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View Full Version : Indiana State Rep. Jim Lucas Introduces Constitutional Carry Bill




William Tell
01-18-2015, 02:05 PM
Constitutional carry proposed in Indiana (VIDEO)

http://www.guns.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/Rep.-Lucas-300x247.jpg (http://www.guns.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/Rep.-Lucas.jpg)Indiana Rep. Jim Lucas (R) would like to scrap the state’s current concealed carry permit in favor of constitutional carry. (Photo: thestatehousefile.com)


State Rep. Jim Lucas (R) has filed legislation that would repeal Indiana’s current concealed carry permit program in favor of free and lawful unlicensed carry.

The bill introduced would strike down the state’s popular handgun permitting scheme as enforced by the Indiana State Police, replacing it with language allowing unlicensed or so-called constitutional carry (http://www.guns.com/search/?q=Constitutional+carry) in the state of 6.5 million. Just four other states have similar laws.

“This is geared toward the innocent person. I want to remove one more obstacle in their path where they can defend themselves,” Lucas told ABC 6 (http://www.theindychannel.com/news/local-news/bill-would-repeal-law-requiring-license-to-carry-handgun).

Under the proposed legislation, entered into the General Assembly as House Bill 1144 (https://iga.in.gov/legislative/2015/bills/house/1144#document-c2e70546), would repeal numerous sections of the more than 30 pages of Indiana law governing the carry of firearms both in a car and on a person. In turn, it would be amended to allow lawful concealed carry of a handgun by anyone in the state that is legally entitled to possess one. As a by-product, the bill would strike several crimes from the state’s code dealing with carry of a firearm without a permit.

With some 570,712 (http://www.in.gov/isp/files/ISP_Firearms_Licensing_Statistics_2014_2nd_Quarter .pdf) permits issued, Indiana has one of the highest rates of lawful concealed carry in the nation. According to a 2014 report (http://crimepreventionresearchcenter.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/07/Concealed-Carry-Permit-Holders-Across-the-United-States.pdf)from the Crime Prevention Research Center, only South Dakota has a higher percent of the eligible population that has a permit. A large part of this is due to the state’s historically low cost for permits, ranging from $10-$50 that include an option for lifetime carry.

A fiscal analysis (https://iga.in.gov/legislative/2015/bills/house/1144#document-5e473790) of HB 1144 by the state Legislative Services Agency released in December found that, while the ISP would realize a savings of the $277,000 it currently spends to support the concealed carry license program, this would be offset by a more than $4.4 million expected loss in revenue to state coffers that the permits generate.

As an unintended consequence, should the bill become law it could force Indiana constitutional carriers to obtain permits from other jurisdictions should they want to carry outside of the Hoosier State. According to the ISP, the current license has reciprocal recognition in 27 states.

Constitutional carry is law in Vermont, Alaska, Arizona and Wyoming, while numerous unsuccessful bills have been proposed in the past several years to expand the concept. Currently Texas (http://www.guns.com/2014/11/12/texas-lawmakers-introduce-bills-for-both-open-constitutional-carry/), which is one of the few states that outlaws open carry, is exploring the option as part a host of legislation to reform the Lone Star State’s gun laws.

House Bill 1144 has been referred to the Public Policy Committee for review.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HU6NrcAlfT0

http://www.guns.com/2015/01/13/constitutional-carry-proposed-in-indiana-video/

mosquitobite
01-18-2015, 09:32 PM
I've heard they refuse to even let it come out of committee.

William Tell
01-18-2015, 09:37 PM
I've heard they refuse to even let it come out of committee.

The author of the bill gives it a 50/50 chance of coming out of committee. I posted that in your State forum, maybe you don't look there? :D
http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?466953-Constitutional-Carry-and-Campus-Carry-Indiana-HBs-1144-and-1143-needs-your-support

mosquitobite
01-18-2015, 09:44 PM
The author of the bill gives it a 50/50 chance of coming out of committee. I posted that in your State forum, maybe you don't look there? :D
http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?466953-Constitutional-Carry-and-Campus-Carry-Indiana-HBs-1144-and-1143-needs-your-support

I give it much lower odds, but the Indiana RLC will be watching and pushing for it.

mosquitobite
01-18-2015, 09:46 PM
We have medical marijuana bills up. We have a nullification bill. We have a bill to get us out of NCLB. We have a bill to rein in asset forfeiture. Quite a few good bills.

And then we have SB100...http://iga.in.gov/legislative/2015/bills/senate/100

William Tell
01-18-2015, 09:55 PM
We have medical marijuana bills up. We have a nullification bill. We have a bill to get us out of NCLB. We have a bill to rein in asset forfeiture. Quite a few good bills.

And then we have SB100...http://iga.in.gov/legislative/2015/bills/senate/100
Cool, you should post some threads about them. I love hearing what other states are considering, Indiana I don't hear much about.

Tod
01-19-2015, 07:34 AM
Ohio has one too.....stuck in committee, never to be heard from again. Probably not a 1 in a 1,000 chance of ever being heard of again.

osan
01-19-2015, 08:04 AM
Did you notice how the single mention of implied objection to the bill was based on lost revenues to the state, rather than because the world would come to an end? That may indicate a sea-change in the anti-gun strategy. I am wondering if they are become smart enough to realize that their "sky is falling" rhetoric is rapidly losing credibility and that they have to change tactics. I am not convinced the "we're losing tax dollars" argument will meet with success.

While the justification for the bill is well taken, I note that legislators never raise the fact that there is no auhtoritative basis for such restrictions, whether for guns, pot, paid sex, or what have you. "Burdensome" is a relative and capricious standard against which one may argue effectively, especially where the political climate favors one's contrary position. But the arguments based in solidly fundamental principle are unassailable, the only alternative for those seeking to violate being to go full-retard/full-tyrant and simply ignore reality, passing statutes or policy changes arbitrarily and against all proper reason and moral authority.

It is my firm opinion that a body of these principles needs to be authored in bullet-proof fashion and distributed to all legislators. Some of my writings have begun this process, but methinks it incomplete. Now THERE is a project for RPF. Anyone interested?

osan
01-19-2015, 08:07 AM
The author of the bill gives it a 50/50 chance of coming out of committee. I posted that in your State forum, maybe you don't look there? :D
http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?466953-Constitutional-Carry-and-Campus-Carry-Indiana-HBs-1144-and-1143-needs-your-support

May I take it that Indiana has no mechanism for putting such questions to a referendum? I'm not a big fan of the mechanism because it reeks of mob-rule, but there are times when it can be helpful.

William Tell
01-19-2015, 08:19 AM
May I take it that Indiana has no mechanism for putting such questions to a referendum? I'm not a big fan of the mechanism because it reeks of mob-rule, but there are times when it can be helpful.

I don't know if they do or not. WA state recently passed an extremely bad anti-gun referendum.

jtap
01-19-2015, 11:55 AM
$4.4 million expected loss in revenue to state coffers that the permits generate

4.4 million reasons it is unlikely to happen. Kudos to Jim for trying though.