If Trump was really a racist, would Ben Carson have endorsed him?

[enhanced_deficit]

Would Ben Carson, who is African-American, have endorsed him if Trump was really a racist?

Resting the case for time being.

[timosman]

Define racist. ;)

[CPUd]

Not all people agree, but must wait until MSM completes their investigation and all the facts come out.



Trump Model: Felt Like 'Slave' Working for Donald's Agency


A Jamaican-born fashion model is taking on Donald Trump, saying the modeling agency owned by the presidential candidate lured her to New York to work at age 17 with the promise of riches and fame and then treated her “like a slave.”

The model, Alexia Palmer, said in a lawsuit against the agency that she received only $3,880 plus cash advances totaling $1,100 over a three year period, even though Trump Model Management filed immigration documents to obtain a special work visa, called an H-1B, for Palmer, certifying she would work “full-time” and earn $75,000 a year.

“That’s what slavery people do,” Palmer told ABC News. “You work and don’t get no money.” The agency took 80 percent of her earnings as expenses and fees but only found her 21 shoots over three years. And under the terms of her visa, she could not work anywhere else if she wanted to stay in the U.S.

https://i.imgur.com/e31soEX.jpg
...

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/trump-model-felt-slave-working-donalds-agency/story?id=37313993

[RJ Liberty]

Would Ben Carson, who is African-American, have endorsed him if Trump was really a racist?


After WWI, Many Jews supported Hitler (http://www.answers.com/Q/Did_some_Jews_vote_for_Hitler). This didn't mean that Hitler wasn't racist.

I'm not saying Drumpf is racist, but pointing out that an African American supports Drumpf doesn't mean Drumpf's not racist.

[phill4paul]

I don't care if he is a racist. It's mostly that he is an establishment-authoritarian that bothers me.

[Root]

Who cares?

[bubbleboy]

Ever heard of 'House Maid'?

[kahless]

Define racist. ;)

In this forum there is a contingent that uses that term to describe any one that does this: (pick one) :D

- Discusses the details of Ron or Rand's immigration policies without saying it is actually Rand and Ron's immigration policy.
- That discusses the merits of the Trump-Sessions immigration policy.
- Does not support black lives matter.
- Did not support the looters and rioters in Ferguson.
- Does not support open borders.

[EBounding]

It's so great that he's endorsed a pedophile (his words).

[cajuncocoa]

Endorsements don't matter.

[kahless]

Ben Carson to endorse Donald Trump
http://www.cnn.com/2016/03/10/politics/ben-carson-to-endorse-donald-trump/


Former presidential candidate Ben Carson will endorse Donald Trump, the real estate mogul said Thursday during the GOP presidential debate hosted by CNN, handing Trump an important boost heading into next week's "Super Tuesday 3."

Carson, a retired neurosurgeon, ended his own White House campaign last week after failing to win a single primary contest. Trump is scheduled to hold a press conference Friday at 9 a.m. ET at the Mar-a-Lago club in Palm Beach, Florida. During the debate, Trump answered a question related to education by adding that Carson is "endorsing me, by the way, tomorrow morning."

[farreri]

Would Ben Carson, who is African-American, have endorsed him if Trump was really a racist?
How would Carson know if Trump was careful to not be an overt racist?

[Antischism]

If people can be racist towards others of their own "race," what makes you think Ben Carson endorsing Trump would have any bearing on him being/not being a racist? It's like that "one of my best friends is black!" defense: it's meaningless. You should have really thought this through before pushing the "Submit New Thread" button.

[AuH20]

Racist? Is this really an issue in the election in 2016? Jesus Christ, please save us.

[nikcers]

Would Ben Carson lie in order to make money?

[misterx]

You can't really say that. Carson doesn't know what's in Trump's head any more than we do. I did notice that Trump was the only candidate who treated Carson like an equal at the latter debates. That's one reason I was expecting this endorsement.

[CPUd]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=24gx0SMep6A

[kahless]

You can't really say that. Carson doesn't know what's in Trump's head any more than we do. I did notice that Trump was the only candidate who treated Carson like an equal at the latter debates. That's one reason I was expecting this endorsement.

Possible VP pick down the road.

[misterx]

Possible VP pick down the road.

It wouldn't surprise me. Strategically it makes sense to deflect the racism charge that the Democrats always use, and they will triple down on it with Trump. It also could help somewhat with taking Michigan.

[kahless]

It wouldn't surprise me. Strategically it makes sense to deflect the racism charge that the Democrats always use, and they will triple down on it with Trump. It also could help somewhat with taking Michigan.

I agree and think Trump will likely get more of the African American vote than Republicans normally receive, with Carson even more. Just too bad for Trump that, Carson is not a Mexican, Muslim women and LGBT. ;)

[Origanalist]

I have a better question. Have the forums really devolved so much to have a thread with such a stupid question?

[Ronin Truth]

I'd hafta say very doubtful, for Ben.

[Ronin Truth]

I have a better question. Have the forums really devolved so much to have a thread with such a stupid question?

Start a new thread with that question as the title.

[Libertas Aut Mortis]

Would Ben Carson, who is African-American, have endorsed him if Trump was really a racist?

Resting the case for time being.

You should read "The Strange Career of Jim Crowe", racism has nothing to do with advocating for the political benefit of others. You can be racist and advocate for the benefit of minorities if it helps you politically (Johnson) of you can be a minority and vote for or advocate for racists if they will benefit you (Johnson again)...but there are many examples in the book, I recommend it.

[69360]

Trump was never racist. He pretends to be racist in order to get racists to vote for him. That's even worse IMO. Carson was this cycle's token negro.

[juleswin]

This comes from the same file that contains the phrase "I can't be sexists against women because my mom is a woman". I have to say you make some of the weirdest post on this forum. First of all who on this forum is this directed to? I have never heard anyone give racism as a reason for not supporting Trump. And even if he was racist, who cares? he is still an authoritarian big govt, Clinton mole, zionist, friends with pedorapist billionaires, establishment politicians which is 1000x worse than just being a racist.

As for Ben Carson, the man is trying so hard to pander to alternative right voters that he would do anything to get their support. I don't think race has anything to do with his endorsement, he is just trying to sell his brand to a new demographic.

[GunnyFreedom]

Thread title is a blatant non sequitur. It does not follow that Trump's status as a racist or a not-racist would necessarily have any impact whatsoever on Carson's endorsement or not-endorsement of Trump.

The sky is blue and raspberry ice cream is blue, therefore the sky must taste like raspberry ice cream. If Bill were a pastrymaker and Bob were diabetic, then Bob would never eat anything Bill made. (nevermind Bill makes sugar free desserts and also a darn good Texas chili.)

Jiminy Crickets, it's like you have to go and get a logic lobotomy immediately upon a declaration of support for this Trump guy. SMDH

[Mr.NoSmile]

...I actually can't believe this is a post. I think any of us care less what Trump thinks of certain people, but really, to go 'He got a famous Black politician to endorse him, so he's obviously not racist' is just...really?

[laurak]

Would Ben Carson, who is African-American, have endorsed him if Trump was really a racist?

Resting the case for time being.

Apply the same reasoning to David Duke's Trump endorsement or lack thereof, the ludicrousness will shine through..

[kahless]

Apply the same reasoning to David Duke's Trump endorsement or lack thereof, the ludicrousness will shine through..

People will make the comparison regardless when there is none. Carson is a prominent national figure, from a competing campaign, for which Trump held a press conference for his endorsement. As opposed to Duke, Trump did not even know he was endorsed by Duke when asked the question and then disavowed the endorsement.

[MelissaWV]

I don't care which of them is racist, Christian, old, left-handed, misogynist, or any number of things. I care whether or not they will impose those views on us via legislation/executive order.

And yeah, as others have explained, "I have a black friend!" doesn't automatically make you not racist.

[GunnyFreedom]

People will make the comparison regardless when there is none. Carson is a prominent national figure, from a competing campaign, for which Trump held a press conference for his endorsement. As opposed to Duke, Trump did not even know he was endorsed by Duke when asked the question and then disavowed the endorsement.

And yet Trump seemed to know exactly who Duke was when he denounced him in 1991 and again in 2000. Along comes 2016 and we are supposed to believe that Trump no longer recognized the man?

Is Trump a liar or just senile?

Why would either of those options make a good President?

[kahless]

And yet Trump seemed to know exactly who Duke was when he denounced him in 1991 and again in 2000. Along comes 2016 and we are supposed to believe that Trump no longer recognized the man?

Is Trump a liar or just senile?

Why would either of those options make a good President?

Do you even realize you are using the same baseless race baiting tactics of the left and the media have used in the past against the Ron and Rand? You could practically remove Trump from your post and insert Rand or Ron and newsletters, CRA, etc.

Never thought I would see the day that it would be used here rather than debate his policy positions. It reeks of desperation.

Evidently Ron agrees.

Ron Paul: The Trump KKK Controversy Is A Media Plant
http://dailycaller.com/2016/03/01/ron-paul-the-trump-kkk-controversy-is-a-media-plant-video/#ixzz42cy288We



Former Rep. Ron Paul says the Donald Trump/Ku Klux Klan controversy “has to be a plant by the media.”

In an interview with CNN’s Carol Costello on Tuesday, Paul said, “It’s interesting the media is able to create the issue, the Ku Klux Klan. You know, I don’t even know if there’s 100 people in the country that even know about it.”
Costello asked Paul about his thoughts regarding Trump, David Duke, and the Ku Klux Klan, and Paul said, “Well, it’s pretty amazing. … Of course it has to be condemned, but why are people able to bring this up? No politician would want it to be brought up. So it has to be, you know, a plant by the media to instigate it and try to make accusations.”

“Let’s blame them and let’s blame the media for tracking him. But the whole thing is is why did it come up? Sure, we can blame Donald Trump. I blame him for everything else, so blame him, but how did this become the issue of the day? The first question you asked on Super Tuesday is the Ku Klux Klan. This is unbelievable to me. This has been condemned, and they have been marginalized. Nobody cares about them. They’re evil, they’re monsters, and yet now it’s going to be the issue of the day,” Paul said.

The issue of the day should instead be “how in the world do these things occur?” Paul asked. “Why aren’t we talking about the military industrial complex, the Federal Reserve, the deficits, the intrusion of our privacy and all the intrusions of our liberties, which are never touched? The protectionism that’s going on and presented, this socialism versus national populism — those are the issues, but today it’s the Ku Klux Klan.”

[GunnyFreedom]

Do you even realize you are using the same baseless race baiting tactics of the left and the media have used in the past against the Ron and Rand? You could practically remove Trump from your post and insert Rand or Ron and newsletters, CRA, etc.

Never thought I would see the day that it would be used here rather than debate his policy positions. It reeks of desperation.

Evidently Ron agrees.

Ron Paul: The Trump KKK Controversy Is A Media Plant
http://dailycaller.com/2016/03/01/ron-paul-the-trump-kkk-controversy-is-a-media-plant-video/#ixzz42cy288We

I am just as rational as I have been since 2007. You on the other hand have completely lost your mind. To me, this is 100% proof that Trump rots the brain. If you will try using your words and actually reading what I wrote (I know, that is so very hard for you) then you would see that I in no way, shape, or form implied or indicated that Trump is a racist. For the record, I do not believe Trump is a racist, I believe that he is cynically using racists to get himself elected. In fact I demonstrated conclusively that he was either lying or senile, and the way I formed the argument, the fact of whether he is or is not a racist was left completely irrelevant.

I do understand that basic English comprehension becomes problematic for Trumpaloompas. Y'all have proven time and time again that supporting that guy totally rots the brain, but what I wrote should have been accessible to your average 3rd grader. You people are reaching new lows every day in your desperation to support an authoritarian tyrant and convince those of us who still have brains that this will somehow be good for liberty.

Now if you are done swatting down your own strawmen, you may proceed to address what I actually said....providing that you are capable of at least a 3rd grade reading comprehension and can actually comprehend what i wrote.

[juleswin]

Just so everything knows what Kahles and Gunny are talking about

Trump said this about David Duke in 1991


King, Nov. 19, 1991: Did the David Duke thing bother you? Fifty-five percent of the whites in Louisiana voted for him.

Trump: I hate —

King: Four hundred New Yorkers contributed.

Trump: I hate seeing what it represents, but I guess it just shows there’s a lot of hostility in this country. There’s a tremendous amount of hostility in the United States.


And in 2000


Lauer, Feb. 14, 2000: When you say the party is self-destructing, what do you see as the biggest problem with the Reform Party right now?

Trump: Well, you’ve got David Duke just joined — a bigot, a racist, a problem. I mean, this is not exactly the people you want in your party. Buchanan’s a disaster as we’ve, you know, covered. Jesse’s a terrific guy who just left the party. And he, you know, it’s unfortunate, but he just left the party. He’s going to be doing his Independence Party from Minnesota.


Also you have this about Trump and the reform party


How Roger Stone and Donald Trump destroyed George W. Bush’s potential rivals in 2000 is less well known. That year, George W. Bush faced two known threats, and Roger Stone was tasked with neutralizing them: Pat Buchanan, whose 1992 run nearly crippled Bush’s father in the primaries; and Ross Perot’s Reform Party, which drained enough votes in ’92 and ’96 to ensure Clinton victories.

So in the lead-up to the 2000 election, Roger Stone cleverly cajoled Pat Buchanan into taking control of Perot’s Reform Party, then used his friend Donald Trump to run a rival campaign against Buchanan for the Reform Party candidacy—only to drop out of the race, and attack Buchanan’s Reform Party as a cesspool full of Hitler lovers and racists. Stone inserted moles like William Von Raab, secretly funded by Trump, into Buchanan’s campaign, according to the Village Voice.

The operation wound up destroying the Reform Party’s brand and burying it for good, stinking it up too much for a late entry by Ross Perot. The Reform Party’s chairman, Pat Choate, called the “Trump/Stone operation” a “Republican dirty trick” meant to “disgust people and drive them away from the Reform Party. They were doing everything in their power to make a mess.”

The point, however, is that it worked: The Reform Party and Pat Buchanan caused no damage whatsoever to George W. Bush’s election bid in 2000, unlike Ralph Nader’s effect on Al Gore’s run.

There's more to this story, including the fact that Ross Perot turned his back on Pat over Israel and sought to destroy him. But this is part of what happened in 2000.

Even the most optimistic view of Trump pales behind what Pat Buchanan could have done in a fair fight.

http://www.philstockworld.com/2015/08/13/behind-the-scenes-of-the-donald-trump-roger-stone-show/

More on the story:
http://www.villagevoice.com/news/the-sex-scandal-that-put-bush-in-the-white-house-6407173

and:

http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/2015/07/buchanan-trump-embrace-recalls-2000-reform-party-race/

[klamath]

I am just as rational as I have been since 2007. You on the other hand have completely lost your mind. To me, this is 100% proof that Trump rots the brain. If you will try using your words and actually reading what I wrote (I know, that is so very hard for you) then you would see that I in no way, shape, or form implied or indicated that Trump is a racist. For the record, I do not believe Trump is a racist, I believe that he is cynically using racists to get himself elected. In fact I demonstrated conclusively that he was either lying or senile, and the way I formed the argument, the fact of whether he is or is not a racist was left completely irrelevant.

I do understand that basic English comprehension becomes problematic for Trumpaloompas. Y'all have proven time and time again that supporting that guy totally rots the brain, but what I wrote should have been accessible to your average 3rd grader. You people are reaching new lows every day in your desperation to support an authoritarian tyrant and convince those of us who still have brains that this will somehow be good for liberty.

Now if you are done swatting down your own strawmen, you may proceed to address what I actually said....providing that you are capable of at least a 3rd grade reading comprehension and can actually comprehend what i wrote.Exactly Gunny.

[GunnyFreedom]

Ever heard of 'House Maid'?

LOL Negging people because they won't worship your boy Trump eh? Typical for you lot.

[misterx]

LOL Negging people because they won't worship your boy Trump eh? Typical for you lot.

Not really. I generally don't neg unless negged.

[GunnyFreedom]

Not really. I generally don't neg unless negged.

I was talking to bubbleboy, and I have received my share of negs from all of you Trumpaloompas.

[misterx]

I was talking to bubbleboy, and I have received my share of negs from all of you Trumpaloompas.

lol at least you came up with a funnier name than **********s. That one was getting old.

[CPUd]

There is a hierarchy:

**********s
--Trumpsuckers
----Trumpaloompas

[enhanced_deficit]

Define racist. ;)

This will need to defined by those calling Trump "racist", see news headlines copied below.


I don't care if he is a racist. It's mostly that he is an establishment-authoritarian that bothers me.

If Trumpster is establishment, why both GOP/Dem/neocon estblishments are peeing in their pants in dspair/fear?
Authoritarian he could be and probably would lean towards being if won.


Ever heard of 'House Maid'?



Trump was never racist. He pretends to be racist in order to get racists to vote for him. That's even worse IMO. Carson was this cycle's token negro.

Carson has been called such terms by some Obama supporters/left wing types but on the Right he is highly respected, upright role model.
Need to learn more about facts fueling such characterizations for once GOP pack leaders like Ben Carson/Herman Cain.



Racist? Is this really an issue in the election in 2016? Jesus Christ, please save us.

It apparetly is at least for some:


Watch Mac Miller 'Whitesplain' to 'Racist F--kwad' Donald TrumpRollingStone.com‎ - 1 day ago

Of course, Donald Trump's a racist, but Clinton and Sanders are wise enough to know slinging that mud will only make ...Salon‎ - 2 days ago

Rapper Mac Miller: 'Racist' Trump Wants to 'Make America White Again'Breitbart News‎ - 1 day ago

John Legend (@johnlegend)
47 mins ago - View on Twitter
Yes, Trump trolls. I'm the real racist.


Here Are 9 Examples Of Donald Trump Being Racist
www.huffingtonpost.com/.../donald-trump-racist-ex (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/.../donald-trump-racist-ex)...
The Huffington Post
Feb 29, 2016 -


'SNL' parody: Racists for Trump - CNN Video - CNN.com
www.cnn.com/.../snl-donald-trump-parody-ad-ra...CNN (http://www.cnn.com/.../snl-donald-trump-parody-ad-ra...CNN)
5 days ago


Just Call Trump a Racist - Gawker
gawker.com/just-call-trump-a-racist-1763944273
Gawker
2 days ago

Hillary Clinton Calls Donald Trump a RACIST... And Trump ...
www.thepoliticalinsider.com/hillary-clinton-calls-donald-trump-a-racist-a (http://www.thepoliticalinsider.com/hillary-clinton-calls-donald-trump-a-racist-a)...





It wouldn't surprise me. Strategically it makes sense to deflect the racism charge that the Democrats always use, and they will triple down on it with Trump. It also could help somewhat with taking Michigan.

Dems usually excel in skin color politics so you may have a point.



I have a better question. Have the forums really devolved so much to have a thread with such a stupid question?

Can you elaborate a bit why this question is "stupid" ?
Do you believe race is not a major factor in US politics?


You should read "The Strange Career of Jim Crowe", racism has nothing to do with advocating for the political benefit of others. You can be racist and advocate for the benefit of minorities if it helps you politically (Johnson) of you can be a minority and vote for or advocate for racists if they will benefit you (Johnson again)...but there are many examples in the book, I recommend it.

Will try to read it but valid argument you made.




Thread title is a blatant non sequitur. It does not follow that Trump's status as a racist or a not-racist would necessarily have any impact whatsoever on Carson's endorsement or not-endorsement of Trump.


Probably so. But I do not assume that US politics and voters choices are logical.
In fact quite often, they are not. This is an observational question taking into account various perceptions that play a part in US elections and to speculate about motivations of Carson, Trump.

[GunnyFreedom]

If Trumpster is establishment, why both GOP/Dem/neocon estblishments are peeing in their pants in dspair/fear?
Authoritarian he could be and probably would lean towards being if won.

He's "outside his lane." You have establishmentarian politicians who take bribes from the oligarchs to do their bidding, and you have establishmentarian oligarchs that pay bribes to the politicians to do their bidding. Trump is an establishmentarian oligarch pretending to run as an anti-establishment politician. He's cutting into the politicians profits by cutting out the bribe taking middlemen.


Carson has been called such terms by some Obama supporters/left wing types but on the Right he is highly respected, upright role model.
Need to learn more about facts fueling such characterizations for once GOP pack leaders like Ben Carson/Herman Cain.

The ease and readiness with which some Trump supporters trot out these despicable terms disturbs me.


Probably so. But I do not assume that US politics and voters choices are logical.
In fact quite often, they are not. This is an observational question taking into account various perceptions that play a part in US elections and to speculate about motivations of Carson, Trump.

Neither the voters nor the politicians have to behave logically for logic to describe their actions and reactions. Any given action may be wholly illogical, and yet logic can be used to describe what happened and why. Say a woman freaks out emotionally because a man gives her roses. This is not a logical reaction, however via the application of deductive reasoning we might learn that roses were her mother's favorite flower, and when her mother passed the funeral home was inundated with roses and therefore she will forever associate roses with her deceased mother. Illogical action --> explained logically.

[nikcers]

I was talking to bubbleboy, and I have received my share of negs from all of you Trumpaloompas.

Come on man, I don't know what you think you know about Trump, but i know the guy. I have seen his true intentions with my minds eye. :eek:

[GunnyFreedom]

And yet Trump seemed to know exactly who Duke was when he denounced him in 1991 and again in 2000. Along comes 2016 and we are supposed to believe that Trump no longer recognized the man?

Is Trump a liar or just senile?

Why would either of those options make a good President?
RonPaulGeorge&Ringo is back at it again, negging anyone who refuses to worship his idol messiah Trump.

[hells_unicorn]

I couldn't care less if Donald Trump is a racist or not (I don't think he is, he thinks in terms of who is an obstacle and who isn't, racial makeup of said persons largely being incidental), and I'll tell you right now, the people that are going to elect him don't give a rat's ass either. Trump will either be horrible at worst or slightly better than Obama at best, and Carson endorsing him has little bearing on that, nor the racial views of Trump or anyone else for that matter.

[GunnyFreedom]

And yet Trump seemed to know exactly who Duke was when he denounced him in 1991 and again in 2000. Along comes 2016 and we are supposed to believe that Trump no longer recognized the man?

Is Trump a liar or just senile?

Why would either of those options make a good President?

http://i.imgur.com/NicYInf.pngSince you are clearly too much of a coward to make this accusation in public, and also obviously incapable of comprehending simple English, you will probably be incapable of noticing that I have made no charges one way or the other regarding racism or the lack thereof. I was addressing the fact that Trump was either lying outright, or suffering from some kind of amnesia stemming from senile dementia.

I do not expect Trump supporters like yourself to understand the difference, so I totally get why you are confused, but really, if you are incapable of comprehending basic elementary English, do you really think you should be passing judgement on those who have actually mastered the language?

Perhaps you can explain for the class, RonPaulGeorge&Ringo -- exactly what part of my quoted post you think qualifies as "race baiting" eh?

[Libertas Aut Mortis]

Will try to read it but valid argument you made.


Absolutely, I'll forwarn you, it is definitely written in a pro-Government Solution manner....but if you are strong willed enough to look past it's progressive leanings, it does dwell into some very good history of racial history. It goes past the "white southerner=bad", and it explores paternalism, northern hypocrisy, imperialism as a factor of legitimacy, ect ect, and it finds that perhaps the commonality of WW2 started the end of Jim Crowe.

I enjoyed the read, even if the narrative was bias, its definitely one of the better books i've read on the subject.