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Mr Tansill
03-12-2015, 04:47 PM
The text of the internet “regulation” has been released and I thought it was worthy to post a couple of relevant cuts here for people’s consumption and information. There was so much fervor and debate about the evil intent behind the government “taking over” the internet that it was making my head spin – especially since no one had even seen the regulations! Turns out, it WAS all hype.

In all, 49 instances of the word “tax” occur, fully 36 of them in the “dissenting opinion” section of the regulation – an indication of the fury and suspicion with which this effort was met. The appearances of the word tax in the actual content of the document are basically there to reassure the masses that it is not, nor was it previously the FCC’s goal to implement some sort of devilish tax scheme on the net – nor do they seek to control it in any other way other than to ensure that net neutrality remains a principle that continues since the net’s inception, until long in the future.

The below are some relevant cuts which should help alleviate concern on this site about the “intent” of the government to tax the “new internet.”

pg 13:

This includes no unbundling of last-mile facilities, no tariffing, no rate regulation, and no cost accounting rules, which results in a carefully tailored application of only those Title II provisions found to directly further the public interest in an open Internet and more, better, and open broadband. Nor will our actions result in the imposition of any new federal taxes or fees; the ability of states to impose fees on broadband is already limited by the congressional Internet tax moratorium.

Pg 224:

We reject the argument that “potential state tax implications” counsel against the classification of broadband Internet access service as a telecommunications service. Our classification of broadband Internet access service as a telecommunications service appropriately derives from the factual characteristics of these services as they exist and are offered today. At any rate, we observe that the recently reauthorized Internet Tax Freedom Act (ITFA) prohibits states and localities from imposing “[t]axes on Internet access.” This prohibition applies notwithstanding our regulatory classification of broadband Internet access service. Indeed, the legislative history of ITFA emphasizes that Congress drafted its definition of “Internet access” to be independent of the regulatory classification determination in order to “clarify that all transmission components of Internet access, regardless of the regulatory treatment of the underlying platform, are covered under the ITFA’s Internet tax moratorium.”

Now, for the parts which I’ve been saying all along the effort was about:


The Verizon court further affirmed the Commission’s conclusion that “broadband providers represent a threat to Internet openness and could act in ways that would ultimately inhibit the speed and extent of future broadband deployment."


Threats to Internet openness remain today. The record reflects that broadband providers hold all the tools necessary to deceive consumers, degrade content, or disfavor the content that they don’t like. The 2010 rules helped to deter such conduct while they were in effect. But, as Verizon frankly told the court at oral argument, but for the 2010 rules, it would be exploring agreements to charge certain content providers for priority service. Indeed, the wireless industry had a well-established record of trying to keep applications within a carrier-controlled “walled garden” in the early days of mobile applications. That specific practice ended when Internet Protocol (IP) created the opportunity to leap the wall. But the Commission has continued to hear concerns about other broadband provider practices involving blocking or degrading third-party applications.


Because the record overwhelmingly supports adopting rules and demonstrates that three specific practices invariably harm the open Internet—Blocking, Throttling, and Paid Prioritization—this Order bans each of them, applying the same rules to both fixed and mobile broadband Internet access service.


15. No Blocking. Consumers who subscribe to a retail broadband Internet access service must get what they have paid for—access to all (lawful) destinations on the Internet. This essential and well-accepted principle has long been a tenet of Commission policy, stretching back to its landmark decision in Carterfone, which protected a customer’s right to connect a telephone to the monopoly telephone network. Thus, this Order adopts a straightforward ban:

A person engaged in the provision of broadband Internet access service, insofar as such person is so engaged, shall not block lawful content, applications, services, or nonharmful devices, subject to reasonable network management.

16. No Throttling. The 2010 open Internet rule against blocking contained an ancillary prohibition against the degradation of lawful content, applications, services, and devices, on the ground that such degradation would be tantamount to blocking. This Order creates a separate rule to guard against degradation targeted at specific uses of a customer’s broadband connection:

A person engaged in the provision of broadband Internet access service, insofar as such person is so engaged, shall not impair or degrade lawful Internet traffic on the basis of Internet content, application, or service, or use of a non-harmful device, subject to reasonable network management.

17. The ban on throttling is necessary both to fulfill the reasonable expectations of a customer who signs up for a broadband service that promises access to all of the lawful Internet, and to avoid gamesmanship designed to avoid the no-blocking rule by, for example, rendering an application effectively, but not technically, unusable. It prohibits the degrading of Internet traffic based on source, destination, or content. It also specifically prohibits conduct that singles out content competing with a broadband provider’s business model.

18. No Paid Prioritization. Paid prioritization occurs when a broadband provider accepts payment (monetary or otherwise) to manage its network in a way that benefits particular content, applications, services, or devices. To protect against “fast lanes,” this Order adopts a rule that establishes that:

A person engaged in the provision of broadband Internet access service, insofar as such person is so engaged, shall not engage in paid prioritization.
“Paid prioritization” refers to the management of a broadband provider’s network to directly or indirectly favor some traffic over other traffic, including through use of techniques such as traffic shaping, prioritization, resource reservation, or other forms of preferential traffic management, either (a) in exchange for consideration (monetary or otherwise) from a third party, or (b) to benefit an affiliated entity.

19. The record demonstrates the need for strong action. The Verizon court itself noted that broadband networks have “powerful incentives to accept fees from edge providers, either in return for excluding their competitors or for granting them prioritized access to end users.” Mozilla, among many such commenters, explained that “[p]rioritization . . . inherently creates fast and slow lanes.” Although there are arguments that some forms of paid prioritization could be beneficial, the practical difficulty is this: the threat of harm is overwhelming, case-by-case enforcement can be cumbersome for individual consumers or edge providers, and there is no practical means to measure the extent to which edge innovation and investment would be chilled. And, given the dangers, there is no room for a blanket exception for instances where consumer permission is buried in a service plan—the threats of consumer deception and confusion are simply too great.


Additionally, consumers on unlimited data plans may be confused by slowed data speeds because broadband providers have not adequately communicated contractually-imposed data management practices and usage thresholds.136 Switching costs are also a critical factor that negatively impacts mobile broadband consumers, in particular due to the informational uncertainties mentioned below, among other reasons.137 Ultimately, when consumers face this kind of friction in switching to meaningful competitive alternatives, it decreases broadband provider’ responsiveness to consumer demands and limits the provider’s incentives to improve their networks.138 Additionally, 45 percent of households have only a single provider option for 25 Mbps/3 Mbps broadband service, indicating that 45 percent of households do not have any choices to switch to at this critical level of service.

Though we have the rules now, I'm sure it won't alleviate all concerns. I'm just glad to see that the rules are working in favor of the consumer.

You can find the entire text here: http://transition.fcc.gov/Daily_Releases/Daily_Business/2015/db0312/FCC-15-24A1.pdf

Chester Copperpot
03-12-2015, 05:18 PM
The Federal Reserve started out great too.

Slave Mentality
03-12-2015, 05:33 PM
Brought to you by those that love digging through your digital sock drawers, medicine cabinets, closets, and bank accounts. Sounds wonderful.

FunkBuddha
03-13-2015, 02:14 PM
So, if I'm a broadband provider, I can't prioritize real-time traffic such as VOIP or live audio/video over traffic that isn't time sensitive?

Stratovarious
03-13-2015, 06:15 PM
Rand ,

When you get in office , I hope the first thing you do after totally dismantling Obama Care, is shutting down any and all policies and programs established by , and ties the FCC has with the Internet.
The accelerated despotism in America is off the rails.

,,

The Free Hornet
03-14-2015, 12:30 AM
Though we have the rules now, I'm sure it won't alleviate all concerns. I'm just glad to see that the rules are working in favor of the consumer.

I'm a consumer who would gladly be throttled to pay LESS. I don't stream, VOIP, youtube (much), no netflix, no hulu. Why not let a neighbor pay more for better service so I can pay less?

I see NN as government imposed one-size-fits-all business models. I have two routes out on smart phone I hold. The carrier and my wifi. I don't need the FCC's protection and sure as fuck don't want to pay for it.

Of course this debate was driven by stream-heavy internet users and statists.

idiom
03-14-2015, 02:51 AM
no unbundling of last-mile facilities

This would be the most useful aspect, as government regulation restricts competition in creating last-mile facilities.

LibForestPaul
03-14-2015, 06:17 AM
All for show. This will all merge with two factor authentication, "data-breaches", zombie machines, and Chinese/Iranian hacking, secure-boot, walled cell phones(Google, Apple). You will no longer own your device that connects with one another.

FunkBuddha
03-14-2015, 07:59 AM
I suspect this bill was written by Google and that this regulation was entirely intended to punish the current non-fiber broadband offerings such as Comcast and AT&T. With the mobile providers now offering wi-fi calling (the timing of the announcement being after the so-called net-neutrality regulations is dubious), and the fact the the current primary broadband providers can't even do reasonable prioritization of the traffic, these providers are going to get crushed with service related issues. Oh, and they're putting the traffic in IPSEC tunnels which could make it more difficult to classify. Cities will be beating down the doors at Google, begging for fiber to the home.

Since providing fiber in rural areas is cost prohibitive, those of us who live there will be stuck with shitty internet service for the foreseeable future. I was actually considering starting a WISP to serve my neighbors, but thats damn near impossible if I can't classify/prioritize traffic.

PRB
03-14-2015, 09:23 AM
So, if I'm a broadband provider, I can't prioritize real-time traffic such as VOIP or live audio/video over traffic that isn't time sensitive?

Correct, thanks to OP for posting this.

What they're essentially saying is, knowing that VOIP, HBOGO, Netflix, youtube are the biggest offenders of bandwidth consumption, you must treat them as equal as blogs which take up 1/1,000 of data usage. If you need to charge customers more, go ahead, but you're not allowed to throttle, filter, regulate.

That means there can (and most likely will) be a big gap between slow speeds and high speeds.

Effectively, dial up and low speed DSL will be cheap, you can HBOGO all you want at a pathetic speed, but if you want it to work properly at 3-6MBps, sorry, FCC just told providers they are allowed to charge you as if you Netflix 24/7 or half of it. Because after all "You paid for it, why shouldn't you be allowed to?"

The understanding is, consumers "have a right" to use it 24/7 regardless of what everybody else does, regardless of market trends, and patterns are not justification for adjusting prices to meet costs. When you tell people you can't charge extra for HBO and Showtime, what do you think happens next? They'll charge everybody an extra $500 a month because they can now assume everybody will be watching HBO & Showtime 24/7. Why wouldn't they?

The attempt to make internet "equal" and affordable, without price regulation, allows providers to overcharge in paranoia (and it helps when there's virtually no competition).

Think back to cellphone providers who say "Unlimited minutes" they basically mean 60x24x31 per month (44,640) per device. When Vonage says you get "unlimited minutes" they also have a "normal usage" expectation which prevents commercial users from abusing their low prices. Mobile internet providers who provide "unlimited data" know that most people will never use up 2GB per month, unless you're streaming Youtube a few hours a day. Sometimes speeds will auto regulate what people are willing to use, but when the band broadens, people will get ideas, and some will abuse it. FCC rules do not allow providers to take into account actual usage, so providers will protect themselves by forcing everybody to pay more. Hooray ObamaNet Affordable Internet Act.

presence
03-14-2015, 09:25 AM
I can't help but see this is an underhanded way to make P2P broadband mesh networks illegal / regulated before they become too popular.

http://thomasquinlan.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/02/wpid-openlibernet-2014-02-16-20-11.jpg

Big Broadband WANTS "Regulatory Capture (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Regulatory_capture)"




We're within years of everyone and their mom being able to launch a 200' tall tethered solar powered quadcopter wifi antenna in their own back yard. Wired copper networks are going the way of the dodo.

Blockchain technology is about to unleash filesharing. (http://www.coindesk.com/could-cryptocurrency-improve-file-sharing/)


http://i.imgur.com/7ZP7p8X.png

PRB
03-14-2015, 09:28 AM
I can't help but see this is an underhanded way to make P2P broadband mesh networks illegal / regulated before they become to popular.

I highly doubt they're aware of this or think it's a problem.

PRB
03-14-2015, 09:36 AM
I'm a consumer who would gladly be throttled to pay LESS. I don't stream, VOIP, youtube (much), no netflix, no hulu. Why not let a neighbor pay more for better service so I can pay less?


Short answer : because the FCC is fucking stupid.

Under this ruling, you can only pay less for slow speed, you cannot pay less for sites and services you don't use.

Example : if you don't use VOIP, Youtube, Hulu, netflix, HBOGo, torrent, share videos with family, you can only pay less by using slow speed internet. If you want to upload your own photos faster, read blogs faster, download news sites faster, sorry, the only way to do that would be to pay the same amount as somebody who Hulus 24/7. FCC does not care if you'll "gladly" pay more for what you use.

This is a lot like cellular mobile internet, it's overall slow, so filtering is unnecessary. Go ahead netflix on the go, if you can tolerate the reliability of the connection. I can see how this ruling paves the way to make cellular internet more expensive too, since once it becomes more reliable and fast, people will abuse it non-stop, the only way to cap would be capping DATA USAGE.



I see NN as government imposed one-size-fits-all business models.


Everybody agrees that's exactly what it is, they just don't agree if it's an accurate and suitable one size fits all. (OSFA can mean fitting 90% or 5%)



I have two routes out on smart phone I hold. The carrier and my wifi. I don't need the FCC's protection and sure as fuck don't want to pay for it.

Of course this debate was driven by stream-heavy internet users and statists.

among other people.

PRB
03-14-2015, 09:40 AM
I didn't see anywhere that said they can't cap DATA USAGE.

Meaning, a person reading blogs and newspapers all day will only use 1/100 of a person streaming 2 movies.

One person uses it for 8 hours, the other only 3. But if you capped and charged for data downloaded (regardless of how long it took), providers can regulate without filtering, censoring and without fast laning. Is that currently allowed? It's bit outdated thinking, but I don't see how that's banned.

This would be an effectivel loophole that'll allow low data users to pay less at high speeds, IF there's a market for that.

presence
03-14-2015, 10:01 AM
I highly doubt they're aware of this or think it's a problem.

You think blue chip tech leadership hasn't pondered a swot analysis of blockchain tech and p2p mesh? Really?

http://www.computerweekly.com/news/2240242272/IBM-could-create-digital-payments-infrastructure-for-central-banks

https://medium.com/backchannel/how-bitcoins-blockchain-could-power-an-alternate-internet-bb501855af67

pcosmar
03-14-2015, 10:52 AM
I'm a consumer who would gladly be throttled to pay LESS.

As a consumer that has consistently been throttled despite what I pay (which continues to increase) I would like to see providers get their shit together.

But I have never wanted government or regulation to be involved in any way..

It would be nice to not get DC'd in the middle of a Raid. (which happens way too often)

Mr Tansill
03-14-2015, 05:57 PM
I'm a consumer who would gladly be throttled to pay LESS. I don't stream, VOIP, youtube (much), no netflix, no hulu. Why not let a neighbor pay more for better service so I can pay less?

I see NN as government imposed one-size-fits-all business models. I have two routes out on smart phone I hold. The carrier and my wifi. I don't need the FCC's protection and sure as fuck don't want to pay for it.

Of course this debate was driven by stream-heavy internet users and statists.

I don't think you're using the term "throttled" properly. Throttled refers to certain sites being allowed to load faster or forced to load slower relative to others given the same level of service. What that means is if you have a 3 MB/s connection, some sites will load at 3 MB/s, while others will load at a slower speed, like 1 MB/s.

The business model you're after is what is currently available world-wide. Take a look at Comcast's offerings as just one of many examples. You don't want to pay for it? I'm surprised you still hold that opinion after the text of the regulation explicitly indicates that there will be no taxation or fees implemented.

PRB
03-14-2015, 06:01 PM
I don't think you're using the term "throttled" properly. Throttled refers to certain sites being allowed to load faster or forced to load slower relative to others given the same level of service. What that means is if you have a 3 MB/s connection, some sites will load at 3 MB/s, while others will load at a slower speed, like 1 MB/s.

The business model you're after is what is currently available world-wide. Take a look at Comcast's offerings as just one of many examples. You don't want to pay for it? I'm surprised you still hold that opinion after the text of the regulation explicitly indicates that there will be no taxation or fees implemented.

I think he's using it correctly, just more convoluted, which I was trying to say "reverse throttling" but that rule is covered as "fast lane" which is not allowed anyway.

Mr Tansill
03-14-2015, 07:00 PM
I think he's using it correctly, just more convoluted, which I was trying to say "reverse throttling" but that rule is covered as "fast lane" which is not allowed anyway.

Cool.

thoughtomator
03-14-2015, 07:19 PM
I'm so happy that the FCC did this. It's extremely annoying when my porn gets throttled for some lame-ass VOIP 911 ambulance call.

Mr Tansill
03-14-2015, 07:30 PM
I'm so happy that the FCC did this. It's extremely annoying when my porn gets throttled for some lame-ass VOIP 911 ambulance call.

Oh man, me too! Is that all the ISPs wanted to do? Ensure that VOIP 911 calls get priority? Thank goodness Comcast, NBC, Verizon, and the rest were only concerned about the safety of the public!

PRB
03-15-2015, 12:21 AM
Oh man, me too! Is that all the ISPs wanted to do? Ensure that VOIP 911 calls get priority? Thank goodness Comcast, NBC, Verizon, and the rest were only concerned about the safety of the public!

Keeping my kids safe from porn and my spouse safe from child porn.

Origanalist
03-15-2015, 03:06 AM
Why should I believe anything in these rules? The government can and does change the rules they make anytime they feel like it. Case in point...http://thehill.com/regulation/court-battles/235054-supreme-court-sides-with-administration-in-rulemaking-challenge

NorthCarolinaLiberty
03-15-2015, 03:19 AM
Keeping my kids safe from porn and my spouse safe from child porn.

Spoken like a true big government advocate. Thanks for expressing your true sentiments.

Mr Tansill
03-15-2015, 08:47 AM
Why should I believe anything in these rules? The government can and does change the rules they make anytime they feel like it. Case in point...http://thehill.com/regulation/court-battles/235054-supreme-court-sides-with-administration-in-rulemaking-challenge

You shouldn't, necessarily. But that is not a reason to oppose NN.

Thor
03-15-2015, 09:56 AM
15. No Blocking. Consumers who subscribe to a retail broadband Internet access service must get what they have paid for—access to all (lawful) destinations on the Internet. This essential and well-accepted principle has long been a tenet of Commission policy, stretching back to its landmark decision in Carterfone, which protected a customer’s right to connect a telephone to the monopoly telephone network. Thus, this Order adopts a straightforward ban:

And what, is the definition of "lawful"?

thoughtomator
03-15-2015, 10:15 AM
Oh man, me too! Is that all the ISPs wanted to do? Ensure that VOIP 911 calls get priority? Thank goodness Comcast, NBC, Verizon, and the rest were only concerned about the safety of the public!

More seriously, the root of the problem is that those companies have government-sanctioned/enforced monopolies/oligopolies. Eliminating their right to their own property is a step in the wrong direction and will cement those oligopolies for decades to come - which is why most of those companies aren't complaining except in the "don't throw me in the br'er patch" sort of way.

It would not surprise me ONE BIT to find that these rules originated from the desk of a Comcast lobbyist.

Mr Tansill
03-15-2015, 11:55 AM
More seriously, the root of the problem is that those companies have government-sanctioned/enforced monopolies/oligopolies. Eliminating their right to their own property is a step in the wrong direction and will cement those oligopolies for decades to come - which is why most of those companies aren't complaining except in the "don't throw me in the br'er patch" sort of way.

It would not surprise me ONE BIT to find that these rules originated from the desk of a Comcast lobbyist.

I 100% agree with you. In my ideal world, there would be no need for such regulation, and the internet provider market would be freely open and accessible to all companies who desired to do business there.

Mr Tansill
03-15-2015, 11:57 AM
And what, is the definition of "lawful"?

This is a most "Socratic" message board...

I suppose it is the set of those actions which do not bring about harm to other people.

TheTexan
03-15-2015, 12:44 PM
So... is internet free now?

PRB
03-15-2015, 03:03 PM
Spoken like a true big government advocate. Thanks for expressing your true sentiments.

So basically to you, I'm always sarcastic except when I'm not?

PRB
03-15-2015, 03:04 PM
This is a most "Socratic" message board...

I suppose it is the set of those actions which do not bring about harm to other people.

In today's world, for practical and legal definitions : anything but child porn, piracy, hacking, spam and advocation of crime (I'm sure I missed something).

Root
03-15-2015, 09:19 PM
And what, is the definition of "lawful"?

See below...


Hell, this whole board is a thought crime in progress.

Thor
03-16-2015, 03:17 AM
And what, is the definition of "lawful"?

See below...


Hell, this whole board is a thought crime in progress.



And that was my point... sanctioned by the state.

Stratovarious
03-16-2015, 06:09 AM
And what, is the definition of "lawful"?
lol...They don't mean lawful silly......they mean FCC APPROVED CONTENT SITES....

Stratovarious
03-16-2015, 06:14 AM
I see nothing in the rules so far that hasn't already had a vehicle for taking care of itself, this is so much meddling, control , agency building, federalizing, tax raising, bureacratic b# , it makes me car sick.
FCC GO ##c# yourself and the horse you rode in on.


, ,

Weston White
03-16-2015, 07:01 AM
Oh yea, and cellphones are free under the Obama plan as well, at least for those that are not paying for them. Hence, enter ObamaNet, it is free, it is fun, it is here.

First they go after the Internet service providers, then they go after Internet servers, then they go after Internet Websites, then they go after Internet users...