Oil Spill Off Pristine Santa Barbara Coastline :(

[dannno]

http://media.independent.com/img/croppedphotos/2015/05/20/05202015_Refugio_Oil_Cleanup_48_t479.jpg?ad1462761 8f647f3902aa65ed5ac8237c798b1ef

For those unaware, the original environmental movement in this country was largely spawned right in Santa Barbara after an oil spill in 1969.

http://media.independent.com/img/croppedphotos/2015/05/20/05202015_Refugio_Oil_Cleanup_48_t479.jpg?ad1462761 8f647f3902aa65ed5ac8237c798b1ef


As Refugio Oil Slick Spreads, Spill Estimate Rises

Authorities Now Say 105,000 Gallons of Crude May Have Gushed From Pipeline
Wednesday, May 20, 2015
By Tyler Hayden

By land and by sea, cleanup crews descended Wednesday morning on the Gaviota Coast as the major oil spill from the day before grew to cover nine miles of ocean along the shoreline. Initial estimates put the spill at approximately 21,000 gallons, but officials now fear as many as 105,000 gallons of crude oil may have leaked from the broken underground pipe operated by Plains All American Pipeline. Responders are still working to pin down the exact figure and to determine how much oil seeped into the ocean.

The oil sheen has quickly spread down the coast from the spill site just west of Refugio State Beach; yesterday’s estimate put the oil slick, which has now split into two separate slicks, at four miles long with expectations it would only spread another two to four miles.

According to information just released by local, state, and federal officials operating the Joint Information Center (JIC) that is overseeing the response effort, a Plains control room employee “saw abnormalities in the line and shut it down at approximately 11:30 a.m.” on Tuesday. Initial reports from local authorities stated that county firefighters responding to smells of gas were the first to spot the leak. Plains personnel then traveled to the spill site and “visually confirmed the release at 1:30 p.m.,” the JIC dispatch reads. County officials with the Office of Emergency Management originally stated on Tuesday that an abandoned and inactive pipeline had discharged a small amount of “leftover product.”

The cause of the spill is still under investigation. The pipeline transports produced oil from ExxonMobil’s Las Flores Canyon Processing Facility near Refugio to the Plains-owned Gaviota pumping station. It shuttles an estimated 50,400 gallons of oil an hour. As of 9 a.m. this morning, vacuum trucks and skimmer boats had cleaned up approximately 6,090 gallons of oil. There are currently nine boats in the area.

According to the JIC, the pipeline’s last internal inspection was just a few weeks ago. Before that, it was assessed in 2012, but the results of those inspections are not yet available. Industry standards for internal inspections typically occur on five-year schedules.

Several citizens outraged by the response time of the oil spill cleanup and taking matters into their own hands, filling buckets just South of Refugio Beach (May 20, 2015)

The JIC said it’s too early to tell how much the cleanup will cost. Plains is still working with state and federal officials to determine how much public agencies will be reimbursed for the work.

...

Environmentalists and politicians have lined up to condemn the spill, oil drilling in general, and what they have called the slow and inadequate response of Plains. Here is a sample of those statements:

State Senator Hannah-Beth Jackson: “Like so many of my constituents, I remain very concerned about the impact of the oil spill yesterday at Refugio Beach, the largest we have had in years in Santa Barbara County, and am continuing to monitor it closely. I commend the California State Parks, the California Department of Fish and Wildlife, the California Office of Emergency Services, the state Office of Spill Prevention and Response, the US Coast Guard and others who are working hard at the scene to respond. This is a tragic reminder of how precious our coastline and wildlife are, and the dangerous and detrimental impacts of oil drilling and oil operations. Just as the 1969 oil spill off the Santa Barbara coast spurred decades of environmental progress, I hope that this devastating situation renews our commitment to protect our coastline, and find safer forms of energy to power our state and our nation.”

Santa Barbara County Supervisor Salud Carbajal: “First responders are doing heroic work responding to this crisis by rapidly cleaning up our beaches and protecting our coastline from further damage. Right now, we need to focus our efforts on the clean-up but this is a wake up call for all of us. We must make decreasing our reliance on fossil fuels a top priority and start expanding green energy alternatives and protecting our environment by increasing safety standards with stricter oversight and increased inspections.”

State Assemblymember Das Williams: “I am deeply saddened and angered to see our beautiful Gaviota coast covered in crude oil and one of our most beloved beaches and campground closed. I am grateful for the first responders and cleanup crews who are working to limit the damage and address the mess. It is unacceptable that local people on the bluffs were the first ones to report the spill before the oil company did. We will also seek answers through a district hearing in the coming days to understand how a breach in the leak detection technology this serious could have occurred without raising alarms to the pipeline operator. We need answers to these serious questions and to find out why the response communication apparently broke down.”

U.S. Senator Barbara Boxer: “This oil spill off the Santa Barbara coast is tragic. This highlights the dangers posed by these pipelines and underscores why I have spent decades fighting against oil drilling off the California coast. I hope that by deploying all necessary resources to clean up this spill, we can prevent even greater harm to wildlife and our local communities.”

Dave Davis, President & CEO of the Environmental Council (CEC): “The Community Environmental Council is, like much of our community, feeling both shock and outrage over yesterday’s oil spill. For our founders, this is the worst type of déjà vu, recalling the 1969 oil spill over 45 years ago that spurred CEC’s formation. Sadly, we were born out of a dirty energy crisis, and we have made it our mission to transition the Santa Barbara region away from fossil fuels. Yesterday was both a step backward and a step forward in our fight to preserve the nature we love and protect the climate. The tragic Refugio oil spill off the Gaviota Coast – a unique bioregion that CEC fought successfully to protect in the 1970’s – is a sharp reminder of all that still needs to be done to defend our precious coast. Both our founders and the next generation of activists who comprise our team have been hit hard by the images of destruction, and we are feeling this spill at a visceral level.

“We are dedicated to preserving this particular coastline not just because it is the right thing to do, but because it is a place we love. Our staff knows each beach not as a name on the map, but as a place where we surf, swim, walk, and bird-watch. It is where we bring our children; the place that we call home. On a practical level, we also know that this spill could not have happened in a worse place. Oil spills are devastating no matter where they occur, but Gaviota happens to be one of only five Mediterranean ecosystems in the world. It is a pivotal bioregion between the cooler waters of the north and the warmer south, with a vibrant diversity of species not found elsewhere.”

http://www.independent.com/news/2015/may/20/refugio-oil-slick-spreads-spill-estimate-rises/

[dannno]

Before:

http://www.morningglass.us/wp-content/uploads/2014/04/Refugio-State-Beach-Santa-Barbara-County-California-USA-surf-3.jpg

The number of times I've hung ten reeling down that point is in the dozens.

[dannno]

State of Emergency delcared:

http://www.independent.com/news/2015/may/21/state-emergency-declared-refugio-oil-spill/

[dannno]

Here we go....


Huge Oversight Gap on Refugio Pipeline in Santa Barbara County

How Did 2,500 Barrels of Oil Escape Without Notice
Thursday, May 21, 2015
By Nick Welsh

It turns out that the Plains All American Pipeline, responsible for the most dramatic oil spill to hit the Santa Barbara coast in this century, is the only pipeline in all of Santa Barbara County operating outside the regulatory oversight of county energy planners and safety officers. “We’re flying blind,” said County Energy Division czar Kevin Drude. That’s because Plains All American took Santa Barbara County to court more than 20 years ago to restrict the county’s regulatory oversight. It won. The consequences of that victory appear to be bearing bitter fruit.

Because the county was denied the regulatory authority to require that Plains equip its pipeline with an automatic shut-down valve in case of a rupture, The Santa Barbara Independent has discovered, the Plains pipeline is the only pipeline in the county without this automatic feature. Instead, the Plains pipeline must be shut down manually in case of such emergencies. According to Drude, the equipment the county requires — known as SCADA — of other pipeline operators is so sensitive it can detect the loss of 20 barrels of oil over a 20-hour period. By contrast, the Plains pipeline leaked about 2,500 barrels worth of oil in a matter of a few hours before the company’s crew manually shut it down.

This isn’t to say the Plains pipeline has operated free of regulatory oversight. Since its inception in 1987, the pipeline has been subject to federal inspections. The feds farmed this function — via contract — out to the California Fire Marshal’s Office, but in 2013, The Santa Barbara Independent has learned, the Fire Marshal informed the Department of Transportation it would not renew its contract. Increasingly, the Fire Marshal’s office reported that it had been finding it difficult to retain or recruit experienced pipeline inspectors. Because the Fire Marshal’s office regarded its federal inspection work ancillary to its primary mission, it turned this duty back to the federal Department of Transportation, which in turn, gave it over to a relatively new and obscure federal agency called the Pipeline and Hazardous Materials Safety Administration — better known as PHMSA (pronounced “pimsa”), which then had to resume its function of inspecting all of California’s oil and gas pipelines.

Organizations like Pipeline Safety Trust — which bird-dogs pipeline companies from an environmental safety vantage point — have expressed concern that PHMSA is too underfunded and understaffed to absorb so monumental a new burden. (In the last few months, Congress authorized the agency to hire 100 new pipeline inspectors. How many have been hired since then remains unclear.) In addition, Pipeline Safety Trust — which publishes a blog called The Smart Pig, the name of a key pipeline safety inspection process — reported there have been 175 “incidents” involving Plains All American pipelines throughout the United States — 11 in California — in the past 10 years. No deaths were caused and no injuries were reported from these incidents, but $24 million in property damage was inflicted. Reports vary as to the fines imposed, but in any case, they appear very low. The lowest that The Independent discovered is $185,000; the highest is $284,000. “In terms of the fines they impose, it’s really a lot less than they are authorized,” said Samya Lutz with the Pipeline Safety Trust. She added that the number of investigations launched by the federal pipeline safety agency was quite low in relation to the number of incidents.

An incident is defined as any occurrence leading to loss of life, an injury requiring hospitalization, or property damage in excess of $50,000. If more than five barrels are spilled — or five gallons escapes the property lines — that, too, constitutes an incident. While there had been a half-gallon leak on the Plains pipeline by Refugio (pronounced Re-fu-hio) in the last few months, that was too small to be deemed an “incident.” Of the 11 Plains incidents that occurred in California, it remains unclear if any involved the Refugio pipeline.


http://www.independent.com/news/2015/may/21/whos-watching-man-whos-watching-pipeline/

Admittedly a great article in regard to showing the ineffectiveness of federal safety regulations.

[Christopher A. Brown]

Here we go....



http://www.independent.com/news/2015/may/21/whos-watching-man-whos-watching-pipeline/

Admittedly a great article in regard to showing the ineffectiveness of federal safety regulations.


Really it goes back to the lawsuit. Who was the judge? Which court?

Automatic shutdowns work pretty good. Some real security is gained by inspecting and testing a shutdown device rather than miles of pipeline.

It's coming down to the simple fact; America is addicted to oil and neglecting justice so they can simply continue using. Like heroin addicts collapsing one vein after another between overdoses. Its like a mass insanity, just running kinda slow, but clearly everyone who is a realist knows it is.

The environmental organizations comments make me sick. It's all about image and money to them. They would not do anything to interfere with that even if it was functional enough to address the insanity.

For example, oak trees are dying by the thousands right now. Environmental orgs say, "drought". Fact is the oaks have always survived that. What they refuse to know is that there was an additive to gasoline called MTBE burned between 1993 and 2003 on an EPA waiver to a ban on the additive.

The combusted carbon from the additive falls on the landscape and runs into aquifers. What it does is causes water to repeal oxygen gas. First all of the coastal creeks lost their algae, then all their frogs, then the birds went. The Eualyptus green gum and blue gum showed effects because they are powerful condensers and the night condensations of water had no oxygen.

The trace elements of oxygen in the water trigger the start of photosynthesis in algae and the trees. With the trees it also provides what the repellent in the sap is made from that protect the trees from parasites. The Euc's were dying from a lipid, leaf scale that came over from Australia with them, almost ineffective for over a 100 years. Suddenly by 2000 Eucs are dying by the thousands. The oaks suffer the same problem but it is from a beetle. It's taken years for it to become real visible, but I saw it in about 2002.

I've seen young trees having the space between the bark and wood, the cambium layer filled with the beetle cuttings from boring into the heartwood while the beetle lived on the water stored in the cambium because the tree can't use it without the trace elements of oxygen in it. Tan oaks in the bay area went down because of that water stored in the trunks becoming infected with the phytophera fungus.

The enviro orgs here don't even know the frogs are gone. In 2002 I was trying to get them to work with me to get the local TV station to point camera at the creeks void of the usual algae in mid summer. Ecoli from sewer outfalls is now fed high nitrate water from creeks right after the first rains. It used to be depleted of the nitrates by the algae through the summer.

It must be collusion that has biologists claiming its dog poop, now I find bags of dog shit everywhere. The city makes about $3.5 mil off of parking tickets that from the street sweeping program that biologists recommended.

Mass insanity? Or stupidity?

[Christopher A. Brown]

This is a video I produced in 2010 to post as a response video to people effected by the gulf BP oil spill.

After 3 days youtube blocked it from being posted as a response video. Then I started posting text comments with the link to it in videos comment sections. Then text posting from my channel was blocked.

Think corporations stick together? Uh huh. Or maybe a big oil corp saw it and called up youtube and said, "We'll pay to stop it."


https://www.youtube.com/v/aek2xO4kFXQ


https://www.youtube.com/v/aek2xO4kFXQ

[presence]

meh, externalities such as these won't effect my energy portfolio

[dannno]

meh, externalities such as these won't effect my energy portfolio

I'm not worried about this company possibly going out of business over it, though it sounds like they are probably pretty big so they probably won't. But even if they did they'll just sell off their equipment to a company with a better safety record. It's the legislation that might come from it that could be harmful, but hey, energy is energy people need it.

[luctor-et-emergo]

Whatever your opinion on oil, spilling it is bad. I don't think more rules need to be put in place. Damages from spills should be claimed at the responsible party which I guess is the transporter normally.

[kfarnan]

They'll get off with a minor slap on the wrist. Why do people stand for it?

[Christopher A. Brown]

Whatever your opinion on oil, spilling it is bad. I don't think more rules need to be put in place. Damages from spills should be claimed at the responsible party which I guess is the transporter normally.

If there were courts that delivered justice, this would be great. But they don't, obsfucation is what you get so attorneys make money and the corporate entity gets to repaint the picture.

This is a good reason something like a citizens grand jury that has serious jurisdictional authority OVER statute law courts as long as decisions are constitution, not even the supreme can overrule for that jurisdiction. Its the spirit of the tenth amendment manifesting, but even more localized within the states.

When enough of them decide a certain direction in associated areas, a precedentual dominance develops that then can become state law, or even a federal law.

The countermand amendment (https://www.countermands.us/countermand-amendment.html) is a VERY good mechanism for getting rid of non function federal laws hampering states in a revised version of what we have that uses different priorities to do mostly the same thing we are doing 10 times more efficiently. Clear out the old ones and assure new ones are optimized along with the industry acting.

Eventually, I feel corporate individual status needs to be revoked completely with industries applying for privilege now considered a right. Certain industries are very needed and will gain privilege, but that will be "above board" and in other cases they lose it. This puts a lot more commerce back onto individuals because they can be accountable as individuals when corporations have no ethics that are absolute.

They refuse to defend the constitution, just for example of how they are, but they want the rights of individuals as a group, then each individual want their rights too after colluding with the others to evade accountability and exploit their individual rights collectively as a group. I a real world of big energy, corporations have to earn their rights by excellence in ethics as a group of individuals working together. When they do it we all appreciate it.

[TheTexan]

This should be great for the economy. Think how much money will be spent cleaning this up

[angelatc]

Shrugs. I am fine with an occasional accident as long as energy is cheap .

[navy-vet]

Shrugs. I am fine with an occasional accident as long as energy is cheap .
and common sense prevails once again....;)

[wizardwatson]

http://i.imgur.com/Sy4uEaO.jpg

[dannno]

Shrugs. I am fine with an occasional accident as long as energy is cheap .

As long as you're willing to pay the damages... problem is that doesn't happen.

[heavenlyboy34]

As long as you're willing to pay the damages... problem is that doesn't happen.

Noone owns the ocean or beach, yes? If so, it's just another public works project that everyone pays for. Socialist waterways work just as well as 'Murica's socialist roads. ;)

[dannno]

Noone owns the ocean or beach, yes? If so, it's just another public works project that everyone pays for. Socialist waterways work just as well as 'Murica's socialist roads. ;)

Oil companies claim to pay for all of the damages - but really they just pay whatever the regulations require. Caps on liability, paying 'fines', leaving economic and private fallout in their wake..

[heavenlyboy34]

Oil companies claim to pay for all of the damages - but really they just pay whatever the regulations require. Caps on liability, paying 'fines', leaving economic and private fallout in their wake..

Color me unsurprised. :P Big Oil gives a cut of their profit to the CA regime via lobbying or some other shady operations for those bene's, I betcha.

[puppetmaster]

Don't worry the nuclear contamination from fukushima will break down the oil. Anyway this will get cleaned up like always. I remember getting oil on my skin there when I was a kid.

[dannno]

Don't worry the nuclear contamination from fukushima will break down the oil. Anyway this will get cleaned up like always. I remember getting oil on my skin there when I was a kid.

Yes, there are a lot of heavy natural oil seeps in the area - which is good in a sense because most of the damage will be contained to the local area of the spill. But refugio and el cap are pretty screwed... hopefully [super secret surf spot redacted] will be ok, as well as the next spot down called [another secret surf spot redacted] which probably has more sea life per acre than anywhere else within at least 20 miles, it's a state marine conservation area.

El cap, princess of the coast (pay attention to the wave at the top at 1:14.....also wave at the bottom at 3:54)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CR3hEbxgbN0

[osan]

Why do people stand for it?


Because they are corrupt and lazy? Just guessing. Hey, so long as it doesn't have a notable effect in their lives, why should they care, eh?

Yes... a reset event is almost certainly needed because , just as with other parasitic creatures, humans of the Empire hive-mindset are not very likely ever to stop their march of consumption down the avenue of time. We are possibly past the natural carrying capacity of the planet and I do believe in the greater intelligence that will at some point correct the errant children. Those corrections, if observations of other populations are valid indicators, tend to be large, carry very harsh qualities, and are administered with utter indifference to the plight of the individual.

[angelatc]

As long as you're willing to pay the damages... problem is that doesn't happen.

Looking at the money that was spent repaying the damages from the Gulf spill a few years ago, it's pretty clear to me that the greenies will never be paid enough to be satiated.

And it isn't your land - who exactly was damaged? Surely you're not advocating that the government should shake down energy companies for "damages," are you?

[JK/SEA]

moderate earthquakes up and down the west coast lately may be the culprit. A new Volcanoe is forming in the ocean just off of Oregon.

[presence]

Looking at the money that was spent repaying the damages from the Gulf spill a few years ago, it's pretty clear to me that the greenies will never be paid enough to be satiated.

And it isn't your land - who exactly was damaged? Surely you're not advocating that the government should shake down energy companies for "damages," are you?

No they should clean up their shit.

The "greenies" don't want money for damages; local businesses do. "Greenies" want the companies that make the mess to put man hours on beaches; solutions other than, pay fine then sink the oil to the bottom and forget it.

[Christopher A. Brown]

As long as you're willing to pay the damages... problem is that doesn't happen.


Noone owns the ocean or beach, yes? If so, it's just another public works project that everyone pays for. Socialist waterways work just as well as 'Murica's socialist roads. ;)

We all own the resources. The natural habitats are part of a balance we do not want to upset.

Corporate personhood is largely to blame for this, because they act with impunity over time buying off courts through obscure methods. Basically, if there was one responsible person, they would never allow something like this to happen just to enable increased profits.

The automatic shutoff valves are costly and they have a built in maintenance cost. Shareholders want the highest profits, CEO's are known to be sociopaths. Given the proper connections, reasonable safeguards can always be bypassed.

With a lawful and peaceful revolution, we can eventually remove corporate personhood.

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?471555-A-lawful-and-peaceful-revolution

We can do anything needed, and if things like this are happening, it is needed. The lawful and peaceful revolution has a massive education built into it with the ending of the abridging of the purpose of free speech. After that, not only will political decisions be easier to make with accuracy, people will realize that there is a certain amount of change they themselves must expect.

We've been living in a bubble of a false economy for about 50 years. The way we do what we do is just not a wise use of resource. Most of it is tailored to corporate profits rather than actual economy, certainly not ecology.

[heavenlyboy34]

We all own the resources. The natural habitats are part of a balance we do not want to upset.

Corporate personhood is largely to blame for this, because they act with impunity over time buying off courts through obscure methods. Basically, if there was one responsible person, they would never allow something like this to happen just to enable increased profits.

The automatic shutoff valves are costly and they have a built in maintenance cost. Shareholders want the highest profits, CEO's are known to be sociopaths. Given the proper connections, reasonable safeguards can always be bypassed.

With a lawful and peaceful revolution, we can eventually remove corporate personhood.

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?471555-A-lawful-and-peaceful-revolution

We can do anything needed, and if things like this are happening, it is needed. The lawful and peaceful revolution has a massive education built into it with the ending of the abridging of the purpose of free speech. After that, not only will political decisions be easier to make with accuracy, people will realize that there is a certain amount of change they themselves must expect.

We've been living in a bubble of a false economy for about 50 years. The way we do what we do is just not a wise use of resource. Most of it is tailored to corporate profits rather than actual economy, certainly not ecology.
Meh, that sort of egalitarian property theory has been tried many times. It only "works" in situations like monastic communes. Hell, Plymouth Colony's population would've died off had William Bardford not turned the public land into private tracts.

[Christopher A. Brown]

Meh, that sort of egalitarian property theory has been tried many times. It only "works" in situations like monastic communes. Hell, Plymouth Colony's population would've died off had William Bardford not turned the public land into private tracts.

If you knew what was hidden about life and the other ways to live it you would not say that.

The abridging of the purpose of free speech prevents you from knowing that and much more. The education that will come after the abridging of the purpose is ended will awaken Americans to greater possibilities for happiness than consumerism can even imagine.

The alternative of doing nothing has Agenda 21 which wants to force or compel the changes. The resistance to that is creating conflicts that have the opposite effect of what they intend. That is a lose-lose. Would you rather have that?

Corporate personhood is different from private property, did you know that? What I posted has nothing to do with private property. It's about Article V and stopping tyranny.

How screwed are we if the tyrants trash the ocean so bad we can't go fishing to survive?

The effects of corporate personhood are condemning private property on a daily basis, is that okay?

[angelatc]

No they should clean up their shit.

The "greenies" don't want money for damages; local businesses do. "Greenies" want the companies that make the mess to put man hours on beaches; solutions other than, pay fine then sink the oil to the bottom and forget it.

Again, I stand by my original statement - from what I have seen no amount of money will satiate the butthurt. When the gulf spill happned, they bought out all the businesses and fishrman, paid billions to the government and spent billions cleaning up the mess.

All we heard (and hear) was that it was not enough, and that the gulf is mucked up forevr, blah blah blah.

Again, I'd rather have the occasional accident as long as energy is cheap. All this self-loathing Westerner crap is annoying.

[Christopher A. Brown]

Again, I stand by my original statement - from what I have seen no amount of money will satiate the butthurt.

There are actually other impacts from oil that are not visible now, which will have destroyed a lot of resource and habitat that cannot be replaced with any amount of money. Not spills or anything like that. Simply an additive that was banned by the EPA because after precipitation in closed system tests, everything died, but the oil industry pulled a fast one and got a waiver to blend it 11% of every gallon.

It created such problems, the governor banned it. Then methanex of Canada sued him. He used defenses of a California and Federal law. The tribunal court under
NAFTA rejected all that and he had to make a deal to let them dispense it for 2 more years until 2002.

NAFTA usurped US law in US territory. Sounds like treason don't it?

Now the sad thing is that a major impact is going to take 20 years to be visible. People have not even figured out what is happening yet.

[heavenlyboy34]

If you knew what was hidden about life and the other ways to live it you would not say that.

The abridging of the purpose of free speech prevents you from knowing that and much more. The education that will come after the abridging of the purpose is ended will awaken Americans to greater possibilities for happiness than consumerism can even imagine.

The alternative of doing nothing has Agenda 21 which wants to force or compel the changes. The resistance to that is creating conflicts that have the opposite effect of what they intend. That is a lose-lose. Would you rather have that?

Corporate personhood is different from private property, did you know that? What I posted has nothing to do with private property. It's about Article V and stopping tyranny.

How screwed are we if the tyrants trash the ocean so bad we can't go fishing to survive?

The effects of corporate personhood are condemning private property on a daily basis, is that okay?
http://cf.chucklesnetwork.com/items/5/4/6/9/original/not-sure-if-argument-or-talking-to-a-brick-wall.jpg

[dannno]

Again, I stand by my original statement - from what I have seen no amount of money will satiate the butthurt. When the gulf spill happned, they bought out all the businesses and fishrman, paid billions to the government and spent billions cleaning up the mess.

All we heard (and hear) was that it was not enough, and that the gulf is mucked up forevr, blah blah blah.

Again, I'd rather have the occasional accident as long as energy is cheap. All this self-loathing Westerner crap is annoying.

Ok, so what you're saying is that BP gave a bunch of money to some large corporate fisheries and a bunch of money to government, hung the little guy whose livelihood depended on the gulf out to dry, and since they are still complaining I guess that makes them liberal.

And I guess you don't care that the environment gets completely destroyed and we can no longer live off the land so you can pay less at the gas pump.

[ghengis86]

Ok, so what you're saying is that BP gave a bunch of money to some large corporate fisheries and a bunch of money to government, hung the little guy whose livelihood depended on the gulf out to dry, and since they are still complaining I guess that makes them liberal.

And I guess you don't care that the environment gets completely destroyed and we can no longer live off the land so you can pay less at the gas pump.

For the record, I knew of two people operating single boat fishing businesses that got a sweet, sweet payout from BP. So it wasn't just big commercial fisheries. I also know of one person who made a claim of lost wages/income due to the spill and got a payout, which may or may not have been legit. So there was likely scamming going on by the little guys too.

I'm not a tree-hugger by a long shot, but these spills and the aftermath bother me. I think it's the government regulation and protection racket for big energy that fosters these types of incidents. That and public land 'ownership'. I'm in the camp that completely privatized lands coupled with robust property right protection and remedy through courts is the answer to maintaining the environment while providing cheap energy.

[Christopher A. Brown]

http://cf.chucklesnetwork.com/items/5/4/6/9/original/not-sure-if-argument-or-talking-to-a-brick-wall.jpg

Your admission to a failure to reason is expected. Consider, your posting an image is far closer to a brick wall than my continued posting of descriptive text.

The notion that our society does not know everything about the human mind, which is what experiences life, which is what knows the rewards of living; is not something you can assimilate. Not many raised by television can.

Television never goes to certain places of knowledge. Just like literature and academia. Therefore the people of our society only exposed to that material sphere of knowledge or experiences it yields cannot comprehend that life is anything but material gratification, or the shared and mutual appreciation of it.

Consider, when you are very old, will you remember all the material stuff you consumed and enjoyed in your life? Or, will the people you love and spent time with dominate your memory? Will the time shared with them discussing and apprehending your mutual existence, your appreciation of the universe we each know be what you cherish in memory after all those experiences are in the further past?

Herein is what the experience of life is really about. Therefore efficiency with the material existence allows more of the real experience for others in the future to enjoy the same thing which is shared by all forms of life that we comprehend.

It is our combined, aware effort to continue that phenomena for all life that is the lasting joy of life, and the love we have for our familes and friends. The stuff only matters to filling needs, and the occasional want that is justified with material gratification.

[Christopher A. Brown]

I'm in the camp that completely privatized lands coupled with robust property right protection and remedy through courts is the answer to maintaining the environment while providing cheap energy.

The elements of air and water are collectively needed therefore owned by all of us as property and that is natural law.

It may be your formula is the most effective, but a society that shares awareness of efficacy, is still the key to function. If the society does not share such, it must focus on creating such function as soon as possible.

Functional and just courts that are based in the cutting edge of natural law awareness will be more and more vital to good descision making in these areas. The American constitution, with its original intents, actually has a basis advanced enough to serve us in arriving at a place where the described function will be happening.

[Anti Federalist]

FWIW, it was an evironmental regulation that, ulitimately, broke the final link in the chain that caused the Deepwater Horizon disaster

[dannno]

Pipe broke from corrosion - Picture in the article shows a dude standing next to it with some duct tape :D

http://media.independent.com/img/croppedphotos/2015/06/03/06012015-Oil-Pipe-Repair-Rock-Cleaning-37_t479.jpg?ad14627618f647f3902aa65ed5ac8237c798b1 ef

http://www.independent.com/news/2015/jun/04/early-pipeline-finding-names-corrosion/


A comment from the article that seems informative:




Yikes! This is so wrong on so many levels. First, the fact that the six inch slit is in the bottom tells me that the product moving down the line has sand in it, which means that ExxonMobil is not removing all the sand before sending to the refinery. Second, the external corrosion indicates that the cathode protection did not work. Thirdly, the discrepancy between what the smart pig recorded and what was really there is an indication that the smart pig inspections are not providing accurate inspection information. So we can conclude that industry standard corrosion control does not work, ExxonMobil's processing plant is not removing all the sand from the crude before shipping it to refineries, and the primary method we have for determining pipeline integrity does not give us accurate information. As I said before, Yikes!

Eckermann (anonymous profile)
June 3, 2015 at 9:04 p.m.