Shots fired, Bundy arrested

[JK/SEA]

need more confirmation...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=youtu.be&v=VVWykMKiOjU&app=desktop

[goldenequity]

Highway 395 at the intersection of US 20 north of Burns -- not far from the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge
-- closed in both directions, Jan. 26, 2016 (KOIN) http://koin.com/2016/01/26/malheur-militia-law-enforcement-01262016/

https://lintvkoin.files.wordpress.com/2016/01/malheur-hwy-395-us-20-01262015.jpg?w=640

[goldenequity]

4 arrested,Ammon Bundy taken into custody. Per stream.
======================


Two people have been shot and Ammon Bundy is in custody, according to a YouTube live stream report by Pete Santilli, who was speaking outside a hospital in Burns.

Santilli, a self-styled journalist, took to social media to discuss the breaking development late Tuesday afternoon. He also reported that the FBI has told the protesters at the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge that they are free to go and need to leave immediately.

Santilli said he was waiting at the hospital to confirm the reports of the shootings. The Oregonian/OregonLive could not independently confirm the reports.

http://www.oregonlive.com/oregon-standoff/2016/01/pete_santilli_militants_suppor.html

[RJB]

I have an unsettled feeling about all this.

[phill4paul]

need more confirmation...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=youtu.be&v=VVWykMKiOjU&app=desktop

Live stream seems to be down.

[phill4paul]

Follow this post for additional updates.



This evening, the FBI made a legal, felony stop on a vehicle carrying Ammon Bundy and several other individuals. After a shoot out with the FBI, four individuals were reportedly taken into custody, including Ammon Bundy. Two individuals are reported to have been taken to the Burns hospital, which is currently on lock down.

FBI sources stated that those at the Refuge are currently free to leave unimpeded, implying that there might be action if they do not leave immediately.

https://www.oathkeepers.org/breaking-ammon-bundy-taken-into-fbi-custody/

[phill4paul]

Santilli is saying that Fox news is reporting 4 in custody. Asking Blain to get all the women and children out of the refuge.

[JK/SEA]

report Santilli has been arrested.

[phill4paul]

Ryan Payne, one of the occupation leaders, suffered multiple gunshots, according to a local government official.

https://twitter.com/LesZaitz/status/692170478425935876?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw

[JK/SEA]

Report Ryan Payne shot several times. un-confirmed on this as well as Santilli...

[phill4paul]

UPDATES:

1811L: Blaine Cooper has reportedly assumed leadership at the Refuge and has been told to leave immediately. During a phone call with Pete Santilli, Pete can be overheard saying, “Blaine, please don’t do this.” Blaine is reportedly wanting to make a stand. Women and children are still at the Refuge.

1821L: According to local government officials, Ryan Payne suffered multiple gunshot wounds and was taken to the Burns hospital.

https://www.oathkeepers.org/breaking-ammon-bundy-taken-into-fbi-custody/

[JK/SEA]

Santilli grabbed for questioning...

[PursuePeace]

wow, what the heck is going on? I was just watching this from earlier in the day:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ebSscwkQpB4

[Danke]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QS9DsehMRAA&ebc=ANyPxKoxt936NE2EDFT9J5oQ-ya0nrWknvGHufeFVciwKddsebb6N2rVbzBmGt_6SC6GEp11-TOvQ45loi0UW4PuUwinhOe-1w

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QS9DsehMRAA&ebc=ANyPxKoxt936NE2EDFT9J5oQ-ya0nrWknvGHufeFVciwKddsebb6N2rVbzBmGt_6SC6GEp11-TOvQ45loi0UW4PuUwinhOe-1w

[Badger Paul]

They're being brought to justice. That's what's going on.

[phill4paul]

Appears they were on their way to a meeting so the Feds knew they would be on the highway.


Update: George Plaven, a reporter for the East Oregonian in Pendleton, is tweeting from the site of a planned community meeting that was to feature Ammon Bundy and other leaders of the occupation at the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge.

6:06 p.m.: Meeting organizer just announced guest speakers won't be here. "It appears there was an altercation b/t here and Burns." #Oregonstandoff

6:24 p.m: Quickly devolving into shouting match here. People demanding to know what happened. Room divided in front and back. #Oregonstandoff

6:25 p.m: Family from KS now praying for Hammonds, militia. Claims to be representatives. She shouted "Someone has been shot!" #Oregonstandoff

http://www.oregonlive.com/oregon-standoff/2016/01/oregon_standoff_venue_changes.html#incart_big-photo

[mrsat_98]

It would have gone a lot easier if he would have just broke into the jail.

[Danke]

They're being brought to justice. That's what's going on.

Ah yes, justice...

[kcchiefs6465]

They're being brought to justice. That's what's going on.
Live free or talk shit on the internet.

[phill4paul]

The Oregonian ‏@Oregonian 8m8 minutes ago
#BREAKING: Bundys in custody, one militant dead after gunfight near Burns #OregonStandoff http://bit.ly/1PRlfuy

https://twitter.com/George_Plaven


Les Zaitz ‏@LesZaitz 9m9 minutes ago
The identity of the militant killed in the highway shootout is not yet being released.

https://twitter.com/Oregonian

[JK/SEA]

one dead....

[Danke]

one dead....

Apparently it was a " militant". I guess the FBI with be mourning their lose.

[phill4paul]

FBI press release:


The FBI and the Oregon State Police jointly reported five people were arrested and one unnamed person was killed in connection with an occupation at the Malheur National Wild Refuge. Here's the full news release:

At approximately 4:25 p.m. (PST) on Tuesday, January 26, 2016, the Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI) and Oregon State Police (OSP) began an enforcement action to bring into custody a number of individuals associated with the armed occupation of the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge. During that arrest, there were shots fired.

One individual who was a subject of a federal probable cause arrest is deceased. We will not be releasing any information about that person pending identification by the medical examiner's office.

One individual suffered non-life threatening injuries and was transported to a local hospital for treatment. He was arrested and is currently in custody.

The arrested individuals include:

Ammon Edward Bundy, age 40, of Emmett, Idaho
Ryan C. Bundy, age 43, of Bunkerville, Nevada
Brian Cavalier, age 44, of Bunkerville, Nevada
Shawna Cox, age 59, Kanab, Utah
Ryan Waylen Payne, age 32, of Anaconda, Montana
These probable cause arrests occurred along Highway 235.

In a separate event in Burns, Oregon, at approximately 5:50 pm, Oregon State Police arrested the following individual:

Joseph Donald O'Shaughnessy, age 45, Cottonwood, Arizona
All of the named defendants face a federal felony charge of conspiracy to impede officers of the United States from discharging their official duties through the use of force, intimidation, or threats, in violation of Title 18, United States Code, Section 372.

We continue to work with Harney County Sheriff Dave Ward and his deputies; Oregon State Police; and the United States Attorney's Office to address any further outstanding issues. As the investigation is ongoing, we cannot comment further at this time.

All defendants should be presumed innocent until proven guilty.

-- The Oregonian

http://www.oregonlive.com/oregon-standoff/2016/01/5_arrested_1_dead_in_connectio.html

[phill4paul]

Reports that LaVoy Finicum was the one that was killed. Looking for confirmation.

[pcosmar]

Where was their backup/over watch ?

AND WHY WERE THEY AMBUSHED ON THE WAY TO A MEETING?

[Rothbardian Girl]

e: saw phill4paul already posted what I was going to post. Apologies.

[69360]

I don't understand why they let it come to this. There was an offer of same passage from the sheriff. Nobody had to die.

[kcchiefs6465]

I don't understand why they let it come to this. There was an offer of same passage from the sheriff. Nobody had to die.
Fuck you.

[PursuePeace]

Reports that LaVoy Finicum was the one that was killed. Looking for confirmation.

!!! I just heard the same thing. omg.

[phill4paul]

Where was their backup/over watch ?

AND WHY WERE THEY AMBUSHED ON THE WAY TO A MEETING?

Because the Feds knew they were on the way to the meeting. They figured if they took out the leaders, cut off the head of the snake, they would end the occupation.

[phill4paul]

I don't understand why they let it come to this. There was an offer of same passage from the sheriff. Nobody had to die.

Dosn't look like the sheriff provided them with safe passage to the meeting they were going to attend.

[69360]

Fuck you.

Is that right?

I suppose I don't see the glory in getting offed by the Feds over an occupation the Oregon family did not want.

Choose your battles wisely and live to fight another day.

[69360]

Dosn't look like the sheriff provided them with safe passage to the meeting they were going to attend.

That was never the offer. A few weeks ago they were offered safe passage to the state line so they could go home.

[kcchiefs6465]

Is that right?

I suppose I don't see the glory in getting offed by the Feds over an occupation the Oregon family did not want.

Choose your battles wisely and live to fight another day.
Suck another dick and live to fight another day.

[69360]

Suck another dick and live to fight another day.

Nice. Who pissed in your cheerios?

[phill4paul]

That was never the offer. A few weeks ago they were offered safe passage to the state line so they could go home.

The Sheriff rolled over for the Feds from the beginning. He abrogated his elected authority. They were in route to a peaceful meeting. The only reason this went down the way it did is because the Feds decided it would go down like this. It didn't have to.

[Danke]

Clinton Foundation took massive payoffs, promised Hammond Ranch and other publicly owned lands to Russians along with one-fifth of our uranium ore.

https://www.intellihub.com/clinton-foundation-payoffs-promised-hammond-ranch-other-publically-owned-lands-russia/

[dillo]

Dosn't look like the sheriff provided them with safe passage to the meeting they were going to attend.

Who knows, the FBI has bugs and sources everywhere. The sheriff couldve been a peace keeper that got bugged.

[phill4paul]

Who knows, the FBI has bugs and sources everywhere. The sheriff couldve been a peace keeper that got bugged.

No. The Sheriff rolled over from day one and asked for Fed help. The whole town is staffed by government cronies. The state Gov. demanded that the Feds do something. And so we have this.

[Bryan]

Fuck you.

I understand emotions are very high but let's please keep this civil. Thank you.

[69360]

The Sheriff rolled over for the Feds from the beginning. He abrogated his elected authority. They were in route to a peaceful meeting. The only reason this went down the way it did is because the Feds decided it would go down like this. It didn't have to.

They may have been en route to a meeting, but they had previously broken laws and were subject to a lawful arrest. I think going into this they had to know they would eventually be arrested.

I'm not opposed to militias. I'm not opposed to what went down at the Bundy ranch. But this time in these circumstances, they should have went home before somebody got killed.

[FrancisMarion]

Just doesn't seem smart to me to leave the refuge. Especially with small numbers. Where were the thousands of three %'s to provide security? Guess we will find out in the end who was riding coat tails for free exposure.

I'm thinking the Feds want this wrapped up. I bet the refuge is frantic right now.

[phill4paul]

They may have been en route to a meeting, but they had previously broken laws and were subject to a lawful arrest. I think going into this they had to know they would eventually be arrested.

I'm not opposed to militias. I'm not opposed to what went down at the Bundy ranch. But this time in these circumstances, they should have went home before somebody got killed.

Whatever, I really don't give a rat's ass what you think, I'm just updating with info as this proceeds.

[phill4paul]

Just doesn't seem smart to me to leave the refuge. Especially with small numbers. Where were the thousands of three %'s to provide security? Guess we will find out in the end who was riding coat tails for free exposure.

I'm thinking the Feds want this wrapped up. I bet the refuge is frantic right now.

Supposedly the Feds have converged on the center. Don't really know what that means though...


Federal law enforcement officers converged on the wildlife refuge after the arrests and were expected to remain at the site throughout the night. It was unclear how many members of the armed group, if any, were at the refuge when the law enforcement officers arrived.

http://katu.com/news/local/leader-of-oregon-occupation-ammon-bundy-three-others-arrested

[Bryan]

Choose your battles wisely and live to fight another day.

There is a lot of wisdom in that but each person has their own perspective and own lines. We will all do well to understand our own and respect each others. No easy answers here but open dialog does help one gain clarity.

This is all very tragic. A life was lost.

[69360]

Just doesn't seem smart to me to leave the refuge. Especially with small numbers. Where were the thousands of three %'s to provide security? Guess we will find out in the end who was riding coat tails for free exposure.

I'm thinking the Feds want this wrapped up. I bet the refuge is frantic right now.

If history has taught us anything, they should get out of there before the feds gas, bomb or burn them out.

[TomtheTinker]

What I know there is a very small minority of people in this country who are sick of what's happening all around them. I wouldn't be surprised if situations like this become more common. I don't know the details or the legalities of this situation but am very sympathetic to these men. Also do know from my own research that the original situation in nevada, that the bundy family had some legit grevionces.

[phill4paul]

Les Zaitz ‏@LesZaitz 11m11 minutes ago
Occupier Jason Patrick at the refuge: We’re all standing here ready to defend our peaceful resolution.

https://twitter.com/LesZaitz

[CaptainAmerica]

It happened in the middle of no where I am assuming? 70 miles away from the meeting they were headed to.


lets take a look back down memory lame :
Waco Texas
Ruby Ridge
Ed and Elaine Brown NH (recent years)

is there anything the FBI ,federal marshalls and paramilitary assholes won't do? FUCK every one of them

[CaptainAmerica]

the PAIUTE tribe is going to be used as a proxy mouth piece to turn the protestors into pure 100 percent evil whitey villain...thats exactly whats happening right now in the media, despite the PAIUTE tribe's artifacts being locked up by federal government as "crime scene evidence" and rotting in mice feces.

[FrancisMarion]

All of them are facing federal felony charges of conspiracy to impede officers of the United States from discharging their official duties, through the use of force, intimidation or threats.

Hmmmm.

[pcosmar]

is there anything the FBI ,federal marshalls and paramilitary assholes won't do? FUCK every one of them

they didn't want their "discussion" recorded by media?

[69360]

It happened in the middle of no where I am assuming? 70 miles away from the meeting they were headed to.


lets take a look back down memory lame :
Waco Texas
Ruby Ridge
Ed and Elaine Brown NH (recent years)

is there anything the FBI ,federal marshalls and paramilitary assholes won't do? FUCK every one of them

I think it's very possible the feds will raid the place and kill more people. There are very few consequences when they overstep athority. The fed who killed Randy Weaver's wife was indicted but the case was dropped The Weavers did get a settlement from the feds, but money isn't justice.

[Danke]

If history has taught us anything, they should get out of there before the feds gas, bomb or burn them out.


http://s3.amazonaws.com/imgly_production/454673/large.jpg

[Dianne]

So we have about 320 million people living in the United States. So each of us owns 320-millionths (not even accounting for all the non U.S. citizens in the country). So why are these people being removed when they own a fraction of the land. The Federal Government doesn't own shit. We the people own the property. As long as you believe the Feds own chit, and it doesn't belong to you and I................ we are f'ked.

Get it through your head, the Feds are our servants. They own nothing. We the people all have a divisible interest in all property the Federal Government calls its own.

[phill4paul]

With the Feds moving in on the refuge and the occupiers refusing to back down I suppose we will find out if the O.K.s and III% were all bluster about "No more Free Wacos."
Since I haven't heard anything from the III% and I'm assuming they've gone dark and are moving into positions even now. I pray so.

[phill4paul]

BREAKING:

Update: Talk Network Executive Producer Dean Ryan just spoke to Deb Jordan.. Pete Santilli co-host. She said Lavoy Finicum was shot cold blooded and un-armed.
Pete Santilli was arrested after pleaing with the FBI to allow him to set up a convoy to save the women and children in the refuge.
Deb told Dean Ryan that Feds are arresting everybody and fears they will shoot all inside refuge including women & children
https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=795717573872774&id=422296034548265

[Dianne]

Well I own 360 millionth of that land, and I was never asked if I wanted them removed.. Were you?

[pcosmar]

Robert 'LaVoy' Finicum

Dead.

Shot three times with his hands on his head.

It was no gunfight. it was an ambush.

[phill4paul]

LaVoyandjeanette Finicum
2 mins ·
This is LaVoy Finicums daughter, Thara Tenney posting this. Please share.

LaVoy Finicum's Stand For Freedom
13 mins · Eagle Mountain, UT ·
LaVoy Finicum has been murdered. LaVoy's hands were in the air and he was shot in the face. Ammon Bundy reported there were 6 witneses. This evil doing must be told to everyone.

https://www.facebook.com/lavoy.finicum

[Dianne]

What a bunch of terrorist bastards. Obama, kiss my f'king ass.

[unknown]

The Feds didnt have to shoot nor kill those men.

Those boys know how to handle a firearm, the fact that no one on .gov's side was injured tells me that it was completely one sided.

Theyre being charged with impeding federal officers. This is the sheriff's fault for allowing federal officers into his jurisdiction n the first place.

[pcosmar]

With the Feds moving in on the refuge and the occupiers refusing to back down I suppose we will find out if the O.K.s and III% were all bluster about "No more Free Wacos."
Since I haven't heard anything from the III% and I'm assuming they've gone dark and are moving into positions even now. I pray so.

I am wondering a number of things,, including how Fed controlled the militias are.

Where is the over watch ?

[sparebulb]

Are there any livestreams or reliable twitters going right now?

[kcchiefs6465]

I understand emotions are very high but let's please keep this civil. Thank you.
I would spit on a red coat as well.

Their roads must be nicely paved.

[JK/SEA]

here's a better live stream...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yUl_TEtV-3w

[phill4paul]

Found something on Brandon Curtiss the Oregon III%'er that seemed to be leading what was going on....

****UPDATE****
I want to clear up the question that keeps coming up, we are being asked why there was not a convoy or why the security buffer in place. The individuals in the refuge provided themselves with their own security and we always tried to maintain additional security as well, however, we were not aware they were traveling or enroute otherwise we certainly would have had additional security in place. Please understand this is a difficult time for many and this is not the time to point fingers.
LikeShare

https://www.facebook.com/brandon.curtiss.90

[phill4paul]

Authorities arrested Ammon Bundy, leader of the armed protesters who took over a federal wildlife refuge in Oregon, and several of his followers in a traffic stop Tuesday, officials said.

One of the occupiers -- LaVoy Finicum -- was killed during the arrest, a law enforcement official said.

The official said when two vehicles were stopped, everyone obeyed orders to surrender except for two people: Finicum and Bundy's brother, Ryan Bundy.

Shots were fired, but it's not known who fired first, the official said. The official said Ryan Bundy was injured.

http://www.cnn.com/2016/01/26/us/oregon-wildlife-refuge-siege-arrests/index.html?sr=twcnni012716oregon-wildlife-refuge-siege-arrests0436AMVODtopPhoto&linkId=20700784

[pcosmar]

http://www.cnn.com/2016/01/26/us/oregon-wildlife-refuge-siege-arrests/index.html?sr=twcnni012716oregon-wildlife-refuge-siege-arrests0436AMVODtopPhoto&linkId=20700784

I had heard it was Ryan Payne that was shot and in critical condition. Still sorting.

and waiting for the "what next?"

[phill4paul]

I had heard it was Ryan Payne that was shot and in critical condition. Still sorting.

and waiting for the "what next?"

Yeah, it's always mixed reports this early in an incident. All I know is they killed LaVoy Finicum. That's been confirmed.

[pcosmar]

Yeah, it's always mixed reports this early in an incident. All I know is they killed LaVoy Finicum. That's been confirmed.

Seems Ryan Bundy Shot too. the two confused initially..

Shooting Ryan is not going to go over well..

[phill4paul]

Seems Ryan Bundy Shot too. the two confused initially..

Shooting Ryan is not going to go over well..

Will get the "official" announcement tomorrow after they have had the time to get the spin in....


Les Zaitz ‏@LesZaitz 9s9 seconds ago
U.S. Atty, FBI SAC, sheriff to hold news conference at 10:30 am Pacific Wednesday regarding occupation arrests and shooting.

[twomp]

If history has taught us anything, they should get out of there before the feds gas, bomb or burn them out.

Dying for something you believe in is very hard for police worshippers like you to understand. If you were alive during the Revolutionary war, you would have been packing your bags for England where its safe. I actually wouldn't be surprised if you let the police have their way with your children, provided they ask nicely.

[pcosmar]

Are there any livestreams or reliable twitters going right now?

Santilli was arrested,, but his stream is still going..

not much news though.

[ZENemy]

Two men are senselessly killed, but hey at least we have roads right?

[sparebulb]

Two men are senselessly killed, but hey at least we have roads right?

Who is the second man killed?

[phill4paul]

Two men are senselessly killed, but hey at least we have roads right?

At this point only one. LaVoy Finicum. I don't have much hope that he will be the only one.

[phill4paul]

On Tuesday, after the FBI and Oregon state police arrested six of his comrades following deadly shootout, notorious Islamophobe Jon Ritzheimer (a.k.a. the angry dildo man) turned himself in to the Peoria, Arizona, police department.

Earlier in the evening, following the arrests in Oregon, Ritzheimer, wrote on Facebook, “I came home to visit my family. The Feds know I am here and are asking me to turn myself in.”

“I just want the country to live by the Constitution and I just want the government to abide by it,” he wrote. He also asked for donations to help pay for an attorney.

Ritzheimer faces the same charge as the six other militants arrested on Tuesday: conspiracy to impede officers of the United States from discharging their official duties through the use of force, intimidation, or threats.

http://gawker.com/anti-muslim-activist-and-oregon-wildlife-refuge-occupie-1755363923

[jonhowe]

$10 says any body cameras at the scene malfunctioned.

[JK/SEA]

its over.

[puppetmaster]

Damn. This over a small fire. fuck the feds Rand as president will pardon them from this injustice

[JK/SEA]

Damn. This over a small fire. fuck the feds Rand as president will pardon them from this injustice

from your lips to Gods ear.

[Weston White]

Is that right?

I suppose I don't see the glory in getting offed by the Feds over an occupation the Oregon family did not want.

Choose your battles wisely and live to fight another day.

"Glory"? Is this what you think this is about--glory? What up and smell the smelling salt. This is about petitioning "the government for a redress of grievances". Their grand jury have failed them, their courts and jury of their peers have failed them, their representatives have failed them, their administration of justice have failed them, their impartial press have failed them--what else is left?

Meanwhile, it has come out that the BLM is on video busting jokes about the small sum of remaining lands they have to take and how much they have acquest thus far and how the remaining ranchers should be very worried. And of potential evidence that local officials are implicated in orchestrating valuable land resources to private and foreign entities.

Living to wisely fight another day, is this the "glory" you envision in your own mind? I have news for you dude, you are living not by a code of glory, but by a code of despotism, and not to wisely fight another day, but to be mindlessly subdued for another day.

Read our American Declaration and become neither glory-struck nor patriotic, but become inspired--be a freeman. Going along to get along is for chattels and peons.

[ZENemy]

Who is the second man killed?

Yeah my bad, I was misinformed.

[pcosmar]

its over.

I don't think so.

But anyone who did not expect the violence to come from the government is both ignorant and foolish.

Those who expected violence from the "militants".. you are probably too stupid to be educated.

[pcosmar]

Cincinnatian Peter Santilli arrested in Oregon standoff
http://www.cincinnati.com/story/news/2016/01/27/cincinnatian-peter-santilli-arrested-oregon-standoff/79386528/

Same charges as the rest.

Waco Texas all over again.

this is what happen when people have guns they are unwilling to use..

First Amendment gone too

[sparebulb]

My grim prediction is that in the next few days, EVERY GOP candidate will be trying to out cop/fedsuck the other to praise this outcome.

Rand might be the lone exception.....

Which will result is further loss of support from Boobus.

[Weston White]

A shootout:


a fight in which people shoot guns at each other until one side is killed or defeated

[sparebulb]

A shootout:


a fight in which people shoot guns at each other until one side is killed or defeated


That's not what it means in Newspeak.

[JK/SEA]

''Lavoy Finicum exited the vehicle, dropped to his knees with his hands on his head and repeated 3 times he was unarmed. Shot 3 times by FBI. '' Aamon Bundy to his wife.

un-comfirmed report.

tomorrow would have been Lavoy's birthday.

[TheTexan]

A shootout:

Did Bundy & crew even have guns? I don't see anything in CNN about them having guns. Maybe CNN chose to leave that detail out, in the interest of objective & unbiased reporting.

[nobody's_hero]

It would have gone a lot easier if he would have just broke into the jail.

To rescue two men who didn't want saving?

We knew this would happen. Bundy should have left when they said more than half the people in that area either worked for the federal wildlife agencies or personally knew someone who did. He should have left when the Hammonds turned themselves in without a whimper. He should have left when he made his point and the Committee of Safety which he helped establish asked him to leave.

Now we have some good patriots in jail because they wasted their stand on people who embrace their own shackles.

[Weston White]

At this point only one. LaVoy Finicum. I don't have much hope that he will be the only one.

Interesting:


Finicum and Blaine Cooper, two of the more outspoken members of the anti-government occupation, said federal authorities pressured Arizona child-welfare officials to retaliate against them days after the siege began. . . . Non-profit tax records show that before joining the standoff, Finicum collected hundreds of thousands of dollars in state subsidies caring for foster children at his former ranch in Paulden and his new one near Colorado City.

http://www.cincinnati.com/story/news/2016/01/26/reports-protest-group-leader-ammon-bundy-arrested/79380650/

[Weston White]

That's not what it means in Newspeak.

The FBI and state police shooting at the subjects of an arrest for being uncooperative is not a so-called, shootout, and that is in everyday plain, whatever, English speak.

[Weston White]

Did Bundy & crew even have guns? I don't see anything in CNN about them having guns. Maybe CNN chose to leave that detail out, in the interest of objective & unbiased reporting.

Nope, they ALL have been making it very, extremely, clear and apparent in each of their FBI contacts that they were ALL unarmed, they are looking only towards peaceful resolution.

[TheTexan]

Did Bundy & crew even have guns? I don't see anything in CNN about them having guns. Maybe CNN chose to leave that detail out, in the interest of objective & unbiased reporting.

This detail seems to be conspicuously missing from all the news stories?

Oh well, it's probably safe to assume that the militants were indeed carrying weapons. I mean, they are militants after all.

Probably assault weapons. Automatic, maybe. But the weapons were definitely black. Or so I assume, given the lack of information.

[Weston White]

To rescue two men who didn't want saving?

We knew this would happen. Bundy should have left when they said more than half the people in that area either worked for the federal wildlife agencies or personally knew someone who did. He should have left when the Hammonds turned themselves in without a whimper. He should have left when he made his point and the Committee of Safety which he helped establish asked him to leave.

Now we have some good patriots in jail because they wasted their stand on people who embrace their own shackles.

But this is a national issue, the feds, through the BLM claims proprietorship of 50% or more of all Western states.

[TheTexan]

Nope, they ALL have been making it very, extremely, clear and apparent in each of their FBI contacts that they were ALL unarmed, they are looking only towards peaceful resolution.

I guess they mistook the man's unarmed hands over his head for semi-automatic assault weapons.

Its an easy mistake to make.

[Zippyjuan]

Interesting:



http://www.cincinnati.com/story/news/2016/01/26/reports-protest-group-leader-ammon-bundy-arrested/79380650/

Also: http://theweek.com/speedreads/597546/oregon-standoff-leader-ammon-bundy-once-took-federal-loan

Oregon standoff leader Ammon Bundy once took out a federal loan


Ammon Bundy runs a Phoenix-based company called Valet Fleet Services LLC, which specializes in repairing and maintaining fleets of semitrucks throughout Arizona. On April 15, 2010 — Tax Day, as it happens — Bundy's business borrowed $530,000 through a Small Business Administration loan guarantee program. The available public record does not indicate what the loan was used for or whether it was repaid. The SBA website notes that this loan guarantee was issued under a program "to aid small businesses which are unable to obtain financing in the private credit marketplace." The government estimated that this subsidy could cost taxpayers $22,419. Bundy did not respond to an email request for comment about the SBA loan. [Mother Jones]

[sparebulb]

This detail seems to be conspicuously missing from all the news stories?

Oh well, it's probably safe to assume that the militants were indeed carrying weapons. I mean, they are militants after all.

Probably assault weapons. Automatic, maybe. But the weapons were definitely black. Or so I assume, given the lack of information.

Officers can't take the chance that they aren't armed.

After all, they were known terrorists.

[nobody's_hero]

But this is a national issue, the feds, through the BLM claims proprietorship of 50% or more of all Western states.

Sure, so start with the parts of that 50% involving residents in the area who actually want the land returned to the people. Looks like folks can cross Oregon off that list. May their chains rest lightly and all that.

GunnyFreedom was right, and I say that as someone who initially thought some good would come out of this. It was a fool's errand for these folks to undertake a fight on behalf of people who didn't want one.

[JK/SEA]

Also: http://theweek.com/speedreads/597546/oregon-standoff-leader-ammon-bundy-once-took-federal-loan

Oregon standoff leader Ammon Bundy once took out a federal loan

irrelevant to the topic at hand. Try and keep up.

[Occam's Banana]

Also: http://theweek.com/speedreads/597546/oregon-standoff-leader-ammon-bundy-once-took-federal-loan

Oregon standoff leader Ammon Bundy once took out a federal loan

:eek:

Did he drive on muh roads, too?

:rolleyes:

[JK/SEA]

Sure, so start with the parts of that 50% involving residents in the area who actually want the land returned to the people. Looks like folks can cross Oregon off that list. May their chains rest lightly and all that.

GunnyFreedom was right, and I say that as someone who initially thought some good would come out of this. It was a fool's errand for these folks to undertake a fight on behalf of people who didn't want one.

well, Gunny was wrong, and so are you. This has been explained as to the reasons ad naseum.

[sparebulb]

Also: http://theweek.com/speedreads/597546/oregon-standoff-leader-ammon-bundy-once-took-federal-loan

Oregon standoff leader Ammon Bundy once took out a federal loan

I have it on good authority that Ammon Bundy once purchased a stamp and mailed a letter, causing the taxpayer to lose money by subsidizing his private business.

[Weston White]

Sure, so start with the parts of that 50% involving residents in the area who actually want the land returned to the people. Looks like folks can cross Oregon off that list. May their chains rest lightly and all that.

GunnyFreedom was right, and I say that as someone who initially thought some good would come out of this. It was a fool's errand for these folks to undertake a fight on behalf of people who didn't want one.

No, GunnyFreedom could be only a little more wrong. And this is a national issue, all portions are unified. The people in Oregon are, sadly, blinded by their reliance, nay, their subjugation by the federal government.

See: Bundys Urge Oregon Ranchers To Tear Up Grazing Contracts (http://www.opb.org/news/article/ammon-bundy-oregon-grazing-blm-finicum-crane/)

[sparebulb]

Allegedly, fed convoy of vehicles and armor staged at the airport are on the move to the reserve.

They might just decide to end this before anyone else shows up.

https://mobile.twitter.com/LaurenKTVZ/status/692233801745993728

[RonPaulIsGreat]

Guys it isn't a big deal. Walking Dead will be back on Feb 14, this doesn't effect anything.

[sparebulb]

Here is a channel where a guy has been posting short videos from within the refuge.

He says all the children have left, with the exception of a pregnant woman.

The comments from the fedbots on these videos are disgusting.

https://www.youtube.com/user/DefendYourBase

[Weston White]

Only By Blood and Suffering Paperback – Unabridged, 2015 by LAVOY FINICUM (http://www.amazon.com/Only-Blood-Suffering-LAVOY-FINICUM/dp/193773594X):


Tells of a family's struggle to come together and survive in the midst of national crisis. A stirring, fast-paced novel about what matters most in the face of devastating end-times chaos. Filled with gripping action and relatable characters, readers are drawn into the heart-rending dilemmas each member of the Bonham family faces. You may even find yourself stopping to ask, "What would I do?" LaVoy Finicum is a real life Northern Arizona Rancher who loves nothing more in life than God, freedom, and family. His spine tingling storytelling conveys in graphic detail just how fragile and precious freedom truly is and leaves his readers with an increased desire to stand for freedom

[ghengis86]

Great. I have to fly into Portland in a couple hours. This is going to be a shit show for a variety of reasons.

[sparebulb]

Livestream up now!!!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A_cM8kmzxK0

[dannno]

Livestream up now!!!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A_cM8kmzxK0

It's like the Blair Witch Project, lol... just hoping I don't see anything too exciting..

[sparebulb]

ABC is reporting the first version from sources in law enforcement saying that they killed a person who shot at them first.

Let's just see how long that story holds up.

[ghengis86]

ABC is reporting the first version from sources in law enforcement saying that they killed a person who shot at them first.

Let's just see how long that story holds up.

It only has to hold up for a few minutes, then the people will forget about it and never see the quiet correction issued next week.

[tod evans]

Mutherrfuck! :mad:

Ain't nuthin' else to put in print......

[tod evans]

Propaganda worded very carefully;

Oregon militia leader Ammon Bundy, 7 others arrested after gunfight kills 1, injures 1

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2016/01/27/oregon-militia-leader-ammon-bundy-7-others-arrested-after-gunfight-kills-1-injures-1.html

The leader of a group of armed protesters who had occupied a federal wildlife refuge in eastern Oregon for 24 days was arrested along with four others Tuesday after a traffic stop prompted gunfire that left one person dead and another injured.

The FBI and Oregon State Police arrested Ammon Bundy, 40, his brother Ryan, 43, Brian Cavalier, 44, Shawna Cox, 59, and Ryan Payne, 32, at around 4:25 p.m. local time on U.S. Highway 395.

Three other people were arrested separately. The FBI said Joseph O'Shaughnessy, 45, and Peter Santilli, 50, were arrested in the nearby town of Burns, Ore. Hours later, authorities said Jon Ritzheimer, 32, turned himself into the Peoria, Ariz. police department.

The FBI said all eight face a federal felony charge of conspiracy to impede officers of the United States from discharging their official duties through the use of force, intimidation or threats.

Neither the FBI nor Oregon State Police released details about what set off the gunfire at the traffic stop. One of those arrested, described only as a man, suffered non-life-threatening wounds and was treated at a hospital, the agencies said.

Another man "who was a subject of a federal probable cause arrest" was killed in the shootout. The Oregonian reported that the deceased man was 55-year-old Robert Finicum. The paper cited Finicum's daughter in making the identification. Authorities said no other information about the deceased would be released pending formal identification by the local medical examiner's office.

The protesters were heading to a public meeting in the town of John Day, about 70 miles north of Burns, to address local residents about the occupation of the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge when the traffic stop took place, law enforcement officials told Fox News.

The Oregonian newspaper reported several hundred people had gathered at the John Day Senior Center on Tuesday evening and were told the "guest speakers" would not be appearing.

The Harney County Hospital in Burns was placed on lockdown out of concern that the protesters may cause a disturbance there.

Ammon Bundy's group, calling itself the Citizens for Constitutional Freedom, seized the refuge's headquarters on Jan. 2 in protest of what they viewed as onerous federal land restrictions, as well as the prison sentences of two local ranchers convicted of setting fires. Law enforcement officers converged on the wildlife refuge after the arrests and were expected to remain at the site throughout the night; it was unclear how many people, if any, remained in the buildings.

Ammon and Ryan Bundy are the sons of Nevada rancher Cliven Bundy, who was involved in a high-profile 2014 standoff with the government over grazing rights.

Many residents of Harney County, where the refuge is located, have been among those demanding that Bundy leave. Many sympathize with his criticism of federal land management policies of public lands but opposed the refuge takeover. They feared violence could erupt.

Ammon Bundy recently had begun traveling into Grant County to try to drum up more sympathy for his cause.

"I am pleased that the FBI has listened to the concerns of the local community and responded to the illegal activity occurring in Harney County by outside extremists," Sen. Jeff Merkley, D-Ore., said in a written statement. "The leaders of this group are now in custody and I hope that the remaining individuals occupying the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge will peacefully surrender so this community can begin to heal the deep wounds that this illegal activity has created over the last month."

The state police said it would investigate the officer-involved shooting, with help from the Deschutes County Major Incident Team and the Harney County District Attorney's Office.

[69360]

Dying for something you believe in is very hard for police worshippers like you to understand. If you were alive during the Revolutionary war, you would have been packing your bags for England where its safe. I actually wouldn't be surprised if you let the police have their way with your children, provided they ask nicely.

You are going too far with personal attacks and being offensive.

I would make a stand and fight to defend my own property from the government. I would not however travel across the country to take over a tourist center and die defending it.


Cincinnatian Peter Santilli arrested in Oregon standoff
http://www.cincinnati.com/story/news/2016/01/27/cincinnatian-peter-santilli-arrested-oregon-standoff/79386528/

Same charges as the rest.

Waco Texas all over again.

this is what happen when people have guns they are unwilling to use..

First Amendment gone too

I think there a major distinction between this and actions like Waco, Ruby Ridge, the Browns and the Bundys at their ranch. They were defending their own property. In this case this group went across the country and took over a tourist center when the aggrieved family did not want them there.

[tod evans]

Focusing on the where discounts the why.

[goldenequity]

Videos: convoy eyewitness account

https://www.facebook.com/mark.mcconnell.127648/videos/10154666860034762/?pnref=story

https://www.facebook.com/melvin.lee.733/posts/1094937370539445

Cliven (father) account of: Ammon's 2 Phone calls from scene: to his wife, to his friend


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AlqYUzP2imY

[UWDude]

The grand jury has reviewed the evidence, and found that procedures were followed.

[Weston White]

"I am pleased that the FBI has listened to the concerns of the local community and responded to the illegal activity occurring in Harney County by outside extremists," Sen. Jeff Merkley, D-Ore., said in a written statement. "The leaders of this group are now in custody and I hope that the remaining individuals occupying the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge will peacefully surrender so this community can begin to heal the deep wounds that this illegal activity has created over the last month."

Sen. Jeff Merkley is no statesman, where was he in all of this? With the governor sitting back afar, moaning for the FBI to intervene. What justice do you bring your constituents by discounting the causation of this entire incident? Moreover, where is your resolution for preventing future occurrences? Oh, yes, infringing the Second Amendment, is that it, is that all you've got?

Listened to the concerns of the local community, while further disenfranchising your own ranchers and farmers in the process?

Begin to heal the deep wounds that were created by this call to redress grievances? Are you freaking kidding? Seriously, are you?

Yes, peacefully surrender under the threat of heavily armed federal thugs. That solves it all, just right, is that it?



http://s3-origin-images.politico.com/news/110630_jeff_merkley_ap_605.jpg

...That is what I thought.

[goldenequity]

Ammon Bundy's Last Talk with FBI (hours before Arrest) 1/26/16


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7U-jTfQJYtM&feature=youtu.be

[Weston White]

I think there a major distinction between this and actions like Waco, Ruby Ridge, the Browns and the Bundys at their ranch. They were defending their own property. In this case this group went across the country and took over a tourist center when the aggrieved family did not want them there.

They capitalized on an incident to bring attention to their own directly related situation, both which are national--as this affects more than a single state. Do you think the feds give a crap if you write them letters from the safety of your home office? You will simply be ignored or blown off with a canned response. They do not care about you or your concerns. You are less than a whisper in a crowded stadium to them.

The "aggrieved family" has no direct involvement with the BLM's offices--and regardless they are under duress by the feds, so of course they are not going to speak against their captors.

And they did not go across the country, they drove over to the adjacent state.

So, what is your alternative? A mass hunger-strike?

[phill4paul]

Here is an account from the driver of the vehicle that Finicum was not in. This information he says he received directly from Payne. He details that Finicum charged the Feds but there is no mention of being armed or of firing.



BURNS – Robert "LaVoy" Finicum, the spokesman of the refuge occupation, was shot and killed after he charged police during a roadside stop north of Burns on Tuesday, according to a man on Facebook who claims to be the driver of one of two vehicles involved in the highway shooting.

Mark McConnell posted a video to Facebook Wednesday morning, recounting the Tuesday afternoon scene that led to Finicum's death and the subsequent arrest of eight people involved in the Jan. 2 takeover of the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge.

His account emerged as police established new checkpoints on roads leading to the refuge, where an unknown number of occupiers remained. Police said only local property owners would be allowed through. The number and exact location of the checkpoints couldn't immediately be established.

Seven of those arrested Tuesday were taken overnight to Portland, where they were booked into the Multnomah County Detention Center.

They included Ammon E. Bundy, 40, of Emmett, Idaho; his brother, Ryan C. Bundy of Bunkerville, Nevada; Ryan W. Payne, 32, of Anaconda, Montana; Brian Cavalier, 44, of Bunkerville, Nevada; Shawna J. Cox, 59, of Kanab, Utah; Joseph D. Oshaughnessy, 43, of Cottonwood, Arizona; and Peter T. Santilli, 50, of Cinncinati.

An eighth person, Jon Ritzheimer, surrendered to police in Arizona.

They were each charged with conspiracy to interfere with a federal official, a felony.

In his video, McConnell said Ammon Bundy and Cavalier were in the vehicle he was driving to John Day for a community meeting. He said Finicum was driving a pickup that carried Ryan Bundy, Payne, Cox and an 18-year-old girl.

He said as they traveled on U.S. 395 police vehicles pulled in behind them and stopped them. McConnell said he was removed by police first, then Ammon Bundy then Cavalier.

He said Finicum's pickup was stopped about 200 yards away, and one passenger already was on the ground in handcuffs.

McConnell said Payne and Cox later recounted how Payne and Finicum got into a "heated discussion" about what to do.

"LaVoy was passionate about this, about the movement," McConnell said.

McConnell said he noticed movement, and Finicum "took off" in the pickup with the remaining passengers. He said Payne and Cox described encountering a police roadblock about a mile north on the highway and apparently tried to get around it, becoming stuck in the snow.

"When he exited the vehicle, the rear wheels were still spinning," McConnell said. "He charged at law enforcement" and was shot.

McConnell disputed earlier accounts on social media that Finicum was shot while on his knees with his hands up.

McConnell said he and the 18-year-old were taken to Burns for questioning and later released.

His account couldn't be immediately confirmed, but several details matched accounts from law enforcement sources.

Meantime, the status of those at the refuge was unclear early Wednesday as the FBI and Oregon State Police set up the checkpoints. Late Tuesday, they established roadblocks near the refuge headquarters, parking a large front-end loader across Sod House Lane.

The FBI was negotiating into the night for the remaining occupiers to leave. Several were allowed to leave without arrest.

"The containment procedure involves a series of checkpoints established along key routes into and out of the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge," the agencies said in a joint news release.

A news conference was scheduled for 10:30 a.m. Wednesday in Burns. U.S. Attorney Billy Williams, FBI Special Agent in Charge Greg Bretzing and Harney County Sheriff Dave Ward were to address reporters.

http://www.oregonlive.com/oregon-standoff/2016/01/militant_shot_and_killed_while.html#incart_maj-story-1


The FB link of the video: https://www.facebook.com/mark.mcconnell.127648?pnref=story

ETA: From the second video it seems Ryan Bundy wasn't shot but was hit by shrapnel.

[nobody's_hero]

They capitalized on an incident to bring attention to their own directly related situation, both which are national--as this affects more than a single state. Do you think the feds give a crap if you write them letters from the safety of your home office? You will simply be ignored or blown off with a canned response. They do not care about you or your concerns. You are less than a whisper in a crowded stadium to them.

The "aggrieved family" has no direct involvement with the BLM's offices--and regardless they are under duress by the feds, so of course they are not going to speak against their captors.

And they did not go across the country, they drove over to the adjacent state.

So, what is your alternative? A mass hunger-strike?

The alternative is to help those who are willing to help themselves.

[vita3]

I wonder who killed LaVoy Finicum & if he was really hands up & on his knees, shouldn't the shooter be prosecuted?

[tod evans]

I wonder who killed LaVoy Finicum & if he was really hands up & on his knees, shouldn't the shooter be prosecuted?

By whom?

The same government that shot him......

[goldenequity]

I wonder who killed LaVoy Finicum & if he was really hands up & on his knees, shouldn't the shooter be prosecuted?

The Oregon State Police have filed it as "Officer Involved Shooting Investigation Underway In Harney County"
https://www.flashalert.net/news.html?id=1002

The road block involved both FBI and OSP.

[Badger Paul]

"What justice do you bring your constituents by discounting the causation of this entire incident?"

You mean the half of the county that works for the BLM or other federal agencies or how about the employees at wildlife refuge who couldn't get to their jobs because these yahoos took over the main building? What about the Hammonds who didn't want them there in the first place. Take your pick.

These guys wanted a confrontation with the Feds, they practically begged for it, and they got their wish. One dead and the rest in jail. Some revolution.

When the next stand-off over Federal lands takes place, may please our militia symps take their activities to another website so RPF doesn't get smeared as a militia hub site. Luckily for Rand he's so low in the polls no one bothered to notice. Believe me it would have been different otherwise This is a site for political activism, not bunker plotting.

[ChristianAnarchist]

Of the two different "live" feeds, one before dawn and one is after dawn??

[phill4paul]

[I]
You mean the half of the county that works for the BLM or other federal agencies or how about the employees at wildlife refuge who couldn't get to their jobs because these yahoos took over the main building?

Am I supposed to shed a tear about now?

[goldenequity]

Newest Updated:
LIVE streaming @ Refuge Center


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NWxu1ajk830

(old 'live link' now archived)

[ghengis86]

I wonder who killed LaVoy Finicum & if he was really hands up & on his knees, shouldn't the shooter be prosecuted?

Lon did it (again).

[ChristianAnarchist]

Watching the live feed it seems like these guys are already accepting their death. That means that the goons better be ready to die as well. I'm sure these military trained men are prepared for the usual goon tactics and have some counter actions prepared... Sorry to see it end this way but goons never stop when their "authority" is challenged...

[ChristianAnarchist]

Sunrise in Oregon is 7:37 and current time there is 7:30...

[phill4paul]

Watching the live feed it seems like these guys are already accepting their death. That means that the goons better be ready to die as well. I'm sure these military trained men are prepared for the usual goon tactics and have some counter actions prepared... Sorry to see it end this way but goons never stop when their "authority" is challenged...

It's a cluster just like it's been from the beginning. Ryan Payne was supposedly the Tac Ops. Why they would ever put all their leadership in one convoy away from the refuge is beyond me.

[GunnyFreedom]

"What justice do you bring your constituents by discounting the causation of this entire incident?"

You mean the half of the county that works for the BLM or other federal agencies or how about the employees at wildlife refuge who couldn't get to their jobs because these yahoos took over the main building? What about the Hammonds who didn't want them there in the first place. Take your pick.

These guys wanted a confrontation with the Feds, they practically begged for it, and they got their wish. One dead and the rest in jail. Some revolution.

When the next stand-off over Federal lands takes place, may please our militia symps take their activities to another website so RPF doesn't get smeared as a militia hub site. Luckily for Rand he's so low in the polls no one bothered to notice. Believe me it would have been different otherwise This is a site for political activism, not bunker plotting.

It's no secret that I thought this specific op was a bad idea from the start, but this is just stupid, and smacks of gloating over the death of a patriotic American who at least thought he was doing right.

[phill4paul]

Sunrise in Oregon is 7:37 and current time there is 7:30...

There is supposed to be a FBI SAC news conference this morning at 10:30 AM. I don't think they will move until after. My guess is that at the presser they will call for a peaceful end from those inside the refuge before swarming. That way they can claim "Hey, we tried to end this peacefully."

[Weston White]

The alternative is to help those who are willing to help themselves.

Hello! They are helping themselves, along with their fellow ranchers.

[ChristianAnarchist]

Live stream is dead...

[GunnyFreedom]

Live stream is dead...

Was about to point out the same. Looks like all the streams are shuttered.

[Ender]

"What justice do you bring your constituents by discounting the causation of this entire incident?"

You mean the half of the county that works for the BLM or other federal agencies or how about the employees at wildlife refuge who couldn't get to their jobs because these yahoos took over the main building? What about the Hammonds who didn't want them there in the first place. Take your pick.

These guys wanted a confrontation with the Feds, they practically begged for it, and they got their wish. One dead and the rest in jail. Some revolution.

When the next stand-off over Federal lands takes place, may please our militia symps take their activities to another website so RPF doesn't get smeared as a militia hub site. Luckily for Rand he's so low in the polls no one bothered to notice. Believe me it would have been different otherwise This is a site for political activism, not bunker plotting.

So. What.

Most of Boston didn't approve the Boston Tea Party. How many "Muricans actually fought in the Revolution? Most didn't want it- now we praise them. And, if it was Trump supporting this, mundanes would clapping and saying Yee Haw!

It should be obvious to anyone awake that the Hammonds went back to jail to protect their families. No one in their right mind would desire to be jailed TWICE for the same offense. Rather unconstitutional, wouldn't you agree?

And if this can happen to the Hammonds, whose next? How long before anyone who commits even a minor offense can be put in jail 2-3-4-100 times if the alphabets decide it?

Everyone screams for change but when a few do something, then 99% complain and disparage.

This has never been more appropriate:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SF2iImTqaTs

[JK/SEA]

so i guess we're just going to wait and watch as these patriots get killed, shake our heads and tell ourselves this was an ill advised op, and tune in to American Idol tonight with the pop corn and drinks...move along, nothing to see here...

[pcosmar]

historic memory jog

Ludlow Massacre

Ludlow Massacre - Birthplace of Public Relations
http://www.roadsideamerica.com/story/2906

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ludlow_Massacre

Let the spin begin.

[ChristianAnarchist]

so i guess we're just going to wait and watch as these patriots get killed, shake our heads and tell ourselves this was an ill advised op, and tune in to American Idol tonight with the pop corn and drinks...move along, nothing to see here...

Only now we have to pick apart the "official" story of what happens. There is not going to be the "other side" for us to hear...

[phill4paul]

so i guess we're just going to wait and watch as these patriots get killed, shake our heads and tell ourselves this was an ill advised op, and tune in to American Idol tonight with the pop corn and drinks...move along, nothing to see here...

What do you suggest?

[Lucille]

http://www.infowars.com/eyewitness-oregon-militiaman-murdered-by-cops-he-had-his-hands-in-the-air/


“I want the world to know how my father was murdered today. His hands were in the air and he was shot in the face by the American authorities. Ammon Bundy reported there are 6 witnesses to this evil.”
Posted by Thara Tenney on Tuesday, January 26, 2016

Her testimony was echoed by another eyewitness, Victoria Sharp, who was in the car with Finicum when the group were pulled over by cops and federal agents. Sharp claims that Finicum put his hands out of the car window and asked the police to allow the women to leave the car.

“They shot at him, but they missed him,” said Sharp, adding that the group then attempted to drive away in the car but were shot at again by police.

“When we crashed and stopped for a second, he got out of the car, he had his hands in the air, he’s like ‘just shoot me then’….and they did, they shot him dead,” said Sharp.

“He was just walking, with his hands in the air, I swear to God, and they shot him dead and after he was down on the ground, shot him three more times,” said Sharp, adding that the vehicle was again “bombarded with bullets” as well as tear gas rounds.

Sharp says that the group tried to “find something white” so they could display it as a sign of surrender. She challenges news reports that only six shots were fired, asserting, “they shot at least 120 shots altogether.”

Sharp also claims that none of the individuals in the car pulled out a gun at any point and that the incident was an “ambush” with “FBI snipers in the trees” surrounding the vehicle.

The Feds accommodate Ammon Bundy and give him his John-Brown-at-Harper's-Ferry moment, and we get to make a choice.
http://sipseystreetirregulars.blogspot.com/2016/01/the-feds-accommodate-ammon-bundy-and.html

[phill4paul]

http://www.infowars.com/eyewitness-oregon-militiaman-murdered-by-cops-he-had-his-hands-in-the-air/



The Feds accommodate Ammon Bundy and give him his John-Brown-at-Harper's-Ferry moment, and we get to make a choice.
http://sipseystreetirregulars.blogspot.com/2016/01/the-feds-accommodate-ammon-bundy-and.html

I wonder who Victoria Sharp is. Possibly the 16 yr. old that was in the vehicle?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y92PvMFL0Eg

[JK/SEA]

What do you suggest?

wait and watch, because there isn't going to be any back up from any militia groups. That much is certain.

[GunnyFreedom]

so i guess we're just going to wait and watch as these patriots get killed, shake our heads and tell ourselves this was an ill advised op, and tune in to American Idol tonight with the pop corn and drinks...move along, nothing to see here...

I don't understand this. If the people who thought this op was a good idea can't be bothered to go and do anything, then why do you think the people who thought it was a bad idea should do more than those? I mean, you thought the op was a good idea, and I don't see you picking up a rifle and rolling into battle, but you want the people who thought it was a bad idea to go and die in your place?

I don't understand this position of yours at all.

[pcosmar]

What do you suggest?

It can't be suggested.

but a soft spoken man, Rancher, family man,, and supporter of the Constitution was just murdered for his support of that.

to send a message.

Do you get it?

[Badger Paul]

The Weather Underground thought they were doing the right thing too.

"It should be obvious to anyone awake that the Hammonds went back to jail to protect their families. No one in their right mind would desire to be jailed TWICE for the same offense. Rather unconstitutional, wouldn't you agree?"

I agree completely and the prosecutor needs to be investigated but taking control of a Federal building by people who have no connection to the family or anyone else in the area and just looking for trouble and disrupting innocent people's lives in the process isn't going to help the situation and just makes things worse.

I'm not gloating over anyone's death. I'm just happy this situation is finally starting coming to a close and this Johnny Reb crap is being exposed for the idiocy that it is and Bundys and others are hardly revolutionaries. Bottom line is you either believe in the process or you don't and if you don't then I would ask you take yourselves away from RPF and retreat to your compounds because you have no business being here.

[phill4paul]

It can't be suggested.

but a soft spoken man, Rancher, family man,, and supporter of the Constitution was just murdered for his support of that.

to send a message.

Do you get it?

Certainly. But, I'm not sitting behind a key board and admonishing everyone else for doing nothing while...doing nothing. I believed this op was ill planned from the beginning. What idiot decides to remove the entire leadership from the refuge and put them in a convoy with a known destination?

[phill4paul]

The Weather Underground thought they were doing the right thing too.

"It should be obvious to anyone awake that the Hammonds went back to jail to protect their families. No one in their right mind would desire to be jailed TWICE for the same offense. Rather unconstitutional, wouldn't you agree?"

I agree completely and the prosecutor needs to be investigated but taking control of a Federal building by people who have no connection to the family or anyone else in the area and just looking for trouble and disrupting innocent people's lives in the process isn't going to help the situation and just makes things worse.

I'm not gloating over anyone's death. I'm just happy this situation is finally starting coming to a close and this Johnny Reb crap is being exposed for the idiocy that it is and Bundys and others are hardly revolutionaries. Bottom line is you either believe in the process or you don't and if you don't then I would ask you take yourselves away from RPF and retreat to your compounds because you have no business being here.

I DON'T believe in the process and you're a fool if you do. And I'll stay right here despite your belief that you are the director of all things RPF's.

[goldenequity]

Newest Updated:
LIVE streaming @ Refuge Center


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NWxu1ajk830

(old 'live link' now archived)

[pcosmar]

. Bottom line is you either believe in the process or you don't and if you don't then I would ask you take yourselves away from RPF and retreat to your compounds because you have no business being here.

Just what process is that?

The Law of the Land. The Constitution provides for such process,, when necessary..
It is the bottom line.


The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.
bottom line is who has the say.. the people.

[RJB]

Certainly. But, I'm not sitting behind a key board and admonishing everyone else for doing nothing while...doing nothing. I believed this op was ill planned from the beginning. What idiot decides to remove the entire leadership from the refuge and put them in a convoy with a known destination?

The natives had a bad habit of trusting the treaty makers as well.

[GunnyFreedom]

The Weather Underground thought they were doing the right thing too.

"It should be obvious to anyone awake that the Hammonds went back to jail to protect their families. No one in their right mind would desire to be jailed TWICE for the same offense. Rather unconstitutional, wouldn't you agree?"

I agree completely and the prosecutor needs to be investigated but taking control of a Federal building by people who have no connection to the family or anyone else in the area and just looking for trouble and disrupting innocent people's lives in the process isn't going to help the situation and just makes things worse.

I'm not gloating over anyone's death. I'm just happy this situation is finally starting coming to a close and this Johnny Reb crap is being exposed for the idiocy that it is and Bundys and others are hardly revolutionaries. Bottom line is you either believe in the process or you don't and if you don't then I would ask you take yourselves away from RPF and retreat to your compounds because you have no business being here.

Have you been in a coma for the last 15 years? "The process" has been hopelessly corrupted to the point where there is no justice left in the "justice" system. You can be sure that the corrupt monsters with their claws into the system down to the bone will not be routed peacefully. They are thugs and monsters, and force is the only language they speak.

Eventually, to route out the corruption, it will come down to force. Even if we won every election, and every Sheriff's office, and every DA in the country, these people will not leave peacefully. Once they have tasted power they will not let go without a fight. This is simply the nature of the beast.

http://i.imgur.com/Jor2RYj.jpg

[Origanalist]

The Weather Underground thought they were doing the right thing too.

"It should be obvious to anyone awake that the Hammonds went back to jail to protect their families. No one in their right mind would desire to be jailed TWICE for the same offense. Rather unconstitutional, wouldn't you agree?"

I agree completely and the prosecutor needs to be investigated but taking control of a Federal building by people who have no connection to the family or anyone else in the area and just looking for trouble and disrupting innocent people's lives in the process isn't going to help the situation and just makes things worse.

I'm not gloating over anyone's death. I'm just happy this situation is finally starting coming to a close and this Johnny Reb crap is being exposed for the idiocy that it is and Bundys and others are hardly revolutionaries. Bottom line is you either believe in the process or you don't and if you don't then I would ask you take yourselves away from RPF and retreat to your compounds because you have no business being here.

This is not your decision to make.

[pcosmar]

Certainly. But, I'm not sitting behind a key board and admonishing everyone else for doing nothing while...doing nothing. I believed this op was ill planned from the beginning. What idiot decides to remove the entire leadership from the refuge and put them in a convoy with a known destination?

Had been wondering the same,,

and the Fed infiltration is the reason for militia ineffectiveness more than anything else.

[phill4paul]

Had been wondering the same,,

and the Fed infiltration is the reason for militia ineffectiveness more than anything else.

I've heard that Ryan Payne was supposedly the Tac Op for the refuge. If he is charged with it's defense then why the hell would he remove himself? Why put the entire leadership in a convoy with a known destination without an escort. Brandon Curtiss with the III% said that if he had been told the PPN would have provided convoy protection.

[goldenequity]

I've heard that Ryan Payne was supposedly the Tac Op for the refuge. If he is charged with it's defense then why the hell would he remove himself? Why put the entire leadership in a convoy with a known destination without an escort. Brandon Curtiss with the III% said that if he had been told the PPN would have provided convoy protection.
Good point.
Have not heard from Brandon Curtiss since arrests.

[JK/SEA]

I don't understand this. If the people who thought this op was a good idea can't be bothered to go and do anything, then why do you think the people who thought it was a bad idea should do more than those? I mean, you thought the op was a good idea, and I don't see you picking up a rifle and rolling into battle, but you want the people who thought it was a bad idea to go and die in your place?

I don't understand this position of yours at all.

you have your reasons, and i have mine.

[pcosmar]

I've heard that Ryan Payne was supposedly the Tac Op for the refuge. If he is charged with it's defense then why the hell would he remove himself? Why put the entire leadership in a convoy with a known destination without an escort. Brandon Curtiss with the III% said that if he had been told the PPN would have provided convoy protection.

some of my questions,,
several things very wrong,, but why they had no cover is a big one.
I understood that Payne was acting as personal security,, and not overall tac/ops.
something feels wrong.

[phill4paul]

Good point.
Have not heard from Brandon Curtiss since arrests.

Not much....

https://www.facebook.com/brandon.curtiss.90?fref=ts

[phill4paul]

some of my questions,,
several things very wrong,, but why they had no cover is a big one.
I understood that Payne was acting as personal security,, and not overall tac/ops.
something feels wrong.

I think he was trying to run the whole show just like many accused him of back at the Ranch. To what purpose whether nefarious or simply egotistical I have no idea at this time.

[Badger Paul]

"I DON'T believe in the process and you're a fool if you do. And I'll stay right here despite your belief that you are the director of all things RPF's. "

I'm no director, I'm just giving you some friendly advice. Nearly 29,000 posts since 2007 on a website supposedly devoted to political activism and you're basically calling armed revolution by this point and all I can say is you've wasted your time. But, it's yours to do so.

And that goes for everyone. Do the moderators of RPF want half the posts to be about politics and the campaign and the other half consisting of takeover plots that might interest the FBI? Because that's where its headed. That's how alienated people are. They're not worried about the campaign. I don't disagree with anything that's been said about corruption or in some cases unconstitutional action. But since that's been going on in all governments and institutions since the beginning of time in all nations, shooting off your guns or taking control of a Post Office isn't going to change it. Life goes on, you make the most of it where you can and how you can legally. That's what I believe and if others disagree that's fine. But the Paul movement and RPF in monitoring it is largely statist - because it is going through the legitimate political process and does what it does through that process and believes in that process, like it or not. If you reject that, fine. But you're wasting your time being here then. I don't want censorship but I'm not going to be a party to people's Tea Party fantasies either and as I said, I hope the website and those running it aren't smeared or harassed by it either.

[goldenequity]

Latest LIVE Refuge... sad. crazies in charge.. :eek:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=72MJLxSTiGM

[dannno]

I'm no director, I'm just giving you some friendly advice. Nearly 29,000 posts since 2007 on a website supposedly devoted to political activism and you're basically calling armed revolution by this point and all I can say is you've wasted your time. But, it's yours to do so.


Nah, I'm just tired of hearing some dude yammer on who thinks what the Hammond's lawyer said under threat as some sort of gospel truth about what the Hammonds actually think.

[GunnyFreedom]

I've heard that Ryan Payne was supposedly the Tac Op for the refuge. If he is charged with it's defense then why the hell would he remove himself? Why put the entire leadership in a convoy with a known destination without an escort. Brandon Curtiss with the III% said that if he had been told the PPN would have provided convoy protection.

If what I was heard is correct, Ryan Payne has multiple gunshot wounds from the recent shootout/arrest.

If true, while it reduces the credibility of his being a fed provocateur, it increases the possibility of his simply being an undisciplined hothead. I obviously do not know what happened, but i would not be surprised if Payne lost his cool and LaVoy Finicum got caught in the crossfire. :(

[dannno]

Clinton Foundation took massive payoffs, promised Hammond Ranch and other publicly owned lands to Russians along with one-fifth of our uranium ore.

https://www.intellihub.com/clinton-foundation-payoffs-promised-hammond-ranch-other-publically-owned-lands-russia/

I'm dissecting this in a separate thread later, but worth the read, especially for guys like Badger Paul who seem to have no idea what is actually going on in this country.

[goldenequity]

Again.

New LIVE Refuge:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P-2gUXrzV6U

[phill4paul]

"I DON'T believe in the process and you're a fool if you do. And I'll stay right here despite your belief that you are the director of all things RPF's. "

I'm no director, I'm just giving you some friendly advice. Nearly 29,000 posts since 2007 on a website supposedly devoted to political activism and you're basically calling armed revolution by this point and all I can say is you've wasted your time. But, it's yours to do so.

And that goes for everyone. Do the moderators of RPF want half the posts to be about politics and the campaign and the other half consisting of takeover plots that might interest the FBI? Because that's where its headed. That's how alienated people are. They're not worried about the campaign. I don't disagree with anything that's been said about corruption or in some cases unconstitutional action. But since that's been going on in all governments and institutions since the beginning of time in all nations, shooting off your guns or taking control of a Post Office isn't going to change it. Life goes on, you make the most of it where you can and how you can legally. That's what I believe and if others disagree that's fine. But the Paul movement and RPF in monitoring it is largely statist - because it is going through the legitimate political process and does what it does through that process and believes in that process, like it or not. If you reject that, fine. But you're wasting your time being here then. I don't want censorship but I'm not going to be a party to people's Tea Party fantasies either and as I said, I hope the website and those running it aren't smeared or harassed by it either.

I neither solicited nor care for your advise. Friendly or otherwise. Perhaps it was the activism and the result and a greater knowledge which came from it that leads me to the point of belief that a peaceful change may not be possible. Doesn't mean you don't try for one and prepare for the other. This is the Ron Paul Forums. It's also the Rand Paul forums. It's also the Liberty Forest. There are many paths towards liberty through the forest. Simply because you believe in one and excoriate any others does not afford you the right to tell others they should leave. If you don't want to be a party to it, well...the log out button is only a mouse click away.

[Weston White]

"What justice do you bring your constituents by discounting the causation of this entire incident?"

You mean the half of the county that works for the BLM or other federal agencies or how about the employees at wildlife refuge who couldn't get to their jobs because these yahoos took over the main building? What about the Hammonds who didn't want them there in the first place. Take your pick.

These guys wanted a confrontation with the Feds, they practically begged for it, and they got their wish. One dead and the rest in jail. Some revolution.

When the next stand-off over Federal lands takes place, may please our militia symps take their activities to another website so RPF doesn't get smeared as a militia hub site. Luckily for Rand he's so low in the polls no one bothered to notice. Believe me it would have been different otherwise This is a site for political activism, not bunker plotting.

Wow, you just added several more points that increase disfavor against the BLM and feds general. Good job buddy. And what difference at this point does it make if they get to their job? None, they are stilling being paid and their job entails NOTHING of any practical consequence.

[JK/SEA]

badger paul is a FED.

pretty obvious.

posts shit just like those dildoe obsessive fucks in those chats on the tubes and FB.

[phill4paul]

If what I was heard is correct, Ryan Payne has multiple gunshot wounds from the recent shootout/arrest.

If true, while it reduces the credibility of his being a fed provocateur, it increases the possibility of his simply being an undisciplined hothead. I obviously do not know what happened, but i would not be surprised if Payne lost his cool and LaVoy Finicum got caught in the crossfire. :(

Negative. False reporting in the beginning. Only LaVoy was shot (and killed). Ryan Bundy received shrapnel wounds. There are two accounts of the actual shooting. One is from a driver in Ammons car that was told, second hand, by Payne that LaVoy charged the Feds. The second is from, I believe the 18 yr. old girl (I posted her interview earlier) that was in LaVoys car that said the Feds gunned him down in cold blood. Put suspicion on Payne and his account to me. Everything still in flux and we are still trying to sort it out.

[Badger Paul]

"There are many paths towards liberty through the forest. Simply because you believe in one and excoriate any others does not afford you the right to tell others they should leave."

It isn't a path to liberty. It's path to a cell or a coffin. I'm only saying what I'm saying because I don't want to see innocent people snagged by your delusions. That's why I believe a choice should be made, because you can't reconcile the two.

[Badger Paul]

"badger paul is a FED."

If was a Fed I wouldn't be writing what I am writing. Think about all those alleged informants inside the militias. You'll find they're not the ones calling for prudence and calm.

[phill4paul]

"There are many paths towards liberty through the forest. Simply because you believe in one and excoriate any others does not afford you the right to tell others they should leave."

It isn't a path to liberty. It's path to a cell or a coffin. I'm only saying what I'm saying because I don't want to see innocent people snagged by your delusions. That's why I believe a choice should be made, because you can't reconcile the two.

It most certainly can be a path to liberty. It is our nations history. Or did they leave that out of your public education? If you feel so vehement then message Bryan. It is his site and I will continue to post what I choose to until he decides otherwise. No matter how much it consternates your delicate sensibilities.

[Athan]

They're being brought to justice. That's what's going on.

Ah yes, "justice" a kangaroo court.

[Indy Vidual]

Latest LIVE Refuge... sad. crazies in charge.. :eek:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=72MJLxSTiGM

RIP
At least our best and brightest are not getting killed today.

[twomp]

"I DON'T believe in the process and you're a fool if you do. And I'll stay right here despite your belief that you are the director of all things RPF's. "

I'm no director, I'm just giving you some friendly advice. Nearly 29,000 posts since 2007 on a website supposedly devoted to political activism and you're basically calling armed revolution by this point and all I can say is you've wasted your time. But, it's yours to do so.

And that goes for everyone. Do the moderators of RPF want half the posts to be about politics and the campaign and the other half consisting of takeover plots that might interest the FBI? Because that's where its headed. That's how alienated people are. They're not worried about the campaign. I don't disagree with anything that's been said about corruption or in some cases unconstitutional action. But since that's been going on in all governments and institutions since the beginning of time in all nations, shooting off your guns or taking control of a Post Office isn't going to change it. Life goes on, you make the most of it where you can and how you can legally. That's what I believe and if others disagree that's fine. But the Paul movement and RPF in monitoring it is largely statist - because it is going through the legitimate political process and does what it does through that process and believes in that process, like it or not. If you reject that, fine. But you're wasting your time being here then. I don't want censorship but I'm not going to be a party to people's Tea Party fantasies either and as I said, I hope the website and those running it aren't smeared or harassed by it either.

This is the kind of "freedom lover" that becomes an authoritarian should he ever get into power. DO THINGS MY WAY!! Good bye "freedom lover"!!

[JK/SEA]

RIP
At least our best and brightest are not getting killed today.

subjective.

[Lucille]

They're being brought to justice. That's what's going on.

"Justice," eh?


2. This was totally unnecessary since the resolve of the occupiers was weakening and they were in negotiations to achieve a peaceable exit. What the hurry was is mystifying to me since the Feds negotiated with the Montana Freemen for 81 days before coming to a peaceful resolution.

3. Our attitude was that as much as we disagreed with Ammon Bundy's choice of targets, tactics, timing and "friends" like the sociopath (and probable Fed provocateur) Ryan Payne, the Feds had a higher duty not to violate the occupiers' due process rights.

4. A sniper's bullet at a pre-planned roadblock is NOT due process (http://sipseystreetirregulars.blogspot.com/2016/01/the-feds-accommodate-ammon-bundy-and.html).

5. Such an action would not have been done without the sanction of the political leadership in the White House. Therefore we can conclude that this is, once again, the Feds making a show of the Waco logic embodied in Catch 22: "We can do anything you can't stop us from doing. We are the Imperial Feds and you WILL obey us."

Just Us.

[Indy Vidual]

subjective.

emotional; based on inner experience rather than fact.

[wizardwatson]

If what I was heard is correct, Ryan Payne has multiple gunshot wounds from the recent shootout/arrest.

If true, while it reduces the credibility of his being a fed provocateur, it increases the possibility of his simply being an undisciplined hothead. I obviously do not know what happened, but i would not be surprised if Payne lost his cool and LaVoy Finicum got caught in the crossfire. :(

Mayhaps....

http://www.oregonlive.com/oregon-standoff/2016/01/militant_shot_and_killed_while.html


McConnell said Payne and Cox later recounted how Payne and Finicum got into a "heated discussion" about what to do.

"LaVoy was passionate about this, about the movement," McConnell said.

McConnell said he noticed movement, and Finicum "took off" in the pickup with the remaining passengers. He said Payne and Cox described encountering a police roadblock about a mile north on the highway and apparently tried to get around it, becoming stuck in the snow.

"When he exited the vehicle, the rear wheels were still spinning," McConnell said. "He charged at law enforcement" and was shot.

McConnell disputed earlier accounts on social media that Finicum was shot while on his knees with his hands up.

[phill4paul]

Latest LIVE Refuge... sad. crazies in charge.. :eek:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=72MJLxSTiGM

I can't watch that shit. This is what happens when you allow the opposition to take out the entire leadership in one fell swoop.

[wizardwatson]

This article saying dead protester pulled a gun...

Don't know if this info has already propagated. Not following the thread that close

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2016/01/27/1-dead-feds-arrest-oregon-protest-leader-ammon-bundy/79392112/

EDIT: "Unidentified sources", of course

[69360]

They capitalized on an incident to bring attention to their own directly related situation, both which are national--as this affects more than a single state. Do you think the feds give a crap if you write them letters from the safety of your home office? You will simply be ignored or blown off with a canned response. They do not care about you or your concerns. You are less than a whisper in a crowded stadium to them.

The "aggrieved family" has no direct involvement with the BLM's offices--and regardless they are under duress by the feds, so of course they are not going to speak against their captors.

And they did not go across the country, they drove over to the adjacent state.

So, what is your alternative? A mass hunger-strike?

I think you defend what is yours and you defend those who ask for your help.


so i guess we're just going to wait and watch as these patriots get killed, shake our heads and tell ourselves this was an ill advised op, and tune in to American Idol tonight with the pop corn and drinks...move along, nothing to see here...

While I think it was ill advised, I am not opposed to miltias in general. I also think it was a damn shame somebody got killed.


The Weather Underground thought they were doing the right thing too.

"It should be obvious to anyone awake that the Hammonds went back to jail to protect their families. No one in their right mind would desire to be jailed TWICE for the same offense. Rather unconstitutional, wouldn't you agree?"

I agree completely and the prosecutor needs to be investigated but taking control of a Federal building by people who have no connection to the family or anyone else in the area and just looking for trouble and disrupting innocent people's lives in the process isn't going to help the situation and just makes things worse.

I'm not gloating over anyone's death. I'm just happy this situation is finally starting coming to a close and this Johnny Reb crap is being exposed for the idiocy that it is and Bundys and others are hardly revolutionaries. Bottom line is you either believe in the process or you don't and if you don't then I would ask you take yourselves away from RPF and retreat to your compounds because you have no business being here.

FWIW my late father was an SDS chapter president and the FBI used to come banging on our door looking for Weather Underground members in the 70's when I was a kid. I don't think the Weather Underground was doing the right thing, but I do think the Bundys were at their ranch. I don't agree with them taking this building.


Nah, I'm just tired of hearing some dude yammer on who thinks what the Hammond's lawyer said under threat as some sort of gospel truth about what the Hammonds actually think.

IMO if they though otherwise, they would not have reported to jail and made a stand on their ranch. I actually would have supported that action.

[phill4paul]

This article saying dead protester pulled a gun...

Don't know if this info has already propagated. Not following the thread that close

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2016/01/27/1-dead-feds-arrest-oregon-protest-leader-ammon-bundy/79392112/

EDIT: "Unidentified sources", of course

Two different accounts. One a second hand source citing Ryan Payne, who was in the vehicle, said LaVoy Finicum charged the Feds. The second a first hand account from an 18 yr. old female in the car saying he was gunned down with hands raised. Both accounts are several pages back because of the detritus clogging the thread up.

[JK/SEA]

emotional; based on inner experience rather than fact.

everyone has a role to play. Some gravitate to leader positions, and others gravitate to true warrior status, but when leaders go down in the field usually someone else picks up the torch. Its not rocket science.

[TruckinMike]

Eye witness account of shooting ---> she was in the car that took the gunfire


https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Y92PvMFL0Eg

[wizardwatson]

Two different accounts. One a second hand source citing Ryan Payne, who was in the vehicle, said LaVoy Finicum charged the Feds. The second a first hand account from an 18 yr. old female in the car saying he was gunned down with hands raised. Both accounts are several pages back because of the detritus clogging the thread up.

So is it two accounts or three?

charging with gun
hands up don't shoot

or

charging
pulling a gun
hands up don't shoot

I'm guessing the former.

[goldenequity]

No current raw feed... probably battery.

Listening to commentary
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_lAYQLD-ZuY.

[JK/SEA]

''you're risking a civil war''.. Rhodes to FEDS

''no more Wacos'' ..Stuart Rhodes

i guess we shall soon find out.

[phill4paul]

So is it two accounts or three?

charging with gun
hands up don't shoot

or

charging
pulling a gun
hands up don't shoot

I'm guessing the former.

I'm only going to go with two accounts. Anytime a reporter lists an "quoting unidentified sources" tells me that it is a government agent acting on conditions of anonymity to put the official spin out there.

[goldenequity]

I'm only going to go with two accounts. Anytime a reporter lists an "quoting unidentified sources" tells me that it is a government agent acting on conditions of anonymity to put the official spin out there.

EYEWITNESS TESTIMONY (I downloaded it. They were being murdered.)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y92PvMFL0Eg

[JK/SEA]

convoy headed to the reserve. Comms down.

[goldenequity]

Current RAW


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dfJDwg6pmM0

[pcosmar]

Mayhaps....

http://www.oregonlive.com/oregon-standoff/2016/01/militant_shot_and_killed_while.html

Mayhaps,, but this McConnell sounds more like the Fed Plant to me.
the only one not arrested and telling a story.

edit,, knee jerk,, I don't know if he said that or if some writer made it up..
But something is foul,, and a lack of aid from those able to do so is disgusting.
it does not matter if you agree with them or not,,

Murder is wrong,, even when Government does it.

[phill4paul]

Mayhaps,, but this McConnell sounds more like the Fed Plant to me.
the only one not arrested and telling a story.

His accounts were second hand. From, he says, Payne and Cox. So there is a bit of a mix up. Given the 18 yr. old females account it would seem that he would have seen the first gunfire exchange as Finicum was only 200 yds. down the road before he took off driving. His account is indeed suspicious.

[RonPaulIsGreat]

Dudes should just give up, there is no "winning". They can die I suppose, but even then there won't be much sympathy, given the goofballs on camera are clearly seeking death by Fed confrontation, or at least chest thumping to that effect.

Stupid is as Stupid does, even Gump knows that. The guy that died, I saw in the previous videos was over the top as well. He was hunting for death.

I detest the Federal government but it's clear most of these guys are mentally ill. The semi-sane ones gave up without their beloved battle to the death. Liberty isn't being watered here.

[goldenequity]

again.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ub15XMwnHfc

[pcosmar]

''you're risking a civil war''.. Rhodes to FEDS

''no more Wacos'' ..Stuart Rhodes

i guess we shall soon find out.

I keep hearing that and Cops keep killing folks with no repercussions.

I am wondering who exactly is the controlled opposition and who are not.

Hint.. Government enforcers are the enemy of liberty.
Kissing the asses of such is unproductive.

[Lucille]

http://hopelesslysane.blogspot.com/2016/01/democrats-would-be-rioting.html

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-Nv8AtfQs6Gs/VqjZWltIclI/AAAAAAAAciw/zgP7ra66QFQ/s1600/2016.PNG

[Valli6]

Greg Walden statement on the situation in Harney County

January 27, 2016 Press Release

HOOD RIVER – U.S. Rep. Greg Walden (R-Hood River) today issued the following statement on the situation in Harney County:

“I've been in close contact with local and federal officials throughout this long standoff, and we had all hoped for a peaceful conclusion to the situation in Harney County. Sadly, our hopes were shattered with the shooting that occurred during last night's arrest. While we wait to learn more details and next steps, we must keep the people of Harney County in our hearts as they are a strong community and have endured a great deal. Once again, I urge those who remain at the refuge to go home before anyone else gets hurt. And when this is done and the cameras' glare turns away from rural Oregon, the healing process will be a long one. Widespread frustration will continue until people in rural America feel like they are being heard and meaningful changes are made to federal land management policy.”

[goldenequity]

Washington Post Livefeed Burns Oregon.... 3 speakers scheduled. No Q&A


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PfPOYPDNLHo

[JK/SEA]

Dudes should just give up, there is no "winning". They can die I suppose, but even then there won't be much sympathy, given the goofballs on camera are clearly seeking death by Fed confrontation, or at least chest thumping to that effect.

Stupid is as Stupid does, even Gump knows that. The guy that died, I saw in the previous videos was over the top as well. He was hunting for death.

I detest the Federal government but it's clear most of these guys are mentally ill. The semi-sane ones gave up without their beloved battle to the death. Liberty isn't being watered here.

reads like what King George probably said about his subjects across the Atlantic in 1776.

[goldenequity]

RAW Live: Helicopter heard...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a-rdXj9xrGI

or here: The Watchman (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_lAYQLD-ZuY)

[GunnyFreedom]

Helo just did a close orbit

[youngbuck]

Washington Post Livefeed Burns Oregon.... 3 speakers scheduled. No Q&A


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PfPOYPDNLHo

Speakers come out at about 47:00, speaking starts at about 47:45. First guy to speak is FBI Special Agent in Charge in Oregon.

[goldenequity]

RAW Live:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QuJki_GfE-U
or here: The Watchman (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_lAYQLD-ZuY)

[GunnyFreedom]

They are really bad at this camera thing.

[Dr.3D]

They are really bad at this camera thing.
Looks like they needed to mark what the top of the camera is.

[Occam's Banana]

I regret that I have but one rep to give for this post.


Have you been in a coma for the last 15 years? "The process" has been hopelessly corrupted to the point where there is no justice left in the "justice" system. You can be sure that the corrupt monsters with their claws into the system down to the bone will not be routed peacefully. They are thugs and monsters, and force is the only language they speak.

Eventually, to route out the corruption, it will come down to force. Even if we won every election, and every Sheriff's office, and every DA in the country, these people will not leave peacefully. Once they have tasted power they will not let go without a fight. This is simply the nature of the beast.

http://i.imgur.com/Jor2RYj.jpg

http://media0.giphy.com/media/11uArCoB4fkRcQ/giphy.gif

[Occam's Banana]

I agree completely and the prosecutor needs to be investigated [...]

Bottom line is you either believe in the process or you don't and if you don't then I would ask you take yourselves away from RPF [...]

What "process" would that be? The same "process" by which you say "the prosecutor needs to be investigated" ... ? :rolleyes:

If you actually believe in that, then I've got some prime ocean-front property in Wyoming to sell you.

(And don't worry - it isn't "owned" by the Feds or "managed" by the BLM or anything like that ... I promise ...)

[nobody's_hero]

"I DON'T believe in the process and you're a fool if you do. And I'll stay right here despite your belief that you are the director of all things RPF's. "

I'm no director, I'm just giving you some friendly advice. Nearly 29,000 posts since 2007 on a website supposedly devoted to political activism and you're basically calling armed revolution by this point and all I can say is you've wasted your time. But, it's yours to do so.

And that goes for everyone. Do the moderators of RPF want half the posts to be about politics and the campaign and the other half consisting of takeover plots that might interest the FBI? Because that's where its headed. That's how alienated people are. They're not worried about the campaign. I don't disagree with anything that's been said about corruption or in some cases unconstitutional action. But since that's been going on in all governments and institutions since the beginning of time in all nations, shooting off your guns or taking control of a Post Office isn't going to change it. Life goes on, you make the most of it where you can and how you can legally. That's what I believe and if others disagree that's fine. But the Paul movement and RPF in monitoring it is largely statist - because it is going through the legitimate political process and does what it does through that process and believes in that process, like it or not. If you reject that, fine. But you're wasting your time being here then. I don't want censorship but I'm not going to be a party to people's Tea Party fantasies either and as I said, I hope the website and those running it aren't smeared or harassed by it either.

Oh give me a break.

The most we're going to get out of the political process is a chance to educate people. GunnyFreedom is right. The leviathan won't let go of power without a fight. Never has, never will. If what you are saying is true, then the patriots in 1775 got a lot of people killed unnecessarily because all they really had to do was vote harder or something and the king would've been like, 'whoops, my bad!'. That sir, is as much of a fantasy (if not more so) as what you refer to as the Johnny Reb mentality.

The question is not whether or not there will be a fight, but when and where it would be wisest to have that fight. I don't think Oregon was the time nor the place. Nevada was. Unfortunately Oregon sort of wiped out any progress made in Nevada and now militias are seen by boobus as the bad guys again.

And for what it's worth, the FBI is interested in everything said here, even the legal stuff. I'm sure I'm on a list somewhere just for being a delegate for Ron Paul, and that was using the process. Martin Luther King, Jr. used "the process" and the FBI has more files on him than Osama bin Laden. Maybe it's you who is delusional.

[Deborah K]

Eye Witness to the shooting:



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZSwAeVI1abc

[phill4paul]

I just had a FB debate about this. Christ, people a braindead. I had to keep re-iterating over and over that McConnell wasn't present at the shooting and that he made unverifiable second hand claims about the situation. And that Victoria gave a first hand eyewitness account. Over, and over and over. I finally just gave up.

[nobody's_hero]

Oh give me a break.

The most we're going to get out of the political process is a chance to educate people. GunnyFreedom is right. The leviathan won't let go of power without a fight. Never has, never will. If what you are saying is true, then the patriots in 1775 got a lot of people killed unnecessarily because all they really had to do was vote harder or something and the king would've been like, 'whoops, my bad!'. That sir, is as much of a fantasy (if not more so) as what you refer to as the Johnny Reb mentality.

The question is not whether or not there will be a fight, but when and where it would be wisest to have that fight. I don't think Oregon was the time nor the place. Nevada was. Unfortunately Oregon sort of wiped out any progress made in Nevada and now militias are seen by boobus as the bad guys again.

And for what it's worth, the FBI is interested in everything said here, even the legal stuff. I'm sure I'm on a list somewhere just for being a delegate for Ron Paul, and that was using the process. Martin Luther King, Jr. used "the process" and the FBI has more files on him than Osama bin Laden. Maybe it's you who is delusional.

and if everyone who didn't believe in the process had to leave RPF then [Badger Paul] would be awfully lonely here. It's highly probable that most of us don't believe in it even as we work to get Rand Paul elected. This is more like something we can point to when SHTF and say that we honestly tried every alternative.

'Don't blame me, I voted for Rand Paul.'

(supposed to have been an edit)

[Badger Paul]

"then the patriots in 1775 got a lot of people killed unnecessarily because all they really had to do was vote harder "

The patriots could not vote for people who made policy in Great Britain (i.e. Parliament) that affected them. That is what no taxation without representation means.

[JK/SEA]

"then the patriots in 1775 got a lot of people killed unnecessarily because all they really had to do was vote harder "

The patriots could not vote for people who made policy in Great Britain (i.e. Parliament) that affected them. That is what no taxation without representation means.

correct. They wrote strongly worded letters of discontent instead, only to be re-buffed with a police state, and the rest is...history.

[Deborah K]

Two different accounts. One a second hand source citing Ryan Payne, who was in the vehicle, said LaVoy Finicum charged the Feds. The second a first hand account from an 18 yr. old female in the car saying he was gunned down with hands raised. Both accounts are several pages back because of the detritus clogging the thread up.

The girl practically swoons over Payne in her testimony. (He's at least got her convinced that he's legit.) And Payne is supposedly stating that Finicum charged the Feds?? Hmmmm....

[phill4paul]

The girl practically swoons over Payne in herThere is no confirmation that Payne actually said anything. testimony. (He's at least got her convinced that he's legit.) And Payne is supposedly stating that Finicum charged the Feds?? Hmmmm....

No. The driver of Ammon's vehicle, a guy named McConell, who was stopped and released said that he talked to Payne. So what is being bandied about as what Payne said is unconfirmed.

[Deborah K]

No. The driver of Ammon's vehicle, a guy named McConell, who was stopped and released said that he talked to Payne. So what is being bandied about as what Payne said is unconfirmed.

Would love to hear from Payne. Would love to see the vehicle. Any chance we'll get either?

[phill4paul]

Would love to hear from Payne. Would love to see the vehicle. Any chance we'll get either?

I'm gonna buy a lotto ticket and see what comes out ahead.

[Deborah K]

Next, we'll be hearing how shots were fired from the vehicle, which is why the Feds shot it up. But will we ever see forensics results on whether their weapons were ever fired? Probably not...Will we get to see the vehicle?

[pcosmar]

Would love to hear from Payne. Would love to see the vehicle. Any chance we'll get either?

Doubts,, They will keep Payne away from any media.. as well as evidence of the ambush.

[Indy Vidual]

http://posca-life-custom.com/sites/default/files/obey-obama.jpg

[phill4paul]

Next, we'll be hearing how shots were fired from the vehicle, which is why the Feds shot it up. But will we ever see forensics results on whether their weapons were ever fired? Probably not...Will we get to see the vehicle?

Doesn't matter. The Feds can fire for any reason under SCOTUS guidelines. Circular force continuum is no longer in the play book. It's simply comply or die.

[GunnyFreedom]

Eye Witness to the shooting:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZSwAeVI1abc
I appreciate it, but I can't understand a word she's saying. I need subtitles. I tried the YouTube CC option but that's even more nonsensical than the audio. :(

[Deborah K]

Here's KrisAnn talking about it:

http://krisannehall.com/oregon-truth/

[Occam's Banana]

I regret that I have but one rep to give for this post.


Have you been in a coma for the last 15 years? "The process" has been hopelessly corrupted to the point where there is no justice left in the "justice" system. You can be sure that the corrupt monsters with their claws into the system down to the bone will not be routed peacefully. They are thugs and monsters, and force is the only language they speak.

Eventually, to route out the corruption, it will come down to force. Even if we won every election, and every Sheriff's office, and every DA in the country, these people will not leave peacefully. Once they have tasted power they will not let go without a fight. This is simply the nature of the beast.

http://i.imgur.com/Jor2RYj.jpg

http://media0.giphy.com/media/11uArCoB4fkRcQ/giphy.gif

[nobody's_hero]

"then the patriots in 1775 got a lot of people killed unnecessarily because all they really had to do was vote harder "

The patriots could not vote for people who made policy in Great Britain (i.e. Parliament) that affected them. That is what no taxation without representation means.

Here is an example of how your vote does not matter:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Lx2AXjlcRk

It's all predetermined bud. I'm sorry to have to be the one to break it to you, since it probably comes as a shock and all.

Oh and this was in the related videos: Here's the entire 2012 delegation from Maine holding a rump convention after they were KICKED OUT BY YOUR BELOVED "PROCESS"


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_yIKl4l728M


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mtjMS4tPWCA

I could post these videos all day (the evidence is as plentiful as it is damning) but I'm not gonna waste my time on someone who has been here for 8 damned years and has amnesia about how many times we've been shat on by the process.

[FrancisMarion]

18 U.S.C.
United States Code, 2011 Edition
Title 18 - CRIMES AND CRIMINAL PROCEDURE
PART I - CRIMES
CHAPTER 19 - CONSPIRACY
Sec. 372 - Conspiracy to impede or injure officer
From the U.S. Government Printing Office, www.gpo.gov

§372. Conspiracy to impede or injure officer
If two or more persons in any State, Territory, Possession, or District conspire to prevent, by force, intimidation, or threat, any person from accepting or holding any office, trust, or place of confidence under the United States, or from discharging any duties thereof, or to induce by like means any officer of the United States to leave the place, where his duties as an officer are required to be performed, or to injure him in his person or property on account of his lawful discharge of the duties of his office, or while engaged in the lawful discharge thereof, or to injure his property so as to molest, interrupt, hinder, or impede him in the discharge of his official duties, each of such persons shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than six years, or both.

(June 25, 1948, ch. 645, 62 Stat. 701; Pub. L. 107–273, div. B, title IV, §4002(d)(1)(D), Nov. 2, 2002, 116 Stat. 1809.)

Historical and Revision Notes

Based on title 18, U.S.C., 1940 ed., §54 (Mar. 4, 1909, ch. 321, §21, 35 Stat. 1092).
Scope of section was enlarged to cover all possessions of the United States. When the section was first enacted in 1861 there were no possessions, and hence the use of the words “State or Territory” was sufficient to describe the area then subject to the jurisdiction of the United States. The word “District” was inserted by the codifiers of the 1909 Criminal Code.

Amendments
2002—Pub. L. 107–273 substituted “under this title” for “not more than $5,000”.

Blood boils.

[Bryan]

To resolve some of the site debate issues...


The site has a very carefully defined Mission, if you support that Mission then this is the right place for you.

The site also has very carefully defined Usage Guidelines, these are necessary to keep the site functional and ideally, thriving.



Some key takeaways from them are that we accept there are many possible paths to liberty but the site staff certainly doesn't know what is best or what will even work. If we did, it would have already been done. So we are very open to dialog and promoting ideas and action to what will work. May the right path be presented, be supported and be executed.


That said, there are certainly some ethical and legal considerations that need to be accounted for to keep the site functional. As such, the Usage Guidelines will limit these elements as necessary which includes prohibiting calls for violence.


In short, there is no reason to ask the staff, you can read what is published in the Mission and Usage Guidelines, we'll be happy to answer any questions on those.


Hope this clears things up.

[JK/SEA]

The girl practically swoons over Payne in her testimony. (He's at least got her convinced that he's legit.) And Payne is supposedly stating that Finicum charged the Feds?? Hmmmm....

'furtive move' or 'charged'...same thing to a coward.

[goldenequity]

RAW Live:

Previous:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P-2gUXrzV6U

Current Live:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I6B4TFYmhss

or here: The Watchman (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_lAYQLD-ZuY)

[JK/SEA]

III% on FB are having 'call to arms'...guns up. At least thats what he said.

[Lucille]

"Authorities urge remaining Oregon occupiers to quit after killing."
http://sipseystreetirregulars.blogspot.com/2016/01/authorities-urge-remaining-oregon.html


The arrests and shooting have angered anti-government protesters across the country, said Mike Vanderboegh, a gun-rights activist active in self-proclaimed militia circles. "It's all I can do to keep people from going and shooting feds right now," he told Reuters. Vanderboegh said the FBI had acted too quickly to end a situation that was already headed toward peaceful resolution.

"Malheur: The 3,025 FPS Arrest Warrant."
http://sipseystreetirregulars.blogspot.com/2016/01/malheur-3025-fps-arrest-warrant.html


News of the recent events in Oregon deeply saddened me. According to Victoria Sharp (who was in the car that was ambushed) Lavoy Finicum was shot when he had his hands in the air. We really won’t know who to believe until video of the event is released. (There were 30+ vehicles there, so the chances are very good that a dashcam recorded what happened.) The Federal agents have apparently now upped the ante, turning what had been a peaceful dialogue into a shooting affray. It saddens me to hear that there was loss of life in the ambush-arrest of several of the Malheur protestors. I must ask: Why did the FBI roadblock them out in the middle of nowhere, where there would no independent witnesses? (Why not just arrest them in the parking lot, just before the well-publicized public meeting?) Since when is an arrest warrant served at 3,025 feet per second?

[ChristianAnarchist]

The sheriff goon looked pretty upset in that video... I'd say he's spending a lot of time looking over his shoulder...

[goldenequity]

"They murdered him. I am an eye witness. Tell the people what they did." -- Ammon Bundy
https://www.facebook.com/DMLdaily/videos/1107295109309945/?fref=nf

A full 20min interview with Mel Bundy in 1 hour. http://www.newsmaxtv.com/

I gave Mel Bundy 20 full minutes to tell the story of what took place last night in Oregon, and what will happen next now that one man is dead and his brothers are being held by the FBI. You can catch the exclusive interview tonight on UNFILTERED. 9pm ET, and again at midnight. Only on NewsmaxTV.

https://static.xx.fbcdn.net/rsrc.php/v2/y4/r/-PAXP-deijE.gif
==========
ugh.. I started to (try) and watch newsmax.... couldn't handle it. I'll wait for the youtube.

[wizardwatson]

"They murdered him. I am an eye witness. Tell the people what they did." -- Ammon Bundy
https://www.facebook.com/DMLdaily/videos/1107295109309945/?fref=nf

A full 20min interview with Mel Bundy in 1 hour. http://www.newsmaxtv.com/

I think if Ammon is asking them to stand down at this point they should.

As sick as it is, the economics of the moment put the pressure on the Fed's to explain the death. If a shootout occurs and a cop is killed, there isn't any leverage for anything. So if what Ammon is supposedly saying is true, that he can get a deal for the remaining occupiers to not be prosecuted if they give up the refuge, they should take it. I don't think any good will be salvageable if a full on shootout occurs. Let Ammon take over the protest from court as he says.

Of course, it appears from reports that there's a few players in the refuge who just want to die. Well, that will certainly generate more attention but it's only going to aggravate the public and become a divisive issue. If you really want some "peaceful" solution, I think this is the out. You wanted to be martyrs, well, one of your guys is one. If you force a shootout at this point, I think the public will side much more with law enforcement after that event.

If they are "really" interested in any kind of grassroots activist change that doesn't amount to scorched earth with respect to civil order, I think this is the last train.

Though, I'm not even sure it's a real deal. Sounds too generous almost, but perhaps this was the FBI's plan all along. Arrest the leadership off site, offer the rest immunity.

[idiom]

Stand down, have a huge fucking funeral with everyone carrying.

That ups the ante for the next confrontation.

Its that or start a war now. But seriously people are not pissed off enough yet.

[Zippyjuan]

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2016/01/27/arrests-death-brings-new-leadership-for-militia-group-in-oregon-standoff.html


Oregon standoff leader asks holdouts at refuge to go home

The attorney for the leader of an armed group occupying an Oregon wildlife refuge said Wednesday the man wants those remaining at the refuge to "please stand down" and go home.

Ammon Bundy made an initial appearance in federal court in Portland, Oregon after he and seven others were arrested Tuesday during an incident with police that killed 1.

This photo provided by the Multnomah County Sheriff's Office on Wednesday, Jan. 27, 2016, shows Ammon Bundy, one of the members of an armed group occupying the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge as part of a dispute over public lands in the Western U.S. Bundy and several others were arrested on Tuesday, Jan. 26, prompting gunfire and leaving one man dead during a traffic stop along a highway in Oregon's frozen high country. (Multnomah County Sheriff via AP)Expand / Contract

Mike Arnold, Bundy's attorney, read a statement afterward in which Bundy urged those still at the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge to leave.

In the statement, Bundy asked the federal government to allow the people remaining at the refuge to depart without being prosecuted. Addressing those still holding out, Bundy's statement said: "Please stand down. Go home and hug your families. This fight is now in the courts. Please go home."


An unknown number of protesters remained at the refuge Wednesday, but members of the media began leaving after the FBI reportedly told some journalists the Bureau couldn't offer "protection."

KTVZ reporter Lauren Martinez tweeted a video of her leaving the compound area with the ominous note "@FBI warns media no protection." Oregon Public Broadcasting reporter John Sepulvado tweeted ".@OPB was told by FBI that we were on our own -- essentially stuff is going down and we need to move."

Earlier in the day, Jason Patrick, one of the leaders of the crew remaining at the outpost, said he could see an armored convoy and a number of law enforcement officers gathered from his perch in the compound.

"Sounds like the definition of peaceful resolution is either forcefully kidnapping me or death," Patrick told USA Today. "A peaceful resolution is not dead people."

The FBI and Oregon State Police were also establishing a series of checkpoints along key routes in and out of the refuge on Wednesday. The agencies said in a statement that the containment was to 'better ensure the safety of community members."

Bretzing said any remaining occupants of the refuge were free to leave through the checkpoints, but those leaving would be identified on their way out.

Patrick wouldn’t say how many people remained with him at the refuge, but he told The Washington Post that occupiers weren’t planning on leaving because of the arrests.

“Right now, we’re doing fine,” Patrick said. “We’re just trying to figure out how a dead cowboy equals a peaceful resolution.” Patrick’s comments could have been aimed at Oregon Gov. Kate Brown who asked for “patience as officials continue pursuit of a swift and peaceful resolution.”

Patrick told The Oregonian: “We’re all standing here ready to defend our peaceful resolution.”

Other protesters suggested the standoff may be petering out.

Brand Thornton, one of Bundy's supporters, said he left the refuge Monday and wasn't sure what those remaining would do.

"The entire leadership is gone," he told The Associated Press in a telephone interview. "I wouldn't blame any of them for leaving."

[asurfaholic]

I am keeping this situation in my prayers and offer up that the battles are raging, but the war is already won. Hope that this can de-escalate before it gets riduliculous and perceptions get polluted by a few rash/ unwise choices.

Stand strong and keep the cameras on every second.

[goldenequity]

Back up streaming... campfire


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0f4zR3Ey8ec

The Watchman (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_lAYQLD-ZuY)

[PursuePeace]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qw5_K8krdZo

[goldenequity]

Spitfire Sentinel LIVE


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hj34aVwJryY