TX-Teacher fired for FedBook post suggesting racial segregation was a good thing

[Anti Federalist]

'Blacks' should be 'segregated': Texas elementary teacher fired for Facebook post on McKinney video

http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/local/article/Texas-teacher-deletes-Facebook-post-with-racial-6321410.php

A teacher at an elementary school near Lubbock has been fired after writing she was "almost to the point" of supporting racial segregation following a controversial police incident in McKinney.

Frenship Independent School District officials fired Karen Fitzgibbons, a fourth-grade teacher at Bennett Elementary School in Wolfforth, for making the controversial post, the district announced in a statement Thursday.

In the since-deleted post, Fitzgibbons decried the Tuesday resignation of McKinney Police Cpl. David Eric Casebolt, shown on video pointing his gun at two unarmed black teenagers and pinning a 15-year-old black girl clad in a swimsuit to the ground outside of a neighborhood pool in McKinney.

"I'm just going to just go ahead and say it...the blacks are the ones causing the problems and this 'racial tension,'" Fitzgibbons wrote in the Facebook post. "I guess that's what happens when you flunk out of school and have no education. I'm sure their parents are just as guilty for not knowing what their kids were doing; or knew and didn't care."

The elementary school teacher continued, "I'm almost to the point of wanting them all segregated on one side of town so they can hurt each other and leave the innocent people alone. Maybe the 50s and 60s were really on to [sic] something. Now, let the bashing of my true and honest opinion begin...GO! #imnotracist #imsickofthemcausingtrouble #itwasagatedcommunity"

In a news release, officials said "Frenship ISD is deeply disappointed in the thoughtlessness conveyed by this employee's post. "We find these statements to be extremely offensive, insensitive, and disrespectful to our Frenship community and citizens everywhere. These comments in no way represent the educational environment we have created for our students."

The statement continued, "We hold our employees responsible for their public conduct even when they are not on active duty as district employees. Employees are held to the same professional standards in their public use of electronic media as they are for any other public conduct. This recent conduct was unacceptable."

Fitzgibbons told the Lubbock Avalanche-Journal that the post "was not directed at any one person or group" and that she "apologized to the appropriate people."

"It was not an educational post; it was a personal experience post," Fitzgibbons told the Avalanche-Journal.

Fitzgibbons isn't the only school official in hot water for making online comments about the McKinney incident: the Associated Press reported that Alberto Iber, principal of North Miami Senior High School in Florida, was removed from his position and reassigned to administrative duties after making a public comment supporting Casebolt on The Miami Herald's website.

[Anti Federalist]

http://i.imgur.com/gMCrwdC.jpg

[Mach]

AF, do you think your employer should review your 60,000+ posts and discipline you, for them?

[tod evans]

Government employees are not permitted to type their thoughts....

Maybe that'll get a few of 'em riled up but I'm betting most will shut their mouths and go along just to keep their place on the tit...

Here's a story about a principal who got the axe for his opinion. (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?476632-Pool-deal-in-Tx-related-but-different-twist)

[alucard13mm]

I live in a diverse neighborhood. I gotta say... when i was in school, the black kids were usually more loud and disruptive. Of course there were quiet blacks, but they were the exceptions.

Based on exams and scoring... usually whites or asians get the highest scores. Ive never seen a black kid have the highest score in academics. Not trying to be racist, but these are just observations living and going to school in a middle class, diverse suburban neighborhood.

[VIDEODROME]

I live in a diverse neighborhood. I gotta say... when i was in school, the black kids were usually more loud and disruptive. Of course there were quiet blacks, but they were the exceptions.

Based on exams and scoring... usually whites or asians get the highest scores. Ive never seen a black kid have the highest score in academics. Not trying to be racist, but these are just observations living and going to school in a middle class, diverse suburban neighborhood.


I'm not sure a lack of a willingness to participate in public school is necessarily a bad thing.

[Slave Mentality]

I always schadenfreude when I read these.

[Anti Federalist]

AF, do you think your employer should review your 60,000+ posts and discipline you, for them?

No, not at all.

There is a school of thought that says that, once having accepted employment, then, well, pretty much anything goes as far as what an employer wants you to do, or wants to do to you.

I am not in that school.

[dannno]

He is saying it was a gated community, yet the black kids were all invited via twitter.

I would probably fire him from my private school if I had one.

[Anti Federalist]

He is saying it was a gated community, yet the black kids were all invited via twitter.

I would probably fire him from my private school if I had one.

Him?

Who are we talking about?

It was a her.

Lesson learned: Do not use FedBook

[Ender]

I'm not sure a lack of a willingness to participate in public school is necessarily a bad thing.

Agreed- especially since everyone learns differently. Public School is an indoctrination prison.

[Cissy]

Dear Teacher:

This is the Internet. No matter what privacy settings you set, anyone who is determined enough can and will (given incentive) find anything you type on it.

Do not type anything on the Internet that you would not be willing to say in a public place. You aren't having a private conversation at your residence with a like-minded friend.

Best regards,

[osan]

So here we have two key points to consider. The most obvious is that your opinions are something to which you are no longer entitled... unless they happen to be the right ones, of course.

The other is that, given reality #1 and the fact that any adult should be well aware that everything they do online is logged, documented, perused, examined, analyzed, quantified, characterized, scrutinized, and palletized for sale or other transfer, they should be holding their yaps about such things if in fact one of their daily goals is to retain their means of paying bills.

Consider that this teacher's career as a teacher is now over. It is kaput - finito. She will likely not be able to find a job as a teacher anywhere in the 50 states. Surely she should have known this was going to be the result of her momentary outburst.

I find myself torn in these situations. On the one hand there are the practical considerations to take into account. On the other, there is the normative "right" that is trampled into the dust every day and with ever greater violence and scope with each new day that passes. This nation is an incomprehensibly messed up place.

Ca. 1990 I semi-jokingly began quipping that the day would come when people would be escaping America to go to Russia for a taste of freedom. The notion was so completely nutty to me that I figured it would have to come to pass, to some degree. Snowden is perhaps the first. I can only wonder who will be second, then third, and so on. What goes on here numbs me with its howling, bland, inarticulate insanity. There isn't even the least shred of art in it. America has become my vision of hell on earth.

[libertariantexas]

This teacher was a complete idiot and/or had been drinking heavily when she decided to post her racist crap on Facebook.

What did she think would happen? She would have been fired from almost any school, public or private, anywhere in the USA for her COLLECTIVIST (not libertarian, btw) nonsense post.

After essentially calling for forced segregation of the races (not exactly a libertarian ideal, folks), and supporting a clearly out of control authoritarian thug cop (who appeared to be only going after the black kids- also not libertarian), she probably would have been fired from most jobs.

She is free to think or say whatever she wants, but she is not free to say whatever she wants WITHOUT CONSEQUENCE.

She's a moron. It's best for everyone that she not teach children. Maybe now she can take a job that more properly fits her skill set- perhaps stocking store shelves.

[libertariantexas]

Based on exams and scoring... usually whites or asians get the highest scores. Ive never seen a black kid have the highest score in academics. Not trying to be racist, but these are just observations living and going to school in a middle class, diverse suburban neighborhood.

So what are you saying, that we should judge people based on collective groups?

That if the average black is less academically skilled than the average white, we should treat them all, even the many who are far brighter and more successful than you, as second class citizens?

Did you get lost and somehow wander into the Ron Paul (very libertarian, not collectivist) Forums by mistake?

[libertariantexas]

Also, I'm glad that cop was shoved out the door as well. Even if you don't think he was racist (despite glaring evidence that he was), you should be appalled by his authoritarian thuggery.

We don't need cops tossing around children who have done nothing more "wrong" than simply not react quickly enough to the cops authoritarian commands.

[RonPaulMall]

This teacher was a complete idiot and/or had been drinking heavily when she decided to post her racist crap on Facebook.

What did she think would happen? She would have been fired from almost any school, public or private, anywhere in the USA for her COLLECTIVIST (not libertarian, btw) nonsense post.

After essentially calling for forced segregation of the races (not exactly a libertarian ideal, folks), and supporting a clearly out of control authoritarian thug cop (who appeared to be only going after the black kids- also not libertarian), she probably would have been fired from most jobs.

She is free to think or say whatever she wants, but she is not free to say whatever she wants WITHOUT CONSEQUENCE.

She's a moron. It's best for everyone that she not teach children. Maybe now she can take a job that more properly fits her skill set- perhaps stocking store shelves.

Actually, since she works for the government she is protected by the 1st Amendment in a way that doesn't apply to private employers. Also, there is nothing contradictory about "segregation" and "libertarianism". In a libertarian world, it would have been private security running those black kids off, and the private schools that replace the public ones would no doubt be just as, if not more segregated, than what exists today.

[69360]

So what are you saying, that we should judge people based on collective groups?

That if the average black is less academically skilled than the average white, we should treat them all, even the many who are far brighter and more successful than you, as second class citizens?

Did you get lost and somehow wander into the Ron Paul (very libertarian, not collectivist) Forums by mistake?

Honestly, you sound more like a progressive liberal than a libertarian, if you want to play the label me game...

[pcosmar]

Honestly, you sound more like a progressive liberal than a libertarian, if you want to play the label me game...

Really,, I thought it sounded exactly like what Ron Paul would say.

[Anti Federalist]

After essentially calling for forced segregation of the races (not exactly a libertarian ideal, folks), and supporting a clearly out of control authoritarian thug cop (who appeared to be only going after the black kids- also not libertarian), she probably would have been fired from most jobs.

I'm not in favor of either, especially authoritarian cops.

I have a hard time accepting the idea that, simply for speaking your mind, your life can, and should be, ruined.

Especially when government starts to prosecute you for it, like that fellow in Montana recently.

Because it will be us next.

[RonPaulMall]

Also, I'm glad that cop was shoved out the door as well. Even if you don't think he was racist (despite glaring evidence that he was), you should be appalled by his authoritarian thuggery.

We don't need cops tossing around children who have done nothing more "wrong" than simply not react quickly enough to the cops authoritarian commands.

There isn't any evidence at all that the cop was "racist". The police were called in because hundreds of black teens had illegally broken in to a white private pool and were raising hell. Black teens were being targeted not because the cop was "racist", but because in this particular situation, they were the criminals and easily identifiable by the color of their skin.

The police officer should have done a better job of keeping his cool, but don't act like there is some unique libertarian issue regarding the racial dynamics of the case. In a Libertarian World, McKinney's police force would be entirely private and they would have been entirely within their rights to shoot the invaders dead.

[Anti Federalist]

The police officer should have done a better job of keeping his cool, but don't act like there is some unique libertarian issue regarding the racial dynamics of the case. In a Libertarian World, McKinney's police force would be entirely private and they would have been entirely within their rights to shoot the invaders dead.

Oh for fuck's sake...

You don't shoot unarmed kids for crashing a fucking pool party.

[Christian Liberty]

Oh for fuck's sake...

You don't shoot unarmed kids for crashing a fucking pool party.

Indeed.

Its funny, in my time at this forum I've gone from being a minarchist who favored limited government police, to an ancap who wanted all prviate police, to a theonomist who doesn't want any police at all.

While my reasons were mostly philosophical, this is indeed a VERY good reason. What RonPaulMall described isn't moral no matter who does it. It also isn't libertarian ie. proportional.

As for this teacher... ugh... our government schools are already indoctrinating people into loving the government... and I'm expected to care that a professional indoctrinator was fired for defending the government? I can't. Though I realize the precedent that it sets.

[RonPaulMall]

Oh for fuck's sake...

You don't shoot unarmed kids for crashing a fucking pool party.

I'm not saying you necessarily would, but lets not sugarcoat the situation. This neighborhood was invaded by over a hundred violent teens. In a Libertarian world, the response almost certainly would have been swifter and more violent than those keystone cops.

[69360]

Meh, she can hate black people. I really don't care and it's not grounds to lose a government job. If she actually discriminates against blacks while employed by government, then fire her.

[thoughtomator]

I love topics about which the country isn't capable of having an honest conversation.

But between us, let's talk about the reality of the situation. Feel free to argue by point number.

1. There is absolutely a set of problems associated with the integration of American blacks into the rest of the culture.

2. The essence of this problem is a lack of respect for the rights of others as expressed with violence.

3. The set of problems are discussed as racial issues, but they are really cultural. Blacks who come here from Africa don't exhibit these problems until they get integrated with the US culture. Black kids who grow up as the only black kid in a white neighborhood - in other words, culturally "white" - don't have these issues.

4. Thus, this is not a "black" problem. This is an "American black" problem.

5. Socioeconomic factors do have an impact but they cannot explain all the data. There are additional issues specific to American blacks not explainable by poverty alone.

6. American black culture is simple barbarism.

7. This barbarism has emerged due to a lack of civilizing factors.

8. Missing civilizing factors include: food, safe shelter, education, family structures.

9. A person can be fed and clothed through charity but this is not a long term solution for a large-scale population.

10. A person cannot be educated if he is not willing to be educated. The will to be educated is dependent on other missing civilizing factors such as having sufficient food, secure shelter, and the example of other educated individuals.

11. Without education in and basic knowledge of government, these people cannot meaningfully participate in a representative process, yet they impact greatly by voting for whoever will promise them solutions to their problems of food, shelter, and education.

12. This leads to the kind of assholes getting in control of government who have every incentive to keep all these problems going, since it is what got them to where they are in the first place.

13. Family structures have been obliterated by mass incarceration.

14. In particular, fathers have been removed almost entirely from the American black family.

15. There is no factor more closely associated with poor outcomes for children than the absence of a father.

16. A boy with no father, and whose friends have no fathers either, is going to have an extremely difficult time learning how to be a decent father himself.

17. The support of a welfare state has contributed to the perpetuation of these fatherless rump-families in huge numbers, where survival requirements would dictate other behavior in the absence of direct material support.

18. Even beyond the war on drugs, the damage done to American family structures (white, black and other) from the war on men conducted by the Family Court system and the laws that enable this destruction is a major factor in removing fathers from their families.

19. In order to progress towards a solution to the above set of problems, the first step has to be returning fathers to their families.

20. Fathers solve the root cause issues of the barbarism by providing food, shelter, security, and education to their children.

21. In order to return fathers to their families, the mass incarceration associated with the war on drugs has to end. In other words, if you want black kids not to turn out to be violent street thugs, don't put their fathers in jail over bullshit, don't incentivize their mothers to kick their fathers out.


I could probably make a list of a hundred points if I wanted to be detailed enough. American black kids by and large are fucked over in a big way from the moment they are born, and from the experience learn to do so to others, and thus we end up with a culture that innovates things like sucker-punching random people in the street. As is so often the case, government drives the problem, makes it a thousand times what it might be otherwise.

have at it

[RonPaulMall]

One quibble I would have is that Africa isn't exactly some paradise. You say "Africans" that come over here don't exhibit the same dysfunctions but getting from Africa to America isn't easy at all and generally only open to the African elites (like Barack Obama's Dad) or the most ambitious and resourceful of the poor. If you look at Africans in Africa you see a lot of the same problems you see in American inner cities. So I think it is at least as much genetic as it is cultural.

[Christian Liberty]

I'm not saying you necessarily would, but lets not sugarcoat the situation. This neighborhood was invaded by over a hundred violent teens. In a Libertarian world, the response almost certainly would have been swifter and more violent than those keystone cops.

We need to define the word "violent." Violence as in breaking the NAP, or violence as in people being physically attacked? The distinction matters.

[Pericles]

Him?

Who are we talking about?

It was a her.

Lesson learned: Do not use FedBook

Nothing good comes from a Fedbook post.

[puppetmaster]

I love topics about which the country isn't capable of having an honest conversation.

But between us, let's talk about the reality of the situation. Feel free to argue by point number.

1. There is absolutely a set of problems associated with the integration of American blacks into the rest of the culture.

2. The essence of this problem is a lack of respect for the rights of others as expressed with violence.

3. The set of problems are discussed as racial issues, but they are really cultural. Blacks who come here from Africa don't exhibit these problems until they get integrated with the US culture. Black kids who grow up as the only black kid in a white neighborhood - in other words, culturally "white" - don't have these issues.

4. Thus, this is not a "black" problem. This is an "American black" problem.

5. Socioeconomic factors do have an impact but they cannot explain all the data. There are additional issues specific to American blacks not explainable by poverty alone.

6. American black culture is simple barbarism.

7. This barbarism has emerged due to a lack of civilizing factors.

8. Missing civilizing factors include: food, safe shelter, education, family structures.

9. A person can be fed and clothed through charity but this is not a long term solution for a large-scale population.

10. A person cannot be educated if he is not willing to be educated. The will to be educated is dependent on other missing civilizing factors such as having sufficient food, secure shelter, and the example of other educated individuals.

11. Without education in and basic knowledge of government, these people cannot meaningfully participate in a representative process, yet they impact greatly by voting for whoever will promise them solutions to their problems of food, shelter, and education.

12. This leads to the kind of assholes getting in control of government who have every incentive to keep all these problems going, since it is what got them to where they are in the first place.

13. Family structures have been obliterated by mass incarceration.

14. In particular, fathers have been removed almost entirely from the American black family.

15. There is no factor more closely associated with poor outcomes for children than the absence of a father.

16. A boy with no father, and whose friends have no fathers either, is going to have an extremely difficult time learning how to be a decent father himself.

17. The support of a welfare state has contributed to the perpetuation of these fatherless rump-families in huge numbers, where survival requirements would dictate other behavior in the absence of direct material support.

18. Even beyond the war on drugs, the damage done to American family structures (white, black and other) from the war on men conducted by the Family Court system and the laws that enable this destruction is a major factor in removing fathers from their families.

19. In order to progress towards a solution to the above set of problems, the first step has to be returning fathers to their families.

20. Fathers solve the root cause issues of the barbarism by providing food, shelter, security, and education to their children.

21. In order to return fathers to their families, the mass incarceration associated with the war on drugs has to end. In other words, if you want black kids not to turn out to be violent street thugs, don't put their fathers in jail over bullshit, don't incentivize their mothers to kick their fathers out.


I could probably make a list of a hundred points if I wanted to be detailed enough. American black kids by and large are fucked over in a big way from the moment they are born, and from the experience learn to do so to others, and thus we end up with a culture that innovates things like sucker-punching random people in the street. As is so often the case, government drives the problem, makes it a thousand times what it might be otherwise.

have at it

No arguments here.

[Anti Federalist]

Nothing good comes from a Fedbook post.

/thread

[oyarde]

Hard to believe any teacher would be on that shit .Everything to lose , nothing to be gained .