCrory. Ok fine. But his challenger is Roy Cooper, the Attorney General that hasn't prosecuted the very cops you are protesting against! So replace one guy that doesn't have the direct ability to prosecute with the guy that has the direct ability but has refused to? Great logic there. Still firmly caught in the false left-right, I see. Also, a handful of people pushing communism, while protesting against the elites that are working toward global socialism. Useful idiot methinks you are, sir. Then there's the speeches about fighting "the state" that are followed up by demands for free healthcare from the state. Huh? Then breaking into a chant about how "we can take care of ourselves". Talk about not having a cogent train of thought. No wonder people are confused. The entire march went right past the Charlotte Federal Reserve branch and not a one even looked at it sideways. The Fed didn't even bother to have cops or national guard guarding the doors. Even the hotels had security out front. Fed? Nope. That shows that they know just how misdirected and uninformed even the most vocal and active of protestors are. No clue who's really pulling the strings. Or the giant obelisk we passed prominently placed in front of the District Attorney's office. Must just be there for decoration ;)

Any way, it was an experience, a very peaceful march and was nice to see people giving a shit about something at a time where it seems to me that people are overall being worn down by everything lately. We'll see what happens once the body and dash cam vids are released sometime today. The police chief's press conference to announce the release was already trying to tie in marijuana and gun possession as subtle excuses for cops to shoot people. "He had marijuana and a gun....so yeah good shoot."

[Danke]

Did you go see Joe Biggs from Info Wars?

[Working Poor]

trying to tie in marijuana and gun possession as subtle excuses for cops to shoot people. "He had marijuana and a gun....so yeah good shoot."

I can assure you it has happened many times. Don't forget the reason the drug war began was to be able to perceive people of color and people against the wars as the enemy.

[devil21]

Did you go see Joe Biggs from Info Wars?

I did not. Like I said, media didn't seem very interested in the march itself. I guess their AC'ed sat vans and hotel rooms beat walking on asphalt in 90 degree heat. Plus there's no one breaking anything and the crowd is too diverse to spin a racial narrative so who cares.

Vids are out and they don't look good. I have the suspicion that this is going to be spun into a gun control narrative by the pols.

[Krugminator2]

If anyone cares, I have a few thoughts after participating in today's march through uptown Charlotte. It was great to see people exercising 1st Amendment actions. The crowd was very diverse and the media doesn't seem interested in showing that angle. The cameras were there for the very beginning of the march and the very end. The media opted-out of the rest of it.



What were you protesting? A career criminal, who just got out a seven year prison sentence for assault with a deadly weapon, who illegally possessed a weapon, refused to put a gun down when police ordered him to, ended up getting shot. The guy had an assault with an intent to kill in the 90s and a couple other stints in jail.

None of the story the family put out about him holding a book was true. He wasn't a family man. I am surprised they didn't call him an honors student while he was in elementary school. He was a guy doing drugs supposedly picking up his kid from school.

The police are often wrong. That doesn't mean they are always wrong. Lately, most of the cases that stir up riots are where the police acted correctly.

[devil21]

What were you protesting? A career criminal, who just got out a seven year prison sentence for assault with a deadly weapon, who illegally possessed a weapon, refused to put a gun down when police ordered him to, ended up getting shot. The guy had an assault with an intent to kill in the 90s and a couple other stints in jail.

None of the story the family put out about him holding a book was true. He wasn't a family man. I am surprised they didn't call him an honors student while he was in elementary school. He was a guy doing drugs supposedly picking up his kid from school.

The police are often wrong. That doesn't mean they are always wrong. Lately, most of the cases that stir up riots are where the police acted correctly.

Perhaps you should reread my posts and rethink what you wrote above. Are you sure you're on the right forum? Your post sounds very trollish. Any way, I was clear that I wasn't protesting anything in particular, just taking in the experience as an observer, though we do have a whole RPF subforum devoted to police issues that was active long before the media gave a rat's ass about any of this stuff.

Now, to the contents of your post. Assuming this isn't a big psyop production like so many of the other 'shooting events' passed off by the media as real (I'm not convinced but ymmv). Personally, I don't care if the guy had a record. That wouldn't give the police the right to shoot him. The videos released today do not show him holding a gun, much less pointing one. His hands are clearly empty upon exiting the SUV and that is plainly obvious against the white background of the SUV. I don't care what his history was.

Now, for some perspective into why all of this is happening, I suggest people watch/listen to this video. It was revealed in the 90's by Bill Cooper and has been building up to this point for a long time.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fa2YaW5jUl4

[Brian4Liberty]

If anyone cares, I have a few thoughts after participating in today's march through uptown Charlotte. It was great to see people exercising 1st Amendment actions. The crowd was very diverse and the media doesn't seem interested in showing that angle. The cameras were there for the very beginning of the march and the very end. The media opted-out of the rest of it.

The cognitive dissonance on display made my head feel like exploding, however. For example, electoral politics was inserted some. Like signs saying to oust Republican Gov. McCrory. Ok fine. But his challenger is Roy Cooper, the Attorney General that hasn't prosecuted the very cops you are protesting against! So replace one guy that doesn't have the direct ability to prosecute with the guy that has the direct ability but has refused to? Great logic there. Still firmly caught in the false left-right, I see. Also, a handful of people pushing communism, while protesting against the elites that are working toward global socialism. Useful idiot methinks you are, sir. Then there's the speeches about fighting "the state" that are followed up by demands for free healthcare from the state. Huh? Then breaking into a chant about how "we can take care of ourselves". Talk about not having a cogent train of thought. No wonder people are confused. The entire march went right past the Charlotte Federal Reserve branch and not a one even looked at it sideways. The Fed didn't even bother to have cops or national guard guarding the doors. Even the hotels had security out front. Fed? Nope. That shows that they know just how misdirected and uninformed even the most vocal and active of protestors are. No clue who's really pulling the strings. Or the giant obelisk we passed prominently placed in front of the District Attorney's office. Must just be there for decoration ;)

Any way, it was an experience, a very peaceful march and was nice to see people giving a $#@! about something at a time where it seems to me that people are overall being worn down by everything lately. We'll see what happens once the body and dash cam vids are released sometime today. The police chief's press conference to announce the release was already trying to tie in marijuana and gun possession as subtle excuses for cops to shoot people. "He had marijuana and a gun....so yeah good shoot."

Very much consistent with my experiences in the real world. People contradict themselves constantly. "Get us money, get us stuff!" "Cut taxes, why do you spend so much!" "Stop police harassment, crack down on those people over there!" "Give us affordable housing, get rid of traffic jams, let more immigrants come here!"

And then there is the media, who ignore everything and then show up to get footage that matches their agenda, even if they have to stage it themselves.

[sdsubball23]

Now, to the contents of your post. Assuming this isn't a big psyop production like so many of the other 'shooting events' passed off by the media as real (I'm not convinced but ymmv). Personally, I don't care if the guy had a record. That wouldn't give the police the right to shoot him. The videos released today do not show him holding a gun, much less pointing one. His hands are clearly empty upon exiting the SUV and that is plainly obvious against the white background of the SUV. I don't care what his history was.

The body cam video shows what could be a gun holster on Keith's ankle. The PD released a photo of the holster. To me this means there was a higher chance of Keith having a gun. I don't think the videos are clear enough to know whether he had a gun in his hands or not. It's possible he had one in his hands and was making nonverbal movements that led the officer to feel threatened which eventually led to the shooting.

Why didn't Keith listen to the officer to drop the gun if he had one? Why didn't Keith raise his arms in the air to surrender?

I'm not saying the officer should've shot him, I wish there was a way to diffuse the situation without shooting him.

[puppetmaster]

The body cam video shows what could be a gun holster on Keith's ankle. The PD released a photo of the holster. To me this means there was a higher chance of Keith having a gun. I don't think the videos are clear enough to know whether he had a gun in his hands or not. It's possible he had one in his hands and was making nonverbal movements that led the officer to feel threatened which eventually led to the shooting.

Why didn't Keith listen to the officer to drop the gun if he had one? Why didn't Keith raise his arms in the air to surrender?

I'm not saying the officer should've shot him, I wish there was a way to diffuse the situation without shooting him. Maybe he was stoned and unable to think clearly

[sdsubball23]

Maybe he was stoned and unable to think clearly

That is a possibility.

What if he had the gun in his hand and due to his intoxication randomly shot it at someone or at an inanimate object? There could've been a threat we couldn't see ourselves in the videos that the officers saw.

Maybe the officers perceived it incorrectly and misinterpreted his actions.

They said there are more videos. Maybe those videos may give us a better idea.

[pcosmar]

That is a possibility.

What if he had the gun in his hand and due to his intoxication randomly shot it at someone or at an inanimate object? There could've been a threat we couldn't see ourselves in the videos that the officers saw.



Now we are at "What if" as an excuse to end someones life.

I am betting there was no gun. and the Cops Feared because that is the type of cowards that they are.

If there was a gun visible in his hand the photos would have been front page days ago.

[silverhandorder]

There was a gun, there were his finger prints. They wanted to leave him alone but he pointed the gun at them earlier. So this is the outcome.

[pcosmar]

There was a gun, there were his finger prints. They wanted to leave him alone but he pointed the gun at them earlier. So this is the outcome.

Oh, So full of Shit.


No gun, no clear threat in Keith Scott police videos
https://sfbay.ca/2016/09/24/no-gun-no-clear-threat-in-keith-scott-police-videos/

http://www.cnn.com/2016/09/24/us/charlotte-keith-lamont-scott-shooting-video/

Putney had said, before the videos were released, that "there is no definitive visual evidence that he had a gun in his hand."

http://www.news-gazette.com/2016-09-24/police-videos-charlotte-shooting-no-gun-apparent-victims-hand.html


CHARLOTTE, N.C. — Videos released Saturday do not show Keith Lamont Scott raising a weapon toward officers nor a gun in his hand.

The videos, from a police dashboard camera and a body camera, capture the confrontation Tuesday in which an officer repeatedly orders Scott to drop his gun.

[John F Kennedy III]

There was a gun, there were his finger prints. They wanted to leave him alone but he pointed the gun at them earlier. So this is the outcome.

Proof?

[silverhandorder]

Proof?

Police said so.

[pcosmar]

Police said so.

Police Lie.

a lot.

[silverhandorder]

Police Lie.

a lot.

So do activists.

[pcosmar]

So do activists.

was it an "activist" that shot the unarmed (video evidence) man?

or was it a Cop?

[Brian4Liberty]

The gun was visible on the ground right after they shot him. It's even visible in the wife's video.

There is no video of him raising it or pointing it, and it doesn't seem that he actually did that. His hand was down, but apparently holding the pistol. If this picture is exactly how it was when it fell to the ground, it looks like it was cocked and ready to fire. They probably didn't have to shoot him at that point, and may have been able to talk him down, but that's a bad situation.

5243

[TheTexan]

Police said so.

Good enough proof for me. +rep

[Brian4Liberty]

The Intercept corrected themselves after first reporting that the gun could not be seen in video:


Correction: September 23, 2016

An earlier version of this report, and its first headline, incorrectly stated that no gun was visible in the video recorded by Keith Scott’s wife. While the images are not definitive, it appears possible that glimpses of an object identified by the police as a gun can be seen.
...
http://theintercept.com/2016/09/23/no-gun-near-keith-scotts-body-in-video-recorded-by-his-wife-seconds-after-killing-2/

[enhanced_deficit]

Hypothetical question in the aftermath of this emotional episode.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PMs8Ut8Ulrs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PMs8Ut8Ulrs


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WWKG6ZmgAX4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WWKG6ZmgAX4

If Obama at next democratic bigwigs gathering joked about guns used by cops instead of drones under Obama's command, would his joke be received in same way by his supporters or differently?


Related

Is the ongoing Surge of Police State in America a Surge of Karma? (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?444261-Is-the-ongoing-Surge-of-Police-State-in-America-a-Surge-of-Karma/page2&)

[RJB]

Good enough proof for me. +rep

Very wise. People get dangerous when they believe their own eyes instead of the word of authority.

[John F Kennedy III]

Police said so.

Proof?

[Krugminator2]

was it an "activist" that shot the unarmed (video evidence) man?

or was it a Cop?

He was armed. Nobody disputes that. His prints and blood were on the gun. "Tests revealed Keith Scott's fingerprints, DNA and blood were on a gun recovered at Tuesday’s officer-involved shooting scene, police sources told Channel 9 reporter Mark Becker."

http://www.wsoctv.com/news/local/sources-keith-scotts-fingerprints-dna-blood-found-on-gun-at-charlotte-police-shooting-scene/449405173

He wasn't some innocent guy. He was doing drugs while he was waiting for one of his seven kids. There were a lot of people around the scene. The police did not just shoot a random guy for fun. He is a guy with a weapon who wouldn't surrender. The police are in an impossible situation dealing with these idiots. If they let their guard down for a second the guy can shoot them. They are on edge in a standoff where the guy is choosing to have a confrontation. People get shot in those situations. I have no sympathy whatsoever for this guy given the evidence. There is an easy way to avoid this. Don't pull a gun on the police. It isn't hard.

"While living in South Carolina in the 1990s, he was charged with a number of offenses including check fraud, aggravated assault and carrying a concealed weapon. Later, he moved to Texas where he shot and wounded a man in San Antonio in 2002, for which he was convicted and sentenced, in 2005, to seven years in prison. He was released in 2011." http://www.nytimes.com/2016/09/23/us/charlotte-shooting-keith-scott.html?_r=1
Sounds a guy just reading Human Action and minding his own business while the mean old stater police thugs took his life.

[John F Kennedy III]

Video evidence he had a gun or GTFO. Police are not above planting evidence.

[pcosmar]

He was armed. Nobody disputes that.

I do not care if he was armed.

THAT IS A HUMAN RIGHT

He did not threaten police nor anyone else.
Video shows NO THREAT.

I do not care if the gun fell out of it's holster or was dropped by someone else.

It is not a reason to assault and kill a man waiting for his children.

[Ender]

The Intercept corrected themselves after first reporting that the gun could not be seen in video:

The angle is completely wrong from the blurred shot of the gun on the ground & the shot of where the cop is actually standing.

[Krugminator2]

I do not care if the gun fell out of it's holster or was dropped by someone else.



For my own curiosity, do you believe OJ Simpson was innocent? If you aren't sure if he is guilty or innocent, do you believe the story about the police planting blood could have happened and that OJ could (greater than 1% chance) have been framed ?

[pcosmar]

For my own curiosity, do you believe OJ Simpson was innocent? If you aren't sure if he is guilty or innocent, do you believe the story about the police planting blood could have happened and that OJ could (greater than 1% chance) have been framed ?

I believe that the planted evidence was but one bungle of incompetent police,, who should have investigated before jumping to conclusions.

I also have a general distrust in both the Government and the Police.. Both have proven themselves to be dishonest and a threat to Liberty.

I always assume they are lying until proven otherwise.

[silverhandorder]

Ignoring all the crazies who think an armed man who previously aimed a gun at police is not dangerous, there is a perfect consensus. As for the crazies this is definition of being eternal losers at life.

[devil21]

I do not care if he was armed.

THAT IS A HUMAN RIGHT

He did not threaten police nor anyone else.
Video shows NO THREAT.

I do not care if the gun fell out of it's holster or was dropped by someone else.

It is not a reason to assault and kill a man waiting for his children.

This is the crux of the debate. OPEN CARRY IS PERFECTLY LEGAL IN NC. The mere presence of a gun/holster/etc has no effect on whether the shooting was justified. If you look at both police videos side by side it is clear he did not have a gun in either hand. The dash cam shows his left hand was empty when he got out of the truck (plainly clear against the white paint of the truck). The body cam showed his right hand was also empty. Therefore he had no gun in his hands when he got out and when he was shot. Holstered on his leg? Perhaps. Tucked visibly in his waistband? Perhaps. Neither of which is illegal in NC or threatening unto itself. Getting to the point where we have to argue that the mere presence of a gun can possibly be called a justification for shooting someone is scary.

[devil21]

Ignoring all the crazies who think an armed man who previously aimed a gun at police is not dangerous, there is a perfect consensus. As for the crazies this is definition of being eternal losers at life.

So you advocate for shooting people because they have a criminal history and a gun may be in their possession? Do I have that correct? Btw, appeal to majority is a logical fallacy and ad hominem is the sign of a losing argument.

[silverhandorder]

So you advocate for shooting people because they have a criminal history and a gun may be in their possession? Do I have that correct? Btw, appeal to majority is a logical fallacy and ad hominem is the sign of a losing argument.

I don't advocate anything.

[devil21]

I don't advocate anything.

Yeah I figured you'd slink off after throwing bricks.

[pcosmar]

I don't advocate anything.

Then why are you here?

I do advocate.. and I will agitate if necessary.
I do consider myself an activist. (perhaps less active than I could be?)

2nd amendment brought me to the party.
Cannabis legalization is also a dear issue. Among others.

Why the phuck are you here?

[Brian4Liberty]

There have been a lot of people saying the video shows cops dropping a gun on the ground. The alternative theory is that they dropped some rubber gloves. As for the gun, it's supposedly next to the foot of the officer with a red shirt, who was making sure it didn't get moved.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FkNdYkGczMk

[Krugminator2]

I believe that the planted evidence was

I always assume they are lying until proven otherwise.

O.J.'s blood and hair and footprints in blood were at the scene of the crime. OJ, Nicole and Ron Goldman's blood were splattered in his OJ's Bronco. The police didn't frame OJ. They don't have vials of OJ blood, hair, and designer shoes sitting around.

I just wanted to use a 100% guilty person as an example to show how far reflexive anti-police bias goes.

[Danke]

O.J.'s blood and hair and footprints in blood were at the scene of the crime. OJ, Nicole and Ron Goldman's blood were splattered in his OJ's Bronco. The police didn't frame OJ. They don't have vials of OJ blood, hair, and designer shoes sitting around.

I just wanted to use a 100% guilty person as an example to show how far reflexive anti-police bias goes.


OJ didn't do it.

[pcosmar]

OJ didn't do it.

I suspect not. but have believed he knew who did.

I also believe the victim of stabbing was A Gold digging Drug Whore and likely brought this on herself.

[Danke]

I suspect not. but have believed he knew who did.

I also believe the victim of stabbing was A Gold digging Drug Whore and likely brought this on herself.

There is a good documentary that shows it was his son that did it Jason Simpson.

[pcosmar]

There is a good documentary that shows it was his son that did it Jason Simpson.

Very possible.. Also Possible was her Drug Connection making a point of her..

None of which was investigated by those charged to do so.
Instead they ran on the jumped to conclusion of a Cop that already had a personal bias.

but that's just my observation.

[silverhandorder]

I don't advocate anything because this is a complex topic. I could if I wanted to. I already told off those who I think are wrong on this.

[pcosmar]

I don't advocate anything because this is a complex topic.

No.
It is not complex at all. It is quite simple.

The Police are out of control. Acting in a criminal manner.

They killed a man that was minding his own business when assaulted.
Video shows no gun in either hand at any time. I watched it. Even the Police Chief that watched it says the same.

and they are still (as usual) covering for it.

[silverhandorder]

So far police was right and activists were wrong.

[pcosmar]

So far police was right and activists were wrong.

So far the pigs are murders as usual.

[puppetmaster]

Oh, So full of Shit.


No gun, no clear threat in Keith Scott police videos
https://sfbay.ca/2016/09/24/no-gun-no-clear-threat-in-keith-scott-police-videos/

http://www.cnn.com/2016/09/24/us/charlotte-keith-lamont-scott-shooting-video/


http://www.news-gazette.com/2016-09-24/police-videos-charlotte-shooting-no-gun-apparent-victims-hand.html since when have you started to beleive liberal CNN and San Francisco rag?

There was a gun and finger prints. With so many people around it is highly unlikely that it was placed with fingerprints and no witnesses

[devil21]

since when have you started to beleive liberal CNN and San Francisco rag?

There was a gun and finger prints. With so many people around it is highly unlikely that it was placed with fingerprints and no witnesses

Who cares if there was a gun? No one seems to want to address the fact that open carry is LEGAL IN NORTH CAROLINA. Can't believe long time members of RPF are suggesting that the mere presence of a gun is justification for police to shoot someone. Goddamn bizarro world around here lately.

[Brian4Liberty]

Who cares if there was a gun? No one seems to want to address the fact that open carry is LEGAL IN NORTH CAROLINA. Can't believe long time members of RPF are suggesting that the mere presence of a gun is justification for police to shoot someone. Goddamn bizarro world around here lately.

I've certainly pointed out the right of all citizens to bear arms, so the mere presence of a gun does not justify shooting.

On the other hand, when a group of hired guns have the drop on you, probably best to excercise great caution.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ciez9G4cADE

[pcosmar]

since when have you started to beleive liberal CNN and San Francisco rag?

There was a gun and finger prints. With so many people around it is highly unlikely that it was placed with fingerprints and no witnesses

I saw the video. The Chief of police saw the video. There is no gun visible in either hand at any time.

I don't care about the gun,, it was not ever a factor.. It is irrelevant. it was not pointed or fired..
It was not in his hand.

They had no reason to assault the man in the first place. NONE WHATSOEVER> they were there on other business (likely nefarious).

There was no reason for any interaction with the goon squad in the first place.

[CCTelander]

Who cares if there was a gun? No one seems to want to address the fact that open carry is LEGAL IN NORTH CAROLINA. Can't believe long time members of RPF are suggesting that the mere presence of a gun is justification for police to shoot someone. Goddamn bizarro world around here lately.


I know, right? This from people who claim to be liberty activists. SMFH

[CCTelander]

I've certainly pointed out the right of all citizens to bear arms, so the mere presence of a gun does not justify shooting.

On the other hand, when a group of hired guns have the drop on you, probably best to excercise great caution.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ciez9G4cADE


Can't argue with this logic.

[pcosmar]

I know, right? This from people who claim to be liberty activists. SMFH

Trump is certainly drawing out Authoritarians and other closet Elitists in a spectrum of flavors.

[silverhandorder]

He pointed the gun at them earlier. They were going to ignore him completely.

[phill4paul]

He pointed the gun at them earlier. They were going to ignore him completely.

Happens every day. :rolleyes: Get off your meds.

[phill4paul]

Trump is certainly drawing out Authoritarians and other closet Elitists in a spectrum of flavors.

He does do that. Yes, he does.

[puppetmaster]

Who cares if there was a gun? No one seems to want to address the fact that open carry is LEGAL IN NORTH CAROLINA. Can't believe long time members of RPF are suggesting that the mere presence of a gun is justification for police to shoot someone. Goddamn bizarro world around here lately. bizzro is people who have never been in either of these situations claiming what should have happened.
Like Monday morning quarterbacks.
Contrary to popular belief from anarchists,
No cop goes to work saying goes today I want to shoot a black man or any person for that matter

[puppetmaster]

Trump is certainly drawing out Authoritarians and other closet Elitists in a spectrum of flavors.

Now this is trumps fault also......lol

[Ender]

He pointed the gun at them earlier. They were going to ignore him completely.

No- they never said he "pointed" a gun at them.

[NorthCarolinaLiberty]

Yes, of course his own prints would be on his own gun. That does not mean he was handling it outside the car.

My prints are on my phone right now, but I have not used it since this morning.

[NorthCarolinaLiberty]

No- they never said he "pointed" a gun at them.

I agree. I read the kop's version of events, and he never said anything about pointing.

[NorthCarolinaLiberty]

I did not hear the police chief or any other lice say the gun was in Scott's hand. Did anyone else? They seem to only imply that he was in possession of a gun. Maybe the gun was in Scott's waistband. Maybe it was in an open holster. That would be open carry. Cops usually disarm legal open carriers rather than let the open carrier take out his own gun. Of course, today you just get shot.

The gun could easily fly out of Scott's waistband when Scott falls. It could even fly out of a holster if not secure.

[Anti Federalist]

Never see the protests, never see the copsuckers, on stories like this.

Why is that, do you suppose?



Cop Charged With Murdering 6 Year Old Child Claims It Was in Self Defense

http://thefreethoughtproject.com/cop-charged-murdering-6-year-old-child-claims-self-defense/

Claire Bernish September 25, 2016

In what could be considered the most telling insight into police culture yet, the officer charged with second-degree murder for killing a 6-year-old child with autism has requested charges be thrown out — because he shot the boy multiple times in the head in self-defense.

Lt. Derrick Stafford, a deputy city marshal in Marksville, Louisiana, has now asked a judge to dismiss charges because — despite he and fellow officer Norris Greenhouse, Jr.’s claims at the time they did not know Jeremy Mardis was present in the vehicle they fired upon — he acted in defense of his and other officers’ lives.

Let that sink in.

This officer’s hubris in asking a judge, as well as the American public, to believe a 6-year-old child in a truck — who had obviously done nothing wrong — posed an imminent deadly threat to his life and thusly deserved to be murdered.

Although body camera footage has yet to be released due to ongoing legal proceedings, State Police Col. Mike Edmonson was asked about what video showed during a press conference announcing the arrests of two officers for the second-degree murder of the child and second-degree attempted murder of his father.

“It’s the most disturbing thing I’ve seen and I will leave it at that,” Edmonson told the media.

“That little boy was buckled in the front seat of that vehicle. That is how he died.”

Attorneys for Stafford, according to the New York Daily News, claim the child’s father had refused to stop his vehicle, had rammed Greenhouse’s car, and would not cooperate with commands to raise his hands — thus, Stafford fired at the unarmed man and his 6-year-old son “out of fear for his life and that of his fellow officers.”

On the night of November 3, 2015, Stafford, Greenhouse, Lt. Jason Brouillette, and Sgt. Kenneth Parnell pursued 25-year-old Christopher Few, whose son, Jeremy, rode as a passenger.

Few eventually stopped and raised his arms to show he did not have a weapon — which was later proven to be true. Nonetheless, as traffic continued unimpeded in the intersection where Few stopped his truck, Stafford and Greenhouse fired no less than 18 rounds into the vehicle — both occupants were hit, and though Few survived, several bullets hit his son in the head, killing him.

Initial reports claimed police had a warrant for Few’s arrest, but that later proved untrue. Indeed, Greenhouse had been actively stalking Few’s fiancée — and it became apparent the young father constituted an obstacle to his object of obsession.

No use-of-force policy exists for the Marksville Police Department, the Advocate wrote after the incident flared public outrage — not even for shooting at vehicles, which tends to have stricter guidelines at departments across the country.

Louisiana State Police viewed officer body camera footage not long after the fatal shooting — tellingly, Stafford and Greenhouse were arrested a short time later.

“This was not a threatening situation for police,” explained Mark Jeansonne, attorney for Few, after watching the body cam footage.

Rather than owning up to his responsibility in the brutally excessive shooting, Stafford is grasping at straws and using the oldest police trick in the book to dodge what he’s done — the tired, I Feared For My Life defense.

A child and an unarmed man, who reportedly cooperated with police commands to raise his arms, could not possibly have threatened these officers’ lives.

When a man with a gun and badge claims an autism-suffering child and his unarmed father posed an imminent threat to himself and other officers, perhaps it’s time to reevaluate how police training facilities are instilling terror into the hearts of people who will be released onto the public with deadly weapons at their disposal.

Or perhaps it’s time to admit that fear is just an excuse to brutalize and kill with impunity.

[RonPaulIsGreat]

So hard in these situation.

From the videos it doesn't appear that he had a gun drawn. So Cops appear in the wrong, but the videos all suck, and no clear video of the actual shooting has been released

But, he was a lifetime criminal now presumably on disability, so don't really care either.

There is no way I'm going to protest either way. FAR FAR FAR FAR better people have injustice served upon them, and no one cares.


I'm kinda a bit fuck the police, and totally on the side of kill repeat violent criminals.

So confused... It's kind of like Hitler getting assassinated by the CIA or something, technically illegal, but good for the world anyway.

[phill4paul]

Never see the protests, never see the copsuckers, on stories like this.

Why is that, do you suppose?



Cop Charged With Murdering 6 Year Old Child Claims It Was in Self Defense

http://thefreethoughtproject.com/cop-charged-murdering-6-year-old-child-claims-self-defense/

Claire Bernish September 25, 2016

In what could be considered the most telling insight into police culture yet, the officer charged with second-degree murder for killing a 6-year-old child with autism has requested charges be thrown out — because he shot the boy multiple times in the head in self-defense.

Lt. Derrick Stafford, a deputy city marshal in Marksville, Louisiana, has now asked a judge to dismiss charges because — despite he and fellow officer Norris Greenhouse, Jr.’s claims at the time they did not know Jeremy Mardis was present in the vehicle they fired upon — he acted in defense of his and other officers’ lives.

Let that sink in.

This officer’s hubris in asking a judge, as well as the American public, to believe a 6-year-old child in a truck — who had obviously done nothing wrong — posed an imminent deadly threat to his life and thusly deserved to be murdered.

Although body camera footage has yet to be released due to ongoing legal proceedings, State Police Col. Mike Edmonson was asked about what video showed during a press conference announcing the arrests of two officers for the second-degree murder of the child and second-degree attempted murder of his father.

“It’s the most disturbing thing I’ve seen and I will leave it at that,” Edmonson told the media.

“That little boy was buckled in the front seat of that vehicle. That is how he died.”

Attorneys for Stafford, according to the New York Daily News, claim the child’s father had refused to stop his vehicle, had rammed Greenhouse’s car, and would not cooperate with commands to raise his hands — thus, Stafford fired at the unarmed man and his 6-year-old son “out of fear for his life and that of his fellow officers.”

On the night of November 3, 2015, Stafford, Greenhouse, Lt. Jason Brouillette, and Sgt. Kenneth Parnell pursued 25-year-old Christopher Few, whose son, Jeremy, rode as a passenger.

Few eventually stopped and raised his arms to show he did not have a weapon — which was later proven to be true. Nonetheless, as traffic continued unimpeded in the intersection where Few stopped his truck, Stafford and Greenhouse fired no less than 18 rounds into the vehicle — both occupants were hit, and though Few survived, several bullets hit his son in the head, killing him.

Initial reports claimed police had a warrant for Few’s arrest, but that later proved untrue. Indeed, Greenhouse had been actively stalking Few’s fiancée — and it became apparent the young father constituted an obstacle to his object of obsession.

No use-of-force policy exists for the Marksville Police Department, the Advocate wrote after the incident flared public outrage — not even for shooting at vehicles, which tends to have stricter guidelines at departments across the country.

Louisiana State Police viewed officer body camera footage not long after the fatal shooting — tellingly, Stafford and Greenhouse were arrested a short time later.

“This was not a threatening situation for police,” explained Mark Jeansonne, attorney for Few, after watching the body cam footage.

Rather than owning up to his responsibility in the brutally excessive shooting, Stafford is grasping at straws and using the oldest police trick in the book to dodge what he’s done — the tired, I Feared For My Life defense.

A child and an unarmed man, who reportedly cooperated with police commands to raise his arms, could not possibly have threatened these officers’ lives.

When a man with a gun and badge claims an autism-suffering child and his unarmed father posed an imminent threat to himself and other officers, perhaps it’s time to reevaluate how police training facilities are instilling terror into the hearts of people who will be released onto the public with deadly weapons at their disposal.

Or perhaps it’s time to admit that fear is just an excuse to brutalize and kill with impunity.

Yeah, I revisited it here....http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?484651-LA-Cops-unload-on-unarmed-man-attempting-to-quot-flee-quot-in-car-killing-6-y-o-boy&p=6318625#post6318625.

Don't ask me man. Being from close to Charlotte, NC and knowing others I've been excoriated on FedBook as a "white", with "privileges," so I can't give an opinion. Some how my views are "racist" at worst or "uninformed" at best. SMDH. You try to expose the bigger picture and those that find solace in the smaller can't open their minds. It is what it is. I'm about at the point of not caring and not trying to lend a different perspective to what is obvious to me a Stockholm syndrome.

[Anti Federalist]

Yeah, I revisited it here....http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?484651-LA-Cops-unload-on-unarmed-man-attempting-to-quot-flee-quot-in-car-killing-6-y-o-boy&p=6318625#post6318625.

Don't ask me man. Being from close to Charlotte, NC and knowing others I've been excoriated on FedBook as a "white", with "privileges," so I can't give an opinion. Some how my views are "racist" at worst or "uninformed" at best. SMDH. You try to expose the bigger picture and those that find solace in the smaller can't open their minds. It is what it is. I'm about at the point of not caring and not trying to lend a different perspective to what is obvious to me a Stockholm syndrome.

Missed that you already updated it.

Good job!

I wish I could stop caring...I really do...but every time I try, I realize the miserable pricks will drag me along for the ride.

And that alone spurs me on at least one more day, as long as I'm upright and taking nourishment.

[phill4paul]

Missed that you already updated it.

Good job!

I wish I could stop caring...I really do...but every time I try, I realize the miserable pricks will drag me along for the ride.

And that alone spurs me on at least one more day, as long as I'm upright and taking nourishment.

Right there with you. I don't know why. It's like arguing on these forums about Trump. "If you're not for Trump you are for Hillary!", "You're not black so you can't understand!." As different as either of those statements are there is so much similarity that makes me want to say....."Ahhh, fuck it."

[Anti Federalist]

Right there with you. I don't know why. It's like arguing on these forums about Trump. "If you're not for Trump you are for Hillary!", "You're not black so you can't understand!." As different as either of those statements are there is so much similarity that makes me want to say....."Ahhh, fuck it."

It's enough to make your head explode, honestly.

[phill4paul]

It's enough to make your head explode, honestly.

Both of us need a good Kentucky whiskey, straight. I am honestly at the point of "head explode." Even folks that I could previously agree with want to excoriate me for saying almost the same thing, but with a liberty over all bent. It's just gotten insane. And more and more I'm just about retreating to my and mine. I'm just so tired I'm pulling back. There is too much bad energy in it. I'm tired of being pissed off. Fuck 'em. I'm six years without filing Federal or state. I'm not a tax evader. I readily admit that I am an conscientious objector. And if that is against the law....I don't care.

[Anti Federalist]

Both of us need a good Kentucky whiskey, straight. I am honestly at the point of "head explode." Even folks that I could previously agree with want to excoriate me for saying almost the same thing, but with a liberty over all bent. It's just gotten insane. And more and more I'm just about retreating to my and mine. I'm just so tired I'm pulling back. There is too much bad energy in it. I'm tired of being pissed off. Fuck 'em. I'm six years without filing Federal or state. I'm not a tax evader. I readily admit that I am an conscientious objector. And if that is against the law....I don't care.

Have one on me, my brother:

http://liquor.s3.amazonaws.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/01/rye-on-the-rocks.jpg

I salute your effort, you're a better man than I.

[Danke]

Both of us need a good Kentucky whiskey, straight. I am honestly at the point of "head explode." Even folks that I could previously agree with want to excoriate me for saying almost the same thing, but with a liberty over all bent. It's just gotten insane. And more and more I'm just about retreating to my and mine. I'm just so tired I'm pulling back. There is too much bad energy in it. I'm tired of being pissed off. Fuck 'em. I'm six years without filing Federal or state. I'm not a tax evader. I readily admit that I am an conscientious objector. And if that is against the law....I don't care.

Unless your work has a federal connection, you are not evading.
Buy the book, or read an older edition here:


https://www.1215.org/lawnotes/misc/ctcforfree.pdf

[phill4paul]

Unless your work has a federal connection, you are not evading.
Buy the book, or read an older edition here:


https://www.1215.org/lawnotes/misc/ctcforfree.pdf

Yeah, yeah. And I should drive around without a license plate or drivers license. :rolleyes:

[Danke]

Yeah, yeah. And I should drive around without a license plate or drivers license. :rolleyes:

I wouldn't.

[phill4paul]

Have one on me, my brother:

http://liquor.s3.amazonaws.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/01/rye-on-the-rocks.jpg

I salute your effort, you're a better man than I.

I didn't even think to look but...there in the back was three fingers of Maker's. So, it was on you. Thank you.

And I'm not a better man than you. My circumstances are just different and that makes it easier for me to make my stand. I know this and you should too.

[phill4paul]

I wouldn't.

Yeah, that's kinda askin' for trouble. As far as the tax thing, I don't worry. There is really nothing they can do to me. OK, they can take away Social Security. They can have it. They can TRY to put me in jail to make an example. Lol. That'll be a hoot.I dunno. For myself there is no downside to paying into a corrupt mafia.

[enhanced_deficit]

Cop Charged With Murdering 6 Year Old Child Claims It Was in Self Defense

http://thefreethoughtproject.com/cop-charged-murdering-6-year-old-child-claims-self-defense/

Claire Bernish September 25, 2016

In what could be considered the most telling insight into police culture yet, the officer charged with second-degree murder for killing a 6-year-old child with autism has requested charges be thrown out — because he shot the boy multiple times in the head in self-defense.

Lt. Derrick Stafford, a deputy city marshal in Marksville, Louisiana, has now asked a judge to dismiss charges because — despite he and fellow officer Norris Greenhouse, Jr.’s claims at the time they did not know Jeremy Mardis was present in the vehicle they fired upon — he acted in defense of his and other officers’ lives.



That is crazy if there was no protest.

http://www.missopen.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/11/Police-officers-Killing-6-Year-Old-Boy-Makes-Bond-in-Marksville.jpg



Did not hear of this in news headlines, media owners and their masters probably don't see much political play for their favored politicians/SWCbags in such news stories.

[Danke]

Yeah, that's kinda askin' for trouble. As far as the tax thing, I don't worry. There is really nothing they can do to me. OK, they can take away Social Security. They can have it. They can TRY to put me in jail to make an example. Lol. That'll be a hoot.I dunno. For myself there is no downside to paying into a corrupt mafia.

If you want, I can discuss driver license (witch is for commercial activities) too, but that is not a battle I wish to fight. The expense is currently low vs. the hassle. Taxation not so much. The Minnesota constitution says I can owe my property in allodial.



Another fight.

[puppetmaster]

If you want, I can discuss driver license (witch is for commercial activities) too, but that is not a battle I wish to fight. The expense is currently low vs. the hassle. Taxation not so much. The Minnesota constitution says I can owe my property in allodial.



Another fight. allodial title?

[phill4paul]

If you want, I can discuss driver license (witch is for commercial activities) too, but that is not a battle I wish to fight. The expense is currently low vs. the hassle. Taxation not so much. The Minnesota constitution says I can owe my property in allodial.



Another fight.

I'm with you on this. I've read your informative footnotes in your sig. And I thank you. There is nothing there that does not cause me to disagree. But, I'm not the government. Theye disagree just because...power.

I don't want a fight, or another fight, I just want to be left alone.

But, it seems this is not an option going forward.

[Danke]

allodial title?

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?189599-Allodial-title

[devil21]

I've certainly pointed out the right of all citizens to bear arms, so the mere presence of a gun does not justify shooting.

On the other hand, when a group of hired guns have the drop on you, probably best to excercise great caution.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ciez9G4cADE

What extra caution can one take? Drop the gun! OK I'm not touching it. DROP THE GUN! OK but I have to reach for it to drop it. DROP THE FUCKING GUN! <reaches> BANGBANGBANGBANG

He reached for the gun.

WTF?

[silverhandorder]

They saw Scott roll what they believed to be “a marijuana ‘blunt.’ ” They returned to watching for their suspect, then Vinson saw Scott hold up a gun.

Read more here: http://www.charlotteobserver.com/news/local/crime/article103973781.html#storylink=cpy

I swear I read somewhere that he pointed instead of held up. I do admit holding up is not the same as pointing. I can see how someone can interpret the encounter your way with he given facts.

Honestly it is a bad situation and the way he acted exacerbated it.

[pcosmar]

No cop goes to work saying goes today I want to shoot a black man or any person for that matter

Bull----.

They certainly are not out to protect my rights.
And I have known some racist bastards that think exactly that.

[puppetmaster]

Bull----.

They certainly are not out to protect my rights.
And I have known some racist bastards that think exactly that. guess we will just disagree

[Brian4Liberty]

The presence of a gun in and of itself is no justification for the Police to shoot someone. There is a Second Amendment, and every citizen has the right to bear arms. Now there are certainly other factors that might make shooting at a suspect acceptable and mandatory.

The NY/NJ bomber, Ahmad Rahami, is a prime example. A suspected killer, who pulled out a gun and started firing. No doubts there whatsoever.

On the other hand, when several officers shout contradictory commands and shoot a person all in a matter of 5 seconds, that is a major problem, even if that person is wearing a side arm or even holding it in their hand when the Police come upon them. Tamir Rice, Andy Lopez and Erik Scott (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?259956-Updates-on-Costco-Police-Shooting-in-Nevada) are examples of unjustified killings.

Now what will the media focus on? The rights of citizens to bear arms? No (unless they want to push the gun-banning agenda). The use of military tactics and training for street cops? No. Patrolling America as if it's Kabul or Baghdad? No.

But they will focus on racism, because it fits their Alinsky agitprop agenda, even if it's a white cop shooting a white person, a black cop shooting a black person, or a Hispanic cop shooting an Asian.

Hillary at the debate last night. Gun control is her solution:


But we also have to recognize, in addition to the challenges that we face with policing, there are so many good, brave police officers who equally want reform. So we have to bring communities together in order to begin working on that as a mutual goal. And we've got to get guns out of the hands of people who should not have them.

The gun epidemic is the leading cause of death of young African- American men, more than the next nine causes put together. So we have to do two things, as I said. We have to restore trust. We have to work with the police. We have to make sure they respect the communities and the communities respect them. And we have to tackle the plague of gun violence, which is a big contributor to a lot of the problems that we're seeing today.

[phill4paul]

Hillary at the debate last night. Gun control is her solution:

So? Trump wants "stop and frisk" and a "no-fly list" banning for gun sales. Neither of which require due process.

[Schifference]

What about this shooting?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uH4PInHFfOc

[Brian4Liberty]

So? Trump wants "stop and frisk" and a "no-fly list" banning for gun sales. Neither of which require due process.

Yep, Trump has his own rights-violating solutions. And both will use these riots as justification for their authoritarianism.

[phill4paul]

What about this shooting?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uH4PInHFfOc

Has the DOJ named the FBI shooter? Has he been charged with shooting or even reprimanded for covering up his actions during the Sheriffs investigation. Why isn't the Sheriff charging him with covering up his actions during an investigations. So many questions, but....we don't have time for this.

[phill4paul]

Yep, Trump has his own rights-violating solutions. And both will use these riots as justification for their authoritarianism.

Magic 8-Ball says "Buy Now."

[AZJoe]

Progressive, Heal Thyself
https://www.lewrockwell.com/2016/10/james-ostrowski/progressive-heal-thyself/

I see leftism as a projection of personal unhappiness into the world of politics whereby the leftist uses the state when they control it, or private violence when they don’t, to do damage to those who are the object of the leftist’s colossal envy and thereby somehow reduce the leftist’s chronic misery. That being the case, leftism has been an extremely dangerous ideology in history and is so now. Its body count is enormous. … they are extremely active and quite fanatical as can be seen when they quickly migrate to cities in distress to spark riots and bloodshed as they have in Charlotte. …

Progressivism is the widely held belief that positive state action, that is, force, can improve society. … progressivism is a not a rational or logical system of thought but a form of self-help therapy that makes the progressive feel better by providing a magical solution to all of the life’s problems: state action. The problem is that it doesn’t work and makes matters worse. However, since progressivism wasn’t conceived as a rational ideology in the first place, its failure doesn’t faze the progressive. Instead, they cling to its therapeutic value by inventing scapegoats for the problems caused by state action. They also construe any problem as an instance where not enough state action was used. Hence, the endless calls for more spending to rescue a long series of failed progressive programs such as the drug war, government schools or the interventions into Libya and Syria.

As we have seen throughout history, scapegoating can be extremely dangerous. Thus, when a wide variety of progressive policies failed or backfired and left many black communities stagnant and in despair, the progressive had to invent a scapegoat instead of blaming progressivism. Keep in mind that progressive scapegoats have to be non-governmental entities. Racism fits the bill perfectly. Thus, all police shootings that are perceived to be unjustified, are now blamed on racism. Racism in this context means white racism and that means, white people. Accordingly, progressives are encouraging race hatred and their constant drumbeat of this message has caused race riots in many cities and the deaths and beatings of many. …

we can’t fully understand why America is in a melt-down mode without understanding the dominant political mindsets that determine public policy and our response to policy failures. Progressives particularly need to acknowledge their role in creating this mess. …

Let’s abolish or scale back the two programs that lead to the largest number of hostile encounters between the police and minorities: the war on drugs (invented by progressives) and the use of traffic tickets not to promote safety but as a form of portable tax collection (to pay for progressive programs). …

A final word to progressives: you are a huge part of the problem in another sense. Every one of your policies, programs or proposals requires a cop with a gun to enforce it. The police are out there enforcing the policies you favor. The explosion of new laws and regulations has led to a sharp increase in hostile contacts between citizens and the police. … The abuse of this power is the natural consequence of the policies you favor. Who is to blame for this crisis? Take a look in the mirror.

[Anti Federalist]

Justified.

Charlotte police officer who fatally shot Keith Scott ‘acted lawfully,’ won’t be charged

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-nation/wp/2016/11/30/charlotte-police-officer-wont-be-charged-for-fatal-shooting-that-set-off-days-of-unrest-prosecutor-says/

[phill4paul]

Justified.

Charlotte police officer who fatally shot Keith Scott ‘acted lawfully,’ won’t be charged

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-nation/wp/2016/11/30/charlotte-police-officer-wont-be-charged-for-fatal-shooting-that-set-off-days-of-unrest-prosecutor-says/

Heavy rain, high winds and tornado watch in Mecklenburg Co. tonight. Good timing. No riots.

[Ender]

Progressive, Heal Thyself
https://www.lewrockwell.com/2016/10/james-ostrowski/progressive-heal-thyself/

I see leftism as a projection of personal unhappiness into the world of politics whereby the leftist uses the state when they control it, or private violence when they don’t, to do damage to those who are the object of the leftist’s colossal envy and thereby somehow reduce the leftist’s chronic misery. That being the case, leftism has been an extremely dangerous ideology in history and is so now. Its body count is enormous. … they are extremely active and quite fanatical as can be seen when they quickly migrate to cities in distress to spark riots and bloodshed as they have in Charlotte. …

Progressivism is the widely held belief that positive state action, that is, force, can improve society. … progressivism is a not a rational or logical system of thought but a form of self-help therapy that makes the progressive feel better by providing a magical solution to all of the life’s problems: state action. The problem is that it doesn’t work and makes matters worse. However, since progressivism wasn’t conceived as a rational ideology in the first place, its failure doesn’t faze the progressive. Instead, they cling to its therapeutic value by inventing scapegoats for the problems caused by state action. They also construe any problem as an instance where not enough state action was used. Hence, the endless calls for more spending to rescue a long series of failed progressive programs such as the drug war, government schools or the interventions into Libya and Syria.

As we have seen throughout history, scapegoating can be extremely dangerous. Thus, when a wide variety of progressive policies failed or backfired and left many black communities stagnant and in despair, the progressive had to invent a scapegoat instead of blaming progressivism. Keep in mind that progressive scapegoats have to be non-governmental entities. Racism fits the bill perfectly. Thus, all police shootings that are perceived to be unjustified, are now blamed on racism. Racism in this context means white racism and that means, white people. Accordingly, progressives are encouraging race hatred and their constant drumbeat of this message has caused race riots in many cities and the deaths and beatings of many. …

we can’t fully understand why America is in a melt-down mode without understanding the dominant political mindsets that determine public policy and our response to policy failures. Progressives particularly need to acknowledge their role in creating this mess. …

Let’s abolish or scale back the two programs that lead to the largest number of hostile encounters between the police and minorities: the war on drugs (invented by progressives) and the use of traffic tickets not to promote safety but as a form of portable tax collection (to pay for progressive programs). …

A final word to progressives: you are a huge part of the problem in another sense. Every one of your policies, programs or proposals requires a cop with a gun to enforce it. The police are out there enforcing the policies you favor. The explosion of new laws and regulations has led to a sharp increase in hostile contacts between citizens and the police. … The abuse of this power is the natural consequence of the policies you favor. Who is to blame for this crisis? Take a look in the mirror.

Good article- BUT- people need to realize that "progressives" aren't necessarily "lefties" just as neocons also span both sides of the political spectrum.

Progressive Nixon brought the nation under the WoD and it has been a disaster for everyone except the alphabets.