Thoughts on Illegal Immigration & Birthright Citizenship

[srps2233]

How can a libertarian be against hiring illegal immigrants? I thought free trade and voluntary exchange was a good thing.If someone can provide a service in exchange for something else, why should the government be involved? Freedom applies to everyone, not just someone who pops out of the womb at a specific latitude. The idea that illegal immigrants "take our jobs" is preposterous and nothing short of protectionism and xenophobia. It presumes that the jobs are collectively owned, which is absurd. Those jobs are owned by specific companies and as the owners they should be allowed to give them away to whoever they want, without the government getting involved. If a thief steals from you and gives it to someone else, why punish the recipient instead of the thief (the government)? As long as someone isn't being violent and pays for their own services or accepts freely offered ones, why should they be prohibited from entering the country, or forced out if they have already entered it? I think if Dr Paul would pardon IRS offenders he could very well pardon these nonviolent offenders who just happened to be born on the wrong side of an imaginary line.

Regarding birthright citizenship, I got my citizenship the easy way: By doing literally, absolutely nothing. By existing. I, like most babies and children , was basically a leech until I started paying taxes. How are children of illegal immigrants born in this country any different, again? That my parents were citizens is irrelevant -- that is completely antithetical to the concept of individual rights. I shouldn't have an advantage because of my ancestors. Either dismantle the system completely and make everyone apply for citizenship when they pay taxes (sales tax I suppose), or allow everyone citizenship at birth because they are all equally leeches. Mix-and-matching is illogical, hypocritical, and anti-individualist.

I don't mean for this to sound too aggressive, I support Dr. Paul and this is really one of the few things I disagree with him on ideologically. It's been bothering me so much that I had register to get some input from other libertarians.

[JosephTheLibertarian]

How can a libertarian be against hiring illegal immigrants? I thought free trade and voluntary exchange was a good thing.If someone can provide a service in exchange for something else, why should the government be involved? Freedom applies to everyone, not just someone who pops out of the womb at a specific latitude. The idea that illegal immigrants "take our jobs" is preposterous and nothing short of protectionism and xenophobia. It presumes that the jobs are collectively owned, which is absurd. Those jobs are owned by specific companies and as the owners they should be allowed to give them away to whoever they want, without the government getting involved. If a thief steals from you and gives it to someone else, why punish the recipient instead of the thief (the government)? As long as someone isn't being violent and pays for their own services or accepts freely offered ones, why should they be prohibited from entering the country, or forced out if they have already entered it? I think if Dr Paul would pardon IRS offenders he could very well pardon these nonviolent offenders who just happened to be born on the wrong side of an imaginary line.

Regarding birthright citizenship, I got my citizenship the easy way: By doing literally, absolutely nothing. By existing. I, like most babies and children , was basically a leech until I started paying taxes. How are children of illegal immigrants born in this country any different, again? That my parents were citizens is irrelevant -- that is completely antithetical to the concept of individual rights. I shouldn't have an advantage because of my ancestors. Either dismantle the system completely and make everyone apply for citizenship when they pay taxes (sales tax I suppose), or allow everyone citizenship at birth because they are all equally leeches. Mix-and-matching is illogical, hypocritical, and anti-individualist.

I don't mean for this to sound too aggressive, I support Dr. Paul and this is really one of the few things I disagree with him on ideologically. It's been bothering me so much that I had register to get some input from other libertarians.

It's all economics. Welfare subsidizes immigration, it's not the same healthy immigration we saw in the 19th century. I think states should control it. Anyway.. look at the party Ron Paul is running for, do you think he would have a chance in hell if he were pro open borders? Use some common sense.

[specsaregood]

Ron Paul has said, that ideologically he would be for open borders on immigration. BUT that we can not have that as long as we have a welfare state.

Ending birthright citizenship would NOT affect anybody here legally, and would remove a MAJOR reason for illegals to come here. This is not an unusual position, very few countries offer birthright citizenship.

[Bradley in DC]

Welcome. :)

[Bryan]

I agree with the caveat that this doesn't consider the massive problems with our method of natural resource ownership (which could very well lead us to civil war).

I say this because it's impossible to talk about jobs without natural resources since they are a major part of the equation of wealth generation (other parts being labor and skill.)

Welcome to the forum!

[sharedvoice]

How can a libertarian be against hiring illegal immigrants? I thought free trade and voluntary exchange was a good thing.

Being Libertarian does not mean that you should support illegal immigration because of the free-trade concept.
Illegal immigration infringes national sovereignty, and encroaches civil liberties of a sovereign people. Besides it is unfair to those who abide by the rules.


If someone can provide a service in exchange for something else, why should the government be involved?

While, your intentions may be good. The business of promoting illegal immigration for profit is not always culturally and socially beneficial, or even ethical in some cases.

The fact is Illegal immigrants do take jobs, saturate labor markets, and effectively drive wages down. Not to mention, cost taxpayers billions of dollars each year to fund welfare programs that could otherwise provide for our own citizens.

Promoting illegal immigration is not only fiscally irresponsible, but also dangerous. It advocates a welfare state, and invigorates the current tax system

While I do understand the humanitarian element, it is important to understand that dependency is not the answer to the world's problems.


I think if Dr Paul would pardon IRS offenders he could very well pardon these nonviolent offenders who just happened to be born on the wrong side of an imaginary line.

Imaginary line? Perhaps in a Utopia somewhere, but we are far from being “Koom Ba Yah” land. Don't know about you, but I kinda like being called the United States of America, not“United States of the Americas”, NAFA, or NAU.

What can I say, call me traditionalist.