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View Full Version : Donald Trump: The Establishment Candidate




jct74
12-18-2015, 03:00 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vt2NPP1z-y8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vt2NPP1z-y8



While his rise in the polls is attributed to his challenging the establishment and the political status quo, let's look at the many ways Donald Trump, when it comes to his political positions, represents that very same status quo. From the Fed, to war, to civil liberties, the "anti-establishment" Trump takes no positions not already endorsed by the establishment.

Chester Copperpot
12-18-2015, 07:01 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vt2NPP1z-y8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vt2NPP1z-y8

well hes against illegal immigration and hes for a nationwide conceal carry permit right??? Arent those 2 positions against the establishment?

kcchiefs6465
12-19-2015, 01:02 AM
well hes against illegal immigration and hes for a nationwide conceal carry permit right??? Arent those 2 positions against the establishment?
The correct positions would be to not bastardize the labor market and not for a nationwide permit, but for the abolition of CCW permits altogether.

It would also be to be against eminent domain, to be against bombing North Korea, Iran, etc., to be against a so called assault weapons ban etc.

As far as I am aware he only has two correct positions (probably for the wrong reasons as he doesn't understand what rights are). They are: his position on the tax code (which could not happen regardless with his welfare/warfare state) and his position on so called free trade agreements.

The man is a protectionist demagogue.

CaptUSA
12-19-2015, 07:17 AM
Wait a minute. You mean the mainstream media would give nonstop coverage to a candidate that promotes the establishment policies?! Nah, can't be true.

tod evans
12-19-2015, 07:56 AM
There are several here who would benefit from watching this video...

doublek321
12-19-2015, 01:48 PM
Another wonderful speech by Dr. Paul. One small nit to pick though is at around 4:40 he talks about things Trump hasn't talked about. I think Donald did talk about some of this stuff. For example, didn't Trump say he's against common core? Didn't he also say the Iraq war was a mistake? And I could be wrong but didn't he mention blowback (maybe not using that exact word but that concept) as a motive for terrorism? Regardless, Dr. Paul's larger message is absolutely correct. Trump basically promises he'll be a better manager of everything (which leaves all the power in the hands of the federal government rather than the people). Also Trump is a tyrannical sort who believes in censoring the internet, being biased against religious groups and building walls.

Feeding the Abscess
12-19-2015, 03:14 PM
Another wonderful speech by Dr. Paul. One small nit to pick though is at around 4:40 he talks about things Trump hasn't talked about. I think Donald did talk about some of this stuff. For example, didn't Trump say he's against common core? Didn't he also say the Iraq war was a mistake? And I could be wrong but didn't he mention blowback (maybe not using that exact word but that concept) as a motive for terrorism? Regardless, Dr. Paul's larger message is absolutely correct. Trump basically promises he'll be a better manager of everything (which leaves all the power in the hands of the federal government rather than the people). Also Trump is a tyrannical sort who believes in censoring the internet, being biased against religious groups and building walls.

If Donald has talked about blowback, the whole bit about killing terrorists' families runs counter to that. Score one for Ron Paul.

LibertyEagle
12-19-2015, 03:44 PM
I agree, but if Rand doesn't magically garner more support, we are s*** out of luck.

Peace&Freedom
12-19-2015, 04:45 PM
I agree, but if Rand doesn't magically garner more support, we are s*** out of luck.

Bingo. This is seeing the trend of the primaries, instead of focusing on the personalities. Regardless of their actual views, three GOP candidates connect with the non establishment voters, and Rand has not been connecting. The focus should be on replicating what the others have done to engage the anti-establishment vote (the themes, the positioning, etc), not on debate society details about what establishment positions Trump et al has or doesn't have.

jmdrake
12-20-2015, 07:05 AM
well hes against illegal immigration and hes for a nationwide conceal carry permit right??? Arent those 2 positions against the establishment?

Donald Trump was for illegal immigration and gun control before he was against it. And a nationwide carry permit = nationwide gun owner database. :eek:

Donald Trump against Gun control.
I am against gun control

At the Conservative Political Action Conference, Trump took issue with Rep. Ron Paul, R-Texas, the libertarian-thinking lawmaker who set some Internet fundraising records with his 2008 presidential bid. "Ron Paul cannot get elected, I'm sorry," Trump said, calling him "a good guy" who has "zero chance" of getting elected. The remark about Paul prompted some boos and screams from some in the audience, some of them Paul supporters out in force to help their candidate win CPAC's presidential straw poll for the second year in a row.

In his CPAC speech, Trump sounded many themes popular with Republican conservatives. "I am pro-life," he said. "I am against gun control."
And in one of his biggest applause lines, Trump vowed to end the nation's health care law: "I will fight to end Obamacare and replace it with something that makes sense for people in business and not bankrupt the country." Trump also pledged not to raise taxes if elected.
Source: USA Today report on 2011 Conservative Political Action Conf. , Feb 10, 2011

Donald Trump FOR gun control!

Dems and Reps are both wrong on guns

It’s often argued that the American murder rate is high because guns are more available here than in other countries. Democrats want to confiscate all guns, which is a dumb idea because only the law-abiding citizens would turn in their guns and the bad guys would be the only ones left armed. The Republicans walk the NRA line and refuse even limited restrictions.
Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000
For assault weapon ban, waiting period, & background check

I generally oppose gun control, but I support the ban on assault weapons and I support a slightly longer waiting period to purchase a gun. With today’s Internet technology we should be able to tell within 72-hours if a potential gun owner has a record.

When are you Trumpsters going to learn that Trump is a salesman and he will lie to you to gain your support?

jmdrake
12-20-2015, 07:09 AM
I agree, but if Rand doesn't magically garner more support, we are s*** out of luck.

I'm holding out for a Rand bump in Iowa. But if that doesn't happen, if I Rand loss becomes inevitable, I will be forced to support Cruz. At least Cruz is not a total gun grabbing, private property grabbing fascist like Donald Trump.

mt4rp
12-20-2015, 07:52 AM
I'm talking to a lot of older people who for the first time in their lives are considering not voting out of disgust. I think Trump is being run by the system in an attempt to entice the disgruntled to continue participating in their own enslavement .