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Brett85
05-06-2014, 09:22 PM
http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2014/05/06/watch-what-happens-when-one-parent-speaks-out-at-a-school-board-meeting-about-a-controversial-book-assigned-to-his-daughter/


Gilford school officials claim the book, “Nineteen Minutes” by Jodi Picoult, contains important themes about a school shooting. But some parents believe a scene described in the book is inappropriate for their children.

According to WCVB-TV, the book contains a graphic description of rough sex between two teenagers, which parents were unaware of until the book had already been distributed to their kids.

— Click here to read excerpts from the explicit passage —

“I was shocked when I read the passage and not much shocks me anymore,” William Baer told EAG News. “My wife was stunned by the increasingly graphic nature of the sexual content of the scene and the imagery it evoked.”

He went to the school board meeting to express his objections.

“It’s absurd,” he told the school board.

“Sir, would you please be respectful of the other people?” a school board member responded.

“Like you’re respectful of my daughter, right? And my children?” he countered.

A police officer then arrived at the scene, instructing Baer to leave with him.

“You are going to arrest me because I violated the two-minute rule?” the father said. “I guess you are going to have to arrest me.”

Moments later, Baer was escorted outside and placed in handcuffs. According to WMUR-TV, he was charged with disorderly conduct because he did not immediately leave when asked by an officer.

His wife spoke to the media shortly after the incident.

“I fully understand how he feels. It really is a huge violation,” Barbara Baer told WCVB.

“Why should those ideas be put in their mind? They can discuss this some other way. They don’t need that kind of imagery,” she added.

School district officials said they normally send out notifications to parents before assigning the controversial book, but forgot to do so this time.

According to WCVB, school officials did not answer any questions Monday or vote on anything regarding the book.

“Many people in education and government truly believe our children are theirs,” William Baer told EAG News. “That parents are only the custodians who feed them and put a roof over their head. These school incidents are a byproduct of this ‘we know best’ philosophy. They believe they have the authority to do this. If people were more complacent, which is hard to imagine, it’d be even worse.”

NorthCarolinaLiberty
05-06-2014, 09:37 PM
People who call the police like this need the holy fuck beat out of them.

Anti Federalist
05-06-2014, 09:40 PM
First Amendment?

Never fucking heard of it. - Officer Friendly.

Goddamn shame this happened in NH.

Cissy
05-06-2014, 09:49 PM
The "arrest" could have been stopped if the other adults had stood up and made it clear that they would not tolerate arresting a man for speaking his beliefs.

Shame that didn't happen.

Keith and stuff
05-06-2014, 09:50 PM
First Amendment?

Never fucking heard of it. - Officer Friendly.

Goddamn shame this happened in NH.
There is no First Amendment right to speak at a indoor public meeting when someone else is supposed to be speaking.

Anyway, thank goodness this story got so much attention! Because the parents were so upset and of the widespread coverage, the district changed from the policy of allowing parents to opt-out of controversial information to the parents now having to opt-in. This empowers parents! Hopefully freedom spreads not just in New Hampshire, but nationally because of this!

This isn't just a way to promote the awesome freedom people are gaining in New Hampshire. You can bring this to the attention of your local school board. Ask the board to create an opt-in policy and increase freedom where you live.

Keith and stuff
05-06-2014, 09:52 PM
The "arrest" could have been stopped if the other adults had stood up and made it clear that they would not tolerate arresting a man for speaking his beliefs.

Shame that didn't happen.
It might not have become as big of a story then. Perhaps the school district might not even have switched to any amazing, pro-liberty opt-in policy then. Don't feel to sorry for the man. He is a lawyer and I believe he moved to NH from NJ. He is tough and will care on another day :toady:

Nirvikalpa
05-06-2014, 10:47 PM
Shit like this kills me. It really kills me.

Talks of semen and spread legs and even rape are found in the Bible, for God's sake.

I get why this guy did it. I get that what happened was wrong from a liberty prospective, but damn... these parents are batshit crazy and I'm free to criticize.

A 9th grader? 14? If she has her own personal computer, she can find way better NC-17 stories on fanfiction.net, or she can just download the million of copies of Fifty Shades of Gray PDF's on the internetz.

Shit, I really hate to break it to the old-school parents out there, but some kids are masturbating by age 14 (http://healthland.time.com/2011/08/11/boys-masturbate-more-than-girls-seriously/). Some do it way earlier.

I really think some parents need to wake up - I don't think the enemy here is sex or the openness of sexual discussion. European countries (especially the Netherlands) have had comprehensive sex education, some have legalized prostitution, most have completely nude or topless beaches... and... also extremely low teenage pregnancy rates! We have as much as 10x as many teen births as some European countries that actually realize puberty and hormones make kids interested in sex, and yes, that kids are going to experiment with their bodies - alone and *gasp* with other people. Crazy, I know.

Wait until they open up their kid's biology textbooks.

Christopher A. Brown
05-07-2014, 12:28 AM
European countries (especially the Netherlands) have had comprehensive sex education, some have legalized prostitution, most have completely nude or topless beaches... and... also extremely low teenage pregnancy

Societal context is lost because the European societies you refer to have inherent and widespread respect for sex. Their media is heavily controlled by public opinion, including film.

Most importantly they teach that fertility has responsibility.

So yes, they are open, but each family takes it upon themselves to teach responsibility, and they do not allow media to usurp the educational responsibility. What is taught in schools matches what is taught at home.

Sexualization without that responsibility invites misinterpretation of all media content later on.

Americans are so irresponsible socially they are even afraid to accept publicly that the ultimate purpose of free speech is to assure information vital to survival is shared and understood.

What do you think children learn from that?

Weston White
05-07-2014, 12:29 AM
Exactly this:


“I was shocked when I read the passage, and not much shocks me anymore,” Baer says. “My wife was stunned by the increasingly graphic nature of the sexual content of the scene and the imagery it evoked.”

Baer, who is an attorney, believes that if someone stood outside the school and handed out copies of the novel’s sexually charged passage to students, he would likely be arrested and prosecuted.

He questions why it’s acceptable for “the state, through its schools and agents,” to mandate reading and discussing this same material.

He believes the politicians and educators running the public school system want to dismantle the family unit, and undermine traditional morality, “though they’re never going to admit this.”

“Many people in education and government truly believe our children are theirs. That parents are only the custodians who feed them and put a roof over their head. These school incidents are a byproduct of this ‘we know best’ philosophy. They believe they have the authority to do this. If people were more complacent, which is hard to imagine, it’d be even worse.”

California’s Sobrato High School includes the novel on its “9th Grade Advanced Common Core” recommended reading list.

ETA:

What is it with these too short verbal appeal times in public meetings or hearings? How in the world can you be expected to make any sort of valid or convincing plea within just 2 to 3-minutes to anybody, least of all to those that are already firmly clawing their hard rubberstamps inside of their hot, chubby fingers, so tightly that their own sweat pools beneath their hotly beating forearms?

Mani
05-07-2014, 12:53 AM
Exactly this:



ETA:

What is it with these too short verbal appeal times in public meetings or hearings? How in the world can you be expected to make any sort of valid or convincing plea within just 2 to 3-minutes to anybody, least of all to those that are already firmly clawing their hard rubberstamps inside of their hot, chubby fingers, so tightly that their own sweat pools beneath their hotly beating forearms?

The illusion of public debate and having your voice heard.

LibertyEagle
05-07-2014, 04:09 AM
Shit like this kills me. It really kills me.

Talks of semen and spread legs and even rape are found in the Bible, for God's sake.

I get why this guy did it. I get that what happened was wrong from a liberty prospective, but damn... these parents are batshit crazy and I'm free to criticize.

A 9th grader? 14? If she has her own personal computer, she can find way better NC-17 stories on fanfiction.net, or she can just download the million of copies of Fifty Shades of Gray PDF's on the internetz.

Shit, I really hate to break it to the old-school parents out there, but some kids are masturbating by age 14 (http://healthland.time.com/2011/08/11/boys-masturbate-more-than-girls-seriously/). Some do it way earlier.

I really think some parents need to wake up - I don't think the enemy here is sex or the openness of sexual discussion. European countries (especially the Netherlands) have had comprehensive sex education, some have legalized prostitution, most have completely nude or topless beaches... and... also extremely low teenage pregnancy rates! We have as much as 10x as many teen births as some European countries that actually realize puberty and hormones make kids interested in sex, and yes, that kids are going to experiment with their bodies - alone and *gasp* with other people. Crazy, I know.

Wait until they open up their kid's biology textbooks.

That's your decision to make for your child, if you are their parent and it should have been the same in this case. The school had no business taking that decision away from the parents and neither should someone else's parent.

moostraks
05-07-2014, 05:37 AM
Shit like this kills me. It really kills me.

Talks of semen and spread legs and even rape are found in the Bible, for God's sake.

I get why this guy did it. I get that what happened was wrong from a liberty prospective, but damn... these parents are batshit crazy and I'm free to criticize.

A 9th grader? 14? If she has her own personal computer, she can find way better NC-17 stories on fanfiction.net, or she can just download the million of copies of Fifty Shades of Gray PDF's on the internetz.

Shit, I really hate to break it to the old-school parents out there, but some kids are masturbating by age 14 (http://healthland.time.com/2011/08/11/boys-masturbate-more-than-girls-seriously/). Some do it way earlier.

I really think some parents need to wake up - I don't think the enemy here is sex or the openness of sexual discussion. European countries (especially the Netherlands) have had comprehensive sex education, some have legalized prostitution, most have completely nude or topless beaches... and... also extremely low teenage pregnancy rates! We have as much as 10x as many teen births as some European countries that actually realize puberty and hormones make kids interested in sex, and yes, that kids are going to experiment with their bodies - alone and *gasp* with other people. Crazy, I know.

Wait until they open up their kid's biology textbooks.

And your attitude is why I won't let my children near a government school because some people who think that children can and should read this garbage become educators and pervert our society with an increased measure to each generation. Just because some parents don't properly supervise what their children are being exposed to does not then mean that others parents should just go with the herd. Call me another batshit crazy parent for being concerned that my children not read porn at 14.

tod evans
05-07-2014, 05:40 AM
Does anyone else see the irony of a lawyer arguing for morality?

Todd
05-07-2014, 05:57 AM
Shit like this kills me. It really kills me.

Talks of semen and spread legs and even rape are found in the Bible, for God's sake.

I get why this guy did it. I get that what happened was wrong from a liberty prospective, but damn... these parents are batshit crazy and I'm free to criticize.

A 9th grader? 14? If she has her own personal computer, she can find way better NC-17 stories on fanfiction.net, or she can just download the million of copies of Fifty Shades of Gray PDF's on the internetz.

Shit, I really hate to break it to the old-school parents out there, but some kids are masturbating by age 14 (http://healthland.time.com/2011/08/11/boys-masturbate-more-than-girls-seriously/). Some do it way earlier.

I really think some parents need to wake up - I don't think the enemy here is sex or the openness of sexual discussion. European countries (especially the Netherlands) have had comprehensive sex education, some have legalized prostitution, most have completely nude or topless beaches... and... also extremely low teenage pregnancy rates! We have as much as 10x as many teen births as some European countries that actually realize puberty and hormones make kids interested in sex, and yes, that kids are going to experiment with their bodies - alone and *gasp* with other people. Crazy, I know.

Wait until they open up their kid's biology textbooks.

Didn't they remove the bible from schools many moons ago?

Philhelm
05-07-2014, 06:05 AM
I wonder how explicit the sexual content was.

juleswin
05-07-2014, 06:18 AM
I wonder how explicit the sexual content was.

Explicit enough for a parent to be worried. You know, I am no prude but parents needs to be informed about things like this. Yes some kids probably know about these things, yes some have sex and masturbate but I think its different when the school authorities introduce concepts like this to the kids. I think its normalizes it in their minds and I too will be opposed to anything that normalizes rough sex to my teenage kids.

DamianTV
05-07-2014, 06:32 AM
Heres the video.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=OsbS9JD7Pvw

Part 2, from another camera.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=1HC2LPu8wHQ

Lesson: Obey the Schoolboard and their arbitrary rules and enforce those rules as if they were Law, which, again, turns ordinary people who do not comply with their rules into Criminals. This proves there are TWO books that they use to enforce. One, the book of rules that people supposedly vote on, or have "representation" and the other, are policies that are written in by some busybody with zero authority to do so.

Oh, and he's a Doctor? Oh, and hes Resisting Arrest? Fucking typical.

kcchiefs6465
05-07-2014, 06:39 AM
I wonder how explicit the sexual content was.

Here’s an excerpt from the explicit passage:

“‘Relax,’ Matt murmured, and then he sank his teeth into her shoulder. He pinned her hands over her head and ground his hips against hers. She could feel his erection, hot against her stomach.

” … She couldn’t remember ever feeling so heavy, as if her heart were beating between her legs. She clawed at Matt’s back to bring him closer.

“‘Yeah,’ he groaned, and her pushed her thighs apart. And then suddenly Matt was inside her, pumping so hard that she scooted backward on the carpet, burning the backs of her legs. … (H)e clamped his hand over her mouth and drove harder and harder until Josie felt him come.

“Semen, sticky and hot, pooled on the carpet beneath her.”
..

kcchiefs6465
05-07-2014, 06:44 AM
Just to be clear, they won't teach your kids about the tax code, the monetary system, or banking in general but they surely find the time to have them reading pornographic-lite material, teaching them useless mathematical concepts, or using their classrooms, as per No Child Left Behind, to indoctrinate and inculcate children to be cannon fodder.

Yes, they'll spend time each day and devote resources about the 'need' to go to college. That everyone needs to go, certain fields are multiplying, and that it matters not how much debt one goes into to obtain their degree. They'll never tell the kid that what they are borrowing is depreciating toilet tissue.

ClydeCoulter
05-07-2014, 07:32 AM
:mad: :( :mad:

Keith and stuff
05-07-2014, 07:47 AM
Didn't they remove the bible from schools many moons ago?
Some schools removed the Bible. Some of those schools brought it back. Typically, something like that is up to the school district. Where I went to school it was opt-in. You could apply to take the Bible class or you could choice to not apply for the class.

PaulConventionWV
05-07-2014, 07:57 AM
They believe they have the authority to do this. If people were more complacent, which is hard to imagine, it’d be even worse.”

He got that right.

pcosmar
05-07-2014, 08:20 AM
That's your decision to make for your child, if you are their parent and it should have been the same in this case. The school had no business taking that decision away from the parents and neither should someone else's parent.

The school has every business doing what ever the state wants.. It is a fucking State School.

Has been for Decades. If parents are upset with they need to stop sending their kids into that environment.
Home school,, Start their own school,, You send kids to a State school you are letting the State raise them.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/73/Students_pledging_allegiance_to_the_American_flag_ with_the_Bellamy_salute.jpg


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=okPnDZ1Txlo

Matthew5
05-07-2014, 08:39 AM
but damn... these parents are batshit crazy and I'm free to criticize.

Do you have children?

LibertyEagle
05-07-2014, 09:46 AM
The school has every business doing what ever the state wants.. It is a fucking State School.

Has been for Decades. If parents are upset with they need to stop sending their kids into that environment.
Home school,, Start their own school,, You send kids to a State school you are letting the State raise them.

So, in your world, parents should just shut the hell up about anything having to do with government, eh? Funny, because I'm thinking this is how we got into this mess to begin with.

pcosmar
05-07-2014, 09:55 AM
So, in your world, parents should just shut the hell up about anything having to do with government, eh? Funny, because I'm thinking this is how we got into this mess to begin with.

NO,, they should educate their own children,, There should not be any such thing as state run schools.. It is not and never was something that the State should be in any way involved in,, And certainly not at the Federal Level with a Department of Education. Not at the federal level ,,not at the state level,,not even at the county level.. It is at the parents level.. Parrents want a school? Hire a teacher and Build a room for the school.

Don't like the books,,don't buy them. Don't like the teacher,, fire em. Parental control on a very local level (Folks you know personally).
It is not in any way,,or on any level ,, a government function.

If it is,, you have a problem.

angelatc
05-07-2014, 10:04 AM
Shit like this kills me. It really kills me.

Talks of semen and spread legs and even rape are found in the Bible, for God's sake.



But most youth group pastors sensibly avoid teaching those passages.

Most teenagers, including teen boys, are not emotionally ready to have a public school teacher assign them soft-core porn as a reading assignment, especially in a mixed-sex setting with a pervy public school teacher tacitly forcing you to admit you read it.

The thing about sex that liberals miss is that it is the very nature of most people to keep sex private. At the end of the day we like it being taboo and naughty. And secret.

Nirvikalpa
05-07-2014, 10:09 AM
Societal context is lost because the European societies you refer to have inherent and widespread respect for sex. Their media is heavily controlled by public opinion, including film.

Most importantly they teach that fertility has responsibility.

So yes, they are open, but each family takes it upon themselves to teach responsibility, and they do not allow media to usurp the educational responsibility. What is taught in schools matches what is taught at home.

Sexualization without that responsibility invites misinterpretation of all media content later on.

Americans are so irresponsible socially they are even afraid to accept publicly that the ultimate purpose of free speech is to assure information vital to survival is shared and understood.

What do you think children learn from that?

Yes, I agree, and there is where the problem is. It's hardly taught at home, and just learned in schools - government schools. There's a big divide there between the shame & embarrassment most Americans feel, and the respect & responsibility the Europeans feel about sex.


And your attitude is why I won't let my children near a government school because some people who think that children can and should read this garbage become educators and pervert our society with an increased measure to each generation. Just because some parents don't properly supervise what their children are being exposed to does not then mean that others parents should just go with the herd. Call me another batshit crazy parent for being concerned that my children not read porn at 14.

Huh? What? And good - keep your kids at home, which is the true liberty message here. Realism apparently is a scary thing to a lot of people.


Do you have children?

Yes I do; here's a write-up on them (https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/).

donnay
05-07-2014, 10:17 AM
Shit like this kills me. It really kills me.

Talks of semen and spread legs and even rape are found in the Bible, for God's sake.

I get why this guy did it. I get that what happened was wrong from a liberty prospective, but damn... these parents are batshit crazy and I'm free to criticize.

A 9th grader? 14? If she has her own personal computer, she can find way better NC-17 stories on fanfiction.net, or she can just download the million of copies of Fifty Shades of Gray PDF's on the internetz.

Shit, I really hate to break it to the old-school parents out there, but some kids are masturbating by age 14 (http://healthland.time.com/2011/08/11/boys-masturbate-more-than-girls-seriously/). Some do it way earlier.

I really think some parents need to wake up - I don't think the enemy here is sex or the openness of sexual discussion. European countries (especially the Netherlands) have had comprehensive sex education, some have legalized prostitution, most have completely nude or topless beaches... and... also extremely low teenage pregnancy rates! We have as much as 10x as many teen births as some European countries that actually realize puberty and hormones make kids interested in sex, and yes, that kids are going to experiment with their bodies - alone and *gasp* with other people. Crazy, I know.

Wait until they open up their kid's biology textbooks.

I take it you do not have children?

Deborah K
05-07-2014, 10:18 AM
There is no First Amendment right to speak at a indoor public meeting when someone else is supposed to be speaking.

Anyway, thank goodness this story got so much attention! Because the parents were so upset and of the widespread coverage, the district changed from the policy of allowing parents to opt-out of controversial information to the parents now having to opt-in. This empowers parents! Hopefully freedom spreads not just in New Hampshire, but nationally because of this!

This isn't just a way to promote the awesome freedom people are gaining in New Hampshire. You can bring this to the attention of your local school board. Ask the board to create an opt-in policy and increase freedom where you live.


How is forcing parents to opt in, freedom? And, as far as I can tell, this was a public school - meaning it is government run. The Bill of Rights should therefor apply.

Lucille
05-07-2014, 10:19 AM
That juvenile pop novel trash is what the publik skools are assigning students in an honors class? YHGTBKM. I can think of 100 other books that would be better reads than that (many of which contain sexual content, since that seems to be a requirement these days).


The school has every business doing what ever the state wants.. It is a fucking State School.

Has been for Decades. If parents are upset with they need to stop sending their kids into that environment.
Home school,, Start their own school,, You send kids to a State school you are letting the State raise them.

This. Pull them out, and watch the whole filthy system collapse.

Pretty pathetic how the other parents there did and said nothing when he was arrested. Cowards.

angelatc
05-07-2014, 10:20 AM
I really think some parents need to wake up


And your attitude is why I won't let my children near a government school because some people who think that children can and should read this garbage become educators and pervert our society with an increased measure to each generation. Just because some parents don't properly supervise what their children are being exposed to does not then mean that others parents should just go with the herd. Call me another batshit crazy parent for being concerned that my children not read porn at 14.

She has no children yet. I think it's a logical fallacy to assume that most people do not change their minds about how to raise kids after they actually have them.

But even then...I saw a tweet from the guy that runs The Daily Kos mention that he winced when he heard his young daughter singing some sexually explicit lyrics from a song. But he immediately put that gut reaction away, because he did not want to be the kind of parent that gets upset about his kids being exposed to that type of music.

SMFH. I never banned any music in our house, but I certainly listened to more Radio Disney than any grown adult should. There's just nothing empowering or cute about a 6 year dropping f-bombs while singing the praises of oral sex.

Matthew5
05-07-2014, 10:21 AM
Yes I do; here's a write-up on them (https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/).

So are you being sarcastic or do you really have a child/ren?

I'm going to assume sarcasm. First of all, indeed, sexual content is in the Bible, but it's not as graphically depicted as this book. That's a cop out.

Secondly, because even more graphic content is widely available to children (sadly), does that make a parent any more "bat shit crazy" for trying to protect their children? Can we protect them from everything? No, of course not. I'm sure my daughter will be (she's rather young) around kids who talk about such subject matter. But I won't force such content on my children nor will I let someone in authority...because let's be honest, there's a gun behind that school administrator...subject my children to such content.

Deborah K
05-07-2014, 10:25 AM
Just to be clear, they won't teach your kids about the tax code, the monetary system, or banking in general but they surely find the time to have them reading pornographic-lite material, teaching them useless mathematical concepts, or using their classrooms, as per No Child Left Behind, to indoctrinate and inculcate children to be cannon fodder.



Ever read "Brave New World" ? This is eerily reminiscent.


Yes, they'll spend time each day and devote resources about the 'need' to go to college. That everyone needs to go, certain fields are multiplying, and that it matters not how much debt one goes into to obtain their degree. They'll never tell the kid that what they are borrowing is depreciating toilet tissue

RPF member, PaulConventionWV posted a thread on "Why act Morally"? and wrote a piece for his college class where the required reading was from Peter Singer. Peter Singer advocates for infanticide. THIS is an example of what college students are force-fed these days. SMFH!

angelatc
05-07-2014, 10:26 AM
How is forcing parents to opt in, freedom? And, as far as I can tell, this was a public school - meaning it is government run. The Bill of Rights should therefor apply.

They do not force you to opt in. Our schools here are pretty conservative, and when there is material that some parents might find controversial, they send home a permission slip. If it is not returned, the kids get an alternate assignment. In junior high I kept them away from some stuff, but by high school I let them decide.

oyarde
05-07-2014, 10:30 AM
Bottom line , this guy should not have been arrested , what is the fine for disorderly conduct ? That is what it is going to cost . More free money for the govt.

Deborah K
05-07-2014, 10:34 AM
Let us now juxtapose this story with this one:


http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2014/05/05/teacher-tells-student-cant-read-bible-in-my-classroom/

Teacher tells student he can't read the Bible in classroom

A Florida school teacher humiliated a 12-year-old boy in front of an entire class after she caught him reading the Bible during free reading time.

The teacher, at Park Lakes Elementary School in Fort Lauderdale, ordered Giovanni Rubeo to pick up the telephone on her desk and call his parents.

As the other students watched, the teacher left a terse message on the family’s answering machine.

“I noticed that he has a book – a religious book – in the classroom,” she said on the recording. “He’s not permitted to read those books in my classroom.”

The Liberty Institute, a legal firm that specializes in religious liberty issues, is now representing the Rubeo family. They are demanding that Giovanni be allowed to read his Bible during free reading time. They also want the school to issue a written apology to the boy.

Audio of teacher at the website. School board is standing behind the teacher.

Deborah K
05-07-2014, 10:36 AM
They do not force you to opt in. Our schools here are pretty conservative, and when there is material that some parents might find controversial, they send home a permission slip. If it is not returned, the kids get an alternate assignment. In junior high I kept them away from some stuff, but by high school I let them decide.

Oh, okay.

Deborah K
05-07-2014, 10:40 AM
NO,, they should educate their own children,, There should not be any such thing as state run schools.. It is not and never was something that the State should be in any way involved in,, And certainly not at the Federal Level with a Department of Education. Not at the federal level ,,not at the state level,,not even at the county level.. It is at the parents level.. Parrents want a school? Hire a teacher and Build a room for the school.

Don't like the books,,don't buy them. Don't like the teacher,, fire em. Parental control on a very local level (Folks you know personally).
It is not in any way,,or on any level ,, a government function.

If it is,, you have a problem.

The fact remains, our money is being stolen from us to fund these monstrosities, so the logical thing to do, if one does not have the luxury to homeschool, or send their children to private school, is to monitor closely everything the teachers, and school administration does, and act accordingly.

donnay
05-07-2014, 10:41 AM
From the OP:


School district officials said they normally send out notifications to parents before assigning the controversial book, but forgot to do so this time.

Deborah K
05-07-2014, 10:45 AM
She has no children yet. I think it's a logical fallacy to assume that most people do not change their minds about how to raise kids after they actually have them.

But even then...I saw a tweet from the guy that runs The Daily Kos mention that he winced when he heard his young daughter singing some sexually explicit lyrics from a song. But he immediately put that gut reaction away, because he did not want to be the kind of parent that gets upset about his kids being exposed to that type of music.

SMFH. I never banned any music in our house, but I certainly listened to more Radio Disney than any grown adult should. There's just nothing empowering or cute about a 6 year dropping f-bombs while singing the praises of oral sex.

That's because collectivists don't want to parent their children - they want to be their ffrriiennnd!

Lucille
05-07-2014, 11:01 AM
This goes here.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T7b8hDVGAMk

angelatc
05-07-2014, 11:22 AM
This goes here.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T7b8hDVGAMk

Ha ha - I used to have those exact glasses back in the '80's.

Back to the topic, I think it would have been funny if another parent go up and started reading the sex passages out loud for 2 minutes.

pcosmar
05-07-2014, 11:56 AM
The fact remains, our money is being stolen from us to fund these monstrosities,


Yes it is..
And unless and until more people do this.

http://www.suindependent.com/images/article/2014_04/5753/u3_zzzzzzzzzzzzzzz_Bundy_NEW.jpg

http://img.allvoices.com/thumbs/image/609/480/104358172-protester.jpg

You will not change anything. They have to be told NO.
In no uncertain terms.

dannno
05-07-2014, 12:01 PM
Shit like this kills me. It really kills me.

Talks of semen and spread legs and even rape are found in the Bible, for God's sake.

I get why this guy did it. I get that what happened was wrong from a liberty prospective, but damn... these parents are batshit crazy and I'm free to criticize.



I'm going to totally agree on this one. When I was that age I read Lord of the Flies in school and the violence was MUCH worse than sex. In fact, sex doesn't necessarily have to be looked on in a negative light at all. There are plenty of ways to protect against pregnancy these days.

I'm still on the father's side from a liberty perspective, and I doubt I'll ever convince him that his 14 year old daughter being exposed to this type of sexual content is probably not that bad in the scheme of things, but as McCain would say "it is what it is".

Lucille
05-07-2014, 12:08 PM
Ha ha - I used to have those exact glasses back in the '80's.

Back to the topic, I think it would have been funny if another parent go up and started reading the sex passages out loud for 2 minutes.

Enormous glasses were all the rage!

Now that would have been the thing to do. Imagine the squirming!

Deborah K
05-07-2014, 12:16 PM
Yes it is..
And unless and until more people do this.

http://www.suindependent.com/images/article/2014_04/5753/u3_zzzzzzzzzzzzzzz_Bundy_NEW.jpg

http://img.allvoices.com/thumbs/image/609/480/104358172-protester.jpg

You will not change anything. They have to be told NO.
In no uncertain terms.

That is but ONE answer - not the ONLY answer. In my flea-bitten opinion.

Brett85
05-07-2014, 03:29 PM
Shit like this kills me. It really kills me.

Talks of semen and spread legs and even rape are found in the Bible, for God's sake.

I get why this guy did it. I get that what happened was wrong from a liberty prospective, but damn... these parents are batshit crazy and I'm free to criticize.

A 9th grader? 14? If she has her own personal computer, she can find way better NC-17 stories on fanfiction.net, or she can just download the million of copies of Fifty Shades of Gray PDF's on the internetz.

Shit, I really hate to break it to the old-school parents out there, but some kids are masturbating by age 14 (http://healthland.time.com/2011/08/11/boys-masturbate-more-than-girls-seriously/). Some do it way earlier.

I really think some parents need to wake up - I don't think the enemy here is sex or the openness of sexual discussion. European countries (especially the Netherlands) have had comprehensive sex education, some have legalized prostitution, most have completely nude or topless beaches... and... also extremely low teenage pregnancy rates! We have as much as 10x as many teen births as some European countries that actually realize puberty and hormones make kids interested in sex, and yes, that kids are going to experiment with their bodies - alone and *gasp* with other people. Crazy, I know.

Wait until they open up their kid's biology textbooks.

The point is that parents have the right to raise their kids how they want to raise them, not the government. People have the right to raise their children with a sense of morality and right and wrong.

bunklocoempire
05-07-2014, 04:01 PM
Someone mentioned the Bible? The uppity Lutheran chimes in... :D

Christians have it too easy:

2 Timothy 3:1–5
3 But mark this: There will be terrible times in the last days. 2 People will be lovers of themselves, lovers of money, boastful, proud, abusive, disobedient to their parents, ungrateful, unholy, 3 without love, unforgiving, slanderous, without self-control, brutal, not lovers of the good, 4 treacherous, rash, conceited, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God—5 having a form of godliness but denying its power. Have nothing to do with them.

I'm not saying I know when the last days are, but I am saying a Christian would, should, have the good sense to get out of the car (school) that was funded by force and that others are trying to drive according to their own beliefs.

By attending church, my folks nurtured the voluntary relationships that afforded my sister and myself the opportunity to attend parochial schools -while still being forced by the state to pay for state schools their children weren't using.

I think we're all familiar with the "relationships" nurtured by the state...

▄︻̷̿┻̿═━一 (it's supposed to be a rifle lol)

The father who was arrested has reacted to the state's own idea of a "relationship" -a mob fighting over stolen goods. When the heck has that worked out? He clearly senses that the relationship is flawed, yet he has not worked the relationship problem backward. Here's hoping that he does.

angelatc
05-07-2014, 04:11 PM
The point is that parents have the right to raise their kids how they want to raise them, not the government. People have the right to raise their children with a sense of morality and right and wrong.

And people also have the right to live in a community where there are certain common values shared, which is something that liberals just can't stand. One big reason that people up and left Europe was to establish Puritan roots in a new country. It irritates me when I see liberals bitching about sex education in Europe, when the social liberalism is the direct descendant of what our ancestors came here to avoid.

KCIndy
05-07-2014, 06:04 PM
Hmmpf.


#1: Mr. Baer should NEVER have been arrested for speaking his mind. It's a public forum involving something in which he is directly involved - namely, his daughter's education.

#2: IMHO Mr. Baer actually knew what was coming and (as a lawyer) saw a perfect chance to use a knee-jerk reaction by the state to make and reinforce his point. His quote at the end of the story sounds almost too good to be spontaneous: “Many people in education and government truly believe our children are theirs,” William Baer told EAG News. “That parents are only the custodians who feed them and put a roof over their head. These school incidents are a byproduct of this ‘we know best’ philosophy. They believe they have the authority to do this. If people were more complacent, which is hard to imagine, it’d be even worse.”

#3: One more reason it is home schooling/private schools FTW.

#4: THE WHOLE CONTROVERSY IS LUDICROUS!!! I've not read the book. But if a synopsis I found is accurate, the "OMG --- SEX!!" scene is approximately 1% of the book's content. The other 99% is a poorly written juvenile angst saga about a school shooting and its consequences.
Apparently the parents in question have no problem with their daughter reading about kids getting shot in the stomach, being disfigured, or heads getting blown off. But they DO have a real problem with anything involving.... **gasp!!**..... S-E-X.

Here's the link I found to what is purported to be a chapter by chapter synopsis of the book in question. If anyone feels like wading through a couple of pages of recap, you can take a look and see if I'm way off base here... or not:

http://www.rindgeucc.org/Nineteen%20Minutes%20by%20Jodi%20Picoult%20Chapter %20Summaries.pdf


SPOILER: Can anyone tell me how someone can fit a "high powered hunting rifle" into a student's school backpack? :rolleyes::rolleyes:

Anti Federalist
05-07-2014, 06:16 PM
Can't rep that enough.

Anything short of that, at this point, is really just mental masturbation.



Yes it is..
And unless and until more people do this.

http://www.suindependent.com/images/article/2014_04/5753/u3_zzzzzzzzzzzzzzz_Bundy_NEW.jpg

http://img.allvoices.com/thumbs/image/609/480/104358172-protester.jpg

You will not change anything. They have to be told NO.
In no uncertain terms.

Anti Federalist
05-07-2014, 06:20 PM
There is no First Amendment right to speak at a indoor public meeting when someone else is supposed to be speaking.

Horseshit.

If the First Amendment does not protect your right speak at a purely political function, of political "leaders" and "officials" then it doesn't do anything.

Oh, it upset some penny ante water cooler dictator's meeting schedule?

Tough.

Paulbot99
05-07-2014, 06:57 PM
When I have kids, they are going to a Catholic school or home school them with Ron Paul's curriculum. Even after it becomes illegal.

angelatc
05-07-2014, 07:13 PM
#4: THE WHOLE CONTROVERSY IS LUDICROUS!!! I've not read the book.

I stopped reading there.

If you look at the reviews on Barnes $ Noble and Amazon, lots of parents have the same concerns. Not that there are sex scenes, but that a specific sex scene is much too raw to be appropriate for middle schoolers.

brushfire
05-07-2014, 08:21 PM
Good thing people have a choice on what school they can send their kids to. :rolleyes:

Keith and stuff
05-09-2014, 08:16 AM
Horseshit.

If the First Amendment does not protect your right speak at a purely political function, of political "leaders" and "officials" then it doesn't do anything.

Oh, it upset some penny ante water cooler dictator's meeting schedule?

Tough.

If everyone in the meeting were all speaking at the same time, it would be a yelling match. It wouldn't be a school board meeting. It would be a waste of everyone's time. Disturbing the peace, IMO. You have a right to be outside of the building and yell like a crazy person for 2 hours, but not inside the official public meeting.

Keith and stuff
05-09-2014, 08:19 AM
Good thing people have a choice on what school they can send their kids to. :rolleyes:

They do, somewhat, in most states. Most states have charter schools. The way that works where I live is you may apply for any government charter school in the states. If your kid is accepted, you may send your kid to that government school. If it is within your school district, the government has to bus your kid to the school. If it is within any other school district, you are responsible for sending your kid to school. There is also an online government charter school here that any parent in the nation may apply for. The which government school a kid goes to based on zip code model is more and more, becoming a thing of the past.

Origanalist
05-10-2014, 03:32 PM
The daughter speaks up.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ryVWfATBT9M

VoluntaryAmerican
05-10-2014, 05:22 PM
So are you being sarcastic or do you really have a child/ren?

I'm going to assume sarcasm. First of all, indeed, sexual content is in the Bible, but it's not as graphically depicted as this book. That's a cop out.

Secondly, because even more graphic content is widely available to children (sadly), does that make a parent any more "bat shit crazy" for trying to protect their children? Can we protect them from everything? No, of course not. I'm sure my daughter will be (she's rather young) around kids who talk about such subject matter. But I won't force such content on my children nor will I let someone in authority...because let's be honest, there's a gun behind that school administrator...subject my children to such content.

Whether or not she has kids has little to do with it. It's a simple decision a person can rationalize.

I happen to not have kids and when I do I will attempt not to subject them to explicit sexual content too young. That personally happened to me.

Edit: I see now the girl is 14. It really depends on the kids mindset. 14-15-16 I was reading shit like A Clock Work Orange. (Because I wanted to)

VoluntaryAmerican
05-10-2014, 05:35 PM
Can't rep that enough.

Anything short of that, at this point, is really just mental masturbation.

Just curious, but I don't recall RP advocating armed rebellion. Although I do believe he would if things got drastic enough.

Not saying this to be a smart ass, just curious where he stands on that. I thought he was in favor of educating.

...anyway off topic

Keith and stuff
05-10-2014, 10:28 PM
The daughter speaks up.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ryVWfATBT9M
You gotta love the liberty media activists in New Hampshire! They are certainly a cut above the liberty media activists anywhere else. Not only did the father make international news, the daughter made national news! Lovin' It!

Occam's Banana
05-11-2014, 12:28 AM
I wonder how explicit the sexual content was.

One person's "explicit" is another person's "prudish" - and that sorta thing just can't be tolerated.
Which is why we've got this "all eggs in one (State-sponsored public-education) basket" situation ...

Occam's Banana
05-11-2014, 12:28 AM
The daughter speaks up.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ryVWfATBT9M

+rep for her (Origanalist will have to stand in as her proxy).

Occam's Banana
05-11-2014, 12:49 AM
That juvenile pop novel trash is what the publik skools are assigning students in an honors class? YHGTBKM. I can think of 100 other books that would be better reads than that (many of which contain sexual content, since that seems to be a requirement these days).

It's not really surprising. Expecting "modern education professionals" (or the mavens of "public school pedagogy") to approve of teaching the likes of Dostoyevsky, et al. is rather like expecting vampires to drink holy water.

I mean, after all, who the hell needs Shakespeare's "beast with two backs" when you can have Picoult's "erection, hot against her stomach [...] pumping so hard that she scooted backward [leaving] [s]emen, sticky and hot, pooled on the carpet beneath her" (h/t kcchiefs6465 (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?451400-Video-Man-gets-arrested-for-defending-his-daughter-at-school-meeting&p=5520046&viewfull=1#post5520046)) - especially considering the fact that most public-school English teachers today would likely be as befuddled as their students by Dostoyevsky, Shakespeare, etc.?

:confused: "Idiot? Two backs? Huh? WTF? ..." :confused:

Origanalist
05-11-2014, 07:30 AM
+rep for her (Origanalist will have to stand in as her proxy).

Proud to do so. She obviously "gets it" now.

Wooden Indian
05-11-2014, 10:46 AM
From a liberty perspective... this is a no brainer.
From a personal perspective... I always find it funny how those without children want to tell others how they should raise theirs.

And you can often tell if he/she have children based on their advice alone. Because frankly, the advice is just that bad. LOL

kcchiefs6465
12-22-2014, 01:13 PM
Update:


Charges Dismissed For Father Arrested At School Board Meeting

Gilford, NH- A judge dismissed all charges against William Baer, the father who was arrested at a May school board meeting after railing against the school’s missteps when it failed to disclose to parents a required reading assignment involving violent and sexually explicit material. The judge’s ruling described Baer’s behavior at the meeting as “impolite, but not criminal.”

Baer was arrested during a school board meeting on May 5 when he criticized the board for its failure to notify parents about a particular book, Nineteen Minutes by Jodi Picoult, that was assigned for his daughter’s advanced English class as required reading. The book, which is about a school shooting in a fictitious New Hampshire town, contained an explicit passage illustrating an aggressive, drunken sexual encounter between two of the main characters.

Baer had taken his concerns to the principal ahead of the meeting and told him he was upset that parents were not notified ahead of time about the book’s content and were not provided with an alternative option for a reading assignment. School officials admitted that past notifications about the book had been distributed since 2007, but the school had failed to do so this year. The school, realizing the mistake, sent out notices to parents about the book after Baer’s meeting with the principal.

http://benswann.com/charges-dismissed-for-father-arrested-at-school-board-meeting/

More at link.

ETA:
From the same link:

Baer said that “these three criminal charges against me were not ‘dropped’ by Gilford Police Chief Bean-Burpee and his prosecutor Sergeant Eric Bredbury, they were dismissed by a New Hampshire Circuit Court Judge after a full hearing.”

“In spite of having months to review the law and the facts, the Prosecutor refused to drop the charges or even propose a plea, but rather continued to seek a conviction to justify the State’s violation of my First Amendment right of free speech, and my unlawful arrest.”

Baer noted that he has experience in the legal system and had obtained a strong legal team, but pointed out that many people in his situation do not have that advantage and “one of the most troubling aspects of this experience is having to face the fact that, out of the millions of people arrested every year in the United States, many are unlawfully arrested, maliciously prosecuted, wrongfully convicted, or pressured to plead guilty just to get it over with.”

fisharmor
12-22-2014, 01:42 PM
The thing I can't figure out is why people like Baer never disclose prices.
Getting out of that charge was at least a four-digit proposition, and potentially even five.
And in the end, the fact that the judge wasn't asleep at the wheel (or just evil enough to believe it was not an erroneous charge) is the only reason why he's not still fighting it in appeals.

The pressure to plead guilty doesn't just come from the prosecutors and smarmy defenders, it comes from simple economics. Even the most dimwitted people are able to see that some probation, a couple hundred dollars in fines, and an arrest record are more preferable to spending a year or two of college tuition on a process that only gets you back to square one, a position where the entire thing can happen again just because some roid raging officer is having a bad day and doesn't like the way you look.