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Anti Federalist
03-21-2014, 12:28 AM
Funded, in part, by NASA.

No, the human race will not be doomed this way, if it is going to be wiped it, it will be because of a bunch of value-neutral eggheads fucking around with shifting antigen "super viruses" and fortified resurrected viruses from past plagues and pandemics, fiddle when they should have faddled.




Society Is Doomed, Scientists Claim

By Marc Lallanilla, Assistant Editor | March 18, 2014 05:15pm ET

http://www.livescience.com/44171-society-civilization-collapse-study.html

There's never been a shortage of doomsday scenarios. From the dreaded Mayan Apocalypse of 2012 (remember that?) to the havoc wreaked in the movie "The Day After Tomorrow," people have been predicting the end of civilization for as long as there has been a civilization.

The trouble is, they're sometimes correct: The Roman Empire fell spectacularly, as did the Mayan civilization, the Han Dynasty of China, India's Gupta Empire and dozens of other once-mighty kingdoms.

But how, exactly, do powerful empires collapse, and why? Researchers now believe they've found an answer, one that has troubling implications for today — because we're clearly on the road to ruin. [11 Failed Doomsday Predictions]

Societal collapse — more common than you think

The researchers' first task was overturning "the common impression that societal collapse is rare, or even largely fictional," as they wrote in their report, to be published in the journal Ecological Economics. [Photos: Life and Death of an Ancient Civilization]

In fact, they argue, the rise and fall of great social structures is so common a theme in human civilization — recurrent throughout history and worldwide in scope — that it's more the rule than the exception.

Most studies of a society's collapse have looked at the specifics of how one civilization declined, citing individual causes such as a disaster (earthquake, flood), loss of resources (soil erosion, deforestation) or human conflict (war, uprising) that led to the particular society's downfall.

But the researchers (funded in part by NASA's Goddard Space Flight Center and the University of Maryland, College Park) cast a wider net. They aimed to create a useful mathematical model that could help analyze how any society might fall — including our current global, technically advanced, interconnected society.

The balance of nature

The model they arrived at takes inspiration from the classic notion of predator vs. prey, sometimes referred to as the "balance of nature." When a deer population grows, for instance, the wolves that feed on those deer reproduce more successfully, too, and so the wolf population grows.

Everything is fine until the wolves become too numerous and overreach, eating so many deer that there isn't enough venison to go around. Then, as the number of deer plunges, the wolf population drops due to famine, until equilibrium is reestablished and the cycle begins anew.

Informed by this paradigm, the researchers developed a relatively simple formula with four factors influencing social collapse: nature and natural resources, the accumulation of wealth, the elite and the commoners. The team calls their model Human And Nature Dynamics, or HANDY.

A HANDY tool

The researchers used the HANDY model to analyze three different social scenarios: an egalitarian society with no elite class; an equitable society with workers and non-workers (students, retirees, disabled persons); and an unequal society with a robust class of elites.

The egalitarian and equitable societies could produce a sustainable civilization and avoid collapse, even with a high ratio of non-workers. Social collapse was more likely after people overreached and depleted natural resources. Importantly, even without any social stratification, collapse could occur if a society exhausted its natural resources.

In the unequal society, however, collapse was almost unavoidable — and these were the HANDY scenarios that mirrored our current globalized society.

The income gap

"The scenarios most closely reflecting the reality of our world today are found in the third group of experiments, where we introduced economic stratification," the researchers wrote, referring to uneven wealth distribution. "Under such conditions, we find that collapse is difficult to avoid."

Other recent research backs up the authors' claims: A 2012 study from the journal American Sociological Review shows that the income share of the top 1 percent of Americans grew rapidly after 1980 — from 10 percent in 1981 to 23.5 percent in 2007, an increase of 135 percentage points.

Meanwhile, the bottom three-quarters of the U.S. population has seen slow economic growth, with predictable results: A 2011 study published in the journal Psychological Science found that happiness, trust in others and life satisfaction plummet when income inequality is high.

Technology won't save you

For those who believe that there must be a technological fix to all this despair and destruction, the researchers found that the historical record provides "testimony to the fact that advanced, sophisticated, complex and creative civilizations can be both fragile and impermanent.

"It may be reasonable to believe that modern civilization, armed with its greater technological capacity, scientific knowledge and energy resources, will be able to survive and endure whatever crises historical societies succumbed to," the authors wrote.

"But the brief overview of collapses demonstrates not only the ubiquity of the phenomenon, but also the extent to which advanced, complex and powerful societies are susceptible to collapse."

Not all is lost, however: Societies can moderate the two factors that contribute most to social meltdown: the exploitation of natural resources and the uneven distribution of wealth, the researchers said.

"Collapse can be avoided and population can reach equilibrium if the per-capita rate of depletion of nature is reduced to a sustainable level, and if resources are distributed in a reasonably equitable fashion," they wrote.

Original_Intent
03-21-2014, 12:49 AM
Of course, most of these eggheads think the best way to redistribute wealth is via Socialism, and I bet not one in a hundred understands that the only thing that needs to be done is massive de-regulation of industry most of which legislation was written BY industrial giants to BAR or significantly retard ease of entry by competitors.

But no, most will just throw more gasoline on the fire, trying to solve a problem by pushing for more of what caused the problem.

Spikender
03-21-2014, 12:58 AM
The fact that just about every country on this Earth redistributes wealth on a massive scale while keeping a few in power apparently flew under the radar of these scientists.

I would like to know: how much money do the scientists have the bank, and why haven't they given half of it to the first street bum they run across? You know, start the process off for us so we know how it works.

"Collapse can be avoided and population can reach equilibrium if the per-capita rate of depletion of nature is reduced to a sustainable level, and if resources are distributed in a reasonably equitable fashion," they wrote.

This will solve nothing, this has been tried, and human nature and corruption wins every time. Not to mention it does not teach people how to be self-sustaining and will simply lead to more people being dependent on the dole like the people we have today.

The truth is, the collapse of many great nations has been because power was taken away from the people and those above them distracted them with games and circuses while society burned and crumbled around them. It's all folly.

fr33
03-21-2014, 01:04 AM
Idiocracy is real. I mean, goddamn. I read that article and I still can't believe that they needed fancy degrees and credentials to come up with this.

fr33
03-21-2014, 01:06 AM
Society is doomed because of what society has done. Solution: society needs to increase rapidly what it's done to doom itself.

Give me a PHD and a NASA contract. Brawndo has electrolytes.

muh_roads
03-21-2014, 01:11 AM
Now that the proletariat's have figured out ways to transfer stolen value away from the central banking cartel with things like crypto-currencies, I expect more articles like this to appear so they can use the power of pen to paper in conjunction with force to try and steal some of that value back.

tod evans
03-21-2014, 03:04 AM
And just exactly who do these fine scientists think is going to be in charge of redistribution?

This is just more mental masturbation because reality is quite simple; "He who has the biggest stick wins."

jclay2
03-21-2014, 10:03 AM
Idiocracy is real. I mean, goddamn. I read that article and I still can't believe that they needed fancy degrees and credentials to come up with this.

Yes Yes and Yes! For anyone who does not know, these "experiments" have nothing to do with science. They are math/logic based models where the outcomes are determined by the inputs you feed into the model. What these scientist did was to create assumptions that don't match up one bit with how the world actually works. They knew the results of the model before it was even run. If I made the capitalist over achiever take a larger growth rate where by the activities of said over achiever reduce the fixed natural resources, of course the society will collapse.

jllundqu
03-21-2014, 10:13 AM
This should be filed under political science, not actual science.

I just had this debate with my stepdad. He lives in napa, ca, so he is swimming in koolaid, but he correctly identifies the problem but thinks the solution (same as this study) is for more government and force to 'make' things the way they should be... in his words.

I would actually welcome a societal collapse to some degree. What we have now is heartbreaking.

Danke
03-21-2014, 10:21 AM
http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?447172-NASA-Redistribute-Wealth-or-Face-Societal-Collapse&highlight=

CCTelander
03-21-2014, 10:23 AM
Society is doomed because of what society has done. Solution: society needs to increase rapidly what it's done to doom itself.

Give me a PHD and a NASA contract. Brawndo has electrolytes.


It's what plants crave!

CCTelander
03-21-2014, 10:23 AM
Society is doomed because of what society has done. Solution: society needs to increase rapidly what it's done to doom itself.

Give me a PHD and a NASA contract. Brawndo has electrolytes.


It's what plants crave!

Dr.3D
03-21-2014, 10:25 AM
My, what a lot of stuff besides space, NASA has become interested in.
http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?447242-NASA-Funded-Study-Total-collapse-of-civilization-because-quot-elites-quot-are-too-free
http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?447172-NASA-Redistribute-Wealth-or-Face-Societal-Collapse

FindLiberty
03-21-2014, 10:36 AM
Scientists speaking here about massive wealth redistribution, your PHD means nothing if you still think you know a little about everything. Go back to school and drink the Brawndo and suck eggs while learning more (and more about less and less) until you truly know everything about nothing. Then shut up

angelatc
03-21-2014, 10:39 AM
Funded, in part, by NASA.

No, the human race will not be doomed this way, if it is going to be wiped it, it will be because of a bunch of value-neutral eggheads fucking around with shifting antigen "super viruses" and fortified resurrected viruses from past plagues and pandemics, fiddle when they should have faddled.


Meh.


And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

angelatc
03-21-2014, 10:43 AM
And just exactly who do these fine scientists think is going to be in charge of redistribution?

This is just more mental masturbation because reality is quite simple; "He who has the biggest stick wins."

That seems to be a character flaw in academics. They conclude that just because their education means they're experts in a subject that they should be granted the power to enslave all of humanity all in the name of what is best.

Christopher A. Brown
03-21-2014, 10:47 AM
Methinks science cannot outrun the toxicity created by technology/industry and redrisdribution of wealth may or may not play a critical role.

It seems the reasons redistribution is accepted, or HOW it is actually done, may have a lot more to do with it than the wealth itself. Or, if the wealthiest decided to give a gift to humanity by advancing the core aspect of what a human is, that may avert what appears as inevitable from current view.

This thread is a parallel in that regard.

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?447140-Is-Our-Investment-In-Toxic-Technology-Industry-Going-To-Mutate-Us-Out-Of-Destiny-amp-Evolution&p=5462079#post5462079

mczerone
03-21-2014, 11:45 AM
"Collapse can be avoided and population can reach equilibrium if the per-capita rate of depletion of nature is reduced to a sustainable level, and if resources are distributed in a reasonably equitable fashion," they wrote.

Great news! The freed market is the only means to sustainability and equitable distribution of wealth!

Anti Federalist
03-21-2014, 11:50 AM
http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?447172-NASA-Redistribute-Wealth-or-Face-Societal-Collapse&highlight=

Damn it.