PDA

View Full Version : 50 western lawmakers meet to discuss the taking back of Federal lands.




phill4paul
04-19-2014, 08:06 AM
http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/politics/57836973-90/utah-lands-lawmakers-federal.html.csp



Western lawmakers gather in Utah to talk federal land takeover
‘It’s time’ » Lawmakers from 9 states gather in Utah, discuss ways to take control of federal lands.
By Kristen Moulton | The Salt Lake Tribune
First Published Apr 18 2014 03:07 pm • Last Updated Apr 18 2014 10:21 pm

It’s time for Western states to take control of federal lands within their borders, lawmakers and county commissioners from Western states said at Utah’s Capitol on Friday.

More than 50 political leaders from nine states convened for the first time to talk about their joint goal: wresting control of oil-, timber -and mineral-rich lands away from the feds.


Photos
(Scott Sommerdorf | The Salt Lake Tribune)
Utah Speaker of the House Becky Lockhart, right, and other western lawmakers spoke about their meeting to effort to transfer public lands back to the states, Friday, April 18, 2014. from left to right: Mark Blasdel - Speaker of the Montana House of Representatives, Montana Senator Jennifer Fielder, Scott Bedke - Idaho Speaker of the House, and Speaker Lockhart.(Scott Sommerdorf | The Salt Lake Tribune)
Utah Rep. Ken Ivory, R-West Jordan, speaks while Utah Speaker of the House Becky Lockhart listens at right. They, along with other western lawmakers spoke about their effort to transfer public lands back to the states, Friday, April 18, 2014.(Scott Sommerdorf | The Salt Lake Tribune)
Utah Speaker of the House Becky Lockhart, right, and other western lawmakers spoke about their effort to transfer public lands back to the states, Friday, April 18, 2014. From left to right: Mark Blasdel - Speaker of the Montana House of Representatives, Montana Senator Jennifer Fielder, Scott Bedke - Idaho Speaker of the House, and Speaker Lockhart. (Scott Sommerdorf | The Salt Lake Tribune)
Idaho's Speaker of the House, Scott Bedke, speaks as he and other western lawmakers spoke about their effort to transfer public lands back to the states, Friday, April 18, 2014. From left to right: Utah Rep. Ken Ivory, R-West Jordan, Mark Blasdel - Speaker of the Montana House of Representatives, Montana Senator Jennifer Fielder, Bedke, and Utah Speaker of the House, Becky Lockhart, R-Provo.
View photo gallery (4 photos)


"It’s simply time," said Rep. Ken Ivory, R-West Jordan, who organized the Legislative Summit on the Transfer for Public Lands along with Montana state Sen. Jennifer Fielder. "The urgency is now."

Utah House Speaker Becky Lockhart, R-Provo, was flanked by a dozen participants, including her counterparts from Idaho and Montana, during a press conference after the daylong closed-door summit. U.S. Sen. Mike Lee addressed the group over lunch, Ivory said. New Mexico, Arizona, Nevada, Wyoming, Oregon and Washington also were represented.

The summit was in the works before this month’s tense standoff between Nevada rancher Cliven Bundy and the Bureau of Land Management over cattle grazing, Lockhart said.

"What’s happened in Nevada is really just a symptom of a much larger problem," Lockhart said.

Fielder, who described herself as "just a person who lives in the woods," said federal land management is hamstrung by bad policies, politicized science and severe federal budget cuts.

"Those of us who live in the rural areas know how to take care of lands," Fielder said, who lives in the northwestern Montana town of Thompson Falls.

"We have to start managing these lands. It’s the right thing to do for our people, for our environment, for our economy and for our freedoms," Fielder said.

Idaho Speaker of the House Scott Bedke said Idaho forests and rangeland managed by the state have suffered less damage and watershed degradation from wildfire than have lands managed by federal agencies.

"It’s time the states in the West come of age," Bedke said. "We’re every bit as capable of managing the lands in our boundaries as the states east of Colorado."

Ivory said the issue is of interest to urban as well as rural lawmakers, in part because they see oilfields and other resources that could be developed to create jobs and fund education.

Moreover, the federal government’s debt threatens both its management of vast tracts of the West as well as its ability to come through with payments in lieu of taxes to the states, he said. Utah gets 32 percent of its revenue from the federal government, much of it unrelated to public lands.

"If we don’t stand up and act, seeing that trajectory of what’s coming … those problems are going to get bigger," Ivory said.

He was the sponsor two years of ago of legislation, signed by Gov. Gary Herbert, that demands the federal government relinquish title to federal lands in Utah. The lawmakers and governor said they were only asking the federal government to make good on promises made in the 1894 Enabling Act for Utah to become a state.

The intent was never to take over national parks and wilderness created by an act of Congress Lockhart said. "We are not interested in having control of every acre," she said. "There are lands that are off the table that rightly have been designated by the federal government."

A study is underway at the University of Utah to analyze how Utah could manage the land now in federal control. That was called for in HB142, passed by the 2013 Utah Legislature.

None of the other Western states has gone as far as Utah, demanding Congress turn over federal lands. But five have task forces or other analyses underway to get a handle on the costs and benefits, Fielder said.

"Utah has been way ahead on this," Fielder said.

RJB
04-19-2014, 08:13 AM
Wow! I hope a lot more local politicians get on board. This is good news.

tod evans
04-19-2014, 08:15 AM
Wow! I hope a lot more local politicians get on board. This is good news.

Politicians caused this problem in the first place...

I, for one, don't have any faith that politicians can fix it....

RJB
04-19-2014, 08:19 AM
Politicians caused this problem in the first place...

I, for one, don't have any faith that politicians can fix it....
Nor do I, but a lot of these are local people who ran for office in their localities and actually work and live there. They not only have their own gripes; they talk to their neighbors.

These are not bought out beltway prostitutes who have call screeners bear the brunt of angry constituents.

To me I see this as the stirring of the sleeping giant.

phill4paul
04-19-2014, 08:43 AM
It's past time. The mineral rights, the oil rights, all these rightfully belong to the citizens of these states. NOT the Federal government. The use of these properties should be determined by state legislators, the representatives of the people of that state, NOT Federal functionaries.

thoughtomator
04-19-2014, 08:48 AM
I do believe this is called "blowback" :D

phill4paul
04-19-2014, 09:00 AM
Bedke said. "We’re every bit as capable of managing the lands in our boundaries as the states east of Colorado."

And here is the heart of the matter. What could any lawmaker east of Colorado say to that? Would they be willing to give up 50+% of their states land to the Federal government?

Southron
04-19-2014, 09:01 AM
I would like to see these lands given to individuals who are willing to live there. Of course give current state residents priority but I dont want to see them auctioned off to corporations.

RJB
04-19-2014, 09:13 AM
I dont want to see them auctioned off to corporations.
I hear ya. I'd rather see homesteaders settle it over a corporation who is half based here and half based in Dubai or China.


The romantic in me would just like to see it as free and open range, for the turtle, cow, white man, indian, whoever passes through...

CPUd
04-19-2014, 09:18 AM
Maybe they could give it back to Mexico.

Carson
04-19-2014, 09:34 AM
Take it back with Eminent Domain.

Of course you'll have to compensate them with fair market value. I'm thinking that is nothing. I don't remember ever receiving anything for any of the resources or land looted.

Then I would set up a fund money could be deposited into for every legal resident. Kind of like Alaska's Permanent Fund only with an account or debit card.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alaska_Permanent_Fund

They've been getting some healthy deposits just for some of the oil they've sold. It would also get people interested in the conservation of their resources and stop them being sold for the price of a politician.

Carson
04-19-2014, 09:36 AM
Alaska Permanent Fund

Annual Individual Payout (Nominal USD):[16]
Year Amount
2013 $900.00
2012 $878.00
2011 $1,174.00
2010 $1,281.00
2009 $1,305.00
2008 $2,069.00 + $1,200 Alaska Resource Rebate
2007 $1,654.00
2006 $1,106.96
2005 $845.76
2004 $919.84
2003 $1,107.56
2002 $1,540.76
2001 $1,850.28
2000 $1,963.86
1999 $1,769.84
1998 $1,540.88
1997 $1,296.54
1996 $1,130.68
1995 $990.30
1994 $983.90
1993 $949.46
1992 $915.84
1991 $931.34
1990 $952.63
1989 $873.16
1988 $826.93
1987 $708.19
1986 $556.26
1985 $404.00
1984 $331.29
1983 $386.15
1982 $1,000.00

phill4paul
04-19-2014, 09:45 AM
Take it back with Eminent Domain.

Of course you'll have to compensate them with fair market value. I'm thinking that is nothing. I don't remember ever receiving anything for any of the resources or land looted.

Then I would set up a fund money could be deposited into for every legal resident. Kind of like Alaska's Permanent Fund only with an account or debit card.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alaska_Permanent_Fund

They've been getting some healthy deposits just for some of the oil they've sold. It would also get people interested in the conservation of their resources and stop them being sold for the price of a politician.

That's the ticket!

Carson
04-19-2014, 10:03 AM
Did you guys see this video talking about the power the Bureau of Land Management has now?

I'm not sure if it is true but the evidence points that way.

The Truth About the BLM - Bundy Ranch Dispute Explained

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tAwALTdrMZ8

I came across it in this thread;

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?450044-Bundy-Ranch-Dispute-Explained-%28Relatively-Concise%29

NoOneButPaul
04-19-2014, 03:58 PM
I do believe this is called "blowback" :D

LOL... it sure is...

If Reid keeps escalating this entire thing they're going to be been blown back like they can never imagine. Right before the elections too...

FloralScent
04-19-2014, 06:46 PM
Did we just get played? I've never known legislators to act this quickly to a non-scripted event, and never at all in opposition to the Federal government.

Ender
04-19-2014, 07:28 PM
Did we just get played? I've never known legislators to act this quickly to a non-scripted event, and never at all in opposition to the Federal government.

Utah had already passed a law taking back much of their land- this is just other states now waking up and joining them.

Carson
04-19-2014, 07:55 PM
Did we just get played? I've never known legislators to act this quickly to a non-scripted event, and never at all in opposition to the Federal government.

This had to of already been in the works, I'm thinking.


I'm so leery of everything I was sort of ran the calculation whether the resent events were a ploy at playing us.

FloralScent
04-19-2014, 08:14 PM
Utah had already passed a law taking back much of their land- this is just other states now waking up and joining them.

Good to know, thanks.

FloralScent
04-19-2014, 08:19 PM
This had to of already been in the works, I'm thinking.


I'm so leery of everything I was sort of ran the calculation whether the resent events were a ploy at playing us.

"Paul!" The Duke frowned at his son. "Knowing where the trap is - that is the first step in evading it. This is like single combat, Son, only on a larger scale - a feint within a feint within a feint... seemingly without end."

- Leto Atreides

NO_GMOs
04-19-2014, 10:39 PM
Good news, maybe those fracking land rapist will have to at least pay the locals for the damage they cause to the land. There is just something wrong when you can light your water on fire at the tap.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4LBjSXWQRV8

ClydeCoulter
04-19-2014, 10:50 PM
Good news, maybe those fracking land rapist will have to at least pay the locals for the damage they cause to the land. There is just something wrong when you can light your water on fire at the tap.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4LBjSXWQRV8

But, those cows belch the methane all of the time!

NO_GMOs
04-19-2014, 11:36 PM
But, those cows belch the methane all of the time!

Yep, but not in your kitchen LOL. Have you checked into what they inject into the ground to cause the fracking, it's a highly guarded secret like the secrets of the GMO's and FDA (Fraud and Death Association).


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uokmsSi7LTY


BTW I am not against Fracking I think it's a great way to get gas out of the ground, but let's stop raping the earth just because we can. Be resposible and not drill a gas hole close to homes.

NO_GMOs
04-20-2014, 12:35 AM
But, those cows belch the methane all of the time!

But not in your kitchen LOL. Have you ever checked into what they inject into the ground to cause the fracking?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uokmsSi7LTY

BTW, I am not against drilling for gas or Fracking, I think we should just be responsible about it. After all no one would want one in your back yard.

Christopher A. Brown
04-20-2014, 10:12 PM
It's past time. The mineral rights, the oil rights, all these rightfully belong to the citizens of these states. NOT the Federal government. The use of these properties should be determined by state legislators, the representatives of the people of that state, NOT Federal functionaries.

Kudos for making that point. Very solid! One huge reason is states are not parties to GATT and NAFTA, so with formal control established far less WTO abuse will occur with the treasonous effect of those treaties. US law is usurped when foreign and domestic corporation do business on US territory.

Christopher A. Brown
04-20-2014, 10:42 PM
Yep, but not in your kitchen LOL. Have you checked into what they inject into the ground to cause the fracking, it's a highly guarded secret like the secrets of the GMO's and FDA (Fraud and Death Association).

BTW I am not against Fracking I think it's a great way to get gas out of the ground, but let's stop raping the earth just because we can. Be resposible and not drill a gas hole close to homes.

All gas well fracking is do e by multi national corporations under GATT, which means they are not accountable under US law. On US territory this is treason, meaning courts and environmental organizations are keeping this a secret for reasons $.

The gas is sold to Aftica and Asia. Profits at our permanent expense.

The XL pipeline is happening under the same premise.

Keith and stuff
04-21-2014, 02:04 AM
It's nice to see people in the Western states start to wake up and stand up for the owning of private property. It's pretty silly to think the federal government is the only organization capable of managing lack tracks on land...

tangent4ronpaul
04-21-2014, 04:30 AM
LOL... it sure is...

If Reid keeps escalating this entire thing they're going to be been blown back like they can never imagine. Right before the elections too...

I believe Reid is up for re-election this year.

The bad news? His backing:
Koch brothers
casino owners
developers
Mormon church

Heller calls for congressional hearings into how BLM handled Bundy roundup
http://www.reviewjournal.com/news/nevada/heller-calls-congressional-hearings-how-blm-handled-bundy-roundup

U.S. Sen. Dean Heller on Friday called for congressional hearings into how the Bureau of Land Management handled the roundup of cattle around Cliven Bundy’s Bunkerville ranch, which turned into an armed stand off between the BLM and militia groups and launched a new debate about the federal government’s 85 percent ownership of Nevada land.

“I want to find out who’s accountable for this,” said the Nevada Republican on a Las Vegas political talk show, where Heller appeared for the first time on live television with U.S. Sen. Harry Reid, D-Nev.

Heller said he hoped he and Reid could agree on holding hearings, but the Senate majority leader didn’t respond to the suggestion, making it unclear if Democrats who control the Senate would agree to such a public examination.

Heller’s staff said he would push for hearings before the Senate Energy and Natural Resources Committee, which the Nevada senator sits on, when he gets back to Washington, D.C., after the Easter break.

Heller said he wanted to look into why the BLM needed “200 armed men,” including some reportedly with sniper rifles, to monitor the roundup, which was cut short on April 12 by the BLM to avoid open violence.

Nevada’s two senators were questioned on KSNV-TV, Channel 3’s “What’s Your Point?” by hosts Jeff Gillan and Amy Tarkanian, whose husband, Danny, lost the GOP primary in 2010 in the contest for Reid’s Senate seat. The show lasted about 30 minutes and covered a range of topics, from Bundy to extending unemployment benefits.

The day before the TV appearance, Reid called supporters of Bundy “domestic terrorists” because they defended him against the BLM cattle roundup with guns and put their children in harm’s way.

“Those people who hold themselves out to be patriots are not. They’re nothing more than domestic terrorists,” Reid said during an appearance at a Las Vegas Review-Journal “Hashtags & Headlines” event at the Paris.

On the Friday show, Reid defended his characterization of the supporters, repeating that some had carried assault weapons and automatic weapons and put women and children in the line of fire. No shots were fired.

“If there were ever an example of people who were domestic violent terrorist wannabes, these are the guys,” Reid said.

Heller objected, saying he didn’t agree and that most were regular folks, including grandmothers, veterans and Boy Scouts.

“I have a very different view,” Heller said, sitting next to Reid. “… What Senator Reid may call domestic terrorists, I call patriots.”

Reid countered: “If they’re patriots, we’re in very big trouble.”

Heller said he wondered why the BLM sent an army of armed men to take back Bundy’s cattle.

“There was no army,” Reid muttered, although neither man raised his voice during the tense exchange.

Last week, Heller and GOP Gov. Brian Sandoval both criticized BLM tactics, which included tasing one of Bundy’s sons and having him arrested. At the same time, both Sandoval and Heller defended the federal government’s right to enforce court orders to round up the cattle and they called for the situation to end without violence.

Bundy, who said his family homesteaded the land in the 1870s and has a right to use it, has not paid federal grazing fees for 20 years and owes about $1 million to the government.

Heller and Reid disagreed about what’s at the heart of the Bundy dispute: control of federal public lands.

“It’s federal land, take it or leave it,” Reid said, while noting some counties had been able to take back some U.S. lands.

Heller said cattlemen “have lost over half of the range land they’re able to run on in the last 30 years.”

Reid blamed the loss of grazing land to global warming, however. Heller disagreed and said the situation could grow worse if the federal government decides to list the sage grouse as an endangered species.

“Wait until the sage grouse comes,” Heller said, predicting more public lands versus environment battles to come.

-t

jtap
04-21-2014, 08:29 AM
It would love to see the states get the land back. I hope it happens.