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View Full Version : Fatal Car Crashes Involving Pot Use Have Tripled in U.S., Study Finds / Hit Piece




Origanalist
02-10-2014, 10:12 AM
POSTED: Tuesday, February 4, 2014, 9:00 AM


TUESDAY, Feb. 4, 2014 (HealthDay News) -- The legalization of marijuana is an idea that is gaining momentum in the United States, but there may be a dark side to pot becoming more commonplace, a new study suggests.

Fatal crashes involving marijuana use tripled during the previous decade, fueling some of the overall increase in drugged-driving traffic deaths, researchers from Columbia University's Mailman School of Public Health report.

"Currently, one of nine drivers involved in fatal crashes would test positive for marijuana," said co-author Dr. Guohua Li, director of the Center for Injury Epidemiology and Prevention at Columbia. "If this trend continues, in five or six years non-alcohol drugs will overtake alcohol to become the most common substance involved in deaths related to impaired driving."

The research team drew its conclusions from crash statistics from six states that routinely perform toxicology tests on drivers involved in fatal car wrecks -- California, Hawaii, Illinois, New Hampshire, Rhode Island and West Virginia. The statistics included more than 23,500 drivers who died within one hour of a crash between 1999 and 2010.

Alcohol contributed to about the same percentage of traffic fatalities throughout the decade, about 40 percent, Li said.

But drugs played an increasingly prevalent role in fatal crashes, the researchers found. Drugged driving accounted for more than 28 percent of traffic deaths in 2010, up from more than 16 percent in 1999.

Marijuana proved to be the main drug involved in the increase, contributing to 12 percent of 2010 crashes compared with 4 percent in 1999.

The study authors also noted that the combined use of alcohol and marijuana dramatically increases a driver's risk of death.

"If a driver is under the influence of alcohol, their risk of a fatal crash is 13 times higher than the risk of the driver who is not under the influence of alcohol," Li said. "But if the driver is under the influence of both alcohol and marijuana, their risk increases to 24 times that of a sober person."

The researchers found that the increase in marijuana use occurred across all age groups and in both sexes. Their findings were published online Jan. 29 in the American Journal of Epidemiology.

Marijuana impairs driving in much the same way that alcohol does, explained Jonathan Adkins, deputy executive director of the Governors Highway Safety Association. It impairs judgment, affects vision and makes a person more distractible and more likely to take risks while driving.

"This study shows an alarming increase in driving under the influence of drugs and, in particular, it shows an increase in driving under the influence of both alcohol and drugs," said Jan Withers, national president of Mothers Against Drunk Driving.

"MADD is concerned anytime we hear about an increase in impaired driving, since it's 100 percent preventable," Withers added. "When it comes to drugged driving versus drunk driving, the substances may be different but the consequences are the same -- needless deaths and injuries."

The movement toward marijuana legalization makes the findings of this study incredibly important to traffic safety officials, Adkins noted.

"It's a wake-up call for us in highway safety," Adkins said. "The legalization of pot is going to spread to other states. It's not even a partisan issue at this point. Our expectation is this will become the norm rather than the rarity."

The problem is, marijuana and drug use before driving does not have the same stigma surrounding it as drunk driving has gained over the years, he added.
cont..

Read more at http://www.philly.com/philly/health/topics/HealthDay684515_20140204_Fatal_Car_Crashes_Involvi ng_Pot_Use_Have_Tripled_in_U_S___Study_Finds.html# doYaFyBS69vM1vRF.99

AuH20
02-10-2014, 11:57 AM
The data is likely true. Some humans who self-medicate possess the temperance of chimpanzees in heat. They will always push the envelope and consume far above the recommended dosages. But with that said, is this enough justification to ban the substance? I don't think so. Are we going to ban ownership of PDAs due to the rash of texting related accidents? Probably not. These marijuana drug detractors are using accurate facts to force an emotional response as opposed to a logical one.

pcosmar
02-10-2014, 12:07 PM
The data is likely true.

What part?


"Currently, one of nine drivers involved in fatal crashes would test positive for marijuana,"
That does not mean that they were high.. or that Pot was in any way a factor.. Only that they tested positive.
And they might have been a victim of another driver,, and not at fault at all.

I would bet that over 50% of drivers (That are not involved in accidents) would test positive for marijuana,, if you were to test the entire population.

Marijuana tests positive if you took a single hit a month ago.

Just how many people do you think actually smoke pot? I'll bet the truth is more than you think.

Ender
02-10-2014, 12:12 PM
What part?

That does not mean that they were high.. or that Pot was in any way a factor.. Only that they tested positive.
And they might have been a victim of another driver,, and not at fault at all.

I would bet that over 50% of drivers (That are not involved in accidents) would test positive for marijuana,, if you were to test the entire population.

Marijuana tests positive if you took a single hit a month ago.

Just how many people do you think actually smoke pot? I'll bet the truth is more than you think.

!000+ agreed.

erowe1
02-10-2014, 12:12 PM
The article doesn't say anything about how often marijuana was a likely contributor to the cause of the accident. The mere fact that accidents happened and people tested positive for it doesn't prove that.

ZENemy
02-10-2014, 12:17 PM
I love cars, I have built and raced a few BMW's and raced in some honda challenges.

The government has taken all my love for vehicles and thrown it out the window.

I think about getting rid of my car and my drivers license almost daily.

Without a car you get rid of MOST DMV interactions and your chances of running into a cop must go down by 80% (totally just a guess, don't ask for a source :)). Save tons of money on insurance, dmv, repairs and so on.

I live in the bay area CA, its very doable to not have a car. Ive already started driving less, maybe Ill take a big step soon.

http://www.amazon.com/s?ie=UTF8&page=1&rh=i%3Aaps%2Ck%3Aelectric%20bikes

CaseyJones
02-10-2014, 12:20 PM
Colorado marijuana legalization's impact on stoned driving unknown

http://www.denverpost.com/marijuana/ci_25101187/colorado-marijuana-legalizations-impact-stoned-driving-unknown


When a 23-year-old Arvada man crashed his pickup into the back of a Colorado State Patrol car in January, authorities said it was an example of what could be a disturbing trend: a rise in dangerous marijuana-impaired driving.

But now, a month later, the case has become an example of a different problem: the difficulty of tracking cases of stoned driving.

While a State Patrol spokeswoman said shortly after the collision that investigators suspect driver Keith Kilbey was impaired by marijuana when the crash happened, neither his official summons nor the public accident report mentions pot. A spokeswoman for the Adams County district attorney's office, which is prosecuting the case, said she couldn't comment on whether officials still contend Kilbey was stoned at the time of the crash or whether a blood test was taken. A man who answered Kilbey's telephone declined to comment.

In addition to careless driving, Kilbey has been charged with driving "under the influence of alcohol or drugs or both," according to his summons.

AuH20
02-10-2014, 12:21 PM
I'm waiting for MADD and it's concerned sponsors to cover this growing epidemic as well. Too much of any mind altering drug will have negative effects on an individual:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2555950/70-MILLION-Americans-mind-altering-drugs-shock-statistic-shows-extent-use-illegal-legal-narcotics.html

pcosmar
02-10-2014, 12:25 PM
I'm waiting for MADD and it's concerned sponsors to cover this growing epidemic as well. Too much of any mind altering drug will have negative effects on an individual:


I'm sure they will manufacture some statistics.

Just as they did with alcohol.

pcosmar
02-10-2014, 12:25 PM
Double post Glitch again..

ClydeCoulter
02-10-2014, 12:38 PM
"And Pot may have been involved" ~ the new MADD Meme on every report of an accident in the Newz

opal
02-10-2014, 02:19 PM
anyone want to take guesses on who paid for the study?

69360
02-10-2014, 02:35 PM
I don't doubt it. Dope is stronger than it used to be and used more widely.

Why is this a hit piece? You shouldn't be smoking dope and driving any more than you should be drinking and driving.

dannno
02-10-2014, 02:43 PM
The researchers found that the increase in marijuana use occurred across all age groups and in both sexes.

I guess listening to MP3 files in your car as opposed to the radio or a CD also causes more fatal accidents since the number of people listening to MP3s as opposed to the radio or CD have been involved in more fatal collisions over time.... Let's not take into account that more people are listening to MP3s as opposed to the radio or CDs.

dannno
02-10-2014, 02:45 PM
I don't doubt it. Dope is stronger than it used to be and used more widely.

Why is this a hit piece? You shouldn't be smoking dope and driving any more than you should be drinking and driving.

Actually there are far more studies that show that smoking small to moderate amounts of cannabis increases the safety of the driver and they may be involved in the same or fewer fatal accidents than sober drivers.

So small to moderate amounts of cannabis can make a person SAFER than a sober driver.

The fact that cannabis is stronger today merely means that you don't have to consume as much so it is more safe and you end up with far less smoke in your lungs.

AuH20
02-10-2014, 03:03 PM
I don't doubt it. Dope is stronger than it used to be and used more widely.

Why is this a hit piece? You shouldn't be smoking dope and driving any more than you should be drinking and driving.

I've smoked so much weed that I could barely stand up, nevermind operate heavy machinery or a vehicle. And it's because I foolishly smoked too much of it. My equilibrium was shot, along with impaired vision and motor skills.

Acala
02-10-2014, 03:11 PM
I don't doubt it. Dope is stronger than it used to be and used more widely.

Why is this a hit piece? You shouldn't be smoking dope and driving any more than you should be drinking and driving.

1. (As Pete said) Having mj metabolites in your urine says nothing about your state of intoxication. It is absolutely NOT analogous to a blood alcohol test.

2. Anyone who says that mj intoxication effects driving the same way as alcohol is either deliberately lying or is totally ignorant of both the physiological effects of the two drugs and the practical experience of the intoxication with the two drugs.

Anti Federalist
02-10-2014, 03:12 PM
One step forward and two steps back.

You people are delusional if you think this police state is just going to roll over and go away because some law was passed.

It is too far gone now, it will go away when people have had enough and push back, with force.

That and that alone is what will stop it.

And nobody has the stomach for that, so, watch and hide as it grows worse, every passing year.

Natural Citizen
02-10-2014, 03:28 PM
I've smoked so much weed that I could barely stand up, nevermind operate heavy machinery or a vehicle. And it's because I foolishly smoked too much of it. My equilibrium was shot, along with impaired vision and motor skills.


It's my understanding that regardless of how much you smoke you're only going to get so high. So then once you're high, you're as high as you're going to get. You're not going to get any higher regardless of how much of it you smoke or however you consume it. Am I wrong about that?

Origanalist
02-10-2014, 03:30 PM
It's my understanding that regardless of how much you smoke you're only going to get so high. So then once you're high, you're as high as you're going to get. You're not going to get any higher regardless of how much of it you smoke or however you consume it. Am I wrong about that?

Ya, I think you're mistaken.

dannno
02-10-2014, 03:31 PM
It's my understanding that regardless of how much you smoke you're only going to get so high. So then once you're high, you're as high as you're going to get. You're not going to get any higher regardless of how much of it you smoke or however you consume it. Am I wrong about that?

100% wrong.

That's like saying if you have a few sips of alcohol you're as buzzed as you're going to be if you have 12 shots.

The truth is most people prefer to smoke a certain amount and then will stop. If the bong or a joint is getting passed around, they may pass, or they may continue with peer pressure. In that sense it's like an alcohol buzz where a few shots feel good and get you social and energized, where too many will cause you to slur your speech, stumble, lack sexual performance and cause a hangover. There's a 'sweet spot' so to speak.

Getting really high can be fun under the right circumstances, some people like to get really high all the time. They will smoke hash in order to do so. It affects different people a little differently.

Acala
02-10-2014, 03:37 PM
From a driving perspective, I would say the most important difference is that if you are too drunk to drive, you often don't know it but if you are too high on mj to drive you know it. Also, mj does not impair your reflexes in the same way as alcohol.

AuH20
02-10-2014, 03:37 PM
100% wrong.

That's like saying if you have a few sips of alcohol you're as buzzed as you're going to be if you have 12 shots.

The truth is most people prefer to smoke a certain amount and then will stop. If the bong or a joint is getting passed around, they may pass, or they may continue with peer pressure.

Getting really high can be fun under the right circumstances, some people like to get really high all the time. They will smoke hash in order to do so. It affects different people a little differently.

Correct. I did about 8 bong hits in a test setting and I was completely destoyed. Vertigo. Destablization of Equilibrium. Impaired motor skills. Really bad shape for 5 hours. But depending on the individual's specs (size, weight, metabolism) one's resistance will vary.

Natural Citizen
02-10-2014, 04:08 PM
100% wrong.

That's like saying if you have a few sips of alcohol you're as buzzed as you're going to be if you have 12 shots.

The truth is most people prefer to smoke a certain amount and then will stop. If the bong or a joint is getting passed around, they may pass, or they may continue with peer pressure. In that sense it's like an alcohol buzz where a few shots feel good and get you social and energized, where too many will cause you to slur your speech, stumble, lack sexual performance and cause a hangover. There's a 'sweet spot' so to speak.

Getting really high can be fun under the right circumstances, some people like to get really high all the time. They will smoke hash in order to do so. It affects different people a little differently.

Yeah, that's just what I was told by a schmoker. An old dead head, so I just took his word for it.

phill4paul
02-10-2014, 04:14 PM
Legalization of weed....

1) A culling of gun rights.
2) Extra driving under influence enforcement measures.

We're winning? Pfft.

RPtotheWH
02-10-2014, 04:28 PM
Drunk people run red lights, high people stop for green lights! :p

dannno
02-10-2014, 04:33 PM
Yeah, that's just what I was told by a schmoker. An old dead head, so I just took his word for it.

Well it is a different feeling than being drunk, it sort of puts you on a different "plane" so to speak. I can sort of see where they were going with it trying to explain it that way, but smoking less is definitely not the same as smoking a lot more.

Some people build up a very heavy tolerance and can just smoke and smoke if they want to. This may be like the guy you talked to.

I've been high for about 12 years straight now and I still have a very low tolerance - even after smoking very heavily socially many years ago - one little hit of some descent herb and I'm good most of the time, but I will smoke more if I feel like getting 'higher' or if I'm smoking socially with other people.

youngbuck
02-10-2014, 05:25 PM
Why is this a hit piece? You shouldn't be smoking dope and driving any more than you should be drinking and driving. It's very simple, and has already been answered:



That does not mean that they were high.. or that Pot was in any way a factor.. Only that they tested positive.
And they might have been a victim of another driver,, and not at fault at all.

I would bet that over 50% of drivers (That are not involved in accidents) would test positive for marijuana,, if you were to test the entire population.

Marijuana tests positive if you took a single hit a month ago.




The article doesn't say anything about how often marijuana was a likely contributor to the cause of the accident. The mere fact that accidents happened and people tested positive for it doesn't prove that.

jonhowe
02-10-2014, 05:33 PM
"And Pot may have been involved" ~ the new MADD Meme on every report of an accident in the Newz

"Friends don't let friends drive within 4 weeks of smoking a joint."

phill4paul
02-10-2014, 05:46 PM
"And Pot may have been involved" ~ the new MADD Meme on every report of an accident in the Newz

Mothers against DRUGGED drivers.

Perfect.

Kotin
02-10-2014, 05:48 PM
What part?

That does not mean that they were high.. or that Pot was in any way a factor.. Only that they tested positive.
And they might have been a victim of another driver,, and not at fault at all.

I would bet that over 50% of drivers (That are not involved in accidents) would test positive for marijuana,, if you were to test the entire population.

Marijuana tests positive if you took a single hit a month ago.

Just how many people do you think actually smoke pot? I'll bet the truth is more than you think.


All this points to is the prevalence of cannabis use... Huge leap to make a correlation of any sort unless you are trying to write a hit piece.

NewRightLibertarian
02-10-2014, 06:04 PM
What part?

That does not mean that they were high.. or that Pot was in any way a factor.. Only that they tested positive.
And they might have been a victim of another driver,, and not at fault at all.

I would bet that over 50% of drivers (That are not involved in accidents) would test positive for marijuana,, if you were to test the entire population.

Marijuana tests positive if you took a single hit a month ago.

Just how many people do you think actually smoke pot? I'll bet the truth is more than you think.

Glenn Beck told Auh that people on 'the pot' are really dangerous so now he posts this type of trash in pretty much every drug war thread. It's best just to ignore his ignorant ravings on this topic.

acptulsa
02-10-2014, 06:13 PM
I love reading between the lines on these things.


"Currently, and since we started actually testing for this we've seen a full 100% increase in the number of cases where there has been a positive result, one of nine drivers involved in fatal crashes would test positive for marijuana," said co-author Dr. Guohua Li, director of the Center for Injury Epidemiology and Prevention at Columbia. "If this trend continues, in five or six years non-alcohol drugs will overtake alcohol to become the most common substance involved in deaths related to impaired driving, though of course these won't be stoners unless we start injecting the corpses with THC."

But if Xanax abusers do become more of a menace to the streets than drinkers, will Big Pharma get any of the blame? I think not.

Henry Rogue
02-10-2014, 06:23 PM
A couple of years ago there was a rash of car accidents with drivers on heroine in a large city in my state. To my knowledge heroine wasn't legal during that time period. My point is, a rise in rates may have occurred regardless of legality.

69360
02-10-2014, 06:42 PM
Actually there are far more studies that show that smoking small to moderate amounts of cannabis increases the safety of the driver and they may be involved in the same or fewer fatal accidents than sober drivers.

So small to moderate amounts of cannabis can make a person SAFER than a sober driver.

The fact that cannabis is stronger today merely means that you don't have to consume as much so it is more safe and you end up with far less smoke in your lungs.

Safer? No.

I know most could drive normally after one hit, just like they can drive normally after one drink. But drive better, no.

AuH20
02-10-2014, 07:54 PM
Glenn Beck told Auh that people on 'the pot' are really dangerous so now he posts this type of trash in pretty much every drug war thread. It's best just to ignore his ignorant ravings on this topic.

Spare me the nonsense. Too much of anything can be destructive. From Marijuana to Xanax to Cheeseburgers. It's the universal law.
Secondly, the sheer hubris exhibited to think that one can defy their biological limitations is comical to say the least. But that's human beings for you. They can rationalize illogical behavior.

AuH20
02-10-2014, 07:59 PM
I love reading between the lines on these things.



But if Xanax abusers do become more of a menace to the streets than drinkers, will Big Pharma get any of the blame? I think not.

That was my point earlier. I doubt they come after Big Pharma with similar findings. I bet you the prescription drug findings are most likely worse.

DamianTV
02-10-2014, 08:52 PM
Personal Responsibility for ones actions needs to be exercised in ALL cases, not just driving, and not just drugs. And odd how the only thing that isnt heavily promoted is that Personal Responsibility. If you use prescription medications, maybe it would be wise to consider how it affects your ability to drive. Maybe it would be just as wise to think when using Pot, Heroin, Xanax, Beer, Pain Killers and the whole damn lot regardless if Legal or Illegal. Sadly, the only thing that many people (most not on this forum) is the Freedom from that Responsibility. Sue the Drug Manufacturer, Drug Dealer, or sue the Bartender. But NEVER admit Guilt. Why? Because your Insurance Company and some Lawyers told you to NEVER admit Guilt, even to yourself.

2young2vote
02-10-2014, 10:48 PM
Safer? No.

I know most could drive normally after one hit, just like they can drive normally after one drink. But drive better, no.

I believe he is referring to the studies that show people drive slower and more cautiously while under the influence. It is interesting because someone may be less likely to cause accidents due to more cautious driving, but does that also mean a person would be less likely to avoid accidents caused by other people?



To be honest, I don't know if any of these studies can be taken as complete truth. The fact that it is still illegal to possess and grow and sell in many states seems like it would impact the results when compared to complete legalization (or atleast the equivalent of what alcohol is now). For example, someone who, in the past, maybe had only used it occasionally (a couple times a year) may be getting braver and doing it more often which could result in these higher numbers, even though the actual affect of the drug didn't negatively impact their driving. It may have more to do with chance and more consistent use than the drug itself.

pcosmar
02-10-2014, 10:50 PM
I've smoked so much weed that I could barely stand up, nevermind operate heavy machinery or a vehicle. And it's because I foolishly smoked too much of it. My equilibrium was shot, along with impaired vision and motor skills.

Bullshitd .
Pure bullshit.
I have smoked on and off since the mid 70s. It is not my habit right now,, but I would certainly like it to be.

I have smoked High grade plants from around the world. And the current Medical grade. I drive through Blizzards in white out conditions and would always prefer a buzz doing so.

I won't pick up my chainsaw after even one beer,, But will do so after smoking. It has no effect on motor skills.

AuH20
02-10-2014, 11:16 PM
Bullshitd .
Pure bullshit.
I have smoked on and off since the mid 70s. It is not my habit right now,, but I would certainly like it to be.

I have smoked High grade plants from around the world. And the current Medical grade. I drive through Blizzards in white out conditions and would always prefer a buzz doing so.

I won't pick up my chainsaw after even one beer,, But will do so after smoking. It has no effect on motor skills.

Why would I lie about such a profound experience? Note that I wasn't like was smoking something as tame as a joint. We're talking full fledged bong hits that can obliterate you rather quickly depending on the tool and blend. Now if someone takes a few tokes off a joint, they're not going to be a threat behind the wheel. However, 7 or 8 copious bong hits will render you useless. It's all relative.

pcosmar
02-10-2014, 11:34 PM
Why would I lie about such a profound experience? Note that I wasn't like was smoking something as tame as a joint. We're talking full fledged bong hits that can obliterate you rather quickly depending on the tool and blend. Now if someone takes a few tokes off a joint, they're not going to be a threat behind the wheel. However, 7 or 8 copious bong hits will render you useless. It's all relative.

Bullshit
And I have no idea why you are pushing bullshit.

I have sat down and smoked a full oz of Premium Hawaiian. ( when I was in the Army)
It was a contest with a Stoner Sgt. We rolled and smoked them back to back,, and then loaded Bowls,,because rolling them got to be a pain.
It was a draw.

But after the first full joint I never got any "higher".. we were just wasting pot.

Marijuana is not a Depressant like alcohol,, it has none of the effects of alcohol, and any comparison to alcohol is simply ridiculous.

AuH20
02-10-2014, 11:44 PM
Bullshit
And I have no idea why you are pushing bullshit.

I have sat down and smoked a full oz of Premium Hawaiian. ( when I was in the Army)
It was a contest with a Stoner Sgt. We rolled and smoked them back to back,, and then loaded Bowls,,because rolling them got to be a pain.
It was a draw.

But after the first full joint I never got any "higher".. we were just wasting pot.

Marijuana is not a Depressant like alcohol,, it has none of the effects of alcohol, and any comparison to alcohol is simply ridiculous.

We're talking high THC content (upward of 20%) as opposed to the lesser stuff of the past? What is the likely THC content of this Premium Hawaiian? Secondly, Marijuana affects the central nervous system as both a stimulant and a depressant. It's very much a hybrid substance.

kcchiefs6465
02-11-2014, 01:45 AM
We're talking high THC content (upward of 20%) as opposed to the lesser stuff of the past? What is the likely THC content of this Premium Hawaiian? Secondly, Marijuana affects the central nervous system as both a stimulant and a depressant. It's very much a hybrid substance.
You saying that shows how indoctrinated you are.

Because the University of Mississippi was growing shit (and still are, amazingly) doesn't mean cannabis became more potent. Experienced farmers knew how to cultivate sinsemilla for centuries. Acapulco gold, Maui wowie, Panama red, etc. were potent strains that many nurtured to seedlessness (that is, they encouraged the plant to produce THC throughout its life, and not only for part of it).

Furthermore, cannabis has different species. Some are "depressants" and others are "stimulants" (though not really). You are conflating different species. And I wonder if the researcher took the time to document the differences?

In any case, I drove stoned daily for a great many years smoking the best cannabis found in America, and many grams daily. A quarter ounce was a slow day. I know countless people who did the same. This is such a non-issue (aside the fact they are imprisoning and impeding/ruining the lives of thousands of people yearly) that I find it humorous how worried and nervous people become. Do you know how many people drive on something? How many people drive sleepy? How many people drive "distracted"? Stay in your house though, potheads and "criminals" are driving the speed limit. :eek:

ETA: Just for clarification, there are three species of cannabis. The "Some are "depressants" and others are "stimulants"" was referring to strains and varieties of the different species.

pcosmar
02-11-2014, 07:37 AM
We're talking high THC content (upward of 20%) as opposed to the lesser stuff of the past? What is the likely THC content of this Premium Hawaiian? Secondly, Marijuana affects the central nervous system as both a stimulant and a depressant. It's very much a hybrid substance.

SO WHAT !
And yes,, I am quite aware of what is being grown.. I knew people that were breeding plants.
Experimenting with them on Government projects years ago.

It is still nothing like Alcohol. Cannabis is not a depressant. it does not suppress the nervous system like an opiate.
It does not kill brain cells. (quite the opposite)

The only possible issue with "Smoking too much",, is a lack of oxygen in a smoke filled environment.

step out and get some air.

Anti-Neocon
02-11-2014, 07:43 AM
Linking pot use to [insert anything bad here] is not a valid argument against legalization.

pcosmar
02-11-2014, 07:57 AM
Linking pot use to [insert anything bad here] is not a valid argument against legalization.

No it is not,, and in most cases where marijuana is blamed,, (if there was any realistic investigation done) you would find other substances involved.

like someone smoking some pot and drinking themselves stupid at the same time.

kcchiefs6465
02-11-2014, 02:18 PM
No it is not,, and in most cases where marijuana is blamed,, (if there was any realistic investigation done) you would find other substances involved.

like someone smoking some pot and drinking themselves stupid at the same time.
People often forget to realize that preventing every accident is not possible. They would not be called accidents if that were the case. Only a particularly arrogant busybody could definitively assert to know that it was this and not that that caused what could be said to be the inevitable "inconveniences" (for lack of a better word) of life. They do not know how the accident would have occurred otherwise or if the accident would not have occurred otherwise. And Per se DUI states are locking up people who smoked days before. And placing blame on them for accidents. It's absurd.

My anecdotal evidence, if believe by any, would shock the average busybody. To say that there are countless people who drive stoned daily without incident would be an understatement. I fucking hate collectivists. They ruin (or attempt to ruin) everything good about life. At least I'm not too young to know that there was once a somewhat different way. At least with regards to DUI laws.

Philhelm
02-11-2014, 02:39 PM
anyone want to take guesses on who paid for the study?

Taxpayers?