Countdown to the Nationalization of Retirement Savings

[nbruno322]

"Obama's new myRA program is at best a sucker's deal… or worse, it's a first step toward the nationalization of private retirement savings."

More...

http://www.internationalman.com/78-global-perspectives/1083-countdown-to-the-nationalization-of-retirement-savings

http://www.internationalman.com/images/2014/02/140205image1.jpg

[jllundqu]

I heard this in the SOTU... This is nothing like 'nationalizing our retirement savings' It's a shitty idea, to be sure. Even in the pseudo-crony-capitalist-(not very) free market-system that we have, the private corps would never let that happen. There would literally be blood in the streets if they tried to nationalize everyone's retirement.

Wait.... Social Security...

ah dang

[nbruno322]

I heard this in the SOTU... This is nothing like 'nationalizing our retirement savings' It's a shitty idea, to be sure. Even in the pseudo-crony-capitalist-(not very) free market-system that we have, the private corps would never let that happen. There would literally be blood in the streets if they tried to nationalize everyone's retirement.

Wait.... Social Security...

ah dang

In just the past six years, it's happened in some form in Argentina, Poland, Portugal, Hungary, and numerous other countries. It would be foolish to think it couldn't happen here too.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/11/20/AR2008112003812.html

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-09-06/poland-confiscates-half-private-pension-funds-cut-sovereign-debt-load

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/financialcrisis/8932687/Portugal-raids-pension-funds-to-meet-deficit-targets.html

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-11-25/hungary-follows-argentina-in-pension-fund-ultimatum-nightmare-for-some.html

[oyarde]

In just the past six years, it's happened in some form in Argentina, Poland, Portugal, Hungary, and numerous other countries. It would be foolish to think it couldn't happen here too.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/11/20/AR2008112003812.html

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-09-06/poland-confiscates-half-private-pension-funds-cut-sovereign-debt-loadhttp://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/financialcrisis/8932687/Portugal-raids-pension-funds-to-meet-deficit-targets.html

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-11-25/hungary-follows-argentina-in-pension-fund-ultimatum-nightmare-for-some.html
If the Dems had the house , someone would have a bill now .

[Sonny Tufts]

People forget that the government is already heavily involved in their retirement savings, since almost all retirement plans must comply with the Internal Revenue Code and ERISA in order to get favorable tax-deferral teatment.

[Origanalist]

Do it for the Homeland comrads! Don't be unpatriotic.

https://encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRSe-KjmcNYfX9Xh2Z4LoOBwOJ9qo6xYQu5P4vN7jc_kAXzhF3HEg

[Acala]

People forget that the government is already heavily involved in their retirement savings, since almost all retirement plans must comply with the Internal Revenue Code and ERISA in order to get favorable tax-deferral teatment.

A stroke of the pen is all that lies between the infinitely avaricious government and any money held in "trust" by a financial institution.


When the government says a certain percentage of 401k funds must be invested in government bonds the banks will say "how much and when?"

[nbruno322]

A stroke of the pen is all that lies between the infinitely avaricious government and any money held in "trust" by a financial institution.


When the government says a certain percentage of 401k funds must be invested in government bonds the banks will say "how much and when?"

+1 for truth.

[Zippyjuan]

Actually it is a plan to increase buyers of government debt.

[Lucille]

Why don't you RTFA for once, Jeffry? Everyone knows that, and the article states that, but it also says it's a "first step."

Top story on ZH: http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-02-05/countdown-nationalization-retirement-savings-has-begun

http://www.americanthinker.com/cartoons/assets_c/2013/02/401LowHanging2WebCR-2_5_13-thumb-600xauto-2490.jpg

[Zippyjuan]

So you expect the government to seize government debt (since that is what would be in the accounts)? What would that gain them? Default would be simpler.

[ZENemy]

Actually it is a plan to increase buyers of government debt.

Yes, its a plan to get people to buy UNWANTED debt. Its unwanted for a reason.

[Lucille]

So you expect the government to seize government debt (since that is what would be in the accounts)? What would that gain them? Default would be simpler.

LOL (http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/quotes/a/abrahamlin109276.html) Actually, no. And you still haven't bothered to read it. There's a shocker.

[Anti Federalist]

And people look at me like I got lobsters crawling out of my ears when I say I don't participate in the 401k system at work.

[LibertyEagle]

If the Dems had the house , someone would have a bill now .

There is a bill. I saw it posted on here yesterday.

[nbruno322]

There is a bill. I saw it posted on here yesterday.

Can you link to the bill?

I am very curious to see it...

[Lucille]

Can you link to the bill?

I am very curious to see it...

Here's the post: http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?443156-Legislation-Says-American-Businesses-Must-Offer-Pension-Retirement-Plan

[nobody's_hero]

So you expect the government to seize government debt (since that is what would be in the accounts)? What would that gain them? Default would be simpler.

FYI, our currency, Federal Reserve notes, are created from debt, and that doesn't stop the IRS from trying to get back as many FRNs as they can each year in April.

[nobody's_hero]

And people look at me like I got lobsters crawling out of my ears when I say I don't participate in the 401k system at work.

I don't either. When we have speakers come in and talk 'retirement' I just hear blah blah blah. Look at all the old folks who have to find jobs after retirement. If true 'retirement' isn't a reality for them in 2014, it sure as f**k won't be a reality for me in 4 more decades. 401k's in my opinion are just ways for people to get your money today and disappear with it tomorrow.

[AuH20]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mbL8hl3hEG4#t=105

[Red Green]

Hey, remember 9/11 folks... if you don't buy the govt IOU, the terrorists win. Just think about that for a moment.... 3,500 people lost their lives and you don't care because you can't be bothered to surrender your retirement account.

[Zippyjuan]

Yes, its a plan to get people to buy UNWANTED debt. Its unwanted for a reason.

Let me elaborate. If these accounts are created, they will be set up to buy US Treasaury notes. US Treasury notes are US debt. When you buy a Treasury, you are loaning the government money to pay their bills. They get your money when you make the purchase and the note is a promise to pay you back later. So what would happen if they "seize" the accounts? They take back their debt notes. But they don't get one penny more than they already have. All they are doing is saying they aren't going to pay you back for the money they borrowed. Does that benefit them?

Say you loan me $100 and give me an IOU. Then later you demand the IOU back. But you haven't paid back the money. When you take the IOU, you don't have any more money than you did in the first place (my $100). You are just saying you aren't going to pay me back. Then nobody else will be willing to loan you money either.

If the government did seize those Treasury Notes, they would be saying they aren't going to pay their debts and the Treasury notes would become worthless (including those not in the accounts taken). It would be nearly impossible for them to raise any more debt in the future (without exorbanant interest rates) which would put them in an even worse position than they were before seizing any accounts. They would not have any more money and would not be able to borrow any more money in the future.

[ZENemy]

Let me elaborate. If these accounts are created, they will be set up to buy US Treasaury notes. US Treasury notes are US debt. When you buy a Treasury, you are loaning the government money to pay their bills. They get your money when you make the purchase and the note is a promise to pay you back later. So what would happen if they "seize" the accounts? They take back their debt notes. But they don't get one penny more than they already have. All they are doing is saying they aren't going to pay you back for the money they borrowed. Does that benefit them?

Say you loan me $100 and give me an IOU. Then later you demand the IOU back. But you haven't paid back the money. When you take the IOU, you don't have any more money than you did in the first place (my $100). You are just saying you aren't going to pay me back. Then nobody else will be willing to loan you money either.

If the government did seize those Treasury Notes, they would be saying they aren't going to pay their debts and the Treasury notes would become worthless (including those not in the accounts taken). It would be nearly impossible for them to raise any more debt in the future (without exorbanant interest rates) which would put them in an even worse position than they were before seizing any accounts. They would not have any more money and would not be able to borrow any more money in the future.

Is there anything you are NOT the expert on?

The DEBT is unwanted, this is a ploy to get idiots to buy gold plated dirt.

[Anti Federalist]

I don't either. When we have speakers come in and talk 'retirement' I just hear blah blah blah. Look at all the old folks who have to find jobs after retirement. If true 'retirement' isn't a reality for them in 2014, it sure as f**k won't be a reality for me in 4 more decades. 401k's in my opinion are just ways for people to get your money today and disappear with it tomorrow.

I'm a lot older, and I have no illusions about working until I'm dead.

Sure, you leave some FRNs on the table, but it's a suckers bet that they will be there later if you scoop them up now.

The little pissant matching funds and tax deferments aren't worth it to me, I'll take the cash now, put it in PMs for savings and eliminate debt so my family wont have debt to worry about when I croak.

[Zippyjuan]

Is there anything you are NOT the expert on?

The DEBT is unwanted, this is a ploy to get idiots to buy gold plated dirt.

Yes, I agree it to get more people to buy US debt so they don't have to rely as much on China or the Fed buying it. Some have said that Japan is in better shape since most of its debt is held by its own citizens rather than foreigners.

"The US doesn't save enough"
"Too much US debt in the hands of foreigners"

This plan would help with those two issues. (does nothing to address the problem of too much debt in the first place though).

[Acala]

Let me elaborate. If these accounts are created, they will be set up to buy US Treasaury notes. US Treasury notes are US debt. When you buy a Treasury, you are loaning the government money to pay their bills. They get your money when you make the purchase and the note is a promise to pay you back later. So what would happen if they "seize" the accounts? They take back their debt notes. But they don't get one penny more than they already have. All they are doing is saying they aren't going to pay you back for the money they borrowed. Does that benefit them?

Say you loan me $100 and give me an IOU. Then later you demand the IOU back. But you haven't paid back the money. When you take the IOU, you don't have any more money than you did in the first place (my $100). You are just saying you aren't going to pay me back. Then nobody else will be willing to loan you money either.

If the government did seize those Treasury Notes, they would be saying they aren't going to pay their debts and the Treasury notes would become worthless (including those not in the accounts taken). It would be nearly impossible for them to raise any more debt in the future (without exorbanant interest rates) which would put them in an even worse position than they were before seizing any accounts. They would not have any more money and would not be able to borrow any more money in the future.

They will seize the accounts by forcing all the funds into US bonds and then they will default on the bonds, either directly by refusing to pay or through inflation. In this way the people's retirment savings will be stolen and handed over to the crony-capitalists.

[Danke]

http://news.goldworth.com/breaking-news/

[HOLLYWOOD]

Just remember this...

When the government controls all of your money,, they control you. 2008 should of been a wake up call, since you witnessed the "Scrimage Game" with all the government employee retirement funds, bailouts, money printing, debt, ARRA, TARP, and what it truly did to savings and bailed out government e.g., CalPERS, FERS, etc. If people know their retirement money is in jeopardy of collapsing, they will be crying on the phones to Washington DC/Manhattan to do whatever to save their morsels. It will always be TBTF...

You have been warned... now back to the visionary, 'Classic Carlin':


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sJeFrqBJF6E

[Lucille]

http://kingworldnews.com/exposed-dangerous-2015-ahead-global-governments-plan-steal-money/


December 29 (King World News) – In mid-December, the U.S. Treasury finalized the rules for what looks like a fairly innocuous addition to the retirement plan menu, the so-called “myRA”. We say “finalized” with a wink as we all know that what has been promulgated is simply the proverbial camel nose under the tent. It looks benign and even positive, but the program clearly has the agenda of redirecting the retirement savings away from the current IRAs and other plans enjoyed as the primary savings vehicle for most Americans.

The target has to be the near $20 trillion of retirement assets in the United States. The final incarnation of this retirement model will most likely be adopted globally by other governments, so those living outside of the U.S. should pay heed as well.
[...]
The myRA regulations proposed by the Treasury call for participants to invest in a “non-marketable, electronic savings bond,” only available to participants in the myRA program. The bond pays virtually no income and is completely illiquid. The program is being billed as “no cost to the employer” and a “no-fee option” for the employee.

Just Another Looting & Other Global Governments To Follow

One of the odd features is that there is a lifetime cap of $15,000. If the balance exceeds that, the account has to be moved to another retirement plan. We can be assured that the cap will be removed once the program is universally adopted. The government needs the money. What could be better…a perpetual loan at no interest? It is also likely that the accounts will not be capable of being inherited like existing IRAs. The balance would just disappear at death.

We can understand the no-fee attribute, but all wage earners and employers should be afraid. The intention of the program will no doubt be to replace the existing array of retirement options, perhaps even forcing retirees down the road to convert existing accumulations into the program. This new model will be served up as being a favor and a benefit. In truth, it will be just another looting.

For a bankrupt government with obligations too massive to pay, the pool of nearly $20 trillion of retirement savings is too juicy not to make a run at it. As we have seen with health care, the elites believe that the average citizen is too stupid to make the right choices for their families. The same will be true on the path to retirement confiscations because only the governments and their crony financial institutions will be allowed to make the investment decisions. This control will serve to facilitate the theft, and you can be assured other global governments will follow the U.S. model of confiscation.

[DamianTV]

Ever deceptively and manipulatively creative ways to separate you from your money.

Things are in the process of changing so that even your Checking Account is not considered your money, it is considered an "Investment", thus, if the Bank for some reason is unable to return your "Investment", they tell you "so sad too bad" because they've already spent your money. You dont own your home, you pay the Govt "rent" (taxes) for the Permission granted by the Govt to live in that which the Govt owns. You dont own your Labor. Income Tax. You dont inherit from deceased relatives; that belongs to the Govt, and they demand that unless you give them some of that inheritance, they will take ALL. It will eventually expand to the complete and total end of Private Property as well as Ownership of Self.