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Pauls' Revere
04-13-2015, 07:36 PM
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2015-04-13/al-gore-joins-tea-party-in-battle-against-utilities

Strange bedfellows indeed.

Dooley, chairwoman of the Atlanta Tea Party chapter, joined with Democratic-leaning environmental groups two years ago, defeating a Georgia proposal to levy a fee on solar-panel owners for their use of the electric grid.

In Florida, she’s pushing a ballot initiative that would allow individual homeowners and businesses to sell their solar power directly to tenants and neighbors, a right now reserved for electric companies. Utilities have opposed those measures, saying they risk losing income needed to keep the grid stable for all consumers.

GunnyFreedom
04-13-2015, 07:41 PM
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2015-04-13/al-gore-joins-tea-party-in-battle-against-utilities

Strange bedfellows indeed.

Dooley, chairwoman of the Atlanta Tea Party chapter, joined with Democratic-leaning environmental groups two years ago, defeating a Georgia proposal to levy a fee on solar-panel owners for their use of the electric grid.

In Florida, she’s pushing a ballot initiative that would allow individual homeowners and businesses to sell their solar power directly to tenants and neighbors, a right now reserved for electric companies. Utilities have opposed those measures, saying they risk losing income needed to keep the grid stable for all consumers.

governments are not here to protect people, but to protect the wealthy, and to help them stay wealthy even when they piss it all away on smack and hookers.

Zippyjuan
04-13-2015, 08:09 PM
The grid (and maintaining it) is a fixed cost for a utility. Depending on the local rules, the costs of the grid may be included in the rates one pays for electricity. But if you go solar or use wind to generate your own electricity, you may have no net energy costs. You still use the grid- it delivers power when you solar is not active and it takes power when you are generating excess- but you pay nothing for the costs of the distribution system- a "free rider" problem. That means that other customers actually subsidise your use of the system. Some utilities are trying to change the pay structure where there is a base price for the grid and actual energy use is added to that base amount.


The practice of utility customers providing home-generated power to the grid and receiving credits for the power they produce is called “net metering,” and is legal in most states. But, it is something the electric power industry considers a threat to traditional utilities, which use centralized power sources that distribute electricity to customers via the power grid.

“Right now, a distributed generation customer is really paying less for the maintenance of the infrastructure than our other customers,” despite the up-front costs of installing solar panels on a roof, said Kathleen O’Shea, spokeswoman for Oklahoma Gas and Electric, or OGE, one of the state’s largest utilities.

Of OGE’s 800,000 customers, between 200 and 400 of them use rooftop solar or wind, she said.

“As solar prices come down and this becomes more popular, we want to make sure everybody who’s using the grid is paying their fair share,” she said, adding that it’s unfair for the utility’s traditional customers — roughly 799,600 of them — to foot the bill for grid maintenance when several hundred people end up saving money by using their own solar panels to provide power to the utility while not paying the grid maintenance surcharge.



http://www.businessspectator.com.au/article/2014/4/29/solar-energy/law-stop-solar-free-riders

Pauls' Revere
04-13-2015, 08:19 PM
I can see a neighborhood grid might be an idea. Some people pay HOA's which could maintain the grid they use, wire etc... but they would distribute between themselves. I'm imagining a localized community grid perhaps (shrug). I cringe at the idea that Al Gore is remotely interested in this. Texas has it's own grid.

Stratovarious
04-13-2015, 09:05 PM
Whenever teh name Al Gore comes up, best check under the fridge, cause you got a dead rat, it's gonna start to smell soon...


, ,

acptulsa
04-13-2015, 09:33 PM
This is nothing new. And there have been meters around for decades that keep track of energy flow both directions. It really isn't all that hard to set them up so they measure incoming at the regular rate, but outgoing at a slower rate that simulates wholesale rates.

How did this suddenly become a problem again? Is this another excuse for shoving smart meters down our throats?

Anti Federalist
04-13-2015, 09:55 PM
This is nothing new. And there have been meters around for decades that keep track of energy flow both directions. It really isn't all that hard to set them up so they measure incoming at the regular rate, but outgoing at a slower rate that simulates wholesale rates.

How did this suddenly become a problem again? Is this another excuse for shoving smart meters down our throats?

More than likely.

Just like fuel use taxes don't "work" anymore and you have to tracked and taxed by the mile.

Anti Federalist
04-13-2015, 09:58 PM
“As solar prices come down and this becomes more popular, we want to make sure everybody who’s using the grid is paying their fair share,” she said, adding that it’s unfair for the utility’s traditional customers — roughly 799,600 of them — to foot the bill for grid maintenance when several hundred people end up saving money by using their own solar panels to provide power to the utility while not paying the grid maintenance surcharge.

So, tell me, if I spend the money to go gridless, no hook up, no wires, come and get your meter, are you going to push for local laws that will now condemn my home for not being hooked up to your "service"?

TheGrinch
04-13-2015, 10:34 PM
Strange bedfellows?

You make it sound like if we want to have our own sustainable sources of energy, we're somehow siding with All Gore?

I don't think anyone in this movement is against finding alternative and better energy resources, we're against the agenda to use "climate change" as a source of control.

A liberty-minded person doesn't even have to have an opinion or even could be a believer in "climate change", and not be in support of scumbags like Gore.

Maybe if we all stood for what we felt was right, and not just what sticks to our " party lines", wed be much better off.

I like to think libertarians are better than that, we usually are, but it saddens me when people act like "free market" means we shouldn't have a say in what we want and don't want.

Sorry, that rant wasn't really directed at the OP, but I do feel like we sometimes get too caught up in politics that we can't criticize when its something that doesn't violate the principles we care most about.

oyarde
04-14-2015, 09:00 AM
The grid (and maintaining it) is a fixed cost for a utility. Depending on the local rules, the costs of the grid may be included in the rates one pays for electricity. But if you go solar or use wind to generate your own electricity, you may have no net energy costs. You still use the grid- it delivers power when you solar is not active and it takes power when you are generating excess- but you pay nothing for the costs of the distribution system- a "free rider" problem. That means that other customers actually subsidise your use of the system. Some utilities are trying to change the pay structure where there is a base price for the grid and actual energy use is added to that base amount.



http://www.businessspectator.com.au/article/2014/4/29/solar-energy/law-stop-solar-free-riders

County next to me has a co op like that , 31 dollars a month to be hooked up , usage on top of that , around 13 cents per kwh , no real bargain if you are using electric from them , but probably would be if you were not .