Why Were U.S. Troops in Hasakah? No ISIS There-Are U.S. Troops "Advising" Kurds To Attack SA?

[AZJoe]

Why Were U.S. Troops in Hasakah? No ISIS There - Are U.S. Troops In Hasakah "Advising" Kurds To Attack The Syrian Army?

http://www.moonofalabama.org/2016/08/hasakah-are-us-troops-advising-kurds-to-attack-the-syrian-army-.html (http://www.moonofalabama.org/2016/08/hasakah-are-us-troops-advising-kurds-to-attack-the-syrian-army-.html)

[August 18] a fight broke out between Syrian Arab Army troops and local Kurdish forces in the predominately Kurdish city of Hasakah in north-eastern Syria. Hasakah, with some 200,000 inhabitants, has held a SAA garrison for years. …

There have been earlier fights but these were local rivalries between Syrian auxiliary National Defense Forces from local Arab (Christian) minorities and some gangs who form a Kurdish internal security force under the label Asayish. Such fights usually ended after a day or two when grown-ups on both sides resolved the conflict over this or that checkpoint or access route.

The Islamic State (grey on the map) once threatened Hasakah but that danger is now far away.

[August 18] another fight broke out, but got serious. The Syrian air force was called in to defend against direct attacks on the SAA garrison and minority quarters. …

The cause of this week's flare-up was unclear. … The reason that fighting started might have to do with U.S. troops who, for whatever reason, seem to be [illegally] in Hasakah. The U.S. military now laments that these troops came under Syrian air force fire …

There was a small number of U.S. Special Operators acting as advisers to the YPG when the Syrian airstrikes began.

After the Syrian Su-24s began to strike, the U.S. immediately contacted the Russians, Davis said, and made clear that American aircraft would respond if coalition forces were under attack. The Russians explained that they were not the ones conducting the strikes and the U.S. scrambled manned fighter aircraft to the area to protect the Americans and allies under attack. …

There is no Islamic State in the area which is now far away from the front line.


Why are U.S. troops, who have zero legal grounds of being in Syria at all, in Hasakah city or the wider area?
Who are they "advising" there and for what purpose?
Why does rare local fighting starts to get serious just when U.S. troops are in the area?

The U.S. has the chutzpah to "warn" the Syrians of defending their own troops on Syrian grounds. … Davis said that the Syrians would be "well-advised" not to interfere with coalition forces [illegally] on the ground in the future.

Syrian government forces are attacked by Kurdish troops who are "advised" by U.S. special forces. According to the U.S. spokesperson the Syrian air force is not allowed to defend them? What has this to do with "fighting ISIS" in eastern Syria which is allegedly the sole reason for U.S. troops being in Syria? …

[goldenequity]

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to AZJoe again.:)

[jmdrake]

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to AZJoe again.:)

Gotcha covered on the rep. And hopefully once this stupid election is over RPF won't be swamped with pro-Trump/anti-Trump threads and stories of real importance like this will get the attention they deserve.

[r3volution 3.0]

Just to be Devil's advocate...

How do we know Kurdish forces started the fight?

The Syrians have a motive to fight the Kurds (namely, to reclaim Syrian territory from them), so perhaps they started it?

They say they're defending themselves from a Kurdish attack, but no side in any war ever admits to being the aggressor.

[Zippyjuan]

Just to be Devil's advocate...

How do we know Kurdish forces started the fight?

The Syrians have a motive to fight the Kurds (namely, to reclaim Syrian territory from them), so perhaps they started it?

They say they're defending themselves from a Kurdish attack, but no side in any war ever admits to being the aggressor.

Al Jazeera reporting:


Civilians evacuated as Syrian Kurds bombed in Hasakah

Dozens killed, thousands evacuated after second day of Syrian government air raids on Kurdish-controlled areas of city.

Syrian government jets have continued to pound Kurdish-controlled parts of the northeastern city of Hasakah for a second day, killing at least 22 residents and forcing thousands to flee.

The Syrian Observatory for Human Rights (SOHR), which reports daily on the war using a network of activists, said on Friday that at least 22 civilians, including nine children, had been killed in the past two days.



The air raids on Hasakah, which is divided into zones of Kurdish and Syrian government control, marks the most violent confrontation between the Kurdish YPG and Damascus in more than five years of civil war.

The YPG and Syrian government have mostly avoided confrontation during the multi-sided war that has turned Syria into a patchwork of areas held by the state and an array of armed factions.

While forces loyal to President Bashar al-Assad, backed by Russia and Iran, have focused mostly on fighting Sunni Arab rebels, the YPG has prioritised carving out and safeguarding predominantly Kurdish regions of northern Syria.


Rami Abdulrahman, of the SOHR, said the fighting began this week after pro-government militiamen detained a number of Kurdish youths, a step that was followed by advances of Kurdish security forces towards government-held areas.

Naser Haj Mansour, a Kurdish official in the YPG-affiliated Syria Democratic Forces alliance, said Kurdish forces had taken some additional positions, including an economics college.

The Syrian army said in a statement on Friday that the air raids were the result of Kurdish forces trying to take over the city.

http://www.aljazeera.com/mritems/Images/2016/8/2/ac3c3d49c12f423999be8d5e0dfaf37d_6.jpg

[oyarde]

If I recall there were a few US special ops there training Kurds . This training would be likely be Forward Observer training ( directing accurate mortar, artillary etc fire ).

[Zippyjuan]

If I recall there were a few US special ops there training Kurds . This training would be likely be Forward Observer training ( directing accurate mortar, artillary etc fire ).

US has sent up to 250 people to Syria including Special Forces. http://www.militarytimes.com/story/military/war-on-is/2016/04/24/250-us-troops-deploying-syria-isis-fight-intensifies/83481188/


About 50 U.S. special operations forces are already operating in Syria. Most of the additional 250 personnel will also be special operations forces, largely Army Green Berets. The group will also include an unknown number of medical and logistical troops to provide them with support.

[r3volution 3.0]

Rami Abdulrahman, of the SOHR, said the fighting began this week after pro-government militiamen detained a number of Kurdish youths, a step that was followed by advances of Kurdish security forces towards government-held areas.

Naser Haj Mansour, a Kurdish official in the YPG-affiliated Syria Democratic Forces alliance, said Kurdish forces had taken some additional positions, including an economics college.

The Syrian army said in a statement on Friday that the air raids were the result of Kurdish forces trying to take over the city.

So it sounds like it wasn't planned by anybody in advance, but the Kurds exploited the opportunity that the initial skirmish presented them.

[Zippyjuan]

http://www.theatlantic.com/news/archive/2016/08/syria-manbij-liberated-from-isis/495779/


What Happens When a Town Is Liberated From ISIS

U.S.-backed Kurdish and Arab fighters fought for more than two months to push the Islamic State out of Manbij, Syria.

https://cdn.theatlantic.com/assets/media/img/mt/2016/08/RTSMZN0/lead_large.jpg?1471093716
A woman smokes Friday after the Syria Democratic Forces drove ISIS out of Manbij. Smoking was one of the many activities prohibited by the group. Rodi Said / Reuters

Men got haircuts and shaved their beards. Women lit up cigarettes and burned their niqabs. Residents of Manbij, Syria, who had lived under the Islamic State for nearly two years, came out onto the streets and celebrated, shedding tears of joy.

“May God destroy them. They slaughtered us,” a young man shouted in a square in Manbij. “May they not live for a minute.”

“I feel joy and [it is like a] dream I am dreaming,” a woman said, according to Reuters. “I cannot believe it, I cannot believe it. Things I saw, no one saw,” She then fainted, the news agency said.

Fighters from the U.S.-backed Syria Democratic Forces (SDF) recaptured Manbij, Aleppo province, on Friday after more than 70 days of intense fighting against ISIS, which seized the northern town about two years ago. SDF fighters, mostly Kurds and Arabs, and including women, freed more than 2,000 civilians who’d been taken hostage by the extremists.

The SDF is “in full control” of Manbij, Nasser Haj Mansour, a fighter with the group, told The Associated Press. Another rebel leader told Reuters they were still looking for possible ISIS sleeper cells in the town, which is near the border with Turkey.

The loss of the town is a major blow to the Islamic State because the group’s supply route from Raqqa, its de facto capital, and Turkey, is essentially cut off. Gordon Trowbridge, the Pentagon deputy spokesman, called Manbij’s loss “a major setback for” ISIS. NBC adds:


The Manbij operation, in which U.S. special forces have played a significant role on the ground, marks the most ambitious advance by the Washington-allied SDF since the U.S. launched its military campaign against ISIS two years ago.

U.S. officials have said once the Manbij operation is completed, it would create the conditions to move on the militant group's de facto capital of Raqqa, Reuters reported. U.S. officials anticipate a tough battle.

But while the U.S. and its allies prepare for that tough battle, resident of Manbij will likely return to a state of relative normalcy that existed before ISIS captured the town.

[Zippyjuan]

So it sounds like it wasn't planned by anybody in advance, but the Kurds exploited the opportunity that the initial skirmish presented them.

There seems to be regular skirmishes in the city but this is the first time Syrian airforce bombed the city (which is not ISIS control nor is it anywhere near the current front lines).

[r3volution 3.0]

There seems to be regular skirmishes in the city but this is the first time Syrian airforce bombed the city (which is not ISIS control nor is it anywhere near the current front lines).

They were evidently responding to the attempted Kurdish seizure of the Syrian quarter of the city referenced in your article.

[asurfaholic]

Gotcha covered on the rep. And hopefully once this stupid election is over RPF won't be swamped with pro-Trump/anti-Trump threads and stories of real importance like this will get the attention they deserve.
Damn right

[juleswin]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lKZqu61IbFI

The kurds are the biggest traitors any nation would want to allow into their country. They always work with the foreign enemy against the local communities. If you can, please watch this little commentary on the whole Kurdish situation. Also, I believe the US doesn't have good intentions in Syria so any victories they attain with their Kurdish fighters would not be celebrated by me.

Nomads like the Kurds do not have any claim to any lands in Syria, they should continue moving like they have always moved through out history. Don't arm the kurds, don't assist them and please kick people out once they start agitating for their nation. They are nothing but trouble.

[Zippyjuan]

Maybe the US should kick the Texans out for the same reason. Kurds are just another oppressed people seeking control over their own lives.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-29702440


Who are the Kurds?

Between 25 and 35 million Kurds inhabit a mountainous region straddling the borders of Turkey, Iraq, Syria, Iran and Armenia. They make up the fourth-largest ethnic group in the Middle East, but they have never obtained a permanent nation state.

In recent decades, Kurds have increasingly influenced regional developments, fighting for autonomy in Turkey and playing prominent roles in the conflicts in Iraq and Syria, where they have resisted the advance of the so-called Islamic State (IS) jihadist group.

Where do they come from?

The Kurds are one of the indigenous people of the Mesopotamian plains and the highlands in what are now south-eastern Turkey, north-eastern Syria, northern Iraq, north-western Iran and south-western Armenia.

Middle East map showing Kurdish areas
http://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/624/media/images/78409000/gif/_78409411_kurds_map624_kobane.gif

Today, they form a distinctive community, united through race, culture and language, even though they have no standard dialect. They also adhere to a number of different religions and creeds, although the majority are Sunni Muslims.




In the early 20th Century, many Kurds began to consider the creation of a homeland - generally referred to as "Kurdistan". After World War One and the defeat of the Ottoman Empire, the victorious Western allies made provision for a Kurdish state in the 1920 Treaty of Sevres.

Such hopes were dashed three years later, however, when the Treaty of Lausanne, which set the boundaries of modern Turkey, made no provision for a Kurdish state and left Kurds with minority status in their respective countries. Over the next 80 years, any move by Kurds to set up an independent state was brutally quashed.

In the chaos in Iraq, they were the only stable region- because they had established governments and organization. They have been successful in not allowing ISIS to move into their areas and have been driving ISIS out of areas they occupy. They can be a stabilizing force for the region given the current power vacuums.


They always work with the foreign enemy against the local communities.

In most cases, they ARE the local communities. (see map above)

[AZJoe]

US has sent up to 250 people to Syria including Special Forces. http://www.militarytimes.com/story/military/war-on-is/2016/04/24/250-us-troops-deploying-syria-isis-fight-intensifies/83481188/

All of them illegal. None of them with the permission of Syria or the UN.

[AZJoe]

There seems to be regular skirmishes in the city but this is the first time Syrian airforce bombed the city (which is not ISIS control nor is it anywhere near the current front lines).

Exactly. so what in the world were US Special Forces "advisers" doing there. And why did the YPG launch an attack against a Syrian Army garrison just when they happen to have US Special Forces advisers embedded with them.

[Zippyjuan]

All of them illegal. None of them with the permission of Syria or the UN.

Kinda like Russia in the Ukraine? Were they invited by Ukraine or the UN?

[Zippyjuan]

Exactly. so what in the world were US Special Forces "advisers" doing there. And why did the YPG launch an attack against a Syrian Army garrison just when they happen to have US Special Forces advisers embedded with them.

What garrison was attacked following Syrians abducting the Kurdish youths? Also no indication that US forces were with the Kurds during the skirmish though they were in or near the city.

[Zippyjuan]

Interesting line in Chinese news on the events there- seems Russia has been supporting the Kurds against ISIS:


Buoyed by the support of the U.S.-led anti-terror coalition, the YPG and the allied Syrian Democratic Forces (SDF) have made sweeping victories against the Islamic State (IS) group, stripping the terror-designated militants of key areas in northern Syria.

The Russians were said to have also backed the Kurdish fighters in their push against the IS, but the Kurdish groups didn't disclose that, or admit receiving such support from Russia.

http://news.xinhuanet.com/english/2016-08/22/c_135621956.htm

Russia also called on Syria to stop their bombing of Hasakah and work on a truce which is now said to be in temporary force.

[AZJoe]

Kinda like Russia in the Ukraine? Were they invited by Ukraine or the UN?

Russia in the Ukraine. Are you nuts? There is no Russia in Crimea. Crimea is not part of Ukraine. It legally separated. The Ukraine government ceased to exists when the US backed coalition of neo-nazi groups overthrew the elected government.

The Russian naval base in Crimea has been there for decades. It was there before the Maidan rebels and after. They did not “invade” Crimea any more than the US just invaded Cuba because there is a US naval base there. Crimea was wholly independent politically with their own parliament and their own laws, and own leaders, attached to Ukraine merely by political boundary. Its people are overwhelmingly Russian.

When the Maidan revolution overthrew the elected government of Ukraine, the government ceased to exist. None of the regions were obligated to subjugate themselves to the revolutionaries any more than Americans would be obligated to subjugate themselves to an Occupy Wallstreet if they violently seized the Capitol. When the Ukraine government was overthrown by Washington revolutionaries, Ukraine did not exist.

Crimea voted by referendum overwhelmingly to part with the rebels in Kiev. That is their right. OSCE observed the election as well as media from all over the world. The people there are ecstatic to be parted from the Kiev regime. The people of Crimea are not out in the streets protesting the election. They aren’t demanding return to the Kiev junta. No, they are happy to be away from the Maidan rebels and Svoboda and Right Sector.

The Crimean people exercised their right to breakaway from the Washington Maidan rebels that overthrew their nation. With a voter turnout of 83.1 percent, the Crimeans voted 96.77% to dissolve the political bands that once connected them with Kiev. The people there are ecstatic to be parted from the Kiev regime. The people of Crimea are not out in the streets protesting the election. They aren’t demanding return to the Kiev junta. No, they are happy to be away from the Maidan rebels and Svoboda and Right Sector.

Likewise the people of Donetsk, Kharkov, Lugansk, all also have the same right to self-determination. The destruction of the elected government of Ukraine by the Maidan rebels, gives them the right to part ways. The government of Ukraine they once belonged to, exists no more. They have the right to self-determination and neither the US, nor Russia, nor EU, nor any nation should interfere with their right to self-determination. Just as the US parted ways from England, they have even greater justification to part from the Kiev Maidan rebel regime.

The only reason the incompetent Kiev regime refuses any diplomatic solution with the eastern provinces (independence, political independence, self-governing like Crimea had, etc) is because they perceive they are backed militarily, politically, fiscally by the giant – US government. If the US stopped interfering like a bull in a China shop, not only would none of these events ever transpired, but the Kiev Regime would already have been forced to sit down and establish a workable solution with the citizens in the East.

The US government has no consistent policy. They support independence movements if the political agenda can exploit it and oppose it if doing so fuels the US political elite’s agenda. The US supported independence of Kosovo. Where two weeks before changing policy the US listed the KLA Kosovo Liberation Army as the number one terrorist organization. Then simply took them off the list and supported their independence. Why? Simply because they wanted to poke a finger in the eye of Russia when they thought it was weak. Serbia was politically loyal to Russia. And the result? The US created the first and only openly Muslim based political government in the heart of Europe.

Sometimes Zippy, your blind loyalty to the disinformation campaign of neocon idiocy exceeds no bounds.

[Zippyjuan]

Likewise the people of Donetsk, Kharkov, Lugansk, all also have the same right to self-determination.

Just as the Kurds would like to do. Russia is aiding Eastern Ukraine (to forge a land bridge to Crimea) and US is aiding the Kurds.

[AZJoe]

What garrison was attacked following Syrians abducting the Kurdish youths? Also no indication that US forces were with the Kurds during the skirmish though they were in or near the city.

Uh, the Syrian forces that even Zippy recognizes were attacked, were the SAA garrison at Hasakah. That is the garrison. Think before leaping to the autonomic knee-jerk defense of neocons agenda.


"The current fight, however, grew far more serious, and seems to have involved Syrian Arab Army regulars garrisoned in Hasakah (where there has been a garrison for years), who called in for support from the Syrian Air Force to defend against “direct attacks on the SAA garrison and minority quarters.”
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2016/8/20/1562179/-Wading-Into-the-Quagmire-U-S-Jets-Sent-to-Hasakah-Syria


What "abducting" of Kurdish youths are you referring to? There are no names reported. No details at all. It smells of a false pretext. Even the article Zippy cites, merely refers to youths being detained by security. Well, tens of thousands of "youths" then are "abducted" on a daily basis in the USA by the Zippy standard. Just read the police blotter. But again, there are no details backing the Zippy referenced pretext for the all out attack on SAA.

[AZJoe]

Just as the Kurds would like to do. Russia is aiding Eastern Ukraine (to forge a land bridge to Crimea) and US is aiding the Kurds.


First there would be no civil war in Ukraine if the US government had not funded a coup overthrowing the Ukraine government in the first place. US assistant secretary of State Victoria Nuland admitted the US poured $5 billion into setting up this regime change. (The US with an $18 trillion official debt by magical government accounting and $75+ trillion actual debt by accounting methods required of you and me and everyone else, the government has no business pouring a single dime into any other nation’s politics). If Washington does not like the consequences of its actions, it should never have fostered the overthrow of the Ukraine government to begin with. Where the blame lies is with this idiotic NeoCon foreign policy implemented by Obama, Bush, Kerry, Clinton, McCain, etc. It’s intellectually defective.

Likewise,again, there would be no ISIS or civil war in Syria if Washington had not funded and fostered another "regime change" revolution, and armed and transplanted its Al Qaeda assets from Libya to Syria and on and on ...

If Washington does not like the consequences of its own actions, it should stop committing them. Maybe listen to Dr. Ron Paul or Thomas Jefferson.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CpmQa07WIAAqbPp.jpg

[Zippyjuan]

What "abducting" of Kurdish youths are you referring to?

Sorry- "detained" Kurdish youths.


Rami Abdulrahman, of the SOHR, said the fighting began this week after pro-government militiamen detained a number of Kurdish youths, a step that was followed by advances of Kurdish security forces towards government-held areas.


Al Jazeera on that report.

China news says both sides were detaining people.


Tension started last week, when both the NDF and Assayish arrested members of each other.

As tension grew bigger, the Kurdish militias demanded the dissolve of the NDF in Hasakah, a request denied by the Syrian army.

Later on, the Assayish started shelling the NDF positions inside Hasakah, prompting the Syrian army to respond with airstrikes for the first time, according to the source, who spoke on condition of anonymity.

The Assayish and the People Protection Units (YPG) said they will respond to the attacks of the Syrian forces, unleashing wide-scale offensives on the NDF positions inside the city of Hasakah.

The source said the Kurds couldn't advance in government-controlled areas, contrary to their claims that they have achieved that.

The Syrian artillery and airstrikes responded to the attempts of the Kurds to advance, he added.

They also say the Kurds didn't advance very far.

Your source notes:


Obviously, it is Reddit, so take things with a shaking of salt,

Link is not a news article.

[timosman]

If I recall there were a few US special ops there training Kurds . This training would be likely be Forward Observer training ( directing accurate mortar, artillary etc fire ).

Also demonstrating how to fire a gun at the enemy by firing a gun at the enemy.

[oyarde]

Also demonstrating how to fire a gun at the enemy by firing a gun at the enemy.

In that neck of the woods , I would imagine everyone knows how to shoot a rifle.