Time for a Reality Check - THIS MEANS YOU

[ronpaulfan]

.....and me.

1) The Republican base hates us, and I mean HATES us. They see us as juvenile, disorderly and not true Republicans. We won't ever win over the elites, but, we should be doing everything we can to win over the rank-and-file. Simple things like being presentable/respectful, attending GOP meetings and wearing GOP elephants next to your Ron Paul paraphernalia can go a LONG way. Let them know you are one of them and you'll be joining the party 100% if Ron Paul gets nominated.

2) The female vote is severely lacking. Think hard about how to win more women over. (if you were laughing inside at the word in bold, then you are part of the problem!!)

3) Nov 5th nay-sayers were wrong. If this was you, remember remember the 5th of November before every post you make :mad: The rhetoric attacking the Blimp is very similar to the rhetoric attacking November 5th.

4) There will be MASSIVE voter fraud against Dr. Paul: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IQxB5VKWlfg

5) The "conspiracy theorists" were right about the CFR, the NAFTA highway and the NAU. The media attempting to spin them as "figments of Ron Paul's imagination" should be an eyeopener to you at the serious importance of Ron Paul winning the election.

[ronpaulfan]

The GOP canceled another straw poll because they didn't want Ron Paul to win. The GOP base hates our guts. Every effort humanly possible must be made to reconnect with the GOP base!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IcNK3zYc5ts

[disciple]

We may not have another chance; it is imperative that we double, trible and quadruple the efforts whether it is donations or efforts.

We just cannot afford to lose.

[ladyliberty]

Ron Paul supporters are not going to have to win this election by a mere landslide, they are going to have to win it and win big by a tsunami of support! We are going to have to completely overwhelm and engulf the voting process like never before - Mitt Romny will not have enough money to buy enough votes to win against Ron Paul!

It is time to make this "MISSION IMPOSSIBLE" completely 100% POSSIBLE! LETS DO IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Arklatex]

I will be leading a small revolution to the primary here in my state! :)

[RonPaulFTFW]

I think they more they try to shut us out the more attention and power they give us.

It's not something they can ignore anymore.

[CelestialRender]

I guarantee that between 12/15 and 1/15, the rEVOLution will go from an interesting talking point to the most shocking thing to happen in American politics since The New Deal.

[scubasteve01]

This is great info, bump!

[mosquitobite]

Great thread ronpaulfan!

As someone who has been a member of the GOP for over a decade and a member on some of the Republican leaning websites, they do dislike us. Going in and overcrowding a room with support doesn't win us any converts. (Sorry, but it's simply the truth!)

As I've asked in other threads, what are we as a group doing WITHIN the GOP? Are we asking if they need volunteers or help? Or are we simply pushing our man into their faces?

If, in a previous life ;), you have always hated Republicans and all they stand for, perhaps these are not the venues for you to attend. If you dislike these people before you even walk in the door, perhaps you should stay at home.

Remember, we are still at this point trying to get him the REPUBLICAN nomination and I believe many here weren't Republican before Dr Paul. I, for one, welcome you! But many in the GOP do NOT.

Dress the part (meaning please wear business casual at least - think Colbert! LOL!) and be friendly - not unruly!

You will win more converts with honey!

If you give these people hope that young people are involved in the process, without making it all about Dr Paul - all the time - we can do this!! The right has always wanted the support of students like the left has had for a long time, but the current strategy of just showing up and overpowering isn't going to get us converts. It might win us a straw poll, but we've won plenty of those. We need more PEOPLE on board. Please try to remember that!

[Bradley in DC]

We won't ever win over the elites, but, we should be doing everything we can to win over the rank-and-file. Simple things like being presentable/respectful, attending GOP meetings and wearing GOP elephants next to your Ron Paul paraphernalia can go a LONG way. Let them know you are one of them and you'll be joining the party 100% if Ron Paul gets nominated.

Interesting from you of all people...anyway, at least here the DC GOP has been far more cooperative to the Ron Paul grassroots than HQ is.

(I am NOT saying we've won the elite over--yet. ;))

Oh yeah, anyone concerned with voter fraud should be a pollworker.

[Pete Kay]

Well, I don't support the GOP's platform, I support Ron Paul's platform. I will only support the GOP if they support Ron Paul's platform. I will not be dishonest and claim that I am a rank and file Republican. I am always respectful anyway to anyone that I speak with, but I won't lie.

[mosquitobite]

Well, I don't support the GOP's platform, I support Ron Paul's platform. I will only support the GOP if they support Ron Paul's platform. I will not be dishonest and claim that I am a rank and file Republican. I am always respectful anyway to anyone that I speak with, but I won't lie.

I've never supported a "platform", always a candidate.

I consider myself a Goldwater Republican, and people are usually ok when they hear that. (The only ones who aren't are the religious right who despised Goldwater's social views)

[Talldude1412]

Well, I don't support the GOP's platform, I support Ron Paul's platform. I will only support the GOP if they support Ron Paul's platform. I will not be dishonest and claim that I am a rank and file Republican. I am always respectful anyway to anyone that I speak with, but I won't lie.

If you support Ron Paul's platform, you support the conservatives of old. Not the conservatives of the past 8-16 yrs. Constitutional republicans have been marginalized for waaay to long.

[Ridiculous]

Well some supporters have been juvenile and disorderly and they've posted the youtube videos showing that they are proud of their behavior.

Getting in arguments and being confrontational with supporters of other candidates when the other candidate comes to town is far from productive.

[freelance]

1) The Republican base hates us, and I mean HATES us. They see us as juvenile, disorderly and not true Republicans. We won't ever win over the elites, but, we should be doing everything we can to win over the rank-and-file. Simple things like being presentable/respectful, attending GOP meetings and wearing GOP elephants next to your Ron Paul paraphernalia can go a LONG way.

I agree with part of this and disagree with PARTS of this. OF COURSE we should be presentable and respectable/respectful; however, we are NEVER, EVER going to win over the elites or the rank and file who follow the elites' every utterance. They consider this war, and there is no negotiation to be had. That represents surrender to them, something against which they have been conditioned the past seven years.


Let them know you are one of them and you'll be joining the party 100% if Ron Paul gets nominated.


That is not acceptable to them. Ron Paul is in no way acceptable to them. They want you to join THEIR Republican party, a Republican party without any room for Ron Paul.

What's the solution? I propose that we expand OUR base, not theirs, to the point where we take over the party. That means President down to Dog Catcher--eventually.

It's become crystal clear that this "thinking" has made its way down to the local level? Why? Where do you think that the locals get their funds? Local and state governments are on the federal dole. Local party organizations are on the national party dole--as long as they do whatever they're told. What comes with money? STRINGS!

Again, be presentable, be respectful, but TAKE NO CRAP! These last two straw polls were a travesty. Sooner or later, those on the fence will see what's happening.

They got a glimpse into their future with yesterday's release of the NIE. The spin has been enough to make you go blind. Those who still blindly follow are not worth the effort. Convert the low-hanging fruit. There's plenty of it out there.

I agree with the rest of your post.

[Bradley in DC]

we are NEVER, EVER going to win over the elites or the rank and file who follow the elites' every utterance.

Without getting into a semantic discussion of how you define "elite," let's just say that what I think of as the "elite" running the party is much more concerned with winning elections and holding on to power and all its perks than policy. If that meant throwing anti-tax, limited government policies under the bus with Bush to win an election, they got no problem with that.

They'd just as quickly throw Bush under the 2008 bus for Ron Paul if they think that's they way for them to maintain themselves. It ain't pretty, it just is.


Again, be presentable, be respectful

Exactly.

[BeFranklin]

The GOP canceled another straw poll because they didn't want Ron Paul to win. The GOP base hates our guts. Every effort humanly possible must be made to reconnect with the GOP base!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IcNK3zYc5ts

Thats ok, I hate torture and warrantless wiretaps too.

The GOP was taken over in the last few years by a group of people with very un-american ideas. It isn't the party I grew up with at all. Those people need to be made to feel unwanted.

[Bradley in DC]

The female vote is severely lacking. Think hard about how to win more women over.

I've always found leading with Dr. Paul being an Ob/Gyn gives him instant credibility. Women trust their, um, personal doctors. :o

[freelance]

Without getting into a semantic discussion of how you define "elite," let's just say that what I think of as the "elite" running the party is much more concerned with winning elections and holding on to power and all its perks than policy. If that meant throwing anti-tax, limited government policies under the bus with Bush to win an election, they got no problem with that.

They'd just as quickly throw Bush under the 2008 bus for Ron Paul if they think that's they way for them to maintain themselves. It ain't pretty, it just is.

Exactly.

You understand me perfectly! Thing is, if Ron Paul were to win, they would be OUTTA THERE, because the party would be taken over--BY US--and they know it. They can stay in power if any of the other candidates should win--and they know it. We are the largest group of "get involved" types, and they know that too. That's why they're running scared. We may not be as large in numbers, but we show up, and as Woody Allen says, 90% of life is just showing up!

[american.swan]

Without getting into a semantic discussion of how you define "elite," let's just say that what I think of as the "elite" running the party is much more concerned with winning elections and holding on to power and all its perks than policy. If that meant throwing anti-tax, limited government policies under the bus with Bush to win an election, they got no problem with that.

They'd just as quickly throw Bush under the 2008 bus for Ron Paul if they think that's they way for them to maintain themselves. It ain't pretty, it just is.




I agree with that. There is a section of the GOP that has no idea what it means to be GOP, they just want to win and they define themselves not by what they stand for but what their against. Their against the left/Clinton/no power. so I totally agree with Bradley's post.

[Bradley in DC]

There is a section of the GOP that has no idea what it means to be GOP, they just want to win and they define themselves not by what they stand for but what their against. Their against the left/Clinton/no power..

If, as RonPaulFan suggests, we can be respectful and not juvenile and disorderly AND show them how they can win in 2008 ONLY with Dr. Paul BECAUSE he "builds the base," you'll see a mantra next year among the elite of how they were always secretly rooting for the good doctor, yadda yadda yadda...:rolleyes: ...whatever, I'll take their support. :D

Oh, and the political newbies here should learn to use the phrase "builds the base" as the retort for "we're not Republicans":

Attack: Dr. Paul's supporters aren't really Republicans anyway.
Response: "Dr. Paul is the best candidate we have to 'build the base.'" :)

Yes, learning a foreign language can be difficult--but necessary--sometimes.

[Talldude1412]

Well some supporters have been juvenile and disorderly and they've posted the youtube videos showing that they are proud of their behavior.

Getting in arguments and being confrontational with supporters of other candidates when the other candidate comes to town is far from productive.

Yep, and it might just cost us the primaries if we can be generalized as a bunch of rude, over-zealous, loud-mouths. I really appreciate how much RP has energized many Americans, but we have to direct our enthusiasm in ways that don't attack other candidates outright.

Anyone who understands anything about psychology knows that confrontation and perceived attack only solidify a persons beliefs. What we need is discussion and understanding.

I know the majority of us are aware of the harm that comes of being overly aggressive and such, and as such this is not addressed to you.

::Prepare for a rant::

I'm going to start with an example from our iconic film V for Vendetta. In this movie at the climax when V is speaking to England, he doesn't call them a bunch of fascist sheep neocons. He says "I know why you did it. I know you were afraid. Who wouldn't be? War, terror, disease. There were a myriad of problems which conspired to corrupt your reason and rob you of your common sense. Fear got the best of you, and in your panic you turned to the now high chancellor, Adam Sutler. He promised you order, he promised you peace, and all he demanded in return was your silent, obedient consent.".

Passionate, deliberate, rational, and moving. Yelling at Rudy while he gets onto ferries in Mackinaw, and calling him things that others might not see (however deserving of them he is), is only going to harden hearts against us. Our movement SHOULD be one of passion and energy, unfortunately with passion and energy often comes high emotions, which leads to doing things that will tarnish the image of our good Dr. Paul, his supporters, and most importantly his message.

Our beliefs are INCREDIBLY powerful ones. Not since Barry Goldwater, and even Reagen has there been such a movement towards constitutional small government conservatism/ libertarianism. Our message is one that DESERVES to be preached loud and proud. It's a message that anyone in our country could connect to and at the very least respect. But instead we get labeled as kooks or worse. This is first and a foremost a failure for these people to open their minds to our argument, but secondly it is our failure to substantiate and explain our stances effectively in ways that welcome an open mind.

I realize that we have much working against us, not the least of which is time. The door to door advertising by Ron Paul supporters is one of the most moving/effective means we have (shows devotion/ enthusiasm on a personal basis), beyond Ron Paul giving some very powerful passionate speech in a way that open hearts and minds to him (Post CNN/Youtube debate speech). I highly advocate showing the energy and enthusiasm of our support at rallies and other forums. But just make sure that when we come a crossed potential voters (just about everyone) that we owe it to ourselves and the cause itself to explain and substantiate our movement calmly and openly without aggressive attack. We owe it to ourselves, Dr. Paul, and the country at large to advance our beliefs in a manner that will open hearts and minds to our message. Respond to aggression with calm, respond to name calling with signs of disappointment in their resorting to such low attacks.

Once again, this is not to knock the MAJORITY openly civil and effective RP supporters. We ARE the majority. But to those who continue to use the "fascists, sheep, neo-cons, murderers" labels for our fellow countrymen, however deserving the label may be, you are doing immeasurable harm to our cause and I hope beyond hope that it is not to late to break down the walls of defense they have built towards our cause because of it.

Sincerely,

Mike K.

[azminuteman]

One thing I wonder is if we can do it. How many of us are there?

Obama has had 62,000 donors as of Q3. Pauls donors are close to the 93,000 range and that is pretty impressive for little to no media face time.

As impressive as his donation numbers are, are there really millions of us that are ready to vote for him?

I live in Arizona and according to http://www.fec.gov/pubrec/fe2000/2000presprim.htm - McCain got 193,000 votes in the primary for the #1 spot.
He got 115,000 in New Hampshire for the #1 spot there as well. Are there 120,000 Ron Paul supporters in NH?

Judging by the 2000 numbers, it looks like he could get 3rd in NH.
If he keeps getting 3rd, the MSM will just not report it as in the current CBS omission.

Are there 250,000 voters in South Carolina to pull him through there?
Are there 50,000 voters in West Virgina to pull him through there?

Really, all this talking isn't doing anything but detracting from getting the unknown/undecided to know about Ron Paul. That is paramount.

[mosquitobite]

Bump.

This thread is so important folks!

[ItsTime]

Show our numbers and spread the Ron Paul ideas! Operation Front Door Dec 17th thru 22nd! (http://myspace.com/operationfrontdoor)

[Maltheus]

Well, I don't support the GOP's platform, I support Ron Paul's platform. I will only support the GOP if they support Ron Paul's platform. I will not be dishonest and claim that I am a rank and file Republican. I am always respectful anyway to anyone that I speak with, but I won't lie.

It's easy to portray yourself as a good Republican in these meetings, without betraying your principles. Just say that you're there to keep Hillary from getting elected and that you believe in the principles of small government. Ron Paul's talking points are the talking points of the GOP. Focus on the issues and not the candidate and you'll find most Republicans nodding along with you.

[jb4ronpaul]

have meetup republicans good at communicating email and call every local republican committee member. VERY IMPORTANT!
*********************************
My name is Joe Bozzi and I am a Republican living in Delaware county. I grew up a Reagan Republican and have been a very dedicated conservative Republican activist in the past, even running an independent conservative newspaper when I was in college. After the conservative revolution I was very hopeful that we would see much smaller government in Washington. But like many others, in recent times I have become frustrated with the rate at which government continues to grow.

I am writing you to tell you about, Ron Paul, a Republican I am excited to support for president in 2008. Ron Paul shares my conservative values. He is a pro-life doctor that has delivered thousands of babies. He is an Air Force veteran and has raised more money from the military than all the other Republican presidential candidates, I believe due to his strong stance on following their oath to uphold the Constitution. In 10 terms in Congress as a Republican he has shown himself to be principled and honest. I trust him and know that in office he will work for much smaller and Constitutional government, and more of our hard earned money will stay in our families, in our states, and out of Washington. He also has a broad and dedicated grassroots support base that is needed to beat Hillary in the coming election.

At times I think the mainstream media has been unfair to Dr. Paul, so many of us are trying to spread the truth about him ourselves. His website is www.Ronpaul2008.com, but I would really love to talk to you about him if you have a few minutes.

[Jaykzo]

I'm the last one to buy into nutty conspiracies, but I do have an honest skepticism towards the voting system.

Does anyone know the rules/regulations of counting votes, like if I can apply to do it, or if I can somehow view or be part of the voting to ensure nothing goofy goes down?

If we can find this information, it would be a good idea to have something organized within each state to ensure a clean vote.

[pacelli]

Excellent thread. First let me say that I love being a part of these forums. But do we represent the majority of ron paul supporters? How many people digg Ron Paul but don't use the internet at all?

Part of the rub is that with all of the posts, the grassroots organizing, the moneybomb planning, the near constant stream of updates, it is easy to get seduced into thinking that we constitute the majority of Ron Paul supporters, and we'll be fine. But in order to secure the nomination, we need more people willing to change their party to republican and get off their butt to vote for him.

In most states you must be a member of the republican party in order to vote for the party nominee. This means that ron paul will not get the nomination if we do not have enough people registered as republicans, as well as delegates, to prove to be the majority of republican voters in the state. I really do not want to see the MSM compare us to the Howard Deaniacs -- i.e. alot of fervent supporters that were too hungover to actually go and vote. Dr. Paul's message is so simple, yet honest. We must get him the nomination.

Ron Paul is founding father material. He is a rare gem in the political landscape, and in my opinion, worth going the extra mile.