For the children: FBI Director James Comey 'Very Concerned' Apple, Google Privacy Features

[aGameOfThrones]

FBI Director James Comey 'Very Concerned' About New Apple, Google Privacy Features

WASHINGTON -- FBI Director James Comey said Thursday that he was "very concerned" about new steps Silicon Valley tech giants were taking to strengthen privacy protections on mobile devices.

"I am a huge believer in the rule of law, but I am also a believer that no one in this country is beyond the law," Comey told reporters at FBI headquarters in Washington. "What concerns me about this is companies marketing something expressly to allow people to place themselves above the law."


"Unlike our competitors, Apple cannot bypass your passcode and therefore cannot access this data," the company said. "So it's not technically feasible for us to respond to government warrants for the extraction of this data from devices in their possession running iOS 8."

Comey said that while he understood the need for privacy, government access to mobile devices may be needed in extreme circumstances, such as in the event of a terror attack.

"I like and believe very much that we should have to obtain a warrant from an independent judge to be able to take the content of anyone's closet or their smart phone," he said. "The notion that someone would market a closet that could never be opened -- even if it involves a case involving a child kidnapper and a court order -- to me does not make any sense."

Comey said FBI officials have had conversations with both Apple and Google about the marketing of their devices.

"Google is marketing their Android the same way: Buy our phone and law-enforcement, even with legal process, can never get access to it," he said.

"There will come a day -- well it comes every day in this business -- when it will matter a great, great deal to the lives of people of all kinds that we be able to with judicial authorization gain access to a kidnapper's or a terrorist or a criminal's device. I just want to make sure we have a good conversation in this country before that day comes. I'd hate to have people look at me and say, 'Well how come you can't save this kid,' 'how come you can't do this thing.'"

The director further expressed concern that public outcry over privacy in the wake of the NSA scandal may lead to unforeseen consequences.

"I get that the post-Snowden world has started an understandable pendulum swing," he said. "What I'm worried about is, this is an indication to us as a country and as a people that, boy, maybe that pendulum swung too far."


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/09/25/james-comey-apple-encryption_n_5882874.html

[CPUd]

http://i.imgur.com/3lMHLZN.jpg

[Austrian Econ Disciple]

Kids, terrorists, hmm...who'd they miss? Oh, yeah women. Check off all those emotional appeal boxes to dupe the suckers. Especially funny coming from the FBI - Hoover and all...ya know? HAHA.

[thoughtomator]

At this point the only safe assumption is that everything is still completely transparent to govt spooks and what we are hearing with this latest round of "privacy" technology is a ruse to get us to go back to sleep.

When trust is destroyed so thoroughly, you cannot get back to where you were without a complete resolution of all outstanding issues, which would have to include prosecution of the guilty.

[Kotin]

So having privacy is being above the law??? Not according to the goddamn constitution which is THE law of the land, bitch.

[helmuth_hubener]

At this point the only safe assumption is that everything is still completely transparent to govt spooks

Yes, that is a wise assumption. Nevertheless, these developments are positive and heartening.

[thoughtomator]

Yes, that is a wise assumption. Nevertheless, these developments are positive and heartening.

You're not paranoid enough. Without prosecution of national security officials it is more likely than not that this is a mere illusion/charade.

[otherone]

"What concerns me about this is companies marketing something expressly to allow people to place themselves above the law."

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-zzd1nv1FaMM/Th7wGYRmySI/AAAAAAAAAdA/yWXgejpjjW8/s1600/eye_of_sauron.jpg

[helmuth_hubener]

You're not paranoid enough. Actually, you have no idea.

Let us say that Apple's technical change and announcement is all, as you say, a charade. Is it not a heartening charade? Here is a major company acknowledging privacy as a major issue, expressing extreme unhappiness over government surveillance, and rolling out a technical change to address that. That is a positive and heartening develop from this libertarian's perspective.

Google and Yahoo are also both going to support e-mail encryption on their mail platforms. These are huge, very important mail platforms. This is the coming true of a dream I and I'm sure others had back in the '90s. Now it's actually happening. Now there's a path forward for email encryption to be a practical, realistic, and downright easy thing to do.

I would not recommend that you trust any of these things. I would recommend probably a much higher level of paranoia than you are capable of implementing. I would absolutely recommend that you assume that anything you write on a networked device is being written for a worldwide audience. All I wrote is that these developments are positive and heartening. And that is all I meant.

[pessimist]

Apple has a totalitarian philosophy when it comes to their products. They have complete control over their devices to such a degree that you literally have to 'jailbreak' them to have any control. When you do that you void your warranty.

To hell with Apple. They don't give two shits about your personal privacy.

[CPUd]

Apple has a totalitarian philosophy when it comes to their products. They have complete control over their devices to such a degree that you literally have to 'jailbreak' them to have any control. When you do that you void your warranty.

To hell with Apple. They don't give two shits about your personal privacy.

They seem to be giving at least one shit now.

[helmuth_hubener]

Apple has a totalitarian philosophy when it comes to their products. They have complete control over their devices to such a degree that you literally have to 'jailbreak' them to have any control.
There has never been any widespread remote attack or malware (https://securosis.com/blog/defending-ios-data-ios-security-and-data-protection) used against (non-jailbroken) iOS devices.

Some silly users consider this a benefit.


When you do that you void your warranty. That is nonsense. Jailbreaking your device does not void its warranty, restoring your device in iTunes will remove the jailbreak completely and you can still uses iTunes and all your apps just as you did before.

[pessimist]

There has never been any widespread remote attack or malware (https://securosis.com/blog/defending-ios-data-ios-security-and-data-protection) used against (non-jailbroken) iOS devices.

It's only a matter of time.


Some silly users consider this a benefit.

Look, if I was going to recommend a phone to my aunt or grandmother or teenage cousin I'd say get an iPhone. They do a fantastic job with their app store, and their highly restrictive devices keep them reasonably safe from malware. I personally wouldn't use a device that doesn't let me (the consumer) have control of.



That is nonsense. Jailbreaking your device does not void its warranty, restoring your device in iTunes will remove the jailbreak completely and you can still uses iTunes and all your apps just as you did before.

You're right, my bad. I don't use apple products, I just remember hearing or reading that it did.

[pessimist]

What about the data stored in the cloud?

[Stallheim]

While I am positive this is pretty clear to everyone here, it is good to remember that a control hungry corporation can only do nasty things to their customers as long as they keep using their products and competitors are always eager to screw you a little less, or at least in a different way. When it comes to the state you have no choice. This is why I find it frustrating when people speak of corporations and business in terms of control and exploitation; language which should be reserved for the real controllers and exploiters.
The water will always be muddy because of government favors, lobbying and backroom deals, but remove the ability for the state to peddle and coerce in the market place and these business advantages would evaporate. Yes there are dirty guys at the top of the political and the corporate pile but only because state force and its threat are for sale in the first place. I just don't want people to be so easily distracted from this simple point.

[helmuth_hubener]

What about the data stored in the cloud? Depends which cloud you use, but I assume you mean Apple's first-party option.

Apple does still have the key to that. The iOS 8 change that the FBI director is reacting to does not affect iCloud. iCloud remains a vulnerable way to store data, and one that is vulnerable to search warrants and law enforcement for sure.

From the link I posted in my thread (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?460352-Apple-will-no-longer-unlock-most-iPhones-iPads-for-police-even-with-search-warrants) about this announcement:

"Apple will still have the ability — and the legal responsibility — to turn over user data stored elsewhere, such as in its iCloud service, which typically includes backups of photos, videos, e-mail communications, music collections and more. Users who want to prevent all forms of police access to their information will have to adjust settings in a way that blocks data from flowing to iCloud." -- http://www.washingtonpost.com/business/technology/2014/09/17/2612af58-3ed2-11e4-b03f-de718edeb92f_story.html

I would recommend that users concerned about their privacy -- and that really should be all of us -- do exactly that: not use the iCloud service.

I don't want to seem like I'm just saying Apple is perfect and defending everything they do. I appreciate your thoughts, pessimist, and feel much the same way about liking control and enjoying tinkering with my devices. I jailbreak my Apple stuff :).

[Stallheim]

I want to apologize to my fellow forum participants; my previous post was not aimed at you. It is a time honored strategy of libertarian leaning street philosophers to focus on the exploiter that is most commonly vilified by the audience. We know this stuff, but there is a root, and we know what really needs to be done once we have successfully opened enough minds. Getting to the root is the goal. Apple frustrates me sometimes but not like a bureaucrat does; I can think of no business man that enrages me close to as much as the average Federal bureaucrat, politician or enforcement agent.

[helmuth_hubener]

I can think of no business man that enrages me close to as much as the average Federal bureaucrat, politician or enforcement agent.
Agreed. I try to keep that at the top of my mind in those rare situations where a businessman does enrage me. No matter how horrible the service is that I've received, it doesn't even compare to what, say, the IRS gives us. Or CPS. Or on and on.

[CPUd]

I want to apologize to my fellow forum participants; my previous post was not aimed at you. It is a time honored strategy of libertarian leaning street philosophers to focus on the exploiter that is most commonly vilified by the audience. We know this stuff, but there is a root, and we know what really needs to be done once we have successfully opened enough minds. Getting to the root is the goal. Apple frustrates me sometimes but not like a bureaucrat does; I can think of no business man that enrages me close to as much as the average Federal bureaucrat, politician or enforcement agent.

Yes, if you really want to protect your devices, you need root.

[pessimist]

I wouldn't recommend a novice root their phone.

But yes, rooting is the only way to adequately secure it. First step after root... get rid of the stock rom that's filled with manufacturing bloat and flash a custom rom like cyanogenmod (my fav) or paranoid android :D

[Chester Copperpot]

the govt is doing this to themselves... everytime people see a video of a cop or govt official acting above the law, its creating an awareness and a DESIRE for privacy outside the scope of govt.. people know that companies must comply with things like subpoenas and companies know people want the privacy.. so the market is creating a solution..

now apple and google can comply with all the court orders 100% without providing any information to the govt.

and if a little kid DID die? Id still blame the govt for creating this scenario because of their abuse of power...

id be okay with arresting EVERY politician, bureaucrat, and cop.. then let them prove theyre not guilty of violating their oath of office... they cant prove a negative so lock them all in jail.. let that sink in real good and long