illegal immigrant kills 2 kids in a hit and run, gets 3yr probation and 250h community service

[aGameOfThrones]

PORTLAND, Ore. (AP) — A 19-year-old Oregon woman who drove an SUV into a leaf pile, accidentally killing two young girls playing in it, has been taken into federal custody and may face deportation.

U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement said on Monday that Cinthya Garcia-Cisneros is being placed in removal proceedings and will be held at a detention center in Tacoma while she awaits a bond hearing before an immigration judge.

Garcia-Cisneros was sentenced to three years of probation and 250 hours of community service on Friday. A jury found the woman guilty of two counts of felony hit-and-run earlier this month.

Prosecutors said the crash on Oct. 20 in Forest Grove, 25 miles west of Portland, was an accident. But they say the teen failed to come forward after learning she might have struck the children in the leaf pile, which was on the street. Police found her the following day.

Authorities said the two girls — later identified as stepsisters, 6-year-old Anna Dieter-Eckerdt and 11-year-old Abigail Robinson — were likely concealed by the leaves and not visible to Garcia-Cisneros.

Minutes after Garcia-Cisneros drove through the leaves on her way home, her brother returned to the scene and saw a man standing over the pile, screaming. The man spoke to him briefly.

The boy went home and told his sister she may have hit two children.

Defense attorney Ethan Levi said Garcia-Cisneros was in a state of shock and denial after learning of the children and fixated on the possibility she wasn't the driver who struck them.

Garcia-Cisneros was brought to the U.S. from Mexico as a 4-year-old. She has temporary permission to be in the country legally under the federal Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals program, meaning she has a work permit and a Social Security number.

To be eligible for the program, immigrants must prove they arrived in the United States before they turned 16, are under 31 years of age as of June 15, 2012, have been living in the country at least five years, are in school or graduated, and have not been convicted of certain crimes.

Those convicted of a felony offense and some other crimes are generally not eligible for the program.

It's unclear whether Garcia-Cisneros may be eligible for any other immigration benefits that could lead to relief from deportation. Immigration attorney Courtney Carter, who represents the teen, was not available for a comment.



Comment from the site:


Koolaid 6 hours ago 1 110
Typical Yahoo story with much left out:

1st part left out - That brother that went back to look and found out the girls were dead? He was in the car along with her boyfriend when she hit and killed those kids.

2nd part left out - Instead of going to the police they went out for ICE CREAM!

3rd part left out -- The next day, Garcia-Cisneros and her boyfriend ran errands in the SUV. Her boyfriend took the vehicle through a carwash to eliminate evidence.

And the 4th part left out was how they caught her (this is the same girl that by the Yahoo story never even knew she hit them) --- Police linked her to the crash through a tip from her neighbor, who spotted her sobbing and examining an SUV outside her house that night. Detectives tracked her down and interviewed her at her boyfriend’s house the next day. On Oct. 22, officers arrested her and her boyfriend, 18-year-old Mario Echeverria.

Now wasn't there someone on here claiming the right-wing racist trolls were out?

http://news.yahoo.com/immigration-detention-teen-leaf-pile-deaths-015307340.html

[AuH20]

Go to Mexico and try to do this. You probably won't see your loved ones for 30 years if you can survive the prison sentence.

[Snew]

Sad. :( R.I.P. to the girls.

[alucard13mm]

This surely, will stir up more racial tension... Mexican running over 2 american girls, possibly little white girls.

I am surprised they didn't list the girl's race to stir up drama.

[rpfocus]

Sad. :( R.I.P. to the girls.

Yup just sad. And she should be deported immediately.

[erowe1]

Terrible.

But why is it relevant if she was an illegal immigrant?

[Deborah K]

Yup just sad. And she should be deported immediately.


That doesn't work. She can just sneak back over. The Mexican Federallies won't do anything about her. About 7 years ago, my husband's hair-cutter was killed in a head-on collision by a drunk illegal alien. He was in a company truck. It was his 5th DUI offense, and he was repeatedly deported. Amy's mother became an activist over it and they finally convicted the a-hole to a 25 year prison term. It was the main reason Mark and I became Minutemen. The whole illegal immigration thing is a f'kd up mess.

[LibertyEagle]

This surely, will stir up more racial tension... Mexican running over 2 american girls, possibly little white girls.

I am surprised they didn't list the girl's race to stir up drama.

It's not funny at all. This kind of crap happens in Austin, Texas, where I live quite frequently. It may not be children, but it's illegal aliens crashing into people and of course, they have no insurance and there is no recourse. Or, they shoot someone, or rob someone... the list goes on. But, of course, Austin is a "sanctuary city", so you have to dig to find out they are illegal aliens.

[LibertyEagle]

Terrible.

But why is it relevant if she was an illegal immigrant?

Because if our immigration laws were being enforced, it wouldn't have happened and the little girls would be alive?

[squarepusher]

Sensationalized title, article states it was an accident and the kids were in the road hiding in leaves. Where are these kids parents?

[AuH20]

It's not funny at all. This kind of crap happens in Austin, Texas, where I live quite frequently. It may not be children, but it's illegal aliens crashing into people and of course, they have no insurance and there is no recourse. Or, they shoot someone, or rob someone... the list goes on. But, of course, Austin is a "sanctuary city", so you have to dig to find out they are illegal aliens.

A similar incident happened in Denver. A drunk illegal alien, with a list of prior infractions as long as my arm, crashed into an outdoor ice cream parlor killing 2 in the middle of the day. The rules only apply to the mundane. If you're an illegal alien, you can commit x number of crimes & your mileage will probably vary for the better.

[erowe1]

Because if our immigration laws were being enforced, it wouldn't have happened and the little girls would be alive?

That's ridiculous. Citizens can just as easily do this kind of thing as illegal immigrants.

You might as well have a headline, "Person Whose Mom Didn't Abort Them Kills Two Kids in a Hit and Run," and try to use that as an argument for more abortions.

[squarepusher]

A similar incident happened in Denver. A drunk illegal alien, with a list of prior infractions as long as my arm, crashed into an outdoor ice cream parlor killing 2 in the middle of the day. The rules only apply to the mundane. If you're an illegal alien, you can commit x number of crimes & your mileage will probably vary for the better.
or rich, right?

[Deborah K]

That's ridiculous. Citizens can just as easily do this kind of thing as illegal immigrants.

You might as well have a headline, "Person Whose Mom Didn't Abort Them Kills Two Kids in a Hit and Run," and try to use that as an argument for more abortions.

Are you an open borders advocate?

[AuH20]

That's ridiculous. Citizens can just as easily do this kind of thing as illegal immigrants.

You might as well have a headline, "Person Whose Mom Didn't Abort Them Kills Two Kids in a Hit and Run," and try to use that as an argument for more abortions.

Citizens will have SWAT teams at their door for unpaid parking tickets. Illegals get the carte blanche treatment since they are deemed a protected class by the political establlishment. I think that's the issue.

[Ender]

Sensationalized title, article states it was an accident and the kids were in the road hiding in leaves. Where are these kids parents?

Very misleading title.

The driver didn't even know she hit the kids- so what's with the "hit & run" baloney.

She is also not an "illegal alien".


Garcia-Cisneros was brought to the U.S. from Mexico as a 4-year-old. She has temporary permission to be in the country legally under the federal Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals program, meaning she has a work permit and a Social Security number.

If she ran over the girls and had no idea that an tragedy had even happened, then she is innocent of wrong-doing.

[erowe1]

Are you an open borders advocate?

Yes.

[AuH20]

or rich, right?

Yes, rich or connected as well. Remember the 'Affluenza' teen in Texas who was given probation after killing 4 in a vehicular homicide?

[erowe1]

Citizens will have SWAT teams at their door for unpaid parking tickets. Illegals get the carte blanche treatment since they are deemed a protected class by the political establlishment. I think that's the issue.

How can that be the issue? This story is about an illegal immigrant who was caught, tried, and sentenced, by a jury, just like any citizen would have been.

[aGameOfThrones]

Sensationalized title, article states it was an accident and the kids were in the road hiding in leaves. Where are these kids parents?

Did you read the comment from the site? She's an illegal immigrant, who killed 2 kids, who was sentenced to 3 years probation and 250 hours of community service.

[erowe1]

Did you read the comment from the site? She's an illegal immigrant, who killed 2 kids, who was sentenced to 3 years probation and 250 hours of community service.

What are you implying, that the sentence was too lenient?

[AuH20]

What are you implying, that the sentence was too lenient?

Imagine if you or I "mistakenly" ran over 2 children of illegal alien parents? Do you think that we'd be getting 3 years of probation? We may also be facing 'hate crime' charges depending on what the prosecution with the fed gov's help, could assemble retroactively from our cyber 'footprint'. Lady Justice in the land of the free isn't impartial I'm sorry to say. That bitch has a nefarious agenda.

[aGameOfThrones]

What are you implying, that the sentence was too lenient?

My comment was regarding the Title thread.

And if this is what happened, then yes.


1st part left out - That brother that went back to look and found out the girls were dead? He was in the car along with her boyfriend when she hit and killed those kids.

2nd part left out - Instead of going to the police they went out for ICE CREAM!

3rd part left out -- The next day, Garcia-Cisneros and her boyfriend ran errands in the SUV. Her boyfriend took the vehicle through a carwash to eliminate evidence.

And the 4th part left out was how they caught her (this is the same girl that by the Yahoo story never even knew she hit them) --- Police linked her to the crash through a tip from her neighbor, who spotted her sobbing and examining an SUV outside her house that night. Detectives tracked her down and interviewed her at her boyfriend’s house the next day. On Oct. 22, officers arrested her and her boyfriend, 18-year-old Mario Echeverria.

[erowe1]

My comment was regarding the Title thread.

And if this is what happened, then yes.

Those comments are pretty damning. But they're also not the whole story, if they're even true. And it looks to me like the entire reason for the sentence being as harsh as it was is because of the hit-and-run aspect. The initial act of running over the pile of leaves that killed those two kids is one that I doubt would have been prosecuted as a crime at all if she had stopped the car to see what she hit. It would have been a careless driving or something like that, with terrible consequences that would last for the rest of the lives of the victims' families and the ones who did it. It's the things mentioned in that comment that make it look like the person who did it ought to get a worse punishment. And 3 years probation plus 250 hours of community service is nothing I'd want to get handed to me. I highly doubt that it would have been a worse sentence if she had been a citizen like AuH2O is suggesting.

[NIU Students for Liberty]

In other news:

"So-called limited government advocates want to steal my money in order to dictate who I can and cannot interact with."

[RandallFan]

She hired this guy to cover up the killing of two girls. She worked a movie theater. She wasn't working on a farm


In December, Echeverria was found guilty of hindering prosecution and is currently serving a 13-month sentence.
Despite his prior conviction for first-degree sodomy, the illegal alien was allowed to remain in this country.

http://www.examiner.com/article/illegal-alien-who-killed-two-children-may-not-be-deported

[Brian4Liberty]

If she ran over the girls and had no idea that an tragedy had even happened, then she is innocent of wrong-doing.

It seems like the charges are based on hit and run and covering up. If she had stopped or come back, she may not have faced any charges. It sounds like they realized they ran over somebody (why go back and look?), so it's pretty much hit and run.

[Philhelm]

She is also not an "illegal alien".

That's not entirely true, as the Deferred Action For Childhood Arrivals (DACA) does not grant lawful immigration status within the U.S., and it does not confer a pathway toward Permanent Resident Status or U.S. citizenship.

Having said that, the idea of "sending her back" is ridiculous as she has lived within the United States since she was four. It's not her fault that her parents broke the law when bringing her into the United States.

[Philhelm]

Sensationalized title, article states it was an accident and the kids were in the road hiding in leaves. Where are these kids parents?

Not in the leaves?

[LibertyEagle]

That's ridiculous. Citizens can just as easily do this kind of thing as illegal immigrants.

You might as well have a headline, "Person Whose Mom Didn't Abort Them Kills Two Kids in a Hit and Run," and try to use that as an argument for more abortions.

Sure, but they WEREN'T citizens, were they? No, they weren't. These particular deaths would not have occurred had the CRIMMIGRANTS not been in our country.

[fisharmor]

Imagine if you or I "mistakenly" ran over 2 children of illegal alien parents? Do you think that we'd be getting 3 years of probation? We may also be facing 'hate crime' charges depending on what the prosecution with the fed gov's help, could assemble retroactively from our cyber 'footprint'. Lady Justice in the land of the free isn't impartial I'm sorry to say. That bitch has a nefarious agenda.

What I don't get is how you complain about how broken the legal system is, you admit that it's singling out a class of people for particular benefit, and then your answer is to try to whip up public support for vilifying that group.

Do you and LE and Deborah not see that the problem is that the legal system in this country is largely nonfunctional?
What's it take to convince you all that there's a root cause for these problems, and a root solution?
If you're all so pissed about it, why spend so much time nibbling at the edges?

[LibForestPaul]

A similar incident happened in Denver. A drunk illegal alien, with a list of prior infractions as long as my arm, crashed into an outdoor ice cream parlor killing 2 in the middle of the day. The rules only apply to the mundane. If you're an illegal alien, you can commit x number of crimes & your mileage will probably vary for the better.

Serious question. Can one decide to be an illegal? If one has no papers,what stops one from being (JAJ) just another Jose? What stops one from being two or three JoseS? And collect all the government cheese accordingly?

[Brian4Liberty]

I fail to see how immigration status is relevant to this tragic accident.

[Weston White]

The driver didn't even know she hit the kids- so what's with the "hit & run" baloney.

1. If that leave pile was large enough to actually hide two children from view, why did she drive over it in the first place? As a public driver it is irresponsible and negligent to drive over avoidable roadway obstructions.

2. If you drive over one solid object—let alone two solid objects—you instantly know about it, you can feel the resulting impact and recoil, and then repositioning of your vehicle.

3. A traffic collision where one party leaves the scene without first exchanging information or reporting it to law enforcement without, as applicable, is legally a hit-and-run collision.

4. Now “after Garcia-Cisneros drove through the leaves on her way home, her brother returned to the scene and saw a man standing over the pile”, why in the world would he have bothered doing that?

5. The driver was found guilty of criminal wrongdoing, though apparently justice was not served with its mere slapping of her wrists (i.e., “A jury found the woman guilty of two counts of felony hit-and-run”).



She is also not an "illegal alien".

Actually, she was until right around 9/15/2012 (with the accident taking place just one year later on October 20th), so yes, thank you Mr. Soetoro for your many great and prospering contributions of public kindness!

“On June 15, 2012, President Obama signed a memo calling for deferred action for certain undocumented young people who came to the U.S. as children and have pursued education or military service here. Applications under the program which is called Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals (“DACA”) begin on August 15, 2012.”

But then as the story further clarified: “Those convicted of a felony offense and some other crimes are generally not eligible for the program.”

Which means that she should lose that status and hence she is again found to be here illegally. (While also questioning if she even qualified for the program to begin with, i.e., is she even pursuing education or military service?) …But don’t worry Soetoro and Crew is surely working to tape off such little loopholes.



If she ran over the girls and had no idea that an tragedy had even happened, then she is innocent of wrong-doing.

Well… That is until she was made aware of what transpired a few hours later and she and her occupants started putting two-and-two together and still failed to come forward to alert the proper authorities, rather instead opting to conceal the now misdeed they were all involved in (i.e., “the teen failed to come forward after learning she might have struck the children in the leaf pile”).

[Weston White]

That's ridiculous. Citizens can just as easily do this kind of thing as illegal immigrants.

You might as well have a headline, "Person Whose Mom Didn't Abort Them Kills Two Kids in a Hit and Run," and try to use that as an argument for more abortions.

That is absolutely crude. Is your brain broken?

[LibertyEagle]

Do you and LE and Deborah not see that the problem is that the legal system in this country is largely nonfunctional?
What's it take to convince you all that there's a root cause for these problems, and a root solution?
If you're all so pissed about it, why spend so much time nibbling at the edges?

If someone broke into my house to rob me blind, my first concern wouldn't be to figure out what had happened in his life to make him want to do this. It would be to get him the hell out of my house.

This wouldn't preclude me from continuing the effort to get NAFTA, CAFTA, etc. thrown out, the FED audited, our government back under the Constitution and real capitalism in place.

Some of us can walk and chew gum at the same time.

[Feeding the Abscess]

If someone broke into my house to rob me blind, my first concern wouldn't be to figure out what had happened in his life to make him want to do this. It would be to get him the hell out of my house.


real capitalism in place.

You're promoting collective ownership (socialism), then talking about 'real capitalism' in the next thought.

You can have one, but you can't have both.

[green73]

//

[fisharmor]

If someone broke into my house to rob me blind, my first concern wouldn't be to figure out what had happened in his life to make him want to do this. It would be to get him the hell out of my house.

This wouldn't preclude me from continuing the effort to get NAFTA, CAFTA, etc. thrown out, the FED audited, our government back under the Constitution and real capitalism in place.

Some of us can walk and chew gum at the same time.

Can you add some coherency to that response? I'm not at all sure what you're trying to say there or why it's at all relevant to what I wrote.

[Weston White]

Serious question. Can one decide to be an illegal? If one has no papers,what stops one from being (JAJ) just another Jose? What stops one from being two or three JoseS? And collect all the government cheese accordingly?

The short answer, yes, simply by using easily obtainable stolen identities, they can moniker themselves over and over and over and over, and there is nobody willing to stop the majority of them.

For example (thanks to Bush and Soetoro working together to further screw over Americans), the IRS knowingly pays out over $4.2 billion each year to illegal immigrants, largely as part of a fraudulent child tax credit refund scam.

[Weston White]

//

I think that all was initially kicked off by the Spanish Conquistadors, and then Tories paid Indians to attack those fighting against the Crown for their independence, followed by Americans fighting or selling them out over claims of expanding territory.

But I think that the majority of Americans do care—while being raised to remain indifferent as to the predicament of the modern day Indian—but that their own government views Indians as expendable tools, just as they do to its own citizens; oh the irony.

[puppetmaster]

Very misleading title.

The driver didn't even know she hit the kids- so what's with the "hit & run" baloney.

She is also not an "illegal alien".



If she ran over the girls and had no idea that an tragedy had even happened, then she is innocent of wrong-doing.

she did know....do more research

[Weston White]

I fail to see how immigration status is relevant to this tragic accident.

It is indicative of the increasing problems facing Americans with regard to the resulting sprawl of illegal immigration.

Incidents such as this serve to exemplify the total disrespect or lack of regard for American justice by those coming from or raised under such a wayward evolved culture.

For the average illegal alien, they are born under a vastly more simplistic way of life, coming to America suddenly everything becomes vastly more complex. The resulting effect is wholly incompatible and its causation is made readily apparent in the steadily increasing stream of such events.

[fisharmor]

Incidents such as this serve to exemplify the total disrespect or lack of regard for American justice by those coming from or raised under such a wayward evolved culture.
I was born here, raised here, and I have spent little time anywhere else, and I have nothing but contempt for American "justice". Where does that leave us?


For the average illegal alien, they are born under a vastly more simplistic way of life, coming to America suddenly everything becomes vastly more complex. The resulting effect is wholly incompatible and its causation is made readily apparent in the steadily increasing stream of such events.
You do realize that the rest of the world has flush toilets, right? I mean, I know I just said I haven't spent much time elsewhere, but I've met scores of people from other parts of the Earth in the last decade, and they tell me that they're pretty comfortable with the idea of washing their hands before meals. Some of them can even do arithmetic!

[jclay2]

This is uneffing believable. If I had done this as a mundane citizen, I would be in prison for a minimum of 10 -15 years. The woman tried to cover up a hit and run. How sick can you be to do such a thing? 3 years and 7 weeks of community service is absurd. This lady should be placed in prison for a long time and deported.

[Philhelm]

Which means that she should lose that status and hence she is again found to be here illegally. (While also questioning if she even qualified for the program to begin with, i.e., is she even pursuing education or military service?)

Evidence of current enrollment or completion of high school would suffice.

[Weston White]

I was born here, raised here, and I have spent little time anywhere else, and I have nothing but contempt for American "justice". Where does that leave us?

The issues that are central to this pertain to much more than possessing simple contempt towards America’s system of governance.


You do realize that the rest of the world has flush toilets, right? I mean, I know I just said I haven't spent much time elsewhere, but I've met scores of people from other parts of the Earth in the last decade, and they tell me that they're pretty comfortable with the idea of washing their hands before meals. Some of them can even do arithmetic!

Again the concern involves much more than just having access to modern utilities, however to note:

Concerning Mexico for example, from 1996 figures:

1/4 of Mexicans earned less that $2 a day.
12% of Mexican households were without electricity
11% lacked running water
26% were without sewer facilities

Since then, using 2010 figures:

Water supply into urban has increased to 93% and 74% within rural areas (however, for 55% of Mexicans they receive water only intermittently); modern sanitation has increased to 64% (of which 80% is within in urban area and only 16% in rural areas. Mexico’s urban population accounts for 78% and its rural population for 22% of its total populace.

[erowe1]

That is absolutely crude. Is your brain broken?

When people try to excuse the evil of deporting illegal immigrants on the grounds that it would have prevented some bad thing that some illegal immigrant did, that's the kind of logic they're using. It's ridiculous.

[erowe1]

This is uneffing believable. If I had done this as a mundane citizen, I would be in prison for a minimum of 10 -15 years.

No you wouldn't. There is absolutely no reason to believe that her sentence was different than anyone else's would have been.

[erowe1]

The issues that are central to this pertain to much more than possessing simple contempt towards America’s system of governance.


But contempt towards America's system of governance is still a good and commendable thing. Right?

[Weston White]

No you wouldn't. There is absolutely no reason to believe that her sentence was different than anyone else's would have been.

Not really, varying state statutes call for anywhere from $1,000-$10,000 in fines and/or at least 90-days to 1-15-years in jail, the former for a "wobble" to misdemeanor charge and the latter for a felony charge. And keep in mind that this would have likely been single count felony H&R along with two-counts of involuntary manslaughter (commonly a two-year prison term per each count); additionally there could have been obstruction of justice charges, evidence tampering, conspiracy, etc. that should have been involved.

[erowe1]

Not really, varying state statutes call for anywhere from $1,000-$10,000 in fines and/or at least 90-days to 1-15-years in jail, the former for a "wobble" to misdemeanor charge and the latter for a felony charge.

Source? Specifically for Oregon.

Note, when you say "at least," that implies that what you're saying here is the minimum sentence. Are you sure that it's not instead the maximum sentence? That makes a big difference.

This case was a felony hit and run (and rightfully so). I'm sure that, whatever states you're talking about, the penalties that you listed would all have to be strictly for felony hit and run. There's no way anything you said would apply to a misdemeanor hit and run charge.


And keep in mind that this would have likely been single count felony H&R along with two-counts of involuntary manslaughter (commonly a two-year prison term per each count); additionally there could have been obstruction of justice charges, evidence tampering, conspiracy, etc. that should have been involved.

I see no reason to believe that.

When a minor traffic offense, like driving through a pile of leaves, results in an accidental unforeseeable death, it generally doesn't bring a manslaughter charge of any kind. The only serious offense here would normally be the felony hit and run, which is what this person got. And the fact that they didn't initially know they hit someone would definitely be a mitigating factor in that.

Their behavior described in that other anonymous comment from that site, if accurate, is disgusting. But it wouldn't change the above points.

[Weston White]

But contempt towards America's system of governance is still a good and commendable thing. Right?

It is not the system itself that is contemptible; it is the parasitic beings that have disguised themselves with the protective cover of trust by that very system in order to use it for their own personal gain be it financial or empowering. To do otherwise is to misdirect that contempt.

[erowe1]

It is not the system itself that is contemptible;

I'm going to have to disagree stridently with that.

Say what you want about illegal immigrants. But at least they have demonstrated disregard for unjust laws. And that alone is highly commendable.

[fisharmor]

It is not the system itself that is contemptible; it is the parasitic beings that have disguised themselves with the protective cover of trust by that very system in order to use it for their own personal gain be it financial or empowering. To do otherwise is to misdirect that contempt.

So in other words, as long as we get the right people in power, everything will be ok?

.....
.......you sure you're on the right site?

[Weston White]

Source? Specifically for Oregon. . . .

"Hit and run involving injuries is a Class C felony. Class C felonies are punishable by up to 5 years in prison and fines reaching $125,000."

Or. Rev. Stat. §811.705: http://www.oregonlaws.org/ors/811.705 | www.oregonlegislature.gov/bills_laws/lawsstatutes/2013ors811.html
Fee and sentencing example: http://www.myoregondefenselawyer.com/criminal-charges/hit-and-run/

Also here is a somewhat similar case that is rather well known (the driver received both a 50-year and 10-year concurrent prison sentence), it was made into CSI, Law & Order episodes, and also a couple of movies and other shows: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chante_Jawan_Mallard

[MelissaWV]

Yeah she should have been deported to a country she has no memory of and relieved of all of her personal property while being split up from all of her connections here in the US because of a hit and run!

...?

This makes about as much sense as deporting any of the rest of you in this thread. You have about as much connection to Mexico as this woman does.

Now should she get a stiffer sentence if what was added in the second set of comments was true? I don't rightly know. I wish it were more of a civil matter considering the entire thing sounds like a godawful accident regardless of who was at the wheel and where they were from. No matter what happened as a result of it, the initial action was driving into a pile of leaves. I'm not even sure what that means because, as someone else pointed out, a pile of leaves large enough to hide two children shouldn't be driven through anyhow. Was it just some leaves scattered around in the road in drifts, where the two girls were lying down in the street? I'm not sure that's as avoidable as some are implying, depending on the road conditions. I do think that they absolutely knew the car had hit something/someone after the fact... it just doesn't pass the sniff test for them to be entirely oblivious.

But that's all a discussion of the justice system here.

As to all the "if this horrible four-year-old hadn't been allowed into the country she never would have grown up into this killer!" type arguments, what's strange is that this same kind of logic is used by the other extreme. There are those who were brought over as children and employ others now, as adults, and even save lives. That's the trouble when you try to paint with such a broad brush; it backfires. If your life is saved by an illegal, then ponder the notion of not being alive because at THAT moment, no citizen was around to save it. If your loved one's life is ended or endangered by an illegal, then you think the opposite. More of the bad stories make it out than the good, because when the positives are put out there, people get upset and offended by it. Frankly I have been endangered by more citizens than non. A lot more.

[MelissaWV]

"Hit and run involving injuries is a Class C felony. Class C felonies are punishable by up to 5 years in prison and fines reaching $125,000."

Or. Rev. Stat. §811.705: http://www.oregonlaws.org/ors/811.705 | www.oregonlegislature.gov/bills_laws/lawsstatutes/2013ors811.html
Fee and sentencing example: http://www.myoregondefenselawyer.com/criminal-charges/hit-and-run/

Also here is a somewhat similar case that is rather well known (the driver received both a 50-year and 10-year concurrent prison sentence), it was made into CSI, Law & Order episodes, and also a couple of movies and other shows: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chante_Jawan_Mallard

Your sources pertain to accidents where the person knows that they've hit a driver/pedestrian. It doesn't say anything about checking every object you strike to ensure the safety of any persons contained therein.

[Weston White]

So in other words, as long as we get the right people in power, everything will be ok?

.....
.......you sure you're on the right site?

That or, and, their constituents might otherwise just empower themselves with the right combination of indignation, political-economical interest, virtue, and wisdom.

I don't know, I really do not seem to fit in anywhere, anymore. Perhaps I am just too inscrutable.

[Weston White]

Your sources pertain to accidents where the person knows that they've hit a driver/pedestrian. It doesn't say anything about checking every object you strike to ensure the safety of any persons contained therein.

Do you honestly believe that those three occupants in that vehicle at the time had no clue, whatsoever, that they had just ran over two solid objects, that the impact and perhaps even the desperate screams of those two children, would not have immediately have alerted them that something very horrible had just happened?

Additionally, in H&R cases, if it can be proved that you had after-knowledge and fail to come forth timely, all bets are off, you inherit full culpability of all wrong doing. That burdening book then falls square into your lap.

Have you ever struck at least a medium sized animal while driving, how about driving over a small speed bump, a pothole, an orange reflecting lane divider, or off the shoulder of a roadway? In any case you feel it right away, leaving you zero doubt that you had just passed over an uneven object on the roadway.

[Weston White]

Yeah she should have been deported to a country she has no memory of and relieved of all of her personal property while being split up from all of her connections here in the US because of a hit and run!

Well, I think in her case, unless it can be readily shown (or proven) that she has immediate family members in Mexico that are able and willing to take her in indefinitely that she should not be deported, otherwise you might as well send her packing off to China. But the underlying issue that is wrought with concern is she and her parents should have never been here in the first place and should have been sent back to Mexico long ago (and then she would not have been there on that faithful day to expend the lives of two young Americans), that is assuming of course that they all here illegally still.

But the fact is that she was involved in more than a simple hit and run, so let us be quite honest about that at least. Geez!

Except for the U.S. Military, individuals that have yet to obtain their citizenship status (having been naturalized) cannot generally work for any level of government.

Would another passing vehicle have come along to take her place if she were not there in the first place and the children remained there playing for a longer period of time in that leaf pile, that remains to be seen. But I am certain the parents would liked to give anything to have risked that chance. Sadly, dizzy liberals sees things rather differently.

[Czolgosz]

Sad all around...kids being kids.

[MelissaWV]

Well, I think in her case, unless it can be readily shown (or proven) that she has immediate family members in Mexico that are able and willing to take her in indefinitely that she should not be deported, otherwise you might as well send her packing off to China. But the underlying issue that is wrought with concern is she and her parents should have never been here in the first place and should have been sent back to Mexico long ago (and then she would not have been her on that faithful day to expend the lives of two young Americans), that is assuming of course that they all here illegally still.

But the fact is that she was involved in more than a simple hit and run, so let us be quite honest about that at least. Geez!

Except for the U.S. Military, individuals that have yet to obtain their citizenship status (having been naturalized) cannot generally work for any level of government.

Would another passing vehicle have come along to take her place if she were not there in the first place and the children remained there playing for a longer period of time in that leaf pile, that remains to be seen. But I am certain the parents would liked to give anything to have risked that chance. Sadly, dizzy liberals sees things rather differently.

How so? It was a hit and run. Those tend to involve the "coverup" aspect people are so aghast about. It is a crime, regardless of where the person committing it is from. The kids parents, who I guess are citizens, had their kids playing in a leaf pile in the middle of the street. If they were immigrants, would they suddenly be more at fault? I doubt it. The core problem is the person not being punished appropriately.

[MelissaWV]

Do you honestly believe that those three occupants in that vehicle at the time had no clue, whatsoever, that they had just ran over two solid objects, that the impact and perhaps even the desperate screams of those two children, would not have immediately have alerted them that something very horrible had just happened?

Additionally, in H&R cases, if it can be proved that you had after-knowledge and fail to come forth timely, all bets are off, you inherit full culpability of all wrong doing. That burdening book then falls square into your lap.

Have you ever struck at least a medium sized animal while driving, how about driving over a small speed bump, a pothole, an orange reflecting lane divider, or off the shoulder of a roadway? In any case you feel it right away, leaving you zero doubt that you had just passed over an uneven object on the roadway.

I honestly need to just stop attempting to communicate.

The laws you talked about are about not rendering aid to a pedestrian or other driver. The examples you gave are about the same. They do not pertain to rendering aid in a situation where you do not know what you ran over, and in fact there are defenses along those lines in some hit and run cases (I thought I hit a deer, etc.). They are not about hitting something in a pile of leaves, which COULD have been something else.

Now, if you'd like to cite someone hitting a person who was concealed in such a way that the driver could not see them at time of impact, that might be relevant to the discussion about sentencing, which is all I was pointing out.

[erowe1]

"Hit and run involving injuries is a Class C felony. Class C felonies are punishable by up to 5 years in prison and fines reaching $125,000."


Notice, "up to." That is the maximum, not the minimum.

That was not a similar case. The difference of this one not being dwi is a huge difference as far as the penalty is concerned.

[Weston White]

How so? It was a hit and run. Those tend to involve the "coverup" aspect people are so aghast about. It is a crime, regardless of where the person committing it is from. The kids parents, who I guess are citizens, had their kids playing in a leaf pile in the middle of the street. If they were immigrants, would they suddenly be more at fault? I doubt it. The core problem is the person not being punished appropriately.

1. This was not a simple property damage collision that is solely a civil matter. Loss of lives and criminal acts were involved.

2. Like most law enforcement officers that conveniently use their firearm, effectively killing their victim point-blank, while intending to use their Taser and are cleared of all wrongdoing, justice in most cases involving illegal aliens does not get appropriately served.

3. While one’s ethnicity is irrelevant to the circumstances involved (e.g., there is no evidence that this was an intentional hate-crime), citizenship status however is not.

4. If immigration laws were being adequately enforced this incident might have likely never taken place.

[Weston White]

Notice, "up to." That is the maximum, not the minimum.

That was not a similar case. The difference of this one not being dwi is a huge difference as far as the penalty is concerned.

Yes up to five years to serve and $125K in fines, and your point being...? Oh is it that if I where involved in a H&R to a parked vehicle I would just get perhaps 1/2 of Cinthya's lenient punishment, with that being 1-1/2 years probation and 125-hours of community service? Sure that is justice being served, yes?

DWI and drug use was merely suspected in the other case, not provable; otherwise that is merely an additional element that brings DWI/DUI multipliers into play. That is the result of hit and runs, law enforcement loses the ability to confirm if alcohol or drugs, or other distractions were involved, such as texting... which is what took place in the instant case.

[Weston White]

I honestly need to just stop attempting to communicate.

The laws you talked about are about not rendering aid to a pedestrian or other driver. The examples you gave are about the same. They do not pertain to rendering aid in a situation where you do not know what you ran over, and in fact there are defenses along those lines in some hit and run cases (I thought I hit a deer, etc.). They are not about hitting something in a pile of leaves, which COULD have been something else.

Now, if you'd like to cite someone hitting a person who was concealed in such a way that the driver could not see them at time of impact, that might be relevant to the discussion about sentencing, which is all I was pointing out.

No the respective law is about the element of hit and run, the degrees of criminal severity involved, address aspects of property damage, personal injury, manslaughter, failure to render aid to the injured, DWI/DUI, etc.

You are wanting to debate what amounts to excuses or defensive strategies. The woman has already been found guilty of wait for it... felony hit and run. Yet she got a mere tap on the wrist and the DA should of included several other qualifying charges against both her and her friend's actions. Which also brings up the matter of charges that her occupants should have faced along with her, being that in Oregon it is also a crime for a witness to leave the scene of an accident before it has been reported.


ETA:

I happened upon a fairly similar case, but it is still pending: http://www.wcax.com/story/24167728/killigton-driver-charged-with-killing-pedestrian

[Brian4Liberty]

I'll go out on a limb and guess that she did not intend to run over a couple of kids.

And as long as she has a US driver's license, immigration status should not be a factor here.

[LibForestPaul]

I'll go out on a limb and guess that she did not intend to run over a couple of kids.

And as long as she has a US driver's license, immigration status should not be a factor here.

Why would a state issue a license, any license, to someone who has illegally taken up residency in this country?
Do they do this with RN licenses, or Pharmacist licenses?

[erowe1]

Yes up to five years to serve and $125K in fines, and your point being...?

My point being that the penalty in the OP is less than that maximum, just like it's supposed to be. I see no reason to believe that her sentence was any less than anyone else's would have been for the same thing. It doesn't strike me as lenient at all.

[Weston White]

My point being that the penalty in the OP is less than that maximum, just like it's supposed to be. I see no reason to believe that her sentence was any less than anyone else's would have been for the same thing. It doesn't strike me as lenient at all.

I would have to strongly disagree mere probation and/or community service is not an appropriate punishment for a Class-C felony--such sentences are really for petty crimes, white-collar crimes, reduced sentences for good behavior, etc.--an lest we forget that several more charges should have been brought forth by the prosecutor. However, I suppose we should just chop it up to prosecutorial laziness and that there was no likelihood involved that perhaps, just maybe the deputy or chief prosecutor did not want his/her office doing anything that would potentially negatively impact immigration reform or that they are not at all an avid "Obama" supporter?

For example if it could have been shown that either of those children would have likely remained alive if they had received timely medical treatment rather than have been left there to be discovered at a later time, manslaughter in the second degree could have easily been included on the charge sheet (first degree as well though the jury would likely have not bitten on that), being that "negligence" is a key element in the act of committing a hit-and-run--including manslaughter with a specific clause for acts committed against children under the age of 14-years (which both of those children were), which she was found guilty of.