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enhanced_deficit
07-31-2016, 08:57 PM
Not good news for neocons/dronegansta/war criminals enabler/ 2-party scams lobbies:

https://i.ytimg.com/vi/DQ_-h30Xu9A/hqdefault.jpg


July 31, 2016, 03:22 pm
Third-party support surging
By Ben Kamisar

Voters now confronted with the choice between Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump are making something abundantly clear: they want another option.
Surveys over the last six weeks have found a steady but noticeable jump in support for third-party candidates. The biggest beneficiary has been Libertarian Gary Johnson, who has shot up from 4.5 percent to 7.2 percent in RealClearPolitics polling averages. Green Party candidate Jill Stein has also seen an uptick since June — from 2.5 percent to 3.5 percent.

The surge in support for a third-party candidate is adding a new element of unpredictability into the presidential race. Should voters opt for a third-party candidate in large numbers, it could potentially tip the scales in crucial battleground states.Pollsters and political scientists say the deep malcontent with Clinton and Trump should give both candidates pause.
“The fact that we have two major party candidates who are enormously disliked by the electorate, enormously and equally disliked, creates the opportunity for the minor party candidates to do better than they would in other presidential elections,” said Peter Brown, assistant director of the Quinnipiac University Poll.
“The minor party candidates can have great influence if the final race is very close.”
Pollsters contacted by The Hill predicted that many of the voters now leaning toward a third-party candidate would eventually side with Trump or Clinton by Election Day.
But they caution that the volatility of the race and the low favorability ratings for both candidates mean anything is possible.
So far, it’s unclear whether Trump or Clinton will benefit most from a strong third-party vote.
There are voters in each party who feel spurned by their party's ticket — Republicans who refuse to side with Trump, and Bernie Sanders (http://thehill.com/people/bernie-sanders) supporters who feel their candidate did not get a fair shake in the Democratic primary.
Conventional wisdom has held that votes for the Libertarian ticket would hurt Republicans, while Green Party votes would do damage to the Democrats.
That dynamic is borne out by recent polling. A CNN survey (http://i2.cdn.turner.com/cnn/2016/images/07/25/trump.clinton.poll.pdf) released last week found that 17 percent of Republican voters who didn’t back Trump in the primary now support Johnson, while only 4 percent of Democrats disgruntled with Clinton supported him. Stein, meanwhile, took 6 percent support among voters who backed Bernie Sanders in the Democratic primaries.
Monmouth’s poll from the start of the GOP convention also found Johnson pulling more from conservative voters than from liberals, while the reverse held true for Stein.


http://thehill.com/blogs/ballot-box/presidential-races/289859-third-party-support-surging


Could this be the historic year when a woman candidate for Presidency becomes the real possibility?

r3volution 3.0
07-31-2016, 09:57 PM
This is what it's all about for libertarians at this point.

The Presidency was lost on February 3rd when Rand dropped.

From that moment, it was 100% certain that a criminal or a retard (retarded criminal?) was going to be the next President.

Now, however, the question is, how much can we get?

If we get 5%, automatic ballot access.

...that's very good.

But, if we win a state....

...everything changes.

presence
07-31-2016, 10:14 PM
http://thehill.com/blogs/ballot-box/presidential-races/289859-third-party-support-surging


Voters now confronted with the choice between Hillary Clinton (http://thehill.com/people/hillary-clinton) and Donald Trump (http://thehill.com/people/donald-trump) are making something abundantly clear: they want another option.
Surveys over the last six weeks have found a steady but noticeable jump in support for third-party candidates. The biggest beneficiary has been Libertarian Gary Johnson (http://thehill.com/people/gary-johnson), who has shot up from 4.5 percent to 7.2 percent in RealClearPolitics polling averages. Green Party candidate Jill Stein has also seen an uptick since June — from 2.5 percent to 3.5 percent.
The surge in support for a third-party candidate is adding a new element of unpredictability into the presidential race. Should voters opt for a third-party candidate in large numbers, it could potentially tip the scales in crucial battleground states.Pollsters and political scientists say the deep malcontent with Clinton and Trump should give both candidates pause.
“The fact that we have two major party candidates who are enormously disliked by the electorate, enormously and equally disliked, creates the opportunity for the minor party candidates to do better than they would in other presidential elections,” said Peter Brown, assistant director of the Quinnipiac University Poll.

“The minor party candidates can have great influence if the final race is very close.”
Pollsters contacted by The Hill predicted that many of the voters now leaning toward a third-party candidate would eventually side with Trump or Clinton by Election Day.
But they caution that the volatility of the race and the low favorability ratings for both candidates mean anything is possible.
So far, it’s unclear whether Trump or Clinton will benefit most from a strong third-party vote.

There are voters in each party who feel spurned by their party's ticket — Republicans who refuse to side with Trump, and Bernie Sanders (http://thehill.com/people/bernie-sanders) supporters who feel their candidate did not get a fair shake in the Democratic primary.

Conventional wisdom has held that votes for the Libertarian ticket would hurt Republicans, while Green Party votes would do damage to the Democrats.

That dynamic is borne out by recent polling. A CNN survey (http://i2.cdn.turner.com/cnn/2016/images/07/25/trump.clinton.poll.pdf) released last week found that 17 percent of Republican voters who didn’t back Trump in the primary now support Johnson, while only 4 percent of Democrats disgruntled with Clinton supported him. Stein, meanwhile, took 6 percent support among voters who backed Bernie Sanders in the Democratic primaries.
Monmouth’s poll from the start of the GOP convention also found Johnson pulling more from conservative voters than from liberals, while the reverse held true for Stein.
But the numbers are far from cut-and-dry. Quinnipiac’s recent batch (http://www.qu.edu/news-and-events/quinnipiac-university-poll/2016-presidential-swing-state-polls/release-detail?ReleaseID=2365) of swing state polls found that Trump’s standing in the race against Clinton improved slightly when all four candidates were included.
Patrick Murray, the Monmouth University pollster who was the first to put Johnson on a national poll, said that he doesn’t think voters are viewing third-party support as an ideological choice.
Johnson has received significantly more media coverage than Stein, last week taking to cable news to tout the potential endorsement of 2012 GOP nominee Mitt Romney. Murray and other pollsters believe that he may be seen as the de-facto third-party candidate for those looking to lodge a protest vote.
“For those who really feel they cannot vote for either of the two major party nominees,
Johnson is nominally the most visible alternative,” Murray said.

“So people are just traveling there without thinking of ideology.”
Even with the uptick in the polls, most experts believe Johnson won't make the debate stage. He’d have to significantly up his average to 15 percent to qualify for the first general election debate in September.
But even if he falls short, third-party candidates have roiled election results winning far less of the vote share.
Ralph Nader’s “2.5 percent in Florida was almost certainly the deciding factor” in the 2000 general election, Murray noted.
“This is why the national polling isn’t all that important anyways, it’s state by state, how close are these states, what are these candidates doing, and are they polling disproportionately in the state?”

Johnson and Stein will likely perform better in some heavily partisan states where voters don’t feel that their vote will actually matter, but Johnson specifically is showing traction in some closer ones.
Utah is fertile ground for Johnson right now, as an internal poll (http://www.sltrib.com/news/4147893-155/trump-winning-utah-converts-but-has?fullpage=1) from Republican Rep. Mia Love’s campaign found him just 3 points behind Trump and 1 point behind Clinton, according to the Salt Lake Tribune.

And Johnson has scored in the high single digits in polls of Florida, Ohio and Pennsylvania while netting 10 percent in New Hampshire, according to recent Quinnipiac figures. And out of the swing states in the 2012 election where the final margin was within 7 percent, Johnson is pulling 4 percent in the Monmouth surveys.
That won’t be enough support to win the election, but it could be enough to tilt the scales.
As the race enters the home stretch, pollsters will be watching closely to see whether the third-party vote holds.
“The question is, can they bring themselves to vote for a campaign only for the purposes of protesting the ticket?” Brandon Rottinghaus, a University of Houston political scientist.
“You are going to look at their platforms and you’ll say, ‘This doesn’t match me at all.



Can I bring myself to do this simply out of spite?’ ”

LibertyEagle
07-31-2016, 10:18 PM
So vote for the retard, Johnson. Hell yeah! A real win for liberty.


================
Gary Johnson supports the Trans Pacific Partnership. That makes him a traitor.

Ender
07-31-2016, 10:20 PM
So vote for the retard, Johnson. Hell yeah! A real win for liberty.


================
Gary Johnson supports the Trans Pacific Partnership. That makes him a traitor.

Where is your educated argument? The one you always call for regarding Trump?

Natural Citizen
07-31-2016, 10:24 PM
Well. I certainly understand the protest vote. We saw record numbers during the 2014 Mid-Term elections that support this trend. If I'm going to vote in protest, though, I'd tend to do so in Liberty and in favor of the more principled candidate. And that would be the Constitution Party Candidate, Darrell Castle. Not Johnson.

surf
07-31-2016, 11:29 PM
Well. I certainly understand the protest vote. We saw record numbers during the 2014 Mid-Term elections that support this trend. If I'm going to vote in protest, though, I'd tend to do so in Liberty and in favor of the more principled candidate. And that would be the Constitution Party Candidate, Darrell Castle. Not Johnson.well thanks for pissing on my cheerios.

i'm just not sure why you'd waste your vote by voting for Castle though. that's a vote for Clinton! and don't forget that this is the most important election of your lifetime.

i'm joking. i'm trying to get folks to vote 3rd by telling them that if they don't - they are endorsing war. if they do, they favor peace. very much hoping we can get Johnson on a stage with those republicratic bumblefucks.

TheTexan
07-31-2016, 11:31 PM
Johnson may be too extreme libertarian for most people though

euphemia
08-01-2016, 01:29 AM
Darrell Castle.

cindy25
08-01-2016, 02:14 AM
the key number is 15% by Sept so Johnson (or Stein) get debate status. even though I lean Trump I would love to see Johnson in the debates, and even win a state

undergroundrr
08-01-2016, 05:51 AM
Darrell Castle is awesome. He's a great option for principled voters.

Strategically, I hope the protest vote goes to the LP. A vote for Castle is probably more likely to take from trump. A vote for Johnson has been repeatedly shown to be more likely to take from Clinton, while it would weaken the republicrat mandate just that bit and buttress third party support.

notsure
08-01-2016, 06:40 AM
...

Origanalist
08-01-2016, 06:41 AM
Johnson may be too extreme libertarian for most people though

He has anarchy written all over him.

Suzanimal
08-01-2016, 06:49 AM
Johnson may be too extreme libertarian for most people though


He has anarchy written all over him.

Good thing he has Weld to balance the ticket.

Origanalist
08-01-2016, 06:53 AM
Good thing he has Weld to balance the ticket.


You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Suzanimal again.///

CaptUSA
08-01-2016, 06:55 AM
How ironic is it that the first time the LP actually has a shot in the debates, real libertarians are fleeing the ticket as quickly as possible?

I suppose this was bound to happen. In order to make the LP palatable to the GOP and Dem faithful, they had to pick a Gary Johnson-type that pisses us off. <great>

So the LP becomes an alternative party that really isn't even an alternative anymore. Oh well, maybe if they can raise their cred a little, a real liberty candidate will be able to take the reins in a future election. I suppose it could help in lower level offices as well.

CaptUSA
08-01-2016, 06:55 AM
So vote for the retard, Johnson. Hell yeah! A real win for liberty.

And here we go again, with the Trump supporter criticizing Johnson... :rolleyes:

(FYI, we know why you're doing this and it has nothing to do with libertarian principles.)

notsure
08-01-2016, 07:04 AM
He has anarchy written all over him.

Forcing bakers to bake gay/nazi wedding cakes, TPP, Kony 2012; he's a real "rebel without a cause".

Occam's Banana
08-01-2016, 07:27 AM
A vote for Johnson has been repeatedly shown to be more likely to take from Clinton [...]

That claim is contradicted by the OP article:

Conventional wisdom has held that votes for the Libertarian ticket would hurt Republicans, while Green Party votes would do damage to the Democrats. That dynamic is borne out by recent polling. A CNN survey (http://i2.cdn.turner.com/cnn/2016/images/07/25/trump.clinton.poll.pdf) released last week found that 17 percent of Republican voters who didn’t back Trump in the primary now support Johnson, while only 4 percent of Democrats disgruntled with Clinton supported him.

Are there other credible polls indicating the reverse dynamic?

euphemia
08-01-2016, 07:49 AM
Johnson may be too extreme libertarian for most people though

He's not a libertarian.

euphemia
08-01-2016, 07:51 AM
Oh well, maybe if they can raise their cred a little

What cred? They were supposed to come up with good candidates. Epic fail, this time.

For true libertarians, the only option looks to be Castle, even if it's a write in.

Suzanimal
08-01-2016, 07:59 AM
He's not a libertarian.

That's why he picked Bill Weld. He's THE Libertarian.

Occam's Banana
08-01-2016, 08:18 AM
That's why he picked Bill Weld. He's THE Libertarian.

The ORIGINAL libertarian.

Or, no, wait ... the ORIGINAL Libertarian ... ?

(These things are so confusing ...)

euphemia
08-01-2016, 08:21 AM
That's why he picked Bill Weld. He's THE Libertarian.

No doubt.

What really bothers me is that there are people who think this is okay. They're like 90% libertarian. That's like saying a hamburger is 90% beef. What's the other 10%. If it's dog poop, guess what? You have yourself a poopburger.

CaptUSA
08-01-2016, 08:25 AM
No doubt.

What really bothers me is that there are people who think this is okay. They're like 90% libertarian. That's like saying a hamburger is 90% beef. What's the other 10%. If it's dog poop, guess what? You have yourself a poopburger.

Agreed. I think the hope is that if America tries a poopburger with a little less poop, they may want to try another one in the future. And that future burger may have even less poop. (Unfortunately, America has a pretty big appetite for poopburgers. They've been raised on them for generations.)

euphemia
08-01-2016, 08:37 AM
Agreed. I think the hope is that if America tries a poopburger with a little less poop, they may want to try another one in the future. And that future burger may have even less poop. (Unfortunately, America has a pretty big appetite for poopburgers. They've been raised on them for generations.)

That sounds very desperate.

CaptUSA
08-01-2016, 08:39 AM
That sounds very desperate.

I think that's the LP slogan.

Champuckett
08-01-2016, 09:18 AM
Johnson has been in the 9-13% range in 3 way polling over the last 3 months. He's going to have to do something more than what he has been doing because the numbers are pretty much flat lining in that range.

Jill Stein is also starting to pick up some momentum after the e-mail shenanigans and the Bernie debacle, which may end up hurting Johnson's numbers.

I'm beginning to think GJ isn't going to make the debates unless he changes strategy to get more people's attention and he does so immediately. Doing interviews where he comes across as awkward and stuttering and doesn't get the message out in a clean and concise way, is not helping him gain ground.

69360
08-01-2016, 10:32 AM
No doubt.

What really bothers me is that there are people who think this is okay. They're like 90% libertarian. That's like saying a hamburger is 90% beef. What's the other 10%. If it's dog poop, guess what? You have yourself a poopburger.

You see the glass half empty don't you?

A presidential candidate that is 90% good and you aren't satisfied? People like you will achieve nothing.

enhanced_deficit
08-01-2016, 10:36 AM
So vote for the retard, Johnson. Hell yeah! A real win for liberty.


================
Gary Johnson supports the Trans Pacific Partnership. That makes him a traitor.


To be clear, I'm by no means suggesting anyone should support Johnson and I'm not convinced about him either.

Will be finding out more about Jill Stein, the historic first woman candidate of GP that media is doing balckout of.

BTW, 3rd party spike seems to be being driven by anti-war Bernie supporters and seems to be hurting neocon's preferred puppet SWC Hillary most. This is a good development for many reasons overall.


https://www.peoplespunditdaily.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/07/US-Presidential-Election-Daily-Tracking-Poll-7-29-2016.png

undergroundrr
08-01-2016, 11:49 AM
Are there other credible polls indicating the reverse dynamic?

Yeah, when it first happened a few months ago, I thought it was an isolated thing, but it keeps happening.

Note that the first couple come from "news sources" that would probably rather Clinton won:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/gary-johnson-trump-clinton-polls_us_5798e0d2e4b01180b5312ad2

Clinton loses over 4 percentage points to Johnson, going from 43.9 percent in questions without any explicit mention of him to 39.6 percent with the Libertarian in the picture. Trump drops more than 3 points, from 42.6 percent to 39.2 percent, when Johnson is a named option in the poll.

http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/election-update-is-gary-johnson-taking-more-support-from-clinton-or-trump/

The majority of pollsters (12) have Clinton’s margin over Trump shrinking when at least one third-party candidate is included. The difference in margins, however, varies among pollsters, and a few, such as Ipsos, have Clinton’s lead rising by the tiniest of bits when at least Johnson is included. Overall, including third-party candidates takes about 1 percentage point away from Clinton’s margin, on average.

http://www.breitbart.com/2016-presidential-race/2016/06/01/libertarian-johnson-will-likely-hurt-clinton-trump/

Quinnipiac University released a poll on Wednesday showing a general election toss-up, with Clinton holding a slight four point edge over Trump, 45-41. When third party candidates Gary Johnson and the Green Party’s Jill Stein were added, Clinton’s edge dropped to two points, 40-38. Johnson captured 5 percent, while Stein earned 3 percent.

A little unrelated but:
http://www.oregonlive.com/today/index.ssf/2016/07/gary_johnson_could_snatch_the.html

This is where Johnson comes in. The New York Times' 269-269 election tie has Utah going for Trump. But an internal poll for a Republican congresswoman in the state has Johnson at 26 percent there, just a few points behind Trump and Clinton. In a normal year, Utah is a safe Republican state. But Mormon voters really don't like Trump (2012 GOP presidential nominee Mitt Romney, a Mormon, famously lambasted him earlier this year), so Johnson really could win in Utah.

jllundqu
08-01-2016, 11:51 AM
h/t Angela

https://scontent-ord1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-0/s526x395/13876400_1095470030527634_2794545712981904421_n.jp g?oh=a2cb1cbef9aca106e363b016b4fe4ac8&oe=5825B5B9

presence
08-01-2016, 05:38 PM
Will be finding out more about Jill Stein, the historic first woman candidate of GP that media is doing balckout of.

..


http://d3n8a8pro7vhmx.cloudfront.net/themes/573d49c578b8e28113000001/attachments/original/1463664223/signature_jill_8.png?1463664223
Key points of the Power to the People Plan:
A Green New Deal:
Create millions of jobs by transitioning to 100% clean renewable energy by 2030, and investing in public transit, sustainable agriculture, and conservation.

Jobs as a Right:
Create living-wage jobs for every American who needs work, replacing unemployment offices with employment offices. Advance workers rights to form unions, achieve workplace democracy, and keep a fair share of the wealth they create.
End Poverty:
Guarantee economic human rights, including access to food, water, housing, and utilities, with effective anti-poverty programs to ensure every American a life of dignity.

Health Care as a Right:
Establish an improved “Medicare For All” single-payer public health insurance program to provide everyone with quality health care, at huge savings.
Education as a Right:
Abolish student debt to free a generation of Americans from debt servitude. Guarantee tuition-free, world-class public education from pre-school through university. End high stakes testing and public school privatization.
A Just Economy: Set a $15/hour federal minimum wage. Break up “too-big-to-fail” banks and democratize the Federal Reserve. Reject gentrification as a model of economic development. Support development of worker and community cooperatives and small businesses. Make Wall Street, big corporations, and the rich pay their fair share of taxes. Create democratically run public banks and utilities. Replace corporate trade agreements with fair trade agreements.

Protect Mother Earth:
Lead on a global treaty to halt climate change. End destructive energy extraction: fracking, tar sands, offshore drilling, oil trains, mountaintop removal, and uranium mines. Protect our public lands, water supplies, biological diversity, parks, and pollinators. Label GMOs, and put a moratorium on GMOs and pesticides until they are proven safe. Protect the rights of future generations.

Racial Justice Now: End police brutality and mass incarceration. Create a Truth and Reconciliation Commission to understand and eliminate the legacy of slavery that lives on as pervasive racism in the economy, education, housing and health. Ensure that communities control their police rather than police controlling our communities, by establishing police review boards and full time investigators to look in to all cases of death in police custody. Demilitarize the police.

Freedom and Equality: Expand women’s rights, protect LGBTQIA+ people from discrimination, defend indigenous rights and lands, and create a welcoming path to citizenship for immigrants. Protect the free Internet, legalize marijuana/hemp, and treat substance abuse as a public health problem, not a criminal problem.

Justice for All:
Restore our Constitutional rights, terminate unconstitutional surveillance and unwarranted spying, end persecution of government and media whistleblowers, close Guantanamo, abolish secret kill lists, and repeal indefinite detention without charge or trial.

Peace and Human Rights:
Establish a foreign policy based on diplomacy, international law, and human rights. End the wars and drone attacks, cut military spending by at least 50% and close the 700+ foreign military bases that are turning our republic into a bankrupt empire. Stop U.S. support and arms sales to human rights abusers, and lead on global nuclear disarmament.
Empower the People: Abolish corporate personhood. Protect voters’ rights by establishing a constitutional right to vote. Enact electoral reforms that break the big money stranglehold and create truly representative democracy: public campaign financing, ranked-choice voting, proportional representation, and open debates.

bunklocoempire
08-02-2016, 03:31 PM
He has anarchy written all over him.

lol

Yeah, and it's all written in a delicious frosting piped in a 100% consistent manner on his jacket by gay nazis... er, I mean, sinful individuals given the power over other sinful men.

Friggin' Johnson.

enhanced_deficit
08-02-2016, 05:27 PM
#JillNotHill is spreading fast and remaking the liberal/anti-war landscape ahead of coming elections. Many Bernie supporters are moving to Jill Stein, a new kind of 3rd party candidate who is rising fast. Not good news for war lobbies/Hillary:

https://twitter.com/search?f=tweets&vertical=news&q=%23jillnothill&src =typd

(https://twitter.com/search?f=tweets&vertical=news&q=%23jillnothill&src=typd)







http://rlv.zcache.com/jill_not_hill_2016_bumper_sticker-r53112ca9224b4022ae4b68c8cb0620c2_v9wht_8byvr_324. jpghttps://scontent.cdninstagram.com/t51.2885-15/s320x320/e35/13724588_629406613887920_1427361179_n.jpg?ig_cache _key=MTMwNTQyMDU0ODExNzIzOTAwNw%3D%3D.2


https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/236x/6b/5e/93/6b5e930e0e1146884f0296d2109a9611.jpg

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/236x/62/5b/1a/625b1ad3d049fd65ed55a38b64e5a87b.jpg

Son_of_Liberty90
08-03-2016, 02:48 AM
Health Care as a Right:


Establish an improved “Medicare For All” single-payer public health insurance program to provide everyone with quality health care, at huge savings.
Education as a Right:


Abolish student debt to free a generation of Americans from debt servitude. Guarantee tuition-free, world-class public education from pre-school through university. End high stakes testing and public school privatization.

This is why the Bernie Sanders ppl are moving to this camp. But if it takes votes away from HRC, then I guess A+

Son_of_Liberty90
08-03-2016, 02:49 AM
Johnson has been in the 9-13% range in 3 way polling over the last 3 months. He's going to have to do something more than what he has been doing because the numbers are pretty much flat lining in that range.

Jill Stein is also starting to pick up some momentum after the e-mail shenanigans and the Bernie debacle, which may end up hurting Johnson's numbers.

I'm beginning to think GJ isn't going to make the debates unless he changes strategy to get more people's attention and he does so immediately. Doing interviews where he comes across as awkward and stuttering and doesn't get the message out in a clean and concise way, is not helping him gain ground.

Yea, he needs to pick up steam

Zippyjuan
08-03-2016, 04:20 AM
This is why the Bernie Sanders ppl are moving to this camp. But if it takes votes away from HRC, then I guess A+

She is only getting about six percent of Sander's supporters so far. http://thehill.com/blogs/ballot-box/presidential-races/289859-third-party-support-surging That isn't that much.


That dynamic is borne out by recent polling. A CNN survey released last week found that 17 percent of Republican voters who didn’t back Trump in the primary now support Johnson, while only 4 percent of Democrats disgruntled with Clinton support him. Stein, meanwhile, took 6 percent support among voters who backed Sanders in the Democratic primaries.

H. E. Panqui
08-03-2016, 05:32 AM
enhanced deficit writes: #JillNotHill is spreading fast and remaking the liberal/anti-war landscape ahead of coming elections. Many Bernie supporters are moving to Jill Stein, a new kind of 3rd party candidate who is rising fast. Not good news for war lobbies/Hillary:

:)

...good points...not good news for trump or the stinking republicans either as their proposed 'defense' :rolleyes: budget$ are the same/larger than those supported by democrats...

...i sense a lot of people here favor the miserable goddamned fools/puppets with r's after there names over the 'd' village idiots...

....i will note that there appeared to be a sizable % of the recent democrat convention delegates who were passionately expressing a yearning for "NO MORE WARS"...(yeah, i know..naive...part of the problem themselves...yada...

...i will also note i didn't hear any "no more war" from that bunch of goddamned fool republican trumpencees....

...btw, 'The Libertarian Party Inc.' is a somewhat tiny organization that could be/has been easily manipulated/dominated..if i'm not mistaken there are less than 1000 people nationwide who 'make the major decisions' every 4 year cycle...essentially...as i understand, my state and many other states have many unfilled delegate slots every year...i've been asked and turned it down..i'm part of the problem...

clint4liberty
08-13-2016, 05:34 PM
Gary Johnson has called for at least reforming the TPP.