Massive $15B Bank Run in FL & MT next; WAHOO!!

[jonahtrainer]

See what happens when title is held by someone else. Counter-party risk. There are people who are heavily invested in the monetary metals with no counter-party risk and therefore their net worth would benefit greatly from a systemic collapse. They benefit from the chaos when people yell "FIRE!!!" I hope everyone is prepared because then they have nothing to fear from such turbulence. Panic rule number one is to do it before everyone else.

"``The unthinkable and the unimaginable have just happened here in Florida,'' said Hal Wilson, chief financial officer of the Jefferson County school district, which kept its entire $2.7 million of cash in the fund. ``What we just experienced here is a classic run-on-the bank meltdown.''

Just 30 miles (48 kilometers) east of the state capitol in Tallahassee, there was no money to pay the 220 teachers and other employees in Wilson's Jefferson County school district today. Wilson said he trusted the State Board of Administration's assurances that the money was safe." Bloomberg (http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=aHR5KklFq4X0&refer=home)

Bad idea to trust government. I sure hope the lack of cashflow to the teachers doesn't cause them to be unable to pay their mortgages, credit cards, student loans and other debt that are held by the fund(s). That would be a very ugly catch-22. The perils of counter-party risk (http://goldmoney.com/en/commentary/2007-08-12.html).

In addition, silly me, I thought sweeps were subject to reserve requirement ratios. The Fed says (http://research.stlouisfed.org/aggreg/swdata.html) they are not. Learn something new everyday.

Don't get so cold your money freezes (http://www.marketwatch.com/news/story/montana-investment-fund-sees-withdrawals/story.aspx?guid={F0D0A48E-C629-411D-B67C-30AB7D5D8BA3}&siteid=yahoomy) like in the Montana state fund! The first rule of panic is to do so before everyone else does :) On the bright side GM has a book value of -$74/share.

Explaining the economic and monetary issues advocated to Ron Paul is a great "I told you so." I was predicting this would happen a year ago and explaining it to my Aunt who is a public school teacher. I also told he Ron Paul understood the issues and could help navigate us through this mess. Now I get to call her up and tell her "I told you so." I sure hope she took my advice or she might get a little hungry ....

[Johnnybags]

They'll let you spend thru the new year without causing a panic but after that all bets are off. Cash out of all paper investments and put it in a Safe Deposit Box. Who cares about the interest pittance. Gold and oil will get whacked as well. When the US Treasury has to ammend good legal contracts its because we are in trouble yet the manipulators on Wall st will try every trick to hold up a house of cards. Mtg borrowers are going to walk away anyway, the new laws make me pay credit cards before mtgs. Thanks to the credit card companies lobbying congress.

[reduen]

Could you guys please clairify what you are getting at here? I think I understand what you are saying here but not sure..

[RPFTW!]

I'm glad I just loaded up on silver.

[jonahtrainer]

Cash out of all paper investments and put it in a Safe Deposit Box.

I assume you mean a place like Das Safe in Austria. Why anyone would keep anything but de minimas assets in the US jurisdiction baffles me. Follow Jim Rogers (http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=amQBwDBSDvBE&refer=home) example. ``I'm in the process of -- I hope in the next few months -- getting all of my assets out of U.S. dollars,'' said Rogers, 65, who correctly predicted the commodities rally in 1999. ``I'm that pessimistic about what's happening in the U.S.''

Perhaps he is saying to get everything you can out of the Empire and where they can't touch it. "FIRE!!!"

[jonahtrainer]

Could you guys please clairify what you are getting at here? I think I understand what you are saying here but not sure..

A complete systemic meltdown of the entire financial assets industry in the US. BOOM!!

[Johnnybags]

I assume you mean a place like Das Safe in Austria. Why anyone would keep anything but de minimas assets in the US jurisdiction baffles me. Follow Jim Rogers (http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=amQBwDBSDvBE&refer=home) example. ``I'm in the process of -- I hope in the next few months -- getting all of my assets out of U.S. dollars,'' said Rogers, 65, who correctly predicted the commodities rally in 1999. ``I'm that pessimistic about what's happening in the U.S.''

Perhaps he is saying to get everything you can out of the Empire and where they can't touch it. "FIRE!!!"

I'll join you.

[Green Mountain Boy]

See what happens when title is held by someone else. Counter-party risk. There are people who are heavily invested in the monetary metals with no counter-party risk and therefore their net worth would benefit greatly from a systemic collapse. They benefit from the chaos when people yell "FIRE!!!" I hope everyone is prepared because then they have nothing to fear from such turbulence. Panic rule number one is to do it before everyone else.

None of us will benefit from a systematic crash.

[specsaregood]

Cash out of all paper investments and put it in a Safe Deposit Box.

If the Safe Deposit Box is IN THE BANK, you aren't gonna be getting it back if there is a run on the banks. Seriously.

[Johnnybags]

If the Safe Deposit Box is IN THE BANK, you aren't gonna be getting it back if there is a run on the banks. Seriously.

The FED annd US Treasury are wildly out of control, patching holes for Wall St instead of letting them merge and layoff people. Its all a farce now, its complete socialism. Privatize profits and socialize losses. The dollar is being propped up against the yen in complete desperation.

[Zym]

Remember, safe deposit boxes can be seized by .gov in a national emergency. Don't keep metals, currency, or valuables in there. One phone call to your financial institution and no one gets in to their boxes until .gov goes through them. I've heard they will be kind enough to leave you a receipt.

[michaelwise]

I thank God every day for the current real estate bust which is causing the credit crisis. A lot of people need to be taught a lesson. That's what you get when you get when you let private world central bankers control US monetary policy, and let them spend our country into the ground with our broken foreign policy. And that goes especially for those people who say we need to keep policing the world.

[dsentell]

If the Safe Deposit Box is IN THE BANK, you aren't gonna be getting it back if there is a run on the banks. Seriously.

For real. If there is a run on the banks, they will lock the doors and no one will get in there for any reason . . .

[RPFTW!]

Watch the price of gold and silver guys, its dropped from 845 to 780 in only a couple days, might be a good time to get in.

[Dave Wood]

I REALLY hope none of RP`s supporters are caught up in this mess!

No money to pay the bills when you least expect it, Christmas time. What is this country coming too? I hope there isnt a cascade effect from this, starting to worry about my one money.

[Johnnybags]

Watch the price of gold and silver guys, its dropped from 845 to 780 in only a couple days, might be a good time to get in.

You need to sell gainers to offset losses and leverage forces you to sell everything. Oil and gold will drop as well, then its a good time. Take advantage of those that must delever.

[Voluntaryist]

Everyone, buy silver and gold if you havent already. Dont keep any US Dollars in savings ANYWHERE.

[akovacs]

I'm glad I converted half my savings to physical gold. If the worst hits, I at least shouldn't lose my house and can survive for a while without a job, even if my account gets wiped out.

[Elwar]

I have about $50k in the military industrial complex. Symbol: SAI (http://finance.google.com/finance?client=ig&q=SAI)

[acstichter]

There are a lot of young people in this freedom movement, who don't know a whole lot about investing and money matters yet.

Can you all give advice on a first time home owner- ARM :( with a new 401K (<$10,000) and maybe a $3000 cash savings account in a bank?

THANKS

(These aren't my numbers, I'm worse off, but just as an example) ;)

[literatim]

TCash out of all paper investments and put it in a Safe Deposit Box.

Nothing in a safety deposit box is safe. When the government confiscated gold, they raided people's safety deposit boxes and took it.

[jaybone]

get on ebay and start picking up all the 90% SILVER halves and quarters you can.
check spot price at www.kitco.com,
then multiply spot price per ounce by 0.7234.
That is what a constitutional dollar is worth.

For every dollar of face value pre-1964 coins, you get .7234 oz silver

even if you only have a few $ to spend, having some widely recognised coinage in a shtf scenario will be very helpful.

[jonahtrainer]

None of us will benefit from a systematic crash.

Speak for yourself .... being a very optimistic person I hate to spread fear but I am a contrarian and make lots of money lots faster being on the other side of the bet. The bull goes up the stairs and the bear goes out the window. The free market at work :cool:


Watch the price of gold and silver guys, its dropped from 845 to 780 in only a couple days, might be a good time to get in.

Gold and Silver are the most manipulated markets in the world. Oddly the manipulation is to keep the price low (to preserve the extremely profitable fiat money monopoly) and is usually greatest during crises. Everyone needs to watch Gold Rush 21 (http://www.goldrush21.com) and read GATA's (http://www.gata.org) stuff. The central banks are still firmly in control of the gold markets but how much longer can they hold on? Realize the trend (waning CB power) it is your friend (if you have physical). The more physical you buy the less power they have. He who has the Gold makes the Rules.

I also like the Sovereign Society (http://www.sovereignsociety.com). Declare your own Independence and realize that countries are just brands like Coke or Pepsi.


For real. If there is a run on the banks, they will lock the doors and no one will get in there for any reason . . .

We are family friends with the Day's. A story we remember is from Sandra Day O'Connor's father. He sold all his cows for $100,000 (about $4M today). He took it down to the bank about 5pm. They were closed but took his deposit at the back door. The next day they went bankrupt. He received nothing and later committed suicide over it.

Right on. If any of you think 911 shocked this nation then you do not understand the psychological and traumatizing effect a bank run has on a people. Of course, being liquid and able to buy while chaos abounds is when some good deals will be found. Fractions of pennies on the dollar ...


There are a lot of young people in this freedom movement, who don't know a whole lot about investing and money matters yet.

Can you all give advice on a first time home owner- ARM :( with a new 401K (<$10,000) and maybe a $3000 cash savings account in a bank?

THANKS

If I were in that kind of a situation I would (1) convert the ARM to a fixed ASAP or (2) liquidate the home. Given my own debt averseness ('owe no man anything' Romans 3:8) I would liquidate the home. However, if there is hyperinflation it would be good to have it. But with deflation you'll get whacked.

I would next convert any debt into long-term fixed interest rate (student loans, etc.). I would cash out any 401Ks, IRAs, etc. I may keep the Roth IRA but remember Congress can and usually does change the rules. I would then purchase physical gold/silver as either legal tender bullion or through GoldMoney.com (http://www.goldmoney.com) (50/50 is my ratio). I would cut expenses as much as I could and then funnel all free cash flow into bullion.

Unfortunately, foreseeing currency controls GoldMoney will be removing its ACH links on Dec 15th. Therefore, getting money into and out of it will be a little more difficult. A few weeks ago I asked Ron Paul about currency controls and he said there was no talk of them but are used when they (government) get desperate.

Be grateful you are young (the baby boomers will have their retirement's dissipate and do not have the time to re-earn) and educated (Austrian economics).

The underlying principle is this: Remove counter-party risk and barriers between you and your assets (purchasing power). Never let greed overpower fear.

For example, foreign owned gold is being withdraw (http://www.gata.org/node/5794) from the New York branch bank of the Federal Reserve (http://federalreserve.gov/releases/bulletin/1007assets.htm).

Or, the FRN carries counter-party risk (the US/Fed) and acts as a barrier (has to be converted) to your wealth. Your FRNs deposited at a bank add an additional layer (title to the FRNs are held by the bank and you have an unsecured loan from the bank). Financial assets (stocks, mutual funds, etc.) are an additional layer (held in 'street name' by your financial institution, etc.). With the craziness of FTDs (http://www.thestreet.com/p/rmoney/investing/10279268.html) if you are going to hold financial assets I would request physical possession of the stock certificate, etc.

[acstichter]

If I were in that kind of a situation I would (1) convert the ARM to a fixed ASAP or (2) liquidate the home. Given my own debt averseness ('owe no man anything' Romans 3:8) I would liquidate the home. However, if there is hyperinflation it would be good to have it. But with deflation you'll get whacked.

I would next convert any debt into long-term fixed interest rate (student loans, etc.). I would cash out any 401Ks, IRAs, etc. I may keep the Roth IRA but remember Congress can and usually does change the rules. I would then purchase physical gold/silver as either legal tender bullion or through GoldMoney.com (http://www.goldmoney.com) (50/50 is my ratio). I would cut expenses as much as I could and then funnel all free cash flow into bullion.

Unfortunately, foreseeing currency controls GoldMoney will be removing its ACH links on Dec 15th. Therefore, getting money into and out of it will be a little more difficult. A few weeks ago I asked Ron Paul about currency controls and he said there was no talk of them but are used when they (government) get desperate.

Be grateful you are young (the baby boomers will have their retirement's dissipate and do not have the time to re-earn) and educated (Austrian economics).

The underlying principle is this: Remove counter-party risk and barriers between you and your assets (purchasing power). Never let greed overpower fear.

For example, foreign owned gold is being withdraw (http://www.gata.org/node/5794) from the New York branch bank of the Federal Reserve (http://federalreserve.gov/releases/bulletin/1007assets.htm).

Or, the FRN carries counter-party risk (the US/Fed) and acts as a barrier (has to be converted) to your wealth. Your FRNs deposited at a bank add an additional layer (title to the FRNs are held by the bank and you have an unsecured loan from the bank). Financial assets (stocks, mutual funds, etc.) are an additional layer (held in 'street name' by your financial institution, etc.). With the craziness of FTDs (http://www.thestreet.com/p/rmoney/investing/10279268.html) if you are going to hold financial assets I would request physical possession of the stock certificate, etc.

THANK YOU.

I love this forum and learn so much. Your response above is a prime example.



I would then purchase physical gold/silver as either legal tender bullion

And invest in Ron Paul 2008 of course.

[Blowback]

It is certainly a difficult situation.

401k's are tricky.. at least for me because I have very limited selections. As such I am in two international mutual funds. This is a way to get out of the dollar a little bit but by no means as good as holding overseas borkerage accounts and buying stocks directly.

I have two Roth IRA's with two different banks (hopefully to divide risk) that I have thought about liquidating but I just can't do it because my parents helped me fund them during highschool and college and until they tell me to I just don't feel right doing it. Would I liquidate if I could.. I'm not sure, tough call. You have to really believe SHTF is about to happen to do that IMO.

If I had more money I would consider opening an account with Peter Schiff at Euro Pacific Capital. Read his book Crash Proof and you'll understand why he is probably one of the few people who knows what is going on. Or I would do an overseas borkerage account or something.

With the Roth IRA money I have now I am mixed into:
Commodities (RJI, RJA, and DBA)
Two Metals Mutual Funds (Midas and USAA Precious Metals and Minerals)
BEARX - to help capture any market collapses
CDE (don't ask me why - impulse buy - but has worked out well - got into it at lower $3)
Yen ETF (small amount)
Swiss Franks ETF (small amount)

I also have some physical gold & silver and some cash in my possession. I am purchasing two firearms in near future. I have some other survival goods as well (food & water).

So this is what I have done so far. We'll just have to see what happens.

These are very sad times but if you get lucky and correctly position yourself with enough assets, you could come out a very rich person.

Another thing to think about is what sort of businesses will thrive in an environment like this. How you leverage your skills best