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View Full Version : Man turns in drug paraphernalia he found, gets put Federal 'Drug Lab' Watchlist




green73
03-17-2014, 12:00 PM
"If you've got nothing to hide (http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20110524/00084614407/privacy-is-not-secrecy-debunking-if-youve-got-nothing-to-hide-argument.shtml), you've got nothing to fear," right? Here's how that works in reality (http://watchdog.org/130508/dea-meth-mistake/).


On Jan. 5, 2012, Paul Valin called the police to report he'd found a backpack containing what he believed to be meth-making equipment. That simple act of good citizenship landed his and wife Cindy's house on the National Clandestine Laboratory Register [NCLR], the federal Drug Enforcement Agency's list of meth labs.

Valin spotted a backpack in a river while kayaking. He took it home and opened it up looking for some identification that might point to its owner. Instead, he found tubing and chemicals. Being a good citizen (with nothing to hide), he called local law enforcement who came and removed the backpack… and then put him on a federal list that put his house in the same category as property where drugs had been seized (you know, as opposed to voluntarily and proactively given to police officers).

cont.
https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20140307/11061626482/man-calls-cops-to-turn-drug-paraphernalia-he-found-gets-home-placed-federal-drug-lab-watchlist-2-years.shtml

Kotin
03-17-2014, 12:15 PM
Don't talk to cops. Don't call them. They will never help and they are not obligated.. Don't call someone who can kill rape and steal with impunity. It's pretty simple.

donnay
03-17-2014, 12:24 PM
Don't talk to cops. Don't call them. They will never help and they are not obligated.. Don't call someone who can kill rape and steal with impunity. It's pretty simple.

This needs to be repeated over and over again until people get it.

PRB
03-17-2014, 12:27 PM
he CLAIMS he found it, he can't prove he's never used it before and just trying to get out of trouble by pretending to be innocent and cooperative.

green73
03-17-2014, 12:32 PM
he CLAIMS he found it, he can't prove he's never used it before and just trying to get out of trouble by pretending to be innocent and cooperative.

:rolleyes:

Czolgosz
03-17-2014, 12:34 PM
LOL

Origanalist
03-17-2014, 12:57 PM
Ha ha

ZENemy
03-17-2014, 12:59 PM
he CLAIMS he found it, he can't prove he's never used it before and just trying to get out of trouble by pretending to be innocent and cooperative.

Im sorry, how does one PROVE a negative?

PRB
03-17-2014, 01:14 PM
Im sorry, how does one PROVE a negative?

There are many ways, for the purposes of this case, he can show what he was doing, where when, which would make it difficult or impossible to be in possession or use of the paraphanelia. In court, the common word we use is "alibi", it's not perfect proof, but it's better than nothing. You are not required to prove you are innocent, the government is obligated to prove you are guilty.

SeanTX
03-17-2014, 01:14 PM
Reminds me of the stories you hear of people who report child porn, thinking they are doing the right thing, then they have their computers seized and searched, the deleted files are found, and they are arrested for the very thing they were trying to report. Don't talk to the police, about anything.

donnay
03-17-2014, 01:36 PM
There are many ways, for the purposes of this case, he can show what he was doing, where when, which would make it difficult or impossible to be in possession or use of the paraphanelia. In court, the common word we use is "alibi", it's not perfect proof, but it's better than nothing. You are not required to prove you are innocent, the government is obligated to prove you are guilty.

That's laughable. The government is proving over and over that people are guilty until proven innocent.

Just look at the many cases of people who sat on death row who were innocent.

Let's add to the mix the legislation that has been enacted-- Patriot Act and NDAA.

PRB
03-17-2014, 02:58 PM
That's laughable. The government is proving over and over that people are guilty until proven innocent.

Just look at the many cases of people who sat on death row who were innocent.

Let's add to the mix the legislation that has been enacted-- Patriot Act and NDAA.

so you basically just admitted it's possible to prove one's innocence, or a negative, right?

Anti Federalist
03-17-2014, 03:07 PM
There are many ways, for the purposes of this case, he can show what he was doing, where when, which would make it difficult or impossible to be in possession or use of the paraphanelia. In court, the common word we use is "alibi", it's not perfect proof, but it's better than nothing. You are not required to prove you are innocent, the government is obligated to prove you are guilty.

There was no case.

There were no charges.

He was placed on a government "blackball" list.

Which can ruin your life.

He was stuck in a legal dead end trying to clear his name, without any legal protections afforded to a citizen who is charged.


You are not required to prove you are innocent

That is precisely what the government is insisting he do.

Anti Federalist
03-17-2014, 03:09 PM
The good news is that someone finally decided to do something about this error. Special Agent Eric Neubauer of the El Paso branch of the DEA took the Des Moines Police Dept. investigative report (which detailed the whole chain of events) provided to him by Iowa Watchdog and used that info to delist Valin's home. The DMPD still hasn't explained why the details on its internal investigative report failed to make their way onto the form sent to the DEA -- an omission that put Valin's home on a national "drug lab" watchlist for two years.

ZENemy
03-17-2014, 03:12 PM
There are many ways, for the purposes of this case, he can show what he was doing, where when, which would make it difficult or impossible to be in possession or use of the paraphanelia. In court, the common word we use is "alibi", it's not perfect proof, but it's better than nothing. You are not required to prove you are innocent, the government is obligated to prove you are guilty.

I cant tell if you are serious man, lol.

GunnyFreedom
03-17-2014, 03:20 PM
he CLAIMS he found it, he can't prove he's never used it before and just trying to get out of trouble by pretending to be innocent and cooperative.

ROFL! This is a joke, right?

Because.....there are lots of easier ways to get rid of used drug cooking equipment than to carry it to a police station. :rolleyes:

Anti Federalist
03-17-2014, 03:47 PM
ROFL! This is a joke, right?

Because.....there are lots of easier ways to get rid of used drug cooking equipment than to carry it to a police station. :rolleyes:

Pretty sure this is Josh_LA's latest incarnation.