Toilet Hell: 21 Years of Failed Flushing

[Suzanimal]

You flush and flush again. It’s clogged. You plunge, and it’s kind of blech. You have lost your appetite, but finally the situation is resolved. Thank goodness the water didn’t spill over the top, because you are at a friend’s house and that would have been humiliating.

That scenario is part of ordinary life today. Has it ever been any other way?

Americans under the age of 30 very likely have no memory of household toilets that work well. And they probably think nothing of it. They are used to it by now.

This is sad. A generation ago, toilets were wonderful. You pulled the lever, and everything went down with a huge whoosh, leaving a clean bowl in its wake.

You didn’t need to have a plunger nearby for common clogging emergencies. You could use thicker paper than one ply. You didn’t need to scrub stains out every few days. You didn’t have to replace the parts inside every few months.

Mostly you could depend with certainty that whatever was inside would flush away with one pull of the lever. Not two. Not three. Just one. No stains remained because, in the old days, 3 or 4 gallons would blast through the bowl and keep it clean. This rushing water would also keep the pipes clean and kept all stink away from the facilities.

It was glorious! I have a vague memory of this. But like some dystopian novel in which an idyllic past has been flushed down the memory hole, people today are completely unaware of what it is like to have a working toilet — a really working toilet.

A basic requirement of civilization — meaning health, cleanliness, and as limited exposure to disease as possible — is that we figure out ways to dispose of human waste. It was a big deal in the ancient world. Rome was a marvel of the world with its aqueducts and sewers that anticipated the best of modern sanitation.

The technology regressed after the fall of Rome and didn’t quite recover for another 1,500 years — and, in the meantime, lack of sanitation contributed mightily to the plagues. Once modernity was born, indoor plumbing was the first to arrive. In the 20th century, the problem was solved with great plumbing and fixtures.

Leave it to the United States Congress to revert the progress of millennia. In 1992, a new law was passed (the Energy Policy Act) that came into effect in 1994. That law mandated that all toilets sold in the United States use no more than 1.6 gallons, which was less than half the water usually used in every flush.

The result was awful. People would buy new toilets or move into new homes and be startled to discover that something they had taken for granted for ages suddenly stopped working.

Why is my new toilet causing so many problems? Why is it clogging all the time? What is that strange stink? Why am I having to crawl around the basement looking for that old plunger?

Then there was a huge shift in the toilet paper market. Paper once used only for the most primitive systems and in prisons suddenly became common.

Black markets developed. You could briefly buy large tank toilets online, but those ran out. Then a porcelain-running market developed between the US and Canada, until border control tightened. Fines increased to $2,500 for any plumber in the US who installed one, and inspectors were forced to report them.

Today, it is next to impossible to find a large tank toilet in the United States.

Several Congressman tried to repeal the law. As with most things Congress does, most legislators had no clue about what they had done. They had rolled back indoor plumbing, a pillar of civilization! But it is much easier to ruin things with regulations than it is to repeal those regulations, so the push came to naught.

And yes, there have been some improvements by manufacturers over time: new shapes, air blasts, different inner workings, and so on. But, in the end, when you are only working with 1.6 gallons, the paltry amount of water is good for some things but not for others, if you know what I mean.

What was the purpose of all of this? We are told often about how much water we are saving. What we are not told is that domestic water use in general, according to the Department of the Interior, is 1 percent of total water use. That includes your dishwasher, washing machine, showers, drinking water, toilets, and even watering grass. In other words, the savings is negligible and essentially pointless.

And look at the cost! The whole thing is outrageous. If you and I do not have a toilet that works super well in our own homes, something has gone very wrong with the state of civilization itself. As long as the technology is available, and we are willing to pay for it, it is a human right.

Next time your toilet clogs, turn your embarrassment into outrage and demand a change.

http://fee.org/anythingpeaceful/21-years-of-failed-flushing/

[phill4paul]

http://i.imgur.com/v4inNXM.gif

[tod evans]

Black markets developed. You could briefly buy large tank toilets online, but those ran out. Then a porcelain-running market developed between the US and Canada, until border control tightened. Fines increased to $2,500 for any plumber in the US who installed one, and inspectors were forced to report them.


Right here is where Americans capitulated to the idiots in DC.

Nullification takes place at street level.

[ds21089]

Wow that's really shitty.

[phill4paul]

Right here is where Americans capitulated to the idiots in DC.

Nullification takes place at street level.

I have charged a premium for finding and installing them. Put in a low flush. After inspection replace with high volume. Wash, rinse Wipe, flush, repeat using the same low volume.

[euphemia]

This is one of the advantages to having an older home. We still have a high flow tank.

Go ahead. Be jealous.

[fisharmor]

Literally right after reading this I left four streaks on the bowl.
It wasnt anything that three more flushes couldnt take care of... this time.

I think its important to note I'm a 5 minute walk away from the water treatment plant on the Occoquan river, so I get to see the millions of gallons of water I'm NOT using three blocks away....

[specsaregood]

./

[phill4paul]

That isn't how I remember them; in fact that description sounds more like modern toilets that rely upon using jets and increased suction rather than water.
The old toilets I remembered were more like the bowl filled with giant swirling pool of poop water that turned into a huge gaping poop whirlpool (hopefully). If that whirlpool suddenly stopped, you had to quickly reach to turn the valve and stop it before it overflowed to the floor. It seems to me that modern toilets are a lot less likely to overflow as well.

I think you mis-remember. There are two toilets in my house. One is in "my" bathroom, a high volume. The other is in "her" bathroom, a low volume. Guess which of the two I plunge at least once a week?

[tod evans]

My 2nd youngest brother plumbs for a living and he loves the "new and improved" toilets.

Since their inception the majority of his residential work is digging up lines running out to the street and replacing them.

After X-number of snakes run through PVC to unclog solidified waste the PVC fails, after just one snaking the inner wall is scratched which enables chunks to grab hold causing the next clog.

All this is due entirely to an insufficient amount of water accompanying the solids.


Makes me wonder how much water is wasted manufacturing and replacing the pipes.......

[specsaregood]

/.

[tod evans]

Which part do I misremember? It seems to me that with less volume, the newer toilets are less likely to overflow, that doesn't mean they are less likely to get clogged.

That's the point, they opened up the throat in the improved toilets to let larger chunks pass knowing unsuspecting Boobus would applaud both the saved water and the infrequent overflow...

It's all about instant gratification, never mind the down the road consequences..

BTW, little brother makes over $150,000 + bonuses every year......

[phill4paul]

Which part do I misremember? It seems to me that with less volume, the newer toilets are less likely to overflow, that doesn't mean they are less likely to get clogged.

You quoted the OP...


A generation ago, toilets were wonderful. You pulled the lever, and everything went down with a huge whoosh, leaving a clean bowl in its wake.

and responded...


That isn't how I remember them; in fact that description sounds more like modern toilets that rely upon using jets and increased suction rather than water.


So, :confused:.

[phill4paul]

My 2nd youngest brother plumbs for a living and he loves the "new and improved" toilets.

Since their inception the majority of his residential work is digging up lines running out to the street and replacing them.

After X-number of snakes run through PVC to unclog solidified waste the PVC fails, after just one snaking the inner wall is scratched which enables chunks to grab hold causing the next clog.

All this is due entirely to an insufficient amount of water accompanying the solids.


Makes me wonder how much water is wasted manufacturing and replacing the pipes.......

And there is this...

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to tod evans again.

[specsaregood]

/.

[Matt Collins]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FAn1FWInBi0

[phill4paul]

I don't recall the old toilets making a "huge whoosh". They seemed relatively quiet compared to the new ones that use jets and such. I know our newer toilet is a helluva lot louder than our older toilet. Its sounds like a jet engine by comparison.

Ah, got it. Thought you were referring to the sentence as a whole, everything going down and leaving a clean bowl, as opposed to just a "huge whoosh."

[Anti Federalist]

You ain't seen nothing yet.

Wait until the Paris Climate Accords are passed, by presidential decree, later this month.

All these toilets that don't flush and light bulbs that don't light and washers that don't wash are just a warm up for what's to come.

Enjoy, mundanes.

[Zippyjuan]

Just need one of these (and it meets California low-water use standards):

http://www.americanstandard-us.com/learn/american-standard-advantage/innovations/?f=2


Champion 4 Toilet

Meet the Champion 4, the undisputed leader in high performance toilets. With the industry's widest 2 3/8" trapway and 4" flush valve, it created a plunger free world for homeowners and virtually eliminated clogged toilet call backs for plumbers. The Champion will move a mass 70% larger than the industry standard. It achieves the highest bulk removal rating of 1,000 grams and will even flush a bucket of golf balls! Which means you can flush with confidence and never worry about plunging a toilet again.

Did you ever wonder if there was something that could keep the streaking in your toilet bowl from happening? Well there is. Our Exclusive EverClean surface inhibits the growth of mold, mildew and bacteria that cause streaking and the unsightly ring around your bowl. The Champion 4's EverClean surface is a permanent fired in surface, so it's always working for you. The toilet actually stays cleaner longer. Which means less work for you. The Champion 4 also comes with the most comprehensive warranty. The toilet and the tank parts are covered for 10 years. That's 9 years more than many other brands. Now that's worry free living.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gaWDH16SqVs

[angelatc]

Expensive toilet....

[Zippyjuan]

Or you can go cheap and won't flush.

[BarryDonegan]

Ahh the unintended consequences of nannies.

[UWDude]

uhh... when I was a kid, toilets were still flooding all the time.
Just sayin'.
It's not like plungers were invented in 1993.

However, I have found, through my parents properties, that newer toilet systems, especially the newer plug and floater systems, are far more problematic than the old ball and stick system. But that is because almost everything new and improved these days seems to be worse and cheaper. I'd susect it has more to do with mass production cost cutting procedures than actual technical difference.

Also, Americans have gotten fatter since the nineties, so maybe they are noticing their toilets are clogging more because they are taking many more mondo shits.

[Anti Federalist]

Or you can go cheap and won't flush.

How about: I decide, and government can go pound salt?

[MelissaWV]

I can't remember the last time the toilet clogged. I'm not sure what on earth some of you are eating. I'm not sure I want to know.

[Occam's Banana]

Black markets developed. You could briefly buy large tank toilets online, but those ran out. Then a porcelain-running market developed between the US and Canada, until border control tightened. [...]

This reminded me of one of my favorite Dave Barry columns (from 01 November 1998):


I SAY IT'S TIME our "leaders" in Washington stopped blathering about sex and started paying attention to the issues that really matter to this nation, such as whether we should declare war on Canada.

I say: yes. I base this position on a shocking document that I have obtained via a conduit that I will identify here, for reasons of confidentiality, only as "the U.S. Postal Service." Here is a direct quote from this document:

"Step One: Before inflating Passionate Pam, be sure to smear plenty of ..."

Whoops! Wrong document! I meant to quote from an article in the July 1998 issue of Contractor magazine, which was sent to me by alert reader Steve Hill. The article, written by Rob Heselbarth, begins:

"WINDSOR, Ontario - Americans are crossing the Canadian border near Detroit to purchase 3.5-gallon-per-flush toilets."

That is correct: Canada has become a major supplier of illegal 3.5-gallon toilets. These toilets were banned by Congress in 1992 under the Energy Policy and Conservation Act, which decreed that henceforth U.S. citizens had to buy 1.6-gallon toilets, which would conserve a lot of water if they worked, which unfortunately most of them don't, the result being that U.S. citizens now spend more time flushing their toilets than on all other forms of exercise combined.

But that is not the point. The point is that 1.6-gallon toilets are the law of the land, and as the late Supreme Court Justice Felix Frankfurter stated: "Just because Congress passes a stupid law, that is no excuse for awwwggh." Unfortunately, Justice Frankfurter died at that point, but most legal scholars believe he intended to finish his sentence by saying "... that is no excuse for people to go up to Canada and buy working toilets."

Yet that is exactly what is happening. The Contractor article quotes a Canadian plumbing wholesaler as follows: "We've definitely seen an increase in the sales of 3.5-gallon toilets. The people who buy them are mostly from the States. They tell us outright they're Americans who came here to buy them."

The article quotes officials of both the Department of Energy and the Environmental Protection Agency as stating that it is illegal to bring these toilets into the United States. But it also quotes a Customs Service official as saying that Customs makes no effort to confiscate the toilets. "As long as they tell us they have them," the official said, "it makes no difference to us."

In other words, people can simply waltz across our borders with illegal toilets supplied by ruthless Canadian toilet cartels headed by greed-crazed Canadian toilet kingpins who will stop at nothing to push their illicit wares on our vulnerable society. If you are a parent, consider this chilling scenario: Your child is attending a party, when another youngster - a "bad apple" - approaches and says, "Psst! Wanna try a 3.5-gallon Canadian toilet? All the other kids are doing it!" The next thing you know, your child is acting furtive and sneaking off to a "bad part of town" whenever nature calls. Your child is hooked.

Perhaps your parental reaction is: "My little Tommy would never do a thing like that!" Well, let me ask you a couple of questions:

* Do you fully comprehend the power of peer pressure?

* Are you aware that your child is not named "Tommy"?

* Did you realize that "peer pressure" was a toilet-related pun?

If you answered "yes" or "no," then maybe you are beginning to see why we, as a nation, need to send a clear message to the Canadians, in the form of either a sternly worded letter or a nuclear strike. Strong words, you say?

Perhaps you will change your mind when you hear what else Canada is exporting. I refer to an article sent in by alert reader Joe Kovanda from the June 1998 issue of Farm Times, reporting that Canada's foreign trading partners were complaining that shipments of Canadian feed barley contained excessive amounts of - get ready - deer excrement. The headline for this article, which I am not making up, states: "Deer Manure in Barley Miffs Japanese."

So there is little doubt that the entire world, or at least Japanese barley buyers, would stand with us if we put a stop to Canada's reign of terror; if we stood up to Canada and said: "Listen, Maple Breath, we are fed up with your efforts to destroy our way of life with your large, working toilets and your excessive deer doots, which by the way would be an excellent name for a rock band."

Some other advantages of declaring war on Canada are (1) It's one of the few foreign nations that average U.S. citizens - even possibly the CIA - can locate on a map; and (2) professional ice hockey would be canceled. There's virtually no downside! So I urge you to call your elected representatives today and tell them, in no uncertain terms: "I am strongly in favor, although don't ask me of what." Also let them know that we, the people, don't want to hear another word about this Washington sex scandal. Or, if we have to hear more, how about some new episodes? Speaking of which, I have to go; Passionate Pam has sprung a leak.

[phill4paul]

Just need one of these (and it meets California low-water use standards):

http://www.americanstandard-us.com/learn/american-standard-advantage/innovations/?f=2




https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gaWDH16SqVs

Which is all well and good. Shit goes through the toilets "neck." How does it address the fact that the shit has to travel a length of pipe before it goes into a septic system or a larger waste disposal pipe. If there is not enough liquid to carry the waste through the pipe the pipe will become clogged. It's not the toilet that is going to back up. It's the stoppage in the line.

[Anti Federalist]

Which is all well and good. Shit goes through the toilets "neck." How does it address the fact that the shit has to travel a length of pipe before it goes into a septic system or a larger waste disposal pipe. If there is not enough liquid to carry the waste through the pipe the pipe will become clogged. It's not the toilet that is going to back up. It's the stoppage in the line.

Pipe down, you.

Zip and Our Leaders know what is best.

Now, buy your $1000 Ferguson and move along.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IL2YRDzpTL4

[Danke]

Just like voting. Flush early, flush often.

[chudrockz]

I can't remember the last time the toilet clogged. I'm not sure what on earth some of you are eating. I'm not sure I want to know.

Shoot. I stop toilets at LEAST three times a week. It's gotten so bad that if I'm at someone else's house and need to "go," I excuse myself and go to a gas station.

[Danke]

Shoot. I stop toilets at LEAST three times a week. It's gotten so bad that if I'm at someone else's house and need to "go," I excuse myself and go to a gas station.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gjwofYhUJEM

[Suzanimal]

We're plunging so much I put a plunger in every bathroom. It's ridiculous. And the toilet in the master bathroom barely has any water in it. I dunno what that's all about.

[Anti Federalist]

http://i.imgur.com/v4inNXM.gif

I'm sure I don't want to think about how badly that could go wrong.

[phill4paul]

I'm sure I don't want to think about how badly that could go wrong.

Yeah, ain't about to give mouth-to-mouth with those chest compression's. :p

[phill4paul]

We're plunging so much I put a plunger in every bathroom. It's ridiculous. And the toilet in the master bathroom barely has any water in it. I dunno what that's all about.

Mineral build-up in the rim holes. If you feel around the underside of the rim there are little holes. These wash and fill the bowl. Mineral deposits and mildew can build up in them. Get an old style coat hanger and use the hook to clean these holes.

[Suzanimal]

Mineral build-up in the rim holes. If you feel around the underside of the rim there are little holes. These wash and fill the bowl. Mineral deposits and mildew can build up in them. Get an old style coat hanger and use the hook to clean these holes.

Ewww.....that sounds like a job for Mr Animal.

[Anti Federalist]

Mineral build-up in the rim holes. If you feel around the underside of the rim there are little holes. These wash and fill the bowl. Mineral deposits and mildew can build up in them. Get an old style coat hanger and use the hook to clean these holes.

I wonder if a jug of CLR run through it would do the trick?

[phill4paul]

I wonder if a jug of CLR run through it would do the trick?

I think it is meant to set and soak but it's not going to hurt anything. I'ts biodegradable and septic safe if you are on that system. Using a coat hanger has always worked for me but I don't see were it would be a problem. Unless it is harsh on gasket seals. Then... I dunno.

[phill4paul]

Ewww.....that sounds like a job for Mr Animal.

Of course. This was meant as instruction for you to relay to him. ;) Men can't fulfill the patriarchal role by only being able to open jars.

[brushfire]

I went with the Toto Drake. I seem to recall it jump starting the innovation in the industry, but it can definitely take more sh!t that I can dish it. The tank fills fast and it cycles within ~5 seconds or so. That is, hit the lever, flush, and refill the tank. Slightly quieter than the 1975 model Kohler 5 gal that it replaced, but definitely more aggressive.

LOL what people wont do to push the limits. Not the first flush, but not clogged either.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p6cxiOTl-q0

[Danke]

I went with the Toto Drake. I seem to recall it jump starting the innovation in the industry, but it can definitely take more sh!t that I can dish it. The tank fills fast and it cycles within ~5 seconds or so. That is, hit the lever, flush, and refill the tank. Slightly quieter than the 1975 model Kohler 5 gal that it replaced, but definitely more aggressive.

LOL what people wont do to push the limits. Not the first flush, but not clogged either.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p6cxiOTl-q0

That is why I am not a vegetarian.

[brushfire]

That is why I am not a vegetarian.

Yea, a bit more fiber than one needs, even for a vegetarian.

[Anti Federalist]

I'm impressed.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yt5kXFKhbIQ

[TheNewYorker]

I don't know, I have 3 newer toilets in my house, and they almost never clog. Maybe once a year. And even then, I'm not lazy enough where taking a few minutes to plunge bothers me.

Maybe you all are shitting incorrectly or something.

[ChristianAnarchist]

Shoot. I stop toilets at LEAST three times a week. It's gotten so bad that if I'm at someone else's house and need to "go," I excuse myself and go to a gas station.

I almost NEVER stop up a toilet but then I make sure not to dump a very large load at one time. You can always flush halfway through your business when necessary. I'm old enough to remember the big flushers. We had one with the elevated tank on the wall that was at least 4 gallons per flush. It had a great volume and it didn't get stopped up very often but when it did, watch out... About 2 of those gallons will be all over the floor along with a few floaters... What a mess.

I'm not saying these 1.6 flushers are the greatest but really, can't you poop a couple and flush, then poop again and wipe? People in China (where I have gone often for 22 years) tell me that the toilets in China are so bad you should not flush the paper after wiping your butt. They have trash cans next to the shitter to put your dirty paper in. I find that disgusting and I refuse to do it so for 22 years I've been flushing my paper down the Chinese toilets that supposedly can't handle it. I've maybe one time stopped up a Chinese toilet during those 22 years. My wife's parents about have a heart attack every time I bring up the fact that I flush paper down their toilets but they never have problems after I've done my business... It's all in the wrist. Poop, flush, poop some more, wipe, flush...

[RabbitMan]

I don't know, I have 3 newer toilets in my house, and they almost never clog. Maybe once a year. And even then, I'm not lazy enough where taking a few minutes to plunge bothers me.

Maybe you all are shitting incorrectly or something.

Agreed. I feel like these newer toilets that are being referred to are really just lower-end products, as most new homes are built to flip these days. I haven't had more than the once a year or so plunge work from something that was just a bit too much to handle.

And who told the OP that toilet paper is 1-ply these days? The only places I see 1-ply at are the dollar store and cost-conscious businesses.

[Marenco]

http://i.imgur.com/v4inNXM.gif
Somehow that reminds me of the Federal Reserve trying to contain the crappy economy with a simple bandage.

[UWDude]

It's all in the wrist.

LoL!!

[TheNewYorker]

Agreed. I feel like these newer toilets that are being referred to are really just lower-end products, as most new homes are built to flip these days. I haven't had more than the once a year or so plunge work from something that was just a bit too much to handle.

And who told the OP that toilet paper is 1-ply these days? The only places I see 1-ply at are the dollar store and cost-conscious businesses.

My toilets are not extremely new, but they are all the 1.5GPF as mentioned in the first post. I mean, they are probably all about 10-15 years old or so. Maybe newest toilets (i.e.) in the last 5 years or so really do have some kind of cheaply made parts or something causing problems, but I don't really see how.

Toilets are pretty damn simple. Seems like it would be pretty hard for a manufacturer to fuck it up. The design of the modern s-trap toilet has been around for almost 200 years now. The only thing that has changed is maybe a few parts in the tank. But that really shouldn't affect things getting clogged, as the clog doesn't happen in the tank.

Maybe pipes in peoples homes are the problem. Maybe PVC or such like mentioned. I'm not sure. My sewer pipes are the old school clay pipes, which are another problem all together. The fucking things are just about all cracked and have tree roots growing in them. Going to have to dig my entire yard up soon and take out the floors in my house. Almost wish I had the PVC.

RE: Toilet paper, I use cottonelle. I'm not sure of the ply, but it's pretty damn thick and soft.

[RonPaulIsGreat]

Got a spare monster toilet in a bathroom I don't even use. Excellent value. Your water bill will surge!, and your poops will be jettisoned into the nearest river at hypersonic speed. Awesome deal!

Bidding starts at 2000.00

[jbauer]

Yeahhhh I missed this. Whats the next draconian idea coming down the pipe?....or lack of flow in the pipe as it pertains to this thread.


You ain't seen nothing yet.

Wait until the Paris Climate Accords are passed, by presidential decree, later this month.

All these toilets that don't flush and light bulbs that don't light and washers that don't wash are just a warm up for what's to come.

Enjoy, mundanes.

[kpitcher]

Just need one of these (and it meets California low-water use standards):

http://www.americanstandard-us.com/learn/american-standard-advantage/innovations/?f=2




https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gaWDH16SqVs


Flushing golf balls is stupid unless you actually have waste that looks like that. Consumer Report did a study awhile ago where they made something out of beans that was about the same as human waste. Then they tested a lot of fixtures.

Toto was the best flushing. They do work well, they're actually priced nicely Although they have fancy ones that get more expensive.

[tod evans]

The problems begin when the crap is out of sight.......

http://www.city-data.com/forum/house/2155730-low-flow-toilets-drain-problems-go.html

[Pericles]

Right here is where Americans capitulated to the idiots in DC.

Nullification takes place at street level.

Agree - defiance is the answer

[TheNewYorker]

Who needs a toilet? Just dig a hole. Has worked fine for millennia.

You can even get fancy and put a roof on it. Call it an outhouse.

[phill4paul]

Who needs a toilet? Just dig a hole. Has worked fine for millennia.

You can even get fancy and put a roof on it. Call it an outhouse.

In many localities verboten by law.

[TheNewYorker]

In many localities verboten by law.

Who's going to know.

Oh, that over there? That's my shed.

[Cissy]

I expect that if one were to visit the mansion of (insert politician's name here), one would find a perfectly functional toilet and quality plumbing.

[phill4paul]

I expect that if one were to visit the mansion of (insert politician's name here), one would find a perfectly functional toilet and quality plumbing.

"Grandfathered." "Historical."