Man facing charges for hanging American flag upside down, spray painting it

[phill4paul]

BLAIR COUNTY, Pa. — A Blair County man said he was standing up for this American Indian heritage and expressing his beliefs when he hung an American flag upside down and spray painted it earlier this week.

But police said what he did was inexcusable.

“I was offended by it when I first saw it. I had an individual stop here at the station, a female, who was in the military and she was very offended by it.” said Allegheny Township police Assistant Chief L.J. Berg.

Berg said he took the flag down and charged Joshua Brubaker with desecration and insults to the American flag.

“I removed it from the building, folded it properly and seized it as evidence,” said Berg.

Brubacker defended his actions and said he never meant to upset or offend anyone. He said he and his wife are of American Indian heritage and are passionate about American Indian Movement, specifically in the Midwest.

“I found that Wounded Knee is up for sale. Not only privately, but commercially. It’s just not right, and simply because I express myself in a way that somebody else doesn’t like or agree with doesn’t mean I should be persecuted for having beliefs,” Brubaker said.

With many of his own family members serving in the military at one point in their lives, Brubaker said the flag should give him the right to express his beliefs.

“If I don’t have a right to fly that flag upside down, which means a sign of distress, which this country is in so much distress right now, then what’s the point of having it?” Brubaker asked.

Authorities said there are other ways he could have expressed himself, other than defacing a symbol so many have fought hard to protect.

“People have made too many sacrifices to protect the flag and to have this happen in my community, I’m not happy with that,” Berg said.

Brubaker said he wishes those who were offended would have come to him so he could have explained his position. He is facing misdemeanor charges, but hopes police will reconsider.

http://www.wpxi.com/news/news/local/man-facing-charges-hanging-american-flag-upside-do/nfx67/

[donnay]

SMDH. It means distress, for God sakes.

[FindLiberty]

Nice try "freedom", PUNISH wins!

150% democracy in action there = applicable rules chosen by the 51% mob of the moment + 99% state coercive power enforcement.

Oh, I forgot to add a dash of propaganda.

[phill4paul]

SMDH. It means distress, for God sakes.

It doesn't matter what it means. Flag worshiping AmeriKunts don't believe that such a great nation could be in distress. In addition, they don't believe in the first amendment unless it's followed with "we'll put a boot in your ass, it's the AmeriKan way"

[acptulsa]

Free speech and liberty made that flag great. How can that flag now be considered more important than free speech and liberty?

It's like the secular version of idolatry. You no longer have the freedom and liberty to use this symbol of free speech and liberty in your free speech and liberty.

Brubaker might have inverted it and spray painted it. But Berg served it a damned sight worse. He made it meaningless. Just another piece of cloth.

[RJB]

Maybe he thought it needed more than 3 colors so he spray painted it? If he said it was for diversity, they may have praised him instead.

[Anti Federalist]

Might as well wipe your ass with it now, for all the damn good it's worth.


“I was offended by it when I first saw it. I had an individual stop here at the station, a female, who was in the military and she was very offended by it.” said Allegheny Township police Assistant Chief L.J. Berg.

OMG, a Praetorian Fury was insulted.

Go to jail Mundane.

[RJB]

Free speech and liberty made that flag great. How can that flag now be considered more important than free speech and liberty?

It's like the secular version of idolatry. You no longer have the freedom and liberty to use this symbol of free speech and liberty in your free speech and liberty.

In Bootcamp they taught us extreme love of the Guidon (A flag with the Platoon's number.) Drill instructors would drop it and we recruits basically fought each other and dove to stop it from touching the deck. Some fellow recruits became quite fanatical in their devotion, that I could picture in combat some of them running over and stepping on wounded Marines in order to save the flag, forgetting that the flag represented the people they were stepping on.

Forgetting what the flag stands for is what the arresting officers did in this scenario.

[Anti Federalist]

http://i.imgur.com/x24r4Hq.jpg

[jclay2]

I just want to know if the Flag is ok and if its feelings were hurt.

[Danke]

I don't get it. It looks like his flag on his property.

http://media.cmgdigital.com/shared/img/photos/2014/05/16/39/22/upside_down_flag.jpg

[phill4paul]

I don't get it. It looks like his flag on his property.

http://media.cmgdigital.com/shared/img/photos/2014/05/16/39/22/upside_down_flag.jpg

But the flag and his property belong to AmeriKa! What are you? A commie or sumptin'?

[NorthCarolinaLiberty]

Those Indians did this to themselves.

[anaconda]

I thought we decided that flag desecration was legal?

[otherone]

I thought we decided that flag desecration was legal?



“People have made too many sacrifices to protect the flag and to have this happen in my community, I’m not happy with that,” Berg said.


https://encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQam1jjXIjnml5AkoJAL5gsiQGVl-N4zvJYYeoOgKW68C0N3ZSL_A

The Mayor of Munchkinland is NOT amused...

[kcchiefs6465]

I thought we decided that flag desecration was legal?
It is.




Texas v. Johnson, 491 U.S. 397 (1989), was a decision by the Supreme Court of the United States that invalidated prohibitions on desecrating the American flag enforced in 48 of the 50 states. Justice William Brennan wrote for a five-justice majority in holding that the defendant Gregory Lee Johnson's act of flag burning was protected speech under the First Amendment to the United States Constitution. Johnson was represented by attorneys David D. Cole and William Kunstler.

Subsequent developments
The Court's decision invalidated laws in force in 48 of the 50 states. More than two decades later, the issue remains controversial; recent polls suggest that a majority of Americans still support a ban on flag-burning.[5] Congress did, however, pass a statute, the 1989 Flag Protection Act, making it a federal crime to desecrate the flag. In the case of United States v. Eichman, 496 U.S. 310 (1990),[6] that law was struck down by the same five person majority of justices as in Johnson (in an opinion also written by Justice Brennan). Since then, Congress has considered the Flag Desecration Amendment several times. The amendment usually passes the House of Representatives, but has always been defeated in the Senate. The most recent attempt occurred when S.J.Res.12[7] failed by one vote on June 27, 2006.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Texas_v._Johnson

The "48" referenced is in regard to only 48 states having anti-flag burning laws, I believe.

[Carson]

I suppose anything to help them get their message out.

[tod evans]

You're free to say what the kops want to hear...

Got it?

[purplechoe]

http://i779.photobucket.com/albums/yy75/rkmar2001/Freerepublic/Bethisguy1small_zps589a5e81.jpg

[Anti Federalist]

You're free to say what the kops want to hear...

Got it?

Yassuh.

[Anti Federalist]

I don't get it. It looks like his flag on his property.

http://media.cmgdigital.com/shared/img/photos/2014/05/16/39/22/upside_down_flag.jpg

You, of all people, should know we don't own anything.

;)

[NorthCarolinaLiberty]

Don't these polls usually show that half of the country want such laws? Just think--for every person like you, there's an Americunt or Americock that values fabric more than liberty.

Well, those are probably pretty good numbers for liberty. Considering this is the U.S., anyway.

[Anti Federalist]

http://i779.photobucket.com/albums/yy75/rkmar2001/Freerepublic/Bethisguy1small_zps589a5e81.jpg

https://upworthy-production.s3.amazonaws.com/nugget/4f84717b1d6c7b000300001f/attachments/Picture_4.png

[heavenlyboy34]

"I leave symbols to the symbol-minded." -George Carlin.

I wish people would get over the whole flag nonsense. It's just an icon for American-style fascism and imperialism. It's no better than the Union Jack or the Soviet Hammer n' sickle. If yer gonna pick a flag, at least pick the Gadsden. It's more of a symbol of a "liberty" movement than Old Glory.

[tod evans]

At one point in the country's history the states were united, and for the most part the people too...

Not any more.

The flag flying today is only a mockery of what once was...

[heavenlyboy34]

At one point in the country's history the states were united, and for the most part the people too...

Not any more.

The flag flying today is only a mockery of what once was...
That only lasted a generation or 2 IIRC. Factionalism, greed, envy, ego, libido dominae, etc are not new by any stretch of teh imagination.

[aGameOfThrones]

http://makethemaccountable.com/images/saved/BushSignsFlag.gif

[ChristianAnarchist]

His flag, his property. Seems he can do whatever he wants with it...

[Christian Liberty]

Might as well wipe your ass with it now, for all the damn good it's worth.



OMG, a Praetorian Fury was insulted.

Go to jail Mundane.

I wonder what portion of the population outside this forum would realize just how downright terrifying that line is. Even imagining a world in which the American flag was some great thing, you were "offended" for crying out loud. Oh the horror. Deal with it. Catholicism offends me for a number of reasons, but it would never even cross my mind to ask the government to ban it. And I know there are Catholics who feel the same way about what I believe. I guess we'll just go back to the Reformation era again and burn all the minority viewpoints at the stake, because heaven forbid, people are OFFENDED!:rolleyes: People who speak out in favor of statism offend me to, but I'd never even consider locking someone up for doing it (that would be ironic;)). Walter Williams said it awhile back: if you only support freedom for activities you approve of, you don't support freedom at all. Rather, freedom is tolerating any peaceful activities, even the ones that disgust you. I find it downright insane that anyone would think being "offended" is enough reason to use violent force against somebody. Its downright disgusting. I could almost imagine a church polling people on this subject and excommunicating everyone who agreed with the police, it would be a good way to separate the Christians from the culturally Christian America-worshippers.

[Christian Liberty]

His flag, his property. Seems he can do whatever he wants with it...

Well yeah, but that only works for crazy people like us who actually believe in freedom. To "normal" people (those who endorse coercion and worship the State) disrespecting "the flag" is like disrespecting a religious shrine and far worse than actually interfering with someone else's rights.

[acptulsa]

I like my Bennington. It looks enough like standard issue to fool Boobus. It's almost like secret code that way. But a judge can tell the difference and no one's going to bitch too hard about an unofficial flag displayed this way or that.

Besides, 1776 was a good year.

[heavenlyboy34]

I like my Bennington. It looks enough like standard issue to fool Boobus. It's almost like secret code that way. But a judge can tell the difference and no one's going to bitch too hard about an unofficial flag displayed this way or that.

Besides, 1776 was a good year.
For what?

[acptulsa]

For what?

For verbiage.


IN CONGRESS, July 4, 1776.

The unanimous Declaration of the thirteen united States of America,

When in the Course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.--That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, --That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security.--Such has been the patient sufferance of these Colonies; and such is now the necessity which constrains them to alter their former Systems of Government. The history of the present King of Great Britain is a history of repeated injuries and usurpations, all having in direct object the establishment of an absolute Tyranny over these States. To prove this, let Facts be submitted to a candid world.

He has refused his Assent to Laws, the most wholesome and necessary for the public good.
He has forbidden his Governors to pass Laws of immediate and pressing importance, unless suspended in their operation till his Assent should be obtained; and when so suspended, he has utterly neglected to attend to them.
He has refused to pass other Laws for the accommodation of large districts of people, unless those people would relinquish the right of Representation in the Legislature, a right inestimable to them and formidable to tyrants only.
He has called together legislative bodies at places unusual, uncomfortable, and distant from the depository of their public Records, for the sole purpose of fatiguing them into compliance with his measures.
He has dissolved Representative Houses repeatedly, for opposing with manly firmness his invasions on the rights of the people.
He has refused for a long time, after such dissolutions, to cause others to be elected; whereby the Legislative powers, incapable of Annihilation, have returned to the People at large for their exercise; the State remaining in the mean time exposed to all the dangers of invasion from without, and convulsions within.
He has endeavoured to prevent the population of these States; for that purpose obstructing the Laws for Naturalization of Foreigners; refusing to pass others to encourage their migrations hither, and raising the conditions of new Appropriations of Lands.
He has obstructed the Administration of Justice, by refusing his Assent to Laws for establishing Judiciary powers.
He has made Judges dependent on his Will alone, for the tenure of their offices, and the amount and payment of their salaries.
He has erected a multitude of New Offices, and sent hither swarms of Officers to harrass our people, and eat out their substance.
He has kept among us, in times of peace, Standing Armies without the Consent of our legislatures.
He has affected to render the Military independent of and superior to the Civil power.
He has combined with others to subject us to a jurisdiction foreign to our constitution, and unacknowledged by our laws; giving his Assent to their Acts of pretended Legislation:
For Quartering large bodies of armed troops among us:
For protecting them, by a mock Trial, from punishment for any Murders which they should commit on the Inhabitants of these States:
For cutting off our Trade with all parts of the world:
For imposing Taxes on us without our Consent:
For depriving us in many cases, of the benefits of Trial by Jury:
For transporting us beyond Seas to be tried for pretended offences
For abolishing the free System of English Laws in a neighbouring Province, establishing therein an Arbitrary government, and enlarging its Boundaries so as to render it at once an example and fit instrument for introducing the same absolute rule into these Colonies:
For taking away our Charters, abolishing our most valuable Laws, and altering fundamentally the Forms of our Governments:
For suspending our own Legislatures, and declaring themselves invested with power to legislate for us in all cases whatsoever.
He has abdicated Government here, by declaring us out of his Protection and waging War against us.
He has plundered our seas, ravaged our Coasts, burnt our towns, and destroyed the lives of our people.
He is at this time transporting large Armies of foreign Mercenaries to compleat the works of death, desolation and tyranny, already begun with circumstances of Cruelty & perfidy scarcely paralleled in the most barbarous ages, and totally unworthy the Head of a civilized nation.
He has constrained our fellow Citizens taken Captive on the high Seas to bear Arms against their Country, to become the executioners of their friends and Brethren, or to fall themselves by their Hands.
He has excited domestic insurrections amongst us, and has endeavoured to bring on the inhabitants of our frontiers, the merciless Indian Savages, whose known rule of warfare, is an undistinguished destruction of all ages, sexes and conditions.

In every stage of these Oppressions We have Petitioned for Redress in the most humble terms: Our repeated Petitions have been answered only by repeated injury. A Prince whose character is thus marked by every act which may define a Tyrant, is unfit to be the ruler of a free people.

Nor have We been wanting in attentions to our Brittish brethren. We have warned them from time to time of attempts by their legislature to extend an unwarrantable jurisdiction over us. We have reminded them of the circumstances of our emigration and settlement here. We have appealed to their native justice and magnanimity, and we have conjured them by the ties of our common kindred to disavow these usurpations, which, would inevitably interrupt our connections and correspondence. They too have been deaf to the voice of justice and of consanguinity. We must, therefore, acquiesce in the necessity, which denounces our Separation, and hold them, as we hold the rest of mankind, Enemies in War, in Peace Friends.

We, therefore, the Representatives of the united States of America, in General Congress, Assembled, appealing to the Supreme Judge of the world for the rectitude of our intentions, do, in the Name, and by Authority of the good People of these Colonies, solemnly publish and declare, That these United Colonies are, and of Right ought to be Free and Independent States; that they are Absolved from all Allegiance to the British Crown, and that all political connection between them and the State of Great Britain, is and ought to be totally dissolved; and that as Free and Independent States, they have full Power to levy War, conclude Peace, contract Alliances, establish Commerce, and to do all other Acts and Things which Independent States may of right do. And for the support of this Declaration, with a firm reliance on the protection of divine Providence, we mutually pledge to each other our Lives, our Fortunes and our sacred Honor.

[heavenlyboy34]

For verbiage.
Careful...you're going to get me on a tangent about the folly of the Revolutionary War...

[acptulsa]

Don't try to put the blame on me. All the &@#% I said was 'verbiage.'

And no, I wasn't asking for some.

[FindLiberty]

He has erected a multitude of New Offices,
and sent hither swarms of Officers to harrass our people,
and eat out their substance.

[Occam's Banana]

Brubacker [...] said he never meant to upset or offend anyone.

Your lack of shenanigans - I am disappoint.

[aGameOfThrones]

“I was offended by it when I first saw it. I had an individual stop here at the station, a female, who was in the military and she was very offended by it.” said Allegheny Township police Assistant Chief L.J. Berg.

Chief L.J. Berg further commented that the female who was in the military told him, "I served so people can have freedoms and Rights, but to use those freedoms and Rights in a way I find offensive, well, it makes my service regrettable," said freedom giver to Chief Berg.


They offending Joshua Brubaker told the Chief regarding his actions and the female soldier's complaint:



That uniform you wear is MINE!*I ALLOW you to wear in on MY BEHALF.*It belongs to ME and represents MY WISHES.*If you DISHONOR IT, you dishonor ME!*And if I SAY you DISHONOR it, then there is no question YOU HAVE.* Every deed you do while in MY uniform reflects on ME, either GOOD or BAD.*And, if you deny anything I just said, then you are NOT an ‘American Soldier!’

[Cleaner44]

Just what is that symbol of freedom supposed to represent?

[coastie]

Just what is that symbol of freedom supposed to represent?

You must defer to your nearest freedom provider for the answer to that question...

She'll let you know when she's ready for you to know it.

[JK/SEA]

isn't this bullying?...

pardon me for thinking outside the box here....

[acptulsa]

isn't this bullying?...

pardon me for thinking outside the box here....


https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ejvyDn1TPr8..

[orenbus]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YNtArygYhE4

What does AIM stand for?

[PaulConventionWV]

SMDH. It means distress, for God sakes.

Spray painting it isn't, but I don't really care anyway. I think he has every right to burn it if he pleases.

[Occam's Banana]

What does AIM stand for?

American Indian Movement

http://www.aimovement.org/

[tod evans]

isn't this bullying?...

pardon me for thinking outside the box here....

Your betters are incapable of bullying...

They merely correct your unapproved transgressions..

You will be sanctioned two demerits for questioning the ruling class....

[Anti Federalist]

Your betters are incapable of bullying...

They merely correct your unapproved transgressions..

You will be sanctioned two demerits for questioning the ruling class....

Nicely stated Comrade.

DoublePlusGood.

[tod evans]

Nicely stated Comrade.

DoublePlusGood.

Jawohl AF you may have one of JK's credits.....

(Isn't it wonderful how freedom works?)

[Christian Liberty]

Don't these polls usually show that half of the country want such laws? Just think--for every person like you, there's an Americunt or Americock that values fabric more than liberty.

Well, those are probably pretty good numbers for liberty. Considering this is the U.S., anyway.

I want nothing to do with half of America. Nothing. Its absolutely disgusting.

There are a lot of borderline sane reasons for supporting tyranny, but we're literally talking about fabric here. Its really that stupid.

[satchelmcqueen]

“I removed it from the building, folded it properly and seized it as evidence,” said Berg.

so he stole it! if i were th indian guy id press charges for theft and trespassing. i assume the cop had no warrant.

besides if ANYONE has a right to complain about Merikah, should it not be indians for fucks sake//??????!!!!!!

[moostraks]

“I removed it from the building, folded it properly and seized it as evidence,” said Berg.

so he stole it! if i were th indian guy id press charges for theft and trespassing. i assume the cop had no warrant.

besides if ANYONE has a right to complain about Merikah, should it not be indians for fucks sake//??????!!!!!!

Well....ya see, we red folks were told to march our rears out west and be grateful that we were given land and taught how to properly worship. We ain't allowed to gripe about nothin' 'cause we was nothin' but a bunch of drunk lazy savages before we was edumacated and taught how to properly pay homage in the white man's courts.

[acptulsa]

Well....ya see, we red folks were told to march our rears out west and be grateful that we were given land and taught how to properly worship. We ain't allowed to gripe about nothin' 'cause we was nothin' but a bunch of drunk lazy savages before we was edumacated and taught how to properly pay homage in the white man's courts.

That's right.

The Indians have an important job to do. Who better to teach the rest of the American Mundanes how to make the best of being a conquered people?

[Christian Liberty]

“I removed it from the building, folded it properly and seized it as evidence,” said Berg.

so he stole it! if i were th indian guy id press charges for theft and trespassing. i assume the cop had no warrant.

besides if ANYONE has a right to complain about Merikah, should it not be indians for fucks sake//??????!!!!!!

This is the sane person's response. Unfortunately, too many Americans respect "the flag" more than private property...

[moostraks]

That's right.

The Indians have an important job to do. Who better to teach the rest of the American Mundanes how to make the best of being a conquered people?

Well seems like some us aren't really keen on doing that job. Some of us happen to still be mighty pissed about certain things which transpired.:) Every dog has its day.

[charrob]

I thought we decided that flag desecration was legal?
It is.





If flag desecration is legal, how can this guy Berg get away with charging the man with a crime?

[kcchiefs6465]

If flag desecration is legal, how can this guy Berg get away with charging the man with a crime?
Fascists tend not to follow their own laws.

Probably a city statute, I really couldn't say.

[acptulsa]

If flag desecration is legal, how can this guy Berg get away with charging the man with a crime?

Lots of jurisdictions have gotten into making some laws out of rubber just for the purpose. You know, like vagrancy, APC and public nuisance.

Bad on a local level. Absolutely horrifying now that Washington has taken up the practice.

[otherone]

Well....ya see, we red folks were told to march our rears out west and be grateful that we were given land and taught how to properly worship.

wow. sorry that happened to you.

[charrob]

Fascists tend not to follow their own laws.

Probably a city statute, I really couldn't say.


Lots of jurisdictions have gotten into making some laws out of rubber just for the purpose. You know, like vagrancy, APC and public nuisance.

Bad on a local level. Absolutely horrifying now that Washington has taken up the practice.

Thanks. -Hope he tries to appeal this based on the Supreme Court Ruling...

[phill4paul]

I've known some A.I.M. members. No Sheriff would have removed that flag from any one of their homesteads. This guy doesn't quite get it.....

http://www.manataka.org/images/Wounded%20Knee%201973.gif

[dillo]

"I leave symbols to the symbol-minded." -George Carlin.

I wish people would get over the whole flag nonsense. It's just an icon for American-style fascism and imperialism. It's no better than the Union Jack or the Soviet Hammer n' sickle. If yer gonna pick a flag, at least pick the Gadsden. It's more of a symbol of a "liberty" movement than Old Glory.

I don't know, a lot of people died fighting for the good that the flag represents to them and others. To be clear I'm not siding with the cops, I am just disagreeing with your interpretation of what the flag means, it's subjective.

[moostraks]

wow. sorry that happened to you.
:D my ancestors inbred with European mutts to give me the privilege of being here. So some self loathing can be attributed here.

In all seriousness, I do think we should be very aware of how it played out for our ancestors. Compliance with those who fancy themselves the superior species did not work out well for the natives in America. It is not so much different from the current state of affairs. (And yes, I do carry a bit of a grudge for the loss of culture of a number of my ancestors but the upside is we can be wiser if we learn from our history)

[otherone]

:D my ancestors inbred with European mutts to give me the privilege of being here. So some self loathing can be attributed here.



Why should you loath yourself for the bad acts of others? Why should you feel persecuted for what happened to others, many years ago?

[moostraks]

Why should you loath yourself for the bad acts of others? Why should you feel persecuted for what happened to others, many years ago?
Self loathing in terms of ancestral guilt in the whole p.c. manner of discussion.(which I am not likely to be, p.c. that is) Personally, I look at it as appears my ancestors felt making love was better than fighting, else wise mutts like me wouldn't be here. Likely why I look at the world spiritually the way I do as well.

[JK/SEA]

Why should you loath yourself for the bad acts of others? Why should you feel persecuted for what happened to others, many years ago?

genocide is never forgotten. Some react differntly to it, especially when said genocide was inflicted on your ancesters. Go figure.

[moostraks]

genocide is never forgotten. Some react differntly to it, especially when said genocide was inflicted on your ancesters. Go figure.

Why is it that the term genocide is rarely used in discussion of what happened with natives in the U.S. and when it is used one is often looked at as being overly sensitive about the issue? Yet it is readily used when discussing Jews. The term is applicable for the events that occurred. Yet to be very specific and accurate is portrayed as if one is looking for reparations by way of a pocketbook. For the sake of my ancestors who did not fare so well, I just don't want to be responsible for not learning from the past.

[Philhelm]

It's just a piece of cloth. Besides, I'm sure China will be more than willing to create a new American flag as a replacement.

[jllundqu]

Is Wounded Knee really up for sale?

Talk about a really freaking terrible chapter in U.S. history... it's fitting that corporate whores are continuing to profit from the massacre.

If I had any Native American heritage, I might just go full-domestic terrorist

**Disclaimer to DHS/NSA - I, in no way, suggest nor advocate violence against the government, even though it is more evil and tryrannical than the government our founders fought to bring about this nation.*** ;)

[phill4paul]

Is Wounded Knee really up for sale?

Talk about a really freaking terrible chapter in U.S. history... it's fitting that corporate whores are continuing to profit from the massacre.

If I had any Native American heritage, I might just go full-domestic terrorist

**Disclaimer to DHS/NSA - I, in no way, suggest nor advocate violence against the government, even though it is more evil and tryrannical than the government our founders fought to bring about this nation.*** ;)

Seems to me that if this is true, the selling, that it would be a great way for ranchers and American Indians to work together to throw the BLM out of the west.

[Philhelm]

Is Wounded Knee really up for sale?

Talk about a really freaking terrible chapter in U.S. history... it's fitting that corporate whores are continuing to profit from the massacre.

If I had any Native American heritage, I might just go full-domestic terrorist

**Disclaimer to DHS/NSA - I, in no way, suggest nor advocate violence against the government, even though it is more evil and tryrannical than the government our founders fought to bring about this nation.*** ;)

DHS/NSA: The burden is on jllundqu to prove his innocence, so you should probably arrest him and then charge him. You don't need a warrant.

[coastie]

I don't know, a lot of people died fighting for the good that the flag represents to them and others. To be clear I'm not siding with the cops, I am just disagreeing with your interpretation of what the flag means, it's subjective.


SO, in a nutshell, we should show respect for people dumb enough to die for a piece of cloth(plastic today) that represents:

1. The most brutal, imperialistic nation ever to infect this planet?

2. A nation that imprisons more of it's own citizens more than any other country?

3. A nation full of people that stand by and record you being executed by the cops, as opposed to stepping in a helping you?

4. A nation where the police can, and do, raid homes with full military gear over 30,000 times a year?


What, exactly, does that flag represent to you, or any idiot that gets emotional over it?

Land of the free? NOPE.

Home of the Brave?
http://i61.tinypic.com/2nq4mcz.gif

Get real. Nationalism is stupid. No matter what you believe.

[acptulsa]

SO, in a nutshell, we should show respect for people dumb enough to die for a piece of cloth(plastic today) that represents:

1. The most brutal, imperialistic nation ever to infect this planet?

2. A nation that imprisons more of it's own citizens more than any other country?

3. A nation full of people that stand by and record you being executed by the cops, as opposed to stepping in a helping you?

4. A nation where the police can, and do, raid homes with full military gear over 30,000 times a year?


What, exactly, does that flag represent to you, or any idiot that gets emotional over it?

Well, to some the waning reverence is to it still having some little bit of resemblance to this flag...

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/1a/US_flag_48_stars.svg

...under which the U.S. thankfully won WWII.

[Christian Liberty]

SO, in a nutshell, we should show respect for people dumb enough to die for a piece of cloth(plastic today) that represents:

1. The most brutal, imperialistic nation ever to infect this planet?

2. A nation that imprisons more of it's own citizens more than any other country?

3. A nation full of people that stand by and record you being executed by the cops, as opposed to stepping in a helping you?

4. A nation where the police can, and do, raid homes with full military gear over 30,000 times a year?


What, exactly, does that flag represent to you, or any idiot that gets emotional over it?

Land of the free? NOPE.

Home of the Brave?
http://i61.tinypic.com/2nq4mcz.gif

Get real. Nationalism is stupid. No matter what you believe.

Amen, I 100% agree. I'm just not sure how to get this across to people who don't already almost get it. Do you just hit them with it like this? Or do you kind of feign a little bit of sympathy while challenging the aggression they support (referring to people who support or are ambivalent toward the law here...)

Well, to some the waning reverence is to it still having some little bit of resemblance to this flag...

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/1a/US_flag_48_stars.svg

...under which the U.S. thankfully won WWII.

WWII was an evil and completely unjustified war, on both sides. Nobody should celebrate either side of that war.

[presence]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HWtvy0LpJwk

[acptulsa]

WWII was an evil and completely unjustified war, on both sides. Nobody should celebrate either side of that war.

I don't celebrate war. But I'll thank God the Allies beat the Axis as I see fit and with a clear conscience. Even though with the Soviets in there, the evil was only very slightly lesser.